Guzan To Re-Sign

[peter w]

I'm not saying Guzan is a poor keeper. he's not he's a good number 2. Nor am I saying Given is the dog's bollocks. He's not but he's a good prem keeper.

[Dave]

He can still play poorly but the team wins.

True, but if people are quoting three games in which he played badly and in one he kept a clean sheet and in another he saved a penalty you have to wonder if their memory is fading a bit.

And in one he conceded four goals (by the same measure)

Quite and it was as bad as any goalkeeping performance I remember seeing. But I don't think that anyone would dispute that one. It's the fallacy that he was bad in the others, when he wasn't.

[peter w]

He was poor in the first league. He was poor in his last game before being dropped last season. Which poor Given performances for Villa stand out?

[Dave]

He was poor in the first league. He was poor in his last game before being dropped last season. Which poor Given performances for Villa stand out?

Really? Which of the one goal that Bolton scored or the two that Swansea scored do you feel he should have stopped? I assume you're not talking about the actual first league game when he kept a clean sheet against Man Utd.

I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make with your second statement as I don't recall saying Guzan should be playing ahead of Given.

[peter w]

He was poor in the first league. He was poor in his last game before being dropped last season. Which poor Given performances for Villa stand out?

Really? Which of the one goal that Bolton scored or the two that Swansea scored do you feel he should have stopped? I assume you're not talking about the actual first league game when he kept a clean sheet against Man Utd.

I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make with your second statement as I don't recall saying Guzan should be playing ahead of Given.

Crap typing I missed  'Cup semi'. Yes it was Swansea. Very poor positioning for Routledge's goal and looked a little at sea.

My point regarding the second statement is that you can pick up Guzan's bad performances and there have (arguably) been a few. You can't with Given. Therefore, we shouldn't be entertaining the idea that he should come back to vie for the number 1 shirt because he's not good enough to be a consistently top Prem keeper.

[not3bad]

we shouldn't be entertaining the idea that he should come back to vie for the number 1 shirt

Lambert's entertaining that idea though.

[The Villa Werewolf]

Just to clarify, with people making claims about the Blackburn games, these are the games Guzan has been included in the squad against Blackburn.

09/10

26/09/09 - Prem Away  L 2-1 (unused sub)
02/01/10 - FAC Home  W 3-1 (started)
14/01/10 - CC Away    W 1-0 (started)
20/01/10 - CC Home    W 6-4 (started)
09/05/10 - Prem Home L 1-0 (unused sub)

10/11

22/09/10 - CC Home W  3-1 (started)

Brad started in our 4 wins over Blackburn, he didn't play in the 2 loses.

I like Guzan, I really do.

However, his performance in the Blackburn 6-4 game was almost certainly the biggest horror show I've ever seen from a goalkeeper at any level.

The fact that the team won regardless is irrelevant.

[Hookeysmith]

we shouldn't be entertaining the idea that he should come back to vie for the number 1 shirt

Lambert's entertaining that idea though.

And quiet rightly so - not just Given but every player should be under no illusion - drop your form and you are out

Should be no automatic choices anywhere - including Bent

[peter w]

Whilst i agree with your point hookey int he main goalkeepers are different. it is very seldom at any team anywhere that you have two keepers fighting for one spot. tehre is always (usually) a number one and the bloke on the bench is either the understudy or just to come on in case of injuries. Therefore, you need a Guzan to be happy with his lot as a number 2 and to cover the number 1.

The problem I have have is Guzan coming back and potentially being a number 1. I just don't think he's consistently good enough. I'd rather get a great keeper to replace Given then potentially hand over to a keeper that has only found Championship sides knocking on his door. he is no better than boaz Myhill who when he left had a few great games for Hull, eventually got found wanting and seems to be back being a number 2 again. i think that's Guzan's lot.

[not3bad]

Some interesting variations in opinion here and it will be interesting to see who ends up proven right.  My feeling is that Guzan is maturing into a very fine goalkeeper and by the time he is 30 he will be Villa's No. 1.

[Karl Bridges]

However, his performance in the Blackburn 6-4 game was almost certainly the biggest horror show I've ever seen from a goalkeeper at any level.

I would direct you to Martin Fulop's final appearance for WBA vs Arsenal for the actual biggest horror show from a goalkeeper

[ozzjim]

Whilst i agree with your point hookey int he main goalkeepers are different. it is very seldom at any team anywhere that you have two keepers fighting for one spot. tehre is always (usually) a number one and the bloke on the bench is either the understudy or just to come on in case of injuries. Therefore, you need a Guzan to be happy with his lot as a number 2 and to cover the number 1.

The problem I have have is Guzan coming back and potentially being a number 1. I just don't think he's consistently good enough. I'd rather get a great keeper to replace Given then potentially hand over to a keeper that has only found Championship sides knocking on his door. he is no better than boaz Myhill who when he left had a few great games for Hull, eventually got found wanting and seems to be back being a number 2 again. i think that's Guzan's lot.

To write someone off on a handful of games  as a number 2 forever more is very harsh, especially when in some of those games they have been very impressive. It is like saying Given is completely past it based on the Euros. Given probably has 12 months or so of top keeping left, and by then I reckon Guzan will be number 1.

[JJ-AV]

Given's injury record suggests that we'll probably need someone else between the sticks at some point during the league campaign next year.

Would anyone really want Marshall in goal?

Given's fine for a while, he was very good last season. But I'm sure there'll be a team when we regret giving him that contract.

[JJ-AV]

Whilst i agree with your point hookey int he main goalkeepers are different. it is very seldom at any team anywhere that you have two keepers fighting for one spot. tehre is always (usually) a number one and the bloke on the bench is either the understudy or just to come on in case of injuries. Therefore, you need a Guzan to be happy with his lot as a number 2 and to cover the number 1.

That's not true. Off the top of my head Man Utd, Man City, Arsenal, Newcastle, Fulham and Sunderland have all had goal keeper changes to some degree within their squad over recent years.

Spurs have had three established, experienced goalkeepers on their books for the past year.

Guzan might turn out to be half decent, he might only be an OK understudy. What's the harm in keeping him to compete with Given? Chances are he'll play at some point next season, if he impresses (like he did last season, IMO) then he'll keep his place. It creates a competitive environment and if Shay has taken his foot off the gas then that will give him a kick up the arse.

[Dave]

As another point, which reserve team keepers would people choose over Guzan? I reckon probably Lindegaard and then I'm struggling.

If Chelsea are getting by with Turnbull and Arsenal with Fabianski, having somebody as reliable as Guzan is an absolute blessing.