Summer 2010 Transfer Thread: B*llsh*t, Rumours & Wishes

[Greg N'Ash]

 
well most of us think he should be looking abroad, but i wouldn't hold your breath. ISM let the cat out the bag on that one.

Maybe so but whoever will sign will be expected to come up with the goods immediately. That's the pressure from us, the fans, especially following Tottenham getting 4th and us realising that we could start going downards with them having stolen a march on us, a more money Man City, and the possibility of a resurgent Liverpool and you can through Everton into the mix.

With that in mind I can see why MON will err on the side of caution. How man foriegners can you name that have come in and been an instant success?

what? half the best players in the premiership are foreign. utter utter madness to tie one arm behind your back and ignore every other market but the uk and ireland

That's not what I asked. How many players have been instant successes? That's what will be expected by us, and a player won't be given the luxury of bedding in such as Bergkamp, Henry, Cantona etc who all went on to be great.

i'd say 4 seasons would be sufficient time to bed in, so if he'd bought any they'd definetely have come good by now. maybe entering your 5th season is a bit late no?

But that's again missing the point. Argue what you like abouut the past 4 seasons but the only relevance is what happens now. So, going into his 5th year on the back of a season seen as a missed opportunity in terms of CL qualification, with the competition being hotter than ever, any player coming in from overseas will be expected to deliver from game 1. By you, me, and the press.

Whether he should have bought from overseas before now is besides the point as this started with you saying he should be looking abroad. maybe he is, and I'd expect him to be doing so but with a healthy dose of realisation that they may not add much to the team until November-December onwards at the eraliest. By which time we may have slipped further behind the pack.

yes ist a gamble but not a gamble worth taking unless you have the luxury of millions to be able to spend and/or waste.

i really don't see your point. yes, they'd be expectation on the shoulders of a foreign striker arriving this summer, but i'm sure if robbie keane arrives they'd be similar, and lets face it he hardly rose to the challenge when he joined liverpool

[Chris Smith]

Of course it's possible point to examples of foreign players who haven't settled at clubs straight away, or at all, but it's equally possible to point to transfers of British players between British clubs which haven't worked out for the same reason.  Shaun Maloney is a case in point.  Cuellar is another who took time to settle in, as is Petrov.

As a policy, or even as a guideline, limiting our range of options to those based in Britain and / or with Premier League experience cannot be beneficial.  We've signed a number of British-based players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out so it doesn't offer any guarantees.

Regardless of whether we do or don't 'look abroad' the fact is that only 3 players in 4 seasons have arrived at the club with no prior experience of British football.  That does point to a very strong preference for the opposite.

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

[Concrete John]

its a bobbins point john. yes, some foreign players are crap or don't settle but the same is true of british players

Just because you do not agree with it, does not make it 'bobbins'.

At least you're accepting that foreign signings come with a risk, which to me is greater than those signed domestically, as opposed to fermenting the view that all our woes would be solved by shopping abroad!

[LeeB]

what? half the best players in the premiership are foreign. utter utter madness to tie one arm behind your back and ignore every other market but the uk and ireland

The very top players brought in by the CL clubs are instant successes, due both to them being class and sliding straight into a very good team.  And unfortunately that is not the market we will be shopping in.

How was Rodallega's first season at Wigan, for example?

It won't happen all the time, but I do think it is a consideration that deserves to be taken into account.

Even we managed a few decent foreign signings john.  i realise olof, Laursen etc., are no Davies or knight but still

We made a profit on Knight. We didn't on the other two.

mcgrath was crap value as well because all we need is to make a profit

Did I say they we're crap? No.
Did you infer Knight was? Yes.
Knight was so bad, he increased in value.

Knight, and now possibly Davies became obsolete because our useless manager found better players where pretty much no-one else was looking. And on these very shores.

[Greg N'Ash]

Of course it's possible point to examples of foreign players who haven't settled at clubs straight away, or at all, but it's equally possible to point to transfers of British players between British clubs which haven't worked out for the same reason.  Shaun Maloney is a case in point.  Cuellar is another who took time to settle in, as is Petrov.

As a policy, or even as a guideline, limiting our range of options to those based in Britain and / or with Premier League experience cannot be beneficial.  We've signed a number of British-based players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out so it doesn't offer any guarantees.

Regardless of whether we do or don't 'look abroad' the fact is that only 3 players in 4 seasons have arrived at the club with no prior experience of British football.  That does point to a very strong preference for the opposite.

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

and carew?

[peter w]

The point being greg that making a point of looking to sign from overseas is as fraught with minefields as much as looking at the home market. I'm sure MON has cast his net far and wide but hasn't come up with the players he thinks are good enough for us.

[LeeB]

Of course it's possible point to examples of foreign players who haven't settled at clubs straight away, or at all, but it's equally possible to point to transfers of British players between British clubs which haven't worked out for the same reason.  Shaun Maloney is a case in point.  Cuellar is another who took time to settle in, as is Petrov.

As a policy, or even as a guideline, limiting our range of options to those based in Britain and / or with Premier League experience cannot be beneficial.  We've signed a number of British-based players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out so it doesn't offer any guarantees.

Regardless of whether we do or don't 'look abroad' the fact is that only 3 players in 4 seasons have arrived at the club with no prior experience of British football.  That does point to a very strong preference for the opposite.

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

and carew?

A no risk move, as he replaced an expensive sack of shit at no extra cost.

[Concrete John]

I think it's a case of £10m for a PL based player v £10m for an overseas player, then Martin will plump for the PL player.  He was quoted a while ago that he felt the overseas bargains were not there anymore.

Taken into account the extra factor of adjusting to PL football and living in this country, who's to say he's wrong?

EDIT: that's presuming they are percieved to be of equal ability.

[Greg N'Ash]

The point being greg that making a point of looking to sign from overseas is as fraught with minefields as much as looking at the home market. I'm sure MON has cast his net far and wide but hasn't come up with the players he thinks are good enough for us.

i agree it is peter, but i don't think its more fraught which i thought was what you were suggesting. i just think to ignore 90% of the football playing world as ISM has said is a bit silly, even suicidal for a manager

[Chris Smith]

Of course it's possible point to examples of foreign players who haven't settled at clubs straight away, or at all, but it's equally possible to point to transfers of British players between British clubs which haven't worked out for the same reason.  Shaun Maloney is a case in point.  Cuellar is another who took time to settle in, as is Petrov.

As a policy, or even as a guideline, limiting our range of options to those based in Britain and / or with Premier League experience cannot be beneficial.  We've signed a number of British-based players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out so it doesn't offer any guarantees.

Regardless of whether we do or don't 'look abroad' the fact is that only 3 players in 4 seasons have arrived at the club with no prior experience of British football.  That does point to a very strong preference for the opposite.

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

and carew?

Hilts didn't cite Carew so I'm not sure why you are mentioning him.

[peter w]

I doubt 90% is ignored just not considered either good enough for us, tried but didn't get, or just plain simple didn't want to join us.

[Greg N'Ash]

Of course it's possible point to examples of foreign players who haven't settled at clubs straight away, or at all, but it's equally possible to point to transfers of British players between British clubs which haven't worked out for the same reason.  Shaun Maloney is a case in point.  Cuellar is another who took time to settle in, as is Petrov.

As a policy, or even as a guideline, limiting our range of options to those based in Britain and / or with Premier League experience cannot be beneficial.  We've signed a number of British-based players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out so it doesn't offer any guarantees.

Regardless of whether we do or don't 'look abroad' the fact is that only 3 players in 4 seasons have arrived at the club with no prior experience of British football.  That does point to a very strong preference for the opposite.

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

and carew?

Hilts didn't cite Carew so I'm not sure why you are mentioning him.

i'm mentoning him beecuse the one time MON spent a decent amount on a   foreign based player he settled immediately which rather wrecks any ideas that MON is worried about them settling

[hilts_coolerking]

Citing Maloney, Cuellar and Petrov supports the argument that players without PL experience take longer to settle than those that do.

And yet Carew is an example of a player with no British experience at all who settled very quickly.  Whereas Curtis Davies, Steve Sidwell and Nicky Shorey, to name just three, are examples of British players with Premier League experience who haven't worked out.

It seems to me that there is no coherent argument to be made in favour of limiting your pool of choices to British based players or those who have Premier League experience.

As we have seen, being based in Britain has no bearing on how long a player will take to settle, and having Premier League experience has no bearing on whether the transfer will be a success.

[peter w]

Sometimes you will find a player that hits the ground running - such as Dion Dublin - but they tend to be the exception not the rule. We live our lives by rules and not exceptions and that's true of transfers. You may buy hoping for the exception but the vast majority don't hit the ground running or settle in immediately.

As for Carew's 3 goals in 11 games when he first joined, I doubt that's the hit the ground running, settling in that would be accepted by expectant fans come August onwards.

[Concrete John]

i'm mentoning him beecuse the one time MON spent a decent amount on a   foreign based player he settled immediately which rather wrecks any ideas that MON is worried about them settling

How does it 'wreck' it?  One success hardly sets a trend!

If that was the case he'd only sign 6'4" Norwegian strikers!!