The run-in for the "looking" doomed

[hawkeye]

KG has a point, they all want to play for him, they dont want to play for Houlier. It would also get the fans back on side and  this is going to be a critical factor in the critical home games.
If we send the team out to face the sort of atmosphere at VP on Saturday then we are half way dead allready.

[SoccerHQ]

Newcastle was a bit of a freak result though, even in this annus horribilis of a season. Annus horrificus, in fact.

We actually played well for the opening 30 minutes. It did offer a portent of what we might come to expect from Friedel and Dunne, mind (in saying that, Friedel was MOTM in the next game v Everton).

Contrast the Newcastle game and that decent 30 minutes with Blackburn away,  Liverpool away Man Citeh away (twice) Sunderland and Wolves at home (just off the top of my head) where we didn't play well at any stage of the match.

Then there were other matches like Spurs at home, where we might have had periods of dominance, but never even looked like beating a side down to 10 men.

I don't think Kevin Mac would be in anyway a long term solution (I'm not sure he'd even want the job on a short term basis again either) and I don't think our defence would suddenly improve tenfold. In fact, I'd still expect a few hammerings between now and the end of the campaign.

But:

We might just have a better chance of etching out the 2/3 wins we need under a figure the players have a degree of time and respect for, rather than one they clearly don't.

yep and we missed a penalty at 0-0 up there which set the tone for the season with Carroll then eating our defence alive for the rest of the game.

What did for McDonald and probably cost him the chance of a full time job was the disaster of the second leg v Vienna but he did at least win two of his three home games. Houllier has managed 4 wins in 12 games.

[pauliewalnuts]

People seem to be talking about getting KM to see us through to the end of the season, seemingly without think about how he'd feel about it, having been passed over for the job a few months ago.

[KevinGage]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

[pauliewalnuts]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

I would be amazed if he took the job on an "until the end of the season" basis, without some cinfirmation he'd keep it if we stayed up.

[PeterWithesShin]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

I would be amazed if he took the job on an "until the end of the season" basis, without some cinfirmation he'd keep it if we stayed up.

Lets say RL goes to him and says "we think you are the man to get us the points we need to stay up. Will you take over until the end of the season?"

Should any employee of Aston Villa remain in the employ of Aston Villa if they refuse to step up to the plate when asked to by their boss?

[pauliewalnuts]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

I would be amazed if he took the job on an "until the end of the season" basis, without some cinfirmation he'd keep it if we stayed up.

Lets say RL goes to him and says "we think you are the man to get us the points we need to stay up. Will you take over until the end of the season?"

Should any employee of Aston Villa remain in the employ of Aston Villa if they refuse to step up to the plate when asked to by their boss?

Football is immune from considerations like that which you'd find in any other workplace.

For example, Dunne and Collins would have been sacked on the spot last week.

You can't force someone to do a job which they're not employed to do, either. And it strikes me that turning to someone to get you out of a hole, in desperation, and then forcing them to take the job on isn't really the best start.

[PeterWithesShin]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

I would be amazed if he took the job on an "until the end of the season" basis, without some cinfirmation he'd keep it if we stayed up.

Lets say RL goes to him and says "we think you are the man to get us the points we need to stay up. Will you take over until the end of the season?"

Should any employee of Aston Villa remain in the employ of Aston Villa if they refuse to step up to the plate when asked to by their boss?

Football is immune from considerations like that which you'd find in any other workplace.

For example, Dunne and Collins would have been sacked on the spot last week.

You can't force someone to do a job which they're not employed to do, either. And it strikes me that turning to someone to get you out of a hole, in desperation, and then forcing them to take the job on isn't really the best start.

Well obviously in the scenario I gave I wouldn't expect or want RL to add, "and if you say no, you're sacked". But we talk of players showing loyalty and stepping up when it counts, with how long KM has been here, shouldn't he in theory care more about the future of Villa than say Habib Beye or Richard Dunne?

If the scenario I gave happened, and lets assume it became public, would you want KM to remain if he turned it down?

[pauliewalnuts]

That's why I said I'm not even sure he would go for it.

He might feel snubbed. Or: If he had doubts about taking the job back then, what kind of doubts would he have now?

I would be amazed if he took the job on an "until the end of the season" basis, without some cinfirmation he'd keep it if we stayed up.

Lets say RL goes to him and says "we think you are the man to get us the points we need to stay up. Will you take over until the end of the season?"

Should any employee of Aston Villa remain in the employ of Aston Villa if they refuse to step up to the plate when asked to by their boss?

Football is immune from considerations like that which you'd find in any other workplace.

For example, Dunne and Collins would have been sacked on the spot last week.

You can't force someone to do a job which they're not employed to do, either. And it strikes me that turning to someone to get you out of a hole, in desperation, and then forcing them to take the job on isn't really the best start.

Well obviously in the scenario I gave I wouldn't expect or want RL to add, "and if you say no, you're sacked". But we talk of players showing loyalty and stepping up when it counts, with how long KM has been here, shouldn't he in theory care more about the future of Villa than say Habib Beye or Richard Dunne?

If the scenario I gave happened, and lets assume it became public, would you want KM to remain if he turned it down?

If he was still good at the job he's doing now? Yes, of course I would.

[PeterWithesShin]

Fair enough Paulie, I have to be honest and say i'd be very disappointed in any Villa  employee saying no when/if the club said they wanted their help in securing the future of the club.

[pauliewalnuts]

Fair enough Paulie, I have to be honest and say i'd be very disappointed in any Villa  employee saying no when/if the club said they wanted their help in securing the future of the club.

I know what you mean, but I was thinking mostly that when he was caretaker, KM often looked very uncomfortable in the role (the stuff about him saying he didn't know if he wanted it, etc etc), and from there, what would happen if he were asked, but said he didn't feel comfortable with the media element / didn't think he'd handle the pressure (and it will be intense) etc.

In those circumstances, he'd be doing us a favour saying no.

[Brian Taylor]

I know, I know, I know x 3 x 5 x 8 and more. 1970 and later..all the desperate status and same again. AV ought to be, and deserve to be at the pinnacle of success; and manage to be where? Exactly here, where  we are...WHY?  30/40 years of the same old same old same old and same old...
Two weeks of no attenance will tell them why, and quick!.
Why endure the misery?

[Stu]

I know, I know, I know x 3 x 5 x 8 and more. 1970 and later..all the desperate status and same again. AV ought to be, and deserve to be at the pinnacle of success; and manage to be where? Exactly here, where  we are...WHY?  30/40 years of the same old same old same old and same old...
Two weeks of no attenance will tell them why, and quick!.
Why endure the misery?

We still all go because we're all obsessed with the Villa. There's no way I'd ever back a boycott of games (unless we were bought out by Colonel Gadaffi or something) because it'd do more harm than good to have the players looking up at empty stands. Mind you, with the way they apparently stunk the place out yesterday, that's precisely what's going to happen anyway

And I'm not sure Villa deserve to be anywhere to be honest. We've not won anything for a long time now and our seasons are regularly over by around this time of year anyway.

[*shellac*]

Just been looking at fixtures for other teams. Some have got it quite tough, some have got it easier.

That's what we thought when we had that "Winnable 11 Games" (or something like that) thread weeks ago.

8 games to save our season.

I live in fear.

[Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air]

There's no way I'd ever back a boycott of games (unless we were bought out by Colonel Gadaffi or something)

Oh I dont know, he seems to have more stomach for a fight than some of our lot.