Aston Villa v Sheffield United Post-Match Thread

[ktvillan]

I wish the General was still here to tell us everything is going to be alright. And to phone Nicky Keys. Although on reflection the sickening displays of sycophancy shown towards him probably makes it best he's not.

I don't recall much sycophancy. General Krulak was and is deserving of respect. He didn't have to come on to the forums and put up with half the bullshit he did put up with.

Oh come on.  Many posters were so far up his arse they could see his tonsils.

He lost any respect he deserved by posting inane motherhood and apple pie stuff when asked direct questions about the issues that really mattered before disappearing off into the sunset when things got a bit heated.

edit - just seen Paulie's post - seems we've said pretty much the same things

To say there was little or no sycophancy requires a very selective memory, it was vomit inducing at times.   But to be fair to Krulak he was on a hiding to nothing.  He couldn't give too much away and what little he did was seized upon by the media and chancers like Gold, twisted every which way and sensationalised.  And at the end he was effectively left holding back a mass offensive in a shit-storm, armed with a wet lettuce.  I can't really blame him for saying "fuck this for a game of soldiers" and slinging his hook.   

[dave.woodhall]

Well obviously Iwon,t go too far into the General thing, but Ialways believed he was here purely for PR andwas always  amazed that the club didn't foresee how it would inevitably end.

For about the millionth time - the 'club' didn't particularly want him online and what he did was more or less independent of them.

[ChicagoLion]

I wish the General was still here to tell us everything is going to be alright. And to phone Nicky Keys. Although on reflection the sickening displays of sycophancy shown towards him probably makes it best he's not.

I don't recall much sycophancy. General Krulak was and is deserving of respect. He didn't have to come on to the forums and put up with half the bullshit he did put up with.

Oh come on.  Many posters were so far up his arse they could see his tonsils.

He lost any respect he deserved by posting inane motherhood and apple pie stuff when asked direct questions about the issues that really mattered before disappearing off into the sunset when things got a bit heated.

edit - just seen Paulie's post - seems we've said pretty much the same things

I agree totally oldhill. How dare Villa fans of 20 years or more standing have the temerity to question some guy who appeared from nowhere on here when things were good, had loads of soundbites, and then disappeared into the sunset PDQ when the shit started to hit the fan. He lost any respect I had for him totally and it was already wearing thin when he was on here

I kept saying at the time, but I dont see how they thought that disengaging like he did - ie disappearing from view - was the best way to withdraw from that whole "interaction with fan forums" thing.

Don't get me wrong, I think they were right to do it - we spent fucking ages asking people not to ask him certain things, and they'd ignore us and ask them over and again in any case - I entirely understand why they opted to withdraw.

What I will never understand is why they didn't go to the trouble of a two or three line post saying he was withdrawing, and maybe hinting at why. They were enough reasons to choose from.

They opted not to bother, though, and the inevitable result was that people thought "hang on, they just disappeared, right as the shit hits the fan for the first time". That was bad enough, but seeing as they didnt bother to tell us what they were doing, it then led people to think that they just weren't that bothered about what we thought.

I also thought that the "it's all just marketing bullshit" line some people had was harsh, but abruptly disappearing as he did made that argument look much stronger than it should have - it started to look like the minute it became more hassle than it was worth to them they knocked it on the head, and didn't really care about how it made them look. People then, inevitably, started thinking "shit, maybe it actually was mostly marketing bullshit, after all".

A big fuck up which could have been very, very easily avoided.

Its pretty obvious they just don't get it, the communication from the club is shocking
Moscow, Appointment of McLeish, Houlier at Anfield, the after match bullshit we have had to listen to from McLeish and now Lambert, Hold on to your seats and now Lamberts latest foot in the mouth stuff.

[dave.woodhall]

I wish the General was still here to tell us everything is going to be alright. And to phone Nicky Keys. Although on reflection the sickening displays of sycophancy shown towards him probably makes it best he's not.

I don't recall much sycophancy. General Krulak was and is deserving of respect. He didn't have to come on to the forums and put up with half the bullshit he did put up with.

Oh come on.  Many posters were so far up his arse they could see his tonsils.

He lost any respect he deserved by posting inane motherhood and apple pie stuff when asked direct questions about the issues that really mattered before disappearing off into the sunset when things got a bit heated.

edit - just seen Paulie's post - seems we've said pretty much the same things

To say there was little or no sycophancy requires a very selective memory, it was vomit inducing at times.   But to be fair to Krulak he was on a hiding to nothing.  He couldn't give too much away and what little he did was seized upon by the media and chancers like Gold, twisted every which way and sensationalised.  And at the end he was effectively left holding back a mass offensive in a shit-storm, armed with a wet lettuce.  I can't really blame him for saying "fuck this for a game of soldiers" and slinging his hook.   

Exactly. Then again, stick a member of a board that could do no wrong at the time in the middle of a group of supporters who were being treated like no club's supporters had ever been treated and what do you expect? It wasn't so much sycophancy as adulation crossed with incredulity. He couldn't talk about playing matters, every time he said something quotable it was back page headlines and as I keep saying, the whole episode started with good intentions but went on far too long.

[peter w]

Well obviously Iwon,t go too far into the General thing, but Ialways believed he was here purely for PR andwas always  amazed that the club didn't foresee how it would inevitably end.

For about the millionth time - the 'club' didn't particularly want him online and what he did was more or less independent of them.

Millionth time or no the was a board member on a fans forum. If he was so independent why did he constantly get people to call or speak to people at theclub regarding issues,or constantly say, "we hear you"? It may well be his choice to come on here and elsewhere but if Randy had been dead set against it it wouldn't have happened.

[pauliewalnuts]

Well obviously Iwon,t go too far into the General thing, but Ialways believed he was here purely for PR andwas always  amazed that the club didn't foresee how it would inevitably end.

For about the millionth time - the 'club' didn't particularly want him online and what he did was more or less independent of them.

Hmmm, but does that raise the question as to why, if they didn't want him online, he was here at all? And he wasn't independent of them when he was giving advice about tickets / issues raised by supporters / things he could answer (and there were a few good things).

He was - and still is - a director of the club, if he was really operating as some sort of lone gun, not with their approval, they should have reeled him in.

[ez]

I imagine when the General got wind of McLeish being hired his first thought would have been "how the fuck do I spin this?" He likely called a meeting of senior military staff to come up up a communication plan. All to no avail.

and Malcolm Tucker.

I always imagined Randy tipped him off about it and advised him to 'Get off those forums if I were you'

[dave.woodhall]

peter and paulie - Try stopping him. He was useful in opening communications channels and persuading fans that they really could pick up the phone and talk to someone at the other end who would listen and act. Once that was going he should have been able to step aside but he didn't want to, it probably wasn't seen as a big deal to force the issue and it was popular with the fans.   

[bertlambshank]

peter and paulie - Try stopping him. He was useful in opening communications channels and persuading fans that they really could pick up the phone and talk to someone at the other end who would listen and act. Once that was going he should have been able to step aside but he didn't want to, it probably wasn't seen as a big deal to force the issue and it was popular with the fans.   

Im confused now,did the club want him on here or not?

[dave.woodhall]

peter and paulie - Try stopping him. He was useful in opening communications channels and persuading fans that they really could pick up the phone and talk to someone at the other end who would listen and act. Once that was going he should have been able to step aside but he didn't want to, it probably wasn't seen as a big deal to force the issue and it was popular with the fans.   

Im confused now,did the club want him on here or not?

I think they tolerated it at first. Then it became awkward for many reasons.

[Ian.]

I'm sure like the rest of us on here The General got that little impulse and little nagging itch to just having a quick peak on H&V. Once your hooked...

[Chris Jameson]

I wish the General was still here to tell us everything is going to be alright. And to phone Nicky Keys. Although on reflection the sickening displays of sycophancy shown towards him probably makes it best he's not.

I don't recall much sycophancy.

Seriously? Some of it was quite sickly. Ask Nicky Keys.

[pauliewalnuts]

peter and paulie - Try stopping him. He was useful in opening communications channels and persuading fans that they really could pick up the phone and talk to someone at the other end who would listen and act. Once that was going he should have been able to step aside but he didn't want to, it probably wasn't seen as a big deal to force the issue and it was popular with the fans.   

Im confused now,did the club want him on here or not?

I think they tolerated it at first. Then it became awkward for many reasons.

If anyone could have stopped him, surely it'd be Randy? Are we that badly run that we can't control a strong willed Director of the club?

I mean no disrespect to General Krulak whatsoever, but to be fair, it was absolutely guaranteed to end in tears - can you imagine the sort of shit he'd be getting here right now if he were still around, for example?

The whole thing, I think, was done with good intentions, and I don't agree it was entirely about marketing, either. I also think that those people who gave him personal shit were extremely out of order.

Like I said, the sad thing is that it was handled so poorly - both in terms that, seemingly, he was on the internet posting  in what was, to all intents and purposes, seen as an official capacity, but they couldn't stop him doing it (which I find hard to believe), but also in the sense that when it ended, they didn't really give the first thought to withdrawing carefully.

It looked too much like they weren't overly arsed, and that was easily avoidable.

[damon loves JT]

Gosh, the General. Back in the good old days. When the worst thing that had happened was Marlon Harewood

[SashasGrandad]

Maybe the club need somebody new in the PR/media role? In addition to new centre half, midfielders etc.

It might help us get the new players if the club's image outside B6 was a bit more positive and not like being on the sun deck of the Titanic!