Delph for England

[paul_e]

Delph looks good in what quite frankly is a poor midfield - he has been our best outfield player this season .
I don't think he should be in the England squad at this moment in time but I do agree there are some in the squad less deserving than him .

All Delph can do is keep performing to a high consistent level and see where it takes him .

The best player in a poor midfield is, for me, a shit argument.  That's basically advocating the approach of picking bit part players from the clubs in the champions league because whilst they're anonymous at least they're being anonymous with better players around them.  Delph is standing up to be counted and has made us tick so far this season, that deserves recognition.

[Mister E]

Delph needs to score some of the goals he used to convert for Leeds.
His overall contribution is good and he has versatility in his play - I think he'd make a very wing-back and can cover at FB. He now needs to be a little more composed and sharpen his decision-making (particularly when going in for the ball).

paul_e's stats show what we see from week to week: he's not just good in a poor midfield: he's actually good by comparison with his peers.

My cynical / selfish side agrees with UK Redsox - we should be pleased that he has been passed over.

[eastie]

Delph looks good in what quite frankly is a poor midfield - he has been our best outfield player this season .
I don't think he should be in the England squad at this moment in time but I do agree there are some in the squad less deserving than him .

All Delph can do is keep performing to a high consistent level and see where it takes him .

The best player in a poor midfield is, for me, a shit argument.  That's basically advocating the approach of picking bit part players from the clubs in the champions league because whilst they're anonymous at least they're being anonymous with better players around them.  Delph is standing up to be counted and has made us tick so far this season, that deserves recognition.

It's not an argument - its a statement , he's the best player by a distance in a poor midfield , not meant in anyway to be a detrimental comment towards him - is he international class - not in my opinion at this moment in time , but he may well as his career progresses.

Henderson and cleverly to name but 2 are also not international class at this moment - it's all about opinions.
Last April there was a clamour for Lowton and Westwood to maybe get called up - Delph is having a great start to the season - let him carry on as he is doing in a villa shirt .

Delph has been outstanding for us iin the last 2 months - if he continuous his improvement in form and consistency then rewards will follow, he's not there yet but he's not too far off .

[PGW]

I know a lot of people on here think that statistics are pointless and I won't try to convince them otherwise but I do think it's worth popping up the whoscored statistics for the entire premier league this season right now...

Linky

For anyone who can't be bothered to click, using OPTA stats whoscored give players a rating based on their effect on the game.  Fabian Delph is currently the 19th best player in premier league on their model with an average rating of 7.48 (out of 10)

To me that suggests his form is so good that he can't be ignored by England on footballing grounds.

For info the only England players (named in the squad) above him are Townsend, Gerrard, Johnson and Sturridge.

Henderson - 7.12
Barkley - 7.18
Cleverley - 6.73
Lallana - 7.29
Wilshere (for info) - 6.88
Shelvey (he got mentioned) - 6.68

The numbers back up my thinking that of the lot Lallana and Delph are the 2 who deserve to be in the squad.

So on this basis Curtis Davies should be in ahead of both Jagielka and Cahill!!!

[eamonn]

Personally - I think he is not international quality - he looks good in our midfield because he is playing with others who are struggling.

He is good at what he does - but does not score or create - as others on this thread have already mentioned.

Delph is more akin to Lee Hendrie, Downing etc. - rather than Mortimer, Cowans, Milner, Barry, who were all worthy of England places

Milner doesn't belong in that list and Delph has just as good an engine as him but is more gifted with the ball at his feet.

[paul_e]

I know a lot of people on here think that statistics are pointless and I won't try to convince them otherwise but I do think it's worth popping up the whoscored statistics for the entire premier league this season right now...

Linky

For anyone who can't be bothered to click, using OPTA stats whoscored give players a rating based on their effect on the game.  Fabian Delph is currently the 19th best player in premier league on their model with an average rating of 7.48 (out of 10)

To me that suggests his form is so good that he can't be ignored by England on footballing grounds.

For info the only England players (named in the squad) above him are Townsend, Gerrard, Johnson and Sturridge.

Henderson - 7.12
Barkley - 7.18
Cleverley - 6.73
Lallana - 7.29
Wilshere (for info) - 6.88
Shelvey (he got mentioned) - 6.68

The numbers back up my thinking that of the lot Lallana and Delph are the 2 who deserve to be in the squad.

So on this basis Curtis Davies should be in ahead of both Jagielka and Cahill!!!

No, that's completely missing the point and extending an argument far beyond it's intention in an attempt to make it it look stupid, which is pretty petty.

Everyone agrees, I assume, That Andros Townsend deserves to be in the squad, and the stats back that up as he's the most effective English midfielder in the league at the minute, but by picking him we didn't drop Gerrard, we 'dropped' Oxlade-Chamberlain (who actually missed out through injury but that's not really important) i.e. one of the weaker midfielders.

In defence you wouldn't be dropping either of the guys you named, you might drop Smalling or Jones to give Davies a place though, and there's a fair argument that you should.

If a striker appears and scores loads you wouldn't expect the choice to be between him or Rooney but it would be fair to bring him in ahead of Welbeck or Rodriguez.

At any point you should be willing to look at the weaker members of the squad and ask if there's a player in form who deserves a call up ahead of them and in real terms that means does Delph deserve a call up ahead of Cleverley/Barkley/Henderson and the answer to all of those is yes.

[PGW]

No i don't think i was missing the point, the point i suppose is what i said in an earlier post that football is a great game due in part to being all about opinions - and in this case all about the opinion of Roy Hodgson and the fact that he has upset a number of Villa fans( i'm not one of them) due to omitting Fabian Delph from his squad. Like i suppose us disagreeing with Paul Lambert's selection policy at times.

The point about Curtis Davies was meant to be tongue in cheek i suppose comparing him to Cahill & Jagielka but you make a fair point about Jones and Smalling but i suppose they are both in the squad due to their versatility.
I sincerely do NOT believe that Delph is ready for an England squad yet based on the poor quality of his first touch, he would get punished at International level because of it. If he improves that part of his game then maybe in the future....i hope so but it won't be this side of the World Cup i'm afraid to say.

[Dave]

you make a fair point about Jones and Smalling but i suppose they are both in the squad due to their versatility.

I can think of a bigger link between the two of them to mean that it's likely they will be picked in an England squad.

[PGW]

you make a fair point about Jones and Smalling but i suppose they are both in the squad due to their versatility.

I can think of a bigger link between the two of them to mean that it's likely they will be picked in an England squad.

It wouldn't ba a team that plays in red would it?

[supertom]

I would argue given Curtis Davies's form early in the season, that an England call up wouldn't be entirely out of the blue. He's been in the squad before and a lot was expected of him when he was around 19-20, as much, if not more than Cahill at that age. I'd have him ahead of Smalling in the pecking order. In terms of versatility, England are quite solid at right back so a center half who can also play there isn't entirely necessary.

[paul_e]

No i don't think i was missing the point, the point i suppose is what i said in an earlier post that football is a great game due in part to being all about opinions - and in this case all about the opinion of Roy Hodgson and the fact that he has upset a number of Villa fans( i'm not one of them) due to omitting Fabian Delph from his squad. Like i suppose us disagreeing with Paul Lambert's selection policy at times.

The point about Curtis Davies was meant to be tongue in cheek i suppose comparing him to Cahill & Jagielka but you make a fair point about Jones and Smalling but i suppose they are both in the squad due to their versatility.
I sincerely do NOT believe that Delph is ready for an England squad yet based on the poor quality of his first touch, he would get punished at International level because of it. If he improves that part of his game then maybe in the future....i hope so but it won't be this side of the World Cup i'm afraid to say.

I don't know if he would struggle internationally because of his touch or not but I think his form is such that he deserves a chance to see if he can step up.  There have been a lot of players over the years who have been capped despite perceived limitations.  I also think his touch now is much better, heavy touches were the route of most of his bookings for a long time but not so much this season.

[bobdylan]

Personally - I think he is not international quality - he looks good in our midfield because he is playing with others who are struggling.

He is good at what he does - but does not score or create - as others on this thread have already mentioned.

Delph is more akin to Lee Hendrie, Downing etc. - rather than Mortimer, Cowans, Milner, Barry, who were all worthy of England places

Milner doesn't belong in that list and Delph has just as good an engine as him but is more gifted with the ball at his feet.

No way is Delph more gifted with the ball at his feet than Milner, completely disagree and their careers to date back this up.

[Meanwood Villa]

Personally - I think he is not international quality - he looks good in our midfield because he is playing with others who are struggling.

He is good at what he does - but does not score or create - as others on this thread have already mentioned.

Delph is more akin to Lee Hendrie, Downing etc. - rather than Mortimer, Cowans, Milner, Barry, who were all worthy of England places

Milner doesn't belong in that list and Delph has just as good an engine as him but is more gifted with the ball at his feet.

Milner was outstanding in central midfield in that season he played there for us. If he hadn't gone to be a substitute winger/full back for Citeh who knows how good he'd have got. Compared to Jimmy who scored, created and tackled Delph has done next to nothing.

[supertom]

No i don't think i was missing the point, the point i suppose is what i said in an earlier post that football is a great game due in part to being all about opinions - and in this case all about the opinion of Roy Hodgson and the fact that he has upset a number of Villa fans( i'm not one of them) due to omitting Fabian Delph from his squad. Like i suppose us disagreeing with Paul Lambert's selection policy at times.

The point about Curtis Davies was meant to be tongue in cheek i suppose comparing him to Cahill & Jagielka but you make a fair point about Jones and Smalling but i suppose they are both in the squad due to their versatility.
I sincerely do NOT believe that Delph is ready for an England squad yet based on the poor quality of his first touch, he would get punished at International level because of it. If he improves that part of his game then maybe in the future....i hope so but it won't be this side of the World Cup i'm afraid to say.

I don't know if he would struggle internationally because of his touch or not but I think his form is such that he deserves a chance to see if he can step up.  There have been a lot of players over the years who have been capped despite perceived limitations.  I also think his touch now is much better, heavy touches were the route of most of his bookings for a long time but not so much this season.

Englands game isn't entirely reliant on touch. If we've tried altering our game rather than playing too our strengths, it generally doesn't work. We'll never be like a lot of the sides in Europe who are comfortable on the ball.

England have always tended to see, what you'd call more limited players as the potential "missing link." Like Parker, Hargreaves etc. Not that Delph is all that limited, but while he might not be as comfortable with the ball as some of the other England mids, what he can offer in mobility makes him worth picking I think.

[eastie]

Personally - I think he is not international quality - he looks good in our midfield because he is playing with others who are struggling.

He is good at what he does - but does not score or create - as others on this thread have already mentioned.

Delph is more akin to Lee Hendrie, Downing etc. - rather than Mortimer, Cowans, Milner, Barry, who were all worthy of England places

Milner doesn't belong in that list and Delph has just as good an engine as him but is more gifted with the ball at his feet.

Milner was outstanding in central midfield in that season he played there for us. If he hadn't gone to be a substitute winger/full back for Citeh who knows how good he'd have got. Compared to Jimmy who scored, created and tackled Delph has done next to nothing.

Agree totally meanwood - Milner was far better .