Summer Transfer Thread: Speculation, Lies, Absolute Cr*p and Bosman Rumours

[LeeB]

With all due respect to Risso and the rest of the moaners, their narrative grows tiresome. "Randy is no longer interested... Randy wants to sell... Sell to buy." It is difficult to understand why some on here are unable to grasp that the club is seeking a more measured fiscal approach and no longer wishes to hemorrhage money. Everyone knows where the wage bill was and that was an untenable position both for Randy and the club's long-term future, thus the desire to dial it back. We can debate issues of "Too much too fast" or what have you, but there is no doubt that this was necessary. That being said, money is there to be spent should PL ask for it, but the player needs to fit within the wage structure. The transfer fee is not the issue (assuming it is not too extravagant), but the weekly wages need to be in line with the long-term fiscal plan of the club. There is no sell-to-buy policy, per se, but it is no secret that there are players the club would like off the books. Even if those players are not shipped off, this would *not* preclude more purchases by the end of the window. If a desire for fiscal sanity = disinterest, then I suppose Randy is no longer interested, but it could be argued that such measures demonstrate a greater interest in the future of the club than the wanton spending of the MON years. As many recognize, the game has changed a bit even since those days and, although Randy may be wealthy, he is not an oil baron. He was never going to outspend Man City and to try to do so would have brought the club to its knees.

I don't disagree with any of that.

[Surrey Villain]

After we've scored no goals out of only a couple of half chances tomorrow and Everton get a couple from several chances  I can see the fans protesting loudly against Lerner, not Lambert.  It almost seemed last week that Lambert may have chosen tactics designed to show how threadbare the squad is, especially upfront and Lerner was in attendance to witness the embarassing non-display.  Nor should anybody kid themselves that the return of Gabby and Delfouneso will improve things - their contributions in the past couple of seasons are witness to that.
 

[Rick_avfc]

After we've scored no goals out of only a couple of half chances tomorrow and Everton get a couple from several chances  I can see the fans protesting loudly against Lerner, not Lambert.  It almost seemed last week that Lambert may have chosen tactics designed to show how threadbare the squad is, especially upfront and Lerner was in attendance to witness the embarassing non-display.  Nor should anybody kid themselves that the return of Gabby and Delfouneso will improve things - their contributions in the past couple of seasons are witness to that.

2 games in and talks of a protest?  Are you being serious buddy?  There will be no protest against Randy. The brand of football Lambert is trying to emloy can take time to work.  The same happened under GH and then towards the end of the season we saw how it started to come together.  We are a work in progress.

[Surrey Villain]

After we've scored no goals out of only a couple of half chances tomorrow and Everton get a couple from several chances  I can see the fans protesting loudly against Lerner, not Lambert.  It almost seemed last week that Lambert may have chosen tactics designed to show how threadbare the squad is, especially upfront and Lerner was in attendance to witness the embarassing non-display.  Nor should anybody kid themselves that the return of Gabby and Delfouneso will improve things - their contributions in the past couple of seasons are witness to that.

2 games in and talks of a protest?  Are you being serious buddy?  There will be no protest against Randy. The brand of football Lambert is trying to emloy can take time to work.  The same happened under GH and then towards the end of the season we saw how it started to come together.  We are a work in progress.

I hope you are right.  I was just really voicing a fear.

[Risso]

If the vague rumours of Dunne going are true then that frees up his wages for further signings but at present we have 3 players with plenty of first team experience to come back. As I said the other day that I liken it to when MON first came and that it will take more than one transfer window for Lambert to build the squad he wants.

The huge difference there is that O'Neill came in late in the summer, and so didn't have much opportunity.   After that, he was lucky enough to be backed to the hilt by Lerner as they spent fortunes on players they thought would get us to the Champions League.  That clearly isn't the target any more, and Lambert isn't ever going to be given big money to spend.  The point in sacking McLeish was the same as when they signed Bent - the consequences of not doing were likely to be far worse and even more expensive.

Why more expensive? If he's lost interest then he can reduce the wage bill far more by allowing us to get relegated. With parachute payments for a couple of years that should give him enough time to find a buyer.

Slightly far fetched, Chris.

Even with parachute payments as a buffer to some lost revenue, it's hard to believe anyone searching for a buyer for a club would see having it not in the premier league as a way of either saving money or making the club more attractive to buyers.

I was offering the other extreme to Risso's position. He's been running with the same line for 18 months, if he was so desperate to sell how come he hasn't? Or at least why no whisper from any interested buyer?

 

Where did I mention anything about Lerner selling in that post? 

[Percy McCarthy]

Seems to me one has to make a lot of assumptions based on not much hard evidence to think one knows what Randy's medium to long-term plans are. It's just a guessing game but I'm hanging my hopes on the fact that he's bothered to appoint an up-and-coming young manager who's stock is high and wouldn't risk his rep on the risk that he can perform miracles without adequate backing from the basket case club that some seem to think we are.

Fuck me that was a long sentence.

[Risso]

With all due respect to Risso and the rest of the moaners, their narrative grows tiresome. "Randy is no longer interested... Randy wants to sell... Sell to buy." It is difficult to understand why some on here are unable to grasp that the club is seeking a more measured fiscal approach and no longer wishes to hemorrhage money. Everyone knows where the wage bill was and that was an untenable position both for Randy and the club's long-term future, thus the desire to dial it back. We can debate issues of "Too much too fast" or what have you, but there is no doubt that this was necessary. That being said, money is there to be spent should PL ask for it, but the player needs to fit within the wage structure. The transfer fee is not the issue (assuming it is not too extravagant), but the weekly wages need to be in line with the long-term fiscal plan of the club. There is no sell-to-buy policy, per se, but it is no secret that there are players the club would like off the books. Even if those players are not shipped off, this would *not* preclude more purchases by the end of the window. If a desire for fiscal sanity = disinterest, then I suppose Randy is no longer interested, but it could be argued that such measures demonstrate a greater interest in the future of the club than the wanton spending of the MON years. As many recognize, the game has changed a bit even since those days and, although Randy may be wealthy, he is not an oil baron. He was never going to outspend Man City and to try to do so would have brought the club to its knees.

Hello Pelty

I'll tell you what's tiresome, it's the enormous mess Lerner and Faulkner have made of running our club, and that fact that for the last few years, we've watched costly mistake after costly mistake being made.  As for things being difficult to grasp, the only thing I struggle with is the question of why anybody on even the vaguest nodding terms with sanity thought that appointing McLeish would be a good idea.  You talk about saving money and correcting the mistakes of the past, but our owners and managment team don't seem to be able to construct a coherent plan.  At first it it was "let O'Neill spend any amount of money he likes with no thought for future cash flow projections", then it changed to "appoint a succession of useless managers, sell our best players and fingers crossed that we don't get relegated".

As for comparisons with Man City, well we don't seem to be able to match the likes of Stoke, Sunderland and Everton these days.

[GordonCowansisthegreatest]

If the vague rumours of Dunne going are true then that frees up his wages for further signings but at present we have 3 players with plenty of first team experience to come back. As I said the other day that I liken it to when MON first came and that it will take more than one transfer window for Lambert to build the squad he wants.

The huge difference there is that O'Neill came in late in the summer, and so didn't have much opportunity.   After that, he was lucky enough to be backed to the hilt by Lerner as they spent fortunes on players they thought would get us to the Champions League.  That clearly isn't the target any more, and Lambert isn't ever going to be given big money to spend.  The point in sacking McLeish was the same as when they signed Bent - the consequences of not doing were likely to be far worse and even more expensive.

Why more expensive? If he's lost interest then he can reduce the wage bill far more by allowing us to get relegated. With parachute payments for a couple of years that should give him enough time to find a buyer.

Slightly far fetched, Chris.

Even with parachute payments as a buffer to some lost revenue, it's hard to believe anyone searching for a buyer for a club would see having it not in the premier league as a way of either saving money or making the club more attractive to buyers.

I was offering the other extreme to Risso's position. He's been running with the same line for 18 months, if he was so desperate to sell how come he hasn't? Or at least why no whisper from any interested buyer?

 

Where did I mention anything about Lerner selling in that post? 

Giving him time to find a buyer.......................

[Risso]

That wasn't me.......

[PeterWithesShin]

It was Chris who said that, not Risso.

[Concrete John]

That wasn't me.......

I hope you were singing that to yourself in a Shaggy voice as you typed it?

[garyshawsknee]

Come on chaps,a week into the season,one average performance which resulted in a defeat,a couple of weeks with no transfer activity,and its all doom and gloom. Its like the joy of dismissing TSM and employing Lambert had never happened.

This season is gonna be a mixture of encouraging performances and wins,and poor performances and defeat,just like MON first season. Its going to be a slow process with players getting use to new coaching methods and tactics.Yes the squad seems quite thin,but theres enough there for us not to struggle,and more importantly,weve got a manager who has shown he can get sucess with a modest squad.

Seeing some of Lamberts press conference today,he seems to be working on potential targets,which can take time to tie up,especially when it gets to the last week and the window,as other clubs want to get in replacements before they sell.

So lets not all shit our pants before the first home game of the season,we may be pleasantly suprised. UTV

[Risso]

That wasn't me.......

I hope you were singing that to yourself in a Shaggy voice as you typed it?

Saw me moanin' about the owner (It wasn't me)
 

[GordonCowansisthegreatest]

That wasn't me.......

Apologies, I miss-read who said what. I'll have to go back to the original post in future.

[pelty]

Hello Pelty

I'll tell you what's tiresome, it's the enormous mess Lerner and Faulkner have made of running our club, and that fact that for the last few years, we've watched costly mistake after costly mistake being made.  As for things being difficult to grasp, the only thing I struggle with is the question of why anybody on even the vaguest nodding terms with sanity thought that appointing McLeish would be a good idea.  You talk about saving money and correcting the mistakes of the past, but our owners and managment team don't seem to be able to construct a coherent plan.  At first it it was "let O'Neill spend any amount of money he likes with no thought for future cash flow projections", then it changed to "appoint a succession of useless managers, sell our best players and fingers crossed that we don't get relegated".

As for comparisons with Man City, well we don't seem to be able to match the likes of Stoke, Sunderland and Everton these days.

I have no interest in defending the selection of AM; I thought it was a bad idea at the time and it got no better as the months passed. As far as a coherent plan goes, it might be better said that there has been a shift in plans some of which was dictated by the sea change brought in by City. You would be wrong, though, to think that the desire for fiscal restraint was not there early on; you just did not see it because it occurred behind the scenes. There was also a desire to support the manager and to provide him the resources to push on for the CL. In hindsight, they should have clamped down earlier, but they also believed that the manager was going to shift players as he had long been directed to do rather than leave them rotting on the bench. Your whinge about "selling our best players" is a red herring; those players wanted to go, pure and simple, and so they were sold for the best possible fee they could pull in. That is the nature of the game these days, unfortunately.

I had not noticed that Sunderland has been buying many players this summer. Cuellar on a free and who else? We have obtained four, if Holman is included, and are looking for more; not sure what else you would want as that is a decent number compared to many other clubs. Anyone with any sense realizes that past personnel mistakes cannot all be fixed in one summer.