The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[PaulWinch again]

Vlaar and Guzan aren't Premier League quality? come on now.

[saunders_heroes]

I don't think I've seen anyone call Vlaar total rubbish.

I think a few people came close to calling him that in his first season which was completely unjustified.

I thought he was hopeless last season. Improved a bit this season though. Still nothing to get excited about.

Yet you praise Collins and Dunne on their leaving threads?

I'd take the above over any of the centrebacks a we've got at the moment.

[saunders_heroes]

Vlaar and Guzan aren't Premier League quality? come on now.

Nothing more than average. I think it's because we've been that poor over the last few years that even average players stand out to the fans.

[SoccerHQ]

I thought Collins was very overrated in his time here personally, even during the excellent effort in 09/10 when Dunne and Carlos at RB covered his errors.

Vlaar over Collins all day long for me especially as you use distribution with criticising Guzan.

Dunney, fair enough superb in 09/10 but was a liability in the next two seasons aswell as his indiscipline off the pitch.

I was just surprised you were so quick on the Dunne thread praising him as an excellent defender when he left yet are always having pops at Vlaar.

[Toronto Villa]

Guzan is a bog standard goalkeeper

*not surprised you'd say that* emoticon

And the way you talk about the team you'd have thought we were a perennial top 6 and not perennial relegation strugglers.

Can you provide any evidence of that, because quite frankly that's complete bollocks? I'm only talking about 2 players that you've essentially just dismissed as being much better than you have given them credit for. Let me know when you find anything to back up me talking about the team like they are a top 6 side.

[Toronto Villa]

Vlaar and Guzan aren't Premier League quality? come on now.

Nothing more than average. I think it's because we've been that poor over the last few years that even average players stand out to the fans.

I would argue that most fans with any balance will say that at times both players have under performed but for the most part both players have ranged from good, very good and even excellent at times. When you say fans, you're talking about you I assume.

[Olneythelonely]

Guzan, Vlaar, Benteke, Delph are all good players or better than that and a team can be built around them. I also think Westwood, Weimann and Bacuna could be good as well.

Other than Benteke I think only Delph is Premier League quality, though he's gone off the boil recently.

Apart from yesterday, when he was very good.

[Mister E]

This the Vlaar who will go into the World Cup with the Netherlands as the first choice CB.

Re the others, Guzan has suffered having Baker in front of him, but he definitely does need to improve his distribution.

I think Bacuna will improve and has real potential. I think we'll get more out of Lowton. Okore comes highly regarded. KEA is finally showing that he can play in the Premiership albeit I'd not make him a first-pick player (but a squad player).

Luna and Tonev look like total dogs.

For me, Lambert has done alright on limited funds: the challenge is - can we find some decent coaches to make something of the potential?

[richard moore]

Vlaar and Guzan aren't Premier League quality? come on now.

Nothing more than average. I think it's because we've been that poor over the last few years that even average players stand out to the fans.

I might disagree with you about Guzan but I think you make a very valid point more generally SH. I always thought that about Kyle Walker who looked a world beater playing for us and, whilst still good when he went back to Spurs, has never really looked anywhere near the player he seemed at Villa. I suspect we've been guilty of overrating our better players for some time now and it's only to be expected really

[silhillvilla]

I see some posters have had too much sun today !!
Guzan "bog standard"
Vlaar "rubbish"

Put a hat on tomorrow and stay in the shade

[Malandro]

I see some posters have had too much sun today !!
Guzan "bog standard"
Vlaar "rubbish"

Put a hat on tomorrow and stay in the shade

poor Guzan, I wouldn't swap him for any other keeper. He's grand.

[silhillvilla]

He's up there with Rimmer and Bosnich as my favourite villa keepers. Hope he stays with us a long time.

[VinnieChase84]

I see some posters have had too much sun today !!
Guzan "bog standard"
Vlaar "rubbish"

Put a hat on tomorrow and stay in the shade

poor Guzan, I wouldn't swap him for any other keeper. He's grand.

Best keeper we've had since Bosnich

[not3bad]

Guzan's shot stopping is better than Friedel's and his distribution isn't much worse. Friedel wasn't great in that department either.

[brontebilly]

This the Vlaar who will go into the World Cup with the Netherlands as the first choice CB.

Re the others, Guzan has suffered having Baker in front of him, but he definitely does need to improve his distribution.

I think Bacuna will improve and has real potential. I think we'll get more out of Lowton. Okore comes highly regarded. KEA is finally showing that he can play in the Premiership albeit I'd not make him a first-pick player (but a squad player).

Luna and Tonev look like total dogs.

For me, Lambert has done alright on limited funds: the challenge is - can we find some decent coaches to make something of the potential?

Vlaar was first choice for the Dutch at the last Euros too, I cant emphasise enough how bad he was

Vlaar as an individual is ok but as a captain he is dire, cant lead a defence, goes to pot when he makes a mistake and most importantly is very injury prone.

Hopefully he has a good World Cup so we can flog him on the back of it. There wouldnt be too many takers for him based on his club form over the last 2 years.

Guzan is a very good shot stopper, if you want more from your keeper like being able to play the ball out from the back then he has a lot to improve on. But we have much bigger issues to resolve than our keeper.