Fans Worried Over Villa Future

[Chris Smith]

There will be no apathy, as I get the feeling that the anger is still simmering from last season.

Possibly, but a couple of signings and a couple of home wins and all is forgiven.

[dave.woodhall]

We are divided as a club fan base, we are apathetic to a degree.

Of course we're divided. There's 30,000-odd of us. Do you really think we should all have the same opinion? It's like saying the country's in a mess becasue the electorate is divided.

Those who don't protest don't want to protest. That's not apathy, it's their choice.

[brian green]

I think we should get back to the core theme of this thread which is worrying.   The planets will remain in their Time Of Pointless Bickering phase until the end of July when they will move into General Bickering phase.   I suggest if barbs we have for each other they are best kept unhurled until there is some concrete evidence to bolster our individual prejudices.   I am very worried as I post this because my son is driving through Munich in his 1982 shirt with his Villa scarf flying from the window of his car.   My deep concern is that he and his friends will be mistaken by the locals for West Ham fans visiting the city to celebrate the rise of Adolf Hitler there in 1933.

[peter w]

We are divided as a club fan base, we are apathetic to a degree.

Of course we're divided. There's 30,000-odd of us. Do you really think we should all have the same opinion? It's like saying the country's in a mess becasue the electorate is divided.

Those who don't protest don't want to protest. That's not apathy, it's their choice.

There's 30 000 of us with the same opinion of Ellis, despite you opining to the opposite in an earlier thread. Whether the wish to protest or not is not the point. The point is that we as a fan base, rightly or wrongly, and I haven't made any point either way about this, are doing very little about it. But, as I said I think that will change very early next season.

Chris, I agree. This is based on my belief that we will see the same next season as the last. if we get off to a decent start then all this is a moot point. The same to a lesser degree, about signings.

[dave.woodhall]

There's 30 000 of us with the same opinion of Ellis, despite you opining to the opposite in an earlier thread.

Now you're just being ridiculous. You think every single Villa supporter wants to get rid of him?

[ROBBO]

I don't believe there are differing opinions about whether Ellis should go for the huge majority of supporters there is no argument, how this translates itself into protest was shown not many weeks ago in the orange balloon fiasco against Oleary where at best it can be said orange ballons were seen at the ground. It does seem however that evert time a poster puts forward an idea for protest there are so many knockers. There may still be some that believe OLeary should be given longer but its been a long time since i've seen any support for Ellis.

[Mister E]

I think the issue is not the number of people who attend the matches. As Dave says, many are not probably inclined to voice their concern over the running of the club and do not have a deep-rooted / blind faith for Villa that translates into anger over the pointless waste of potnetial that the Master of Mediocriy has presided over.
No, the issue is over the number of hard-core supporters who are prepared to do something to right the wrongs of the Ellis-years - many of whom voice their clear anger and frustration in fora like this. We do not appear to have enough angry hard-core fans, yet, to form a critical mass of protesters. Until more of the 'moderates' become hard-core we will continue to lack the people-power that we need.
A lack of credible transfers over the close season and a poor start to the new campaign might just be the tipping-point for some more angry people; but don't hold your breath: our record in this area is not good.

[peter w]

There's 30 000 of us with the same opinion of Ellis, despite you opining to the opposite in an earlier thread.

Now you're just being ridiculous. You think every single Villa supporter wants to get rid of him?

No I'm not. So, if anyones is being ridiculous its your pandering to everyones middle ground. You agree with the sentiment as you've said so on enough occasions. Is the Damascene conversion to the 'lets not get rid of Ellis' either.

a) Devils advocate

b) Arguing for the sake of it

c) Arguing for the sake of the website

d) A truly held belief tha Ellis should remain in charge.


We, and I'm one of the guilty party, harangued Chris Smith over his David O'Leary stance last season. So. I'll ask the same of you Dave. What exactly is your stand poiunt over Doug Ellis. If its that he should go, what is the reason for your stance now?

Don't take this the wrong way, as its meant as a seriou question, are you worried about sales of H&V if you nail your flag to any one mast? If not, I find your stance curious.

[dave.woodhall]

I've seen some nonsense written on here, but the above post must be right up there with the best.

I don't think that every single Villa supporter wants to get rid of Doug Ellis, so according to your twisted logic I must want him to stay.

Have I ever said that? No. Have I said I want him gone? Every time the question's asked. Have I campaigned to get rid of him? Plenty of times. Have I realised that there's no point, because he'll go when he wants to? A few years ago. Have you got any evidence to back up your claim? None at all. Am I getting tired of your regular digs about H&V? Definitely.

[peter w]

Are you just getting frustrated? Where above was a dig? I put some honest questions up, but you want to twist it to some anti H&V thing which is as pathetic as it is childish and stupid.

Just because we may not agree on a certain subject does not mean either of us is anti anything, merely that we are probing ideas about one subject we are all concerned about.

did my 'twisted logic' state you wanted him to stay or did it put questions which you didn't answer? I was one of many people who questioned Chris Smith last season- sorry to use you here Chris- but you are not even attempting to answer any questions that may target your replies.

Regular digs at H&V? Show me a regular dig at H&V.

[ROBBO]

Effdee may have a point maybe the bulk of supporters are not yet angry enough, which begs the point what will it take. It may sound strange but I do have a little sympathy for Oleary at this stage, can't wait for the book to come out. I have absolutely no sympathy for Ellis.

[dave.woodhall]

Are you just getting frustrated? Where above was a dig? I put some honest questions up, but you want to twist it to some anti H&V thing which is as pathetic as it is childish and stupid.

Just because we may not agree on a certain subject does not mean either of us is anti anything, merely that we are probing ideas about one subject we are all concerned about.

did my 'twisted logic' state you wanted him to stay or did it put questions which you didn't answer? I was one of many people who questioned Chris Smith last season- sorry to use you here Chris- but you are not even attempting to answer any questions that may target your replies.

Regular digs at H&V? Show me a regular dig at H&V.

But before that he said.

, if anyones is being ridiculous its your pandering to everyones middle ground. You agree with the sentiment as you've said so on enough occasions. Is the Damascene conversion to the 'lets not get rid of Ellis' either.

And after I'd answered every question he asked he said.

but you are not even attempting to answer any questions that may target your replies.

He also said

are you worried about sales of H&V if you nail your flag to any one mast?

which doesn't seem to show much kn
owledge of H&Vs passim, particularly from someone who has said more than once that it isn't as outspoken as it used to be.

Which is it? Do I want Doug to stay ("Damascene conversion") or go ("You agree with the sentiment").

You twice said I haven't answered questions. Which ones?

You reckon 30,000 people all support your point of view. Where are they?

[peter w]

Bloody hell you really have got problems. Right, lets start again as you obviously are starting an argument that wasn't there.

I stated that you had shown anti- Ellis statements every time previously. You had mentioned that it was time to go. I believed that was a sentiment that all Villa fans shared.

This is the first time anyone has jumped to Ellis's defence in the 'We all want him out' tenet.

The Damascene Conversion comment is how you've flitted (or should I say 'he' all the time? In the mistaken belief that anyone else really gives a shit about our posts, like you do? You think this is a soap opera?) from Ellis Out to well not everyone wants Ellis out. Really? As I said give me 1 poster, or person that you know you is a Villa fan who thinks Ellis is doing a good job and wants him to stay. but that's one of the questions that you said you've answered I suppose.

The question about H&V? Wasn't answered at all. It was a serious question, but as ever, if anyone dares question H&V you throw the toys out of your pram. As, you seem to be an expert at quoting me its strange that you didn't quote me correctly that its not as outspoken as it used to be. Which I believe was a quote from a year ago? Nearly well remembered.

Why are you making such a big noise about this? Something which started with me and Robbo stating that things need to change. That we all want Ellis out, etc etc. Yet you seem to be on a one man crusade looking for an argument that isn't there.

Cut out the HE said bollocks as well. You're not on your soap-box in Speakers Corner.

[dave.woodhall]

I appreciate that there's less than a handful of people who are in the a slightest bit arsed about this thread, so this is my last word on the subject.

Wanting Doug out is a million miles from saying that not everyone wants him to go. If you're going down that daft road, my mate Dave in Shirley - I asked him yesterday and he said he wasn't fussed but he thought Doug had been okay in the past. It wasn't me that started an argument; if you look back you'll see that I pointed out not everyone wants rid of Doug and I don't appreciate this line that anyone who disagrees is somehow splitting the fans. I'd call that a common sense approch but it seems to have touched a nerve somewhere.

I'm not the one with problems, but then again I'm not the one using words like childish, pathetic and bollocks about someone else's opinions and then claiming it's them who started it, miss.

[ROBBO]

Was it only three years ago that we all, me included were pleading with Ellis to get Oleary signed up quick smart before he was snapped up by one of our bigger rivals, when we looked forward to the new season with optimism. I can only hope that there are big surprises in store for the faithfull. Chill out guys.