Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: spk on February 20, 2016, 08:13:50 AM
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A lot about this on twitter etc What do people think following the success of the Liverpool walkout ?
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Not for me sorry,unoriginal and wont achieve what ever the desired effect is meant to be
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The Liverpool walkout was aimed at one specific problem not the general demise of the club.
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Perhaps ours should be "don't even go through the door, because it's all such a bore".
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It's more interesting to stare at the floor.
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It's more interesting to stare at the floor.
At least we don't have Tim, the media whore
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Which game is this planned for?
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Perhaps ours should be "don't even go through the door, because it's all such a bore".
don't go near, we are rotten to the core
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Stay at home and lock the door
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Which game is this planned for?
The Everton game.
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
That's a nice atttitude to have towards anyone who doesn't agree with you.
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Rather than a mass exodus,have we discussed a mass sit in on a ,hopefully warm, spring evening?
It could be fun too
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As hard as things are surely we should be backing the 11 guys in the shirt on the pitch? Any walk out or protest during a game will affect them & their already fragile confidence.
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
That's a nice atttitude to have towards anyone who doesn't agree with you.
What has my opinions on the Villa farce got to do with the Liverpool protest? Stop looking for squabbles.
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The symbolism of walking out on the 74th minute would be lost on most non-Villa people and, if we're losing, wouldn't look much different to how many left after Liverpool's 5th went in on 65 minutes last Sunday. To make a real impact we should all walk out at half time
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
That's a nice atttitude to have towards anyone who doesn't agree with you.
What has my opinions on the Villa farce got to do with the Liverpool protest? Stop looking for squabbles.
I'm not looking for squabbles, I'm disagreeing with your attitude towards supporters. If you don't like it, don't post.
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I'm boycotting the game completely.
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School night Leeg? ;)
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
That's a nice atttitude to have towards anyone who doesn't agree with you.
What has my opinions on the Villa farce got to do with the Liverpool protest? Stop looking for squabbles.
I'm not looking for squabbles, I'm disagreeing with your attitude towards supporters. If you don't like it, don't post.
You disagree that it's better to make a stand when during an unprecedented period of huge TV rights clubs are trying to put ticket prices up even though we are already have the most expensive tickets in the world?
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
That's a nice atttitude to have towards anyone who doesn't agree with you.
What has my opinions on the Villa farce got to do with the Liverpool protest? Stop looking for squabbles.
I'm not looking for squabbles, I'm disagreeing with your attitude towards supporters. If you don't like it, don't post.
You disagree that it's better to make a stand when during an unprecedented period of huge TV rights clubs are trying to put ticket prices up even though we are already have the most expensive tickets in the world?
If you want to do something, fine. If you don't there are many reasons why you might choose not to, without being accused of the childishness you came out with.
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School night Leeg? ;)
Yes, there is that minor issue aswell.
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A protest especially on a Game televised on SKY makes sense.
But what about if we beat Stoke and are winning 1-0 against Everton with 74 minutes to go? It wouldn't seem right to walk out then.
I think we should save any protests of this nature until we're mathematically relegated.
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I do understand the desire to protest in some way, but the Villa's woes - and the reasons for them - are well known by now and don't really need highlighting. As for actually changing anything... What's to change? Lerner wants out anyway and the transfer window's long shut.
The Everton game's only the second one I'll have been able to go to this season, so I won't be walking out!
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People just don't think things through. Trying to get Villa fans to do anything en mass is like herding cats, so a walkout will be a bad idea. But, yet again, this thread illustrates perfectly the lack of unity among Villa fans. On that score, Lerner couldn't have picked a better club to run into the ground.
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Which game is this planned for?
The Everton game.
You broke the rhyming scheme.
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A protest especially on a Game televised on SKY makes sense.
It isn't on Sky is it?
Norwich-Chelsea is the live game.
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Which game is this planned for?
The Everton game.
You broke the rhyming scheme.
Yes, it had become a lovely theme.
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As good as A Midsummer Night's Dream
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But may run out of steam
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Bit like the team
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For fans of any club who actually go to the games the only vote they have is with their feet . Whether this is a total boycott of a game or walking in late as Leicester fans were encouraged to do recently at Arsenal as a protest to the game being moved at short notice at Sky's behest , or The Liverpool fans walkout on 74 mins to protest against a ludicrous ticket price.
We have a more complex problem hence the seeming disunity amongst us. What no-one can argue is things are as bad at our club in most of our living memories.
I still take my hat of to the German clubs demonstations against problems or conditions they don't like, the Bayern fans at Arsenal , the fans with the arrow running behind the goal as their team couldn't score , or my favourite one that the Dortmund fans did with the tennis balls.
I would prefer the latter before the Everton game, high profile should get good media coverage and we could then do the only positive thing left to us and support the team during the match, something we are as good as and fans are provided the team reciprocates.
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Lerner masks with the word out printed on the forehead. Printed on on A4 piece of paper and cut out, that should be easy enough the do, and would look good on tv.
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It makes it sound as if we're having a protest against bingo.
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Long shot, but what if we're winning 1-0?
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Long shot, but what if we're winning 1-0?
Behave! The 'Joke' thread is in 'Off Topic.'
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A protest especially on a Game televised on SKY makes sense.
It isn't on Sky is it?
Norwich-Chelsea is the live game.
Good point. I thought so too. Someone mentioned to me yesterday that the game was televised.
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Protests are very difficult in football because most things eventually hurt the thing the fans love, their club.
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Long shot, but what if we're winning 1-0?
We don't take shots, long or otherwise. And we are rarely winning 1-0.
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Firstly I'm not making a 170 mile round trip on a Tuesday night to then walk out after 74 mins, and secondly I don't get this walk out bollocks anyway.For years we have laughed at Small Heath through their hard times,with their shit attendances, and them not going until Carson Yeung leaves the club.Now by the looks of it, many now want to go to down the same route.By all means don't buy a burger or a drink or anything from the club shop, but no one is going to pay a blind bit of notice to a low gate, or a walk out with 15 minutes to go for a midweek game against Everton.
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The best way is boycott the games for the rest of the season, I've no respect for the players out boozing the night before a game, squaring up to each other at Bodymoor Heath. If we hit Lerner in the pocket he might just try harder to sell the club for whatever it's worth.
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Loads of people leave with around 15 minutes to go anyway, so who'll notice the difference?
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We'd do better to just make loads of noise at the end of the game, as what happened spontaneously at the end of the Liverpool match.
These days there's enough empty seats for everyone to make a similar racket during the full 90.
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I'm with the noise making.
Noise can tell those in power just how pissed off and angry we are
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If our performance is anything like the last home game then forcing people to wait until the 74th minute before clearing off is just cruel.
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No, needs to be different.
Someone mentioned cowboy costumes earlier for the end of season wake, that could work.
Do it with a bit of humour, so we aren't seen as just copying other fans again.
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You just have a cowboy fetish
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I don't deny it.
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No, needs to be different.
Someone mentioned cowboy costumes earlier for the end of season wake, that could work.
Do it with a bit of humour, so we aren't seen as just copying other fans again.
Not having a go at you personally, KG, but just think about this for a few moments. There is no will among Villa fans to protest en masse. When 25 people turn up dressed as Wyatt Earp it'll just look like we're auditioning for a Village People tribute act.
And as for this 'let's make some noise' idea. Football fans frequently make noise, some might say it's what they're supposed to do. How can that ever be considered a protest?
Whatever it is, if it relies on mass participation and coordination of Villa fans, it is doomed to fail. Leeds' projection of images on their ground worked because only a few people had to actually do something. Dortmund's tennis ball protest only required a few hundred participants.
I wish we'd think things through, sometimes.
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A protest especially on a Game televised on SKY makes sense.
It isn't on Sky is it?
Norwich-Chelsea is the live game.
Is it ?
Bournemouth -Southampton is the live game
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No, needs to be different.
Someone mentioned cowboy costumes earlier for the end of season wake, that could work.
Do it with a bit of humour, so we aren't seen as just copying other fans again.
Randy is the cowboy
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner out paper darts?
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The last away day at the end of the season is normally an outlet for fans who are so inclined to dress up and make a bit of a spectacle of themselves. Was just thinking it might be easier to do it then. I'm not advocating assless chaps.
As for Village People tribute acts, there is no way we could ever match this.
So there is no point in even trying.
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
An old mobile with an on screen message? Touch dangerous maybe but what the hell!!!
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
An old mobile with an on screen message? Touch dangerous maybe but what the hell!!!
my old mobile was a brick
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
An old mobile with an on screen message? Touch dangerous maybe but what the hell!!!
my old mobile was a brick
Exactly! It may just work
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
An old mobile with an on screen message? Touch dangerous maybe but what the hell!!!
my old mobile was a brick
My old Nokia would kill or maim..
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Well done to them. Better than being completely shafted and taking it bent over asking for more please sir.
Apparently, the Club were planning to include a bottle of lube as part of the season ticket renewal pack this year. But then they realised that anyone renewing won't complain if there isn't any and they could save money by not including it.
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The last away day at the end of the season is normally an outlet for fans who are so inclined to dress up and make a bit of a spectacle of themselves. Was just thinking it might be easier to do it then. I'm not advocating assless chaps.
As for Village People tribute acts, there is no way we could ever match this.
So there is no point in even trying.
Ahhhh, I miss Nigeria.
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The best thing we could do would be what happened at the end of the last match for every game.
Make it a party regardless of the football, celebrate being Villa, balloons, banners, and continuous singing.
It would make it a better place whilst we wait for inevitable, and the we as fans at least could rescue the good name of the club.
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On 74 everybody do the Dinosaur, had the 7", great track Claire Reeves was putty in my hands down the Rubery Youth club.
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Out the gate on 88. Plus stoppages.
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Has African Car Reverser endorsed this? He might've been planning an early get-away already.
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Back to mine on 89.
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It's 90. Anyone going for a Pinty ?
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After 94 I just can't take anymore.
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Can't hold this wee. I'm off on 73
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0121 Lerner do one
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I'd prefer :
Fox is on his way by May
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shouldn't the exodus occur on 87 to commemorate the last time we were sent down?
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Won't it just be the usual 'out the door when the other team score'?
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shouldn't the exodus occur on 87 to commemorate the last time we were sent down?
Too late. Most folks will have gone by then.
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Won't it just be the usual 'out the door when the other team score'?
Out of the door on 4
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I'll be boycotting the first 90 minutes.
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
You would if you shoved them down your trousers.
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
You would if you shoved them down your trousers.
New balls please!!
Unless a couple of folks did it without telling anyone else there's no way the club wouldn't find out about something like the tennis ball idea, so they would just step up the searches before letting folks into the ground.
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The tennis ball protest gets it for me, two or three thousand tennis balls on the pitch emblazoned words Lerner out will make a statement. Can you get nicked for lobbing a tennis ball in the ground? Lerner our paper darts?
You'd never get in the ground with tennis balls. Maybe there's an item fans habitually take to football matches that could be chucked on the pitch?
You would if you shoved them down your trousers.
I look like I already have. Just sayin'
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(http://wildeastfootball.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/buster-2.jpg)
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Villa Fans are great when it comes to getting behind the club. Petrov's minute of applause was envied and copied by other clubs. The regular release of balloons in the 80s was a great show of unity.
The OTDO74 might not be for everyone (I don't know whether I will do it yet) but it needs to be supported by Villa fans. If I decide to walk on 74 I may watch the rest of the match in the concourse area (a great atmosphere can be generated down there). If I don't walk then I will stand and applaud those fans who do. Villa fans should protest/demonstrate in whatever way they feel comfortable with and be supported by their fellow Villans. I like the idea of black balloons to show loss of PL status or white balloons to show the board's surrender. Normally we would rely on the 11 players to represent us, but the current team can't be relied on for that so we as fans must do it for ourselves. We don't just represent the current group of supporters but supporters and players long gone. Sing the old favourites re Andy lockhead, Sammy Morgan,Andy gray, Brian little, Deano, John Carew, Paul McGrath etc currently there's no-one to sing about. Singing as in the last 10 mins against against Lpool shows our support for AVFC and our defiance against the board. Apathy, acceptance and surrender is the friend of Lerner, Fox and their cronies. Villa Fans must rise above their lethagy in whatever form they wish and know that they will be supported.
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Villa Fans are great when it comes to getting behind the club. Petrov's minute of applause was envied and copied by other clubs. The regular release of balloons in the 80s was a great show of unity.
The OTDO74 might not be for everyone (I don't know whether I will do it yet) but it needs to be supported by Villa fans. If I decide to walk on 74 I may watch the rest of the match in the concourse area (a great atmosphere can be generated down there). If I don't walk then I will stand and applaud those fans who do. Villa fans should protest/demonstrate in whatever way they feel comfortable with and be supported by their fellow Villans. I like the idea of black balloons to show loss of PL status or white balloons to show the board's surrender. Normally we would rely on the 11 players to represent us, but the current team can't be relied on for that so we as fans must do it for ourselves. We don't just represent the current group of supporters but supporters and players long gone. Sing the old favourites re Andy lockhead, Sammy Morgan,Andy gray, Brian little, Deano, John Carew, Paul McGrath etc currently there's no-one to sing about. Singing as in the last 10 mins against against Lpool shows our support for AVFC and our defiance against the board. Apathy, acceptance and surrender is the friend of Lerner, Fox and their cronies. Villa Fans must rise above their lethagy in whatever form they wish and know that they will be supported.
I won't be walking out, and I also don't particularly have a problem with those who think it's the right thing to do.
What I have a problem with is my 90 minutes of support being called 'apathy' or 'lethargy' - and it's not just you that's done it - it's everywhere.
Give me a protest with a clear specific aim which I think will improve this club's future prospects, & I'll take part. I'd prefer it to be something that keeps me in the ground, but I'll walk out if I'm clear enough what it's about.
....but this is ill thought through in that loads of people leave well before time on a night match anyway, and the extent and timing of a walkout will be largely influenced by the score. In fact - it's what Liverpool did & it worked so let's do that.
...and - it feels like we're just protesting against being shit, because there isn't a clear demand - even the 'mission statement' just asks for 'a change of direction' (what?) - so it's not a protest, it's a strop.
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Abbey, I agree for the need to protest, but a walkout is not the way to go about it. The reason it worked at Liverpool is a) they fill their ground; and b) they are able to mobilise a significant number of fans to take action.
None of the above is true at Villa, where the ground frequently has empty seats during games (understandably), where people habitually leave early when we're being beaten (routinely), and where it's uncommon for two Villa fans to agree on anything, let alone thousands, which is what you'll need to make this work.
Whoever is behind this is right to take action, but just hasn't thought it through.
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Amfy, there really is no need for a clear specific aim. It's enough for paying fans to say, 'you're wrecking our club and we want it to stop.'
It would be a strop if this were just one season. It's five. Villa fans have every right to make their feelings known, because nobody else is on our side as one look at the local or national media will demonstrate.
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Amfy, there really is no need for a clear specific aim. It's enough for paying fans to say, 'you're wrecking our club and we want it to stop.'
It would be a strop if this were just one season. It's five. Villa fans have every right to make their feelings known, because nobody else is on our side as one look at the local or national media will demonstrate.
I agree.
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Give me a protest with a clear specific aim which I think will improve this club's future prospects, & I'll take part. I'd prefer it to be something that keeps me in the ground, but I'll walk out if I'm clear enough what it's about.
....but this is ill thought through in that loads of people leave well before time on a night match anyway, and the extent and timing of a walkout will be largely influenced by the score. In fact - it's what Liverpool did & it worked so let's do that.
...and - it feels like we're just protesting against being shit, because there isn't a clear demand - even the 'mission statement' just asks for 'a change of direction' (what?) - so it's not a protest, it's a strop.
Exactly. Not a single person has come up with a tangible aim / outcome. It will achieve absolutely nothing except making us look like copycat twats in the media.
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Beat the traffic queue, leave on 72.
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Chris, you don't need a tangible aim / outcome. This isn't the workplace, it's football. It's not some performance appraisal, where you have to come away with a set of achievable goals and targets that you can tick off as you go. It's a bunch of football fans who've been paying through the nose to watch unmitigated crap for five years. They have every right to say "stop wrecking our club."
You don't cheer a goal because it has a tangible aim / outcome. It's an expression of how you feel about something. When Spanish fans wave white hankies, they don't do it because they have a list of achievable aims / outcomes to tick off. They do it because they're pissed off at something and want to show it. That's enough.
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Chris, you don't need a tangible aim / outcome. This isn't the workplace, it's football. It's not some performance appraisal, where you have to come away with a set of achievable goals and targets that you can tick off as you go. It's a bunch of football fans who've been paying through the nose to watch unmitigated crap for five years. They have every right to say "stop wrecking our club."
You don't cheer a goal because it has a tangible aim / outcome. It's an expression of how you feel about something. When Spanish fans wave white hankies, they don't do it because they have a list of achievable aims / outcomes to tick off. They do it because they're pissed off at something and want to show it. That's enough.
I disagree. A protest is usually designed to achieve something. This can't and won't. Making your feelings known is one thing and perfectly natural. An organised protest is just pointless. Everyone knows how shit we are including the owner, Board & players. We'll just get even more bad press and it will be labelled a poor mans Liverpool protest. Frankly, in my opinion, it will all be a bit embarrassing.
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Go for a butty at 4.30.
Probably will work better in Scotland.
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74 mins leave at once
make us look like copycat ******.
No?
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How many will leave if we are winning?
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How many will leave if we are winning?
I guess we'll never know what the answer to that question might have been...
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How many will leave if we are winning?
ha ha
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Covered in the Meaning Evil (http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-fans-planning-walkout-10928250) yesterday. Apparently being organised by Mike McKenna (whoever he is) and we're walking out on 74 in the next 3 home games! News to me, but he's got a Mission Statement and everything so it must be happening. It'll all be a bit half-cocked and as I said somewhere else people won't get the significance of it and just think people are leaving a bit early
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Chris, you don't need a tangible aim / outcome. This isn't the workplace, it's football. It's not some performance appraisal, where you have to come away with a set of achievable goals and targets that you can tick off as you go. It's a bunch of football fans who've been paying through the nose to watch unmitigated crap for five years. They have every right to say "stop wrecking our club."
You don't cheer a goal because it has a tangible aim / outcome. It's an expression of how you feel about something. When Spanish fans wave white hankies, they don't do it because they have a list of achievable aims / outcomes to tick off. They do it because they're pissed off at something and want to show it. That's enough.
I disagree. A protest is usually designed to achieve something. This can't and won't. Making your feelings known is one thing and perfectly natural. An organised protest is just pointless. Everyone knows how shit we are including the owner, Board & players. We'll just get even more bad press and it will be labelled a poor mans Liverpool protest. Frankly, in my opinion, it will all be a bit embarrassing.
This is football. People have been venting their emotions at matches for over a century. I know modern football clubs want to corporatise the customer experience, but don't let them squeeze every last vestige of life out of us, for Christ's sake. You are paying fans, you have every right to express your displeasure. More power to you if you have the intelligence and unity to be organised.
To reiterate, I think a walkout is a bad idea for the reasons given above. But there's every need for the right show of disapproval, and organisation is sometimes necessary to make the required impact. The Leeds fans got it right, because it didn't require large numbers of people to change their routine or do anything. What was their achievable aim / outcome again?
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A few people walk out. Everyone goes, "oh look a few Villa fans have walked out because they are shit. Liverpool did it better though." Randy and the board go "the fans think we're shit, but relegation kind of already told us that"
And life goes on.
Call me a traditionalist, but if you want to vent emotions then boo at the end. 'Protest because we're shit' just doesn't work.
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The Leeds fans got it right, because it didn't require large numbers of people to change their routine or do anything. What was their achievable aim / outcome again?
Their aim was to put pressure on their owner to sell & to tell him the ticket price rise wasn't acceptable. Ours owner already wants to sell. See the difference?
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I reckon there'll be a few more spontaneous acts of disquiet at The Emirates for the final game. Hope so, anyway. Strange that our "journey" under Lerner and his henchmen started so positively at The Emirates all those years ago and will end in disaster at the same place. Would be a fitting venue for some noisy protests. I'll be doing my bit to let them know what I think.
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A few people walk out. Everyone goes, "oh look a few Villa fans have walked out because they are shit. Liverpool did it better though." Randy and the board go "the fans think we're shit, but relegation kind of already told us that"
And life goes on.
Call me a traditionalist, but if you want to vent emotions then boo at the end. 'Protest because we're shit' just doesn't work.
If you think this is just because "we're shit" you haven't been paying attention for the last five years. We've been shit on and off throughout my entire Villa supporting life. Not quite as shit as we are now, though, and certainly not as dysfunctional as a club. The former is a symptom of the latter.
And, as I said, a walkout is a bad idea, so we agree on that point. But what really shows us up is not having the nous to organise ourselves and act as one, and that may be the only reason any protest is doomed to fail.
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The Leeds fans got it right, because it didn't require large numbers of people to change their routine or do anything. What was their achievable aim / outcome again?
Their aim was to put pressure on their owner to sell & to tell him the ticket price rise wasn't acceptable. Ours owner already wants to sell. See the difference?
There's no difference. We're in exactly the same position, or did you miss Fox's "Randy's not a motivated seller right now" comment? Why should we believe anything has changed?
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When I was a lad you had a "sit in" and refused to shift - be fun when they turn the lights out...
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The Leeds fans got it right, because it didn't require large numbers of people to change their routine or do anything. What was their achievable aim / outcome again?
Their aim was to put pressure on their owner to sell & to tell him the ticket price rise wasn't acceptable. Ours owner already wants to sell. See the difference?
There's no difference. We're in exactly the same position, or did you miss Fox's "Randy's not a motivated seller right now" comment? Why should we believe anything has changed?
Randy has been actively looking for a seller. As far as I'm aware their owner hasn't. And whilst Randy has presided over a very poor period in our club, I don't think he is actively trying to bait fans. Their owner claimed to have put up prices to 'punish' fans. Randy has not been successful, but I think there's a world of difference here.
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As hard as things are surely we should be backing the 11 guys in the shirt on the pitch? Any walk out or protest during a game will affect them & their already fragile confidence.
Most of the ****** don't give a fuck anyway. There is no way we will stay up and to be honest, I couldn't give a fuck if any of them were here next season anyway. Fuck them.
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Is there a relevance to 74 that I'm missing? It wouldn't surprise me.
Cheers
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While we still have the faintest glimmer of staying-up, all this stuff isn't going to help the players at all so I hope it doesn't gather momentum. If/when our faith is sealed, fill your boots.
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Call me a traditionalist, but if you want to vent emotions then boo at the end. 'Protest because we're shit' just doesn't work.
I'm in favour of the booing approach as well.
I'm there to watch football, so why should I walk out ?
My favourite football booing story comes from Fred Macaulay. He does a longer version in his live shows but here's the shortened version from Mock the Week
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Take no notice of this so-called walkout - it's just something's that's been engineered by the club to get our fans to stay as late as the 74th minute.
Most are normally gone by then.
A bit like the "Tray of chips on 36" campaign.
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The Anfield walk out was effective because it was well publicised and something all football supporters could relate to but also very visible as it took place in a packed stadium where suddenly thousands of empty seats appearing is always going stand out. There are already thousands of empty seats at Villa Park so any walk out isn't going to have much of an effect on any watching on TV.
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Villa Fans are great when it comes to getting behind the club. Petrov's minute of applause was envied and copied by other clubs.
We copied Bolton.
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The Anfield walk out was effective because it was well publicised and something all football supporters could relate to but also very visible as it took place in a packed stadium where suddenly thousands of empty seats appearing is always going stand out. There are already thousands of empty seats at Villa Park so any walk out isn't going to have much of an effect on any watching on TV.
Stop being so sensible.
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It's got to be better than the Anfield walkout because there's fuck all chance of us throwing a two goal lead away.
And congratulations to UK Redsox and DeKuip for a brace of LOLs.
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1) The Liverpool was a marketing exercise, they were never going to charge £77 they did it to get a reaction which they did, they then announced they weren't going to do that so now the fans will buy more stuff from the club because they feel the club have given them something.
2) Our protest is quite possibly the most pointless protest you're ever likely to see it has 0% of success. Step back and look at it without emotion what the protest is saying is Lerner who wants out we want you out. Walk out on 74 minutes it won't make a wealthy new owner appear Lerner will still be here he will still want out and we will still be relegated. Unless someone knows a a person who has a few billion pounds and can convince him to buy us there is nothing us fans can do.
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One individual protest isn't -in isolation- going to give Lerner second thoughts.
But all these things can have an accumulative effect.
That said, I think this particular idea is ill advised, for the reasons mentioned elsewhere in this thread.
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Step back and look at it without emotion what the protest is saying is Lerner who wants out we want you out.
Eh?
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1) The Liverpool was a marketing exercise, they were never going to charge £77 they did it to get a reaction which they did, they then announced they weren't going to do that so now the fans will buy more stuff from the club because they feel the club have given them something.
Of course it was organised by the marketing brains at Liverpool!
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Rather than just leaving on 74 minutes we should stay away from our seats til the 18th minute, then leave on the 74th. That'd show them
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Step back and look at it without emotion
Impossible.
Just because Lerner doesn't give a shit about how we feel doesn't mean we shouldn't remind him of it. Is there such a thing as pointless protest anyway? it's people showing their feelings. Anyway, it's either Lerner getting it from both barrels or Garde. Somebody will be on the end of some dogs' abuse once relegation is confirmed. Will solve nothing but might help a few dozen, hundred, thousand Villa fans let off some steam after being taken for absolute mugs for the last few years
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5, 4, 3, 2
I'm a better supporter than you
Sheep, goat, donkey, cow,
I'm a better supporter than yow
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Step back and look at it without emotion
Impossible.
Just because Lerner doesn't give a shit about how we feel doesn't mean we shouldn't remind him of it. Is there such a thing as pointless protest anyway? it's people showing their feelings. Anyway, it's either Lerner getting it from both barrels or Garde. Somebody will be on the end of some dogs' abuse once relegation is confirmed. Will solve nothing but might help a few dozen, hundred, thousand Villa fans let off some steam after being taken for absolute mugs for the last few years
Again read what you are saying. We are protesting to try and get an owner of a limited company who wants to sell to sell. For example if you put your house up for sale if you don't get any offers then you can't sell your house.
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I'm all for some sort of protest, but won't be participating in this.
On a Tuesday night in our current form there will be 30k there max to start with, so even if it was successful and a few thousand left after 74, Fox n Co. would just shrug their shoulders.
If we are a couple of goals or more behind, then the media will just think it's like when people left early against Liverpool, e.g being fed up.
If the game's tight and poised at say 0-0 or 1-1 after 74 then we go on to lose, we may feel in some way responsible that our lack of support for the last 15 mins contributed.
Unfortunately I don't have the alternative solution, but can't see the benefit in this, I'd rather watch all of the game.
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1) The Liverpool was a marketing exercise, they were never going to charge £77 they did it to get a reaction which they did, they then announced they weren't going to do that so now the fans will buy more stuff from the club because they feel the club have given them something.
Of course it was organised by the marketing brains at Liverpool!
Its simple marketing really put something out there to annoy, Liverpool fans then protested then the Liverpool board backed down. Now the Liverpool fans feel the club have listened and will be more open to spending their money. What made it obvious was how fast they changed their mind after 1 protest.
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5, 4, 3, 2
I'm a better supporter than you
Sheep, goat, donkey, cow,
I'm a better supporter than yow
Horse, rabbit, red setter
I'm going to write an open letter.
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1) The Liverpool was a marketing exercise, they were never going to charge £77 they did it to get a reaction which they did, they then announced they weren't going to do that so now the fans will buy more stuff from the club because they feel the club have given them something.
If you read the FSG statement, they're not really even giving them anything. They're giving themselves an excuse not to spend money.
“… we have been driven solely by the desire to return LFC to the pinnacle of football. In the world of modern football, growing the club in a sustainable way is essential to realising this objective... A great many of you have objected strongly to the £77 price level of our most expensive GA seats and expressed a clear expectation that the club should forego any increased revenue from raising prices on GA tickets in the current environment”
Cue three years down the line with Liverpool still mid-table and the owners not spending as much as Man City or Bristol Rovers: "you guys told us that you wanted it this way"
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Step back and look at it without emotion
Impossible.
Just because Lerner doesn't give a shit about how we feel doesn't mean we shouldn't remind him of it. Is there such a thing as pointless protest anyway? it's people showing their feelings. Anyway, it's either Lerner getting it from both barrels or Garde. Somebody will be on the end of some dogs' abuse once relegation is confirmed. Will solve nothing but might help a few dozen, hundred, thousand Villa fans let off some steam after being taken for absolute mugs for the last few years
Again read what you are saying. We are protesting to try and get an owner of a limited company who wants to sell to sell. For example if you put your house up for sale if you don't get any offers then you can't sell your house.
No, you make your house more attractive for sale, whether that's lowering the price or tarting it up.
What about the fact the club had given up and accepted relegation by January? Should we also just let that pass without a whimper?
As Chico says, whether it's organised and peaceful, or otherwise, there will doubtless be some letting off of steam to come.
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The fact that we aren't very saleable is a separate issue, and I agree that a protest against that is pretty futile. The fact that the board gave up on survival with 4 nof the season left to play is far from futile.
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Step back and look at it without emotion
Impossible.
Just because Lerner doesn't give a shit about how we feel doesn't mean we shouldn't remind him of it. Is there such a thing as pointless protest anyway? it's people showing their feelings. Anyway, it's either Lerner getting it from both barrels or Garde. Somebody will be on the end of some dogs' abuse once relegation is confirmed. Will solve nothing but might help a few dozen, hundred, thousand Villa fans let off some steam after being taken for absolute mugs for the last few years
Again read what you are saying. We are protesting to try and get an owner of a limited company who wants to sell to sell. For example if you put your house up for sale if you don't get any offers then you can't sell your house.
No, you read what I'm saying. I don't give a shit about what our legal entity is or whether Lerner wants to sell, I just want to let him know what an absolute twat I think he is.
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I am absolutely sick to death about people saying that Lerner wants to sell the club!
Does he REALLY want to sell the club? Obviously if he gets a ridiculous offer and it passes due diligence (miracles do happen) the he MIGHT sell! Lerner put the club up for sale in May 2014, coming up to 2 years ago and in that time he has not managed to sell it... why?
It is the same as me saying I want to sell my house, do I really want to sell it, I might do if I got a ridiculous offer then again I might just enjoy pissing people off!
Doing nothing achieves nothing, just don’t moan about it!
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Lerner seems to vacillate between wanting to sell and not 'being a motivated seller,' so how does stuart 445 or anyone else know what he wants to do this month?
He was attracted by the price Fulham went for in 2013, but we are unlikely to go for anywhere near £200 million.
The appeals of Dancing with the Shunammite seemed to wane after our cup run last year, and it has been mentioned elsewhere that a buy out was close in the summer, only for Lerner himself to pull the plug.
There is genuinely wanting out and then there is the Bill Kenwright version of wanting to sell, which means remaining in place until the next Ice Age.
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I am absolutely sick to death about people saying that Lerner wants to sell the club!
Does he REALLY want to sell the club? Obviously if he gets a ridiculous offer and it passes due diligence (miracles do happen) the he MIGHT sell! Lerner put the club up for sale in May 2014, coming up to 2 years ago and in that time he has not managed to sell it... why?
It is the same as me saying I want to sell my house, do I really want to sell it, I might do if I got a ridiculous offer then again I might just enjoy pissing people off!
Doing nothing achieves nothing, just don’t moan about it!
I am no Lerner apologist, but going by the above, surely he can't win?
If it is like you selling your house, then it's like you having instructed an estate agent, having a board outside, and waiting for someone to make an offer.
There's a difference between him wanting to sell and accepting any old offer. To use your estate agent example again, that's like you putting your house on the market, me offering you four cans of Kestrel and a packet of digestive biscuits, and then complaining when you say no.
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Yes, but by the same token, not mowing the lawn for five years , grime on the windows, mould in the fridge and dirty pants on the bedroom floor isn't going to do you any favours.
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Yes, but by the same token, not mowing the lawn for five years , grime on the windows, mould in the fridge and dirty pants on the bedroom floor isn't going to do you any favours.
Don't forget the sitting tenants, all earning thousands per week and refusing to vacate the building.
And the neighbours bring down the value
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You'd think they'd be queuing up to buy. After all, you can get away with any old shit here and nobody will so much as cough impolitely within a mile's radius.
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Amfy, there really is no need for a clear specific aim. It's enough for paying fans to say, 'you're wrecking our club and we want it to stop.'
It would be a strop if this were just one season. It's five. Villa fans have every right to make their feelings known, because nobody else is on our side as one look at the local or national media will demonstrate.
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We're not really going to be overtaken by Bristol Rovers, are we?
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Amfy, there really is no need for a clear specific aim. It's enough for paying fans to say, 'you're wrecking our club and we want it to stop.'
It would be a strop if this were just one season. It's five. Villa fans have every right to make their feelings known, because nobody else is on our side as one look at the local or national media will demonstrate.
Of course we do.
I just personally think a protest should be better thought out than this, so I won't be joining it.
Despite having a bit of a thing about early leavers at the best of times, I have no problem with those that join this, as long as that respect goes both ways.
I'll be staying, not out of apathy or lethargy which are some of the more polite things that have been said about those of us that don't want to take part, but because it's how I support Villa, & what feels right for me.
It's one thing for us not to agree on how to act, but fans need to respect how each other respond to times like these.
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Lerner seems to vacillate between wanting to sell and not 'being a motivated seller,' so how does stuart 445 or anyone else know what he wants to do this month?
He was attracted by the price Fulham went for in 2013, but we are unlikely to go for anywhere near £200 million.
The appeals of Dancing with the Shunammite seemed to wane after our cup run last year, and it has been mentioned elsewhere that a buy out was close in the summer, only for Lerner himself to pull the plug.
There is genuinely wanting out and then there is the Bill Kenwright version of wanting to sell, which means remaining in place until the next Ice Age.
A bit of respite from the Lerner stuff for a minute, what a terrible purchase that turned out to be. Surely now worth less than a quarter of what Khan paid for them just 3 years ago, with no sign of a return to the PL close.
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Villa Fans are great when it comes to getting behind the club. Petrov's minute of applause was envied and copied by other clubs.
We copied Bolton.
If you mean for Muamba, i'm pretty sure the first time they did the applause for his shirt number was at VP for THAT McLeish game.
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We're not really going to be overtaken by Bristol Rovers, are we?
No.
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We're not really going to be overtaken by Bristol Rovers, are we?
No.
I wouldn't worry about it for a least 18 months.
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1) The Liverpool was a marketing exercise, they were never going to charge £77 they did it to get a reaction which they did, they then announced they weren't going to do that so now the fans will buy more stuff from the club because they feel the club have given them something.
If you read the FSG statement, they're not really even giving them anything. They're giving themselves an excuse not to spend money.
“… we have been driven solely by the desire to return LFC to the pinnacle of football. In the world of modern football, growing the club in a sustainable way is essential to realising this objective... A great many of you have objected strongly to the £77 price level of our most expensive GA seats and expressed a clear expectation that the club should forego any increased revenue from raising prices on GA tickets in the current environment”
Cue three years down the line with Liverpool still mid-table and the owners not spending as much as Man City or Bristol Rovers: "you guys told us that you wanted it this way"
No they haven't given anything back so to speak. What they have done is make it look like they've listened to them, basically the fans now feel like they have a voice so are more happy to spend their money.
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Step back and look at it without emotion
Impossible.
Just because Lerner doesn't give a shit about how we feel doesn't mean we shouldn't remind him of it. Is there such a thing as pointless protest anyway? it's people showing their feelings. Anyway, it's either Lerner getting it from both barrels or Garde. Somebody will be on the end of some dogs' abuse once relegation is confirmed. Will solve nothing but might help a few dozen, hundred, thousand Villa fans let off some steam after being taken for absolute mugs for the last few years
Again read what you are saying. We are protesting to try and get an owner of a limited company who wants to sell to sell. For example if you put your house up for sale if you don't get any offers then you can't sell your house.
No, you read what I'm saying. I don't give a shit about what our legal entity is or whether Lerner wants to sell, I just want to let him know what an absolute twat I think he is.
So give him your money and walk out at 74 minutes then that's sensible isn't it. I hope you think I'm a twat because by the logic of all the people taking part in the protest you owe me £30
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No they haven't given anything back so to speak. What they have done is make it look like they've listened to them, basically the fans now feel like they have a voice so are more happy to spend their money.
I'm struggling to see how you've arrived at that conclusion.
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No they haven't given anything back so to speak. What they have done is make it look like they've listened to them, basically the fans now feel like they have a voice so are more happy to spend their money.
I'm struggling to see how you've arrived at that conclusion.
It's the speed of the U turn that makes it obvious. They have massaged the ego of the Liverpool fans making them feel important, if you feel valued then when you're 50 / 50 about buying something that'll help the vast majority of people.
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Beginning to think this could have some impact It goes against the grain to leave early but we as fans have to make a statement.
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The goal has to be to get Lerner to drop the asking price imo, yes I know people walking out of games won't achieve that on it's own but it may slightly pose a few questions as to what the custodian of the club is now owning with open mutiny.
Amusing anyway that Lerner buys a premier league club for 64m and could still be demanding 150m for a championship club. I think relegation in itself will force him to lower it to 100m, hopefully they'll be more interest then.
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I think this will only work if we're losing. Can't see many fans wanting to leave if the game is on a knife edge, or (brace yourselves) we're actually winning.
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I probably won't be at the game, but if I was there's no way i'd leave if we were winning. Halley's Comet appears more often than a home win.
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I think this will only work if we're losing. Can't see many fans wanting to leave if the game is on a knife edge, or (brace yourselves) we're actually winning.
If 'we're actually winning'.
I'd just like this to happen. UTV!
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There is now a suggestion that those who want to protest but don't want to leave, wave white flags (or something white) from 74 minutes.
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I used to think SHA was the gift that kept on giving but now it's us.
Now we are looking at some people leaving the ground on 74 minutes and I expect the majority staying (unless we are on the end of a hammering). The Liverpool walk out was 'successful' based on a club trying to move forward with owners using business common sense (knowing the TV deal money is coming) and promoting empathy with its fanbase that provides a ten year waiting list for season tickets.
The only way out for us is Lerner selling.
Not buying tickets / merchandise / hospitality is the only way he may look for a quick exit but the risk is, as the income reduces more staff and facilities are cut and the wage bill is reduced even further.
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That sounds like a good compromise. Those who want to walk out do it, those who don't wave the white flag at Lerner and his cronies.
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I think so too. It also allows people to go with how they feel at the time much more.
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I think it will look like those who are staying are waving white flags are those who are leaving.
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That sounds like a good compromise. Those who want to walk out do it, those who don't wave the white flag like Lerner and his cronies.
Who the fuck do you think you are? I shall stay until the end because I support Aston Villa, not Randy Lerner, and I'm getting well pissed off with this idea that anyone who talks about protesting in any form is somehow a better fan than the rest of us.
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Calm down dear. It was a typo. ''wave the white flag at Lerner and his cronies''
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Calm down dear. It was a typo. ''wave the white flag at Lerner and his cronies''
Had your phone in your pocket did you?
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I think it will look like those who are staying are waving white flags are those who are leaving.
Interesting point!
I think it's important that this option is well publicised so everyone is clear what's happening. Both those taking part and those watching.
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I think it will look like those who are staying are waving white flags are those who are leaving.
Interesting point!
I think it's important that this option is well publicised so everyone is clear what's happening. Both those taking part and those watching.
If anyone's been waving the white flag it's been the club.
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(https://i.imgflip.com/zsv6m.jpg)
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It could be a designated protest day. People leaving the ground on 74, white flags, scarfs thrown on to the pitch, just general disquiet. We are going down with our lowest points total, lowest wins and lowest goals should things carry on as is.
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I think it will look like those who are staying are waving white flags are those who are leaving.
Interesting point!
I think it's important that this option is well publicised so everyone is clear what's happening. Both those taking part and those watching.
If anyone's been waving the white flag it's been the club.
Which is the point, obviously.
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Calm down dear. It was a typo. ''wave the white flag at Lerner and his cronies''
Had your phone in your pocket did you?
at/like is hardly a typographical error.
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I shall stay until the end because I support Aston Villa, not Randy Lerner.
Totally agree.
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Calm down dear. It was a typo. ''wave the white flag at Lerner and his cronies''
Had your phone in your pocket did you?
at/like is hardly a typographical error.
Well whatever it's called when you are rushing and use the wrong word that was it. I want the fans to give Lerner shit because he's the wanker, not the fans. Whatever everyone decides to do individually I'm not that arsed to be honest.
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(http://madridbullfighting.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/plaza-de-toros-de-las-ventas-madrid.jpg)
(https://23thorns.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/morris-dancers-01.jpg)
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I'm a little tea pot.
(http://img.thesun.co.uk/aidemitlum/archive/02149/The_Prince_of_Wale_2149666a.jpg)
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Up The Shitter if we miss a sitter
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I am starting to get really fucked off with this leaving early protest already. It, as I knew it inevitably would, is bringing out the worst in the "better fan than you" types.
I don't know how many people I have seen ranting on social media about how anyone that doesn't walk out is a disgrace and how leaving early will create, amongst other things, global headlines.
All it will do is cause rows between the fans, the club still pocket the cash anyway and the message is lost when a few people bugger off from a half empty ground.
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I'm an apathetic lethargic sheep and not a proper supporter for errm staying and supporting rather than following some other people out early.
So be it.
I understand why people want to do it. I don't want to do it.
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I've said it before, these coordinated, planned protests rarely work because we all have different opinions and approaches. The best method is the 'organic' natural protest where fans have just had enough and don't turn up in the first place. This was evidenced against Man City and will be repeated as this dreadful season just gets worse and worse, reaching a climax of apathy once we are mathematically relegated.
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I'm an apathetic lethargic sheep and not a proper supporter for errm staying and supporting rather than following some other people out early.
So be it.
I understand why people want to do it. I don't want to do it.
That's two of us.
Baaaa!
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People honestly think Randy Lerner gives a shit?
You bought your match day ticket, a pie, a pint and a program. He got what he wanted, and you missed 16+ minutes of a match you paid for.
Nothing is going to change the way the club is run.
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I'm an apathetic lethargic sheep and not a proper supporter for errm staying and supporting rather than following some other people out early.
So be it.
I understand why people want to do it. I don't want to do it.
agree
you pays your money you takes your choice
if you want to leave early fine, if you dont fine
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It's about 74 days to the end of the season - I'm leaving now.
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If you think supporting players that by and large don't give a toss, over your fellow fans is the way forward then by all means.
but this site has lost massive credibility for me, we won't get the media exposure next year that we currently enjoy in the PL, mass walkouts will make global headlines, you stood there looking glum will do naff all, I'm sorry you should be doing what's best and that's making a statement shoulder to shoulder with your fellow fans.
As is you could have thrown considerable weight behind and really contributed, now you've just contributed to the apathy and disunity among the fans, good job Lerner and co must be grateful.
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Pardon?
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Some ****** from last night that hasn't responded yet to the temper tantrum response he got from me.
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Taken from a comment on our FB Page.
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There's a surprise. I love it when "me and my twelve Twitter followers" equates to "everybody".
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I travel a decent lick from the north for every home game, so I don't want to be missing minutes of the game in protest.
I.like the idea of some collective chucking of the Bright Future scarfs though.
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I kept my cup final scarf for symbolic use but I would prefer to wear/throw it on a happy day. Like the day we are conga ing our way back up. That scarf was witness to a truly miserable day. It needs soaking in success, not more failure.
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Mine is in a box in the garage Brian.
I don't think it will ever see the light of day again!!
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I gave mine away.
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i'd forgotten all about that scarf. Don't know where it is either.
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There is a bloke on the H&V Facebook page who hasn't been to a match for seven years yet is giving Villa his 'support' blaming those who go to the match for the mess they're in and calling them 'fans'. Personally I'd call them supporters.
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Do the Electric Boogaloo on 82.
That'll show them.
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Football is too expensive to forfeit some of the game. With the price of tickets you need to stay as long as possible to get your moneys worth, if that's even possible. I expect the walkout will get some media attention but the club will be unresponsive. Boycotting the merchandise, programmes and refreshments is less visible but would be more of a concern to the club.
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I kept my cup final scarf for symbolic use but I would prefer to wear/throw it on a happy day. Like the day we are conga ing our way back up. That scarf was witness to a truly miserable day. It needs soaking in success, not more failure.
I never received one on the day - a supportive fellow fan obviously lifted it. Afterwards, I really didn't have the enthusiasm to go get a free one from the club shop despite the kind offer from the club.
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There is a bloke on the H&V Facebook page who hasn't been to a match for seven years yet is giving Villa his 'support' blaming those who go to the match for the mess they're in and calling them 'fans'. Personally I'd call them supporters.
'Customers' if you don't mind, Chris.
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Football is too expensive to forfeit some of the game. With the price of tickets you need to stay as long as possible to get your moneys worth, if that's even possible. I expect the walkout will get some media attention but the club will be unresponsive. Boycotting the merchandise, programmes and refreshments is less visible but would be more of a concern to the club.
They haven't changed course despite the risk of losing the biggest pot of sky money in history. Do you think they care if you buy a pie?
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Maybe this needs changing to "Out the door on 54"?
Then it will be a more natural walking out of fans as we go three nil down.
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I gave mine away.
Left mine in the stadium after such a poor display. Wasnt in the mood for memorabilia that day
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I've kept all my Cup Final scarf, so when I'm a wheelchair-bound, dribbling old man of letters who's just collected his fifth Booker Prize, I'll have it round my neck when they let me present the Villa with the Cup.
Of course, by that point, the Final will be on a Thursday night at the New Den, but I won't give up the dream.
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Personally, I say stay in Villa Park and let yourself be heard.
I can't walk away from my Aston Villa.
My love is for Aston Villa.
Try as I may, I cart turn my back on them
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i'd forgotten all about that scarf. Don't know where it is either.
When I am very naughty they get it out of the drawer and make me look at it very hard until I realise what a bad person I am...
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I've kept all my Cup Final scarf, so when I'm a wheelchair-bound, dribbling old man of letters who's just collected his fifth Booker Prize, I'll have it round my neck when they let me present the Villa with the Cup.
Of course, by that point, the Final will be on a Thursday night at the New Den, but I won't give up the dream.
I'd do the same, but I'm not sure I'm going to live until 31016, so I may not see our next FA Cup Final victory.
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I'm looking at getting a load of the Lerner Clown masks and handing them out at home matches - not walking out on the Villa but will take the piss out of the present incumbents at any opportunity - we are Villa 'til we die
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I'm looking at getting a load of the Lerner Clown masks and handing them out at home matches - not walking out on the Villa but will take the piss out of the present incumbents at any opportunity - we are Villa 'til we die
These will also be useful on the last game of the season so that the cameras don't find anyone crying.
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I'm looking at getting a load of the Lerner Clown masks and handing them out at home matches - not walking out on the Villa but will take the piss out of the present incumbents at any opportunity - we are Villa 'til we die
These will also be useful on the last game of the season so that the cameras don't find anyone crying.
Going to be doing it as soon as possible Amfy - don't care about cameras - you won't see me crying!
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There was no crying or other signs of wimpish behaviour on our way to Division 3.
We are are the famous
The famous Holte End
If Villa's going down
We'll all go together
And We Shall Overcome
Sing it, Comrade Pete:
Fuck off, middle class parvenus who have no idea of what Aston Villa is.
We are not afraid.
Fuck off Lerner, you toerag.
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There was no crying or other signs of wimpish behaviour on our way to Division 3.
We are are the famous
The famous Holte End
If Villa's going down
We'll all go together
And We Shall Overcome
Sing it, Comrade Pete:
Fuck off, middle class parvenus who have no idea of what Aston Villa is.
We are not afraid.
Fuck off Lerner, you toerag.
We shall lead the children out of the Wilderness to the Promised Land Brother - show no mercy to the unbeliever - We've done it before, We'll do it again!
Fuck the fuckers
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Missing an apostrophe:
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtp1/v/t1.0-9/12801646_10154017117239917_3413198242027992493_n.jpg?oh=ddace5e223d9399045977a392c875af6&oe=5757AA31)
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We are going to be okay. No crying. Show that we the fans have the courage the club and the players lack.
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I think we've all come to terms with what will happen months in advance.
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If Villa are a goal up after 74 minutes, no way is anyone leaving. So desperately starved of success we'd surely want us to win more than want to walk out and not see a victory?
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When i started going in the mid 1970's the 74th minute was about the time the less prosperous were going into the ground.
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If Villa are a goal up after 74 minutes
Good one.
Surely the ground should be full or nearly full for this kind of thing to have any impact? There will be 10,000+ empty seats at kick off anyway, and if we're losing comfortably loads will have gone well before the 74th minute. It will be a damp squib and will make us look daft now all media outlets have latched onto it. Imo either boycott completely and stay away, or stay and sing and shout and make your feelings known for 90 minutes. Like Lerner cares if a few walk out on the 74th minute, he'll already have their money and won't give a toss.
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There are too many factors against this walk out for it to have any effort whatsoever.
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Turn your back on the field of play on 74 minutes. That way, the already empty seats won't matter. Turn your back like Lerner has turned his.
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This will only be more impactful once relegation is confirmed. While the candle of hope still flickers too many still will be reluctant to make a stand and participate in any real protest.
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Football is too expensive to forfeit some of the game. With the price of tickets you need to stay as long as possible to get your moneys worth, if that's even possible. I expect the walkout will get some media attention but the club will be unresponsive. Boycotting the merchandise, programmes and refreshments is less visible but would be more of a concern to the club.
They haven't changed course despite the risk of losing the biggest pot of sky money in history. Do you think they care if you buy a pie?
That'll do it, Hollis will crumble, boycott the Bovril and its game over.
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I am going to whine on 79.
No, make that wine on 9.
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I am going to masturbate on 88.
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I'm going for a poo on 82.
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Being fickle I will walk out the door when Everton hit 4..
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I am going to masturbate on 88.
I'm going for a poo on 82.
I might be out the door on 74!
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I'm...errr...going to listen to Little Mix on 76?
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I am going to masturbate on 88.
That is disgusting.
Who is our 88 anyway?
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I am going to masturbate on 88.
That is disgusting.
Who is our 88 anyway?
I thought Brian was down the Bingo again.
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I'll get my kicks on 66.
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I am going to masturbate on 88.
That is disgusting.
Who is our 88 anyway?
I thought Brian was down the Bingo again.
* applauds *
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Right now I'll be surprised if 74 fans actually walk out because of some protest, or if they just walk out because we are down 4-0
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I'm not doing a 180 mile round trip on a Tuesday after work,Just to leave early.
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If some folks want to leave on 74 mins,fine, they should do what they feel is best for them. Same applies to those that don't leave. Neither is a better fan, and I just hope everyone respects what other fans choose to do tomorrow night.
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Football is too expensive to forfeit some of the game. With the price of tickets you need to stay as long as possible to get your moneys worth, if that's even possible. I expect the walkout will get some media attention but the club will be unresponsive. Boycotting the merchandise, programmes and refreshments is less visible but would be more of a concern to the club.
They haven't changed course despite the risk of losing the biggest pot of sky money in history. Do you think they care if you buy a pie?
Well they sacked a few managers.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
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If some folks want to leave on 74 mins,fine, they should do what they feel is best for them. Same applies to those that don't leave. Neither is a better fan, and I just hope everyone respects what other fans choose to do tomorrow night.
Quite right. I'm undecided and will probably be swayed by how the game's going - if we're out of it, I'll walk, if we're still in it I'll stay.
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I'm sure it's already been said but I can't see it on page 1 and I'm not reading all 16 pages!
What's the 'story' with this protest? For a protest to work it needs awareness - it needs to capture the press's imagination. With that in mind why tonight? Why a meaningless Tuesday night match in March? Nothing significant is going to happen tonight. The opposition isn't particularly significant (unless you're going with the very tenuous most-played-game-in-the-top-flight thing). The result won't be significant. The 74th minute thing is also pretty tenuous.
I just don't get it. Yes people are pissed off but why not protest at the Liverpool game? At least that was a Saturday. Why not the next game?It just makes no sense. Even if the protest happens it'll barely register in the national press.
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If some folks want to leave on 74 mins,fine, they should do what they feel is best for them. Same applies to those that don't leave. Neither is a better fan, and I just hope everyone respects what other fans choose to do tomorrow night.
Quite right. I'm undecided and will probably be swayed by how the game's going - if we're out of it, I'll walk, if we're still in it I'll stay.
I have similar feelings - if in the unlikely event we are leading or at least on level terms and making an effort to win it - I might be tempted to stay. But we all know how unlikely that is.
If Remi publicly comes out and says we will do our best to be winning on 74 and if the players respond and actually do it then that is the only way to stop the protest. We all know what will happen. We will sing the new song with all 4 sides of the ground joining in. We might make it to half time then concede a couple of poor goals and most of us walk out on 74.
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I'm sure it's already been said but I can't see it on page 1 and I'm not reading all 16 pages!
What's the 'story' with this protest? For a protest to work it needs awareness - it needs to capture the press's imagination. With that in mind why tonight? Why a meaningless Tuesday night match in March? Nothing significant is going to happen tonight. The opposition isn't particularly significant (unless you're going with the very tenuous most-played-game-in-the-top-flight thing). The result won't be significant. The 74th minute thing is also pretty tenuous.
I just don't get it. Yes people are pissed off but why not protest at the Liverpool game? At least that was a Saturday. Why not the next game?It just makes no sense. Even if the protest happens it'll barely register in the national press.
I heard it mentioned for the first time on Five Live last night and it seems to be going around - well, the Everton fans are certainly aware of it.
I'm not a supporter of this action to be honest, it just looks as though we are protesting about being shit rather than being in the shit.
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Anything that brings attention to the damage Lerner has done to our club is fine by me.
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I'll be staying late on 98
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I'm sure it's already been said but I can't see it on page 1 and I'm not reading all 16 pages!
What's the 'story' with this protest? For a protest to work it needs awareness - it needs to capture the press's imagination. With that in mind why tonight? Why a meaningless Tuesday night match in March? Nothing significant is going to happen tonight. The opposition isn't particularly significant (unless you're going with the very tenuous most-played-game-in-the-top-flight thing). The result won't be significant. The 74th minute thing is also pretty tenuous.
I just don't get it. Yes people are pissed off but why not protest at the Liverpool game? At least that was a Saturday. Why not the next game?It just makes no sense. Even if the protest happens it'll barely register in the national press.
I heard it mentioned for the first time on Five Live last night and it seems to be going around - well, the Everton fans are certainly aware of it.
I'm not a supporter of this action to be honest, it just looks as though we are protesting about being shit rather than being in the shit.
It was mentioned on the Midland bulletin on the BBC Breakfast news this morning. I feel like you, I might well clear off early if we are 4-0 down or something but if we are in the game I will stick with it on the off chance of a rare win.
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What does the 74 signify?
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I take it it's as in 1874
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
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I take it it's as in 1874
I see, ta.
Glad we are not walking out on the 18 bit, wouldn't be worth leaving the pub for.
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I've not read all this thread, so can someone please explain what aim of the protest is.
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A walkout in a stadium with 15,000 empty seats at kick off for a match that isn't televised sadly isn't going to have the effect people are hoping.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
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I've not read all this thread, so can someone please explain what aim of the protest is.
There isn't one it seems. But apparently there doesn't need to be one, people just want to let the board know we are shit and not very happy. Personally I suspect they are aware of this.
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I've not read all this thread, so can someone please explain what aim of the protest is.
There isn't one it seems. But apparently there doesn't need to be one, people just want to let the board know we are shit and not very happy. Personally I suspect they are aware of this.
Right. So, you think they may have noticed already? Fair point then.
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I've not read all this thread, so can someone please explain what aim of the protest is.
There isn't one it seems. But apparently there doesn't need to be one, people just want to let the board know we are shit and not very happy. Personally I suspect they are aware of this.
Right. So, you think they may have noticed already? Fair point then.
I'm just guessing like. They may be completely oblivious, but my spidey sense tells me they've probably got a reasonable idea the fans are a bit disappointed.
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Anything that brings attention to the damage Lerner has done to our club is fine by me.
And do you think the media will report it as a protest against the owners or as a protest against being shit?
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Anything that brings attention to the damage Lerner has done to our club is fine by me.
And do you think the media will report it as a protest against the owners or as a protest against being shit?
As far as I can see, the media have already started reporting about it being a protest against the poor running of the Club.
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Anything that brings attention to the damage Lerner has done to our club is fine by me.
And do you think the media will report it as a protest against the owners or as a protest against being shit?
As far as I can see, the media have already started reporting about it being a protest against the poor running of the Club.
So it's brought the poor running of the club to the media's attention. That'll be well worth the effort then. I was a bit concerned that they may have thought everything was going swimmingly.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
I shall be standing, singing loudly while applauding those who walk out - all bases covered...
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The walkout will be supported if we are losing. People will be less likely to leave if the side is winning. I realize it's all looking inevitable but one win and other results being favourable brings that word hope back into play and fans will be less likely to jeopardize things if things are going well.
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A walkout in a stadium with 15,000 empty seats at kick off for a match that isn't televised sadly isn't going to have the effect people are hoping.
It may not seem like much, but the game is televised outside of the UK, and more importantly is on in the US where Lerner can see and hear what the fans think of him in glorious surround-sound and HD technicolor. Of course that assumes he cares enough to be watching, which is probably not the case.
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According to Doug Ellis he watches every game
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A walkout in a stadium with 15,000 empty seats at kick off for a match that isn't televised sadly isn't going to have the effect people are hoping.
It may not seem like much, but the game is televised outside of the UK, and more importantly is on in the US where Lerner can see and hear what the fans think of him in glorious surround-sound and HD technicolor. Of course that assumes he cares enough to be watching, which is probably not the case.
Do you honestly believe Randy thinks it's all ok? And a few hundred people walking out 15 minutes early is going to completely change his view of the club?
He says the club's up for sale. The only way he'll sell it quicker is if he drops his asking price by 10s of millions of pounds. He's not going to suddenly decide to give up on that cash because of a half arsed protest on a wet Tuesday night. If there's no protest at the next home game this will all be forgotten.
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Like someone else said the other day, if people want to do it, then fine. If they don't, then that's fine as well. Personally, I'm not sure what good its going to do.
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Whether it's been thought out properly or not, whether it will have any effect or none whatsoever, whether people choose to take part or not, it's fans saying "We've had enough of this shit". And why shouldn't they?
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Whether it's been thought out properly or not, whether it will have any effect or none whatsoever, whether people choose to take part or not, it's fans saying "We've had enough of this shit". And why shouldn't they?
Said it before but I reckon the real protest will be when relegation is nailed on. And I don't think it will be a friendly one
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Go on now go, walk out the door
Just turn around now
'Cause you're not welcome anymore
Weren't you the one who tried to hurt me with goodbye
Did you think I'd crumble
Did you think I'd lay down and die
Oh no, not I
I will survive
Oh as long as I know how to love
I know I'll stay alive
I've got all my life to live
I've got all my love to give
And I'll survive
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Like someone else said the other day, if people want to do it, then fine. If they don't, then that's fine as well. Personally, I'm not sure what good its going to do.
It doesn't really have to do anything tangible. If it makes those doing it feel happier, then it's meeting a purpose.
Like pacing around a hospital waiting room doesn't bring a doctor out to see you any quicker than if you just sit still, but tell the bloke waiting for someone's operation to finish that what he's doing doesn't have an achievable aim or a clearly defined goal, and you'll probably be given short shrift.
Good luck to them.
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I think the first game after relegation is confirmed will be quite volatile.
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Well anyone walking out will have to have attended anyway so you have to say fair play to them in going in the first place.
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Whether it's been thought out properly or not, whether it will have any effect or none whatsoever, whether people choose to take part or not, it's fans saying "We've had enough of this shit". And why shouldn't they?
The risk is that a half arsed protest takes away the impact of any future properly planned and arranged protest. It's not news if it's happened before.
As others have said, if the objective is to ramp the pressure up on Randy to lower his selling price, mathematically-confirmed relegation is the trigger to do it. At that point the eyes of the world will be on us and the emotion amongst the fans will be highest, therefore likely to elicit a greater response to any protest. Unless tonight is the start of regular protests building up to that point it's a complete waste of time.
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Like someone else said the other day, if people want to do it, then fine. If they don't, then that's fine as well. Personally, I'm not sure what good its going to do.
It doesn't really have to do anything tangible. If it makes those doing it feel happier, then it's meeting a purpose.
Like pacing around a hospital waiting room doesn't bring a doctor out to see you any quicker than if you just sit still, but tell the bloke waiting for someone's operation to finish that what he's doing doesn't have an achievable aim or a clearly defined goal, and you'll probably be given short shrift.
Good luck to them.
Was going to post that, but you appear to have saved me the bother.
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Whether it's been thought out properly or not, whether it will have any effect or none whatsoever, whether people choose to take part or not, it's fans saying "We've had enough of this shit". And why shouldn't they?
The risk is that a half arsed protest takes away the impact of any future properly planned and arranged protest. It's not news if it's happened before.
As others have said, if the objective is to ramp the pressure up on Randy to lower his selling price, mathematically-confirmed relegation is the trigger to do it. At that point the eyes of the world will be on us and the emotion amongst the fans will be highest, therefore likely to elicit a greater response to any protest. Unless tonight is the start of regular protests building up to that point it's a complete waste of time.
This is the big problem with tonight for me, picking a midweek game when there'll already be a lower than average crowd. If it's a damp squib tonight, it will be a case of the Boy Who Cried Wolf the next time we tell the media outlets we are doing a protest.
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I'm heading into town soon for a drink before heading to B6. Maybe if I drink enough i'll be on the floor on 74.
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I'm heading into town soon for a drink before heading to B6.
That's rubbish, doesn't even rhyme.
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...Unless tonight is the start of regular protests building up to that point it's a complete waste of time.
Isn't it the first of four?
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I think if we're losing by two goals or more the thing may catch on and you could see a mass exodus.
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Whether it's been thought out properly or not, whether it will have any effect or none whatsoever, whether people choose to take part or not, it's fans saying "We've had enough of this shit". And why shouldn't they?
The risk is that a half arsed protest takes away the impact of any future properly planned and arranged protest. It's not news if it's happened before.
As others have said, if the objective is to ramp the pressure up on Randy to lower his selling price, mathematically-confirmed relegation is the trigger to do it. At that point the eyes of the world will be on us and the emotion amongst the fans will be highest, therefore likely to elicit a greater response to any protest. Unless tonight is the start of regular protests building up to that point it's a complete waste of time.
As I've said from the very beginning, any organised protest that requires mass participation from Villa fans is doomed to fail. There is simply no unity among us unless we're winning, or unless something spontaneous happens.
I think a walkout is a bad idea for most of the reasons stated above. I don't think it's been thought through and I doubt it will be a success. But I wouldn't tell them not to do it, just like I wouldn't tell anyone who doesn't want to participate that they should.
I think Chico is right, there will be a letting off of steam eventually, and it will probably be ugly. A well thought through, organised protest might have allowed some fans to feel like they'd vented, had their say, got something off their chests. But as I say, organising that would be like herding cats.
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When we're two down after ten minutes we'll be wishing we were formed in 1914.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
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A number of actions are being planned by various groups in conjunction with with the walk-out.
For my own part, I wll be joining the Situationist Faction who will assemble at Aston Park Pavilion and have a collective howling at the moon which is in its last quarter phase. A wind chime installation will be assembled leveraging the westerly wind forecast to be gusting at 30mph by that point.
Telegram Sam and Purple Pie Pete are conducting an action in the grounds of the church involving witchcraft and automatic shoes.
There will also be a laugh-in on the platforms of Aston Station as the game ends.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
I shall be standing, singing loudly while applauding those who walk out - all bases covered...
Because it comes hot on the heels of that scouse protest, almost identical timing,and I like to think, as I said, we have more class than that! Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and all that!
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
I shall be standing, singing loudly while applauding those who walk out - all bases covered...
Because it comes hot on the heels of that scouse protest, almost identical timing,and I like to think, as I said, we have more class than that! Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and all that!
It could well be embarrassing. At best it will look like a a copycat protest and if it doesn't work well there will certainly be comments like 'they can't even get that right'
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I think if we're losing by two goals or more the thing may catch on and you could see a mass exodus.
I suspect theb thumping Everton are likely to administer will ensure an impressive exodus on 74mins
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
I shall be standing, singing loudly while applauding those who walk out - all bases covered...
Because it comes hot on the heels of that scouse protest, almost identical timing,and I like to think, as I said, we have more class than that! Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and all that!
It could well be embarrassing. At best it will look like a a copycat protest and if it doesn't work well there will certainly be comments like 'they can't even get that right'
I think that will be well down the list of most embarrassing things to happen to Aston Villa in 2016, to be honest.
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Walking out on 74 would be a complete embarrassment to us. We have, I hope, much more class than that
It's a protest, why would it be embarrassing?
For me, there's no class in sitting quietly and accepting your fate like a boiling frog in a saucepan.
Hear hear!
I shall be standing, singing loudly while applauding those who walk out - all bases covered...
Because it comes hot on the heels of that scouse protest, almost identical timing,and I like to think, as I said, we have more class than that! Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and all that!
It could well be embarrassing. At best it will look like a a copycat protest and if it doesn't work well there will certainly be comments like 'they can't even get that right'
I think that will be well down the list of most embarrassing things to happen to Aston Villa in 2016, to be honest.
To the club maybe not, but to us, the fans, definitely.
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.
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How did it go?
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I left. Quite a few others did too.
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A few left but it was a tiny percentage of the crowd. More left after the third went in.
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My beef with it was always that it looked more like we were protesting because we were going to get relegated and we couldn't take it, rather than having a go at the neglect of the club by its owner. It may have been a stronger tactic towards the end of the transfer window to force Lerner's hand. Now it looks like sour grapes.
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Although not that many looked to leave, it did get a lot of coverage. Both on the stream I was watching and the BBC live text. For that at least, it achieved something.
Still think it would have had more effect by doing it at the start of the game. Ten empty minutes from kick off representing Lerner's ten empty years would have had greater impact.
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Not gonna work unless the stadium is fuller or we are winning. Turn your back on the field of play or just don't go at all.
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I left, as did many others.
Outside the ground was nearly as busy as it is at full time.
My reason for supporting the walkout is this.
We all know the team is poor, and we know we are going down.
We also know that the management of the club know we are not happy, so what's the point of a protest you might ask?
For me, I believe that people, and particularly, Americans hate to be shown up or made to feel embarrassed.
So, walking out and highlighting how poorly the club is being run will embarrass Lerner, and this (hopefully) will resonate more with him that the crowd singing 'what a wanker' or, God forbid, doing the usual shrug of the shoulders, sighing and effectively doing nothing.
It's a long shot, but it's my reason for doing it.
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Well played to everybody who did it. Looked like a considerable number from the footage.
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Bit of a non event as expected.
If you want to do a protest do something that'll get noticed.
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Plenty left, certainly the Holte rapidly emptied.
My advice to anyone who wants to do this in the future games is....don't sit in the lower north and attempt to get out as it's nearly up to injury time before you can actually get out due to the narrow exit!
Still it's only the start I'm lead to believe, plenty more planned for the remaining games. More interesting was the very vocal anti-lerner and fox chants in the second half.
This is only the start.
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No doubts this will get some ridicule by the likes of that fat twunt Alan Brazil as the gate was lower than usual and he wouldn't have noticed the difference. Anything for the media to bash us with at the moment. Cheers Lerner. Fair play to those that the walking out. However, something more is needed, like wall to wall anger or not attending at all.
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Don't let anyone tell you invading the pitch is illegal as it's not.
The Football (Offences) Act 1991 would suggest otherwise...
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/d_to_g/football_related_offences/#a04
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Plenty left, certainly the Holte rapidly emptied.
It really didn't. Around me less than 5% of people left and there was quite a bit of anger shown towards those that did.
I thought the more impressive protests were the new Randy Lerner song which was very loud indeed and the seat banging for the last five minutes which would be unbelievably intimidating for the Board if it were done when there were more people in the ground.
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Imagine Tom Fox and Randy Lerner chants 30 minutes after the game, the club will have to do something about and not just ignore it
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I take back that the media would look at this as a protest about being shit. Maybe they actually do realise that it was a stand (or a leave) against Lerner and his folly.
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Don't let anyone tell you invading the pitch is illegal as it's not.
The Football (Offences) Act 1991 would suggest otherwise...
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/d_to_g/football_related_offences/#a04
Interesting reading.
Being drunk at a designated sporting event - s.2(2)
LOL really?
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I'm amazed how lightly the club's management are getting off at the moment. Polite walkout. Fox and co should be getting non stop abuse during the game.
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Whatever form the protests take, let them be sustained, let them be visible and let them be angry. I hope this is just the start, because I fear we're nowhere near finished with Lerner's idiocy.
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I was in L2 and a fair few left but they were definitely in the minority. Some had already gone after an hour though. There were a few half hearted boos for a few seconds that was aimed at those leaving but that was it. Those that left went on their way, those that stayed carried on. Which is how it should be, there was no sign of arguing etc near me between anyone leaving/staying.
The countdown to 74 mins was quite amusing, followed by silence and no one moving as though nobody wanted to be the first to leave.
I'll also hazard a guess that a fair few stayed until 74 mins just to do the walkout. It will also look more effective in a ground that isn't about a third empty to begin with. Still, it will hopefully get some attention.
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I'm amazed how lightly the club's management are getting off at the moment. Polite walkout. Fox and co should be getting non stop abuse during the game.
Fox and Lerner had plenty sung about them tonight.
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Lerner is never here, so won't hear chants. Fox and the other wankers are, so I'd suggest we dig those bastards out first.
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Five years of being treated with contempt by Randy Lerner is hopefully about to explode in his face. This isn't the NFL Randy. You don't treat a one hundred and forty odd year old institution like Aston Villa as if it is a throwaway toy and you don't disrespect the generations of supporters by blocking off all forms of meaningful communication. A more textbook way of running a football club badly you could not find. Get out of our Club and let us move on.
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I'm amazed how lightly the club's management are getting off at the moment. Polite walkout. Fox and co should be getting non stop abuse during the game.
Fox got a fair bit of abuse. I went after about 65 minutes. Partly through the awfully performance and partly through having had enough of the young girl behind wittering on about how gorgeous Ross Barklay is all match. It really was a totally dispiriting night.
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I'm amazed how lightly the club's management are getting off at the moment. Polite walkout. Fox and co should be getting non stop abuse during the game.
Fox got a fair bit of abuse. I went after about 65 minutes. Partly through the awfully performance and partly through having had enough of the young girl behind wittering on about how gorgeous Ross Barklay is all match. It really was a totally dispiriting night.
Bloody hell, she must, as my Mum would say, "have shit in her eyes".
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The likes of Fox will only really get the message when they're embarrassed in front of guests, therefore something like a total boycott of a game needs serious consideration. we need the message to be very, very plain.
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It's a romantic notion but won't get even close to happening. Notwithstanding the season ticket holders that will want to get full use out of their ticket, there are only so many you can reach. Remember that Bells Are Ringing fiasco, where we all said it'd be ace, and it was on the news? The club started playing the bongs and it was almost total silence. Often ideas online will remain just that.
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The walkout got a mention by Alan Smith on Sky on the game summary. Very sympathetic to our situation as you would expect.
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Tom Fox got the treatment tonight as well, the massive whopper.
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I thought the 74th minute walkout went pretty well. I didn't partake myself because I wanted to see the game through to the bitter end, but I don't blame people for wanting to do the walkout.
It was also good to hear a loud rendition of Tom Fox what a wanker. Let's see him throw 20,000 of us out, the c***.
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I thought the 74th minute walkout went pretty well. I didn't partake myself because I wanted to see the game through to the bitter end, but I don't blame people for wanting to do the walkout.
It was also good to hear a loud rendition of Tom Fox what a wanker. Let's see him throw 20,000 of us out, the c***.
90 minutes of us venting our feelings at Fox might have some sort of effect on him at least.
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He'll hire another minder to cover his ears
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Apparently a 13 year old kid in the Lower North was wrestled to the ground by stewards for holding a Lerner out banner.
You know what to do v Spurs....
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I was in the Lower North and saw him holding up the banner at the front. There was a confrontation with the steward but it died down and he wasn't thrown out.
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I thought protest wise it was pretty effective tonight to be fair.
Loads went when the third went in
A noticeable load more streamed out around the ground at 74 minutes
Those who were left continued to make their feelings known
Around me there was no in fighting between goers and stayers either, it just went strangely quiet, like everyone was biting their lip for a minute to just allow each other to do what they needed to do. There was much more hostility between fans as fans walked out as the Liverpool score racked up.
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I was in the Lower North and saw him holding up the banner at the front. There was a confrontation with the steward but it died down and he wasn't thrown out.
Bet he was gutted he wasn't thrown out (winky)
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The Spurs TV game will be the one to crank it up for. Worldwide tv, team going for the title, us dead and buried. We could have a lot of fun at fox and lerner's expense. Needs to be very visual.
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The Spurs TV game will be the one to crank it up for. Worldwide tv, team going for the title, us dead and buried. We could have a lot of fun at fox and lerner's expense. Needs to be very visual.
It's not on TV is it? Thought it was moved because of them being in Europe.
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I walked out on 74. First time I've done that in 50 years of watching Villa. I'll do it again though.Was proud to walk out with other fans. Outside there were loads walking down Witton Lane. The gloves are off, the real fight starts now. Loved the anti Lerner song too. He watches all the games on TV. so he will have heard it.
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The TV cameras seem to like showing random people holding the Lerner out scarves, the ones with the American flag crossed out on one end, and the Union Jack on the other, above their head. Noticed it on Saturday and again tonight.
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Bill my sentiments entirely. We appear to be of same supporting generation, and have been through this before but it is more important now as football has moved on especially the finances.
It I am sure will be harder to return. Whin I came out of trinity middle I could not help but have a smile at even the corporate guests were leaving through the main entrance
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If success is measured by publicity then it's achieved something. It's been mentioned on five live sport in the last two bulletins and there's a story about it on Skysports.
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Also mentioned in The Graun:
"For some Aston Villa supporters the thought of waiting until the 74th minute to walk out in protest against the club’s board was too much to bear. The sight of Romelu Lukaku scoring Everton’s third, on the hour mark, had prompted many to make for the exits even earlier than planned on another chastening evening for the club.
It was not exactly a mass exodus later in the game, when a couple of thousand left their seats as part of the Out the Door on 74 campaign, but there was no escaping the hostility in the air, with the mood close to mutinous at times as the supporters made their feelings known.
Tom Fox, the chief executive, was subjected to some abusive chants as he looked on from the directors’ box and moments later “We want Lerner out” reverberated around the stadium. Randy Lerner, of course, is nowhere to be seen, with the Villa owner more detached than ever from a club that remain eight points adrift of safety with only 10 games remaining. It is a case of when, not if, Villa will be relegated."
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From Relegation Fights to Relegation Rites, dont give him credit for anything.
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At last we seem to be getting some mass media coverage regarding our disgust with Lerner, Fox et al
Whatever your thoughts on the 74th minute walkout, it seems to at least achieved a heightened focus on our anger, which can only be a good thing.
Well done to all involved.
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The TV cameras seem to like showing random people holding the Lerner out scarves, the ones with the American flag crossed out on one end, and the Union Jack on the other, above their head. Noticed it on Saturday and again tonight.
Do they sell similar scarfs without the less than subtle xenophobic bit?
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Also mentioned in The Graun:
"For some Aston Villa supporters the thought of waiting until the 74th minute to walk out in protest against the club’s board was too much to bear. The sight of Romelu Lukaku scoring Everton’s third, on the hour mark, had prompted many to make for the exits even earlier than planned on another chastening evening for the club.
It was not exactly a mass exodus later in the game, when a couple of thousand left their seats as part of the Out the Door on 74 campaign, but there was no escaping the hostility in the air, with the mood close to mutinous at times as the supporters made their feelings known.
Tom Fox, the chief executive, was subjected to some abusive chants as he looked on from the directors’ box and moments later “We want Lerner out” reverberated around the stadium. Randy Lerner, of course, is nowhere to be seen, with the Villa owner more detached than ever from a club that remain eight points adrift of safety with only 10 games remaining. It is a case of when, not if, Villa will be relegated."
But surely Tom Fox already knew we don't like him? And Randy already wants to sell, but he can't because nobody's buying football clubs anymore. Without a clear aim the fans have wasted their time. Etc....
Well done to everybody who took part. Ramp it up for the next game, and the next. If a couple of thousand are prepared to act, think what impact a scarf or towel throw, or something else more visual than a walkout would have?
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Pat Murphy :-
"The mood is turning ugly. The crowd are chanting 'from European nights to relegation fights - we want Lerner out'. A few fans are pointing fingers at chief executive Tom Fox in the directors' box.
"There are hundreds of fans streaming out of Villa Park. There are a lot of people who have paid a lot of money walking out. The Villa fans are voting with their feet. I haven't seen anything like this before at Villa.
"I remember the demonstrations against Doug Ellis, but he must seem a great chairman in retrospect. This is the worst team I've seen in 41 years of reporting on Villa, simple as that."
Absolutely well done to everyone involved
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Whether you are out the door on 74 or stay behind to sing and make noise against the owner you are doing something.
There was a little murmuring about being "the true fans" by a couple of lads by me but I applauded those who walked and then sang out my displeasure for the rest of the match and shall do so for the rest of this miserable season.
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I was surprised so many were still in the ground after the team managed 300 seconds before folding again. Shame on them. Respect for the 30,000 who still turn up.
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A good video in this article which gives a general feel of the atmosphere last night.
http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/aston-villa-fc/2016/03/02/watch-fans-out-the-door-on-74-as-villa-strugglers-fail-again/
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Hadn't planned to before the game, but ended up doing the 74th minute walkout. My mate wanted to leave when their 3rd went in, but I said wait until the 74th as it will be more powerful if everyone leaves at the same time. Reports that it was around 2,000 that left on 74, I'd guess at least 90% of these were from the Holte.
One thing I will say is it got widespread media coverage and is today, on driving in to work it was mentioned on Radio 1 during the Sport, and on regional stations Free Radio and Capital it was mentioned during their morning shows.
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OK, so I was generally against the demo. But at three nil down began to think I hope it's a success.
It was and there's obviously been a lot of publicity. The solidarity from the Everton fans was fantastic and we should remember that. I can't see how it will change Lerner's current stance one bit, but if he was under any illusions that we were ok with how he has run the club he's not now.
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The TV cameras seem to like showing random people holding the Lerner out scarves, the ones with the American flag crossed out on one end, and the Union Jack on the other, above their head. Noticed it on Saturday and again tonight.
But the point is he wants out! So those who bought these things are just wasting their money. Are they selling them in the club shop? It could be that nobody wants to buy the club a position that WBA and Wolves also find themselves in. I think we are stuck with him and his harsh costcutters. Its all very sad.
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I was surprised so many were still in the ground after the team managed 300 seconds before folding again. Shame on them. Respect for the 30,000 who still turn up.
There weren't 30k - 25k max
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The TV cameras seem to like showing random people holding the Lerner out scarves, the ones with the American flag crossed out on one end, and the Union Jack on the other, above their head. Noticed it on Saturday and again tonight.
But the point is he wants out! So those who bought these things are just wasting their money. Are they selling them in the club shop? It could be that nobody wants to buy the club a position that WBA and Wolves also find themselves in. I think we are stuck with him and his harsh costcutters. Its all very sad.
To be honest I'm sick of hearing, reading people saying " but he wants out" Somebody posted a brilliant analogy on here which likened the protest to pacing round a waiting room waiting for a Dr to arrive. It won't make him come any quicker but it sure as hell makes you feel better. If it can encourage Lerner to drop his price or even invest properly in the Championship then it has to be a good thing.
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The TV cameras seem to like showing random people holding the Lerner out scarves, the ones with the American flag crossed out on one end, and the Union Jack on the other, above their head. Noticed it on Saturday and again tonight.
But the point is he wants out! So those who bought these things are just wasting their money. Are they selling them in the club shop? It could be that nobody wants to buy the club a position that WBA and Wolves also find themselves in. I think we are stuck with him and his harsh costcutters. Its all very sad.
To be honest I'm sick of hearing, reading people saying " but he wants out" Somebody posted a brilliant analogy on here which likened the protest to pacing round a waiting room waiting for a Dr to arrive. It won't make him come any quicker but it sure as hell makes you feel better. If it can encourage Lerner to drop his price or even invest properly in the Championship then it has to be a good thing.
Human beings need to take control of their lives or they experience stress - these actions can be symbolic and have just as much effect as those that bring about concrete change - this is about us as fans doing what we have to do so we can survive this shit as it is about getting rid of the Board
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Action is better than inaction.
http://www.myoldmansaid.com/supporter-charter-improve-aston-villa-football-club/
Not sure if this has been posted, but other fan groups are trying to structure the protests so they have a tangible goal.
Whilst everyone will not agree on all the points, it is a good start.
I particularly applaud the recommendation for reduced prices for long suffering season ticket holders.
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Randy said he was a custodian - would be nice to mock this somehow in the protests?
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We all throw custard on the pitch?
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We all throw custard on the pitch?
Fits doubly with the Lerner as clown motif!
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This has been covered quite a few times on Five Live this morning and covered in respect to being a protest against Lerner. I didn't think it would but well done to all concerned.
I'm still not sure it'll make a shit of difference to RL but its good to vent your spleen.
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This has been covered quite a few times on Five Live this morning and covered in respect to being a protest against Lerner. I didn't think it would but well done to all concerned.
I'm still not sure it'll make a shit of difference to RL but its good to vent your spleen.
Yes, this.
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This has been covered quite a few times on Five Live this morning and covered in respect to being a protest against Lerner. I didn't think it would but well done to all concerned.
I'm still not sure it'll make a shit of difference to RL but its good to vent your spleen.
It's also being reported on SSN every hour, with video of the actual protest and subsequent walk-out.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
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Is it more to do with the poor management of the club and lack of direction that people are protesting at, rather than wanting Lerner out?
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Is it more to do with the poor management of the club and lack of direction that people are protesting at, rather than wanting Lerner out?
Randy Lerner = poor management and lack of direction. To have the former is to have the latter. After ten years of catastrophic mismanagement, I think we can safely say this is true.
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Turns out the fans do know who Tom Fox is as well judging by the chants.
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Yes we all know that Lerner wants to sell but can't. However not facing up to his responsibility is the issue here. Turn up for games, face the music and actually look like you care and admit we are all in the shit but at least try and do something/ anything about it. Instead he has chosen to run the other way.If your life was in danger you wouldn't want him as your last hope.
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Is it more to do with the poor management of the club and lack of direction that people are protesting at, rather than wanting Lerner out?
That's harder to put into song though
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Is it more to do with the poor management of the club and lack of direction that people are protesting at, rather than wanting Lerner out?
That's harder to put into song though
I mean that some on here repeatedly remind others that Randy already wants out, like it's an excuse for the way he's handles us (or not).
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Well done to all who walked out but it's not enough.
We need to get the whole ground virtually empty, it doesn't matter what minute symbolically it is, from the first minute would be better.
Just don't go at all.
I was there at the Preston game, it needs to go further before we force this regime out of Villa for ever once and for all, and believe me it's going to get a whole load worse, as it did then, but eventually we came back stronger.
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Any attention it brings to the total mismanagement that has taken place under Lerner's tenure is a worthy cause, whether that be by singing, black balloons (still my favorite), walks outs, whatever, if it allows the anger of the fans to be vented that is a good thing, but I would change the words to the following
We want Lerner out, Randy Lerner out,
I don't think he gives a fuck,
from relegation fights to relegation rites,
Randy Lerner's not our man.
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Keeping it simple how about...
Where the fuck is randy Lerner. Where the fuck is randy Lerner.
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Remember that although he wants out, he has form for changing his mind if things start to look better (like when we made a cup final last year & he was no longer a 'motivated seller') and that he could decide to hold on here, in the hope of promotion straight back next season, to minimise his losses.
Whilst I remain wary of who we might end up with if he sells us quick & cheap, I have actually moved into the camp of seeing no harm in encouraging him on his way......
....and I like the song!
....but I'm still staying rather than walking.
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I have no issues with the people walking out. Fair play.
I travel a decent distance and I'm not keen on missing a minute of the game, let alone 21 as it turned out, bu there was good numbers who did leave.
I too like the anti-Lerner song, as it builds up and can be pretty loud. Last night was probably the loudest B6 has been all season!
I'm glad Fox copped some flack too. I hope he found it uncomfortable, 10,000 calling him a wanker and I hope he feels less and less comfortable for the remaining two months of the season.
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"'Wanker'. So, that's, like, a good word, right?"
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Stick your shirt deal up your arse.
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Keeping it simple how about...
Where the fuck is randy Lerner. Where the fuck is randy Lerner.
That sounds like we want him here, but we don't.
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If success is measured by publicity then it's achieved something. It's been mentioned on five live sport in the last two bulletins and there's a story about it on Skysports.
I didn't go so i don't know how many took part but the media don't care if it was a modest amount taking part. They love to report a footy protest.
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The coverage of the walkout on Central News tonight was excellent.
It showed the protest was really well supported.
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Keep it simple and clear.
Proud history
No future
Repeat.
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The seemingly spontaneous rendition of "the greatest team ever seen" was very loud - all we need to do is get the two sides of the ground involved even if it is just clapping - some Lower Trinity went mad and clapped during the Norwich game 'cos I saw 'em!
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Black balloons released on the 10th minute? Enough to stop the game?
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The seemingly spontaneous rendition of "the greatest team ever seen" was very loud - all we need to do is get the two sides of the ground involved even if it is just clapping - some Lower Trinity went mad and clapped during the Norwich game 'cos I saw 'em!
When we sing this when we are crap, it feels like we are reminding the team who they are supposed to be.
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I saw highlights on a foreign channel the commentator summed the walk out well, "not on mass, but significant"
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I think at some point in the game we should all chant "USA! USA!"
That'll confuse the fuckers.
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Can we all just dress entirely in black for the remainder of the season?
We are mourning the loss of our club. Our club, not his.
Out the door on 74.
Dress in black.
Get Villa back.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
I'm not sure I'd be able to stop at that AJ. The players and running of the club has been a shower of shit. Even the pundits are feeling sorry for us.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
Or my suggestion of growing up.
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Not joining in with the "throw some wee on seventy-three" campaign, then?
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I understand Fox likes to watch the match from the directors suite which is that strange parapet style thing on the corner of the Holte and Trinity.
Whilst not advocating a mass trespass up the outside steps maybe a mass paper plane initiative thrown right at the middle tier with words to the effect 'For Fox sake, do one "
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Not joining in with the "throw some wee on seventy-three" campaign, then?
Bottle of u-rine on fifty-nine? Chuck some poo on eighty-two?
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If we was formed in 1801
We could walk out in the first minute
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74th second close enough?
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Here's an idea that doesn't involve anything illegal, and doesn't involve boycotting games: On the 74th minute every single Villa fan in the ground stands up and turns their back on the pitch. We then have a minutes silence for the death of a great football club.
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We're not supposed to stand!
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Turning your back for a minute or 2 before raising merry hell by way of support is a much better protest.
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Turning your back for a minute or 2 before raising merry hell by way of support is a much better protest.
Requires mass participation, and is therefore a non-starter.
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Who the fuck wants to watch us anyway? It would be blessed relief.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
Do they still sell Aston Manor cider?
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Not joining in with the "throw some wee on seventy-three" campaign, then?
Bottle of u-rine on fifty-nine? Chuck some poo on eighty-two?
Throw a turd when we concede a third.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
Do they still sell Aston Manor cider?
yes its called frosty jack and sold in all Iceland stores
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
Do they still sell Aston Manor cider?
yes its called frosty jack and sold in all Iceland stores
Bet it goes down very easily.
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Walking out doesn't seem enough. I am so angry with this shambles.
There's always my suggestion of throwing a bottle of piss at Fox.
Do they still sell Aston Manor cider?
yes its called frosty jack and sold in all Iceland stores
Bet it goes down very easily.
Easier than the Villa.
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I'll be doing this again at the weekend. May as well, would rather not see all of the game, beat a lot of the traffic and make a small stand with however many other hundreds or thousands join in.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
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I would sooner the demand was for investment while selling (he is already selling) but it seems like a nice venting of anger. Cant blame them for that.
The current statement pretty much just abuses the man then says he just needs to publicly say again he is selling at a decent price. If he did respond like they demand I cant see how fans would be any happier to be honest.
He blew it in January and rightfully receives criticism for it (along with the rest of the board). The next opportunity for Randy to do anything is the summer window. I would sooner they were demanding that.
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I am generally very supportive of those that have made the effort to co-ordinate these protests, heaven knows we've all had enough of this tripe, but I'm still not convinced I can bring myself to walk out on 74 minutes.
Personally, I thought the banging of empty seats was a very poignant and effective signal of discontent, and goes hand in hand with those that do leave on 74. Is there any plan to co-ordinate something, or was this just a spontaneous response? Apologies if this has already been covered earlier in the thread
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I would like to see some mass vocal abuse of our shit players. Fuck it! Can't you all give them some fucking stick? The arrogant useless c***s!
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Hi all. I am one of the fans behind the out the door on 74 campaign and the recent open letter. I have been meaning to come on here for a while to engage with you and get your feelings on the walkouts, good and bad, but as I am sure you are aware these things take some organising and having the time to come on here as been difficult to find.
If any of you have any questions, concerns or would just like to offer support then it would be good to hear your feelings. I have had a quick scan through the thread and as has been the feedback in general it is pretty mixed it seems.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
I'm not sure how effective their 74th-minute protest will be, but they've written a very good letter, particularly when they describe the helpless anguish of the fans. I suspect, though, that it's one of many that Lerner has received. Does he even read them, let alone take them seriously?
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I would like to see some mass vocal abuse of our shit players. Fuck it! Can't you all give them some fucking stick? The arrogant useless c***s!
They are next in line after Lerner and Fox get both barrels again. It was noticeable that when the crowd got going with their anti Lerner chant against Everton the performance on the pitch improved, or perhaps Everton just eased up at 3-0?
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is always in the mainstream media - this isn't which is precisely the aim of these protests.
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Nice to see the Chelsea supporters supporting the protest tonight, lot of them left early tonight.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is always in the mainstream media - this isn't which is precisely the aim of these protests.
Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
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Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
Dave these walkouts/protests come with specific actions, as shown in the open letter to Randy Lerner, that we are asking him to undertake.
Firstly that Randy becomes a more motivated seller and prices the club at a level it will sell and also ensures the person or persons he sells to have the where with all and vision to restore it to at the very least a club that can hold its own in the top flight. In the mean time we are calling on Lerner to commit to invest in the squad and to ensure people are brought in above the manager who have the expertise and experience and who know what tools are required for a manager to succeed. Until we get these appointments right we will continue to fail to employ a manager who is capable of realising the clubs potential or who will have the means to do so.
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Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
Dave these walkouts/protests come with specific actions, as shown in the open letter to Randy Lerner, that we are asking him to undertake.
Firstly that Randy becomes a more motivated seller and prices the club at a level it will sell and also ensures the person or persons he sells to have the where with all and vision to restore it to at the very least a club that can hold its own in the top flight. In the mean time we are calling on Lerner to commit to invest in the squad and to ensure people are brought in above the manager who have the expertise and experience and who know what tools are required for a manager to succeed. Until we get these appointments right we will continue to fail to employ a manager who is capable of realising the clubs potential or who will have the means to do so.
Which is all well and good, but how exactly are you going to get him to do all that?
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Chinese burn.
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Well I'm all for the protests of all kinds and if it gets any media coverage then brilliant.
Better then sitting on your Arse and doing fuck all .
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Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
Dave these walkouts/protests come with specific actions, as shown in the open letter to Randy Lerner, that we are asking him to undertake.
Firstly that Randy becomes a more motivated seller and prices the club at a level it will sell and also ensures the person or persons he sells to have the where with all and vision to restore it to at the very least a club that can hold its own in the top flight. In the mean time we are calling on Lerner to commit to invest in the squad and to ensure people are brought in above the manager who have the expertise and experience and who know what tools are required for a manager to succeed. Until we get these appointments right we will continue to fail to employ a manager who is capable of realising the clubs potential or who will have the means to do so.
Might want to call that out a bit more in future statements. I think thats very important indeed and does not come across in the Mail piece. Just fyi. Good luck, I hope something comes of it!
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
I think they effectively want him to give the club away.
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An open fucking letter.
The self-important twats.
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Well I'm all for the protests of all kinds and if it gets any media coverage then brilliant.
Better then sitting on your Arse and doing fuck all .
Agreed.
What else is there?
Keep taking it up the council-gritter?
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Well I'm all for the protests of all kinds and if it gets any media coverage then brilliant.
Better then sitting on your Arse and doing fuck all .
Agreed.
What else is there?
Keep taking it up the council-gritter?
or the Gary
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so until they wrote the letter no one knew what a clusterfuck the club was?
walkouts, black balloons, tennis balls whatever all highligts we are not happy but a letter to the owner saying we are shit what are you going to do will acheve sod all. we already know he isnt a commited seller and he hasnt got a clue when it comes to running a football club and as much as we may hate it as the owner he can do whatever he feels like which is exactly what he is doing.
the only thing he will notice is people not renewing and buying merchandise
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Why are open letters always so long?
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Because they won't fit in an envelope. That's why they're open.
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The people who wrote that letter have done more than I have so I ain't criticising them. They may not have a 4 step master plan, or even a 5 year plan ( remember them?) but raising the general awareness of our shiteness is only a positive.
I know Randy isn't going to sell on the back of a letter to the Mail but every little step helps. Hollis - who is used to dealing with basket cases, and who will logically be painting as dark a picture as possible - will be communicating the full extent of the clusterfuck to Lerner Towers methinks.
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Which is all well and good, but how exactly are you going to get him to do all that?
By applying pressure. We’d hope that by staging these walkouts it continues to bring negative media attention. Puts the focus very much on Lerner. We saw after the Everton game every match report was heavily focussed on the walkouts. The walkouts come accompanied with a message which is clearly spelt out in the open letter.
We are not naive enough to believe these walkouts will definitely have a positive impact. What I would say though is that at least by trying to get a message heard there is a chance it will be. By doing nothing it will never be heard.
I think many would agree we have let Lerner off the hook really. We have allowed, even assisted him, in continually making managers scapegoats. The bigger issue though, and the main constant, over the last 6 years of decline has been Lerner. His failure to appoint people above the manager with the relevant nous, experience and where with all has meant that we have made some very strange managerial appointments. Until we get these positions right at the club we will never employ a manager good enough to bring us relative success, or even if we do, allow him the tools to carry out his job successfully.
I think really the best outcome for all would be for Lerner to become a more motivated seller and to sell the club. You can’t force him to do that though but for however long he remains he has to over the summer commit to invest in the squad because this squad is not good enough to gain promotion and he must ensure we have the right people on the board who can ensure that investment isn’t wasted and who have the nous to ensure the right manager is brought in.
I don’t think as a fan base we can afford to sit by idly and just assume those at the club know what they are doing because they have continually shown they don’t. This is a massive few months for us coming up. We get things wrong and we could well be looking at years of stagnation in the Championship or worse still could drop again.
I know a lot of fans don’t agree with this form of protest. All I would say is if that you feel you have some better ideas then act on them. We also intend to look at other means of protest following these walkouts. We have to do something though. We have to try to get a message heard even if the chances of it being heard and acted upon are slim.
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Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
Dave these walkouts/protests come with specific actions, as shown in the open letter to Randy Lerner, that we are asking him to undertake.
Firstly that Randy becomes a more motivated seller and prices the club at a level it will sell and also ensures the person or persons he sells to have the where with all and vision to restore it to at the very least a club that can hold its own in the top flight.
Out of interest, how much do you think is a reasonable selling price? Also, I'd say the second point is the most important thing of all.
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Hi all. I am one of the fans behind the out the door on 74 campaign and the recent open letter. I have been meaning to come on here for a while to engage with you and get your feelings on the walkouts, good and bad, but as I am sure you are aware these things take some organising and having the time to come on here as been difficult to find.
If any of you have any questions, concerns or would just like to offer support then it would be good to hear your feelings. I have had a quick scan through the thread and as has been the feedback in general it is pretty mixed it seems.
There's been a very predictable response from some Villa fans to this. I won't be sneering at these protests, even though I don't think a walkout is the most effective way of protesting. Because of the fractious nature of Villa fans, you need mass participation for a walkout to be truly successful (although I was surprised at the positive media coverage of the Everton walkout). Also, the events of a match could possibly work against future walkouts - who knows, we might even be drawing a game on 74 minutes?
I think whatever further action you decide to take, you need to take into account the fact that Villa fans will never act en masse unless we're winning. We are too divided. Whatever you do will need to be effective with a relatively small number of participants.
The Borussia Dortmund tennis ball protest was an excellent example of this. It's been suggested on here that fans throw their Bright Future scarves on the pitch just after kick-off. Or towels, after all, the club threw the towel in at the end of January. Anyone can bring an old tea-towel in the ground. The idea would be that, in stopping the game, you would demonstrate that fans have at least some power and influence over on-pitch matters. And you'd only need a few hundred fans to take part.
Well done for actually doing something, though. There's so much apathy around Villa Park - from the owner and board, to the players on the pitch - so it's great to see at least some fans taking a stand. And as for the notion that you're doing this just to get your faces in the media - are people really serious? I'm sure there are much less risky ways of doing that than protests which could easily fail and make you look stupid.
One thing's for sure, being passive and doing nothing but sneering at fellow Villa fans will achieve precisely nothing. And even if your actions don't achieve anything tangible, at least you've registered your displeasure, got something off your chests, and shown the media that you will not sit idly by while your club is destroyed from the inside. If all you can do is apply pressure, channel anger, and raise awareness, then that is good enough.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
To get Lerner to sell the club....or at least get his asking price reduced so more interested parties come forward. (Although relegation will probably accelerate that).
There have been examples recently, Steve Morgan sold up at Wolves partly it seems due to fan abuse.
http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2015/10/07/abuse-from-fans-cited-for-wolves-sale/
I'm sure the very negative atmosphere developing on matchdays is being fed back to him in the States from Fox and co...."Sir, Sir they're calling me a W^^ker!"
I'm not saying it will be the sole reason but I think it could help speed things up a bit.
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
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Their aim is to get into the papers? If so, well done them.
Dave these walkouts/protests come with specific actions, as shown in the open letter to Randy Lerner, that we are asking him to undertake.
Firstly that Randy becomes a more motivated seller and prices the club at a level it will sell and also ensures the person or persons he sells to have the where with all and vision to restore it to at the very least a club that can hold its own in the top flight.
Out of interest, how much do you think is a reasonable selling price? Also, I'd say the second point is the most important thing of all.
Who knows? I know he paid 67million so I guess for a club in total turmoil and hurtling towards relegation he should be happy to sell for say 100 million. As for the 74 protesters I say good luck to them. At least they are doing something instead of just sitting around moaning. We all want this situation sorted for the love of our proud football club.
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
I never said I agreed with the open letter strategy, the walkouts and any other ground protests like using the bright future scarves are fine by me though.
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Hi all. I am one of the fans behind the out the door on 74 campaign and the recent open letter. I have been meaning to come on here for a while to engage with you and get your feelings on the walkouts, good and bad, but as I am sure you are aware these things take some organising and having the time to come on here as been difficult to find.
If any of you have any questions, concerns or would just like to offer support then it would be good to hear your feelings. I have had a quick scan through the thread and as has been the feedback in general it is pretty mixed it seems.
There's been a very predictable response from some Villa fans to this. I won't be sneering at these protests, even though I don't think a walkout is the most effective way of protesting. Because of the fractious nature of Villa fans, you need mass participation for a walkout to be truly successful (although I was surprised at the positive media coverage of the Everton walkout). Also, the events of a match could possibly work against future walkouts - who knows, we might even be drawing a game on 74 minutes?
I think whatever further action you decide to take, you need to take into account the fact that Villa fans will never act en masse unless we're winning. We are too divided. Whatever you do will need to be effective with a relatively small number of participants.
The Borussia Dortmund tennis ball protest was an excellent example of this. It's been suggested on here that fans throw their Bright Future scarves on the pitch just after kick-off. Or towels, after all, the club threw the towel in at the end of January. Anyone can bring an old tea-towel in the ground. The idea would be that, in stopping the game, you would demonstrate that fans have at least some power and influence over on-pitch matters. And you'd only need a few hundred fans to take part.
Well done for actually doing something, though. There's so much apathy around Villa Park - from the owner and board, to the players on the pitch - so it's great to see at least some fans taking a stand. And as for the notion that you're doing this just to get your faces in the media - are people really serious? I'm sure there are much less risky ways of doing that than protests which could easily fail and make you look stupid.
One thing's for sure, being passive and doing nothing but sneering at fellow Villa fans will achieve precisely nothing. And even if your actions don't achieve anything tangible, at least you've registered your displeasure, got something off your chests, and shown the media that you will not sit idly by while your club is destroyed from the inside. If all you can do is apply pressure, channel anger, and raise awareness, then that is good enough.
Spot on mate. I 100% agree with your post.
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Good luck to anyone who gets off their arses to make themselves heard.
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Good luck to anyone who gets off their arses to make themselves heard.
Indeed, and I thought the letter was very good.
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
It's not actually that long-winded. There's a lot to complain about, isn't there?
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
It's not actually that long-winded. There's a lot to complain about, isn't there?
It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
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It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
Dave that is fair enough. Feedback in the main to the open letter has been very positive from supporters. There is a lot that needs to be put to Randy and to do that was always going to require a substantial letter. It has already been reported on in the local and national press and with letter being relatively substantial it has helped publicise/draw attention to the issues at the club.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise. What we are asking of Randy Lerner is not something that cannot be achieved or asking him to go the extra mile. We are asking him, if he stays, to simply ensure that people with the proven expertise and experience are brought onto the board as that way we give ourselves the best chance of employing a manager that can bring us relative success. If he does stay he will also need to invest over the summer as only a fool would suggest we can get promotion with these players.
I think it would be best for all concerned if Randy did motivate himself to sell. His heart is clearly not in Aston Villa any more and we deserve better than that.
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I think that the walkout went well last time and I hope it succeeds in future. It might not do much aside from venting our spleen but that can't be a bad thing.
However, I can't see anything short of complete boycott of tickets, attendance and merchandise making any difference to the sale of the club.
I'm not a great fan of open letters (even when I agree with the most of it) purely because they are always long winded, preach to the converted and lose their point in ire.
Anyone who has sat through a powerpoint presentation will testify that a few bullet points speak a 1000 words.
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Maybe if Mr Lerner hadn't turned into a hermit there would be no need for such actions as the fans would know what is going on. It's the feeling of helplessness and despair that has prompted the letter and the protests. I'm totally behind anything that highlights our feelings towards the plight of our club and the deafening silence from our current "custodian"
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It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
Dave that is fair enough. Feedback in the main to the open letter has been very positive from supporters. There is a lot that needs to be put to Randy and to do that was always going to require a substantial letter. It has already been reported on in the local and national press and with letter being relatively substantial it has helped publicise/draw attention to the issues at the club.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise. What we are asking of Randy Lerner is not something that cannot be achieved or asking him to go the extra mile. We are asking him, if he stays, to simply ensure that people with the proven expertise and experience are brought onto the board as that way we give ourselves the best chance of employing a manager that can bring us relative success. If he does stay he will also need to invest over the summer as only a fool would suggest we can get promotion with these players.
I think it would be best for all concerned if Randy did motivate himself to sell. His heart is clearly not in Aston Villa any more and we deserve better than that.
"We deserve better than that"
Hear Hear.
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
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It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
Dave that is fair enough. Feedback in the main to the open letter has been very positive from supporters. There is a lot that needs to be put to Randy and to do that was always going to require a substantial letter. It has already been reported on in the local and national press and with letter being relatively substantial it has helped publicise/draw attention to the issues at the club.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise. What we are asking of Randy Lerner is not something that cannot be achieved or asking him to go the extra mile. We are asking him, if he stays, to simply ensure that people with the proven expertise and experience are brought onto the board as that way we give ourselves the best chance of employing a manager that can bring us relative success. If he does stay he will also need to invest over the summer as only a fool would suggest we can get promotion with these players.
I think it would be best for all concerned if Randy did motivate himself to sell. His heart is clearly not in Aston Villa any more and we deserve better than that.
"We deserve better than that"
Hear Hear.
Too bloody right we do!
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
It's not actually that long-winded. There's a lot to complain about, isn't there?
It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
We could keep this going forever if that's what you want - so I'll disagree with you again and reiterate that there's a lot to complain about. Your turn.
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I’m not going to convince you Dave clearly. What I would say is we are just a small group of normal fans who go to work every day and are spending our spare time organising this campaign. We aren't going to get everything right. Not even close. If others feel they can help including yourself then we would welcome the input.
To those of you who are being supportive thank you. I know even some of those who support it aren’t 100% with what we are doing but doing something has to be better than doing what we have done for the last 6 years of decline which is nothing other than to call for another manager to be sacked. All that has done though is to take the focus off Lerner as we have all thought just maybe the next manager will get things right. Some of the managerial choices though have been very strange and this is down to the likes of Faulkner and Fox simply not having the knowledge/experience required to undertake the role of CEO. If we had better people on the board with the proven expertise in terms of running a football club I am confident we would have employed a manager and allowed him the tools, that meant armed the amount of money that has been spent, could have at least kept us competitive in the top flight.
The blame though ultimately sits with Lerner as he has employed the likes of Faulkner and Fox. Now we have Hollis running the club a guy who openly admits he had never had any interest in getting involved with a football club and now finds himself running one.
If Lerner is to remain it is crucial he gets the appointments above the manager right otherwise we will never employ a manager who can get things right on the pitch.
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If you want to succeed it's probably not a good idea to publish a long-winded criticism that goes on to make demands before finishing off with veiled threats.
It's not actually that long-winded. There's a lot to complain about, isn't there?
It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
We could keep this going forever if that's what you want - so I'll disagree with you again and reiterate that there's a lot to complain about. Your turn.
As I said above - there's no point in going over old ground and saying the same thing a hundred times. No more turns.
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Long as you get the last one, eh? Twas ever thus.
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I’m not going to convince you Dave clearly. What I would say is we are just a small group of normal fans who go to work every day and are spending our spare time organising this campaign. We aren't going to get everything right. Not even close. If others feel they can help including yourself then we would welcome the input.
To those of you who are being supportive thank you. I know even some of those who support it aren’t 100% with what we are doing but doing something has to be better than doing what we have done for the last 6 years of decline which is nothing other than to call for another manager to be sacked. All that has done though is to take the focus off Lerner as we have all thought just maybe the next manager will get things right. Some of the managerial choices though have been very strange and this is down to the likes of Faulkner and Fox simply not having the knowledge/experience required to undertake the role of CEO. If we had better people on the board with the proven expertise in terms of running a football club I am confident we would have employed a manager and allowed him the tools, that meant armed the amount of money that has been spent, could have at least kept us competitive in the top flight.
The blame though ultimately sits with Lerner as he has employed the likes of Faulkner and Fox. Now we have Hollis running the club a guy who openly admits he had never had any interest in getting involved with a football club and now finds himself running one.
If Lerner is to remain it is crucial he gets the appointments above the manager right otherwise we will never employ a manager who can get things right on the pitch.
The lack of football knowledge is something I totally agree with - and have been saying so since the day Lerner arrived. There is just one thing, and it's a point you've touched on here which hasn't been cleared up. Who is running the club; Fox or Hollis? CEO or chairman? Who reports to who? That's one point which could be asked and answered immediately if they have the will.
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Long as you get the last one, eh? Twas ever thus.
Absolutely but you missed out the bit about cliques and making money from Villa fans.
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
I think thats a bit unfair, you've kind of pulled markavfc40 into saying something like that by accusing him of making veiled threats. Plus I reckon one can come up with a lot of old claptrap in boardrooms and be taken seriously. They're full of it. So a mild cliche saying you are promising action when accused of veiled threats is probably ok..... Also the facebook likes and that type of support help to give this action some momentum which in turn may be taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Probably won't affect anything but folk want to do something, anything. The feeling of helplessness as Villa get relegated is one of the toughest parts of all of this.
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
I think thats a bit unfair, you've kind of pulled markavfc40 into saying something like that by accusing him of making veiled threats. Plus I reckon one can come up with a lot of old claptrap in boardrooms and be taken seriously. They're full of it. So a mild cliche saying you are promising action when accused of veiled threats is probably ok..... Also the facebook likes and that type of support help to give this action some momentum which in turn may be taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Probably won't affect anything but folk want to do something, anything. The feeling of helplessness as Villa get relegated is one of the toughest parts of all of this.
I didn't pull him into anything - he was the one who said it in the first place. What I did say is what I stick by, and it's something that is an increasing feature of modern life. Do you want to protest for the sake of it, to do "something" or do you want to effect real change? If it's the former then go ahead, but the latter takes careful consideration of everything you say and do.
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Long as you get the last one, eh? Twas ever thus.
Absolutely but you missed out the bit about cliques and making money from Villa fans.
I have never accused you of either of those. Check your facts before making accusations like that, it's not appreciated and does you no credit.
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Long as you get the last one, eh? Twas ever thus.
Absolutely but you missed out the bit about cliques and making money from Villa fans.
I have never accused you of either of those. Check your facts before making accusations like that, it's not appreciated and does you no credit.
If you want an argument, please go somewhere else for one. The last word stuff usually goes hand in hand with the rest - apologies if you weren't aware of that.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
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I didn't pull him into anything - he was the one who said it in the first place. What I did say is what I stick by, and it's something that is an increasing feature of modern life. Do you want to protest for the sake of it, to do "something" or do you want to effect real change? If it's the former then go ahead, but the latter takes careful consideration of everything you say and do.
The aim here is quite clear (albeit a little long winded as has been said) so its not just a protest for the sake of it. The message to Lerner is - You said if you couldn't make it work you would move on but the last comment attributed to you on the issue of selling is that you are not a motivated seller. Given the incompetence on and off the pitch these 2 messages seem to contradict each other. So tell us, are you selling or what?
So the protest itself may not effect real change but it can play a part...And then Lerner sells... Inevitably we are sold at a cut-price leaving us exposed to all sorts of crooks, chancers and parasites. A few years down the line we'll be traipsing around in Villa shirts with 'Mark-One' emblazoned across the chest with an idiot manager whose main tactic is to p*ss in each corner of the pitch before the game.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
Then I'll agree with this.
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Sooner or later things are going to come to a head at Villa, and we might reflect that a peaceful protest with fans united against the destruction of the club was the better option.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-protest-group-write-11016668#nav-panel
each to their own and fair play for doing something but what is this going to achieve?
I've seen it reported in mainstream media so its achieving more than doing nothing.
Tomorrow's weather forecast is in the mainstream media. I still don't know what the ultimate aim of these protests is.
To get Lerner to sell the club....or at least get his asking price reduced so more interested parties come forward. (Although relegation will probably accelerate that).
There have been examples recently, Steve Morgan sold up at Wolves partly it seems due to fan abuse.
http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2015/10/07/abuse-from-fans-cited-for-wolves-sale/
I'm sure the very negative atmosphere developing on matchdays is being fed back to him in the States from Fox and co...."Sir, Sir they're calling me a W^^ker!"
I'm not saying it will be the sole reason but I think it could help speed things up a bit.
Steve Morgan hasn't sold up at Wolves. He still owns Wolves. You have to get a buyer first before you can sell up. Randy is in the same boat.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
"morons" is too strong a word to use without being offensive. Incompetents would be more suitable.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
Then I'll agree with this.
Sorry, qualification: no violence, as this would be wrong and totally counterproductive.
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Sooner or later things are going to come to a head at Villa, and we might reflect that a peaceful protest with fans united against the destruction of the club was the better option.
A co-ordinated protest would be excellent but it seems there are too many factions within the Villa Park faithful to agree on one single mode of attack.
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Well done and good luck to Markavfc40 and co. I find it sad that so many fellow Villa fans cant wait to criticise those who are actually getting up and trying to do something about the state of our club.
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It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
Dave that is fair enough. Feedback in the main to the open letter has been very positive from supporters. There is a lot that needs to be put to Randy and to do that was always going to require a substantial letter. It has already been reported on in the local and national press and with letter being relatively substantial it has helped publicise/draw attention to the issues at the club.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise. What we are asking of Randy Lerner is not something that cannot be achieved or asking him to go the extra mile. We are asking him, if he stays, to simply ensure that people with the proven expertise and experience are brought onto the board as that way we give ourselves the best chance of employing a manager that can bring us relative success. If he does stay he will also need to invest over the summer as only a fool would suggest we can get promotion with these players.
I think it would be best for all concerned if Randy did motivate himself to sell. His heart is clearly not in Aston Villa any more and we deserve better than that.
I agree with the aims and aspirations of the protest, but in respect of the letters, Dave is right.
You need your message to be succinct. You focus on the big ticket item and you hammer it home and remember that a letter is not a statement of case.
It may be worth seeing if there is a solicitor within you midst that you could chuck the next letter too to eviscerate the cliches and superfluous paragraphs.
I very much like the idea of throwing the towel in though.
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It actually is incredibly long, and while there might be plenty to complain about, putting everything down at once obscures your message. Never use ten words when one will do.
Dave that is fair enough. Feedback in the main to the open letter has been very positive from supporters. There is a lot that needs to be put to Randy and to do that was always going to require a substantial letter. It has already been reported on in the local and national press and with letter being relatively substantial it has helped publicise/draw attention to the issues at the club.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise. What we are asking of Randy Lerner is not something that cannot be achieved or asking him to go the extra mile. We are asking him, if he stays, to simply ensure that people with the proven expertise and experience are brought onto the board as that way we give ourselves the best chance of employing a manager that can bring us relative success. If he does stay he will also need to invest over the summer as only a fool would suggest we can get promotion with these players.
I think it would be best for all concerned if Randy did motivate himself to sell. His heart is clearly not in Aston Villa any more and we deserve better than that.
I agree with the aims and aspirations of the protest, but in respect of the letters, Dave is right.
You need your message to be succinct. You focus on the big ticket item and you hammer it home and remember that a letter is not a statement of case.
It may be worth seeing if there is a solicitor within you midst that you could chuck the next letter too to eviscerate the cliches and superfluous paragraphs.
I very much like the idea of throwing the towel in though.
Don't we charge by the word anymore? I must be older than I thought.
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the accounts are out. Appalling - £27 million loss, revenue down, staff costs up, Fox gets a big increase in wages for 2014 15
Its time to meet and plan. The era of hoping protests will by themselves work is over. There is no lack of action at the moment, the latest is the self style Protest Group, who wrote a letter to Lerner Nice Letter
What do they plan to do about his response or non response?
In the old days before Lerner, there would be a fan meeting. Why not now? A pity the AVISA independent supporters association was closed down. We had no problem calling meetings. Alas my generation is now too old, but can still support younger people
Trevor Fisher
ex Vice Chair AVISA
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I reckon we should start more threads.
Archbishop Herbert Cockthrottle
News at Ten
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I'm right behind the OTD O74 protests because they are, at least, showing Randy Lerner that the fans have had enough of the way he has run Villa up to now. If the protests can somehow represent a line in the sand and become a huge catalyst for change and future success at Villa Park then it will all be worth it. At the moment I don't see any mixed messages coming from OTD, everything they have published sits well with me. Randy now needs to come out and communicate clearly with the fans. If he is not selling, he needs to explore all avenues that could help to re-ignite/reboot the Club. The OTD protests give me just a little hope that we can turn a calamitous moment in the history of Villa into something positive, unique and groundbreaking.
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the accounts are out. Appalling - £27 million loss, revenue down, staff costs up, Fox gets a big increase in wages for 2014 15
Its time to meet and plan. The era of hoping protests will by themselves work is over. There is no lack of action at the moment, the latest is the self style Protest Group, who wrote a letter to Lerner Nice Letter
What do they plan to do about his response or non response?
In the old days before Lerner, there would be a fan meeting. Why not now? A pity the AVISA independent supporters association was closed down. We had no problem calling meetings. Alas my generation is now too old, but can still support younger people
Trevor Fisher
ex Vice Chair AVISA
On the accounts, agreed on the loss it's bad news and a lot worse than I think most of us hoped. However, turnover has remained pretty much static (£115m v £116m last year), and Fox didn't have an increase in wages, that was his wage from his first employment commencing November 2014.
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Trevor, you and I go back to AVISA days, but let’s be frank here, we may have been organized but we didn’t really have a coherent strategy back then, just enthusiasm. I simply fail to see how any fan group can exercise any leverage on a man who has clearly expressed his desire to leave and who has put our club in de facto hibernation until he can find the required buyer that will enable to walk away with minimal losses. Fan ownership is a pipe dream and protests such as the ’74 one, are one off release valves that achieve little in the long term.
As I recall, it was hard enough galvanizing support back in the AVISA days, with most telling us they just went to the match and weren’t interested in the politics; I suspect it’s even worse now. Not trying to be uber-pessimistic, but I don’t see any groundswell of support for protesting, fan forums or anything else; it’s just apathy.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
Then I'll agree with this.
Sorry, qualification: no violence, as this would be wrong and totally counterproductive.
I didn't mention or condone violence.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
"morons" is too strong a word to use without being offensive. Incompetents would be more suitable.
potato- potarto.
What they have done and continue to do to the once mighty Aston Villa is moronic.
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Did not join in the protest during the Everton game, but will be joining in this one. As a fan, I think it's currently the only way I can show my dislike of what is going on and with the game on TV I'm hoping there will be more publicity. I'm hoping we create a really good atmosphere for 74 minutes before making our point.
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Did not join in the protest during the Everton game, but will be joining in this one. As a fan, I think it's currently the only way I can show my dislike of what is going on and with the game on TV I'm hoping there will be more publicity. I'm hoping we create a really good atmosphere for 74 minutes before making our point.
If you are talking about Spurs at home this Sunday, it's not on TV
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Out of interest, how would you have worded that part of this "open letter" to get it taken seriously in the boardroom?
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Out of interest, how would you have worded that part of this "open letter" to get it taken seriously in the boardroom?
I wouldn't have written an open letter in the first place.
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Out of interest, how would you have worded that part of this "open letter" to get it taken seriously in the boardroom?
I wouldn't have written an open letter in the first place.
Okay, so how about in a private letter?
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You didn 't have to put in anything that hasn't been said hundreds of times already.
And this is the language of the playground.
They aren't veiled threats at the end either. We are genuinely in this for the long haul and protests in one form or another will continue. That isn't a threat that is a promise.
You're dealing with multi-national billionaire businessmen here. Saying "That isn't a threat it's a promise" might get you likes on Facebook but it won't get you taken very seriously in the boardroom.
Out of interest, how would you have worded that part of this "open letter" to get it taken seriously in the boardroom?
I wouldn't have written an open letter in the first place.
Okay, so how about in a private letter?
I wouldn't have written one of them either. I'd have issued a statement about a quarter the size of the letter they wrote, making one request rather than three or four and certainly not ending with any threats.
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All this bickering is getting us nowhere. Everyone has the right to say their piece about OUR club. We should be putting all this energy into challenging the morons who have turned Aston Villa into a laughing stock. All protests are valid in my view.
Then I'll agree with this.
Sorry, qualification: no violence, as this would be wrong and totally counterproductive.
I didn't mention or condone violence.
Totally agree - indeed you didn't - it was just the line "All protests are valid in my view" that I wanted to qualify for the avoidance of doubt.
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Okay, so how about in a private letter?
I wouldn't have written one of them either. I'd have issued a statement about a quarter the size of the letter they wrote, making one request rather than three or four and certainly not ending with any threats.
While I think the letter is overly wordy, I think the requests (I counted three) were fair enough. I also think them saying that they won't just go away, perhaps in not so many words, was fair enough.
It's all about opinions.
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The most effective lobbyists are the quietest.
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Okay, so how about in a private letter?
I wouldn't have written one of them either. I'd have issued a statement about a quarter the size of the letter they wrote, making one request rather than three or four and certainly not ending with any threats.
While I think the letter is overly wordy, I think the requests (I counted three) were fair enough. I also think them saying that they won't just go away, perhaps in not so many words, was fair enough.
It's all about opinions.
The problem is not looking like you're sending a wish list. For example, "We want you to go...we want you to spend money" comes across as hopelessly naive. I think getting a statement of intent would have been a good first step.
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The problem is not looking like you're sending a wish list. For example, "We want you to go...we want you to spend money" comes across as hopelessly naive. I think getting a statement of intent would have been a good first step.
Wish list? We aren't asking for the earth here Dave. Wanting people on the board who know what they are doing, wanting the club to be run by people who can ensure that you finish in a position in the league somewhere with in the region of what you are spending on wages relative to other clubs, wanting those running the club to have at least got close to maximising commercial income at a time the Prem league is booming, these kind of things shouldn't have to be on a wish list. They should simply be expected.
This club has failed in the basics and it is so frustrating. If we had people in the senior positions above the manager with the proven nous and experience who knew what was required to allow a manager to succeed then we could well have employed a manager who was capable of realising the clubs potential or at the very least kept us competitive.
As has been shown today lack of money hasn't been the biggest issue at this club. It may be an issue in terms of us finishing in the top 8 over the last handful of years but we have spent enough, certainly on wages, to have been competitive in this league and to be able to compete for a 10th - 14th place finish. The fact that we have failed is that we have not had the right people in place to oversee the spending and those same people have failed to employ the right manager to spend it or have forced that manager to adopt a policy in terms of incoming players of quantity over quality.
The reasons we are protesting, the requests that we want actioned with in the open letter, aren't unreasonable requests or a wish list, we simply want a club that is doing the basics right and is employing the right people with the required levels of expertise to ensure that happens. If Randy can't do that as he has continually shown then he needs to do all he can to get out and let somebody who can take over.
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Wish list? We aren't asking for the earth here Dave. Wanting people on the board who know what they are doing, wanting the club to be run by people who can ensure that you finish in a position in the league somewhere with in the region of what you are spending on wages relative to other clubs, wanting those running the club to have at least got close to maximising commercial income at a time the Prem league is booming, these kind of things shouldn't have to be on a wish list. They should simply be expected.
This club has failed in the basics and it is so frustrating. If we had people in the senior positions above the manager with the proven nous and experience who knew what was required to allow a manager to succeed then we could well have employed a manager who was capable of realising the clubs potential or at the very least kept us competitive.
As has been shown today lack of money hasn't been the biggest issue at this club. It may be an issue in terms of us finishing in the top 8 over the last handful of years but we have spent enough, certainly on wages, to have been competitive in this league and to be able to compete for a 10th - 14th place finish. The fact that we have failed is that we have not had the right people in place to oversee the spending and those same people have failed to employ the right manager to spend it or have forced that manager to adopt a policy in terms of incoming players of quantity over quality.
The reasons we are protesting, the requests that we want actioned with in the open letter, aren't unreasonable requests or a wish list, we simply want a club that is doing the basics right and is employing the right people with the required levels of expertise to ensure that happens. If Randy can't do that as he has continually shown then he needs to do all he can to get out and let somebody who can take over.
You're saying that you want him to sell up, but you also want him to throw more money away while he's doing so. That strikes me as wanting the best of both worlds.
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The most effective lobbyists are the quietest.
I'd have guessed "richest".
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This club has failed in the basics
This is the absolute crux for me - looking at spend, wages, set-up it can only be the personnel involved in running the club who are to blame. I can only assume the "root and branch" investigation has to be put in place to allow the legal removal of incompetent incumbents without the fear of constructive dismissal claims.
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If I were Fox, I might be thinking: 'Thank god the fans are largely apathetic, divided and bickering among themselves, otherwise they could make life really difficult for me. Now, that new car of Joleon's looks nice...''
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Wish list? We aren't asking for the earth here Dave. Wanting people on the board who know what they are doing, wanting the club to be run by people who can ensure that you finish in a position in the league somewhere with in the region of what you are spending on wages relative to other clubs, wanting those running the club to have at least got close to maximising commercial income at a time the Prem league is booming, these kind of things shouldn't have to be on a wish list. They should simply be expected.
This club has failed in the basics and it is so frustrating. If we had people in the senior positions above the manager with the proven nous and experience who knew what was required to allow a manager to succeed then we could well have employed a manager who was capable of realising the clubs potential or at the very least kept us competitive.
As has been shown today lack of money hasn't been the biggest issue at this club. It may be an issue in terms of us finishing in the top 8 over the last handful of years but we have spent enough, certainly on wages, to have been competitive in this league and to be able to compete for a 10th - 14th place finish. The fact that we have failed is that we have not had the right people in place to oversee the spending and those same people have failed to employ the right manager to spend it or have forced that manager to adopt a policy in terms of incoming players of quantity over quality.
The reasons we are protesting, the requests that we want actioned with in the open letter, aren't unreasonable requests or a wish list, we simply want a club that is doing the basics right and is employing the right people with the required levels of expertise to ensure that happens. If Randy can't do that as he has continually shown then he needs to do all he can to get out and let somebody who can take over.
You're saying that you want him to sell up, but you also want him to throw more money away while he's doing so. That strikes me as wanting the best of both worlds.
Dave what we are saying is that he needs to be a more motivated seller as it is clear that his heart is no longer with Aston Villa. That could though obviously take some time so in the meantime we are asking him to ensure that investment is made in the squad as quite clearly this squad will not get us promoted. Just as importantly, in fact perhaps more importantly, he has to ensure that people with the relevant expertise and experience come on to the board to allow the manager the tools to succeed. I am repeating myself here but until we get the senior positions above the manger right then we will never employ a manager who is capable of succeeding or allow him the support and means to do so.
Money alone won’t solve this. That has been shown as we have pissed a fortune up the wall. I’d hazard a guess that we have somewhere around the 10th – 14th highest wage bill in the league yet find ourselves rock bottom. The reason for that is that we have had CEO’s and others in senior positions above the manager who don’t know their arses form their elbows and until that changes then we will continue to waste money and continue to fail to maximise our commercial income. Non TV commercial income rose by 6% in 10 years. That is absolutely shocking.
As I said before we simply want a club that is doing the basics right and is employing the right people with the required levels of expertise to ensure that happens. I think most fans would expect that wouldn't they and would think it reasonable to ask that of the owner. If Randy is to stick around as seems likely, as given our imminent relegation and recent accounts it doesn't seem an appealing club to buy at present, then asking him to invest in the squad to ensure we get back into the Premier League at the first attempt and don’t stagnate in the Championship also seems a reasonable request and will surely assist him in selling the club further down the line.
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I don't think that anything Mark has said is unreasonable. Whether it will have any effect is doubtful but one thing is certain, doing nothing certainly won't.
Apathy will be the death of this club.
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I don't think that anything Mark has said is unreasonable. Whether it will have any effect is doubtful but one thing is certain, doing nothing certainly won't.
Apathy will be the death of this club.
Thank you mate. You know what we have doubts ourselves that this will have the positive impact that we hope it will. What is certain though is that if we don’t make ourselves heard, don’t at least try to force a message home then it will never be heard or acted upon.
I know some fans might not agree with how we are going about getting this message heard, might not agree with the open letter, some of its contents or the amount of words, but we would like to think that most agree with what we are asking.
We are a very small group of fans who are organising this and we would welcome all the support we can get. Welcome input from other supporters. We are desperate for other fans to help us hand out flyers on Sunday so if anyone wants to help in that way please PM me.
If need be we intend to continue this beyond the two further planned walkouts and want to engage with other supporters in terms of what other realistic and reasonable forms of protest could be undertaken.
We don’t want to divide supporters with this protest. We want to bring supporters together. The fan base will never 100% agree with any protest group in terms of what form of protest they want to embark on but I would like to think most fans would agree that what we are asking is reasonable and achievable. Help us get that message heard. It is just wasted energy arguing amongst ourselves and becoming distracted when our focus needs to be fully on the man ultimately responsible for this mess – Randy Lerner.
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Money alone won’t solve this. That has been shown as we have pissed a fortune up the wall. I’d hazard a guess that we have somewhere around the 10th – 14th highest wage bill in the league yet find ourselves rock bottom. The reason for that is that we have had CEO’s and others in senior positions above the manager who don’t know their arses form their elbows and until that changes then we will continue to waste money and continue to fail to maximise our commercial income. Non TV commercial income rose by 6% in 10 years. That is absolutely shocking.
From Totalsportek (sorry about the formatting)
http://www.totalsportek.com/money/english-premier-league-wage-bills-club-by-club/
Premier League Clubs Wage Bill For 2015-16 Season
NO# CLUB 2013-14 2014-15 2015-16
3 Chelsea £190m £192.7m £215.6m
1 Manchester United £187m £215.8m £203 m
2 Manchester City £216m £205m £193.8m
4 Arsenal £166.4m £180.4m £192m
5 Liverpool £140m £144m £152m
6 Tottenham £112m £100.4m £110.5m
7 Newcastle United £68m £78.3m £75.8m
8 Everton £66m £69.3m £74.7m
9 Stoke City £55m £60.6m £72.3m
10 Sunderland £55m £69.5m £71m
11 West Ham United £60m £63.9m £69.5m
12 Aston Villa £74m £69.3m £65.1m
13 West Bromwich £49m £65.4m £68.5m
14 Southampton £47m £55.2m £59.5m
15 Swansea City £55m £48.1m £51m
16 Crystal Palace £45.7m £54.3m
17 Leicester City £36.6m £48.2m
18 Norwich City £37m
19 Watford £29m
20 Bournemouth £25m
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Money alone won’t solve this. That has been shown as we have pissed a fortune up the wall. I’d hazard a guess that we have somewhere around the 10th – 14th highest wage bill in the league yet find ourselves rock bottom. The reason for that is that we have had CEO’s and others in senior positions above the manager who don’t know their arses form their elbows and until that changes then we will continue to waste money and continue to fail to maximise our commercial income. Non TV commercial income rose by 6% in 10 years. That is absolutely shocking.
From Totalsportek (sorry about the formatting)
http://www.totalsportek.com/money/english-premier-league-wage-bills-club-by-club/
Thanks mate. I don't know how accurate those figures are given they were way out with our 2014/15 figures but I would not be surprised if our wage bill was around the 12th highest in the league.
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In light of the new appointments, is this to be called off now?
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According to Tom Ross it has been.
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In light of the new appointments, is this to be called off now?
But we still get to abuse the owner and TF etc right?
If not what's the point in going ;-)
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The most effective lobbyists are the quietest.
I'd have guessed "richest".
Possibly. Either way it's a transaction, so you need to offer something in exchange, whatever that currency you're offering is; money, power, influence.
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As one of those involved in this group and the decision to postpone for anyone interested let me give you an update.
This campaign hopes to achieve three things. Firstly asking Randy Lerner to release a public statement stating he was once again a motivated seller and would price the club accordingly to achieve a sale.
Secondly whilst a buyer was found commit to providing the necessary financial support to ensure we can win football matches. For me that always meant ensuring we could build a squad to to get promoted next season.
Thirdly that people with the correct expertise and a proven track record are brought into the club to provide the tools for the manager to succeed.
I am not stating that it was down to this protest group but yesterday with the announcement of Little and Bernstein a third of those actions were met. For me the last one represented a lot more than that though as the biggest issue for us over the last few years hasn't been spending money it has been putting money into the hands of the wrong people. I'd imagine we have a wage bill in the top 12 in the league yet sit rock bottom. Money is being wasted and that is down to a continued failure to have the relevant knowledge on the board and until we rectified that we would always fail to employ a manager who could bring us relative success or allow him the tools/support to do so.
Lerner, as shown by the accounts, is still putting money into the club and he will need to commit to do that over the summer. Just as money without expertise wasn't enough, expertise without investment also won't work they have to go hand in hand.
With regard to a sale I think due to the accounts, the imminent relegation, the club is clearly a tougher sell at the moment and I think it unlikely it will be sold any time soon which made it even more important that the expertise was brought on to the board. Lerner still needs to become a more motivated seller and needs to state that though and give it the best chance possible of being sold to the right people who can provide it with a brighter future.
Some supporters are disappointed in the decision of the protest group to postpone this walkout and we are getting plenty of flak which comes with the territory I guess but it was one made as a collective that we felt was the right one. It may not be. We are adamant though that this is just a postponement and the club now need to act further otherwise we will continue to walk against Chelsea.
For too long there has been a divide at this football club between the club and the fans due to a lack of trust and belief that those at the club know what they are doing That needs to be rectified and it needs to be a relationship built on trust and belief that the club has people on board who can deliver. By playing fair now we have shown we will support good decisions and we have left the ball in the clubs court. We have stated this is only a step in the right direction though so we will pause, but this isn't enough and requires other positive action is taken over the next couple of weeks otherwise we will walk against Chelsea. We have made that clear.
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A couple of questions Mark.
1. How much do you think is a reasonable price for the club?
2. Is the proposed walk out against Chelsea a threat or a promise?
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This campaign hopes to achieve three things. Firstly asking Randy Lerner to release a public statement stating he was once again a motivated seller and would price the club accordingly to achieve a sale.
Secondly whilst a buyer was found commit to providing the necessary financial support to ensure we can win football matches. For me that always meant ensuring we could build a squad to to get promoted next season.
Thirdly that people with the correct expertise and a proven track record are brought into the club to provide the tools for the manager to succeed.
This is what the open letter should have said. Just this really.
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We have stated this is only a step in the right direction though so we will pause, but this isn't enough and requires other positive action is taken over the next couple of weeks otherwise we will walk against Chelsea. We have made that clear.
Fair enough on the pause, but is everyone clear what positive action needs to be taken before the next walk out?
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Would it not be worth releasing a statement confirming this and indicating that the club has acquiesced to one of the demands so the protests will halt?
The perception of power can be as important as the genuine article and I'm minded of the Spirit of Shankly group for a football comparison.
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Would it not be worth releasing a statement confirming this and indicating that the club has acquiesced to one of the demands so the protests will halt?
The perception of power can be as important as the genuine article and I'm minded of the Spirit of Shankly group for a football comparison.
A very good point well made
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out the door on 74 ,why stop it , randy and fox are still there , in fact dont go at all , like me , its pointless , i was at man city last week and will be at swansea next week , but while we are playing spurs i will be on the piss in digbeth after the parade . anyone else should bear in mind what ever pub your in dont go out the door after 4 , or you wont get back in till after 6
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Secondly whilst a buyer was found commit to providing the necessary financial support to ensure we can win football matches. For me that always meant ensuring we could build a squad to to get promoted next season.
I am not stating that it was down to this protest group but yesterday with the announcement of Little and Bernstein a third of those actions were met. For me the last one represented a lot more than that though as the biggest issue for us over the last few years hasn't been spending money it has been putting money into the hands of the wrong people. I'd imagine we have a wage bill in the top 12 in the league yet sit rock bottom. Money is being wasted and that is down to a continued failure to have the relevant knowledge on the board and until we rectified that we would always fail to employ a manager who could bring us relative success or allow him the tools/support to do so.
Lerner, as shown by the accounts, is still putting money into the club and he will need to commit to do that over the summer. Just as money without expertise wasn't enough, expertise without investment also won't work they have to go hand in hand.
Surely the second paragraph already answers the first and gives no basis for the concern in the third?
By raising a point about something that might come to be, albeit 180 degrees opposed to 10 years experience, you're risking looking a tad scatter gun. Especially when the elephant in the room, the root cause of our troubles from day 1 of Lerner's ownership, looks like it's starting to be addressed.
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How about 'Out the door for Agbonlahor', if he's on the team sheet.
I'm here all week.
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Can we please have this back...
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A few did it today anyway.
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We need lots and lots of banners at the next home game, they can't remove them all.
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If they try to take our banners down it will be a scandal. Bannersgate.
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If everyone had a banner and gave Tom Fox stick, could everyone be thrown out?
Form an orderly queue....
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I put a cigarette in my mouth at half time and went up to a steward and asked him if I lit it would I be thrown out? He said no so I put it back in my pocket.
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Charlton's beach ball protest was pretty good today.
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Charlton's beach ball protest was pretty good today.
Well done to them. You can make quite an impact with just a few fans and a well-thought out protest.
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Charlton's beach ball protest was pretty good today.
Well done to them. You can make quite an impact with just a few fans and a well-thought out protest.
Wouldn't it be nice...
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Still think the Black Balloons and as they are easy to conceal even the Stazi on the turn styles could not stop them. We had Claret and Blue ones in the good times, Black ones for now.
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1874 (http://outthedooron74.co.uk/press-releases)
Firmer Action Necessary
Monday 14th March 2016
First of all we think it is only proper to hold our hands up and say we made a mistake. We acted in good faith in postponing the walkout yesterday with no hidden agenda and we felt it was the correct decision at the time.
It is clear though that we were wrong to show the club respect as it was made clear yesterday they have zero respect for us, the supporters. The behaviour seen by club officials at the Tottenham game is disgraceful and is indicative of a power structure failing to take responsibility and it must end. We want this regime changed and we as a collective need to make it happen sooner rather than later.
We have thought long and hard about the criticisms levelled at us for postponing the Tottenham walkout. We are a young protest group learning on the job and we would like to float an idea to you.
We are still happy to proceed with Out the Door on 74, however in light of the recent developments we believe firmer action is needed. The mood we encountered at the ground yesterday certainly suggests that.
Including the usual disappointment and understandable anger aimed at the board, we had the horror show as officials wrestled with ordinary, decent fans wanting to display an inoffensive message. We the supporters are hurting and we should be able to portray that hurt in a peaceful manner. Even the Tottenham Hotspur fans joined in with our Lerner Out songs.
So we are proposing Banners Out on 74. They may think they have control but Aston Villa Football Club is not a dictatorship so let’s give THEM pause for thought this time. This is Villa Park not North Korea. This has to be a democratic movement and we are more than willing to keep working as hard for you as we have intended since our inception.
Our initial alternative proposal would be that fans bring their own banners, of all sorts and of any size. Whether that be a bed sheet, a t-shirt, a tea towel, or even just a piece of A4 paper to visually display to a national audience their disgust. Whatever the size or shape, it doesn’t matter. The cameras will capture it. We will hold them up on the 74th minute and they will stay held until the end of the game. The game is on TV of course, so the visual aspect will be electric and will only serve to further highlight the way our club has been driven in to the gutter.
If you put your faith in us once more we will also be looking at ways in which to assist fans who cannot bring their own. Though we absolutely encourage everyone to have their own say. This has to be your choice, we are still firmly committed to Out the Door on 74 Vs Chelsea if you feel that is correct.
Aston Villa Protest Group.
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Sounds like a good idea to me.
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At least they are being honest.
They were totally naive in my opinion, taken in by a cheap PR stunt that will end in tears.
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'This has to be a democratic movement and we are more than willing to keep working as hard for you as we have intended since our inception.'
Blimey, that sounds familiar.
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1874 (http://outthedooron74.co.uk/press-releases)
Firmer Action Necessary
Monday 14th March 2016
First of all we think it is only proper to hold our hands up and say we made a mistake. We acted in good faith in postponing the walkout yesterday with no hidden agenda and we felt it was the correct decision at the time.
It is clear though that we were wrong to show the club respect as it was made clear yesterday they have zero respect for us, the supporters. The behaviour seen by club officials at the Tottenham game is disgraceful and is indicative of a power structure failing to take responsibility and it must end. We want this regime changed and we as a collective need to make it happen sooner rather than later.
We have thought long and hard about the criticisms levelled at us for postponing the Tottenham walkout. We are a young protest group learning on the job and we would like to float an idea to you.
We are still happy to proceed with Out the Door on 74, however in light of the recent developments we believe firmer action is needed. The mood we encountered at the ground yesterday certainly suggests that.
Including the usual disappointment and understandable anger aimed at the board, we had the horror show as officials wrestled with ordinary, decent fans wanting to display an inoffensive message. We the supporters are hurting and we should be able to portray that hurt in a peaceful manner. Even the Tottenham Hotspur fans joined in with our Lerner Out songs.
So we are proposing Banners Out on 74. They may think they have control but Aston Villa Football Club is not a dictatorship so let’s give THEM pause for thought this time. This is Villa Park not North Korea. This has to be a democratic movement and we are more than willing to keep working as hard for you as we have intended since our inception.
Our initial alternative proposal would be that fans bring their own banners, of all sorts and of any size. Whether that be a bed sheet, a t-shirt, a tea towel, or even just a piece of A4 paper to visually display to a national audience their disgust. Whatever the size or shape, it doesn’t matter. The cameras will capture it. We will hold them up on the 74th minute and they will stay held until the end of the game. The game is on TV of course, so the visual aspect will be electric and will only serve to further highlight the way our club has been driven in to the gutter.
If you put your faith in us once more we will also be looking at ways in which to assist fans who cannot bring their own. Though we absolutely encourage everyone to have their own say. This has to be your choice, we are still firmly committed to Out the Door on 74 Vs Chelsea if you feel that is correct.
Aston Villa Protest Group.
I've read some 'up their own arse' stuff in my time but that's right up there with it.
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"How dare they? Who do they think they are? They just want to get in the papers." Etc. Etc.
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The Charlton protest was pretty good yesterday. Got the game held up for a few minutes, much TV coverage and pundit reaction and the fans probably felt that someone was looking at listening to them at last. Well done to whoever keeps up the protests at Villa.
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That statement is a bit 'up their own arse' but I fully agree with the general sentiment.
Yesterday really pissed me off with the way the club acted. We've won 3 of our last 32 league games and they think it's acceptable to go in mob handed and physically drag a banner off fans that has no obscenities etc on it. Smacks of a 'pay up, sit down and shut the fuck up' attitude which doesn't sit at well with me. Way I feel right now, that could be it for me this season. They want to treat us as c***s then i'll spend my money elsewhere.
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OK - I'm up for this
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I think one of the problems we've got with these protests is that whenever something is suggested or a statement made people refer to it as being 'them' and 'they'. This is US, all as one together, we are all Villa. We need to unify against the ownership and how the club has been run, exactly how we protest is not important. It's a case of either protest, with what everyone else is doing, or don't. People talk about OTD@74 creators being self-important but the way many aren't willing to join in sounds as if it's because it wasn't their idea and they feel they are too important to just be one of many.
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I think one of the problems we've got with these protests is that whenever something is suggested or a statement made people refer to it as being 'them' and 'they'. This is US, all as one together, we are all Villa. We need to unify against the ownership and how the club has been run, exactly how we protest is not important. It's a case of either protest, with what everyone else is doing, or don't. People talk about OTD@74 creators being self-important but the way many aren't willing to join in sounds as if it's because it wasn't their idea and they feel they are too important to just be one of many.
well said mate
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That statement is a bit 'up their own arse' but I fully agree with the general sentiment.
It's also good that they're not just copying somebody else. It's seeing something that happened at the club (the banner kerfuffle) and turning that into the protest. Rather than just saying "Liverpool/Dortmund/Charlton fans did this, we should do it too".
It's a thumbs up from me.
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Thumbs up from me too. It's peaceful in nature, respectful in that it's not telling anyone what they ought to do. Fair play and good luck.
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https://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/affiliate/1246955/-C59/product/138084413/view/1/sb/1457968794_Tab_O_O_LS (https://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/affiliate/1246955/-C59/product/138084413/view/1/sb/1457968794_Tab_O_O_LS)
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The Fiver's take:
VILLAN OF THE PIECE
In May 2014, the Aston Villa owner Randy Lerner nailed a large “For Sale” sign to the Holte End, saying he owed it to the grand old club to “move on and look for fresh, invigorated leadership if in my heart I feel I can no longer do the job”. He was, in effect, daubing a metaphorical bed sheet with foot-high letters (that squish up a bit as you get near the end because these things are always trickier than they look) spelling out the words L-E-R-N-E-R and O-U-T.
Oddly, however, the Aston Villa stewards were less keen on the club’s supporters backing Lerner’s corporate message in the stands on Sunday. While Villa did their bit against Tottenham Hotspur to hasten their relegation, a handful of downtrodden fans unveiled a Lerner Out bed sheet in the North Stand, prompting stewards to wade in and tell them to take it down. Whereupon the fans did and the stewards wandered off. So the fans took the sheet out again – revealing another message on its back to the effect that the chief suit Tom Fox could do a sharpish one too – and the stewards waded in again. The whole routine repeated itself several times over, providing supporters with the most entertainment they’ve had at Villa Park so far this season. Let’s face it, if you’ve a choice between watching Rudy Gestede clump shots into the crossbar from six yards out or playing cat-and-mouse with a hired goon in a hi-vis tabard, then that’s really no choice at all.
Eventually, this dignified little skit ended with one balding enforcer indulging in a spot of tug-of-war with a fan, ripping the sheet from his hands, then nearly heading down the stand’s steps on his front teeth while various fans questioned his parents’ marital status. And all because the supporters were simply reminding potential buyers that the owner wants out and Villa Park and associated assets are available for a reasonable fee, no onward chain. It was left to hapless manager Rémi Garde to offer a response. Of sorts. “I prefer to live in a world where everybody can say with respect – which is very important and what everybody has to do – but on this occasion I would say as well that nobody has to forget what happened in the past and what has been done in the past by everybody involved in this football club,” he parped, adding: “If you know what I mean.” To which the correct response was: no, no one knows what you mean because the words that have just come out of your mouth are gibberish.
Lerner pointed out in 2014, a whole year before handing Tactics Tim a contract, that “fates are fickle in the business of English football and I feel that I have pushed mine well past the limit”. Now that club security guards are preventing fans from telling Lerner to do something he actually quite wants to do, it’s probably about time for fate to deliver the Villa owner his long overdue hoof up the hole.
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Won't the gate stewards just be told to search everyone for folded-up banners?
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
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Won't the gate stewards just be told to search everyone for folded-up banners?
That would create chaos adding to the vitriol there is going to be so let them do it if they are stupid enough
Flags don't have to be huge - a plain white cloth about 3' square wrapped around my ample middle should do it - I am going to try and make it look like a pair of Y-fronts ;-)
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
that happened to me
he said he was a steward but on second thoughts it was 2am. must have been a night game
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That statement is a bit 'up their own arse' but I fully agree with the general sentiment.
Yesterday really pissed me off with the way the club acted. We've won 3 of our last 32 league games and they think it's acceptable to go in mob handed and physically drag a banner off fans that has no obscenities etc on it. Smacks of a 'pay up, sit down and shut the fuck up' attitude which doesn't sit at well with me. Way I feel right now, that could be it for me this season. They want to treat us as c***s then i'll spend my money elsewhere.
Indeed. Whilst they have taken a panning at times of late, I see the Trust have had their two penneth on it as well:
http://villatrust.org.uk/?p=1648
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From reading this and the banners thread, it seems to me the vast majority of us are behind the planned latest show of displeasure.
How about h&v throwing their backing behind the said protest, im sure one or two on here could help publicise the banner protest, it can only help the bigger picture.Me and the boy will be there, flags suitably concealed.
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That statement is a bit 'up their own arse' but I fully agree with the general sentiment.
Yesterday really pissed me off with the way the club acted. We've won 3 of our last 32 league games and they think it's acceptable to go in mob handed and physically drag a banner off fans that has no obscenities etc on it. Smacks of a 'pay up, sit down and shut the fuck up' attitude which doesn't sit at well with me. Way I feel right now, that could be it for me this season. They want to treat us as c***s then i'll spend my money elsewhere.
More fool them. They bought more attention to the banner than there would have been.
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I'll be purchasing a Lerner Out scarf from the guy outside the Holte Pub next home game, that's for sure.
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I haven't got a problem with the banner protest itself. It's on the telly, it should be effective and if it's what people want to do then fine. I didn't even notice the banner yesterday until my mate pointed it out and like it's already been said, the club have made a bigger issues of it than it should have been. However, the 'we are working hard for you' type comments that the protest group are coming out with just smacks of self importance.
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I'm all for it and don't care how they've articulated the proposal. The club have united the fans by trying to stop something tiny (even the clubs ability to stifle a protest is as effective as their attempts to win football matches). Classic stamp on a single flame that actually spreads fire instead of putting it out.
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The searches at turnstiles have already descended into barely a glance, and while a screw cap on small bottle of water is a major security risk, a 2kg thermos flask is fine!
I hope the belligerence goes up a notch Vs Chelsea.
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The searches at turnstiles have already descended into barely a glance, and while a screw cap on small bottle of water is a major security risk, a 2kg thermos flask is fine!
Presumably they've decided that you're probably likely to want to keep your 2kg thermos and take it home with you, but the bottle cap is the difference between a full, half-kilo missile that you're unlikely to mind losing and a light, virtually harmless missile that you don't mind losing.
Not that there is anything stopping you from taking your own bottle cap in your pocket if you really wanted to launch a full bottle at the target of your ire.
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That statement is a bit 'up their own arse' but I fully agree with the general sentiment.
Yesterday really pissed me off with the way the club acted. We've won 3 of our last 32 league games and they think it's acceptable to go in mob handed and physically drag a banner off fans that has no obscenities etc on it. Smacks of a 'pay up, sit down and shut the fuck up' attitude which doesn't sit at well with me. Way I feel right now, that could be it for me this season. They want to treat us as c***s then i'll spend my money elsewhere.
More fool them. They bought more attention to the banner than there would have been.
Ahh. The Streisand Effect.
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Yes. For maximum exposure we need the Gestapo to keep wading in. Use them.
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It sounds good in theory but holding a banner aloft for 20 minutes sounds like a stress position last carried out at Gitmo.
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Buy a Lerner out t-shirt or use a Sharpie on an old white one and wear it to every game until he sells , what are they going to do stop you going in?
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A banner protest (We'll call it a Bannan protest to keep the clubs snoopers in the dark) could be really effective.
It's a protest, given last weeks nonsense by the stewards, that will get attention.
It's defiance and a challenge to the lowerarchy that have possession of the Villa.
And would the stewards be able to resist wading in, given their apparent dull intellect?
Could be fun and put our plight in the spotlight for a short while.
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I'm sure I read something late last night about fans bringing in a tennis ball for the Chelsea game and throwing them on to the pitch in the 20th minute.
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I'm sure I read something late last night about fans bringing in a tennis ball for the Chelsea game and throwing them on to the pitch in the 20th minute.
Let it be
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
Searches are worse at away games, so there's less chance of getting anything in.
I suspect that any banner could be confiscated on the grounds that it could be an obstruction to the view of other fans
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
Searches are worse at away games, so there's less chance of getting anything in.
I suspect that an banner could be confiscated on the grounds that it could be an obstruction to the view of other fans
what if everyone at swansea held up an A4 size piece of paper , printed at home with something like fox out in big font bold letters , folded up and put in your pocket before the match . maybe someone could hand them out near where the coaches park or in the pubs where we are drinking , I could put mine in my underpants
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
Searches are worse at away games, so there's less chance of getting anything in.
I suspect that an banner could be confiscated on the grounds that it could be an obstruction to the view of other fans
what if everyone at swansea held up an A4 size piece of paper , printed at home with something like fox out in big font bold letters , folded up and put in your pocket before the match . maybe someone could hand them out near where the coaches park or in the pubs where we are drinking , I could put mine in my underpants
Why, don't you have pockets?
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
Searches are worse at away games, so there's less chance of getting anything in.
I suspect that any banner could be confiscated on the grounds that it could be an obstruction to the view of other fans
Searches at away grounds are always a bit hit and miss. I staggered into Upton Park this season after going straight from work to the pub to the ground, wearing a rucksack with my laptop in and all number of wires and cables hanging out and nobody batted an eyelid. Ushered straight through
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What about away games for example Swansea is on TV our henchmen can't stop banners there?
Searches are worse at away games, so there's less chance of getting anything in.
I suspect that an banner could be confiscated on the grounds that it could be an obstruction to the view of other fans
what if everyone at swansea held up an A4 size piece of paper , printed at home with something like fox out in big font bold letters , folded up and put in your pocket before the match . maybe someone could hand them out near where the coaches park or in the pubs where we are drinking , I could put mine in my underpants
Why, don't you have pockets?
yes i have got 4 in my jeans (2 at the front and 2 at the back) and 4 in my jacket (one each side plus an inside one and a small one at the front with a zip)
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A3 size works ok
Here's one I've just made
(http://i67.tinypic.com/i4fxis.jpg)
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A3 size works ok
Here's one I've just made
(http://i67.tinypic.com/i4fxis.jpg)
will it fit in your underpants
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To be carried inside a folded up newspaper, secret agent style
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To be carried inside a folded up newspaper, secret agent style
good thinking , they will never look in there . I might do that too
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To be carried inside a folded up newspaper, secret agent style
Last year at Headingley I had a magazine taken from me on the way in as "it isn't one of the recognised sponsors". I argued with him until I lost the will to live and pointed out a bloke with a copy of the Mail allowed entry and I was fairly certain they weren't official sponsors either.
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
yes that would be a natural progression as they are already asking us to open our jackets at the turnstiles
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
Why not? We're all getting shafted regardless
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
That's the standard formation of Villa's midfield
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
That's the standard formation of Villa's midfield
Maybe we should sign Ben Dover and pay him in the hole.
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Unless they take your trousers down I can't see them locating banners.
Perhaps we should all approach the turnstiles with our trousers round our ankles!
That's the standard formation of Villa's midfield
Maybe we should sign Ben Dover and pay him in the hole.
Where's Mick McCarthy when you need him?
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(http://media.balls.ie/uploads/2014/01/york.gif)
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Play in the hole?
Barry hole
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Appreciate Man Yoo supporters showing solidarity by all leaving the ground last night on the 74th minute.
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Sorry if it's been mentioned before but I don't think it has - beach balls, hundreds of them.
Small enough to go in your pocket when deflated, blow 'em up and lob 'em onto the pitch at a given time...BALLS TO LERNER
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OR stay in the ground
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To be carried inside a folded up newspaper, secret agent style
Last year at Headingley I had a magazine taken from me on the way in as "it isn't one of the recognised sponsors".
That'll teach you for trying to take in a copy of Big Jugs when everybody know that Asian Babes are the main sponsors
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Asian Babes would probably beat Worcestershire.
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Asian Babes would probably beat Worcestershire.
Insert joke about bouncers here.
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Asian Babes would probably beat Worcestershire.
Insert joke about bouncers here.
Hur hur hur. You said 'insert'.