Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: PeterWithesShin on August 25, 2017, 09:37:05 PM
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A meh performance against a crap side. Good job that pen decision went our way.
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Tough place to go. Not the end of the world.
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Well we didnt lose. We came from behind. They could have had 19 hand balls against Terry. Erm thats it
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Bad result. Needed a win.
5 points from our opening 5 games is a bad return, nowhere near promotion form.
Another disappointing season.
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Bruce out
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Only played for 60 minutes.
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First time weve came from behind to get anything away from home under Bruce so thats a positive. Never looked like winning though.
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WM sound quite positive about this. Which in itself is a statement. Sounded like we played some decent football. I'll gladly take that. Onwards and upwards.
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Decent point but we're not gonna go up without winning away games. Thought we played well actually.
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Almost numb to the pain of mediocrity anymore.
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Mostly rubbish, and another sub-standard performance.
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Took way to long to make the changes. Getting a 1-1 in a game where it's a "difficult place to go"is all well and good if you want to finish 6-16. That's where we will be.
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WM sound quite positive about this. Which in itself is a statement. Sounded like we played some decent football. I'll gladly take that. Onwards and upwards.
Occasionally we did.
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Tough place to go. Not the end of the world.
I'd say that was fair enough if we were in control of the game, peppered them and just had one of those nights.
The problem for me is that we are at their level, which isn't acceptable
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He knows the division, he is the person for the job, he will get it right.
My arse!
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Yawn. Not good enough again and the stall was set out by the system we started the game with. We don't try to dominate away we try and sneak a result and always fucking fail.
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Bruce's football deserves to be in the shithouse thread. Not for good reasons.
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A f ing draw at Bristol City just not good enough.
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Plenty of effort and they're no way a crap side but probably a fair result.
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I haven't seen any team in the Championship either this year or last who were so good that we needed to play 3 at the back to counter them.
Rubbish decision, but we rallied from the switch of formation onwards.
Some nice periods of possession when we looked like we might have actually played together before. Shame Elmo wasn't at the races at all to provide the cutting edge from out wide.
Terry had a Barry Crocker.
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He knows the division, he is the person for the job, he will get it right.
My arse!
So, when the fuck is he going to start?
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Better than the previous away games... but we have to start getting 3 points.
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You can sense the apathy starting to set in about 'going up'. We have assembled a Harlem globe-trotting squad for this level. If we aren't promoted this season automatically it will be remiss. On that showing, that is not likely.
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Bad start. We were probably the better team second half. They don't lose many at home.
Given our recent record I'd say a reasonably positive result which will hopefully keep some momentum
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A f ing draw at Bristol City just not good enough.
We got done 3-1 last season.
Anyway, I thought we looked quite lively at times in the second half especially the last twenty mins. In hindsight the tinkering shouldn't have happened but let's not slit our wrists yet. Thought Davis ran out of steam and Hogan and Birkir looked lively when they came on.
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With that squad we really should do better, forget the excuses.
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I haven't seen any team in the Championship either this year or last who were so good that we needed to play 3 at the back to counter them.
Rubbish decision, but we rallied from the switch of formation onwards.
Some nice periods of possession when we looked like we might have actually played together before. Shame Elmo wasn't at the races at all to provide the cutting edge from out wide.
Terry had a Barry Crocker.
I'd largely agree other than I think it took us about 15 minutes once we changed shape for us to start looking like a team. The last few minutes of the first half and the 2nd half was ok but because we started so badly Davis had run himself into the ground for no reward and Hourihane wasn't getting forward as much as he should.
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He knows the division, he is the person for the job, he will get it right.
My arse!
lets appoint it please ;D
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Bad start. We were probably the better team second half. They don't lose many at home.
Given our recent record I'd say a reasonably positive result which will hopefully keep some momentum
I'd agree with that assessment. Second half, we passed it better.
I want to see more from Green, and someone playing up top with Davis.
Not a bad point. Next two home games are very important.
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Apart from the barmy formation and shit first 25 mins, I didn't think it was that bad. At least he changed it and I have the feeling we would've lost that last season.
Small steps and all that.
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The next three games are very winnable so we'll see. Shame about the shitty international break.
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Bree looked good we he came on too.
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But that's the problem isn't it?
It's always 'the next 3 games' or 'the next 2 games are winnable'.
All games are winnable, it's that we are just not very good at doing it.
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The useless cnut is going to ruin Davis with shit like that, Eric Morecambe reincarnated, tarrraahhhh, useless,tactically inept twat.
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Got exactly what he set up for.
One point out of 9 away from home is not nearly good enough especially against the might of Cardiff, Reading & Bristol.
Elmo was abysmal. Virtually every cross was behind everyone or failed to beat the first man. Taylor on the other side was pedestrian at best.
Snodgrass is a good signing and by God do they need an injection of quality and verve in midfield.
Not even close to be good enough for me.
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Just sounds like Aston Villa Football Club are happy with a point away at Bristol City? When are we going to show some arrogance and passion rather than respect for these no mark outfits?
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
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Add Kodjia, Jedi, Snodgrass and later Jack and things will look a lot better. A point away is fine, something to build on....
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Got exactly what he set up for.
One point out of 9 away from home is not nearly good enough especially against the might of Cardiff, Reading & Bristol.
Elmo was abysmal. Virtually every cross was behind everyone or failed to beat the first man. Taylor on the other side was pedestrian at best.
Snodgrass is a good signing and by God do they need an injection of quality and verve in midfield.
Not even close to be good enough for me.
Elmo does nothing for me, either. He slows the play down in my opinion, rarely manages to get a decent cross in. Snodgrass is a definite upgrade, though I fear Elmo is the new Hutton-ie, he 'picks himself'.
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Played well in small doses. But still nowhere near the sum of our parts. Taking Davis off ...that alone sums Bruce up. The fans again awesome, heard them in France. Bruce out.
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Didn't see the match, but am I to understand it was back to Shit Sandwich territory?
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Add Kodjia, Jedi, Snodgrass and later Jack and things will look a lot better. A point away is fine, something to build on....
1 point out of 9 away from home isn't fine though.
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I'd rather we had that bearded centre half with the tattoos who played for Bristol tonight than the tw*t who wears number 26 for Villa.
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
And he will soon be gone.
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Add Kodjia, Jedi, Snodgrass and later Jack and things will look a lot better. A point away is fine, something to build on....
But we can't play 15 in a match :)
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
I noticed that in many passages of play, when we were knocking the ball sideways along the halfway line looking for a forward pass, the only one making any runs or movement in front of the ball was the premier league player.
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A step up from the horrors of Cardiff and Reading, but for the unnecessary change that Bruce started with. Other than the goal, Bristol didn't cause that many problems (very lucky not to concede a penalty mind). But we showed more urgency in the second half, and knocked it around nicely at times. Just that final ball.
Its a game we'd have lost last season and a couple of weeks ago.
Onwards and upwards.
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Davis is the real deal.
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Ignore the first half hour because of the train wreck tactics Bruce employed and it was ok. Onomoah was our best player by miles particularly in the second half, looks a level above our lot technically. Terry seemed keen to literally hand them goals and was their most potent attacking threat. Elmo was very average, everyone else was ok. Disappointing that we never really took charge after equalizing.
Johnstone 6, Chester 6, Terry 4, Samba 5, Taylor 6, Elmo 5, Whelan 7, Onomoah 8, Hourihane 6, Green 6, Davis 7.
Bree 7, Bjarnsson 7, Hogan 6. Bruce 4.
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Good character after they scored and we looked well in control after that but you never thought we'd grab a winner. We just don't win enough games nor do we look like being head and shoulders above anyone we play - even on Saturday you felt we were vulnerable both times Norwich scored. We are a solid side but nothing more. Top half maybe, playoffs? .... nah. Prove me wrong, Mr Bruce.
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Davis is the real deal.
Impressed he started. Hopefully Bruce is seeing the light and trusting the kids more.
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Didn't see the match, but am I to understand it was back to Shit Sandwich territory?
Yes mate.
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The problem is we dont get enough men forward and hence dont score enough.
Overall a point is ok but its not good enough when we have lost the first two
Bruce is still going on about the poisonous atmospherewhen when he arrived 10 months ago. Just get on with it
Thor looked ok when he came on
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We drew, when we really needs to win. The problem is, we never looked like winning.
I know a lot of people will be happy with a draw away to Bristol City, manager probably included, but I'm not one of them. Draws didn't do RDM any good, and then won't do Bruce any good. You're not going to draw your way out of this division.
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Add Kodjia, Jedi, Snodgrass and later Jack and things will look a lot better. A point away is fine, something to build on....
1 point out of 9 away from home isn't fine though.
Spot on. We need to win at least half our games away from home if we want to guarantee promotion. Would help if we could win more at home also.
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Davis is the real deal.
Impressed he started. Hopefully Bruce is seeing the light and trusting the kids more.
Hopefully he wont get a say next game as he'll be at the dole office.
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
Definitely - lucky with the deflection for the goal but if you don't shoot etc, and nobody else looked like doing anything. Also took one for the team with a smart yellow card later on. Shame he's a good prospect for Spurs and not for us.
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Bruce is displaying all of the diversionary tactics that other useless managers have used - Lambert, I'm looking at you,you ******.
basically, everything is our fault.
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Steve isn't getting us up this year, that's as plain as day.
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
I noticed that in many passages of play, when we were knocking the ball sideways along the halfway line looking for a forward pass, the only one making any runs or movement in front of the ball was the premier league player.
He linked well with Davis. Could be a good partnership
Green was anonymous. Stays very wide and has no room to go on the outside and hence has to cut back onto his right foot
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Much better than Cardiff and Reading and could have nicked it..they have been playing well too so not a disaster.
Positives Davis did well again, Hourihane too. Bree was composed and Whelan improved as it went on. But Onomah is a bloody diamond. What a player he is going to be in 2 years time. He will play many, many times for England.
Negatives - Bruce changes. Hogan up with Davis maybe sacrificing Whelan last 10 and Adomah is an assist magnet, should have been on not Thor for me but for Elmo not Green. Terry was fucking awful. Samba should start ahead of him. Elmo was rubbish.
Chester hates taking throws!
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We could be 10 points behind the top 2 after tomorrow's games.
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Didn't see the match, but am I to understand it was back to Shit Sandwich territory?
Yes mate.
Davis is the real deal.
Impressed he started. Hopefully Bruce is seeing the light and trusting the kids more.
Hopefully he wont get a say next game as he'll be at the dole office.
These are not happy takes on the match.
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Has anyone asked Bruce why he changed a winning formation and line-up?
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Mostly rubbish, and another sub-standard performance.
You can just cut and paste that to 90% of our away games.
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
I noticed that in many passages of play, when we were knocking the ball sideways along the halfway line looking for a forward pass, the only one making any runs or movement in front of the ball was the premier league player.
He linked well with Davis. Could be a good partnership
Green was anonymous. Stays very wide and has no room to go on the outside and hence has to cut back onto his right foot
Davis and Hogan, from the start, Green sat behind and we would of won tonight, I'M CONVINCED OF THAT.
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The useless cnut is going to ruin Davis with shit like that, Eric Morecambe reincarnated, tarrraahhhh, useless,tactically inept twat.
Ehh?
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We are what we are: a mid table championship team.
It's just not going to happen under Bruce I'm afraid.
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Link to post match interview https://www.facebook.com/avfcofficial/videos/1661415017235894/
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Some positives to take from the match tonight. Probably only Terry in the team knows that if you go a goal down it isn't game over...But please all this bollocks about Bruce being a promotion specialist is exactly that...bollocks.
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Add Kodjia, Jedi, Snodgrass and later Jack and things will look a lot better. A point away is fine, something to build on....
1 point out of 9 away from home isn't fine though.
No. But tonight was 1 point out of 3 at a team who don't lose often at home. It's on the back of two wins and may be part of a recovery. Of course that is yet to be seen.
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Has anyone asked Bruce why he changed a winning formation and line-up?
From which game Norwich or Wigan?
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Fear factor football.The team is dying to play offensively but is hamstrung by the absolute crass management and coaching set up.
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I'm sorry I didn't think we were that bad. He got it wrong to start and changed it. We aren't going to win every game and for me we have shown improvement.
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I reckon it's turning round. More confident about us than I have for a while. Some very good players to come back in yet.
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Didn't see the match, but am I to understand it was back to Shit Sandwich territory?
Wasn't the Subway footlong turd spectacular as per Cardiff, Reading or most of our away offerings under Bruce.
But not one to tell the Grandkids about in 40-odd years either. 'I was there when Terry made a fool of himself.' So what?
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Clown commentator on sky all night, "Villa haven't spent much this season", "Steve Bruce will surely turn it around at Aston Villa if given time "etc etc. Our wage bill must dwarf Bristol ten times over ffs. Such an easy ride Bruce is getting.
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The useless cnut is going to ruin Davis with shit like that, Eric Morecambe reincarnated, tarrraahhhh, useless,tactically inept twat.
Ehh?
Keinan was asked to do far too much for a 19 y-o on his own, he played all the right players , almost, but in the wrong order, goodbye, you tactically inept twat. How's that?
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
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The useless cnut is going to ruin Davis with shit like that, Eric Morecambe reincarnated, tarrraahhhh, useless,tactically inept twat.
Ehh?
Keinan was asked to do far too much for a 19 y-o on his own, he played all the right players , almost, but in the wrong order, goodbye, you tactically inept twat. How's that?
Bruce isnt going anywhere
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I thought once we started playing the correct formation there were far more positives than negatives. We looked like we were actually trying to win the game away from home for a change and we coped fairly comfortably with most of what they chucked at us. If we'd brought Hogan and Thor on 5-10 minutes earlier I think we might have nicked it.
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So who can we beat away?
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Kodija for green and we'll have a top 2 team.
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Terry...hmmm
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
100% correct, If we had the right manager.
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Clown commentator on sky all night, "Villa haven't spent much this season", "Steve Bruce will surely turn it around at Aston Villa if given time "etc etc. Our wage bill must dwarf Bristol ten times over ffs. Such an easy ride Bruce is getting.
Bruce in pure politico/ marketing Svengali mode. Say it often enough and it becomes true.
See also David O'Leary's high tempo attacking football.
Emily Bishop's son who (somehow) writes for the nationals came out with that gem once. Which showed just how often he'd watched us.
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Stick to the same team and formation as last weekend, and we win that game...he didn't and we didn't.
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Kodija for green and we'll have a top 2 team.
But who is going to create the chances for him. We created nada for the 3 away games
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
In fairness the bar is pretty low when it comes to us away from home. We played ok but I can't really remember their keeper making a notable save whereas we needed a dodgy pen decision and a fingertips save to take a point. Hopefully we do click but hard to see if your manager is going to fanny around with daft decisions like tonight's starting line-up.
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
You're not alone.
Jury is still out for me but on the back of two wins that was ok for me given our prior away record (and their home record)
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They lost 8 at home last season and finished 3 points above the drop zone, it's not like Ashton Gate is a fortress.
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I thought we played well tonight but without the win promotion just got a little bit further away.
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They lost 8 at home last season and finished 3 points above the drop zone, it's not like Ashton Gate is a fortress.
And? Every game is different. Last season means jack shit, different teams now.
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Kodija for green and we'll have a top 2 team
No chance.
Not while we're set up like tonight.
Hopefully that's the last we'll see of 3 centre halves.
Elhomady was very poor. Bree improved things when he came on. Terry? Hmmmmmmmmm.
Hogan looked lively. Davis did well.
But we!re just a "nothing" team going forward underder Bruce.
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
You're not alone.
Jury is still out for me but on the back of two wins that was ok for me given our prior away record (and their home record)
It was Bristol City we were playing, not ( insert premier or champions league) team.
Fk off Steve(I have all the right media excuses) Bruce.
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Agree with most other folks. From what I saw (2nd half) we played decent in spells. That is not good enough to win this league which simply must be our aim.
With all due respect to Bristol City, Aston Villa should never be celebrating a point at their place. We needed a win and we didn't get it.
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Kodija for green and we'll have a top 2 team.
Rather Green than Elmo on the right , also the defence doesn't look sure of itself at the moment
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
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Six games from 9th to 30th of September. We'll have a good idea by then.
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Davis is the real deal.
Bet he starts with hogan and snodgrass next game
Impressed he started. Hopefully Bruce is seeing the light and trusting the kids more.
Hopefully he wont get a say next game as he'll be at the dole office.
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
In fairness the bar is pretty low when it comes to us away from home. We played ok but I can't really remember their keeper making a notable save whereas we needed a dodgy pen decision and a fingertips save to take a point. Hopefully we do click but hard to see if your manager is going to fanny around with daft decisions like tonight's starting line-up.
Oh that was madness but at least he changed it this time.
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Six games from 9th to 30th of September. We'll have a good idea by then.
we will need 12-15 points from them if we are going to do anything this year
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Some crazy comments. A point is fine. Bruce will get us up this season. He's done it 4 times before. A platform to build on, some great talent to come in.
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Terry...hmmm
Brucie revealed that he has done great meet and greet in the dressing room with young players. He even goes the extra mile in his own car! Turning up at games he is not involved in. Great value.
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The three centre halves thing is odd.
Odd in the sense that I don't think we tried it once during pre season, despite Bruce previously expressing an interest to go that way.
And now he is trialing it in games where we actually need to win. He is a spoofer. Our hopes of going up seem to rely on enough leadership or chemistry coming from the senior players themselves. Because there will be little>no guidance from Bruce at all.
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Terry...hmmm
Brucie revealed that he has done great meet and greet in the dressing room with young players. He even goes the extra mile in his own car! Turning up at games he is not involved in. Great value.
Hopefully he'll start turning up for the games he is playing.
/baddumtish
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The three centre halves thing is odd.
Odd in the sense that I don't think we tried it once during pre season, despite Bruce previously expressing an interest to go that way.
And now he is trialing it in games where we actually need to win. He is a spoofer. Our hopes of going up seem to rely on enough leadership or chemistry coming from the senior players themselves. Because there will be little>no guidance from Bruce at all.
Bruce played three at the back in all of the pre season games.
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Am I alone in thinking that was much, much better away from home? This is a game that epitomised last season we lost it in ignominious fashion with very little fight. This season okay we haven't won but we were a lot more composed and played much better football. I honestly don't think we are that far away from really clicking this season.
You're not alone.
Jury is still out for me but on the back of two wins that was ok for me given our prior away record (and their home record)
It was Bristol City we were playing, not ( insert premier or champions league) team.
Fk off Steve(I have all the right media excuses) Bruce.
If you can't, or don't want to, see any progression then fair enough. For me not losing was important. It helps keep momentum and is good for confidence. I'm hopeful we will go on a run and maybe in a few weeks time we'll look back and consider this as a good result in terms of confidence and just stopping the away losing streak.
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Man for man we had far better players than Bristol but Andrews got it right at half time when he said that Villa are all individuals looking to make something happen (or words to that effect). On the other side you had lesser players playing to a system of movement and working the ball through the middle and up the pitch. We would walk this league if we had a tactical coach in place of Bruce who is just trying to join the dots.
Some of his comments show him up e.g.:
1. We brought players in at Xmas that statistically were at the top in the Championship. So no thought as how they fitted the team
2. Players showed no desire last season to put hard effort in and just rolled over at times. So he brought Gabby back - great example to the other players!
I could go one but I am fed up with not getting the best out of what we have got. It's a criminal waste. I am getting fed up with his comments about it being down to everybody else. I have said it before that my impression of him before at other clubs is that he always feels sorry for himself when things don't go for him. If we get promoted it will be because of the players, not the manager.
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The formation was wrong but he made the change so that's fair enough. Sometimes you can just hit on a formation that clicks so I can understand why he's tinkering around looking for something to break the pattern away from home.
It's easy to say just play the same way as the last two games. It rarely works that way and the we clearly have a psychological barrier to overcome.
We recovered from being behind and we got something from the game so something to build on.
4 of the next 6 games at home. September will make or break the season.
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Some crazy comments. A point is fine. Bruce will get us up this season. He's done it 4 times before. A platform to build on, some great talent to come in.
You're taking the piss, Shirley
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The three centre halves thing is odd.
Odd in the sense that I don't think we tried it once during pre season, despite Bruce previously expressing an interest to go that way.
And now he is trialing it in games where we actually need to win. He is a spoofer. Our hopes of going up seem to rely on enough leadership or chemistry coming from the senior players themselves. Because there will be little>no guidance from Bruce at all.
Bruce played three at the back in all of the pre season games.
Not sure he has the personnel to pay three at the back. Those three dont fill me with any confidence
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de leat for samba might work as a three.
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I thought Samba looked excellent before went off but the system didn't work
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The formation was wrong but he made the change so that's fair enough. Sometimes you can just hit on a formation that clicks so I can understand why he's tinkering around looking for something to break the pattern away from home.
It's easy to say just play the same way as the last two games. It rarely works that way and the we clearly have a psychological barrier to overcome.
We recovered from being behind and we got something from the game so something to build on.
4 of the next 6 games at home. September will make or break the season.
Excellent post - completely agree
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
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I think the last time we flowed forward as a team was the Wembley semi.
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Well said, I couldn't agree more.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
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The three centre halves thing is odd.
Odd in the sense that I don't think we tried it once during pre season, despite Bruce previously expressing an interest to go that way.
And now he is trialing it in games where we actually need to win. He is a spoofer. Our hopes of going up seem to rely on enough leadership or chemistry coming from the senior players themselves. Because there will be little>no guidance from Bruce at all.
Bruce played three at the back in all of the pre season games.
Of those that I seen (Telford, Shrewsbury the German games and Watford) I don't recall three at the back being used. Starting formations indicate we didn't either. But with 23+ substitutes allowed per pre season friendly, admittedly it's hard to keep track.
When did we go to 3 at the back v Shrewsbury? Fairly certain we ended up with defensive lynchpins Richards and Hutton as our two centre halves, replacing Terry and Chester.
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Grealish
Onomah
Davis. Kodja
Could be deadly(under the right management)
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Bruce in the headmaster's study again after that I'm afraid. Put it in the pre match thread, but why a complete change of formation after the last two games? We looked badly disjointed with three at the back and were all over the place. When he changed it back to the formation from last Saturday, we were much better and it was a pretty decent display from then on to be honest. Bruce gets marked down again though, for not changing things earlier when we had a bit of a lull and not bringing Adomah on for Elmohamady, who I thought had a poor game.
Some other positives from tonight:
Bree - thought he did well when he came on and has got to be given a run in the side now
Bjarnason and Hogan - looked sharp and decent when they both came on even if the final product was not quite there.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
You do however, need the players who can do it.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
You do however, need the players who can do it.
Yes, that's for sure. But at this level Elmo ought to be a reasonable wing back. But it didn't work. It was horrible. And to his credit Bruce recognised this and had the balls to change it after 20 mins, so I'm not really sure why there is so much angst
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Positives:
We showed a bit of fight when we went 1-0 down for a change
We looked fairly solid
Still got Jedinak, Snodgrass, Grealish and Kodjia to come back in
The fans and the 'limbs' for the goal
Negatives:
We went 1-0 down again in an away game
Negative approach from kick off
Terry can't run or jump
Samba can't run
Bjarnason isn't a footballer
Another away game without a win
Overall there were some signs of improvement and a bit of character on display. However our approach at the start of away games is wrong and just so frustrating. We've got the best squad in this league and it's about time we started to show it. We should be going to places like that and starting on the front foot and letting them worry about us, not the other way round.
His formation and tactics were just bizarre considering our last two games. Too much emphasis is put on playing away, it's just a big green football pitch ffs.
September is a massive month for Bruce, he needs to be in or around the top 6 by the end of it for me.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
They play three at the back yes.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
They play three at the back yes.
Rightio .
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
You do however, need the players who can do it.
Yes, that's for sure. But at this level Elmo ought to be a reasonable wing back. But it didn't work. It was horrible. And to his credit Bruce recognised this and had the balls to change it after 20 mins, so I'm not really sure why there is so much angst
Why start with it in the first place when the two previous games had gone well?
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
You do however, need the players who can do it.
Yes, that's for sure. But at this level Elmo ought to be a reasonable wing back. But it didn't work. It was horrible. And to his credit Bruce recognised this and had the balls to change it after 20 mins, so I'm not really sure why there is so much angst
Because it's increasingly likely we'll be here next year with crippling financial issues.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
They play three at the back yes.
Rightio .
Ok. So if they don't play three at the back and two wing backs what system do you think they play?
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
They play three at the back yes.
Rightio .
Ok. So if they don't play three at the back and two wing backs what system do you think they play?
It's called the inverted Hidegouti system
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I reckon just tell them from the start that we're a goal down and maybe they might try a bit.
It's the only time we did.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
They don't play with Chester, Terry and Samba as a three. You need some pace and with our three we needed the two wing backs to drop back as cover to then become a 5-man defence. Also, why play Samba on the left and Terry in the middle which made a completely unbalanced.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Are you serious? Have you not seen Chelsea or numerous other top teams playing this recently?
It may not have been right for us tonight, but to say it is for dinosaurs when some of the most progressive managers in the world play it is a bit odd.
But they don't play a true three centre half system do they?
They play three at the back yes.
Rightio .
Ok. So if they don't play three at the back and two wing backs what system do you think they play?
Chelsea do play 3 at the back but they don't play wing backs. It's more like 343.
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I thought we did ok and deserved a draw, but not sure why Bruce changed a recently successful shape.
Onomah is class, always seems to have a second or two on the ball. Terry often looks more of a liabililty than a legend - needs to keep his arms down especially. I thought Davies did well to hold it up and lay it off a few times despite attempts by Beckenbaker and others to physically bully him by going through him a few times. Green started well but faded badly, Hourihan was good in patches but anonymous in others. Very happy not to see any sign of Hutton or Gabby.
I think there is something to build on but still have feelings that Bruce is more of a tinkerman than Ranieri, in an "if it aint broke I think I'll try and break it" kind of way. Jury's still out but he needs to radically improve our away form and maintain our home form if he's going to get my support.
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Yep, SHA beat them there to stay up on the last day. They'll be mid table this season.
Mid table sides are the sort we need to be beating to make sure we get top 6 and also have a crack at automatic promotion. We're not getting 80 odd points just from home games.
On the performance a draw was fair but in the context of where we need to be this was two points dropped especially as we've started scoring goals and putting in convincing performances.
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As is the norm,Bruce sent us out in a away game with the intention of not losing .If he sent us out to try and actually win it ,we might actually win a few
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As is the norm,Bruce sent us out in a away game with the intention of not losing .If he sent us out to try and actually win it ,we might actually win a few
Yep and basically this is the issue.
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It's shocking how bad we are away really.
3 away wins under Steve Bruce and two of those were at teams no longer in this division due to being relegated (Rotherham and Wigan).
Other at Reading really was just a new manager bounce type result given we then didn't win any for another four months.
We really just can't impose any sort of game plan on the opposition. Just think back to those days under MON when we would be spoiled with 9-10 away wins a season. Conceding possession but so lethal on the counter attack.
Nowadays we just don't offer anything bar being content with a 0-0 and struggling to respond when the home team inevitably scores. It's not good enough if we want to go up I'm afraid.
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It's because we don't try to impose ourselves away from home, we're unnecessarily negative.
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I have seen much, much worse under Bruce, but that's really not saying much.
The first 20-25 minutes were like some sort of bad acid trip. Why try to be so clever?
Just do the same fucking thing with the same fucking players as you did against Norwich. This is a fucking awful league. We've got a strong squad that, purely by applying the minimum of common sense should be challenging at the top. That is exactly how Benitez got Newcastle up - no insane cleverness, just apply the minimum of common sense and let your squad do the work and get you up.
He's an infuriating manager. 90 minutes of exciting football last week and he's straight back to cautious just-don't-lose nonsense.
He's his own worse enemy.
Unfortunately, our expectations are now so fucking low, we have to think of that as a good result.
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Genuinely, did anyone not on our coaching team think that Chester - Terry - Samba thing was going to work?
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Too many anonymous players. Good in bits and pieces but Onomah and Hourihane need to influence the game much more. Green too. Three games unbeaten, three games on the telly, also unbeaten. A point was about right.
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It'll come to a point where we have to win these type of away games, just don't think he's the person to achieve this.
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Onomah was good tonight, he has that extra touch of quality at this level. Looking forward to seeing him progress throughout the season.
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That's 3 times now he has tried 3 centre halves and it hadn't worked.
I bet he try's it again with the same outcome, if this does not tell you how smart he is I don't what will.
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I have seen much, much worse under Bruce, but that's really not saying much.
The first 20-25 minutes were like some sort of bad acid trip. Why try to be so clever?
Just do the same fucking thing with the same fucking players as you did against Norwich. This is a fucking awful league. We've got a strong squad that, purely by applying the minimum of common sense should be challenging at the top. That is exactly how Benitez got Newcastle up - no insane cleverness, just apply the minimum of common sense and let your squad do the work and get you up.
He's an infuriating manager. 90 minutes of exciting football last week and he's straight back to cautious just-don't-lose nonsense.
He's his own worse enemy.
Unfortunately, our expectations are now so fucking low, we have to think of that as a good result.
Agree completely. If we attack teams home and away we'll win the vast majority of our games.
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Onomah was good tonight, he has that extra touch of quality at this level. Looking forward to seeing him progress throughout the season.
I think he is a really good player in the making but he sometimes tries a fancy Dan thing, rather than simple. Needs to influence much more. Take away his goal and he didn't do as much as I want him to. He's capable but I want even more from him.
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We came from behind to get something which can't have happened much over the last five years. Nonetheless I saw nothing tonight that makes me think we won't wind up disappointed in mid table again this year.
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Genuinely, did anyone not on our coaching team think that Chester - Terry - Samba thing was going to work?
Totally agree, away from home we just hand the initiative to the opposition.
I think we have the squad to dictate both home and away.
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Genuinely, did anyone not on our coaching team think that Chester - Terry - Samba thing was going to work?
"Steve - apparently some of them good teams are playing three at the back noo"
"Wor, I just gan and got two new centre backs. That's nearly three. Wor Tony used to play Chesto oot wide, he can probably do it. He can run more than John or Chris"
"Greet. How do Bristol play anyhoo? Shall I check?"
"Dinnee bother Colin, I think we got this"
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I have seen much, much worse under Bruce, but that's really not saying much.
The first 20-25 minutes were like some sort of bad acid trip. Why try to be so clever?
Just do the same fucking thing with the same fucking players as you did against Norwich. This is a fucking awful league. We've got a strong squad that, purely by applying the minimum of common sense should be challenging at the top. That is exactly how Benitez got Newcastle up - no insane cleverness, just apply the minimum of common sense and let your squad do the work and get you up.
He's an infuriating manager. 90 minutes of exciting football last week and he's straight back to cautious just-don't-lose nonsense.
He's his own worse enemy.
Unfortunately, our expectations are now so fucking low, we have to think of that as a good result.
Couldn't agree more. The blueprint was there last Saturday and when we went on a winning run towards the end of last season. Unfortunately, he hasn't bought very well overall and in some cases the players don't really fit the system in question.
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We came from behind to get something which can't have happened much over the last five years. Nonetheless I saw nothing tonight that makes me think we won't wind up disappointed in mid table again this year.
This.
We are basically slipping into Forest / Wednesday / Leeds style multi-year mediocrity.
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He couldn't play the same team because Hutton was injured. Oh formation you mean, well, he knows how shit we have been away so I guess he was trying to instill a mental belief not to lose? At least he changed it when he knew it went bat shit half way through the 1st half.
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Genuinely, did anyone not on our coaching team think that Chester - Terry - Samba thing was going to work?
"Steve - apparently some of them good teams are playing three at the back noo"
"Wor, I just gan and got two new centre backs. That's nearly three. Wor Tony used to play Chesto oot wide, he can probably do it. He can run more than John or Chris"
"Greet. How do Bristol play anyhoo? Shall I check?"
"Dinnee bother Colin, I think we got this"
I...I wish this weren't so probably accurate.
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He couldn't play the same team because Hutton was injured. Oh formation you mean, well, he knows how shit we have been away so I guess he was trying to instill a mental belief not to lose? At least he changed it when he knew it went bat shit half way through the 1st half.
Maybe he should try instilling a mental belief to win?
He did change it half way through the first half, but that meant we still had to play with our best centre-back at right-back until the interval.
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MoM was Onomah. Looks a good prospect
The Aston Villa of long ago wouldn't have been happy with a point at Bristol City but this is now. A step forward. Plenty of fight if not enough quality. Send Terry back where he came from and the play offs are possible.
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Yep, SHA beat them there to stay up on the last day. They'll be mid table this season.
Mid table sides are the sort we need to be beating to make sure we get top 6 and also have a crack at automatic promotion. We're not getting 80 odd points just from home games.
On the performance a draw was fair but in the context of where we need to be this was two points dropped especially as we've started scoring goals and putting in convincing performances.
We have won 4 away matches in 2 years and how many others have we got a result in after falling behind? This is progress.
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Genuinely, did anyone not on our coaching team think that Chester - Terry - Samba thing was going to work?
Totally agree, away from home we just hand the initiative to the opposition.
I think we have the squad to dictate both home and away.
Chester and Samba can work, Ditch Terry. Too slow. Can only play when he has a class act alongside him. Anybody can look good playing for Chelsea.
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Yep, SHA beat them there to stay up on the last day. They'll be mid table this season.
Mid table sides are the sort we need to be beating to make sure we get top 6 and also have a crack at automatic promotion. We're not getting 80 odd points just from home games.
On the performance a draw was fair but in the context of where we need to be this was two points dropped especially as we've started scoring goals and putting in convincing performances.
We have won 4 away matches in 2 years and how many others have we got a result in after falling behind? This is progress.
5 points out of 15 is progress?
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Yep, SHA beat them there to stay up on the last day. They'll be mid table this season.
Mid table sides are the sort we need to be beating to make sure we get top 6 and also have a crack at automatic promotion. We're not getting 80 odd points just from home games.
On the performance a draw was fair but in the context of where we need to be this was two points dropped especially as we've started scoring goals and putting in convincing performances.
We have won 4 away matches in 2 years and how many others have we got a result in after falling behind? This is progress.
5 points out of 15 is progress?
An away point after falling behind is progress. Not happened very often in recent years. This is supposed to be a thread about the Bristol City game which was an improvement on Cardiff and Reading so that is progress. This team isn't going to become Real Madrid. Please can fans stop expecting this happen.
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Whelan was garbage
Elmo vs Albert....
The changes to the formation made little sense
The double subs was not what was needed, hogan is not a loan striker and Davis looked good
Green is our best player right now
We miss jedinak and the ability of kodja to make a goal out of nothing
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Well Chris was saying how good they are at home, so I was pointing out they aren't.
And maybe we'll stop being a shit division 2 side if fans, manager and players stop thinking a draw away to crap sides like Bristol City is a good result. It's not a good point, it never has been and never will be.
Yep, SHA beat them there to stay up on the last day. They'll be mid table this season.
Mid table sides are the sort we need to be beating to make sure we get top 6 and also have a crack at automatic promotion. We're not getting 80 odd points just from home games.
On the performance a draw was fair but in the context of where we need to be this was two points dropped especially as we've started scoring goals and putting in convincing performances.
We have won 4 away matches in 2 years and how many others have we got a result in after falling behind? This is progress.
5 points out of 15 is progress?
An away point after falling behind is progress. Not happened very often in recent years. This is supposed to be a thread about the Bristol City game which was an improvement on Cardiff and Reading so that is progress. This team isn't going to become Real Madrid. Please can fans stop expecting this happen.
We don't need to be Real Madrid to get out of this league, we do Need to be able to beat teams like Bristol City though.
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and because we still can't so that, we won't.
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It's shocking how bad we are away really.
3 away wins under Steve Bruce and two of those were at teams no longer in this division due to being relegated (Rotherham and Wigan).
Other at Reading really was just a new manager bounce type result given we then didn't win any for another four months.
We really just can't impose any sort of game plan on the opposition. Just think back to those days under MON when we would be spoiled with 9-10 away wins a season. Conceding possession but so lethal on the counter attack.
Nowadays we just don't offer anything bar being content with a 0-0 and struggling to respond when the home team inevitably scores. It's not good enough if we want to go up I'm afraid.
Pretty sure there have been more - QPR? Colchester?
You're main point is still correct though.
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An improvement over the previous two nightmare away days. However, we must start playing on the front foot and 15 metres higher up the pitch both home and away. We give teams far too much respect. Pressure teams in the Championship and they will fold. I'm just hoping that one decent win away will start the ball rolling. Without away wins going up is impossible.
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August 1 good win, 1 opening day draw, 1 frustrating draw, 2 shit show defeats.
For a team hoping to go up in the top 2 quite simply not good enough.
September 4 home games, 2 away. Less than 15 points and automatic will be out the window.
As Dr X said on Twitter, September is now quite important.
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An improvement over the previous two nightmare away days. However, we must start playing on the front foot and 15 metres higher up the pitch both home and away. We give teams far too much respect. Pressure teams in the Championship and they will fold. I'm just hoping that one decent win away will start the ball rolling. Without away wins going up is impossible.
This. It give the opposition players and fans encouragement because we let them dictate the play, put balls into the box and rack up the corners. Before you know it we're under pressure and struggling to get out of our half. We need to move 10 yards further up the pitch and press the opposition and force them into mistakes.
Will we ever win an away game comfortably again? I mean a proper 3 or 4 nil where we can relax and have a sing song. I can't see it happening and for me a team who wants to finish in the top 2 has to have the ability to do that.
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Poor first half. We looked disjointed and the system didnt seem to suit us very much. Second half was better, we looked more of a threat. He maybe should have brought Bjork and Hogan on a little bit earlier than he did
Overall, disapointed not to get the three points but a draw was probably a fair result in truth.
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can't be arsed to look but how does this start compare to last season over the same games?
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can't be arsed to look but how does this start compare to last season over the same games?
Exactly the same record. one win, two draws, two defeats. I don't think we won any of the next seven games either, not many losses but no wins. I'm sure we'll get one or two wins over the next seven games and better it.
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Three at the back is a dead duck.A mantra for defensive minded dinosaur managers.
It says let's not go on the front foot.Let's be scaredy cats at Ashton Gate ffs.
Tell that to Conte at Chelski.
What he got wrong was the personnel: difficult playing three at the back with no pace and a slow DMF.
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Totally negative from Bruce ........ he still has no idea of what formation he wants or what his best team is!
Point from a team who will be nearer the bottom than top is unacceptable
Promotion? You go to these clubs and put in a storming performance and win
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Disappointing to waste 40 minutes against a poor side with little threat, when the result of the system was to have 6 behind the ball.
Once we switched from 3 at the back we looked more purposeful.
But we have up momentum in the game against a team who were there for the taking.
Better second half. Such a poor goal to concede but they were offside. Onomah impresses as does Davis, shame he was blowing out his backside.
Hogan was very busy when he came on, as was Thor who was let down by his final ball.
Mystifying why Bruce changed what did not need to be changed. But great that finally, we didn't fold like a deck chair when going behind, but came back much the stronger.
We have to put sides as mince as Bristol away. If we hadn't been so awful at the first two away games, the pressure wouldn't be so great to win this one.
5 behind the notional target already and the away form has to change.
Edit: I suppose it was always unlikely going from Dog and Duck level to putting sides away, but the fact we aren't out played away from home, actually competed and were the ones dominating at the end for a change, having come from behind, is actual progress. The evolution has to be quick.
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http://www.skysports.com/football/bristol-c-vs-a-villa/374670
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I think we are often too dismissI've of the opposition. I thought Bristol were energetic and organised but lacked decisiveness in the final third. Even when we were on top we had to work hard to get anything and their defence nullified our wide men to a great extent. I think they'll win a fair few at home this season. Green in particular seemed anonymous, Elmohamady was more involved but wasteful. Davis took a while to get the measure of their centre backs but once he did I though he put in another good performance although he looked knackered by the time he went off so it was the right thing to do.
The idea to try three at the back is not automatically a bad one but the players clearly didn't adapt well and it allowed Bristol to get on the front foot. to be fair Bruce saw it and changed after 25 minutes. Once the players settled into it I though we had the better of things for the rest of the game without ever completely dominating, we made half chances but seemed to lack conviction or the final ball was not quite right.
A draw was a fair result but now need to follow it up with wins.
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It's shocking how bad we are away really.
3 away wins under Steve Bruce and two of those were at teams no longer in this division due to being relegated (Rotherham and Wigan).
Other at Reading really was just a new manager bounce type result given we then didn't win any for another four months.
We really just can't impose any sort of game plan on the opposition. Just think back to those days under MON when we would be spoiled with 9-10 away wins a season. Conceding possession but so lethal on the counter attack.
Nowadays we just don't offer anything bar being content with a 0-0 and struggling to respond when the home team inevitably scores. It's not good enough if we want to go up I'm afraid.
Pretty sure there have been more - QPR? Colchester?
You're main point is still correct though.
Ah yes QPR I forgot about so 4 wins.
I discount cup games as you can get knocked out next round.
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We now have to win half of our away games to go up automatically. That is a big ask after playing three mid-table teams already.
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A good point but we need to obviously follow this up with a couple of away wins to fuel the confidence. Looking forward to Barnsley already.
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I though we played decent / well , we were busy , kept our workrate for 90mins , competed right around the pitch and played some neat and tidy stuff at times - As a LJ sceptic I have to say we looked coached / drilled last night and much more cohesive than Villa - We at least looked as if we had a style and noticeable method of play where Villa didn't
Something I read on a Bristol City forum. That last bit is my biggest criticism of Bruce, perhaps a style will emerge but he's had a long time to implement something now. Interesting that it's evident to neutrals too.
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I think we are often too dismissI've of the opposition. I thought Bristol were energetic and organised but lacked decisiveness in the final third. Even when we were on top we had to work hard to get anything and their defence nullified our wide men to a great extent. I think they'll win a fair few at home this season. Green in particular seemed anonymous, Elmohamady was more involved but wasteful. Davis took a while to get the measure of their centre backs but once he did I though he put in another good performance although he looked knackered by the time he went off so it was the right thing to do.
The idea to try three at the back is not automatically a bad one but the players clearly didn't adapt well and it allowed Bristol to get on the front foot. to be fair Bruce saw it and changed after 25 minutes. Once the players settled into it I though we had the better of things for the rest of the game without ever completely dominating, we made half chances but seemed to lack conviction or the final ball was not quite right.
A draw was a fair result but now need to follow it up with wins.
This was one of the few away games I will be able to attend and I agree with Chris' summing up, although Davis was well monitored by Baker who was always close up behind Davis every time the ball came to him, giving him no space at all particularly in the first half. Was expecting Baker to go off injured as was his wont at B6 but not this time.
I think the two games with four goals was a blip, and we'll settle back into our normal one or two and as we don't look like being able to keep a clean sheet, will struggle to be in the top 6.
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My yokel accent got me thro a police cordon after the game and cut 10 mins or so off the walk back to my car.
Bumpkin bonus
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Fair to say Bruce fucked it up again meddling with the formation. There was no need to do it, he won't learn, we will no go up this year.
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My yokel accent got me thro a police cordon after the game and cut 10 mins or so off the walk back to my car.
Bumpkin bonus
They let us civilised folk through to as well. Heavy police presence. Doubt there's any history.
Davis came into it a lot more second half and I thought gave Nathan Lets it Bounce a bit of working over in the 50/50s.
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Fair to say Bruce fucked it up again meddling with the formation.
That's unfair. Bruce managed to put out a team and formation to successfully achieve his goal; to steal a point.
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At least I got the correct score right I just couldn't see anything other than a 1-1 draw.
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Nice little cameo from Hogan. I thought he looked sharp when he came on.
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The only thing last night worse than Bruce's tactics was the referee's performance. Once again in this league, absolutely shocking. Where do they find them?
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The only thing last night worse than Bruce's tactics was the referee's performance. Once again in this league, absolutely shocking. Where do they find them?
Agreed.
I would have been livid if we had not been given at least one of those Terry hand balls.
That corner we should have been given near the end, the Hogan one, was one of the worst decisions I have ever seen. And that's saying something!
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Nice little cameo from Hogan. I thought he looked sharp when he came on.
Thought we lost all shape up top when Davis went off to be honest. Ref bizarrely didn't call a corner for Hogan in his first contribution but don't remember much of a contribution from him afterwards. Bjarnsson had more impact, and more mistakes like a very poor offside, but Green had been at fault for not tracking a run for their chance that hit the post. Bjarnsson added some much needed presence to support Taylor.
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Bugger me dismissive of the opposition its not like we were playing real madrid
we are talking about a team that finished 17th last season and wont be in the top half come may. These are the games that we need to be picking 3 points at if we are going to have any notion of going up
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Bugger me dismissive of the opposition its not like we were playing real madrid
we are talking about a team that finished 17th last season and wont be in the top half come may. These are the games that we need to be picking 3 points at if we are going to have any notion of going up
You can't expect us to go and beat the Mighty Bristol City you know.
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Hope that's the end of the back five, just doesn't seem to suit us.
Thought we improved immensely in the second half and deserved to win. We didn't though and September will be decisive for our promotion hopes and Bruce's future.
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Bugger me dismissive of the opposition its not like we were playing real madrid
we are talking about a team that finished 17th last season and wont be in the top half come may. These are the games that we need to be picking 3 points at if we are going to have any notion of going up
You can't expect us to go and beat the Mighty Bristol City you know.
Apologies for my lunacy
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My yokel accent got me thro a police cordon after the game and cut 10 mins or so off the walk back to my car.
Bumpkin bonus
They let us civilised folk through to as well. Heavy police presence. Doubt there's any history.
Davis came into it a lot more second half and I thought gave Nathan Lets it Bounce a bit of working over in the 50/50s.
We walked straight through it as well. Mind you, with only 45 minutes to walk back to the station before the last train to Paddington went, nothing would have stopped us.
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Hope that's the end of the back five, just doesn't seem to suit us.
Thought we improved immensely in the second half and deserved to win. We didn't though and September will be decisive for our promotion hopes and Bruce's future.
A back five is ok if you have someone cultured and prepared to venture out, like say, Barry or Southgate. When you pick the creaking relics that are Terry and Samba though, it's just a sign that the manager has shit the bed and is in panic mode again.
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Southgate worked in a back three because he was a midfielder. He was excellent as a spare man, but nowhere near as good as Ugo at picking up and dominating a forward.
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Southgate worked in a back three because he was a midfielder. He was excellent as a spare man, but nowhere near as good as Ugo at picking up and dominating a forward.
They didn't need a zimmer frame to move about though which helps immensely.
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If I had one question for Bruce it would simply be "what are you afraid of?" Because despite what should an advantage of squad size, depth and quality he manages like he has none of that.
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How did Bruce expect 'his' back 3 to cope when Bristol had a player like Reid who was going to buzz around all over the place. It immediately meant that his wing backs were pulled back into a defensive back 5, leaving the midfield short and requiring Green to drop deeper. Changing to a flat back four immediately pushed us further up the pitch.
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How did Bruce expect 'his' back 3 to cope when Bristol had a player like Reid who was going to buzz around all over the place. It immediately meant that his wing backs were pulled back into a defensive back 5, leaving the midfield short and requiring Green to drop deeper. Changing to a flat back four immediately pushed us further up the pitch.
How many chances did this Reid fella have in.the first half?
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How did Bruce expect 'his' back 3 to cope when Bristol had a player like Reid who was going to buzz around all over the place. It immediately meant that his wing backs were pulled back into a defensive back 5, leaving the midfield short and requiring Green to drop deeper. Changing to a flat back four immediately pushed us further up the pitch.
How many chances did this Reid fella have in.the first half?
Are you actually defending Bruce's decision to start with 3 centre backs?
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If I had one question for Bruce it would simply be "what are you afraid of?" Because despite what should an advantage of squad size, depth and quality he manages like he has none of that.
Totally agree. A big squad but still whinges about injuries. Doesn't have a clue about formation or best 11.
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How did Bruce expect 'his' back 3 to cope when Bristol had a player like Reid who was going to buzz around all over the place. It immediately meant that his wing backs were pulled back into a defensive back 5, leaving the midfield short and requiring Green to drop deeper. Changing to a flat back four immediately pushed us further up the pitch.
How many chances did this Reid fella have in.the first half?
Not sure but did enough to make our manager change his formation during the game. The starting formation gave the initiative to Bristol. Would have been interesting to know if Samba hadn't been injured, would Bruce have taken one of his central defenders off for a fullback or would he have continued with Chester at fullback.
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If I had one question for Bruce it would simply be "what are you afraid of?" Because despite what should an advantage of squad size, depth and quality he manages like he has none of that.
Yep fear of defeat seems to trump ambition to win, but ironically if that continues it'll be the draws that cost him his job.
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maybe Bruce doesn't send them out to be negative maybe he sends them out to attack and be positive but the players are struggling to do that on the pitch so it looks like it's come as a directive from Bruce
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maybe Bruce doesn't send them out to be negative maybe he sends them out to attack and be positive but the players are struggling to do that on the pitch so it looks like it's come as a directive from Bruce
He set up the team to win vs Norwich and we had a superb first half. Away from home he shrivels like a 70 year old penis.
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The interview with Wyness revealed that Bruce loses sleep worrying about losing.
It does not take a physocology genius to work out what the problem is here.
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The interview with Wyness revealed that Bruce loses sleep worrying about losing.
It does not take a physocology genius to work out what the problem is here.
are they sleeping together ?
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maybe Bruce doesn't send them out to be negative maybe he sends them out to attack and be positive but the players are struggling to do that on the pitch so it looks like it's come as a directive from Bruce
He set up the team to win vs Norwich and we had a superb first half. Away from home he shrivels like a 70 year old penis.
How do you know that TV?
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maybe Bruce doesn't send them out to be negative maybe he sends them out to attack and be positive but the players are struggling to do that on the pitch so it looks like it's come as a directive from Bruce
He set up the team to win vs Norwich and we had a superb first half. Away from home he shrivels like a 70 year old penis.
How do you know that TV?
My 70 year old grandma told me...😬
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It was an improvement. We need to improve quite a bit further though for the next away game and stick to it all season, and we need to stick to the form against Norwich with a slightly tighter defence at home. If we can manage all of that we might go up. I'm not optimistic.
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I was thinking about all the whiners in this thread - then I saw some Boro fans calling for Monk's head - after 5 games !!!!!! I take it all back...
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Wednesday want their boss out.
The Serbian gentleman at Fulham has just got their first win of the season.
Plenty of sides who ought to be competing higher up have bad an indifferent start.
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If I had one question for Bruce it would simply be "what are you afraid of?" Because despite what should an advantage of squad size, depth and quality he manages like he has none of that.
He's afraid of losing, so he plays to avoid defeat, the problem is win one-lose one is better than 2 draws so it's a flawed approach. From where we are winning every home game for the rest of the season wouldn't be enough to guarantee promotion so we need wins away from home. if we can get 7-8 of those (from 20 games) it at least gives us a chance if we can makes home wins a regular thing that's why going a bit gung-ho away from home is worth it even if it means a few more defeats because converting draws to wins is so much more important.
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In isolation a draw away at Bristol, at this stage is ok, however to get automatic promotion, these are the games we need to win
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Wednesday want their boss out.
The Serbian gentleman at Fulham has just got their first win of the season.
Plenty of sides who ought to be competing higher up have bad an indifferent start.
Pheeeeew I am so pleased it's not just us who are shit.
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My 70 year old grandma told me...😬
A 70 year old grandma with penis...I am not going to mess with you😟
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I thought we played some good stuff at times last night, having some good periods of possession in the opposition half without troubling their keeper that much. But after walking out of the Majeski a couple of weeks ago totally dejected and not seeing anything positive I think we are starting to make progress and we are now capable of stringing a decent run together to get ourselves back in the promotion race.
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Wednesday want their boss out.
The Serbian gentleman at Fulham has just got their first win of the season.
Plenty of sides who ought to be competing higher up have bad an indifferent start.
And I bet none of them stick with their underperforming managers as long as we have, and still might do.
Bruce has September to sort this out. If he doesn't I don't think the fans will accept another season of mediocrity.
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Didn't see the game but from the highlights I'd say it was a step up from the vast bulk of away games last season, in style and character
Not doing enough yet to look automotic promotion candidates for me. But after a horrible week, a much better one
I know Davis wasn't on his Norwich form, but he still looked pretty handy
Hourihane really should have set Elmo up for a brilliant chance, but pushed him too wide.
If we win our best two home games - which we really should be looking to - this will look a good point. If not, it won't.
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That's a fair point. Beat Brentford and Boro, as we ought to then all of a sudden 10 points from 4 games is good going.
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Won't it be 11 points from 7 games?
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I was about to say hopefully Brentford will have sold Jota by the time we play them
Though I see Boro are the main team after him so maybe not
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Won't it be 11 points from 7 games?
The then last four I'd guess so you're both right!
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Won't it be 11 points from 7 games?
I'm talking, quite specifically, about how this result can be a decent one depending on what follows. We beat Norwich and we don't lose away, grand. That's how you win titles. But 5 from 5 isn't good enough. Win the next two as we ought to and it's 10 from 4.
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Won't it be 11 points from 7 games?
I'm talking, quite specifically, about how this result can be a decent one depending on what follows. We beat Norwich and we don't lose away, grand. That's how you win titles. But 5 from 5 isn't good enough. Win the next two as we ought to and it's 10 from 4.
Ah. I see.
Perhaps that's why some people consider it a bad result then? With what went before it (4 points from previous 4 games)?
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
You taking the piss?
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
Yeah, and that Westwood guy, what a player.
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Both Newcastle and Brighton won at Bristol city last season
Though they picked up one point between them at home against the same side
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Bristol City will struggle to finish top 10 so I don't get the very good side claim. That's for teams like Cardiff and Wolves.
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
Yeah Benteke was rubbish wasn't he.
Also whatever you think of them Heskey and Bent always gave it their all when playing.
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I thought we played decently and gave them very few chances, we we're a little let down by the two wide players who both had poor games and hence starved Davis of anything to attack, he did very well again particularly in the second half and gave Baker a tough game. I see at as two point dropped mind.
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Bristol City will struggle to finish top 10 so I don't get the very good side claim. That's for teams like Cardiff and Wolves.
I agree. They worked hard, but you'd expect that. If we'd set out to attack at the start, rather than try to hopefully nick a win, we'd have won the game. We allowed them to look ok because we set out in a negative way.
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
Nose alert.
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Bristol played well and are a v good team. Therefore a good effort from Villa, and really enjoyed seeing how hard the team worked. After years of watching the likes of Benteke, Bent, McCormack and Heskey walking around it is great to see a team wanting to wear the shirt. The support was again tremendous and right behind their manager; they can see the improvement.
Nose alert.
Surely not. He used the words 'therefore' and 'tremendous'.
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This is getting beyond a joke. Someone makes one comment that isn't as pessimistic as usual and immediately they get called a Nose or a troll.
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The ridiculous references about past players is usually a sign. I was quite positive about us for once and I'm definitely not a nose.
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Was not happy with the change to three central defenders, and it didn't work at all.
However in fairness to Bruce he did what he often doesn't and changed tactics to deal with it. We looked much better after that and had enough chances to have won it. Last season we would have lost that, it is promising to see us respond to going a goal down.
Not great but some positives. Just annoyed he started with such a daft formation change.
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Or maybe it's someone with a different perspective.
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I was just countering the Bristol City are a very good side line just because the pass the ball around o.k. They had 20 goals from Abraham last season and nearly went down, don't see them finishing top half this season with what they have.
Edit: Only side to lose to SHA in the league this season aswell.
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Or maybe it's someone with a different perspective.
And not a bad point. You can say a lot about (most of) the players, but they do seem in the main happy and honoured to be at the club.
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I was just countering the Bristol City are a very good side line just because the pass the ball around o.k. They had 20 goals from Abraham last season and nearly went down, don't see them finishing top half this season with what they have.
Edit: Only side to lose to SHA in the league this season aswell.
I think they'd won five from seven at home or something like that
I was hoping for a win, definitely. And we do need to go to places like that and win on a regular basis
But as I said earlier it will be a decent point if we stack up some wins either side of it, and another missed opportunity if we don't
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
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Or maybe it's someone with a different perspective.
And not a bad point. You can say a lot about (most of) the players, but they do seem in the main happy and honoured to be at the club.
And that in itself is a point, because for all that Benteke was the most consistently complete target man I've ever seen at the Villa, he never seemed to give the impression that we were anything but a staging post for his next big move.
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
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Or maybe it's someone with a different perspective.
And not a bad point. You can say a lot about (most of) the players, but they do seem in the main happy and honoured to be at the club.
And that in itself is a point, because for all that Benteke was the most consistently complete target man I've ever seen at the Villa, he never seemed to give the impression that we were anything but a staging post for his next big move.
Yeah, it's not that he has no feeling for the club - I'm sure he's fond enough of us - more that it's plain we were playing a role in his career that many clubs do now.
was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Indeed, in the same way as you can acknowledge when he does something right even if you're still not at all convinced.
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
What, you mean the five at the back in the first half?
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
What, you mean the five at the back in the first half?
Yes, genius or bonkers?
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
What, you mean the five at the back in the first half?
Yes, genius or bonkers?
I didn't have a problem with him trying it but it didn't seem to suit us at all.
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
What, you mean the five at the back in the first half?
Yes, genius or bonkers?
I didn't have a problem with him trying it but it didn't seem to suit us at all.
I just didn't see the need to try it to be honest. The previous two games had been a step forward, so why not just try and build on that rather than change things again? I could understand it if we had been going in to it on the back of a couple of poor results.
It's the signals that it sent out that concerned me as well. Without wishing to sound arrogant, I want the manager of Aston Villa to be going into a second tier game against Bristol City and not changing the formation to a safety first approach.
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Was not happy with the change to three central defenders, and it didn't work at all.
However in fairness to Bruce he did what he often doesn't and changed tactics to deal with it. We looked much better after that and had enough chances to have won it. Last season we would have lost that, it is promising to see us respond to going a goal down.
Not great but some positives. Just annoyed he started with such a daft formation change.
I too take some comfort from the above. It just goes to show, Bruce is not as stupid as he pretends to be. He got the point he was looking for.
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was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
And this is where I don't understand the support for Bruce.
How do you explain that decision?
You can be critical of what he does from time to time whilst still backing him.
Sure, Even you must admit, that decisions seems bonkers.
What, you mean the five at the back in the first half?
Yes, genius or bonkers?
I didn't have a problem with him trying it but it didn't seem to suit us at all.
Even though he threw away the momentum he had built after the Norwich result?
This for me shows a complete lack of judgement and this is showing up all the time.
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We've not kept a clean sheet all season
I can understand him wanting to make us more resilient for an away game. I think 352 was a mistake, but I also don't think we can just play like we did v Norwich in all our away games
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
That's my gripe with Friday night. The totally unnecessary tactical change meant us being on the back foot from the off, whereas with Norwich we flew out of the traps and had the whip hand from the off.
You need to fuck about with formations when your the fucking Blues or suchlike, packed with limited players. We're not. Play a simple framework they all understand, drill their particular defensive responsibilities and then let them do what they're paid to do.
Instruct them to go for the kill in the first half, once we get in front we can murder teams if they leave space behind. Kodja, Davis and Hogan will have field days.
Do that and not only do we go up, we entertain.
We have to go on the front foot and start asserting ourselves and that comes from the top.
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
That's my gripe with Friday night. The totally unnecessary tactical change meant us being on the back foot from the off, whereas with Norwich we flew out of the traps and had the whip hand from the off.
You need to fuck about with formations when your the fucking Blues or suchlike, packed with limited players. We're not. Play a simple framework they all understand, drill their particular defensive responsibilities and then let them do what they're paid to do.
Instruct them to go for the kill in the first half, once we get in front we can murder teams if they leave space behind. Kodja, Davis and Hogan will have field days.
Do that and not only do we go up, we entertain.
We have to go on the front foot and start asserting ourselves and that comes from the top.
That's been my point all along. We need to approach every game knowing that if we turn up and do all the basics properly our extra quality will be enough to win more often than not. That's not thinking we have a divine right to anything or disrespectful to the league or any other silliness that gets thrown around, it's knowing that we've got a very good squad and making best use of it. Bruce, like a lot of fans on here, seems so determined to not come across as arrogant that he's meek instead and we play within ourselves all too often.
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
That's my gripe with Friday night. The totally unnecessary tactical change meant us being on the back foot from the off, whereas with Norwich we flew out of the traps and had the whip hand from the off.
You need to fuck about with formations when your the fucking Blues or suchlike, packed with limited players. We're not. Play a simple framework they all understand, drill their particular defensive responsibilities and then let them do what they're paid to do.
Instruct them to go for the kill in the first half, once we get in front we can murder teams if they leave space behind. Kodja, Davis and Hogan will have field days.
Do that and not only do we go up, we entertain.
We have to go on the front foot and start asserting ourselves and that comes from the top.
That's been my point all along. We need to approach every game knowing that if we turn up and do all the basics properly our extra quality will be enough to win more often than not. That's not thinking we have a divine right to anything or disrespectful to the league or any other silliness that gets thrown around, it's knowing that we've got a very good squad and making best use of it. Bruce, like a lot of fans on here, seems so determined to not come across as arrogant that he's meek instead and we play within ourselves all too often.
Where we differ I think is that I believe the conservative approach was necessary last season, we were too damaged mentally throughout the club.
But that's not the case now, and that approach will only set us back. The Hull game I could accept, we looked good and bad at times but it's first game and it happens often, but the Cardiff game should never happen when you've got the deck he has to play with, and then to go to Reading and set up like that, and to claim we were unlucky, sets off big alarms.
After finding something that worked against Norwich and then Wigan, too go back to that against Bristol City, for fucks sake, was just baffling. The performance following the change was good generally, and fact he changed it was encouraging, but why do it in the first place?
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We've not kept a clean sheet all season
I can understand him wanting to make us more resilient for an away game. I think 352 was a mistake, but I also don't think we can just play like we did v Norwich in all our away games
3-5-2 would have been a mistake, but it would have been better than the 5-4-1 that we started with.
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
That's my gripe with Friday night. The totally unnecessary tactical change meant us being on the back foot from the off, whereas with Norwich we flew out of the traps and had the whip hand from the off.
You need to fuck about with formations when your the fucking Blues or suchlike, packed with limited players. We're not. Play a simple framework they all understand, drill their particular defensive responsibilities and then let them do what they're paid to do.
Instruct them to go for the kill in the first half, once we get in front we can murder teams if they leave space behind. Kodja, Davis and Hogan will have field days.
Do that and not only do we go up, we entertain.
We have to go on the front foot and start asserting ourselves and that comes from the top.
That's been my point all along. We need to approach every game knowing that if we turn up and do all the basics properly our extra quality will be enough to win more often than not. That's not thinking we have a divine right to anything or disrespectful to the league or any other silliness that gets thrown around, it's knowing that we've got a very good squad and making best use of it. Bruce, like a lot of fans on here, seems so determined to not come across as arrogant that he's meek instead and we play within ourselves all too often.
Where we differ I think is that I believe the conservative approach was necessary last season, we were too damaged mentally throughout the club.
But that's not the case now, and that approach will only set us back. The Hull game I could accept, we looked good and bad at times but it's first game and it happens often, but the Cardiff game should never happen when you've got the deck he has to play with, and then to go to Reading and set up like that, and to claim we were unlucky, sets off big alarms.
After finding something that worked against Norwich and then Wigan, too go back to that against Bristol City, for fucks sake, was just baffling. The performance following the change was good generally, and fact he changed it was encouraging, but why do it in the first place?
I think it was necessary for a time but we needed to have a spell of consolidating and then start to progress which didn't happen and in the end, in my opinion, the brilliance of Kodjia saved us from finishing in a relegation battle. This year we've started in the same way and a good performance against Norwich was very welcome but that can't be allowed to mask just how toothless we still are. I'm not going to count in the cup game because the team was so changed and the atmosphere was so different that it doesn't really fit.
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There was a huge difference this year to conceding and last year. The more I think about it the more of an improvement it was, just such a folly to have hamstrung ourselves for 40 minutes.
That's my gripe with Friday night. The totally unnecessary tactical change meant us being on the back foot from the off, whereas with Norwich we flew out of the traps and had the whip hand from the off.
You need to fuck about with formations when your the fucking Blues or suchlike, packed with limited players. We're not. Play a simple framework they all understand, drill their particular defensive responsibilities and then let them do what they're paid to do.
Instruct them to go for the kill in the first half, once we get in front we can murder teams if they leave space behind. Kodja, Davis and Hogan will have field days.
Do that and not only do we go up, we entertain.
We have to go on the front foot and start asserting ourselves and that comes from the top.
That's been my point all along. We need to approach every game knowing that if we turn up and do all the basics properly our extra quality will be enough to win more often than not. That's not thinking we have a divine right to anything or disrespectful to the league or any other silliness that gets thrown around, it's knowing that we've got a very good squad and making best use of it. Bruce, like a lot of fans on here, seems so determined to not come across as arrogant that he's meek instead and we play within ourselves all too often.
Where we differ I think is that I believe the conservative approach was necessary last season, we were too damaged mentally throughout the club.
But that's not the case now, and that approach will only set us back. The Hull game I could accept, we looked good and bad at times but it's first game and it happens often, but the Cardiff game should never happen when you've got the deck he has to play with, and then to go to Reading and set up like that, and to claim we were unlucky, sets off big alarms.
After finding something that worked against Norwich and then Wigan, too go back to that against Bristol City, for fucks sake, was just baffling. The performance following the change was good generally, and fact he changed it was encouraging, but why do it in the first place?
Agree with all of that. Seeing as we have Hogan and soon will have Kodjia back, I still think he wants to play two up front and is looking at ways to incorporate that. The problem I see is that any formation with two up front doesn't really suit various other players in the squad. I think the 4-1-4-1 formation we saw against Norwich and after the switch at Bristol City is the best fit for the players we currently have:
Johnstone / Steer
Bree / De Laet / Hutton Chester Terry / Samba Taylor
Whelan / Jedinak
Elmohamady / Adomah Onomah / Lansbury Hourihane / Bjarnason Snodgrass / Green
Davis / Hogan/ Kodjia
There is obviously the question of where the likes of Grealish and O'Hare will fit into that formation and if Hogan and Kodjia will be able to lead the line if Davis is not fit or loses form.