The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[tomd2103]

Unless we go down my hunch is he will get the summer but we will need to show a marked upturn otherwise that will be his last transfer window.

I agree with you, Chris and it would demonstrate a knee jerk reaction from Lerner leaving us with a very limited pool to find a better manager, not that it's impossible but it hardly brings the much needed stability that so many seem to value. For me, the summer is the best time to find a replacement.

Additionally, I'd imagine Lambert (and his staff) will have signed a new contract(s) extension which would mean sacking him in next season a very expensive exercise.

Sacking him will mean them tacitly admitting that they have got three successive appointments wrong. No organisation wants that.

Only by the most cynical Lerner haters. Houllier was down to illness, McLeish they it got wrong and Lambert did his job under strict financial limitations, keeping us up whilst bringing in a talent of young, promising players is how I'd spin it.

All would soon be forgotten/forgiven should Lerner appoint the right man. I'd be more concerned with being known as the owner that pays out the best compensation in the Premier League than the owner that has a mixed record of managerial appointments, as I'm sure his bank manager would agree.

Not to go over old ground, but I still and always will find it hard to believe and understand the TSM appointment.  It is like an indelible stain.  When you factor in that the club had to pay millions in compensation both when he arrived and left, I think it is the single worst piece of judgement in the 30 years I have been supporting club.     

[David_Nab]

Unless we go down my hunch is he will get the summer but we will need to show a marked upturn otherwise that will be his last transfer window.

I agree with you, Chris and it would demonstrate a knee jerk reaction from Lerner leaving us with a very limited pool to find a better manager, not that it's impossible but it hardly brings the much needed stability that so many seem to value. For me, the summer is the best time to find a replacement.

Additionally, I'd imagine Lambert (and his staff) will have signed a new contract(s) extension which would mean sacking him in next season a very expensive exercise.

Sacking him will mean them tacitly admitting that they have got three successive appointments wrong. No organisation wants that.

Only by the most cynical Lerner haters. Houllier was down to illness, McLeish they it got wrong and Lambert did his job under strict financial limitations, keeping us up whilst bringing in a talent of young, promising players is how I'd spin it.

All would soon be forgotten/forgiven should Lerner appoint the right man. I'd be more concerned with being known as the owner that pays out the best compensation in the Premier League than the owner that has a mixed record of managerial appointments, as I'm sure his bank manager would agree.

Not to go over old ground, but I still and always will find it hard to believe and understand the TSM appointment.  It is like an indelible stain.  When you factor in that the club had to pay millions in compensation both when he arrived and left, I think it is the single worst piece of judgement in the 30 years I have been supporting club.     

You forgot to mention the 20 mil plus wages he was allowed to spend on N'zogbia , Given and Hutton all of whom are deemed not good enough with little to no sell on value now.

[Dante Lavelli]

Sorry Billy I admire your loyalty and respect your opinion but if Lambert gets two more transfer windows like the ones he had already there won't be many at the games.

Thanks Brian and likewise I respect your opinion and experiences as a long-standing supporter.  I suppose my view centres on my desire to see the club fight through with its vision.  I'm fed up of the crash and burn, boom and bust endless cycles of being a Villa fan and I can't see how these will ever end until we have owners who have the  finances and resources to compete with the very wealthiest.  Our only other option for the long-term success I crave is for us to have some kind of a plan and stick with it.  Lambert's twenty months in, I think?  Once we get this season out of the way I think he will have got through the dirtiest and toughest part of his remit - keeping us up whilst slashing the wage bill.   

If folk had been told at the start of the season that, come April, we would be three points off eleventh place having not once been involved with the relegation scrap in earnest, I think many would have taken that as acceptable progress on the previous season.  Yes, it's been shocking at times but we are making some form of progress. 

The next transfer window is, for me, the big one for the Lambert era as I think this is the one where he can now start fine-tuning and aiming for the quality additions that should lift us back into top-half territory.   I don't want to undo the strategy of the past couple of seasons and go back to square one again: I want the current strategy to be given the time to really bed in and be allowed to grow. To get rid of the manager now would mean all the pain and suffering of the past couple of seasons has been pointless - I'd rather embrace it all as part of the journey we are on back to the top. 

Billy, I understand your concerns and agree with most of your post although I'm not sure the fans when asked fans at the start of the season, come April we're behind Stoke, Hull and West Ham and on the same points as newly promoted Palace, just four points above the relegation zone, too many "would have taken that as acceptable progress on the previous season".

Like you, I agree that the strategy should be maintained, I just don't see Lambert as the right man to deliver it. Any new manager would have to work with the majority of the existing squad as we don't have the money to replace them. It's possible to bring in a more talented manager to not only maintain what's been built over the last 2 years but also improve on it. Somebody like Rene Girard would be a perfect match.

Billy,

I don't think getting rid of Lambert necessarily means we're abandoning the 'plan'.  It's not as if it is so sophisticated that we could not find another manager to step in.  Furthermore, with a year (two?) left his contract should not result in a massive payout.

The way I see it, is that Lambert deserves credit and respect for ruthlessly abiding by the 'plan' but has demonstrated that he is not good enough at the coaching side of things to move the players forward.  This problem could be solved by getting in a modern coach to  apply his vision but I am not convinced there is one.  Getting in a new guy could be like martinez rejuvenating Moyes' everton team... (optimist's hat on).

[tomd2103]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

[ChicagoLion]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.     

So  that means you give him the summer transfer budget, the ability to play the same underperforming players, with the same total lack of strategy and cohesion to prove what exactly?

I am staggered that any one can think that he deserves anything other than the sack.

[mr underhill]

agreed. there is no point handing Lambert further transfer funds. Even if we manage to recruit a few talented players, he's not capable of managing them effectively - he's amply demonstrated over the past two seasons that he simply does not have the essential  skills. The rare good things happen in spite of him.

[Dave Clark Five]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

It is a toss of the dice whether we go down or not. We could stay up but still lose every game. Why should Lambert get any credit for that? Culverhouse out now. Lambert out now as well.

[Dante Lavelli]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

For that to work then there would need to be some pretty significant changes behind the scenes.  New coaches, a clearer football philosophy and ultimately he would need to acknowledge that it has not been good enough to date.  Most managers fail to spot their weaknesses and I think/fear Lambert would be the same.

[richard moore]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

You've given it a lot of thought? And this was your conclusion? I'm speechless

[Archbishop Herbert Cockthrottle]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

You've given it a lot of thought? And this was your conclusion? I'm speechless

Well that's a blessed relief.

[pbavfckuwait]

Surely the measurement of any manager comes down to a few basic things.
For Lambert:
Players bought and money spent on them = Fair to average at best
Players sold and money gained from them = Abysmal
Tactical nous = None
Backroom staff = Poor
Man Management skills= Not yet seen
and most importantly of all
Results = Poor and no significant sign of improvement after replacing the most unwanted man at Villa Park in living memory.
Summary of overall report = Say good bye as soon as possible at the end of the season.
Any advantage to sacking him now, not fully decided.

[Malandro]

[Damo70]

It isn't good that we seem to be forming a new bomb squad made up of players he himself has signed. Also, I have heard him being called inexperienced. Hasn't he had about ten years in management?

Just checked. This is his ninth season as a manager.

[N'ZMAV]

I don't know how manager have the face to bomb out players they've signed. Ridiculous really. Quite embarrassing.

[Ads]

Given this a lot of thought over the past few days and although I can fully understand where those calling for Lambert to be sacked are coming from, I wouldn't go down that route just yet.  He's still a fairly inexperienced manager and although his two seasons at the club have been pretty poor, I would give him one last chance to prove that he has learnt from the experience (providing we stay up - if we go down he should be sacked immediately).  I would personally give him the first ten games of next season and see where we stand after that.       

I can see where you are coming from. In order for it to work for any manager, they need to be backed.

He has been given money, but it has had to be spread so thin. We're likely to sign a new left back in the summer for the third window in a row. You can bemoan the collective failure of Lambert, Bennett and Luna, but then when you consider the outlay on two players is less than £2 million, it hardly constitutes a waste and more of a failed gamble. For every half a million pound Westwood or Bacuna that looks like they can offer something in a Premier League first XI and squad, you have your Bennett's and Luna's.

I want to see him given the opportunity to buy more players in that £5-8 million bracket, as when he does that he gets it right.

The quality of player and the right system should be symbiotic in the pursuit of good football. I think we lack both, when it comes to playing at home. I remember the style of football he wanted to play at West Ham, at home to Everton and away at Newcastle before abandoning it through a lack of quality to play that way. I still think that is how he wants to go about affairs, having stumbled on a system last January that he thought would see us through the next 18 months.

We have good strikers in Benteke and Kozak, good central players in Delph and Westwood- but that is where the quality stops. I want to see him given the opportunity to buy the midfielders capable of getting us on the front foot in a game at home and turning things around.