Jores Okore

[Steve67]

Okore and Clark was probably our best centre back partnership of the last few seasons, I think it would be folly to just turf him out. I'd rather Black went if anybody.

And yet they make/made mistake after mistake, game after game.  Not having a go mate.  I think they are both very ordinary players. Five mill for Clark is daylight robbery, if true of course that this is what his release fee is.  Okore starting just 36 game since he signed, when we need him to get through 46 in one season tells me that we need to get rid. Defensively, apart from Amavi, start again. Okore might be ok if we have a beast next to him, an organiser like a John Terry, but we'd still get the injuries.

[PeterWithesShin]

I should probably clarify it's 36 league starts (and 2 sub appearances) for us, he started another half a dozen cup games. Not much better but just to be clear.

[paul_e]

Starting again just isn't an option and people really need to forget about it.  Making the 15-16 changes to the squad that some are advocating would be just as bad as doing nothing.  This summer should be focused on removing the ones who've created the atmosphere that allowed us to fail with a squad that, on paper, shouldn't have been adrift. The players like Clark, Westwood and Gestede who've looked a bit out of their depth could well be good enough to help us get back up and we should keep them to avoid making too many changes in 1 go.

[Concrete John]

Starting again just isn't an option and people really need to forget about it.  Making the 15-16 changes to the squad that some are advocating would be just as bad as doing nothing.  This summer should be focused on removing the ones who've created the atmosphere that allowed us to fail with a squad that, on paper, shouldn't have been adrift. The players like Clark, Westwood and Gestede who've looked a bit out of their depth could well be good enough to help us get back up and we should keep them to avoid making too many changes in 1 go.

Totally agree.  It will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get everything done.

I'd honestly look at it as a 2 year project to get back to the Premier League.

[brontebilly]

Starting again just isn't an option and people really need to forget about it.  Making the 15-16 changes to the squad that some are advocating would be just as bad as doing nothing.  This summer should be focused on removing the ones who've created the atmosphere that allowed us to fail with a squad that, on paper, shouldn't have been adrift. The players like Clark, Westwood and Gestede who've looked a bit out of their depth could well be good enough to help us get back up and we should keep them to avoid making too many changes in 1 go.

Totally agree.  It will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get everything done.

I'd honestly look at it as a 2 year project to get back to the Premier League.

with the parachute relegation money, Newcastle and Villa should walk the second division next term

if it slips another year, the money may dry up and any remaining asset would be gone

In terms of budget, Newcastle, Villa, Norwich and Derby at a stretch should be miles ahead of the rest

cant see anyone else in the division doing a Middlesboro and spunking crazy money on the likes of Downing and Rhodes this summer

immediate promotion has to be the target

[Steve67]

Starting again just isn't an option and people really need to forget about it.  Making the 15-16 changes to the squad that some are advocating would be just as bad as doing nothing.  This summer should be focused on removing the ones who've created the atmosphere that allowed us to fail with a squad that, on paper, shouldn't have been adrift. The players like Clark, Westwood and Gestede who've looked a bit out of their depth could well be good enough to help us get back up and we should keep them to avoid making too many changes in 1 go.

Totally agree.  It will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get everything done.

I'd honestly look at it as a 2 year project to get back to the Premier League.

And yet, if many of the players we signed have release clauses, they can go and will need replacing, therefore, we might just see a fair few changes. I agree that it will take more than one window to sort but I was only talking about the defence, not the whole squad when I say start again.  If we can keep Gueye, Ayew and Veretout, add a toughie for the middle of the park, we might do well.

[paul_e]

Starting again just isn't an option and people really need to forget about it.  Making the 15-16 changes to the squad that some are advocating would be just as bad as doing nothing.  This summer should be focused on removing the ones who've created the atmosphere that allowed us to fail with a squad that, on paper, shouldn't have been adrift. The players like Clark, Westwood and Gestede who've looked a bit out of their depth could well be good enough to help us get back up and we should keep them to avoid making too many changes in 1 go.

Totally agree.  It will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get everything done.

I'd honestly look at it as a 2 year project to get back to the Premier League.

And yet, if many of the players we signed have release clauses, they can go and will need replacing, therefore, we might just see a fair few changes. I agree that it will take more than one window to sort but I was only talking about the defence, not the whole squad when I say start again.  If we can keep Gueye, Ayew and Veretout, add a toughie for the middle of the park, we might do well.

I understand but if you remove everyone except amavi that means 7 defenders minimum, then add a keeper and with a few others going you're quickly up to 12-13 players just to have a full squad and that's too many changes for me.  For that reason, Clark, Baker, Bennett, Hutton and Okore can all stay this summer (unless we get a good offer for one of them) that way there's a chance that 1 or 2 of them will step up and show they can be of use again once we're back up as well.

I think we need to try to get back up in 1 year though.  If Xia isn't as rich as we want then the money is important, if he's loaded then as soon as we're back up we can start going for signings of a level or 2 above where we've been and try to get ourselves firmly in the top half straight away.  In either case getting there quick is important.

[pbavfckuwait]

We are going to have them changes whether we want them or not and as some of the oxygen thieves are going to cost us to shift, if getting rid of Okore and Clark if the money that is offered is right, is what is required fair enough, these are two components of what has been a truly awful defence and they have all played their part with individual mistakes and having no organizational skills at all.
If we got 8 or 9 million for the pair, to me that would be thank you and bye bye.

[brian green]

Pubehead will attract a lot of media attention in the Euros and that will give Clark the chance to showcase himself.  Good offers will come in for him that could see him sold.  I like him and I think his career has been seriously held back by playing shit or bust games for shit or bust managers in bad teams.  I wish him well whatever the future holds.

[mr underhill]

if offers come in, I'd not hesitate to sell every defender we have with the exception of Amavi and start again.

[brian green]

My big hope for the incoming manager is that he will be bold and that Tony Xia backs the boldness by the amounts he is prepared to spend.  We should never, ever forget just how bad we were last season.

[aj2k77]

My big hope for the incoming manager is that he will be bold and that Tony Xia backs the boldness by the amounts he is prepared to spend.  We should never, ever forget just how bad we were last season.

Spot on again Brian. We will have a few months without having to watch us getting routinely beaten, other things will distract our minds, there may be a feel good factor with a new manager and owner but the bottom line is the club has been broken over the last 5 years and it's going to take a hell of a lot of joined up thinking and hard work to get us back in the right direction.

Turning up with the same group of players and expecting us to steam roll the division is just not going to happen. We can't be complacent on how much work is needed between now and August, just over 2 months away...

[Ads]

RDM signed 13 players on permanent and loan deals in the season he got the Bitters promoted.

[Edvard Remberg]

If you were Okare and you had put your career on the line while playing with major injury problems then you would feel rather pissed off that you couldn't get into the team later on and feel the "club" owed you similar loyalty. However similarly if your Black, you'd have to say he owed Okare no such loyalty as he wasn't here then.  That's just how it goes in real life. You put yourself out for the management while others don't and your back to square one when a new guy comes in. Welcome to real life Jores

or was it that Okore was upset that Richards was getting in ahead of him, somebody who looked as though he didn't give a f***.

Okore deserves another shot at the CB shirt, IMHO. And at the Villa.

This is where I am - as he absolutely has shown quality in patches. As with any CB - consistency is what proves a good CB - and we have not had a solid 2 CB for 5 seasons (injury mostly the reason)

[Steve67]

Okore is consistently inconsistent, that's the problem, same as Clark, Baker and Lescott. Reliable? No. Dependable? No. There is a player in there somewhere, but he needs to find the above elements to his game.