Everton v Aston Villa Post-Match Thread

[Brend'Watkins]

My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games.  It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game.  With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin?  We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.

The table doesn't lie.

Somebody told me that if we'd won all our games, we'd be top by now.

Food for thought.

Well done for that useful and insightful contribution, I'm glad to see you're not letting your standards slip.

The point is that we've dropped more points in this way than anyone else, which is what makes it significant. I'm not trying to make excuses or claim that we're anything that we're not. I just thought what with this being a discussion board it was something worth discussing.

I know we've dropped more points than anybody else in this way, point is, little or nothing is being done about it and the side collectively shit themselves when they take the lead.
But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads is meaningless and you've been pedalling that line since the days of O'Leary.
Such as
'If we'd drawn at Arsenal and turned 3 of our home draws into wins, we'd be in the top 10 by now.'

[AV82EC]

My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games.  It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game.  With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin?  We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.

I think we do that but we aren't clinical enough.  Sunderland away, sunderland at home , fulham away, Man U at home, bolton away all games where we could potentially have won by 3 clear goals using our attacking talent but didn't stick the bloody ball in the onion bag.  Frustrating isn't the word....

[Chris Smith]

But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads

I have already explained, I just used is an illustration. I don't really think we could be third but it is a massive amount of points to be dropped and that is the reason we're near the bottom of the league rather than comfortably in mid table. I read on here all the time criticism of Young, Downing etc and how attacking players are out of position when it is clear as day that is not where the problems lie.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.

The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.

[Chris Smith]

If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.

The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.

I remember when you used to be funny.

[Risso]

But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads

I have already explained, I just used is an illustration. I don't really think we could be third but it is a massive amount of points to be dropped and that is the reason we're near the bottom of the league rather than comfortably in mid table. I read on here all the time criticism of Young, Downing etc and how attacking players are out of position when it is clear as day that is not where the problems lie.

It's not the main problem, agreed, but goal scoring has still not been great this year. 

[Rip Van We Go Again]

If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.

The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.

I remember when you used to be funny.

A bit like Viz.

Don't go into your 'I know you're only 12, Clearly you haven't been down Villa Park this season etc etc' haughty reply mode.

[Merv]

It is an interesting stat and certainly confirms what I was thinking over the weekend - we can't hold onto a lead or close out games. We've really lost our way on that - this goes back all the way to the game at Stoke in September but really kicked in around Fulham away, Man Utd at home. Even our last two away games - really should have beaten both Bolton and Everton. Those extra five points and we'd be 10th and laughing now.

As it stands, we're in trouble, and I've so little faith in us to actually finish games off that I can't view any of our remaining seven matches with any level of optimism. Arsenal, Liverpool - sure, always tough games. But West Ham, West Brom away? We've got the losing habit now and it's hard to shake off.

[glasses]

Not read all of the thread yet. Thought we showed some spirit in coming from behind, which was nice to see. Thought the 442 worked ok. We scored goals and looked threatening, but never looked like controlling the game (however, i struggle to think of a point this season we have). Didnt keep the ball well enough. The two weak links for me were Walker and Makoun. The former gave the ball away on numerous occasions, missed a sitter, and his suicidal header to let in Beckford in the first half should have been punished. The latter was pretty much anonymous for most of the game, lunges in a lot, but perhaps was unlucky for the pen. Bents goals were a massive plus, more of the same please, and Downing and Young did well too.

Friedel 5 Should have done better with the first maybe, one good save comes to mind
Walker 4 Not his best game at all, riddled with mistakes. Better going forward.
L Young 6 Didnt do too badly all round
Dunne 6 Dealt ok with what was thrown at him
Collins 5 Turned inside out for the first goal, but not terrible.
Downing 8 Always looked lively, part of everything good about us
A Young 8 Was going to be a 7, as all round worked hard and was decent, but the pass for Bents second was sublime.
Reo-Coker 6 Both centre midfielders were pretty anonymous, he had a blocked shot.
Makoun 4  Again, pretty anonymous apart from another lunge and giving the pen away (Harshly)
Agbonlahor 6 Worked Hard. I think Bent benefitted from some support. Went missing a bit in second half
Bent 9 Two chances, two great finishes. Great to have a clinical finisher in the team. We need to keep giving him chances and cut the silly mistakes out at the other end.

[Concrete John]

More worryingly is that we've only won 3 points from a losing position this season (all draws). Only team worse than that is Blackburn.

If we can't keep leads and struggle to come from behind, it suggests a real isue with team spirit to me!

[Chris Smith]

If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.

The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.

I remember when you used to be funny.

A bit like Viz.

Don't go into your 'I know you're only 12, Clearly you haven't been down Villa Park this season etc etc' haughty reply mode.

But it's what I do best, being sneeringly dismissive is something I've had to work at and I'm not going to give it all up now.

I agree with what Bren says, that it's unlikely we're going to solve our defensive issue at this stage of the season so we should concentrate on the other end of the pitch; score enough to make conceding late irrelevant.

On Saturday my PC crashed when we were 2-1 up and I just know that by the time I got the stream back they'd have equalised.

[The Situation]

My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games.  It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game.  With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin?  We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.

Pretty much.

Self-destruction in the last 10 minutes has been quite a big part of why we're in the position we're in at the moment.

In previous seasons we'd close out games with ease because we knew our defence was solid and wouldn't break down mentally - it's the complete opposite this season.

[WikiVilla]

Feels as though We've been giving late goals away since the year dot

[eamonn]

So did Saturday's game as losing points from leading positions or gaining one? Cos you could argue for both.