How good are they really

[olaftab]

Gabby and Ash are very good compared with the shiite that went to South Africa however our best player  next season once he recovers will be Fab Delph.

[LeeB]

Gabby is not worth anywhere near £20m- he needs to improve his finishing vastly to be in that class, he has potential though and is improving yearly .

Ash is a quality player on his day and he and milner could be England regulars also for many years.

I'd say milner is ahead of them at the moment but a good year could really see ash and gabby push on this season at club and international level.

If Gabby was to leave this summer then we'd easily get £20m for him.

There's no way of proving that one way or the other unless we actually sell him.   Personally I'd be surprised if anyone, with the possible exception of  Cash City, would fork out 20m on a 10-12 goal a season striker who contributes relatively little else to the team.

That's laughable, quite frankly. A statement like that leads me to question your judgement and understanding of football.

[ktvillan]

And a statement like that leads me to quetion your ability to engage in rational debate without jumping to conclusions. Very easy to dismiss something without coming up with any coherent arguments against it.   You can question it all you like but I've explained my stance in a subsequent post, that it's relative to the kind of all round contribution that I would expect from a genuine 20m striker. Gabby falls short as far as I'm concerned and I'm far from being the only one who thinks that way.

[Concrete John]

And a statement like that leads me to quetion your ability to engage in rational debate without jumping to conclusions. Very easy to dismiss something without coming up with any coherent arguments against it.   You can question it all you like but I've explained my stance in a subsequent post, that it's relative to the kind of all round contribution that I would expect from a genuine 20m striker. Gabby falls short as far as I'm concerned and I'm far from being the only one who thinks that way.

Defoe and Bent do less 'team work' than Gabby, yet are rated at £20m+.  OK, both score more goals, but as all round players I'd rate Gabby higher.

He improved his physical strength and hold up play last season.  He has increased his goals scored each season.  I'm not his hugest fan either, but get excited about what he'll improve next and how far he can take his game.

[ktvillan]

Defoe and Bent do less 'team work' than Gabby, yet are rated at £20m+.  OK, both score more goals, but as all round players I'd rate Gabby higher.

He improved his physical strength and hold up play last season.  He has increased his goals scored each season.  I'm not his hugest fan either, but get excited about what he'll improve next and how far he can take his game.

Rated by whom at 20m+ ?  Both have been transferred relatively recently for quite a bit less than 20m.  Has Man City's new found wealth suddenly increased evey player's value by 25-30%?

I don;t watch them often enough to assess their all round contributions compared to Gabby's, but as you correctly say they both score quite a few more goals , averaging around 1 every two games in the league and overall.    If Gabby could score that many I wouldn't care if he sat in an armchair smoking a cigar for the rest of the time.

Sure he's improved his hold up play but reasonable hold up play and fewer than one goal every three games does not equal 20m in my view.  Not yet anyway.

[Concrete John]

Well, unless one of them moves then it's all speculation, as it is with Gabby, but I doubt either could be prised away from their current clubs for less than £20m.

[sfx412]

And a statement like that leads me to quetion your ability to engage in rational debate without jumping to conclusions. Very easy to dismiss something without coming up with any coherent arguments against it.   You can question it all you like but I've explained my stance in a subsequent post, that it's relative to the kind of all round contribution that I would expect from a genuine 20m striker. Gabby falls short as far as I'm concerned and I'm far from being the only one who thinks that way.

Thing is there are very few pundits and managers out there who agree with you and those others who have a derogatory opinion of the bloke.
I still think with Drogba seemingly valued at 24 mill that Gabby would sell for under 20 .

Even Milners price is now dropping I see in the media.

[Concrete John]

And a statement like that leads me to quetion your ability to engage in rational debate without jumping to conclusions. Very easy to dismiss something without coming up with any coherent arguments against it.   You can question it all you like but I've explained my stance in a subsequent post, that it's relative to the kind of all round contribution that I would expect from a genuine 20m striker. Gabby falls short as far as I'm concerned and I'm far from being the only one who thinks that way.

Thing is there are very few pundits and managers out there who agree with you and those others who have a derogatory opinion of the bloke.
I still think with Drogba seemingly valued at 24 mill that Gabby would sell for under 20 .

Even Milners price is now dropping I see in the media.

With the best part of 10 years between them in age, comparing the value of Drogba and Gabby is quite misleading.  And Milner's value is not dropping, just the press picked a smaller number out of the air this morning when filling column inches!

[ktvillan]

You may be right, but, if so, a lot of it will be down to their goalscoring records which Gabby can't match, and which his improved hold up play does not compensate enough for.

[ktvillan]

And a statement like that leads me to quetion your ability to engage in rational debate without jumping to conclusions. Very easy to dismiss something without coming up with any coherent arguments against it.   You can question it all you like but I've explained my stance in a subsequent post, that it's relative to the kind of all round contribution that I would expect from a genuine 20m striker. Gabby falls short as far as I'm concerned and I'm far from being the only one who thinks that way.

Thing is there are very few pundits and managers out there who agree with you and those others who have a derogatory opinion of the bloke.
I still think with Drogba seemingly valued at 24 mill that Gabby would sell for under 20 .

Even Milners price is now dropping I see in the media.

Not sure I understand what you are getting at.  You seem to be saying most pundits ánd managers would value Gabby at over 20m but you personally don't.  I can't say Ive seen any pundits value Gabby at 20m and I don't recall any bids or valuations from managers in that ball park..

[Olof's Beard]

Sure he's improved his hold up play but reasonable hold up play and fewer than one goal every three games does not equal 20m in my view.  Not yet anyway.

Gabby scored 13 in 33 league games last season, that's one every 2.53 games, and 16 in 41 games in all competitions at one every 2.56.  Just three more goals in the league and he'd have one every two games and as someone pointed out, he doesn't take penalties.  He has his faults but his goal record is improving and already none too shabby.

[Olneythelonely]

There's no way of proving that one way or the other unless we actually sell him.   Personally I'd be surprised if anyone, with the possible exception of  Cash City, would fork out 20m on a 10-12 goal a season striker who contributes relatively little else to the team.

16 goals last season, but apart from that you are spot on. Well, apart from contributing little else to the team, he contributes hugely and is one of our most missed player when not in the team. So yeah, apart from him scoring 16 goals last season and offering a lot more besides, spot on.

I was thinking PL goals and over his career to date.  His average return over the four full seasons he's played is 11.25. Even if you count all his cup goals it's only 12.5 so still not a million miles from my assertion of 10-12 a season.  Although admittedly his total has increased each year and he may yet improve and prove me wrong.

I didn't say he contributes little else, I said he contributes  relatively little else.  It's an important distinction that you overlook.  In my opinion he doesn't do as much as some other strikers in terms of , say, clever link up play, creating space for others with intelligent runs (fat chance), reading the game,  playing other players in, creating something out of nothing etc.  Certainly not enough, in my opinion, to justify a 20 million price tag.

Assists - 2008/09

Rooney - 7
Gabby 8

Assists - 2009/10

Rooney - 5
Gabby - 5

Seeing as Premier League stats are the only stats that matter, "relatively" he does alright.

I personally don't give a shit how much other teams think he's worth, at this moment in time I'd say he's pretty priceless for us.

[ktvillan]

According to the official PL website Gabby played 36 games, 1 as sub.  That means it's one goal every 2.77 games, a lot nearer to 1 in 3 than 1 in 2. In any case it's all ifs and buts, he didn't get the extra goals and you can only judge him on what he did do, not what he might have done.  You can't say he didn't have the chances to improve his tally, how many 1 on 1s did he fluff?

Good point about the penalties though - but would you trust him to take them with his tendency to be not so good when given time to think ?

BTW I don't think Defoe is the Spurs penalty take any longer (Modric?) because he missed something like 6 out of his last 10 or 11 taken.

[Mazrim]

WE wouldn't sell him for less than £20m. Arguably no player is worth such a stupid amount of money but Aston Villa, at this moment in time, would not entertain an offer of under £20m for Gabby.

And if we did, we'd be twats and may as well pack it up.

[cheltenhamlion]

I don't understand some of the grief that Gabby gets.

He is the one player we miss more than any other when he is not available, has improved year on year and his goal scoring record is comparable with all but the very top scorers in the league.