The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[Jimbo]

Also, this idea that football fans' expectations shouldn't rise with the ever increasing costs involved in supporting their club. Just turn up when the Premier League tells you to and support the millionaires wrecking your club in a family-friendly way so it looks good on TV, like good football fans. What an insult.

[not3bad]

An article that is indeed disingenuous - reminds me of the press coverage that followed the TSM / Bolton game; equally, bollox.

Ironically though, wasn't it a writer in the Guardian that hit the nail on the head with the situation at Villa at the time?

[Fuse]

Perhaps we are unrealistic about where we should expect Villa to be competing but I would say that until the early 2000's when the CL money really started to influence, Aston Villa thoughout their history were a big enough club to aspire to compete for trophies and european qualificaiton. Nothing has changed in that respect as far as football fans are concerned, the change has come through finances comingn into the game being dispersed across a small number of clubs and a cartel has developed that will never allow this to change - UEFA are compliant with this too.

I think we are slowly becoming realistic to this and why I would say most Villa fans are falling out of love with the game as it is clubs such as ours and Everton who have been effected most by this -  previously we were both clubs who could rightly aspire to contending.

Unless we get a richer sugar daddy I cant see this ever changing and in fact as the next generation of supporters become adults, I cna see our crowds dwindling as all they will ahev been brought up on is dross and medicority.

At least I had the joy in my lifetime of seeing us win - any kid under the age of 25 have had nothing but the odd fleeting moment to enjoy.

None of this excuses Lambert by the way

[olaftab]

Obviously written by out PR  man Doogan!

[Monty]

It's not unrealistic to ask that a manager be good enough to avoid 10 home defeats, or that his best idea for combating this be better than throwing on Jordan Bowery and humping it down the middle. Unrealistic expectations? The club has a 40,000-plus capacity stadium, is the biggest club in the country's second biggest city, has a very large fanbase and highly creditable tradition, brilliant training facilities, excellent academy, all of that. This club shouldn't be producing football as relentlessly, depressingly boring as it is, and certainly shouldn't be doing so in order to drift towards relegation.

This new Lovejoy is hardly an improvement on the old one.

[saunders_heroes]

It's not unrealistic to ask that a manager be good enough to avoid 10 home defeats, or that his best idea for combating this be better than throwing on Jordan Bowery and humping it down the middle. Unrealistic expectations? The club has a 40,000-plus capacity stadium, is the biggest club in the country's second biggest city, has a very large fanbase and highly creditable tradition, brilliant training facilities, excellent academy, all of that. This club shouldn't be producing football as relentlessly, depressingly boring as it is, and certainly shouldn't be doing so in order to drift towards relegation.

This new Lovejoy is hardly an improvement on the old one.

This is all true but even with the great facilities, fan base, tradition etc, what let's us down is the fact we pay Championship wages. That's why we have a squad full of below average players.

[Ads]

We played Champions League wages under O'Neill and didn't have the football to match. We paid top six wages under Houllier and McLiesh and struggled with relegation until late April in the case of the former and went pretty close in the case of the latter.

What ever wages we appear to be paying, we still end up without value for money.

[saunders_heroes]

We played Champions League wages under O'Neill and didn't have the football to match. We paid top six wages under Houllier and McLiesh and struggled with relegation until late April in the case of the former and went pretty close in the case of the latter.

What ever wages we appear to be paying, we still end up without value for money.

We finished top 6 in 3 consecutive seasons under O'Neill so god knows what you're on about there. Lerner's cutbacks started with O'Neill's departure so it should come as no surprise that our decline started from then on.

[Monty]

It's not unrealistic to ask that a manager be good enough to avoid 10 home defeats, or that his best idea for combating this be better than throwing on Jordan Bowery and humping it down the middle. Unrealistic expectations? The club has a 40,000-plus capacity stadium, is the biggest club in the country's second biggest city, has a very large fanbase and highly creditable tradition, brilliant training facilities, excellent academy, all of that. This club shouldn't be producing football as relentlessly, depressingly boring as it is, and certainly shouldn't be doing so in order to drift towards relegation.

This new Lovejoy is hardly an improvement on the old one.

This is all true but even with the great facilities, fan base, tradition etc, what let's us down is the fact we pay Championship wages. That's why we have a squad full of below average players.

Oh no question. But this does not absolve the manager of blame.

[aj2k77]

I read somewhere, i'll try to find the link, that the average wages as of September 2013 were

Premier league £27,500
Championship £4,500
1st Div £2,000
2nd Div £1,400

We definitely do not pay Championship wages. We just employ incompetent fools at every level of the club.

[saunders_heroes]

It's not unrealistic to ask that a manager be good enough to avoid 10 home defeats, or that his best idea for combating this be better than throwing on Jordan Bowery and humping it down the middle. Unrealistic expectations? The club has a 40,000-plus capacity stadium, is the biggest club in the country's second biggest city, has a very large fanbase and highly creditable tradition, brilliant training facilities, excellent academy, all of that. This club shouldn't be producing football as relentlessly, depressingly boring as it is, and certainly shouldn't be doing so in order to drift towards relegation.

This new Lovejoy is hardly an improvement on the old one.

This is all true but even with the great facilities, fan base, tradition etc, what let's us down is the fact we pay Championship wages. That's why we have a squad full of below average players.

Oh no question. But this does not absolve the manager of blame.

Absolutely I agree. He's humiliated our club more than any manager I can remember.

[Ads]

We played Champions League wages under O'Neill and didn't have the football to match. We paid top six wages under Houllier and McLeish and struggled with relegation until late April in the case of the former and went pretty close in the case of the latter.

What ever wages we appear to be paying, we still end up without value for money.

We finished top 6 in 3 consecutive seasons under O'Neill so god knows what you're on about there. Lerner's cutbacks started with O'Neill's departure so it should come as no surprise that our decline started from then on.

God knows? It's been done to death, but to précis; we paid very good wages under O'Neill and achieved par for the course as far as Aston Villa was concerned. Finishing consecutively in the top six was good, but the home form was poor under O'Neill as we were so one dimensional. 7 home wins in his final season was not good enough and it was his arcane approach to football that meant it was mediocre throughout his tenure. A pity we didn't have a more progressive manager than him in 2006, as with the funding O'Neill got, a better manager would have seen us qualify for the Champions League.

I wouldn't disagree with your second sentance. 

[Monty]

Every March O'Neill's shortcomings made themselves painfully apparent, and his failure to acknowledge them fatally undermined all the good work that he did do.

[FranzBiberkopf]

Absolutely I agree. He's humiliated our club more than any manager I can remember.

Its a close call between all of the last three incumbents if I'm honest.

Houllier for his denigrating of the club from day one, his throwing of cup ties through fielding second string teams.
McLeish for the sheer tedium of it all.
Lambert for the multiple lower league cup losses, the lack of any discernible tactics.

[London Villan]

I think Lambert's charge list is longer than that... club record defeat, record number of home losses, fewest home wins...