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Author Topic: Anyone starting to get worried?  (Read 95426 times)

Online olaftab

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1590 on: February 16, 2020, 07:16:32 PM »
Agreed that we are not very good. We are not even good. However to avoid relegation you donít have to be very good, good or even bad. You just have to be not very very bad. We are just that. So we are not nailed on for relegation never have been and never will be till the last game is played. Despite losing two more crucial games we are still not in relegation position. Just need to keep going and picking up points like we have been doing and we will see come the day.

Offline KRS

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1591 on: February 16, 2020, 07:22:32 PM »
At times today we werenít good or even very good...we were excellent. We absolutely dominated Spurs for the first half hour and should have been 2 or 3 up. Unfortunately we do have a flip side to the excellent coin, and that borders on utter shite to sheer incompetence. Weíre so consistently inconsistent even during a 90+ minute game.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1592 on: February 16, 2020, 07:23:19 PM »
I'd go so far as to say we're pretty good in patches - but those patches rarely last entire matches, or multiple matches. 

When we went down in 2016, we rarely looked like a decent side, and although we've struggled, and lost late goals against a lot of sides, we've looked like we could compete and event beat some of the top teams.  I've said previously, but we were within a few minutes of beating Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool this season.  Those were games where we got zero points, but we're not a million miles away from winning a few games like those, and games like today.  It always feels worse losing so late.  Imagine how the Watford fans felt a couple of weeks ago.

Sheff Utd, who everyone agrees are having a brilliant season, have only won 3 more than we have.  The big difference is draws, which we simply can't hold on to for some reason.

I still think we'll be OK, and we'll be a much better side next season with the younger players having had a year's experience and two or three quality additions.

Online dave.woodhall

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1593 on: February 16, 2020, 07:24:34 PM »
Agreed that we are not very good. We are not even good. However to avoid relegation you donít have to be very good, good or even bad. You just have to be not very very bad. We are just that. So we are not nailed on for relegation never have been and never will be till the last game is played. Despite losing two more crucial games we are still not in relegation position. Just need to keep going and picking up points like we have been doing and we will see come the day.

As amfy said a few weeks ago, we'd settle for seventeenth and this is what seventeenth looks like.

Offline Demitri_C

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1594 on: February 16, 2020, 07:29:28 PM »
Yeah my comment was out of order and said in the heat of the moment, for that I apologize.

The over the top hyperbolic nature of certain posters in each and every thread after todays game is very tedious to read though.

I apologise luke. Im hurting tonight and gettkng a lot of aggro from my spurs mates

Offline villa `cross the mersey

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1595 on: February 16, 2020, 07:33:37 PM »
I'd go so far as to say we're pretty good in patches - but those patches rarely last entire matches, or multiple matches. 

When we went down in 2016, we rarely looked like a decent side, and although we've struggled, and lost late goals against a lot of sides, we've looked like we could compete and event beat some of the top teams.  I've said previously, but we were within a few minutes of beating Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool this season.  Those were games where we got zero points, but we're not a million miles away from winning a few games like those, and games like today.  It always feels worse losing so late.  Imagine how the Watford fans felt a couple of weeks ago.

Sheff Utd, who everyone agrees are having a brilliant season, have only won 3 more than we have.  The big difference is draws, which we simply can't hold on to for some reason.

I still think we'll be OK, and we'll be a much better side next season with the younger players having had a year's experience and two or three quality additions.
Good post Smithy .......I wished I shared your optimism :)
I think we have been far too naive in games against the likes of Tottenham and Liverpool et al ......a bit of professionalism is called for to see games out.....I would have thought John Terry would have drummed that into the players

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1596 on: February 16, 2020, 07:39:00 PM »
I'd go so far as to say we're pretty good in patches - but those patches rarely last entire matches, or multiple matches. 

When we went down in 2016, we rarely looked like a decent side, and although we've struggled, and lost late goals against a lot of sides, we've looked like we could compete and event beat some of the top teams.  I've said previously, but we were within a few minutes of beating Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool this season.  Those were games where we got zero points, but we're not a million miles away from winning a few games like those, and games like today.  It always feels worse losing so late.  Imagine how the Watford fans felt a couple of weeks ago.

Sheff Utd, who everyone agrees are having a brilliant season, have only won 3 more than we have.  The big difference is draws, which we simply can't hold on to for some reason.

I still think we'll be OK, and we'll be a much better side next season with the younger players having had a year's experience and two or three quality additions.

Danger with just comparing us to 2016 version is that is simply one of the worst top flight outfits in last 30 years, the points total shows as much. As history has shown though even those types of teams have some good players lurking in them.

I think we're similar to 12-13. Lots of enthusiasm and good play at times but always a sense we're not far from a woeful run of form as happened in the middle part of that season. Vlaar-Delph-Benteke held things together as much as Mings-McGinn-Grealish would if they were all fit at same time.

We were actually in worse shape and still stayed up with our front 3 getting hot that year. Of course didn't then kick on with more bargain based signings that summer.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1597 on: February 16, 2020, 07:42:54 PM »
I'd go so far as to say we're pretty good in patches - but those patches rarely last entire matches, or multiple matches. 

When we went down in 2016, we rarely looked like a decent side, and although we've struggled, and lost late goals against a lot of sides, we've looked like we could compete and event beat some of the top teams.  I've said previously, but we were within a few minutes of beating Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool this season.  Those were games where we got zero points, but we're not a million miles away from winning a few games like those, and games like today.  It always feels worse losing so late.  Imagine how the Watford fans felt a couple of weeks ago.

Sheff Utd, who everyone agrees are having a brilliant season, have only won 3 more than we have.  The big difference is draws, which we simply can't hold on to for some reason.

I still think we'll be OK, and we'll be a much better side next season with the younger players having had a year's experience and two or three quality additions.
Good post Smithy .......I wished I shared your optimism :)
I think we have been far too naive in games against the likes of Tottenham and Liverpool et al ......a bit of professionalism is called for to see games out.....I would have thought John Terry would have drummed that into the players

Ultimately, we lost today because of an individual mistake. The sort of mistake he'll make maybe once in his career.  Not that he'll learn to hoof it next time, but that 99/100 he'll control it, like he does most the time.

If he'd taken the ball down, then messed around with it and been dispossessed to lose the goal, I'd agree it's more of a coaching issue - but missing the ball isn't really about game management, just an individual lapse.

I still feel a bit sick about it to be honest, but I'm sure he feels worse.  It would definitely hurt less to have lost to a piece of individual brilliance.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1598 on: February 16, 2020, 07:49:19 PM »
I'd go so far as to say we're pretty good in patches - but those patches rarely last entire matches, or multiple matches. 

When we went down in 2016, we rarely looked like a decent side, and although we've struggled, and lost late goals against a lot of sides, we've looked like we could compete and event beat some of the top teams.  I've said previously, but we were within a few minutes of beating Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool this season.  Those were games where we got zero points, but we're not a million miles away from winning a few games like those, and games like today.  It always feels worse losing so late.  Imagine how the Watford fans felt a couple of weeks ago.

Sheff Utd, who everyone agrees are having a brilliant season, have only won 3 more than we have.  The big difference is draws, which we simply can't hold on to for some reason.

I still think we'll be OK, and we'll be a much better side next season with the younger players having had a year's experience and two or three quality additions.

Danger with just comparing us to 2016 version is that is simply one of the worst top flight outfits in last 30 years, the points total shows as much. As history has shown though even those types of teams have some good players lurking in them.

I think we're similar to 12-13. Lots of enthusiasm and good play at times but always a sense we're not far from a woeful run of form as happened in the middle part of that season. Vlaar-Delph-Benteke held things together as much as Mings-McGinn-Grealish would if they were all fit at same time.

We were actually in worse shape and still stayed up with our front 3 getting hot that year. Of course didn't then kick on with more bargain based signings that summer.

Indeed, I certainly wasn't trying to draw comparisons between this side and the one in 2016 (they are, as you point out very different). I was merely pointing out that by reading the fatalist reactions of some posters on here you'd think we WERE watching the team of 2016. 

Every fan is entitled to their view, it's their club as much as it is mine, and I hate to think of any fellow Villan feeling shit about our side.  I guess I just struggle to see how we're "definitely down" with 12 games to go and while we're not currently in the relegation places.  We're in a relegation fight, definitely, no doubt about it, but it feels like people are throwing in the towel when the bell's only just gone for the end of the first round.

I just hope the people in and around the changing room have a more positive outlook.

Offline villa `cross the mersey

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1599 on: February 16, 2020, 07:54:54 PM »
One of my neighbours is a close relative of Engels` partner - I'm still waiting to see him to ascertain why Engels has not been making the bench and why the heck he didn't welly it today :)
I like Engels and Mings but they do make some errors - they appear " over confident or cocky" sometimes - hopefully they learn from such blips

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1600 on: February 16, 2020, 07:56:48 PM »
We're not down but with the games running out we simply need to be taking points from games we play reasonably well in. It was only two weeks ago we played pretty poorly at Bournemouth and that was 4 days after a fantastic cup win so a bad performance is normally around the corner and that's why happens with a young team.

Was criminal to lose like we did and in the 94th minute.

Offline Smithy

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1601 on: February 16, 2020, 08:05:24 PM »
One of my neighbours is a close relative of Engels` partner - I'm still waiting to see him to ascertain why Engels has not been making the bench and why the heck he didn't welly it today :)
I like Engels and Mings but they do make some errors - they appear " over confident or cocky" sometimes - hopefully they learn from such blips


I think what you see in Engels and Mings is what you see in pretty much any "ball playing" centre half, which Smith clearly likes to play with. People are still saying this sort of thing about John Stones.  Defenders who just defend and always play the percentage ball don't make these sorts of mistakes, but they also give away possession a lot.  I think ball-playing centre-halves who can defend, rarely make mistakes, and can pass the ball really well are once in a generation - and I don't think Mings and Engels are at that level, you can only hope the can get mistakes down to a level where it's not costing us.

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1602 on: February 16, 2020, 08:14:52 PM »
Ironically didn't think the Spurs CBs were much better at all, I rate Toby but the way Grealish just breezed past him in the first half was funny to watch. Sanchez always struck me as a liability as he comes from the same reading of the game as hause and Konsa. They were poor defending corners all game aswell. Vertonghen was a good CB but also lost pace and can't get in their side anymore.

Ultimately Spurs have the attack to bail them out time and again (they've kept 4 clean sheets all season). We don't.

Don't think there's many world class CBs in the league anymore bar Van Dijk, Laporte and the odd other CB and that's reflected in the top 8 teams struggling to keep clean sheets.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2020, 08:16:34 PM by SoccerHQ »

Offline Demitri_C

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1603 on: February 16, 2020, 08:16:51 PM »

Ironically didn't think the Spurs CBs were much better at all, I rate Toby but the way Grealish just breezed past him in the first half was funny to watch. Sanchez always struck me as a liability as he comes from the same reading of the game as hause and Konsa. They were poor defending corners all game aswell. Vertonghen was a good CB but also lost pace and can't get in their side anymore.

Ultimately Spurs have the attack to bail them out time and again (they've kept 4 clean sheets all season). We don't.

Don't think there's many world class CBs in the league anymore bar Van Dijk, Laporte and the odd other CB and that's reflected in the top 8 teams struggling to keep clean sheets.
I think if we played two uo top we could ahvw win today as their defence was as bad as ours. They know they stole one today

Online Villan82

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #1604 on: February 16, 2020, 10:17:21 PM »
I cannot believe how optimistic I was last May. We had a knack of drawing games in the Championship - it was the thing that held us back from the automatic places - but I thought it would be the thing that would keep us up in the premier league.

I thought we would draw 10-11 this season and win 9-10.

I am alarmed at our inability to draw games. Like, we have thrown away draws against Bournemouth at home, Palace away, Arsenal away, Liverpool at home, Spurs at home. That's five points and I know there are others that I can't just think of. 3-4 extra points right now would be MASSIVE.

It is incredibly frustrating.