The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[Chris Smith]

If Benteke was playing and Delph was fit on Saturday, then we still wouldn't have seen us attack in any way different than have our full backs put balls in from deep.

We may have scored off a corner, as they couldn't deal with the balls that were put in there and Benteke would certainly have caused Reid and Collins, a pair of donkey's, ten times as many problems as Gabby.

But the fact remains, that even with all his best players fit, we still have only one plan for breaking sides down and it isn't very good.

I don't agree with that at all. Benteke allows us to play off and around him, to get the midfield further up the pitch as he is able to play with his back to goal. Without him, or his similarly injured understudy, we are forced to sit deep and play on the break.

[Chris Smith]

I've seen us play utterly shit football many times when we've had all of our main players fit. So this 'everything will be rosey when so and so is back' is complete bollocks in my opinion. We may just rise from a 1/10, to a 2/10.

When was that? I am really struggling to think when we were last able to put out "all our main players fit". We might get the odd game but as Benteke was out for months and just as he came back Delph was crocked then the chances are few and far between. Without me having to list them we are all aware of the other long term injuries over the past 18 months or so.

[Villa in Denmark]

Thick and thin.

The love for my club increases in hardship and when so many are jumping ship.

VTID.

How many are jumping ship?

There're plenty who are saying the football, I can't quite describe it as style, is awful.
There're plenty who are saying we should be doing better than we have done.
You say give him until May.
You've still not addressed why you think he can turn around.
30 points in 31 games in 2014 = 36 or 37 points over 38 games - squeaky bum time but might be /probably safe.
15 points in the last ½ season worth of results = 30 points over 38 games - RELEGATED.
11 points from 11 games this season = 38 points over 38 games  - squeaky bum time but might be /probably safe.

with anything concrete.  Just adopted what appears to now be the club culture of excusing failings and not even aspiring to mediocrity.

I don't think we have a divine right to be top 4 or top 6, not even top half, but we sure as hell should be achieving more with the resources we have. 

You can keep your excuses about injuries. 
Yes he lost Kozak and Benteke for a prolonged period. So why the hell didn't he change the approach to suit the players we had got available instead of lumping the ball in the general direction of Gabby or Andi. (incidentally, the very fact that that is his chosen tactic with Benteke or Kozak in the team is even more damning.)

Over the course of a season you pretty much end up where you deserve.

The last 3 years have said we're shit but not completely incompetent.  The last bit about not being completely incompetent is looking increasingly flaky.

"The love for my club increases in hardship and when so many are jumping ship"

They do say love is blind.

[Dr Butler]

I've seen us play utterly shit football many times when we've had all of our main players fit. So this 'everything will be rosey when so and so is back' is complete bollocks in my opinion. We may just rise from a 1/10, to a 2/10.

When was that? I am really struggling to think when we were last able to put out "all our main players fit". We might get the odd game but as Benteke was out for months and just as he came back Delph was crocked then the chances are few and far between. Without me having to list them we are all aware of the other long term injuries over the past 18 months or so.

yeah I just read that and agree Chris, when have we consistently had a full strength 11 out there on the pitch in a run of 7/8 games ?  we always seem to get one back and then two fall by the wayside injured.

losing Kozak and Benteke would of knocked any team backwards, let alone Vlarr, Delph, NZogbia, Senderos etc...

[supertom]

If Benteke was playing and Delph was fit on Saturday, then we still wouldn't have seen us attack in any way different than have our full backs put balls in from deep.

We may have scored off a corner, as they couldn't deal with the balls that were put in there and Benteke would certainly have caused Reid and Collins, a pair of donkey's, ten times as many problems as Gabby.

But the fact remains, that even with all his best players fit, we still have only one plan for breaking sides down and it isn't very good.

I don't agree with that at all. Benteke allows us to play off and around him, to get the midfield further up the pitch as he is able to play with his back to goal. Without him, or his similarly injured understudy, we are forced to sit deep and play on the break.

We're only forced to play that way by Lamberts own ineptitude.
I know Tekkers hasn't been fit this season, but the ball hasn't stuck to him, and he's not been winning much in the air either. We need other ways to play as opposed to hoping Benteke produces magic.

For much of last season Benteke didn't make us look all that much more effective as a team. The cohesison he had with Weimann and Gabby for a few months in Feb-May 13 was gone. He still scored enough to keep us up thankfully and he turned that Norwich game on a moment of pure class. But moments like that weren't as consistent as the previous season. That was partly fitness, but partly because of Lamberts tactical ineptitude.

[PaulWinch again]

If Benteke was playing and Delph was fit on Saturday, then we still wouldn't have seen us attack in any way different than have our full backs put balls in from deep.

We may have scored off a corner, as they couldn't deal with the balls that were put in there and Benteke would certainly have caused Reid and Collins, a pair of donkey's, ten times as many problems as Gabby.

But the fact remains, that even with all his best players fit, we still have only one plan for breaking sides down and it isn't very good.

I don't agree with that at all. Benteke allows us to play off and around him, to get the midfield further up the pitch as he is able to play with his back to goal. Without him, or his similarly injured understudy, we are forced to sit deep and play on the break.

Whilst Benteke has an impact on our style, we still very much sit back and play on the break when he's in the team.

[PaulWinch again]

Thick and thin.

The love for my club increases in hardship and when so many are jumping ship.

VTID.

Who's jumping ship? You can support the club without blindly accepting everything that is going on.

[LeeB]

What is it about Lambert's attitude that suggests he thinks we belong in the Premier League? Thinking big lends itself to acting big. If you think that Aston Villa don't deserve to be in the top flight and that first and foremost we're a club who are "40 points first" then your expectations have been hacked to shreds.

We've gone humbly and meekly to our demise in the six straight defeats this season, offering next to nothing going forwards. Its no surprise we're not scoring goals, its the way we're set up; to contain, to be negative, to avoid defeat, rather than winning the game.

Its awful and there is no sign of change coming.

And this is exactly what he said he was going to change. Two and a bit fucking years on and we're worse.

He should walk for that alone.

[supertom]

Thick and thin.

The love for my club increases in hardship and when so many are jumping ship.

VTID.

Who's jumping ship? You can support the club without blindly accepting everything that is going on.

Absolutely. 3 years of this guff and we're all still here. No one has jumped ship yet, but we shouldn't just have to like it or lump it when it comes to us heading increasingly closer to being a second tier club.
Lamberts in his third season and has run out of excuses. He worked on certain things in pre-season perhaps to try and cope without a big bastard up front. The season proper saw him merely resort to tried and tested.

[NeilH]

The club has been through hard times before and will no doubt do so again, but the last five years have been especially hard to take, as it’s been the footballing equivalent of a slow death. Our decent to Division 2 from European Cup winners was so rapid that it caught many of us by surprise (6th,10th,10th, 16th,22nd), since season 2011-12 is been 16th, 15th, 15th and currently 16th. Perpetually struggling, despite spending a fair wedge of money and with a confusing strategy that smacks of short term-ism, is no way to operate.
Like many hear, I truly want to believe that the return of key players will turn things around, but I still believe that the current 11 we have is under-performing to where it ought to be and for that I lay the blame squarely at the feet of Lambert.
Every single football fan wants to have hope, it’s that combined with loyalty that drives us to watch our clubs. If you take hope away, then you put significant enough pressure on the loyalty side that fans will slowly drift away. In my case, I drifted to a second tier Dutch team around the corner and cut back my trips to Villa Park to only twice a season, opting not to take my kids for fear of putting them off the club for life. Have I jumped ship, am I not loyal? Maybe, but it’s a choice I made based on the fact that my club seemed determined to remove the hope of many of us fans by persisting with a manager who clearly isn’t up to scratch.

[WestleyArmsAV]

Given the money that he has had, or not, plagued by injuries to key players, I would strongly say that he has competently kept us up when we should have gone down with the squad he has been left with after injuries.

We are now in November, following a tough run of games and continued injuries and now suspension to a key player and it is panic again.

Lambert we trust.

UTV

[Smirker]

Given the money that he has had, or not, plagued by injuries to key players, I would strongly say that he has competently kept us up when we should have gone down with the squad he has been left with after injuries.

We are now in November, following a tough run of games and continued injuries and now suspension to a key player and it is panic again.

Lambert we trust.

UTV

The only reason we should have gone down is cos we were getting smashed repeatedly in games like Wigan at home, or look at our cup exits to Bradford, or Sheffield United etc, even with injuries we should be good enough to win those. You are going to get injuries in a season, it's inevitable. The manager has to adapt and he hasn't done that. Even when we've got good results we've generally played absolutely shit football to get them and fluked the win. We constantly play shit on a stick in every game win lose or draw and it's Lambert's doing pal.

[AGRIPPA]

Given the money that he has had, or not, plagued by injuries to key players, I would strongly say that he has competently kept us up when we should have gone down with the squad he has been left with after injuries.

We are now in November, following a tough run of games and continued injuries and now suspension to a key player and it is panic again.

Lambert we trust.

UTV

Sorry Wesley Arms AV but you sound delusional....

[NeilH]

I doubt that for most it’s a kneejerk reaction to a bad run of games, it’s about the overall trend over the last few seasons and the style of play. He’s shown little or no sign of the tactical nous that one would associate with a man schooled in the Dortmund approach. He’s not only been outwitted by the managers in his own division, but he’s also been out-maneuvered by the likes of Bradford, Orient and Millwall. Despite our good start to the season, where it seemed that we had finally sorted out the leaking defence, our reliance on counter-attacking football and our inability to create any width in the team has been sussed out by our fellow teams. We look incapable of being able to play at home, making us a soft touch to all and sundry and the only seeming silver lining to this, is that our counter-attacking approach has continued (thank god) to bear fruit away from him.
I would like some evidence that is able to adapt his approach to the opposition. I would like some evidence that he has studied up on every side we meet, such that we adapt our style of play accordingly. However, I see little evidence that this is the case.
Removing him, will of course not be a silver bullet that addresses the other fundamental problems that are holding back the club, but other clubs have proved that off-field issues can be mitigated by a competent manager who builds a team who are disciplined and adaptable. Lambert has had more than enough opportunities to demonstrate that he can do this too, but I just don’t see it.

[paul_e]

We have had a lot of bad luck with injuries, that's undeniable, but can you honestly say that we've been so decimated by injuries that our only option when playing the top 5 was to line up on the edge of the box and ask them to be gentle?

Aside from that he's had bad luck with injuries for 3 seasons in a row, at some point you have to stop and think if something he (or someone else at the club) is doing is contributing to those injuries.  Aside from that I'm not sure I want an unlucky manager.