The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[gpbarr]

I am sure remaining undefeated against Sandwell and Man Ure will be down to playing another awful team and a spent force for the other.

ILWT

Eh? No, it will mean that we performed better than or similar to them and we scored more or an equal amount of goals. Wind your neck in, please.

His point is well made because if that happens then that's exactly what the reaction will be. He's damned either way. That's all

Does anyone really believe that if Villa suddenly started playing decent football and winning games consistently there would be many people slating him. We want to be proven wrong, we want to watch a successful side, we want to see Lambert saying we are excellent after we've just trounced Manure 3-0 at home. Just the evidence suggests it's not likely to happen under him.

I believe it - he'd get slated either way. And thats what will happen because as results & style improve, expectations will continue to grow (out of control much as they are now) so he (as with most managers frankly) are always behind the eight ball.  Survival isn't enough (we should be comfortably mid table), when we get to mid table thats not enough (we should be in the Europa League at least), and Europa League isn't enough (we should be Champions League surely?). Uncomfortable as it is to accept, thats precisely what happens. No club is different and Lambert doesn't deserve to be treated different either - its just fact. The man is doomed, its just a matter of time.       

[WestleyArmsAV]

Yet MON got away with many home defeats v man ure cus they were great .

[pauliewalnuts]

I am sure remaining undefeated against Sandwell and Man Ure will be down to playing another awful team and a spent force for the other.

ILWT

Eh? No, it will mean that we performed better than or similar to them and we scored more or an equal amount of goals. Wind your neck in, please.

His point is well made because if that happens then that's exactly what the reaction will be. He's damned either way. That's all

Does anyone really believe that if Villa suddenly started playing decent football and winning games consistently there would be many people slating him. We want to be proven wrong, we want to watch a successful side, we want to see Lambert saying we are excellent after we've just trounced Manure 3-0 at home. Just the evidence suggests it's not likely to happen under him.

I believe it - he'd get slated either way. And thats what will happen because as results & style improve, expectations will continue to grow (out of control much as they are now) so he (as with most managers frankly) are always behind the eight ball.  Survival isn't enough (we should be comfortably mid table), when we get to mid table thats not enough (we should be in the Europa League at least), and Europa League isn't enough (we should be Champions League surely?). Uncomfortable as it is to accept, thats precisely what happens. No club is different and Lambert doesn't deserve to be treated different either - its just fact. The man is doomed, its just a matter of time.       

I look forward to seeing "results and style improve" to test that theory out.

The reason so many people have lost faith in Lambert is precisely because there is, two and a bit years in, no sign of either of those things happening with any consistency.

Also, do you really, honestly think expectations are "out of control"?

The expectation not to skulk around 15th place year after year? The expectation to win a few games? To not suffer from any of the abysmal records we've broken in the last couple of years?

I went to my first match 40 years ago, and honestly, I struggle to think of many times in that spell when expectations were lower then they are now.

If he could even get us scoring more than a goal every other match, for example, he'd go up considerably in most fans' opinions. He can't, though.

I wish he could. i like the bloke. I want it to work out for him. I don't want to sack another manager and spunk more money and time looking for a replacement, I want us to win more games, I want changing manager to be something we're not even thinking about.

But for that to be the case, the current manager needs to start doing his job a lot better than he is, because currently, it isn't looking good. Westley can post his ILWT nonsense as much as he likes, and he can cast aspersions on what kind of "fans" the rest of us are as much as he likes, but he's defending a man with one of the worst win ratios of any Villa manager, ever. A man who has lost half of the games he has managed us in.

I don't see many "fans" being happy with that sort of record.

[Deano's Mullet]

Two wins on the bounce have been nice but lose on Saturday and its all blown wide open again.

[silhillvilla]

Two wins on the bounce have been nice but lose on Saturday and its all blown wide open again.

Agree, yet if we somehow win ? Knighthood , civic reception , open top bus.
Welcome to modern football Premier League Stylee .

[Deano's Mullet]

If say we won seven out of the next ten games you'd definitely think we'd turned a corner. Only once has Lambert's team managed to put together a succession of wins over a 10 game period and that was at the end of his first year.  Last 10 games of that year, W 5 D 2 L 3. A couple of those defeats were to Man United and Chelsea. I think we are capable of putting a run together provided Lambert lets the team express itself a bit more.

[paul_e]

The expectation thing gets on my tits with people from other clubs and in the media suggesting Villa fans expectations are out of line.  in the last 25 years we've averaged top 6, any other club with that record would expect to be up around there every season and not be given shit for it but for some reason we get told that we should accept being a bottom half club with good grace and stop whining like the moaning little brummie's we are.  I expect top 8 every season, even if I know we're not likely to get there, anything less than that means we've had a poor season, much like manu or arsenal would find not being top 4 to be a terrible return and chelsea and Man City are disappointed if they don't win something and Liverpool are disappointed that this isn't 'their year' again.

[Shrek]

Regarding expectations, what is expected for a club that has been run so poorly from the top, that has made such drastic cut backs wages wise?
Should we, as people expect, not be hovering around 15th?

The problem I think, is people are struggling to accept where we are as a club and that Lambert is just doing what is expected by everyone bar us fans?

[Comrade Blitz]

Ally McCoist anyone?

[Tokyo Sexwhale]

Ally McCoist anyone?

For what?

[Comrade Blitz]

McCoist Offers His Resignation from Rangers

[gpbarr]

The expectation thing gets on my tits with people from other clubs and in the media suggesting Villa fans expectations are out of line.  in the last 25 years we've averaged top 6, any other club with that record would expect to be up around there every season and not be given shit for it but for some reason we get told that we should accept being a bottom half club with good grace and stop whining like the moaning little brummie's we are.  I expect top 8 every season, even if I know we're not likely to get there, anything less than that means we've had a poor season, much like manu or arsenal would find not being top 4 to be a terrible return and chelsea and Man City are disappointed if they don't win something and Liverpool are disappointed that this isn't 'their year' again.

it may get on yout tits but expectations are out of line, sorry its fact. Any reasoned commentator will tell you thats true. And its just illogical - we don't invest anywhere near as much as the following, nor have we done so for many years (MON oversaw the last bastion of that era) - Chelsea, Man C, Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham so we certainly have no right to expect to be in that company on any regular basis. So we basically expect to win the 2nd tier of the Premier League every season - even when we invest nowhere near as much as most in the 2nd tier - go back on this thread and look at the facts - we were outspent by 9 of the remaining 14 clubs this summer.

I am not a Lambert apologist, nor am I happy with half the shit that has been served up under his tenure, but as I have said before, it is very evident to unbiased folk that Villa as things stand, cannot expect to regularly compete in the top half of this division, and Lambert or any other fellow in charge, that wont change until the money situation changes.

Our problems as a club go way, way deeper than an unpopular manager. 

[gpbarr]

Regarding expectations, what is expected for a club that has been run so poorly from the top, that has made such drastic cut backs wages wise?
Should we, as people expect, not be hovering around 15th?

The problem I think, is people are struggling to accept where we are as a club and that Lambert is just doing what is expected by everyone bar us fans?

Rationality never went down well with fans.

[Gregorys Boy]

I agree with most of negative comments about Lambert.  For a long time I was one of his biggest defenders because of him taking over at a tough time, because of the job he did at Norwich, and because we needed stability rather than losing another manager.  But three seasons down the line it really is time for a bit more than 15 place, bad football and scraping to stay up every year.  If we win or at least avoid defeat tomorrow then I think Lambert should be safe for awhile yet.  I am pretty sure we will not go down, as this year there actually seems a number of teams worse than us, Palace, The Foxes, Sunderland, Hull, Burnley etc...  At least the defence has improved and there does seem a better team spirit at the moment.  But if we finish around the same position then it will be time for a change.

[Ian.]

Ally McCoist anyone?

For what?

Has he been sacked from A Question of Sport?