The Cricket Thread 2013

[paul_e]

England's attack as a whole has looked piss poor in all forms of cricket on flat wickets. Not that we'll get too many of those in the forthcoming Ashes series.

What we seem to lack is the ability to vary things when the pitch/conditions aren't helpful. This is true of most bowlers we could pick. Anderson with the new ball apart, it didn't seem to matter who was bowling all deliveries seemed to be of a similar speed line and length.

Finn ought to improve things but I'm not too sure about Broad who seems to pick up clutches of wickets every now and then but gets spanked around the ground fairly regularly.

Dernbach really is just too expensive. Woakes is still a developing player and should not be discarded completely. He certainly has the temperament for this level of cricket.

Interesting ODI career comparison :-

Broad - Batting ave : 12.23, Bowling Econ : 5.19
Woakes  - batting : 23.5 Bowling :  5.66

The numbers aren't that significant given the relative length of their careers, but it would be a mistake to think the return of Broad will make that big a difference.

In ODIs, Woakes' lack of pace shouldn't matter. It seems to be a well accepted principle that scoring becomes more difficult when there is less pace on the ball.

He needs to learn more about the art of bowling rather than look for extra yards of speed.

Paul Collingwood was no Denis Lillee but his ODI bowling economy was 4.96

Broads figures are pretty misleading - he's been a much more accurate bowler in the last few years.

[PaulWinch again]

Whether it's pace or the art of bowling, Woakes needs to learn something because he has looked really short of international quality with the ball. Dernbach has to go back to county cricket and work out how to bowl a stock delivery, the variation by definition should add variety not be the standard.

[Villan For Life]

Whether it's pace or the art of bowling, Woakes needs to learn something because he has looked really short of international quality with the ball. Dernbach has to go back to county cricket and work out how to bowl a stock delivery, the variation by definition should add variety not be the standard.

I agree. Dernbach seems to be a product of the 20/20 generation. Bowling dross is unacceptable across 24 balls in a 20 over thrash; bowling dross across 60 balls of an ODI is contemptible. I wouldn't pick him again. His game has not developed in any way. He needs to learn the art of building pressure by bowling dot balls which he does not do. His career economy rate is over 6; compare that with Jimmy Anderson whose career economy rate is less than 5.

Woakes needs time away from the international team, time in which to learn more about his art. That said, I'm not convinced that he is international class.

[paul_e]

Whether it's pace or the art of bowling, Woakes needs to learn something because he has looked really short of international quality with the ball. Dernbach has to go back to county cricket and work out how to bowl a stock delivery, the variation by definition should add variety not be the standard.

I agree. Dernbach seems to be a product of the 20/20 generation. Bowling dross is unacceptable across 24 balls in a 20 over thrash; bowling dross across 60 balls of an ODI is contemptible. I wouldn't pick him again. His game has not developed in any way. He needs to learn the art of building pressure by bowling dot balls which he does not do. His career economy rate is over 6; compare that with Jimmy Anderson whose career economy rate is less than 5.

Woakes needs time away from the international team, time in which to learn more about his art. That said, I'm not convinced that he is international class.

Comparing any other bowler in england to Jimmy is unfair, the guy is comfortably the best bowler in the country.  Finn is a better comparison, he had similar stats after 10-12 matches, but Finn then improved at a much better rate.

As PaulW says above, the issue is that he doesn't have a stock delivery.  He should, by now have developed the slightly fuller inswinger as his stock ball, with his slow yorker (which is the reason he gets picked, it's a beauty) as his main variation.  By having the variation similar in line and length to his stock ball the slower delivery is much more likely to be mistimed, making it a yorker length just makes it tougher to play.  If he can learn that control he'll get a lot of clean bowled and lbw wickets.  The bggest issue is his age.  He's 27 now, he should be much more reliable, he still bowls like a 20 year old.

[PaulWinch again]

Off the top of my head I'd be looking at Tremlett(if he's fit), Onions, Harris or Wood as options and that's just off the top of my head.

[PaulWinch again]

If Napier can bowl like that he deserves a shot, useful bat as well.

[Steve R]

Not too sure about Broad at all, both he and Woaks played all three ODIs in NZ - Woakes had the better returns. Broad went for nearly 6 an over.

[PaulWinch again]

Broad is fine provided he's not bowling too short and he has proven Test class.

[PaulWinch again]

Australia 36-6 against India.

[Villan For Life]

Australia 36-6 against India.

65 all out. India won by 243 runs.

A remarkable recovery by India this morning. 55 - 5 off 16.1 overs to 308 - 6 off 50 overs.

Only a warm up game and you are able to mix and match your batting line up from your squad but it's still a very poor performance from the Crims.

[PaulWinch again]

Jamie Overton looks a good prospect as a bowler, quick and accurate.

[DB]

Australia 36-6 against India.

65 all out. India won by 243 runs.

A remarkable recovery by India this morning. 55 - 5 off 16.1 overs to 308 - 6 off 50 overs.

Only a warm up game and you are able to mix and match your batting line up from your squad but it's still a very poor performance from the Crims.

Aye, not looking to 'ripper' are they and with Clarke a doubt too....

[PaulWinch again]

Glad Finn and Broad are fit, and it's also fair enough that Woakes and Dernbach are dropped. Bopara gets another opportunity.

[PGW]

Apparently Dernbach is hot footing it back to Guildford to play for Surrey against the Bears!!!!

What are the rules as i know Bresnan was allowed to play for Yorkshire when he was left out first One Dayer.

Can 2 players from same county when released go and play for their county - IE Woakes and Rankin have presumably been released or are they required for Saturdays game at Edgbaston against the Aussies. Or does the rule state that only one ''substitute'' is allowed..........Woakes or Rankin?

[PGW]

just said on Bears commentary that Dernbach and Rankin have been released by England and both can play in game from tomorrow - assume that Woakes then has been retained in squad for ICC Trophy.