Cameron Archer (on loan at Middlesbrough)

[Risso]

Cam’s performance from the game yesterday. He was very good

https://twitter.com/boro_analytics/status/1619655637549600781?s=46&t=_7ifQ0YHfskRgGm4O1ic7g

That touch in the lead up to Boro's first. Filth.

[Meanwood Villa]

My Boro mate is raving about him

[eamonn]

I loved the improvisation by the goalscorer for the headed goal he made. That player could try finish like that 10 more times and it wouldn't come off!

[LeeB]

Cam’s performance from the game yesterday. He was very good

https://twitter.com/boro_analytics/status/1619655637549600781?s=46&t=_7ifQ0YHfskRgGm4O1ic7g

That touch in the lead up to Boro's first. Filth.

The one that takes him inside the defender? Outrageous. He's got it, he should have been given time on the pitch. I think he'd have got it had Gerrard not made such an arse of things and we were in panic mode from the get go.

[Legion]

Definitely.

[Risso]

The one that takes him inside the defender? Outrageous. He's got it, he should have been given time on the pitch. I think he'd have got it had Gerrard not made such an arse of things and we were in panic mode from the get go.

I'd put the blame further back with Lange and Purslow. They ballsed up the recruitment after the sale of Grealish, and we ended up with £50m+ of strikers who couldn't play together. Both Smith and Gerrard were more concerned with trying to sort that out then giving Archer minutes, especially when it started to go wrong for both of them.

[LeeB]

The one that takes him inside the defender? Outrageous. He's got it, he should have been given time on the pitch. I think he'd have got it had Gerrard not made such an arse of things and we were in panic mode from the get go.

I'd put the blame further back with Lange and Purslow. They ballsed up the recruitment after the sale of Grealish, and we ended up with £50m+ of strikers who couldn't play together. Both Smith and Gerrard were more concerned with trying to sort that out then giving Archer minutes, especially when it started to go wrong for both of them.

True, but in fairness Archer exploded out of nowhere really with that hat trick at Barrow a couple on months after we signed Ings.

[Paul.S]

Unless Emery just doesn’t think Archer is either ready or good enough then I don’t see the reason why he’s been let out on loan without a replacement coming in. He’s done well at Preston and now it’s looking good at Middlesbrough for him, surely we should’ve kept him here and at least given him a chance to shine.

[Drummond]

He needs minutes, if he rips it up for Boro, then he'll either come back and be a hit or we'll sell him for good money. I'd love it to be the former, because the local lad come good is the best, but if we're heading where I think the owners and manager want us to go he will have a very tough job on his hands.

Abraham wa a great but didn't get to play for Chelsea, and there are plenty of other players with similar stories.

[Risso]

He needs minutes, if he rips it up for Boro, then he'll either come back and be a hit or we'll sell him for good money. I'd love it to be the former, because the local lad come good is the best, but if we're heading where I think the owners and manager want us to go he will have a very tough job on his hands.

I think that's all true, long term, but with Ings going and seemingly nobody else coming in, he'd surely have got a decent amount of time for us. As with Ings himself, I don't have a problem as such with him going (out on loan again), it just looks strange when you have two goalies and two completely untried youth players on the bench.

[OCD]

I think they thought it would be better for his development to get regular first team football than getting the odd few minutes here and there off the bench. Then West Ham offered us more than we could justify turning down, and we probably discussed it with the player and considered what he wanted to do.

They must have considered what if they can't get someone in, or if Watkins gets injured. They still came to the conclusion that it was the right thing to do.

[Legion]

Cam CAM: https://fb.watch/inljnkabRS/

[Risso]

They still came to the conclusion that it was the right thing to do.

I wouldn't personally trust Lange's conclusions all that much. Anybody thinking that one striker can get you through half a season doesn't deserve to be in a job.

[Smithy]

He needs minutes, if he rips it up for Boro, then he'll either come back and be a hit or we'll sell him for good money. I'd love it to be the former, because the local lad come good is the best, but if we're heading where I think the owners and manager want us to go he will have a very tough job on his hands.

Abraham wa a great but didn't get to play for Chelsea, and there are plenty of other players with similar stories.

The Tammy analogy is a good one.  He went back to Chelsea after his loan with us, as a 22-year-old with some excellent first-team experience, plenty of goals, and became Chelsea's regular number 9.

I think Cam is going to have to go some in the second half of the season to become a first-choice here, but I think another 6 or 7 goals and he could easily be competing for a starting 11 position next season.   I still suspect we're going to bring in another forward (either by tomorrow, or in the summer), so he'll have plenty of competition - but if we don't sign one permanently by tomorrow, and it's only a loan till the summer, then how he does at boro might impact what we decide to do in the transfer market this summer.

What I will say, is that as much as we'd all love another local lad in the team, Unai has seen him up close and personal in training, and for several weeks, so he probably has a good idea of where Cam's potential ceiling is.  I hope he thinks it's high enough to be part of his squad.

[paul_e]

I think they thought it would be better for his development to get regular first team football than getting the odd few minutes here and there off the bench. Then West Ham offered us more than we could justify turning down, and we probably discussed it with the player and considered what he wanted to do.

They must have considered what if they can't get someone in, or if Watkins gets injured. They still came to the conclusion that it was the right thing to do.

I agree with this. When the loan offer came in it was probably best for everyone for him to go and get regular games (and I suspect he'll now be starting most weeks after that performance). It was the right decision at the time and the early signs are that it will prove to be a successful one.

What happened afterwards with Ings has nothing to do with it really. The decision will have been based on a bunch of things; Emery wanted to replace Ings, the money on the table was more than we stood any chance of getting in the summer and Ings wanted to go there. Sellnig him was also not the wrong decision.

What currently looks wrong is that we haven't added another striker, either on loan or permanently. If that's still the case tomorrow night then we've fucked up, but the decisions around Archer and Ings aren't at the heart of that fuck up.