England: How do you stand?

[pablopicasso_10]

Lee; football is the national sport... no-one cares about field hockey.

undone your own argument there fella...

[LeeS]

I'm 1/4 English, why should I have to go to an England game? I'm not a patriotic English fan, I just like to see England do well, that's all. I just think it's all a bit sad and pathetic listening to people on the internet despite being 100% English being anti-English towards the England football team saying silly things like ''I wouldn't really care if England won the World Cup".

Lee; football is the national sport... no-one cares about field hockey.

Now we are getting somewhere. Do you accept that not everyone cares about the same things you do? Do you honestly believe that literally no-one cares about field hockey.  Or badminton. Or tennis. Or archery. Or athletics. Or volleyball. Or any other things that are not 'football'. We are independent people. We can choose our own interests and decide for ourselves what we care about. You proclaiming that 'no-one cares' is not going to change that.

[john e]

Question to The Situation

How did you feel when England lost to New Zealand in the hockey earlier today?

Personally I felt a tinge of sadness. But I am not crying into my laptop because Hockey isnt my thing. Does that make me unpatriotic? I presume you are nearly suicidal, am I right? Have you lowered your England flag to half mast outside your house? I'm sure you and your mates will be asking people in the pub later why they are having fun and smiling after England's terrible defeat. It is England who lost after all. Everyone who was born in England and is English supports England. Why would they not?

So like I say, I'm not overly bothered about it. But I feel ten times worse about that than I did about the England game the other night. I dont know the names of a single hockey player (although I remember Imran Shiwani and Sean Curly from the victorious GB team in Seoul 88). I didnt watch the game, I just read about it on the BBC website. But I was able to put myself in the players shoes - just for a few seconds - and imagine how they felt after all the training, all the hope, all the expectation. They are not professionals, they are just ordinary working people like me who happen to excel in a particular sport. I can identify with them. I absolutely cannot identify with Wazza, Steevie G and the other arseholes who disrespect my country every time they pull on an England shirt and play like they dont give a fuck.

So I'll make my own decisions about who and what I care about and leave you to cry over our loss in the 2 badminton finals earlier today.

England may have lost in the Hockey, i'm not that bothered either, but here's the difference, i dont really care to much for Hockey, so i'm not on a Hockey thread telling everybody how much i dont like Hockey.

i have next to no time at all for Formula 1, i've never seen the need to post on any of there threads telling them how little i care for the sport, why because i really really dont care.

i accept that this thread is a little different,
 as it asked the question 'where do you stand on England' which is fair enough,
 but you only have to look at some threads started in 'international football' about a up and coming England match, and without fail there they are every time, posters telling anyone that will listen just how much they dont care about the national side, Why ?

a bit like all the posters who hate talksport and never listen, but somehow know all the presenters and what they were saying

if you truly not interested in England why the need to tell everyone all the time,

i honestly have no problem with DW's position on England, and anyone else who holds the same, everyone can support the team/teams as they see fit.
no one can tell another how to support or who to support

but i have had to many conversations in my pub on England night with Man u/Chelsea etc supporters who seem to think i'm iinterested in how much they detest England, well i dont give a flying toss what the glory hunting twats think.

they can sod of and watch there 1999 treble winning DVD instead, because there wont be any glory watching England thats for sure.

the question about England winning the world cup or Villa winning the league, is a false one, we all know what the answer for most of us would be,

another question would be would you rather England win the world cup or Argentina/Germany, sadly i know what the answer would be for a lot of people

[LeeS]

another question would be would you rather England win the world cup or Argentina/Germany, sadly i know what the answer would be for a lot of people

I draw the line there.

[paul_e]

another question would be would you rather England win the world cup or Argentina/Germany, sadly i know what the answer would be for a lot of people

As I've said, if it led to england taking stock and putting a strategy in place to ensure next time we won and were technically better I'd accept it and certainly wouldn't be upset.  A similar thing happened in the rugby a few years ago (To clear things up, rugby I'll happily watch any game that's on, football I'm just not interested in anyone aside from Villa and England, there's too many things I dislike about the people involved in the sport to pay any more attention to it) where england got to the WC final despite being a very poor side.  SA won the final and I should've been gutted but we lost to the better side and we were able to hide from the fact that we were shown up at times during the tournament.  The fall back from it is that a lot of technically superior players are coming through as the clubs and the national sides work together to improve the quality of our players and tactics.

That the england football team and a lot of the clubs are completely disinterested in improving the quality of youngsters coming through to create a sustainable level of excellence despite a large number of high profile failures shows that the people who can influence things don't care.  I personally can't get behind a team fully when I know that most of them would rather be on a beach with their WAG looking for someone to cheat on her with, and that their management know that but pick them anyway.  None of the other sports I follow have such a high number of supposed top players who clearly put personal gain ahead of club and country.

Can't be bothered to find the post to quote but the situation asked why I can watch if I don't like the players, that's the patriotism coming through, I'll always be interested in england and of course I'm happy if they win but I'm not bothered enough to care if they don't.  I actually hate the fact that stevie me, JT, cashley cole, etc all play for england as everytime I see their names on the team sheet I'm disappointed as not only have they failed on the same stage before, but they've got personal lives that would see them in prison if they weren't above the law.  Whatever you may want to say about Villa there's very few Villa players in the last 15-20years (since the media spotlight became so focused) who've done anything to stir the gutter press into action, one of my favourite things about Villa is that there are very few players you can dislike as a neutral (it also means we haven't got the nasty bugger in centre mid we need however).

[Shrek]

Reading this it's as though you are all trying to persuade yourselves that it's ok to be so negative.

[LeeB]

That's because it is. We don't live in North Korea last time I checked.

[Dave Cooper please]

Lee; I'm only 1/4 English but you don't see me acting anti-English towards the England football team, so how can 100% English people on here be anti-English towards the England football team?

For fucks sake. it's not anti-English to not like the England football team!
It's anti- the England football team, that's it, nothing else.

You don't have to like the England football team to be a proud Englishman.

Either you can see this or you are as thick as a whale omelette.

[The Situation]

So being negative, not caring and abusing the players who play for England is not being anti-English? Why do you feel the need to act this way when you're ENGLISH! Fair enough if your background was from other nationalities, you may have a point, but you admitted that you're very very English. I just find this completely incredible and bizarre how someone who is 100% English can have this attitude towards his country's football team.

Again, I'll ask, how on God's Great Earth can someone who is English be anti-English towards the English football team? What you're saying sounds completely whacko. You're not from another country, you're English, get over it i'm afraid.

Imagine all the strange looks and mouthful of abuse you'd get off fellow English people if you said "I'm anti-England football team"... infact, I don't think you'd get abuse, I think a lot of people would feel sorry for you and worry what your mental state is at.

Thank the Lord I only have to have this 'discussion' with you on the internet. In real life I cannot imagine how hard you'd get the piss taken out of you by fellow English people.

You can keep on debating me as much as you want, but at the end of the day the fact still stands being anti-English towards England's football team makes no sense and is just quite frankly ridiculous and deep down I think you know this too.

I look foward to your reply and hopefully you can address the questions I've asked in this post.

[Clampy]

He's boring me now.

[paul_e]

You clearly don't get it so I don't see any point in any further replies about it.  A lot of people don't like the players chosen or the people running things for the national side and therefore don't feel the need to be 100% behind them.

This is called free will and there's nothing you can do about it.

I think you'd also be very suprised by how many people there are who feel exactly the same.  Also stop confusing apathy with being anti-england.  It's not anti anything, it's just that we don't care as much as you about the english national football team, oh and stop calling it the national game, there's enough sports played by a large number of people in this country for that to be a very narrow minded thing to say.

[curiousorange]

I will watch England but for me, everything stops for Villa and nothing stops for England. That's the difference.

[The Man With A Stick]

Given the choice of Villa winning the league or England winning the world cup how many of us would actually choose England?

Given the choice of Villa winning a corner, or England winning the World Cup, i'd go for the Villa.

[supertom]

Frankly we've enough stagnant, woeful football at the Villa. Do I really want to spend the weekends off from prem footy, watching the national team playing a hideous brand of football too? No.

Hopefully times are changing with the Villa. If they change for England too (new manager required for this and 10 years of new youth structure already implemented needed too) then perhaps I'll regain some enthusiasm. Right now though, I have absolutely none for England, it's not in the blood like the Villa is, so I really don't have to put up with the shit times. The times when most of the squad are a bunch of arrogant, irksome, hideous, assholes like the case is now with England. To endure much more of that oiky cretin Wayne Rooney lumbering through matches, looking forlorn and not putting any effort in, until he inevitably has one of his fits of petulant frustration (See his booking) and being carried by 10 supposedly inferior teammates not in his "world class" calibre, would be too much.

If we put out a squad of 22 plodders for England, I'd actually give them the time of day. Mid road Prem players, high end Championship. They'd play with more pride and have no expectation in tow.

Above all I'd get rid of the 100k club. Too long that lot have not delivered for the nation. No where near.

[Dave]

So being negative, not caring and abusing the players who play for England is not being anti-English? Why do you feel the need to act this way when you're ENGLISH! Fair enough if your background was from other nationalities, you may have a point, but you admitted that you're very very English. I just find this completely incredible and bizarre how someone who is 100% English can have this attitude towards his country's football team.

Again, I'll ask, how on God's Great Earth can someone who is English be anti-English towards the English football team? What you're saying sounds completely whacko. You're not from another country, you're English, get over it i'm afraid.

Imagine all the strange looks and mouthful of abuse you'd get off fellow English people if you said "I'm anti-England football team"... infact, I don't think you'd get abuse, I think a lot of people would feel sorry for you and worry what your mental state is at.

Thank the Lord I only have to have this 'discussion' with you on the internet. In real life I cannot imagine how hard you'd get the piss taken out of you by fellow English people.

You can keep on debating me as much as you want, but at the end of the day the fact still stands being anti-English towards England's football team makes no sense and is just quite frankly ridiculous and deep down I think you know this too.

I look foward to your reply and hopefully you can address the questions I've asked in this post.

Does this stop at football? Were you cheering on the mighty BP against the US government in the spring? Where do you stand on Eurovision? Personally, I'm quite a fan but I don't really care how well we do. Which I think is fine because it correlates nicely with where I stand on international football.

Surely when Chelsea win the league they are representing England? Am I right in thinking that you are right behind them cheering on EBJT et al when they play in Europe? It would be very unpatriotic if you didn't.

Final question - considering 46% of the 135 people who have voted on the poll on this thread either have no interest or actively dislike the England football team, do you not think that your rather narrow-minded world-view might not be as universal as you first thought?

I look foward to your reply and hopefully you can address the questions I've asked in this post.