Aston Villa v Fulham Post-Match Thread

[LeeB]

I thought the introduction of the original 'tech' was supposed to solve all issues?

Does anyone really think further tech is going to make things better?

I said earlier about the geo tags but honestly, it's fucking ridiculous isn't it? Multiple cameras, cutting edge tech, trams of people poring over them in a specially designated location, protocols, pitchside monitors, blah blah fucking blah, and for what? To be worse off than we were before.

[VillaTim]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

[Stu]

It's the same whenever technology meets fallible humans. Aeroplanes for a, possibly, melodramatic example: the tech is solid, they work like they're engineered to. The only reason there are any fuck ups is because of stupid human intervention.

[RamboandBruno]

I thought the introduction of the original 'tech' was supposed to solve all issues?

Does anyone really think further tech is going to make things better?

I said earlier about the geo tags but honestly, it's fucking ridiculous isn't it? Multiple cameras, cutting edge tech, trams of people poring over them in a specially designated location, protocols, pitchside monitors, blah blah fucking blah, and for what? To be worse off than we were before.

This is exactly it. The whole element of this thread has tuned me out, because its so bloody dull…no offence to anyone intended, but cutting edge tech ensuring decisions are to the tenth of a millimetre correct, so what!

I have not looked at one VAR offside decision against a team, when VAR has correctly called offside because someones nostril hair was slightly further forward than the last defender and thought great, this makes the game so much better.

Maybe my memory fails me, but I don’t remember a massive clamour from supporters for this. It was the high profile managers ranting and calling out referees sometimes correctly, sometimes incorrectly but completely blinded by their own bias, er, exactly whats still happening now, except now we have the soul sapping experience of every single goal being viewed and us having to wait for even the most obvious decisions to be rechecked. Its sucking the joy out of it.

[Lastfootstamper]

It's the same whenever technology meets fallible humans. Aeroplanes for a, possibly, melodramatic example: the tech is solid, they work like they're engineered to. The only reason there are any fuck ups is because of stupid human intervention.

I agree, we just don't trust machines, even though they've got no reason or motive to lie or be wrong (yet).
You mention 'planes, then there's autonomous vehicles. "They're awful, did you hear about that one that crashed?". Cocking a deaf 'un to the thousands of crashes that occurred on the same day when a human was allegedly in control.
And medicine. Pile all your symptoms and profile into an algorithm and it'll tell you, almost certainly, what's wrong with you. But we'd rather believe a fallible human who's due at the golf club later because, well, he was wearing a tie.

[Brazilian Villain]

It's the same whenever technology meets fallible humans. Aeroplanes for a, possibly, melodramatic example: the tech is solid, they work like they're engineered to. The only reason there are any fuck ups is because of stupid human intervention.

MCAS?

[Toronto Villa]

I agree stomper. VAR was brought in to rule out clear and obvious errors, but on offside they've tried to be millimetre perfect.

Yep. And if they all said that unless the mistake is glaringly obvious, then the benefit of the doubt goes to the attacking player then it would be overwhelmingly accepted. Because it would and should be the same for everyone. This is where it has failed and why it takes an eternity to make a decision. In the NFL, they go with the on field ruling. So in offside, if the lines official doesn’t raise his/her flag then the VAR check would need to clearly show the player was offside. If it cannot be determined a matter of seconds then the onside ruling would stand. Same the other way around. Would it be perfect? No. But it works both ways and a damn sight better than where we are today.

[dave shelley]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

The game survived for one hundred years plus without too much carping.  Sure there were errors but we went away, moaned a bit but we're there again the next week.  It couldn't have been all that bad because the game evolved into the most popular field sport in the world. 

I'm all for improvement and consistency, which, is only my opinion, you're never going to have, and therein lies the main problem.  Without being patronising and condescending, unless you've actually been involved as a match official and all that goes with it regularly you just don't realise.  Take VAR and put it where it belongs, in the bin! 

[Simon Page]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

I'm guessing you never watched a Premier League, European or international match on telly prior to the introduction of VAR.

[pablo_picasso]

I thought the introduction of the original 'tech' was supposed to solve all issues?

Does anyone really think further tech is going to make things better?

I said earlier about the geo tags but honestly, it's fucking ridiculous isn't it? Multiple cameras, cutting edge tech, trams of people poring over them in a specially designated location, protocols, pitchside monitors, blah blah fucking blah, and for what? To be worse off than we were before.

This is exactly it. The whole element of this thread has tuned me out, because its so bloody dull…no offence to anyone intended, but cutting edge tech ensuring decisions are to the tenth of a millimetre correct, so what!

I have not looked at one VAR offside decision against a team, when VAR has correctly called offside because someones nostril hair was slightly further forward than the last defender and thought great, this makes the game so much better.

Maybe my memory fails me, but I don’t remember a massive clamour from supporters for this. It was the high profile managers ranting and calling out referees sometimes correctly, sometimes incorrectly but completely blinded by their own bias, er, exactly whats still happening now, except now we have the soul sapping experience of every single goal being viewed and us having to wait for even the most obvious decisions to be rechecked. Its sucking the joy out of it.

But its not us as fans who are trying to make these decisions gnats pube accurate.

The concern & suggestion that I personally raised is purely to help fix the problem of them getting help with what they are currently doing.

If I had my way, if a player is in an offside position & he makes a move towards the ball, then it should be considered offside. No first phase, no off a defender who has intended to play the ball, or any other complication that needs a degree in physics & mathematics to be able to understand.

We need to simplify the whole process.

Mostly because footballers are as thick as pig shit, but 99% of officials either don't know or understand the rules & it is often left to my age old rules & regulations nemesis, "subjectivity".

No rules & regulations should be "subjective".

Otherwise we are not playing on a level & fair playing field.

And that 'simplification of rules & regulations' argument could be made across the board, not just offside.

But I know that isn't going to happen, so we work with & discuss improvements to the current situation...

[Somniloquism]

Amazing how many people want VAR changed specifically for offside when our highline works, not just because of the tick-tock of our defenders, but because VAR will pick up the narrow offsides.

[VillaTim]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

I'm guessing you never watched a Premier League, European or international match on telly prior to the introduction of VAR.

eh ? we never had the cameras showing umpteen replays of decisions that looked wrong. It wasn't in the DNA back then

[Somniloquism]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

I'm guessing you never watched a Premier League, European or international match on telly prior to the introduction of VAR.

eh ? we never had the cameras showing umpteen replays of decisions that looked wrong. It wasn't in the DNA back then

1966 World Cup final wants a word.

However until Sky came along, most matches were not televised or had a solitary camera for MOTD highlights. That was 30 years ago. Since then, there has been loads of contentious decisions shown a month.

2010 was when VAR was first considered after FIFA had previously rubbished it. The Lampard "Goal" in the 2010 world cup seemed to be the catalyst for it and probably was more through embarrasment on such an error at a prestigious tournament a week or so after Blatter had said no.

[olaftab]

Amazing how many people want VAR changed specifically for offside when our highline works, not just because of the tick-tock of our defenders, but because VAR will pick up the narrow offsides.

This. We need VAR.

[Simon Page]

We don't know how bad it was before as the errors were never checked or scrutinised. I imagine it was horrendous

I'm guessing you never watched a Premier League, European or international match on telly prior to the introduction of VAR.

eh ? we never had the cameras showing umpteen replays of decisions that looked wrong. It wasn't in the DNA back then

When is back then? Football coverage since Sky has been 45 minutes followed by the studio arguing about and replaying every decision, followed by 45 minutes followed by the studio arguing about and replaying every decision. Then we could do it all again on the highlights, just with less football to interrupt the arguing and slo-mos. The only difference now is we also get to argue about whether it should have gone to VAR or not plus whether VAR got it wrong. Scrutiny is the same, it's just the arguing that has grown.