Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on October 02, 2010, 08:57:02 AM
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Available Saturday evening.
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A bit sloppy at the back, competitive in the middle but awful up top once Carew replaced heskey. It meant we couldnt keep the ball there so the midfield and defense got swamped. If Heskey had stayed on, I reckon we'd have got something from it
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I hate football. We are never going to be where we want to be. Carew is so, so bad it's scary and why Cuellar was dropped is beyond me. Gutted.
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Signs of improvement, real improvement, but they're far more polished an article than we are and had one player who could make the difference. I think we'll beat them when they come to VP, by that time we'll have had more opportunity to work on our game.
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Again, we got what we deserved. Getting in that top-six this season will be beyond us, I'm afraid.
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Worrying that we have picked up the habit of losing leads. This is now 2 defeats, Stoke and Spurs, that should have been avoided.
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Sensational from Carew there, just sensational. Heck, he's been good this season when he's played........
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Our outstanding player went off crocked after half an hour after creating our goal. Theirs stayed on and scored two goals.
Not an awful lot between us, so I hope there's not too much hand-wringing about this.
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Seriously pissed off with the result.
Carew was very poor and offered nothing up front, but I thought we were generally OK and without the 2 defensive cock-ups and JC might have got more out of this.
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Would have liked to see Ireland on earlier as we were losing the midfield. Good in places but just not good enough especially after Heskey went off - any news on why/how serious? Carew was woeful.
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Heskey was great before he went off and Reo-Coker played really well. The rest were average, with the exception of Dunne, Collins and Carew who were terrible.
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I only saw the second half but it was toothless when it counted as per usual. If we don't sign somebody capable of keeping a bit of composure in the area soon I swear I'll have some kind of meltdown. I counted 7 moves that a bit of quality up front would've resulted in a shooting chance. Instead we invariably choose the complete wrong option. They go up the pther end and that bit of quality (Van der fucking Vaart) counts. Fucking Spurs.
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To be fair, probably the best i've seen us play all year.
More positives than negatives.Failing to pick up Crouchy on the back post for both goals.
Their 2nd goal, came 30 secs after Carew and Young , partic Carew should have done a lot better on the counter.
Did'nt deserve to lose today, Downing and Reo, both very good, all the back 4, i thought played well, as did Ashley, and Heskey when he was on.
Missed Gabby today, partic with Heskey coming off.
More of this though please.
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I think in every game this season we've had periods in the game where we look a very good side. They've been longer periods in GH's three games so far. The problem seems to be ensuring these periods of being good becomes longer and more frequent. It's obvious to those who watch that we are capable of playing good football and being a good team.
As for this game, Spurs are ahead of us, as they were last season, and in this game VDV was very, very good and is probably the best player Spurs have.
In my opnion, I've certainly seen enough in our games so far this season to suggest 6th place is still a possibility.
Basically, GH's job is to try and ensure the players play like they can do for longer periods of the game.
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Played well for some of it. Carew awful and Dunne was a fucking disgrace. How can he still be carrying so much weight?
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Also, what has Dunne done to deserve to be brought back in ahead of Cuellar?
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Carew was dire. Even when he did something good, he ballsed it up. I'd have rather played no striker than him.
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Our attack really needs to be FISHY:
Fab/Fonz
Ireland
Stewie
Heskey
Young (A)
Carew has been carp and needs filleting off. His performance sticks in yer throat.
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Also, what has Dunne done to deserve to be brought back in ahead of Cuellar?
Worst decision he's made since joining us.
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A spine of:
Overweight Dunne
Over the hill Petrov
Overrated Carew.
Are we really surprised that we got beat by a very enterprising Spurs team?
Houllier should never have dropped Cuellar for Dunne, Petrov needs dropping, Carew is just shite.
rant over
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Carew and Heskey both need replacing as far as I'm concerned. They're both far too injury prone so even when one of them hits a little bit of form, it rarely lasts 3 games.
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A spine of:
Overweight Dunne
Over the hill Petrov
Overrated Carew.
Are we really surprised that we got beat by a very enterprising Spurs team?
Houllier should never have dropped Cuellar for Dunne, Petrov needs dropping, Carew is just shite.
rant over
A very enterprising Spurs side? They play more long balls than we do.
The difference was Van Der Vaart, that's it.
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Just like Stoke's equaliser and winner, and just like Wolves' equaliser, their winner was inevitable. We could have done something to stop it, by shoring up the midfield or adding Cuellar, but we didn't.
We simply can't keep the ball, so we're always going to invite pressure. And because our defence is frequently at fault, as it was today, we're always going to concede.
Big changes needed on the personnel side, which really isn't going to happen until next season. This one is all but wrecked already.
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I'd never claim to know more than a highly respected manager, but honestly, can anybody explain the rationale behind dropping Cuellar who was great against Wolves, for an overweight and under performing Dunne?
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From what i can gather, Houllier swapped Cuellur who was immence last week for Dunne.
Then Dunne was at fault for both goals, is this right?
Carew is finished.
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Bye everyone. Off to sulk ...a miserable rest of weekend.
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Have to say - I was no fan of Heskey, but he is a different player under GH. We were good when he was on the pitch - he was chasing back and challenging for balls - like having an extra midfielder when we needed it and was a superb outlet. Carew came on and did his usual sack of shit lumbering around and we lost the battle and quality. Petrov looked half a yard off the pace - but better than recent performances I thought. Perhaps taking him and Albrighton off 10 minutes earlier may have been a bit more beneficial - but hindsights a bitch.
All in all we deserved to get nothing out of the game based on the second half.
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Why not start with Ireland, if we are trying to move into an era of possession football seems strange to me leave our most creative player on the bench, me i would like to see him starting in midfield with RC and Petrov holding, ash back out on wing, downing or albrighton on other wing, heskey or gabby up front, with ireland pulling strings in midfield and linking up with the striker
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A really excellent first 30 mins. We had some nasty, we had some pace, we had no shortage of skill and an ability to play the ball on the deck. That Spurs were still running hard at the end of the game says to me that this first 30 mins wasn't a result of them being knackered from their midweek CL match, but that we were playing really really well! Heskey was, once again, bloody marvelous! Great running from Albrighton to sense the opportunity.
Spurs only seemed to really come into it just after the half-hour mark when we seemed to concede an easy 15-20 yards of the pitch. Coincidence that that was the time Heskey went off?
NRC did an excellent job on Spurs midfield, especially Modric who only dared to venture into the Villa half on (I think) 2 or 3 occasions. But, as usual, Petrov's fading on the hour meant NRC had twice the work to do and Spurs really had the best of the 2nd half.
Disappointed to see Carlos not in the starting line-up. Dunne left VDV for the first goal and for their winner. His distribution was ok but no way should he have been in there ahead of Cuellar.
What the fuck was going on in Carew's head today, I'll never know. His lack of any decent decision making and poor efforts on goal cost us 3 points today. Literally undoing all of the good work that went before he came on.
If he can be arsed to fucking well switch on, then he can fuck right off! I'm totally pissed off with him. I hope I never hear that "Bigger than me and you" song again. He no longer deserves it.
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As good as Heskey has been recently, he's never far away from a niggley injury.
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Any news on Heskeys injury? Didnt see any incident.
Once again, the highlight of the game was Heskeys work for the goal...everything else very average.
Going to take time for GH and co. to change things. Need a striker more than ever.
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Heskey got injured setting up Albrighton's goal in which he did brilliantly. Can hardly accuse him of being injury prone in this instance, surely?
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As good as Heskey has been recently, he's never far away from a niggley injury.
I'd have left an injured Heskey on ahead of the absolute bollocks that replaced him.
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Lots of positives to be taken from today. We deserved a point but we really look weak up front. Carew needs replacing and we badly miss Gabby. Heskey was great for the short time he was on and our midfield looked the best I've seen it for years. NRC was excellent, unquestionably MOTM although Downing had another good game.
Dunne was at fault for ball watching for their first goal and sleeping for their second. We really handed it to them today. When you only have four bloody shots on target all day, you can't really expect to win games.
The big difference today though was Van de Vaart.
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Another good game for the 2 O'Neill caste offs, Petrov did very well in the first half, then faded but he wasn't on his own. Can't see the point of Carew any more, not that I thought he was much use anyway apart from scoring against poor sides.
Houllier must be desperate with the lack of alternatives in midfield and attack, but then if he'd had 150 mill to spend like some he might have.
Generally not a bad performance, worth a draw, pity its 3 points dropped and its 9 months before he can sign anyone seriously. I don't see the youth stepping up, Albrighton faded again, Bannan did little, Ireland doesn't fit and will soon get fed up.
Why he played Dunne I'm not sure, he couldn't cope with their front line, his concentration wandered too many times again.
Perhaps in the 2 weeks before Chelsea visit he will have sorted more out, I wish him luck, the depth of the problem left by the previous manager was exposed for all to see, today. All that money spent and few no options.
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Gypsum your summary of Dunne's performance is bang on. Terrible that Carlos was dropped for him.
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I'm confused, has Heskey suddenly remembered he's a footballer or have Villa suddenly become very, very rubbish because once he went off they seemed to fall apart.
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It's going to be very tempting for many to make Petrov the 'escaped goat' as Karl Pilkington would say, but he put in his best performance since the West Ham game and was not responsible for our general capitulation - that was Dunne and Collins being seemingly desperate to be as close to Friedel as possible. Besides, they scored their second when we had come back into it and were running the midfield. Added to NRC's continued excellence and Ireland's decent cameo, I think it would be fair to say that the problems were at the back and the front in the shape of Big Fucking John Carew, not the midfield.
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You just don't feel that Villa can hold the lead at the moment. It's Groundhog Day week after week. Even at 1-0 up the recent performances suggested what was going to come.
This is when we find out what GH can do for us.
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Big changes needed on the personnel side, which really isn't going to happen until next season. This one is all but wrecked already.
Its been on the rocks since that bastard ran off, but with over 30 games to go and lying with just 2 defeats, I would say that's a bit hasty.
Would you bet against Everton reaching Europe I wouldn't and I would say a close defeat at Spurs where we rarely do well in Houlliers first few weeks is not the time to start crying and bringing out the sack clothe and ashes, unless you know where Mon is.
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Carew is finished.
A lot of people seem to be saying this but it's a bit simplistic. At the end of last season, he had his best spell since he joined. He's just out of form and confidence, and it cost us today.
Couple that with a shit fucking attitude = carew.
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
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A spine of:
Overweight Dunne
Over the hill Petrov
Overrated Carew.
Are we really surprised that we got beat by a very enterprising Spurs team?
Houllier should never have dropped Cuellar for Dunne, Petrov needs dropping, Carew is just shite.
rant over
I second your rant. Carew has no enthusiasm. On a positive note, it was nice to see Albrighton get his first goal. Carew is a bad influence on the club. Petrov is pretty much mediocre at best.
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
Different players bloom at different ages. It depends on the position as well, and Bale is electric quick and a left-winger, two attributes which help him stand out at an earlier age.
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A really excellent first 30 mins. We had some nasty, we had some pace, we had no shortage of skill and an ability to play the ball on the deck. That Spurs were still running hard at the end of the game says to me that this first 30 mins wasn't a result of them being knackered from their midweek CL match, but that we were playing really really well! Heskey was, once again, bloody marvelous! Great running from Albrighton to sense the opportunity.
Spurs only seemed to really come into it just after the half-hour mark when we seemed to concede an easy 15-20 yards of the pitch. Coincidence that that was the time Heskey went off?
NRC did an excellent job on Spurs midfield, especially Modric who only dared to venture into the Villa half on (I think) 2 or 3 occasions. But, as usual, Petrov's fading on the hour meant NRC had twice the work to do and Spurs really had the best of the 2nd half.
Disappointed to see Carlos not in the starting line-up. Dunne left VDV for the first goal and for their winner. His distribution was ok but no way should he have been in there ahead of Cuellar.
What the fuck was going on in Carew's head today, I'll never know. His lack of any decent decision making and poor efforts on goal cost us 3 points today. Literally undoing all of the good work that went before he came on.
If he can be arsed to fucking well switch on, then he can fuck right off! I'm totally pissed off with him. I hope I never hear that "Bigger than me and you" song again. He no longer deserves it.
I've felt he hasn't deserved it for ages to be honest. Even when he was knocking in a few goals, I thought his all round game was letting us down very badly on far too many occasions. He needs to be kicked out in January big time...
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Another good game for the 2 O'Neill caste offs, Petrov did very well in the first half, then faded but he wasn't on his own. Can't see the point of Carew any more, not that I thought he was much use anyway apart from scoring against poor sides.
Houllier must be desperate with the lack of alternatives in midfield and attack, but then if he'd had 150 mill to spend like some he might have.
Generally not a bad performance, worth a draw, pity its 3 points dropped and its 9 months before he can sign anyone seriously. I don't see the youth stepping up, Albrighton faded again, Bannan did little, Ireland doesn't fit and will soon get fed up.
Why he played Dunne I'm not sure, he couldn't cope with their front line, his concentration wandered too many times again.
Perhaps in the 2 weeks before Chelsea visit he will have sorted more out, I wish him luck, the depth of the problem left by the previous manager was exposed for all to see, today. All that money spent and few no options.
I really hope that you're wrong wrt Ireland. We need his creativity.
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On one positive we do seem able to move the ball round better already, so in time I think we'll play some really good football. However once again I cannot understand how Dunne turned up after pre season is such poor shape, but the fact he is still that fat is unbelievable.
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On one positive we do seem able to move the ball round better already, so in time I think we'll play some really good football. However once again I cannot understand how Dunne turned up after pre season is such poor shape, but the fact he is still that fat is unbelievable.
It's almost like he never recovered from our preseason trip to Ireland. I think that Houllier needs to find a way for Ireland to get involved.
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I fear we've missed our chance with the defeats to Stoke and Newcastle and the draw against Bolton. Our next few games in the league are Chelsea (H), Sunderland (A), Blues (H) and Fulham (A). No "should-wins" until Blackpool at home on the 10th of November. Looks like it could be a long October, folks.
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
Different players bloom at different ages. It depends on the position as well, and Bale is electric quick and a left-winger, two attributes which help him stand out at an earlier age.
So you wouldn't have played Albrighton then?
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I fear we've missed our chance with the defeats to Stoke and Newcastle and the draw against Bolton. Our next few games in the league are Chelsea (H), Sunderland (A), Blues (H) and Fulham (A). No "should-wins" until Blackpool at home on the 10th of November. Looks like it could be a long October, folks.
We should win all of them bar Chelsea!
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Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
Different players bloom at different ages. It depends on the position as well, and Bale is electric quick and a left-winger, two attributes which help him stand out at an earlier age.
So you wouldn't have played Albrighton then?
When did I say that? I'm defending our young players! I think we should give them as much chance as they need because they're very promising. It's just that Bale is standing out at a younger age, which while true might be a bit misleading as to overall promise.
I fear we've missed our chance with the defeats to Stoke and Newcastle and the draw against Bolton. Our next few games in the league are Chelsea (H), Sunderland (A), Blues (H) and Fulham (A). No "should-wins" until Blackpool at home on the 10th of November. Looks like it could be a long October, folks.
We should win all of them bar Chelsea!
Sunderland are so tight at their own ground, Blues is a derby and derbies are rarely "should-wins" and Fulham look strong at home again, although without Hodgson it's too early to tell if they still have the same resilience.
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why are so many people throwing in the towel? We got beaten by a good side. Good sides beat good sides all the time. Our challenge is how we react from defeat. If anyone thinks Houllier was going to magically make us into the finished article is dellusional. It's going to take time and a couple of transfer windows at least. Keep yourselves together. It's a long season where a lot will change.
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I think we are being a bit over-critical of Dunne on here today.
Both goals come from Crouch dropping off Collins' shoulder, and heading the ball back, and VDV reacted like the quality player he is.Not sure Cuellar would have reacted any quicker.
One aspect where Dunne is vastly superior to Cuellar is his passing, and some of his passing out of defence today was very good.Personally, i think if Heskey, or Gabby would have been on the pitch today for 90 mins, i don't think we would have lost.
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I just despair of the way our defence didn't learn from the two goals. It wasn't the only pair of times Spurs tried that tactic but they still managed to score twice from it. And it was obvious Hutton couldn't deal with any forward threat so why didn't we attack him more? Trying to get any joy from Assou-Ekotto is pointless because all he does is fall over and buy free-kicks.
Carew is bloody pointless, Heskey was great and it's galling to see that we can't get two strikers playing in tandem that actually want to play together at any time (I know Carew replaced Heskey but the point remains we don't have a strikeforce, we have a player in form at any one time). So now we're stuck with Carew, Ash and Delfouneso, who's had hardly any football in the last six months and hasn't shown many signs of being the player that can fill the gap anyway).
It's not a crisis to lose to a good team away from home but the lack of invention and motivation in the second half was frightening.
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Watched the match at home via web feed, a simple failure to mark Crouch twice at the far post and prevent the header coming back across the box cost us that match. Dunne asleep on Van Der Vart for the first and Petrov ball watching and losing Van Der Vart for the second. I watched Spurs in the CL midweek and thats all they did in that game too, looked for Crouch on the back stick all game. Anyone watching that CL game (and I assume either GH or Gary Mac were there) should have known that the way to stop Spurs was to cut out the ball to Crouch or prevent him heading the ball at the back stick, its not rocket science. Apart from those two situations I thought we coped well with the Spurs threat in particular nullifying Bale very well. We needed to hold the lead at half time and the result may have been different. Heskey having to go off was a game changer also as Carew was nowhere near as effective and hence neither was Young. We move on to Chelsea at home and lets hope to keep the home form going. Keep the faith.
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
Yes Bale is some player, but I'm surprised you hadn't realised he plays for Spurs not us and it was our youth I was talking about.
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I think if Mon had never been our manager we'd have got a point today.
If he'd never even have existed we'd have got three points at least.
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why are so many people throwing in the towel? We got beaten by a good side. Good sides beat good sides all the time. Our challenge is how we react from defeat. If anyone thinks Houllier was going to magically make us into the finished article is dellusional. It's going to take time and a couple of transfer windows at least. Keep yourselves together. It's a long season where a lot will change.
Why drop Cuellar for Dunne though. That was a stroke of absolute madness.
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why are so many people throwing in the towel? We got beaten by a good side. Good sides beat good sides all the time. Our challenge is how we react from defeat. If anyone thinks Houllier was going to magically make us into the finished article is dellusional. It's going to take time and a couple of transfer windows at least. Keep yourselves together. It's a long season where a lot will change.
Bang on mate!!
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Beaten by a team with better players, more depth and class finishing.
Its great the likes of General K telling us we need to give the kids a chance but they don't cope with the pressure of such games.
Another good game for the 2 O'Neill caste offs, Petrov did very well in the first half, then faded but he wasn't on his own. Can't see the point of Carew any more, not that I thought he was much use anyway apart from scoring against poor sides.
Houllier must be desperate with the lack of alternatives in midfield and attack, but then if he'd had 150 mill to spend like some he might have.
Generally not a bad performance, worth a draw, pity its 3 points dropped and its 9 months before he can sign anyone seriously. I don't see the youth stepping up, Albrighton faded again, Bannan did little, Ireland doesn't fit and will soon get fed up.
Why he played Dunne I'm not sure, he couldn't cope with their front line, his concentration wandered too many times again.
Perhaps in the 2 weeks before Chelsea visit he will have sorted more out, I wish him luck, the depth of the problem left by the previous manager was exposed for all to see, today. All that money spent and few no options.
I really hope that you're wrong wrt Ireland. We need his creativity.
So do I but so far he's failed to impress which really and truly is not surprising considering he only moved a few months back, has been injured and has not played 2 games on the trot.
Thing is he's not suited to our present style of play, with him in the side we lose some defensive capabilities.
Perhaps GH will change that in time.
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Why the feck can't we hold on to a lead on a regular basis? I hate days like this.
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Why drop Cuellar for Dunne though. That was a stroke of absolute madness.
Dunne the ever present, current International, driving force behind most of last season, and you reckon its absolute madness?
If he hasn't bucked up his ideas in 2 games time it might be, but sticking with the tried and tested and not changing much would seem a very sensible option in the initial stages of his managership.
Well it does for me.
He has already kept Coker and Young in to some benefit, rejuvenated Heskey and A Young and even Downing looks the real article, at last. I admit he's lost a game and I've got the knives out of the drawer, but only for a polish, you seem to have yours nicely sharpened, Risso.
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Good job we only used one kid for 80 minutes and another for 10 then isn't it. Although, Gareth Bale is the same age as both of them.
Different players bloom at different ages. It depends on the position as well, and Bale is electric quick and a left-winger, two attributes which help him stand out at an earlier age.
So you wouldn't have played Albrighton then?
When did I say that? I'm defending our young players! I think we should give them as much chance as they need because they're very promising. It's just that Bale is standing out at a younger age, which while true might be a bit misleading as to overall promise.
I was arguing the same point. I thought you were disagreeing with me. Never mind.
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Why drop Cuellar for Dunne though. That was a stroke of absolute madness.
Dunne the ever present, current International, driving force behind most of last season, and you reckon its absolute madness?
If he hasn't bucked up his ideas in 2 games time it might be, but sticking with the tried and tested and not changing much would seem a very sensible option in the initial stages of his managership.
Well it does for me.
He has already kept Coker and Young in to some benefit, rejuvenated Heskey and A Young and even Downing looks the real article, at last. I admit he's lost a game and I've got the knives out of the drawer, but only for a polish, you seem to have yours nicely sharpened, Risso.
So surely that means sticking with a player who had a good game in a match we won last week?
And the Dunne we are seeing this season is not the Dunne we saw for most of last season, that's why the decision doesn't make much sense.
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Disappointed by defeat but by no means a bad performance.
In fact, I thought we passed the ball around better than we have done for 4 years.
There was a willingness to hold the ball and take 5 or 6 touches when possible rather than hoof it at the earliest opportunity, which we have done for the past 4 years.
Unfortunately, we still have the same problem we've had for some time. Fuck-all up front.
Theres no question moving AY up front takes a threat away from the wing. Albrightons good but not at Ashleys level.
I don't know if Carew's pissed, on drugs, unmotivated, unfit, out of practice or out of confidence but he was way off the pace today and has been all season.
We need someone stronger than Young, more mobile than Carew and more intelligent than Gabby.
If GH really thinks the forward line doesn't need some work I'd be very surprised.
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Yes Bale is some player, but I'm surprised you hadn't realised he plays for Spurs not us and it was our youth I was talking about.
So it's just our kids that can't cope with the pressure? Gotcha.
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Dear sfx412, I have an idea that you will polish away until your wrist can take no more.
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It was only a matter of time till we lost under GH and it will be interesting to see how we bounce back. Just a shame his first home league game is against Chelski, so hoping for a good strong display in a game we're not expected to win.
GH is dealing with the aftermath of the MON era, and making the best of an average expensively assembled squad. Its genuinely hard at times to look through our squad and see where money was squandered, but we'll just have to take it game by game and hope for improvements over time.
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why are so many people throwing in the towel? We got beaten by a good side. Good sides beat good sides all the time. Our challenge is how we react from defeat. If anyone thinks Houllier was going to magically make us into the finished article is dellusional. It's going to take time and a couple of transfer windows at least. Keep yourselves together. It's a long season where a lot will change.
Bang on mate!!
from the mood on here the only mistake Houllier made was Cuellur being dropped, we are not throwing the towel in, we are just really pissed of at how shit Carew currently is and how shite Petrov is.
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Thing is with Carew, he doesn't look unfit to me. He still has a burst of pace over 5 yards, he just makes the wrong decision more often than not. He isn't finished, he's just as limited as he ever was. Both he and Gabby are effective when making instinctive, athletic movements but as soon as they have to think about it they struggle.
Our approach play is great at times: incisive and few teams can live with the pace, however it comes off 1 in 5 times at best with the other 4 times ending in a bad cross or a missed one on one. Guile in the middle up front has been lacking since I don't know when. I think GH will sort that out but until he does we'll be nearly men and infuriating to watch at times.
As for Dunne. He's out of form but still put in the tackle of the game. He deserves time after last season to get it right.
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My disappointment at the result is offset by a lot of positives. We played some great stuff first half an hour and they couldn't live with us the first 15 mintues. We passed and moved more in one half than in 10 games under MON. EVen second half we passed it around nicely but had no cutting edge in the final third.
Other plusses were that Warnock was much improved, Heskey was inspired, NRC did a lot of good work and Downing looked lively and inventive, as did Albrighton at first, and Luke Young kept Bale fairly quiet.
Downside Albrighton faded again and should have been subbed after about 60 mins, we had nothing up front once Heskey got crocked, Ashley spent too much time bitching and falling over, Carew was hopeless again, and Collins, who had a good game otherwise, was beaten in the air for both goals. Dunne looked slow and lethargic again and shouldn't be in ahead of Cuellar or even Davies for me. Petrov was okay but badly at fault for goal 2 where he stood and watched VDV get away from him and have a free shot at goal.
We must tighten up in defence and find a few more goal threats.
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My disappointment at the result is offset by a lot of positives. We played some great stuff first half an hour and they couldn't live with us the first 15 mintues. We passed and moved more in one half than in 10 games under MON. EVen second half we passed it around nicely but had no cutting edge in the final third.
Other plusses were that Warnock was much improved, Heskey was inspired, NRC did a lot of good work and Downing looked lively and inventive, as did Albrighton at first, and Luke Young kept Bale fairly quiet.
Downside Albrighton faded again and should have been subbed after about 60 mins, we had nothing up front once Heskey got crocked, Ashley spent too much time bitching and falling over, Carew was hopeless again, and Collins, who had a good game otherwise, was beaten in the air for both goals. Dunne looked slow and lethargic again and shouldn't be in ahead of Cuellar or even Davies for me. Petrov was okay but badly at fault for goal 2 where he stood and watched VDV get away from him and have a free shot at goal.
We must tighten up in defence and find a few more goal threats.
some decent points but the davies comment? Dont forget dunney and his performances last term, it is going to take a while for gerard to change things!
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Lots of good things about the performance and individually I was impressed by Downing, Heskey, Ash, Marc and Warnock(first time in ages). However they were diminished by the result and Carew and Dunne's performances.
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Agree with the comments Carew isint up to it anymore time to move on im afraid, Reo has to start regularly hasnt put a foot wrong and petrov can only play 1 half.
Not sure if Ireland can play in this formation he would be better in the Ash role but Ash is playing that role well.
I like the formation but but it needs... and I cant believe im saying it Heskey in it i doubt Gabby could play it and we can see Carew cant play it. Not sure if the Fonz could do it possibly but a lot to ask a young inexperienced striker to do it.
I like the fact we have 3 really good centre halves and one youngster we can rotate.
Somehow weve got to get a decent tall striker upfront in transfer window or end of season someone like Adebayor even if he is a knobhead
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Carew is fucking shit and needs to be replaced as soon as we can.
Amazing that Heskey is looking twice the player Carew is.
We couldn't cope with Crouch today and VDV was just the one that shone through.
For them Jenas did nothing and Bale? What's all the hype?
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Mixed feelings on that game. Really at times we played some lovely crisp football and moved it around nicely, so already Houllier's passing game and the influence of messrs Cowans and McAllister is starting to show some results. We lacked that cutting edge up front however and fluffed our lines several times when we could have had good scoring opportunities.
Most worrying is our defence, it just hasn't looked right all season, especially from crosses. The two spurs goals were almost identical in their set up and we should have been aware to this obvious tactic. But we haven't looked up to dealing with crosses in most of our games this season. Could it be because Cuéllar wasn't playing? I think Cuéllar can dominate in the box and adds that real extra presence there in the air, without him we just look too vulnerable. Possibly why MON had him in at right back instead of Young. Personally i think he should be playing ahead of Dunne, though to be fair he did play well in parts today.
Carew was cack today, made some bad decisions and again his touch was awful. Ash was ok but didn't really shine without Heskey, who was immense when he was on. I though the midfield played ok today, NRC was great again, Petrov was good but tired, Downing made some nice runs but still can't cross to save his life, Albrighton got a good goal but looked quite ineffective really.
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Carew is fucking shit and needs to be replaced as soon as we can.
Amazing that Heskey is looking twice the player Carew is.
We couldn't cope with Crouch today and VDV was just the one that shone through.
For them Jenas did nothing and Bale? What's all the hype?
Add Lennon to that as well.
Think 2nd goal killed us today. Same as the timing as the first. If we'd held on first half we would have got at least a point today.
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In Gerard's own words "a draw would have been fair, and that's good because Tottenham are a slightly better team than us". That's the point - slightly, and Houllier's had very little time to impose his style on the team. I'm optimistic.
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Thought we played some good football today and were unlucky. Had it not been for the previous manager's inability to find a decent striker for 4 years we'd have probably won.
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Thought we played some good football today and were unlucky. Had it not been for the previous manager's inability to find a decent striker for 4 years we'd have probably won.
Oddly, we suffered today because the striker whose signing our previous manager was most ridiculed for went off injured. I think it's more that we can no longer rely on Carew, whereas we could to some extent previously.
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In Gerard's own words "a draw would have been fair, and that's good because Tottenham are a slightly better team than us". That's the point - slightly, and Houllier's had very little time to impose his style on the team. I'm optimistic.
And if Heskey hadn't gone off crocked I'm sure we'd have won it.Plenty to be positive about and everyones raving what a great match it was.Highly entertaining Game of the day and even though we lost I am looking forward to the highlights
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Dead chuffed with how Heskey and NRC have been doing. GH has to take credit. Slightly dissapointed with Ireland, just hope he gets fit and takes his chances.
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why are so many people throwing in the towel? We got beaten by a good side. Good sides beat good sides all the time. Our challenge is how we react from defeat. If anyone thinks Houllier was going to magically make us into the finished article is dellusional. It's going to take time and a couple of transfer windows at least. Keep yourselves together. It's a long season where a lot will change.
Why drop Cuellar for Dunne though. That was a stroke of absolute madness.
was he dropped or rotated? We've been crying out for variety and clearly it has it's risks. There's no perfect answer here, so we all better start to accept that players will be rested or benched irrespective of the opposition. I hope that we get to a point in the not too distant future that Ash doesn't have to start every game. When that happens we'll be a much better squad, we'll still win games, but we might lose some games. Overall, Spurs are a better than us "right now", and you have to applaud them for pulling off a brilliant transfer for one of the worlds best midfield players at a stupidly low price. We don't have anyone of his quality and he made the difference today.
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still giving the ball away in attacking positions, being let down by Dunne Carew and downing
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Thought Downing played well today Hawkeye.
We are not far off a really good team, a bit of tinkering, and a couple of good buys, then i don't see any reason why we can't do as well, or better , than the last 3 yrs.
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Dunne should be dropped and Carew's days at the club should be numbered.
If we find a good striker in January and manage to bring Ireland into the team without disrupting the solidity of the midfield, our season in transition might not impact too much on our leage position.
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Thought Downing played well today Hawkeye.
We are not far off a really good team, a bit of tinkering, and a couple of good buys, then i don't see any reason why we can't do as well, or better , than the last 3 yrs.
dodgy stream so not the best view, saw enough of us giving the ball away Downing Young Carew the main i culprits
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Quite surprised to see Cuellar dropped/rested and replaced by Dunne. We seemed to start well and Heskey was doing the business. The last-second goal in the first half was gutting. After that we were not at the races.
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can we get away with playing 2 wingers and ash in an advanced position, particularly away from home?
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can we get away with playing 2 wingers and ash in an advanced position, particularly away from home?
We probably can but only just and it does raise the question as to why need Ireland... Is he a luxury item we should cash in on?
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Carew is fucking shit and needs to be replaced as soon as we can.
Amazing that Heskey is looking twice the player Carew is.
We couldn't cope with Crouch today and VDV was just the one that shone through.
For them Jenas did nothing and Bale? What's all the hype?
paul, why does there always have to be a ****** of the week off you? John carew this, some other ****** next week then another after that?
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One quality player the difference today, was amazed to see Dunne in for Cuellar, hopefully its just GH taking a look at the squad. We can forget any idea of 6th as this is going to be an experimental period up to the January window and probably for the rest of the season, as I can't see us forking out on the over-inflated transfer prices that January brings, though based on the performances of Carew and Dunne today we could do with it.
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Far too many negative comments on here. I went to the game and went home feeling positive, considering Houllier's been here a couple of weeks, considering he's working with someone else's players, considering he's managed NRC and Emile back to effective first team football, considering he's got them PASSING the football TO A TEAMMATE, considering we played Spurs off the park for long periods (and not just the first half) when if you remember it was them who did the same to us at VP last year, and considering they have some pretty good players despite their injuries. The only difference was the Crouch-van de Vaart partnership which we couldn't replicate. We played some good stuff. Houllier felt we should have had a draw and Harry was particularly magnanimous about us, and fair dooze to him. For the neutral a pretty entertaining game and maybe one we should have drawn. Let's hope MOTD does us justice.
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Yes 'Arry was very complimentary about us in the post match interview I thought
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Some people are suggesting the season's a write off, or that top 6 isn't realistic. I'm struggling to find a realsitic challenger to us for 6th to be honest. In any other year, you'd expect Liverpool and Everton to be obvious candidates, but quite frankly both of those teams have massive issues of their own. We have a lot more stability than both of those two. I'd argue that our squad depth is better with more overall quality, and we will have money to spend in January to improve on that. Taking the obvious; Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City and Spurs have better squads, who else is better and will have what it takes to beat us out for 6th over the course of a season? I think 6th is very realistic this season.
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Far too many negative comments on here. I went to the game and went home feeling positive, considering Houllier's been here a couple of weeks, considering he's working with someone else's players, considering he's managed NRC and Emile back to effective first team football, considering he's got them PASSING the football TO A TEAMMATE, considering we played Spurs off the park for long periods (and not just the first half) when if you remember it was them who did the same to us at VP last year, and considering they have some pretty good players despite their injuries. The only difference was the Crouch-van de Vaart partnership which we couldn't replicate. We played some good stuff. Houllier felt we should have had a draw and Harry was particularly magnanimous about us, and fair dooze to him. For the neutral a pretty entertaining game and maybe one we should have drawn. Let's hope MOTD does us justice.
good positive feedback and i agree! 3 games in and gerard is going to need a bit of time!
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I'm with the optimists. We were quality for long periods, apart from decision making in the final third. I reckon if Houllier and his staff were in situ a fortnight before the start of the season we'd be second in the league now. Just the way the League Cup is going means the season shouldn't be regarded as a write-off yet.
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Dunne playing worse now than under MON - was he pro-MON?
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I thought Spurs deserved to win tbh. We had a few breaks (including some comical fcuk ups when we had 3s on 2s at 1-1) but the only real chance after our goal I can remember was Albrighton not quite gambling on Carew missing that chance.
Our lack of ball retention is worrying me again. It cost us at Stoke just sitting back in the second half, we got away with it last week as Wolves are crap but today time and again giving the ball away at 1-1 it was only a matter of time before Spurs scored. We need to improve that otherwise we'll continually come up short like in cup finals, today and Man. City away last season.
Big fan of Petrov but he hasn't looked at all right this season so I'd look at getting a cultured european central midfielder in january to replace him.
Oh and move Young back to the wing a.s.a.p and have Ireland just off the striker please. It's not hard, that Van der Vaart chap looks quite decent at it.
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Far too many negative comments on here. I went to the game and went home feeling positive, considering Houllier's been here a couple of weeks, considering he's working with someone else's players, considering he's managed NRC and Emile back to effective first team football, considering he's got them PASSING the football TO A TEAMMATE, considering we played Spurs off the park for long periods (and not just the first half) when if you remember it was them who did the same to us at VP last year, and considering they have some pretty good players despite their injuries. The only difference was the Crouch-van de Vaart partnership which we couldn't replicate. We played some good stuff. Houllier felt we should have had a draw and Harry was particularly magnanimous about us, and fair dooze to him. For the neutral a pretty entertaining game and maybe one we should have drawn. Let's hope MOTD does us justice.
Thank you
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Just like Stoke's equaliser and winner, and just like Wolves' equaliser, their winner was inevitable. We could have done something to stop it, by shoring up the midfield or adding Cuellar, but we didn't.
We simply can't keep the ball, so we're always going to invite pressure. And because our defence is frequently at fault, as it was today, we're always going to concede.
Big changes needed on the personnel side, which really isn't going to happen until next season. This one is all but wrecked already.
Yep, that in a nutshell for me.
Top priority for me in January would be a culture european central midfielder from somewhere, have Petrov as a reserve.
I honestly think we'd be o.k when Gabby gets better and gets back into his stride with Young back on the wing and Ireland in the free role.
Albrighton once again had a good first half and an ineffective second half so I'd look at having him as an impact sub.
And yep shocked that Carlos was dropped. Poor decision. That said I though Dunney was generally o.k, lost both goals from Crouch pulling to the back post and beating Young in the air and Petrov not tracking VDV.
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Far too many negative comments on here. I went to the game and went home feeling positive, considering Houllier's been here a couple of weeks, considering he's working with someone else's players, considering he's managed NRC and Emile back to effective first team football, considering he's got them PASSING the football TO A TEAMMATE, considering we played Spurs off the park for long periods (and not just the first half) when if you remember it was them who did the same to us at VP last year, and considering they have some pretty good players despite their injuries. The only difference was the Crouch-van de Vaart partnership which we couldn't replicate. We played some good stuff. Houllier felt we should have had a draw and Harry was particularly magnanimous about us, and fair dooze to him. For the neutral a pretty entertaining game and maybe one we should have drawn. Let's hope MOTD does us justice.
Just got back. Haven't read the whole thread but you are quite right Martyn.
I thought we played really well at times and enjoyed Heskey's hard work in winning the ball for the assist for Albrighton's goal.
We certainly didn't deserve to lose.
It's a new era, it takes time but it's looking positive at the moment.
Looking forward, for the first time in a long time after a loss, to seeing MOTD.
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I'm not too unhappy about the result (apart from all my family are Spurzzzz fans >:(). We have to give Houllier time to mould his own team and style. At least he is using subs and trying out players. Give it a month then he will know who he wants to keep and who can go. He will also have moulded his own team and style.
I'm optimistic about this season. We will get stronger than we are now and we're not far off the top 6. Apart from Chelski (who lost last week), no team is setting the league alight and even Manure seem to have trouble both scoring and hanging on for wins.
We are still in two cup competitions and have a favourable draw next round, so what's not to be optimistic about.
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MotD. Dunne was rubbish whenthey scored. Late, slow and static
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Far too many negative comments on here. I went to the game and went home feeling positive, considering Houllier's been here a couple of weeks, considering he's working with someone else's players, considering he's managed NRC and Emile back to effective first team football, considering he's got them PASSING the football TO A TEAMMATE, considering we played Spurs off the park for long periods (and not just the first half) when if you remember it was them who did the same to us at VP last year, and considering they have some pretty good players despite their injuries. The only difference was the Crouch-van de Vaart partnership which we couldn't replicate. We played some good stuff. Houllier felt we should have had a draw and Harry was particularly magnanimous about us, and fair dooze to him. For the neutral a pretty entertaining game and maybe one we should have drawn. Let's hope MOTD does us justice.
Quite agree Martyn, just got home back up here in Manchester and I haven't walked away from an away defeat as positive as this in a long time. We gave Spurs as good as we took and came up just a little short. They had a world class player in Van der vaart to make that little bit of difference. The players can take great credit from their performance today and if we play like that against 75% of this division we'll be winning more than we're losing. Special mentions for NRC and Downing today, superb.
Lets also not forget how we played against Spurs away last season, we somehow got a 0-0 draw with probaaly one ofthe worst displays of anti-football ever and it was when I started to seriously doubt O'Neill. Now this season we've got a worse result but we looked as though we belonged on the same pitch and they won't be looking forward to VP on Boxing Day.
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I was at the game and I don’t think we deserved to lose that. We had enough opportunities to have won the game. Some incredibly poor decision making by Young, Petrov and Carew respectively when we were breaking forward and outnumbering the Spurs backline.
I thought we played the better football first half and the system works incredibly well with a big and aggressive mobile striker. Full credit to Heskey for the goal and is performance.
The equaliser rocked us and I thought that, coupled with their change of shape really knocked us for the first 15 minutes of the second half, before we finally remembered how to keep the ball.
There’s not a great deal between them and us- some extra depth in a few key positions, notably up front and that's it. Carew isn’t mobile enough for me and has been really poor so far this season. Albrighton needs to work on his fitness, as he’s similar to Delph in that he’ll fade after the hour mark energy wise. Petrov is starting to worry me too, as I think he’s getting exposed too often and leaving too much space in behind him, although NRC did a very good job of winning nigh on every loose ball.
I was surprised Cuellar didn’t start, although Dunne did well in the main. I felt he had to commit himself to the block for the second and that Collins should have competed with Crouch a lot better for both goals.
I hate having a two week break after a loss, but given that Gabby is out until Sunderland and now Heskey has picked up a knock, we’ll almost certainly need that time to get him fit again. Some tough but winnable games coming up and I’d include Chelsea in that bracket.
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We're a work in progress, and this is going to be a very up and down season with the recent changes.
I've not seen the game, but the consensus on here seems to be that we played some more than decent football. I thought we did the same at Stoke, and at Wolves, too, so the signs are there, and that's enough for me at the moment.
The manager's been here a little over a week. He's probably not managed to remember everyone's name yet, let alone get them performing as best he can.
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We're a work in progress, and this is going to be a very up and down season with the recent changes.
I've not seen the game, but the consensus on here seems to be that we played some more than decent football. I thought we did the same at Stoke, and at Wolves, too, so the signs are there, and that's enough for me at the moment.
The manager's been here a little over a week. He's probably not managed to remember everyone's name yet, let alone get them performing as best he can.
Yep to be fair we did play some very good stuff. Downing appears to be growing in confidence which is encouraging and I do think we need to fit Ireland into the team. The result was disappointing, but if the improvement in quality of football in the space of a couple of weeks is this good hopefully we are of the right path. However Dunne needs to sort himself out, he is still in dreadful shape and Carlos should have started today.
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I was at the game today. I thought it was a fine football match.
Spurs had the measure of us today, but only just. I thought we played terrific football at times, but lacked the cutting edge in the second half.
Heskey seems to have aura around him that hasn't been present since he joined the club. He was quite simply magnificent before he went off.
I was proud of the team today.
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Does playing 'nice football in periods' win us games and put points on the board?
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Does playing 'nice football in periods' win us games and put points on the board?
Not always. Sometimes you play poorly and win, like at The Molineux last week.
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We probably can but only just and it does raise the question as to why need Ireland... Is he a luxury item we should cash in on?
Cash in on after starting one game? Don't be soft, he's going to be a key player for us over the next 4.4 years.
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Dunne playing worse now than under MON - was he pro-MON?
Pro MOn? I think he was is pro MAC.
That's BIG MAC -- with extra fries and a supersize Coke.
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Positives, NRC, Heskey, Downing, Dunne blocked a couple that could have been goals so not a disaster that some reckon. If Houllier can turn some of these players around we will have a good season although i think Carew is a lost cause. He let the side down with his lack of effort and poor decision making, why he tries to shoot from outside the box i'll never know. He was a poor relation to Heskey who must be a twin because his brother was bloody useless.
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I'm starting to get really pissed off with some of the negativity on this site. We played well at possibly the second most difficult place to go in the league. Spurs did have the edge but we knew that already. Petrov actually played well I thought. Dunne didn't have the shocker people are claiming. We looked extremely dangerous in the first half. With a sharper edge up front we could well have won. Look at the comments made by redknapp, houllier, motd pundits and the press reports.
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Oh and I don't see why this game is convincing people that young needs to go back to the wing. He played very well.
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Matt - Yes, I think Ashley did well albeit in patches as he searched for space. He is not Milner though is he? Luke has been a revelation as have been NRC and Ivanhoe of course. Some good managemnt here and I am positive about the tactical nouse and our fluidity too in comparison with MoN.
Bit mostly I was pleased with the aggression. Bordering on Nasty at times I admit but it will be good to have a reputation as being a bit hard.
Sorry about the result but quite happy so far.
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It was good to see the whole team play so aggressive, particularly in the first half. Maybe Houllier waited too long with the last substitutions. And Dunne is far from the giant of last season.
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I think the criticism of Dunne is a bit harsh, if Collins or Young had coped better with Crouch, VDV wouldn't have had the chance to get ahead of Dunne.
Carlos should have kept his place, it also meant Collins swaping sides to allow Dunne to play on the left which can't help.
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Question for those that were there: was there any particular reason that VDV went to celebrate his second goal with the Villa fans as opposed to the adoring Spuds public? Just watching MOTD highlights and looked like he made a beeline for the away section.
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Compared to last season, Dunne looks more like a sack of potatoes. He made some crucial saves too, to be honest.
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We're conceding far too many goals, sort it Gerard.
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My disappointment at the result is offset by a lot of positives. We played some great stuff first half an hour and they couldn't live with us the first 15 mintues. We passed and moved more in one half than in 10 games under MON. EVen second half we passed it around nicely but had no cutting edge in the final third.
Other plusses were that Warnock was much improved, Heskey was inspired, NRC did a lot of good work and Downing looked lively and inventive, as did Albrighton at first, and Luke Young kept Bale fairly quiet.
Downside Albrighton faded again and should have been subbed after about 60 mins, we had nothing up front once Heskey got crocked, Ashley spent too much time bitching and falling over, Carew was hopeless again, and Collins, who had a good game otherwise, was beaten in the air for both goals. Dunne looked slow and lethargic again and shouldn't be in ahead of Cuellar or even Davies for me. Petrov was okay but badly at fault for goal 2 where he stood and watched VDV get away from him and have a free shot at goal.
We must tighten up in defence and find a few more goal threats.
some decent points but the davies comment? Dont forget dunney and his performances last term, it is going to take a while for gerard to change things!
I'm in the minority that thinks Davies is much better than he's given credit for. I doubt he'd have stood and watched VDV pick his spot twice yesterday. I don't give a toss how good Dunne was last season, it's irrelevant, at the moment he is crap and a liability and shouldnt be selected on reputation alone. If you want to use last season as a reason to pick him why not use three seasons ago, when Davies was playing well, as a reason to pick him? It' just as relevant to today.
Pisses me off the Spurs got VDV, who just looks utter class, for 4m less than we paid for Downing, less than we paid for Davies and about the same as we paid for NRC. That's MON's flawed transfer policy for you.
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I'm sure MON would have loved VDV or Sneijder. They wouldn't have come to Villa.
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Does playing 'nice football in periods' win us games and put points on the board?
Not always but I would rather that than the last two seasons where we scraped wins very very luckily on any number of occasions but eventually got found out in the longer run by the better teams and the demands of playing hoof football and never hanging on to the ball
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There's a lot of overly harsh criticism. If the delivery is good enough to Crouch his size means that he's going to win his share of headers when you couple that with the movement and anticipation of a top class player really on form in Van der Vaart then most teams will have problems.
Overall an encouraging performance but our problem is the same one we've had for a couple of seasons, we just do not score enough goals.
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I'm sure MON would have loved VDV or Sneijder. They wouldn't have come to Villa.
I acknowledge they may not have come anyway, but what, in MON's transfer history with us, makes you "sure" MON would have loved to sign those players, or most other foreign or foreign based players?
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Havent read any posts yet , just got in.....
John Carew Carew hes shitty than me and you.....
sorry, but he was bloody awful again. soon as Heskey went off I thought bollocks.. and I would never have said that a few mths ago.. if Heskey had stayed on we would have got a result there...
Carew has lost his pace,hes lumbersome , his decisions and final ball are awful. He needs to look up when hes got the ball, twice he could have played Villa players in for one and one with the tottenham goalie, you just know Heskey would have done those passes... Replace in Jan please...
Suprised to see Dunne start, you cant drop a MOM player ( cuellar )from a week before ..even Dunne had said it will be hard to get into team...
actually think NRC looks better because hes getting a run in the team, looks confindent ..
VDV was the difference ... bargain and Im pissed off with spurs getting him as I hate them...
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There's a lot of overly harsh criticism. If the delivery is good enough to Crouch his size means that he's going to win his share of headers when you couple that with the movement and anticipation of a top class player really on form in Van der Vaart then most teams will have problems.
Overall an encouraging performance but our problem is the same one we've had for a couple of seasons, we just do not score enough goals.
The encouraging thing is that Houllier saw the same thing yesterday. We're just not clinical enough with or without Gabby. Despite him saying we have 3 good strikers at the club I think it's an area he will address given the right opportunity.
And the criticism is way too harsh on here. There's no patience any more which is rather sad. For me the performance, style of play and desire was just as important as the result. Big teams lose to big teams all the time. We played well for most of yesterday and our challenge now as a big team is to bounce back from this.
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I thought that we played very well and were worth a point, like it or not Spurs are a very good side, the best I saw at VP last season, and its no disgrace to lose narrowly to them, especially away from home. The only real difference between the sides was Van der Vaart who was superb all game.
Its clear Carew is off form at the moment but some seem to have very short memories, he's scored a lot of goals for us and will come into form again. I thought Downing did very well, he passed the ball really well and showed a lot of energy to get back into defence at times.
I'm starting to feel pretty optimistic about GH's reign.
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The most annoying thing for me was Gabby Logan on red button Final score saying ,when we were leading coming up to half time, "Have Villa shown how to play the big Teams?"
I am fuming ..I used to like her but now she can go and %$##@##$%$%^
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I thought that we played very well and were worth a point, like it or not Spurs are a very good side, the best I saw at VP last season, and its no disgrace to lose narrowly to them, especially away from home. The only real difference between the sides was Van der Vaart who was superb all game.
Its clear Carew is off form at the moment but some seem to have very short memories, he's scored a lot of goals for us and will come into form again. I thought Downing did very well, he passed the ball really well and showed a lot of energy to get back into defence at times.
I'm starting to feel pretty optimistic about GH's reign.
Very well summed up.
VDV will end up at Chelsea/Man City/Man Utd next season if he carries on like that.
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Alot of positives to take from yesterday. Was great to see us go to Spurs and have a real go at them. Rather than the negative tatics of last seaon - ok so we got a point from last season but we didnt attack them like yesterday.
Dissapointed to see Cuellar dropped and I dont think Spurs would have lumped every ball to the back post with him in the side.
Yet again dissapointed with Stan. Every game seems to pass him by. Think its time for Ireland to have a run. Hoping Delp will out him from the side when fit.
Big improvement from Albrighton, he lasted a little longer this time.
Possibly the worst performance from Big John yesterday that Ive witnessed. And I'm a big fan. We striker urgently!
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VDV will end up at Chelsea/Man City/Man Utd next season if he carries on like that.
No that is unlikely. Any of them could have signed him at any time in the last two or three years but chose not to. Problem with VDV is that he is attracted to the celeb culture along with his supermodel wife. Very soon he will be part of the West End circuit and his game will suffer. If he had concentrated on his game in the last few years he could have have been great at world stage.
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It was good to see the whole team play so aggressive, particularly in the first half.
Apart from the improvement in passing and movement off the ball, that really was the other main difference. We really got at them from the start and Spurs didn't know what day it was. We've been far too soft for far too long, so it's great to see Sid and Gary Mac have been addressing the problem.
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Did Petrov shake Houllier's hand after being subbed?
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It is a positive sign that Rene is aware Petrov is "not 90 mins player"
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Just watched MOTD. The major factors was the dutchman and a poor performance from Dunne. It seems we now have striker problem - so why doesnt he bring the Fonz into the action...Also what news on Weimann?
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It is a positive sign that Rene is aware Petrov is "not 90 mins player"
I will say this only once...... "Rene" . I like that. V. Good.
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Heskey only had a dead leg so no problem for next game. Thought our football awareness has been more noticeable that would be enhanced if Ireland is on the pitch. I know ash is doing well up front but really need Ireland`s presence. Think he is going to be massive for Villa ............
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For the Chelsea game I’d feinitely give young Marc a rest, given how good their full backs are and their physicality.
Chris Smith is right. We create a good number of chances, but we’re just not as clinical as we’d like and we haven’t been for some time. The football is getting better game by game, there is a genuine balance about the side with Heskey up top and in the form he currently is. I think we’ll be in and around 8th to 5th spot come January, where hopefully Houllier will be able to bring in a goal scorer and a good central player. Couple that business with the return of Delph and we’ll be in with a decent shout of competing right up until May.
There is not a lot between Spurs and us, inspite of the summer we’ve had.
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There is not a lot between Spurs and us, inspite of the summer we’ve had.
I'd beg to differ when they had a midfield player at cb, and a bench that made ours look amateurish, and we couldn't as normal make our superiority count in goals.
Not that that's GH's fault of course, a good performance another poor result, and with Chelsea and Blackpool coming soon something needs sorting quickly, if at all possible, a fit Gabby for instance
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Question for those that were there: was there any particular reason that VDV went to celebrate his second goal with the Villa fans as opposed to the adoring Spuds public? Just watching MOTD highlights and looked like he made a beeline for the away section.
I was in the second row of the lower tier and we had been giving him some stick when he took a couple of corners immediately in front of us. I haven't seen the highlights but hopefully you can see me giving him the v's in the background.
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This positivity in the face of a defeat to an injury ravaged Spurs side is great, but yesterday again showed a naivety to our play that good sides (and not so good sides) have exploited so far this season.
It's difficult to be too critical for playing a more open and expansive game after criticising some of the dross last year, but if we are opting to play this way our defence needs to be on the money.
Tottenham had Huddlestone at CB yesterday, and VDV admitted they didn't get started for the first half hour after the exertions of mid week. If we gave a team a half hours head start we'd expect the game to be out of sight - and that's how it should have been yesterday. And versus Stoke, Wolves and to a lesser extent Bolton.
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Bang on KevinGage. Some good signs but ultimately nowhere near clinical enough against a good but depleted Spurs side.
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Having watched at leisure the Football First coverage I tapes earlier, we need a finisher, by fuck do we need someone clinical in the box, a Lineker type.
We are great on the break, we have pace, we can stretch defences using wide players, we have no one good enough turn that into goals.
Gabby isn't it, he's a mid-table Premiership striker at best, Carew is finished, Delfouoneso will never be good enough and Heskey will eventually become...well...Heskey!
Need to break the bank for two strikers, dunno who, dunno if we can afford them, but we need them.
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Dave Copper, plain as fuck. Strikers needed. Good news is that if we can see it so can the new manager / club. Why MON didn't address it is one of the only real criticisms I can think of, fucking off when he did aside.
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I honestly think we'll be o.k upfront once Gabby gets better and Ireland starts playing just off him.
Don't laugh but I honestly believe Ireland can be as effective for us as VDV is currently for Spurs when he starts getting played off the main striker.
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Its far too soon to be writing off Delfounso, I'd like to see him out on loan to a decent Championship side to get him in the goals and give him that desire for first team football, then back here to get the last twenty minutes of a few games.
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HQ, I think Ireland will be ace once he's settled. I wonder who (Albrighton / Downing) will make way though.
Yet to see anything other than promise from the Fonz - not a criticism as he's still a kid. Would be great to see more of him.
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Gabby isn't it, he's a mid-table Premiership striker at best, Carew is finished, Delfouoneso will never be good enough and Heskey will eventually become...well...Heskey!
You judgemental fecker.
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I honestly think we'll be o.k upfront once Gabby gets better and Ireland starts playing just off him.
Don't laugh but I honestly believe Ireland can be as effective for us as VDV is currently for Spurs when he starts getting played off the main striker.
Ireland will be a great player once hes played and utilised in the right position...the problem is the players we have in midfield around him which makes it a big risk to play him how he should be played.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
You have to think he saw something or simply thought that Dunne was the better option for this game. He says he meets with his staff every day to discuss issues, so that would have come up I'm sure. It's not like MON where every team was the same. We have to get used to different selections from now on, rotations, certain players in certain situations etc. It may not always make sense, and it might not always come off. Hopefully over the course of time it will pay off more often than not.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
Carlos being dropped is actually bothering me more than us losing.He'd certainly earned his place after last week.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
You have to think he saw something or simply thought that Dunne was the better option for this game. He says he meets with his staff every day to discuss issues, so that would have come up I'm sure. It's not like MON where every team was the same. We have to get used to different selections from now on, rotations, certain players in certain situations etc. It may not always make sense, and it might not always come off. Hopefully over the course of time it will pay off more often than not.
I understand that that might be what has happened, but I'd have thought the fact that Dunne is currently the only human being visible from space might be warning enough.
And then there's the fact that Cuellar did so excellently last weekend.
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I honestly think we'll be o.k upfront once Gabby gets better and Ireland starts playing just off him.
Don't laugh but I honestly believe Ireland can be as effective for us as VDV is currently for Spurs when he starts getting played off the main striker.
Ireland will be a great player once hes played and utilised in the right position...the problem is the players we have in midfield around him which makes it a big risk to play him how he should be played.
Don't see why it would be any different to Young as long as we play two holders behind him.
Albrighton's already flagging in the second half of games so the simple answer to me is use him as an impact sub for the next few games and then rotate him and downing later on in the season.
Let's hope we finally have a manager who moves away from a fixed 11 and rotates on form, fatigue and flexibitility regarding the opposition.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
You have to think he saw something or simply thought that Dunne was the better option for this game. He says he meets with his staff every day to discuss issues, so that would have come up I'm sure. It's not like MON where every team was the same. We have to get used to different selections from now on, rotations, certain players in certain situations etc. It may not always make sense, and it might not always come off. Hopefully over the course of time it will pay off more often than not.
I understand that that might be what has happened, but I'd have thought the fact that Dunne is currently the only human being visible from space might be warning enough.
And then there's the fact that Cuellar did so excellently last weekend.
yep, he could do with shedding a little. I don't think he was doing that badly up until the first goal mnd you. He shouldn't have been beaten and got his timing for the jump completely wrong. I don't want to crucify him for the 2nd because you have to give a lot fo credit to VDV for the way he controlled the ball and finished. Still, I think there are more positives than negatives to come out of the game.
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Probably the best we have played in a while, even though you just knew we wernt going to hang on. Absolutly nothing in the final third of the pitch, and I really want Young to stop complaining and either falling over or standing there with his arms spread. The refs must get sick of it and are less likely to give him the odd 50/50. Toughen up and get on with it. Thought NRC was immense always thought he had been short changed by MON.
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Gabby isn't it, he's a mid-table Premiership striker at best
That makes absolutely no sense.
He's been a mainstay of a side that has finished 6th 3 seasons in a row and yet he's a mid table striker?
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Gabby isn't it, he's a mid-table Premiership striker at best
That makes absolutely no sense.
He's been a mainstay of a side that has finished 6th 3 seasons in a row and yet he's a mid table striker?
We need him in the side (fully fit), he and Young will soon run defences ragged.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
You have to think he saw something or simply thought that Dunne was the better option for this game. He says he meets with his staff every day to discuss issues, so that would have come up I'm sure. It's not like MON where every team was the same. We have to get used to different selections from now on, rotations, certain players in certain situations etc. It may not always make sense, and it might not always come off. Hopefully over the course of time it will pay off more often than not.
Well he couldn't have got it more wrong on Saturday.
Shocking decision.
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One thing I didn't get yesterday was why, having bigged him up several times last week ("he's like Jamie Carragher") GH dropped Carlos yesterday.
You have to think he saw something or simply thought that Dunne was the better option for this game. He says he meets with his staff every day to discuss issues, so that would have come up I'm sure. It's not like MON where every team was the same. We have to get used to different selections from now on, rotations, certain players in certain situations etc. It may not always make sense, and it might not always come off. Hopefully over the course of time it will pay off more often than not.
Well he couldn't have got it more wrong on Saturday.
Shocking decision.
Perhaps, but I don't think it would have made much difference.
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Perhaps, but I don't think it would have made much difference.
You're probably right but it's the message it sends out. I do think he'll get it right more often than not though.
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Perhaps, but I don't think it would have made much difference.
You're probably right but it's the message it sends out. I do think he'll get it right more often than not though.
I don't think it made a particularly large difference on Saturday, it was more the fact that he'd dropped him after spending most of the week lavishing praise on him that struck me as odd.
Still, it's no massive deal.
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I think we could do with getting Patrice Bergues to the club, that'd help sort the defence.
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Perhaps, but I don't think it would have made much difference.
You're probably right but it's the message it sends out. I do think he'll get it right more often than not though.
I was surprised that Carlos was left out but on reflection I think perhaps it's down to what Houllier has said about wanting us to be better at keeping possession and in that respect Dunne is a better bet. he's also a bit more of a leader.
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I understand that that might be what has happened, but I'd have thought the fact that Dunne is currently the only human being visible from space might be warning enough.
I dont think Dunne looked out of shape on Sat.
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Had we taken our chances we'd have been out of sight. That's the bigger issue.
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After the way Carlos played against Wolves, he should have kept his place. While it was'nt the reason why we lost, i feel it was Houiller's first mistake since he's been here.
As for the game, we played well i thought, although we missed Heskey badly when he went off and i did'nt think i'd ever say that. I'm encouraged though. Under Houiller, it looks like we could in time be a very good side.
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Thought NRC was immense always thought he had been short changed by MON.
Probably his best game in a Villa shirt. I was very impressed with him as he looked so controlled and focused, his passing and movement off the ball were both simple and intelligent. I think during the whole 90 minutes he put just one pass astray. Admitedly his shot from outside the box could have been better but overall, a superb display that can only be down to Gary Mac/Sid's coaching and a large injection of confidence.
I remember when we first signed him and how we would develop him into a quality player...well better late than never. Based on Saturday's performance, we may have just prevented throwing a diamond out with the rubbish.
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Oh and the referee was abysmal.
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was dunne all that bad yesterday. looked like he made a couple of great blocks. for me, collins also looks a little out of shape, he never should have left van der vaart for the second goal. Cuellar looks in better shape than both. I think we need to settle on a partnership. It is a very tough one.
Couple of thing we need to sort out. Reo Coker gets caught ahead of the ball too much which is a disaster with Petrov behind him. He tend to get caught positionally a bit. Warnock and Downing let crosses come in far too easy from the left. I wouldnt have Albrighton in the side personally but good that he is getting game time I guess. Organisation wise we need to smarten up a bit. Still in defence have two players going for the ball, workrate of our wide midfielders needs to improve and we have a hole in central midfield. Still with a fully fit firing trio of Gabby, Ireland and Delph to come in plus a couple of signings in jan we might make a late push for Europe again.
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No Dunne was'nt that bad.If you are being over harsh you could possibly say he could have jumped at VDV, to try and put him off rather than head it, but i could'nt fault him for the 2nd.
The reason why 3Gs pick Dunne ahead of Cuellar is because he passes the ball much better.
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No Dunne was'nt that bad.If you are being over harsh you could possibly say he could have jumped at VDV, to try and put him off rather than head it, but i could'nt fault him for the 2nd.
The reason why 3Gs pick Dunne ahead of Cuellar is because he passes the ball much better.
yep, that's how I saw it too. It was a decision that didn't quite work out as planned in hindsight.
So, from the Bee Gees to the Three Gee's.