Aston Villa v Tottenham Hotspur Post-Match Thread

[Dave Clark Five]

Why we got so many bloody injuries ?          it was bad when Houlier was manager too . what they f**k are they doing in training. Just let them stick to the playstation please.

'Twas ever thus. The few good players invariably get injured, sometimes for so long that you forget we have them.

[saunders_heroes]

I don't think they need to be proven in the Premiership. Johnny Foreigner seems to have an ability to play the game and not cost as much as established Premiership players.

Look at Jacob, Mulumbu, Michu and Olsen. They'd have cost us less than £3 million and would have us competing in the top half.

Premier League quality is what I meant. If they come from abroad, that's fine.  It's the obsession with signing "young and hungry" players from the lower leagues that pisses me off. "Young and hungry" is just code for "cheap" in reality.

Whilst I agree with you Saunders, it's going to be mighty difficult to persuade quality players to come here for a relegation scrap.
The horse has bolted, the signings should have been made in the Summer and bearing in mind the paucity of the squad, £23m was not nearly enough.

As others have pointed out on here, the TV revenues shoot up 70% next season, get relegated and it will be harder than ever to get back up.

And yes, it is Lerner's fault, all very well saying about all the good things he's done in the past, but it means Jack Shit if you're going to pull the ladder up when you lose interest.
A Premiership club needs continual and sustained investment, not just when you feel like it, if he didn't realise that, he should never have become a 'custodian' in the first place.

Players will come if you pay them the going rate. People talk of the cash we spent last summer, and yes we did spend a lot of money. The problem with our spending these days is that we simply refuse to pay the wages for PL standard players. That's why we have to sign players from the lower leagues on a pittance who are clearly out of their depth. Until this ridiculous policy is scrapped we'll continue to struggle and spiral into decline.
Lerner is to blame, full stop.

[JUAN PABLO]

well If we sell the likes of Bent and replace with Murray from palace.   championship here we come.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

well If we sell the likes of Bent and replace with Murray from palace.   championship here we come.

Charlie Austin more like.

[nigel]

I remember Gary Neville saying he likes to watch Villa now as they use to bore him to death. No f**king wonder , there is plenty of goals .
Can I have being bored to death just to stay in this league this season.

Last season it was: I'd rather us play football and lose than play boring, not to lose, football.
I lost count of the number of comments: Rather a 4-3 loss than a poor 1-1 draw, or a poor 1-0 win

We've been well and truly thumped the last two game, but we still tried to play football.
I've said nearly all season that we need our midfield needs beefing up as we're pretty light weight in the middle. that's why we got thumped so heavily in the last two games.

[Mister E]

Can you just explain what "find and deploy the key to each players personal motivation triggers" means exactly?

What I meant was that people have various psychological drivers that individually get them pumped up and focussed. Sports psychologists are able to identify these and help players to perform more effectively as a result. What we've seen over the last two games is a set of players whose heads have 'gone' after the first couple of goals; they seem mentally fragile even though coming off two excellent games.

Get the experienced players lifting the team in a more responsible manner - Have I missed something, are they not at the moment then?

I don't know! but it doesn't look like it to me.

Get some experience in the dressing room - even non-players like Vlaar and Petrov should be in there pre-game to lift the players and instill some confidence; Again, they are probably already doing this, especially Vlaar.  Do you know different?

Ditto; I don't know but it would help if they were.

And the reason we couldn't "bounce back the way they did in the cup at Norwich and not against Tottenham" are because Tottenham have far more quality than us in every department - it's not really a fair fight anymore.

I'd agree to a point, but Spurs have shown frailty in their results this season; they're not unbeatable. The fact is that we didn't go out there with a winning mentality. The players who have demonstrated resilience and skills previously just were not 'at the races'.
Against Chelsea Benitez out-thought PL and PL did not respond during the game to right what was wrong. And Chelsea - in full flow - are formidable.

We can over analyse this all we like, truth is, we have an inexperienced team with players that particularly against top opposition are being outclassed.  Our squad isn't good enough and we have injuries to boot.  Lets just thank McGrath we don't play Chelsea and Spurzz every week.

You're right to a point but we weren't outclassed against ManUre or Arsenal - in fact we gave them both a decent game. What happened this week is more about PL getting things wrong tactically and the players losing the plot psychologically.

[JUAN PABLO]

I remember Gary Neville saying he likes to watch Villa now as they use to bore him to death. No f**king wonder , there is plenty of goals .
Can I have being bored to death just to stay in this league this season.

Last season it was: I'd rather us play football and lose than play boring, not to lose, football.
I lost count of the number of comments: Rather a 4-3 loss than a poor 1-1 draw, or a poor 1-0 win

We've been well and truly thumped the last two game, but we still tried to play football.
I've said nearly all season that we need our midfield needs beefing up as we're pretty light weight in the middle. that's why we got thumped so heavily in the last two games.

well Sky love putting us on as we always get spanked , probably why Neville likes us , he also said Villa Park was his fave ground and we know why.
 I didnt see any football being played last night , we were embarrassing , we looked like a division four outfit to be fair . 
Of course last year was awful , worse I can remember in a long time , I use to get depressed now im just embarrassed at least .


4-3 loss was what I was expecting a few times not exactly a 4 -0 home loss and a 8 (should have been 13 ) drubbing.

[brian green]

I agree that paying low wages is and will be a barrier to signing better quality players.   I am not defending the policy of cutting the wages bill at the cost of jeopardizing our Premiership survival but the reason why it has come about is that the cheese parers on the board can point at any number of players signed by previous managers who have been brought in on grossly inflated money and excessively long contracts.   The rumour has it that the player who only came on a sub for Tottenham yesterday was on his way to us on £100K a week until Lerner said no.   Was that a wise decision or a foolish one?   Only time will tell.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

When I saw Parker coming on, I thought to myself that he's just the sort of player we need.

Instead we have to contend with the likes of KEA and bomb scare Holman.

[JUAN PABLO]

When I saw Parker coming on, I thought to myself that he's just the sort of player we need.

Insted we have to contend with the likes of KEA and bomb scare Holman.

More chance of Parker and Lady Penelope in the midfield

[Ron Manager]

This reminds me very much of the mid sixties, even worse perhaps. The club then had five good or very good players in Withers,Sleewenhoek,Burrows Woosnam and Hateley. The others just made up the numbers. They were not good enough and we were relegated.

We have even less of the required standard of player now. I dont know what Lambert can do. If Mr Lerner for whatever reason does not provide him with substantial funds then Mr Lambert has a huge task on his hands to keep us up.

Its obvious from his interviews on Sky he is not a great verbal motivator of players and I personally did not like the way in which he dealt with the Darren Bent situation.

If he was told before he took on the job he would have very little finance to play with all well and good he must have accepted that.

I, however, would have expected better than we have got after five months.

Mr Lerner may have personal problems but a lot of money I think. If he has lost interest thats his perogative, perhaps he should attempt to sell the club on and make even more money.

but my New Years wish is that he would say anything at all regarding the future of Aston Villa

So we will all know where we stand!

[Dave Clark Five]

Don't hold your breath.

[paul_e]

Players will come if you pay them the going rate. People talk of the cash we spent last summer, and yes we did spend a lot of money. The problem with our spending these days is that we simply refuse to pay the wages for PL standard players. That's why we have to sign players from the lower leagues on a pittance who are clearly out of their depth. Until this ridiculous policy is scrapped we'll continue to struggle and spiral into decline.
Lerner is to blame, full stop.

I disagree.  I don't think the quality of the signings is anything like that.

I think Lambert looked at the squad and saw:

Given, Dunne, Ireland, Nzogbia, Gabby and Bent and though he had enough premier league experience that he could add a couple of experienced internationals (Vlaar and KEA) along with another who'd already been signed and then fill the squad out with promising players who would grow around that experienced core.

The problem is:

Given - Not the player he was, had a really poor world cup and started the season in terrible form.
Dunne - Was due back in september but is still sidelined, has never been available to PL
Ireland - Looks pretty but offers very little end product
Nzogbia - See Ireland but add in a hint of headless chicken
Gabby - No longer a goal threat so is all hard work but again very little end product
Bent - Needed the 3 above to produce for him to be the player he can be
Vlaar - Started very well, injury is a big blow
KEA - Hasn't looked up to speed with the league at all
Holman - Works hard and does offer something around the box but he gives the ball away too much

So of that list the only one who has really provided the backbone we should've expected is Vlaar.

That's the problem.

It's very easy to shout that Lerner needs to throw more money at it but the reality is the experience we need should be there in the main but for whatever reason all but 1 of them are offering well below the requirements (and their own abilities).

[arnie66]

Well its the morning after the night before....again.

I drove back to Bristol last night feeling very deflated and depressed, not helped by a 1hr delay on the M5......but it also gave me a chance to think and try to clear my head.  I was thinking about the following - although I have no answers as yet:

1 One up front - was this out of necessity through injuries or a reaction to Chelsea...but did we really expect to contain one of the best attacks in the league for 90 mins

2 Why is there so much space between our defence and forwards.  There were times last night when there was actually 40 yards for Spurs to run in to.  Lambert was on the side shouting for us to compress the space but we just didn't.  In other games this season we have done this which allowed us to close players down quickly.

3 It looked like a senior side versus a youth team last night in physical size - especially in the middle.  The better sides all seem to have a physical but athletic presence in the middle.  We seem very small and weak in the most important area of the pitch.

4 I know we are young and inexperienced but surely we should have a degree of technical ability required at this level.  Last night our first touch was poor and we didn't seem able to control it the way Spurs did.

5 Despite everything that happened on the pitch - I was so proud of our support in the last 10 mins

6 Like any business that's having a hard time the employees look for leadership and direction.  As a struggling business we need to have a visible Chairman with a very specific commitment to the club and a plan to work with.....I hate feeling like we are a ruder-less ship.  So lets have some leadership Mr Lerner.

This morning I also feel a sense of perspective.....I thought this season would be a roller coaster of ups and downs and that's exactly how its turning out.  Currently we are in a down period, Saturday can resolve that for us.  The one thing i am sure of is that the young kids will be hurting as much as we are and the only thing we can do to help is get behind them on Saturday.

[JUAN PABLO]

Players will come if you pay them the going rate. People talk of the cash we spent last summer, and yes we did spend a lot of money. The problem with our spending these days is that we simply refuse to pay the wages for PL standard players. That's why we have to sign players from the lower leagues on a pittance who are clearly out of their depth. Until this ridiculous policy is scrapped we'll continue to struggle and spiral into decline.
Lerner is to blame, full stop.

I disagree.  I don't think the quality of the signings is anything like that.

I think Lambert looked at the squad and saw:

Given, Dunne, Ireland, Nzogbia, Gabby and Bent and though he had enough premier league experience that he could add a couple of experienced internationals (Vlaar and KEA) along with another who'd already been signed and then fill the squad out with promising players who would grow around that experienced core.

The problem is:

Given - Not the player he was, had a really poor world cup and started the season in terrible form.
Dunne - Was due back in september but is still sidelined, has never been available to PL
Ireland - Looks pretty but offers very little end product
Nzogbia - See Ireland but add in a hint of headless chicken
Gabby - No longer a goal threat so is all hard work but again very little end product
Bent - Needed the 3 above to produce for him to be the player he can be
Vlaar - Started very well, injury is a big blow
KEA - Hasn't looked up to speed with the league at all
Holman - Works hard and does offer something around the box but he gives the ball away too much

So of that list the only one who has really provided the backbone we should've expected is Vlaar.

That's the problem.

It's very easy to shout that Lerner needs to throw more money at it but the reality is the experience we need should be there in the main but for whatever reason all but 1 of them are offering well below the requirements (and their own abilities).

agree . I thought with the experience we had and the young players coming in and the young ones already at the club , samir and Gardner etc we would have enough until we looked at the situation in January .  we did spend money but injuries has not helped , neither has formations at times.

Actually thinking about it we have a lot of players , maybe not the quality but loads of players , you would think we would be ok . midfield is a massive concern thou.