No signings so concerning

[Concrete John]

I see two possibilities here:-
1.  Randy invested to get us where he wanted, but we haven't got there.  Both in terms of CL qualification and increased revenue to support further spending.  So his original goal of the club fudning itself and getting a return on his investment is still there, but if that's as a 6th-8th side and no more then fair enough, because he no longer thinks further investment will get us any higher.
2.  He's happy to keep investing, mixed with a bit of restraint.  So he wants the wagebill reduced, which he feels can be achieved due to non-playing high earners and the emerging youth, and then keep buying players within the revised framework.  Sort of one step back in order to take two forward.

Either is his perogative as he owns the club, but number one does sound awfully close to the way Doug ran the club.  I'd be perfectly happy with number 2, as would a good manager who may come in, so I agree the next appointment will say more about the club's ambitions than anything we hear from the General or Randy himself.   

[Chris Smith]

I said that I have worries because the team had issues at the end of the season that still haven't been addressed

Some of us have been saying very similar things for the past three seasons and have been shot down by the Smudge gun on every occasion.

It's not as though anything has happened to cause any of us to reassess is it?

I've been behind the policy of patiently building and expected that this summer we'd do for the striking options what we did for the defence last summer. That seems highly unlikely now.

[damon loves JT]

This is going to be a long, hard season.

[Concrete John]

I said that I have worries because the team had issues at the end of the season that still haven't been addressed

Some of us have been saying very similar things for the past three seasons and have been shot down by the Smudge gun on every occasion.

I don't think anyone was under the illusion that MON or the Villa side he built was perfect.  The differences were really in whether you thought the positives outweighed the negatives and your judgement as to whether he could put right the things that were needed.

I'd be much more confident with Martin in charge and the Milner money to spend than I am now with no permanent manager and us unlikely to spend anything.  Granted, that could change in the next 6 days, but the club has to move fast!

[pauliewalnuts]

I said that I have worries because the team had issues at the end of the season that still haven't been addressed

Some of us have been saying very similar things for the past three seasons and have been shot down by the Smudge gun on every occasion.

I don't think anyone was under the illusion that MON or the Villa side he built was perfect.  The differences were really in whether you thought the positives outweighed the negatives and your judgement as to whether he could put right the things that were needed.

i don't remember many of the more pro-MON posters saying "so long as you think the positives outweigh the negatives that's ok" - for starters, I've moaned about the transfer lateness and the shit football for two years plus, but never thought the positives didn't outweigh the negatives.

Didn't stop people from piling into me (and many others) for being a miserablist, though.

It looks now that, with MON gone, there's the opportunity to raise the "no time to fix things which needed to be fixed last season" thing with someone other than MON to point the finger at, so that's "ok" now.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

I see two possibilities here:-
1.  Randy invested to get us where he wanted, but we haven't got there.  Both in terms of CL qualification and increased revenue to support further spending.  So his original goal of the club fudning itself and getting a return on his investment is still there, but if that's as a 6th-8th side and no more then fair enough, because he no longer thinks further investment will get us any higher.
2.  He's happy to keep investing, mixed with a bit of restraint.  So he wants the wagebill reduced, which he feels can be achieved due to non-playing high earners and the emerging youth, and then keep buying players within the revised framework.  Sort of one step back in order to take two forward.

Either is his perogative as he owns the club, but number one does sound awfully close to the way Doug ran the club.  I'd be perfectly happy with number 2, as would a good manager who may come in, so I agree the next appointment will say more about the club's ambitions than anything we hear from the General or Randy himself.   

I've heard nothing to date that would suggest anything other than Option 2.
The "reducing the wage bill" is more down to financial engineering than cutting costs across the board. By this I mean getting rid of the players we pay very handsome wages to that serve no purpose at the club. Imagine how Randy must feel each month when he sees the list of salaries and the part they're playing in our team; NRC, Sidwell, Davies, Luke Young, Heskey.. that's £200k a week going out the door for next to zero contribution.

The most important issue is getting the right manager. Once we have him, I'm sure he will get the backing he deserves but like all managers, he will be accountable to the players he buys. I really don't see a problem with that.

[bob]

A flamin mess? So for a couple of vowels we can get Mathieu and Leo, job's a good'un.

Well done.

[Concrete John]

i don't remember many of the more pro-MON posters saying "so long as you think the positives outweigh the negatives that's ok" - for starters, I've moaned about the transfer lateness and the shit football for two years plus, but never thought the positives didn't outweigh the negatives.

Didn't stop people from piling into me (and many others) for being a miserablist, though.

It looks now that, with MON gone, there's the opportunity to raise the "no time to fix things which needed to be fixed last season" thing with someone other than MON to point the finger at, so that's "ok" now.

I guess it's a matter of perspective, but if some of the 'miserablists' on here tought the good outweighed the bad, then why did they never post on it and always have a pop at the manager? 

I'm not sure what you mean by the last paragraph, but IMO whatever needs addressing is the same should MON still be manager or not.  We need a better striker and more steel in the midefield, plus a greater use of the squad and to evolve our style of play to help break down the bus parkers, an opinion I've been pretty consistent in my opinion on this since the end of last season.  If anything I'll give a new manager more leeway in addressing these issues as he'll have a small amount of the window left, if any at all, and will want to assess for himself first.     

[pauliewalnuts]

i don't remember many of the more pro-MON posters saying "so long as you think the positives outweigh the negatives that's ok" - for starters, I've moaned about the transfer lateness and the shit football for two years plus, but never thought the positives didn't outweigh the negatives.

Didn't stop people from piling into me (and many others) for being a miserablist, though.

It looks now that, with MON gone, there's the opportunity to raise the "no time to fix things which needed to be fixed last season" thing with someone other than MON to point the finger at, so that's "ok" now.

I guess it's a matter of perspective, but if some of the 'miserablists' on here tought the good outweighed the bad, then why did they never post on it and always have a pop at the manager? 

A lot of them did say when they thought things were good. They just weren't afraid to mention when things were bad.

How many regular posters on here, for example, were calling for MON to get the bullet?

I can think of about five. You'd think there was a massive knot of "sack the manager" feeling, when it was nothing of the sort.

[Concrete John]

How many regular posters on here, for example, were calling for MON to get the bullet?

I can think of about five. You'd think there was a massive knot of "sack the manager" feeling, when it was nothing of the sort.

And I can only think of two posters on here who were jumping on anything negative with the zeal you suggest.  OK, three if you include me

[Concrete John]

I see two possibilities here:-
1.  Randy invested to get us where he wanted, but we haven't got there.  Both in terms of CL qualification and increased revenue to support further spending.  So his original goal of the club fudning itself and getting a return on his investment is still there, but if that's as a 6th-8th side and no more then fair enough, because he no longer thinks further investment will get us any higher.
2.  He's happy to keep investing, mixed with a bit of restraint.  So he wants the wagebill reduced, which he feels can be achieved due to non-playing high earners and the emerging youth, and then keep buying players within the revised framework.  Sort of one step back in order to take two forward.

Either is his perogative as he owns the club, but number one does sound awfully close to the way Doug ran the club.  I'd be perfectly happy with number 2, as would a good manager who may come in, so I agree the next appointment will say more about the club's ambitions than anything we hear from the General or Randy himself.   

I've heard nothing to date that would suggest anything other than Option 2.

Neither have I, but then we also have not seen anything to date that confirms either theory, other than Randy's previous record with us, which lends itself towards option 2.

I think the proof is in the tasting, so it's a matter of sit back and see what happens.  The new manager will be a significant pointer though, as in modern football the better he is the more money he'll have been promised to work with!

[pauliewalnuts]

How many regular posters on here, for example, were calling for MON to get the bullet?

I can think of about five. You'd think there was a massive knot of "sack the manager" feeling, when it was nothing of the sort.

And I can only think of two posters on here who were jumping on anything negative with the zeal you suggest.  OK, three if you include me

I can think of plenty of times when poster x posted something in anyway negative about the club and was pounced on by a number of people.

You only have to look at General Krulak's thread to see examples of that - people being told to stop moaning by people with different opinions and priorities.

How many times did we hear "some people never stop moaning, we're sixth blah blah blah" when people suggested - for example - that the football was shit?

Incidentally, since MON went, some of the most zealous critics of the moaners in the past have now become the most zealous critics of the club.

It's ok when they're moaning, and they're expressing their opinions, see.

[peter w]

The most zealous critics, or moaners, about the x-manager seem to be from the club itself.

[cheltenhamlion]

How many regular posters on here, for example, were calling for MON to get the bullet?

I can think of about five. You'd think there was a massive knot of "sack the manager" feeling, when it was nothing of the sort.

And I can only think of two posters on here who were jumping on anything negative with the zeal you suggest.  OK, three if you include me

I can think of plenty of times when poster x posted something in anyway negative about the club and was pounced on by a number of people.

You only have to look at General Krulak's thread to see examples of that - people being told to stop moaning by people with different opinions and priorities.

How many times did we hear "some people never stop moaning, we're sixth blah blah blah" when people suggested - for example - that the football was shit?

Incidentally, since MON went, some of the most zealous critics of the moaners in the past have now become the most zealous critics of the club.

It's ok when they're moaning, and they're expressing their opinions, see.

Bingo

[Concrete John]

How many regular posters on here, for example, were calling for MON to get the bullet?

I can think of about five. You'd think there was a massive knot of "sack the manager" feeling, when it was nothing of the sort.

And I can only think of two posters on here who were jumping on anything negative with the zeal you suggest.  OK, three if you include me

I can think of plenty of times when poster x posted something in anyway negative about the club and was pounced on by a number of people.

You only have to look at General Krulak's thread to see examples of that - people being told to stop moaning by people with different opinions and priorities.

How many times did we hear "some people never stop moaning, we're sixth blah blah blah" when people suggested - for example - that the football was shit?

Incidentally, since MON went, some of the most zealous critics of the moaners in the past have now become the most zealous critics of the club.

It's ok when they're moaning, and they're expressing their opinions, see.

It's a word I use a lot, but it's all about balance.  I can think of one particular poster, who I won't name, who said he thought MON desrved another season, but then posted NOTHING but criticism and was conspicuous by his absence when ever we won a game.  I can also say that everytime I would even dare to suggest his transfer record was good, I'd end up in a me vs. the world argument.  It works both ways.

As for some people now moaning at the club, I must confess I see very little of that.  What i do see is questions and some doubts, which is understandable when a manager they rated walked out, but the 'pervailing opinion seems to be wait and see who the new manager is'.  And anyway, I don't deny anyone their right to moan, but I do feel that what I see unfair criticism of ANY manager should be countered.  If I saw someone having a pop at Randy ("he hasn't invested enough and is at asset stripper", etc.) I'd equally be arguing the toss with them.