Gerard Houllier

[TopDeck113]

No chance we will be bottom 3.

I'm getting sick of these blasé statements when all the evidence is currently to the contrary.

So go on, convince me. Why is there no chance?

Just because my opinion is not the same as yours, does not mean it is blase! I don't have to convince you. My beief is we will finish in well clear as we have had a bad run of fixtures recently. If you don't agree with me, ho-hum I will get over it

So we won't finish in the bottom three because... you don't think we will.

Great! I'll sleep so much better now.

Why is that such a problem for you? Are you a member of the thought police? You have both analysed the evidence and reached different conclusions. We will see who is right in the end or whether Randy shares these fears.

I tell you why its a problem.  Its because when someone says "we won't go down" its not a million miles off "we're too good to go down".   Its complacent and its naive.

Yes, we've had a difficult run of fixtures (and we were in many ways lucky to beat Albion), but before them?  Did you see the performance at Ewood Park? The failure to hold onto the lead at Fulham?  The inability to convert chances against Sunderland? Etc, etc, etc.

The reality is we are playing poorly, have the worst goal difference in the division, can't score, can't turn around a deficit, can't play the style of play that the manager and his coaching staff seem to want us to play, a manager that has apparently lost the dressing room, an owner who has pulled shut the purse strings, a home support that doesn't lift the side and now elements of the media are laughing at our ineptness.

So go on,  now convince me to the contrary.

[garyshawsknee]

No chance we will be bottom 3.

I'm getting sick of these blasé statements when all the evidence is currently to the contrary.

So go on, convince me. Why is there no chance?

Just because my opinion is not the same as yours, does not mean it is blase! I don't have to convince you. My beief is we will finish in well clear as we have had a bad run of fixtures recently. If you don't agree with me, ho-hum I will get over it

So we won't finish in the bottom three because... you don't think we will.

Great! I'll sleep so much better now.

Why is that such a problem for you? Are you a member of the thought police? You have both analysed the evidence and reached different conclusions. We will see who is right in the end or whether Randy shares these fears.

I tell you why its a problem.  Its because when someone says "we won't go down" its not a million miles off "we're too good to go down".   Its complacent and its naive.

Yes, we've had a difficult run of fixtures (and we were in many ways lucky to beat Albion), but before them?  Did you see the performance at Ewood Park? The failure to hold onto the lead at Fulham?  The inability to convert chances against Sunderland? Etc, etc, etc.

The reality is we are playing poorly, have the worst goal difference in the division, can't score, can't turn around a deficit, can't play the style of play that the manager and his coaching staff seem to want us to play, a manager that has apparently lost the dressing room, an owner who has pulled shut the purse strings, a home support that doesn't lift the side and now elements of the media are laughing at our ineptness.

So go on,  now convince me to the contrary.

 The only thing im clutching to is that its a poor division this year,and their are worse teams than us this season.All the teams starting with W for starters,so thats at least 5th from bottom.

[Dave]

Yes, we've had a difficult run of fixtures (and we were in many ways lucky to beat Albion), but before them?  Did you see the performance at Ewood Park? The failure to hold onto the lead at Fulham?  The inability to convert chances against Sunderland? Etc, etc, etc.

If we were lucky to beat Albion we were unlucky not to beat Fulham and Sunderland.

You can't have it both ways.

[pauliewalnuts]

He's not Villa, he has no passion for us and if anyone on here honestly thinks that he will do anything for us in January then look at his first choice of a loan player - 37 year old Pires.

Apart from the "he's not Villa" nonsense, which is meaningless guff, I'll also point out that Pires is not a loan player, he was an unattached player, which is the only type of player you can sign outside a window, and there wasn't much of a choice available to Houllier.

I'm all for criticising GH for the stuff he deserves it for - and right now, there is plenty - but "first choice of loan player" suggests you're somewhat off beam.

[Fergal]

I don't want Villa to be a club that sacks the manager every time we have a bad run.  I want us to back the manager and give him time to develop a squad capable of challenging for the top of our league.  We can only do that if we have the right man in place in the Premiership, I can see GH taking us down so he has to go.  Who we replace him with I don't know, I can say who I don't want as our manager, but we need to get the right man in and back him all the way.
I am shitting myself that we will be in a relegation battle with a manager who can't put a bit of fire in the belly of his players.  When you are in the shit like we are it's not quality football that saves you it's bottle and I don't see any at the moment.  That is what scares me the most.

[garyshawsknee]

He's not Villa, he has no passion for us and if anyone on here honestly thinks that he will do anything for us in January then look at his first choice of a loan player - 37 year old Pires.

Apart from the "he's not Villa" nonsense, which is meaningless guff, I'll also point out that Pires is not a loan player, he was an unattached player, which is the only type of player you can sign outside a window, and there wasn't much of a choice available to Houllier.

I'm all for criticising GH for the stuff he deserves it for - and right now, there is plenty - but "first choice of loan player" suggests you're somewhat off beam.

 I dont like this he's not Villa bollocks,we'll soon come across like the scousers and geordies.

[5ft811st2 Durham]

I am amazed that so many people want Jol.

The facts are that he he was sacked in October 07 with Spurs  having won just one of their first League 10 matches and lying third from bottom in the table.

He was given huge money to spend at Spurs and at the time had Berbatov,Bent, Keane and Defoe to choose from up front.

Given his abject failure working with that kind of quality what do we seriously imagine he could achieve with Carew Heskey and Gabbie and little or  no money to spend.

Given our circumstances we  need a proper football manager with a proven track record of getting performances out of seemingly average players and Owen Coyle is that man..

[taylorsworkrate]

I am amazed that so many people want Jol.

The facts are that he he was sacked in October 07 with Spurs  having won just one of their first League 10 matches and lying third from bottom in the table.

He was given huge money to spend at Spurs and at the time had Berbatov,Bent, Keane and Defoe to choose from up front.

Given his abject failure working with that kind of quality what do we seriously imagine he could achieve with Carew Heskey and Gabbie and little or  no money to spend.

Given our circumstances we  need a proper football manager with a proven track record of getting performances out of seemingly average players and Owen Coyle is that man..

Dangerously close to describing a certain Ulsteman there. 

[dl9]

thanks for putting me 'back on beam', youre right, Pires is great, whatever was I thinking...........

[garyshawsknee]

I don't want Villa to be a club that sacks the manager every time we have a bad run.  I want us to back the manager and give him time to develop a squad capable of challenging for the top of our league.  We can only do that if we have the right man in place in the Premiership, I can see GH taking us down so he has to go.  Who we replace him with I don't know, I can say who I don't want as our manager, but we need to get the right man in and back him all the way.
I am shitting myself that we will be in a relegation battle with a manager who can't put a bit of fire in the belly of his players.  When you are in the shit like we are it's not quality football that saves you it's bottle and I don't see any at the moment.  That is what scares me the most.

 Thats the hard part of football,knowing if youve chosen a good man for the job,as there has been times when Everton couldve easily got rid of Moyes for poor form and bad results,but with us,we have the same set of players showing no spirit and making costly mistakes,consistantly.

[Irreverent ad]

No chance we will be bottom 3.

I'm getting sick of these blasé statements when all the evidence is currently to the contrary.

So go on, convince me. Why is there no chance?

Just because my opinion is not the same as yours, does not mean it is blase! I don't have to convince you. My beief is we will finish in well clear as we have had a bad run of fixtures recently. If you don't agree with me, ho-hum I will get over it

So we won't finish in the bottom three because... you don't think we will.

Great! I'll sleep so much better now.

Why is that such a problem for you? Are you a member of the thought police? You have both analysed the evidence and reached different conclusions. We will see who is right in the end or whether Randy shares these fears.

I tell you why its a problem.  Its because when someone says "we won't go down" its not a million miles off "we're too good to go down".   Its complacent and its naive.

Yes, we've had a difficult run of fixtures (and we were in many ways lucky to beat Albion), but before them?  Did you see the performance at Ewood Park? The failure to hold onto the lead at Fulham?  The inability to convert chances against Sunderland? Etc, etc, etc.

The reality is we are playing poorly, have the worst goal difference in the division, can't score, can't turn around a deficit, can't play the style of play that the manager and his coaching staff seem to want us to play, a manager that has apparently lost the dressing room, an owner who has pulled shut the purse strings, a home support that doesn't lift the side and now elements of the media are laughing at our ineptness.

So go on,  now convince me to the contrary.

Why do you have to be "convinced". I think we will finish the season well ahead of the relegation zone. I think this because of what I have seen in our team and others this season. I think our team, when fit, is good enough to be top half especially with a couple of additions. The only peoply who can fulfill your desire to be "convinced" are the players by the end of the season. I don't think that 6-0 defeat to Newcastle , when GH was not here, did us any favours with our goal difference.

[Irish villain]

Maybe people are right about Jol...if he was so good why was he sacked by Spurs?

Any chance Moyes would leave struggling Everton? It seems to me he's been there too long and won't ever take them any further. A fresh challenge with a similar sized club could be a good career move? If we had Moyes for 8 or 9 years imagine what we could achieve. A better version of MON (and he's not a prat).

[TheSandman]

I thought Pires was quite good against Blackburn, Spurs and even today when he came on. He does the job he's supposed to probably even more so than some starting players but he doesn't have the legs to replace them. He has just given a bad impression against Arsenal when he started, which was way too much for him, leading to a lot of people getting on his back, unfairly so in my opinion.

[eastie]

jol also finished in the top 5 twice in his last 2 seasons at spurs - he was sacked after a nandful of games - moyes would have been sacked every year at spurs given his record at starting the season but everton gave him a chance to redeen himself.

jol had a bad run and was sacked as was atkinson at villa after one bad run.trigger happy chairmen! i think many everton fans would be happy to see moyes go as they seem to have reached a plateau there similar to mon did here - he may well be tempted away now.

[KevinGage]

[quote author=garyshawsknee link=topic=41563.msg1656493#msg1656493
 Thats the hard part of football,knowing if youve chosen a good man for the job,as there has been times when Everton couldve easily got rid of Moyes for poor form and bad results,but with us,we have the same set of players showing no spirit and making costly mistakes,consistantly.
[/quote]

The thing with Everton is generally, even when they're not winning they put up a fight.

They might lose by the odd goal here and there and as a fan you can rationalise that just a bit of tinkering or a bit of luck will change things around for you.

When you have performances like today, Liverpool, Blackburn, B-lose in the cup and even Tottenham the other day -when we couldn't beat a team playing with 10 men for the majority-  it's harder to make the leap that it'll all click into place soon.