Rugby Union 2012/13

[cheltenhamlion]

Speaking of Wood's and props, what the fuck has Nick Wood done wrong?

[PaulWinch again]

Samoa win in Wales, Samoa played really well but Wales have completely fallen apart.

[lovejoy]

Well deserved by Samoa, they missed 13 points in kicks as well. Where of Wales go from here? ABs next week!

[paul_e]

it's fairly typical of wales in recent times, every time they start to look decent they overhype them, get unrealistic expectations, and then they fail again.  I find it quite amusing that whenever England are having a tough time of it Wales play well but as soon as we start to look like a good side again Wales fall apart.  Has been the same for the last 20 odd years.

[PaulWinch again]

Big game for us today, we need to win.

[paul_e]

Today summed up all of our problems:

Flood isn't a threat from 10 because he's isn't quick enough or elusive enough to beat his man.
The centres are just  too similar.
Robshaw isn't aggressive enough in the tight to play openside, against a quality 7 he disappears.

We had field position and possession enough to win, but didn't have the ability to expose them.

[PaulWinch again]

Well Johnson shouldn't play for England again, Wood is a million times the player. Also Marler, Palmer and Care should be dropped. Desperately disappointing and poor.

[lovejoy]

Marler cannot scrummage ergo he is never going to make it as an international prop.

[cheltenhamlion]

Freddie Burns played well for Glaws. And we had a Morgan hat trick to enjoy as well.

[paul_e]

Freddie Burns played well for Glaws. And we had a Morgan hat trick to enjoy as well.

Neither should've been available but nice to see they did the business at club level, fingers cross they're missing for glaws for a couple of weeks now, england need defense breakers and they're 2 of the best in the league.

[lovejoy]

I dont give a toss about England, we need them vs Sale next week.

[andyaston]

I still can't get my head around Morgan not being picked. On the game itself, I was suprised we didn't dominate the scrum and we should of took the 3 points every time it became available in the second half.

[paul_e]

I still can't get my head around Morgan not being picked. On the game itself, I was suprised we didn't dominate the scrum and we should of took the 3 points every time it became available in the second half.

I don't fault Robshaw for going for the tries, I fault the selection policy that has left us incapable of finishing those chances despite having some superb finishers in the country.  I still think the centres is the biggest problem and will be so long as he persists with the current side, Ashton and Sharples looked lost because no good ball got to them form set plays, it was only when we had broken field and the ball was with Robshaw and Wood (or a couple of times Goode) that either winger had the chance to open their stride and take people on.  With 2 crash centres, neither of whom has particularly good hands, it's hard to get good ball out wide without loopy passes from 10, which are risky as can be against the top sides.

As it stands I'd drop Manu and bring Joseph in at 12 with Barritt moving out 1.  Harsh on Manu who is scoring but Barritt does the basics better and Manu is a great option on the bench (in place of Brown, If a winger goes off Jospeh and Manu can both move out there).  I'd like Foden to come in on the wing (when fit) to give us quality fullback cover if Goode takes a knock, in the meantime Sharples can probably cover there reasonably well as he's good under the high ball, kicks well and has a good rugby brain.  Burns then has to be the backup for 10 to give us game changers in the backs on the bench.  Currently we have a kicking option in Farrell who weakens our attack and a full back who's coming on to the wing and, whilst getting involved, just isn't good enough for international rugby.

At 9 I think Youngs and Care are too similar, I'd like an alternative and still think Dickson is the only viable choice.  Robson will stroll into the side in a couple of years, his basic skills are already well ahead of anyone we have, just needs to get his game management right, which will come with experience, so he;'s not quite ready yet.

[Dave Summers]

First time had chance to get on here since coming back from the game Saturday and to be honest I was so gutted and still am, by the result and more especially the performance.

I saw Woodward on Sky when I got home and agreed with him that we lost the game in the first half, when bizarrely we were ahead.   I would just say one word on the whole thing from England's point of view, TEMPO.   And there was none on Saturday.

We have always, a bit like Villa, played our best Rugby when we play with a bit of tempo, quick taps and moving the ball out of contact.  Was just so slow on Saturday and we were constantly taking the ball behind the gainline.  We don't commit enough forwards to any ruck, for fear of what might happen if we turn it over and as a result it's all very stodgy.

Felt so sorry for Sharples and Ashton on Saturday as they may just as well have been sat with me in the South Stand.  Any winger who plays outside Manu may as well give up on getting any passes because he doesn't look or think, he just looks for the first person he can run into.  On the odd occasion he does pass, as Paul says above, he is crap.   Point of fact, wouldn't it be Barritt at 12 and JJ at 13 and not the other way around?.  They won't drop Tuilagi anyway, so not going to happen.

Biggest shock was how poor our forwards were, they were so soft.  I see Marler is hurt now and I thought that at the time, so why wasn't he brought off in the first half?.  I still fail to see what Waldrom brings to the party, although stats say he made more carry's and made more metres than any other forward.   And I may have to eat my words about Robshaw at 7.

With all that, this is my 23 for the Boks

Corbs
Youngs
Cole

Launchbury
Parling

Wood
Morgan
Robshaw

Youngs
Flood

Sharples
Barritt
Joseph
Ashton

Goode

Vunipola
Paice
Wilson
Lawes (if fit enough for bench)
Haskell
Care
Burns
Tuilagi

Not sure Lawes is fit, if he was he would be in the team.  Hoping he is fit enough for the bench.

And finally, the kit was bad enough, but please please, can we never endure a National Anthem sung like that ever again.  Totally and utterly ruined it.

[paul_e]

Point of fact, wouldn't it be Barritt at 12 and JJ at 13 and not the other way around?.  They won't drop Tuilagi anyway, so not going to happen.

Probably would be but it shouldn't be in my opinion, I prefer a creative 12 inside a bustling 13, 13 should be capable of covering for the back row in clearing out the ruck when play gets stretched.

I mostly agree with your 15.  Robshaw suffered exactly as I expected, he's not aggressive to counter a top class opposition 7.  McCaw will destroy him, it's not that he's a bad player, it's that he's just not suited to play 7 at the highest level, he may be good enough to play 6 but Croft and Wood are probably ahead of him there.  The shame is I like him as a player and as a captain.

Reflecting on it a little more I think Youngs at hooker is probably a little too inexperienced as well, add Marler not being fit and our front row failed to dominate a team that we should have walked all over.  Corbs and Hartley in there and we'd have been far more powerful.

Oh, and agree totallly on Launchbury getting a start, he looks the real deal, him and Lawes, along with Parling and Kitchener should be our 2nd row options until the world cup, they're all great modern 2nd rows who are good around the park, tackle and pass like back rows but are still big strong guys in the pack.