Quote from: Villan82 on July 08, 2020, 11:23:31 AMQuote from: Ads on July 08, 2020, 09:59:54 AMBielsa might get Leeds up in two years. Smith did it in less than one season and with the poorest excuse for a defence at the start of his time that we've had in my lifetime. Dyche has kept a Burnley side up and got them into Europe. Look at their squad, look at their midfield. Why rubbish his achievements which are far greater in the Premier League than Bielsa, who so far, has not managed a single game in the top flight of English football.Thats your problem there. Assuming that being forrin rather than from iNguRlaNd is a prerequisite for success.What nonsense. Utter nonsense.Somebody got out the wrong side of the bed. The season has been a dreadful struggle. Points pissed up the wall in the first half of the season. A monumental waste.Oh thats me told.Nonsense is disregarding English managers achievements like Dyche or Wilder "because its more of the same" or Fat Sam, who keeps clubs up. You can take your pick over styles of football; but all 3 regular achieve success relative to their aims. In the same breath ignoring Bielsa and what he's actually done in English football club compared to what he might. For avoidance of doubt, he took Leeds from top after beating us at Christmas, to watching us get promoted on the tele in May. Of course this season has been a struggle. I hoped for 11th feared 2015/16 cannon fodder, would be happy to stay up. And we still might which will be job jobbed.
Quote from: Ads on July 08, 2020, 09:59:54 AMBielsa might get Leeds up in two years. Smith did it in less than one season and with the poorest excuse for a defence at the start of his time that we've had in my lifetime. Dyche has kept a Burnley side up and got them into Europe. Look at their squad, look at their midfield. Why rubbish his achievements which are far greater in the Premier League than Bielsa, who so far, has not managed a single game in the top flight of English football.Thats your problem there. Assuming that being forrin rather than from iNguRlaNd is a prerequisite for success.What nonsense. Utter nonsense.Somebody got out the wrong side of the bed. The season has been a dreadful struggle. Points pissed up the wall in the first half of the season. A monumental waste.
Bielsa might get Leeds up in two years. Smith did it in less than one season and with the poorest excuse for a defence at the start of his time that we've had in my lifetime. Dyche has kept a Burnley side up and got them into Europe. Look at their squad, look at their midfield. Why rubbish his achievements which are far greater in the Premier League than Bielsa, who so far, has not managed a single game in the top flight of English football.Thats your problem there. Assuming that being forrin rather than from iNguRlaNd is a prerequisite for success.
Pretending things are better than they are is not being supportive. We all show up for games that we know we're going to lose, that's part and parcel of being a supporter. But I watch enough football to know a hopeless case when I see one, and I'm not going to tell my fellow supporters that it's somehow OK that we've stank up the Premier League this season. It's certainly not OK to me.
Quote from: LeeB on July 08, 2020, 02:06:40 PMMaybe the task is beyond him, but maybe the task we had was beyond most managers, rebuilding a squad in a couple of months in the wealthiest league in the world. Are they all 'shit'? It's backwards thinking, it means throwing the baby out with the bathwater every time and it will lead to us being shit for another 10 years if we don't find the magic unicorn that will fix all of our ills.Anyway, weren't you calling for Smith's head when we lost at home to the baggies last season? After what, 4 months in the job?Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is a definition of madness. Smith has to go. Any manager doing this badly would have to go. Did lambert get any better for being kept on at least a season too long? Should we have kept McNeil, Turner, Venglos, Garde? Do you think Leicester regret binning off Pearson, Ranieri and Shakespeare even though they all improved them before faltering? Maybe Man Utd should have kept hold of Moyes for another few years?Plenty of managers have taken teams up and kept them there on less resource. We shouldn't be aspiring to having a manager that 'isn't shit', we should be aiming for good.
Maybe the task is beyond him, but maybe the task we had was beyond most managers, rebuilding a squad in a couple of months in the wealthiest league in the world. Are they all 'shit'? It's backwards thinking, it means throwing the baby out with the bathwater every time and it will lead to us being shit for another 10 years if we don't find the magic unicorn that will fix all of our ills.Anyway, weren't you calling for Smith's head when we lost at home to the baggies last season? After what, 4 months in the job?
I want Pepe and to play the best football imaginable and to win every week.I wouldn't mind Dyche's effectiveness.The problem with Bielsa and Smith, is Smith succeeded, Bielsa failed and quite spectacularly too. He may still get them up this season, stands a good chance.
We should have sacked Taylor in 89. And Little for taking us so close to relegation. And Saunders when we were going backwards after 77 etc. Everton should have sacked Kendall, blah de blah.And choosing Man Utd as an example in this case is probably not the wisest.Anyway, it's all just scapegoating, the mob have had enough and they want a head. In football it's usually the manager, and to hell with trying to sort out the real issues we'll just bring in the next scapegoat that will fail to meet expectations.It just feels dumb.
It never ceases to amaze me how much moaning goes on about the perceived moaning or pessimism. As if there's something incomprehensible about why people are pessimistic at this particular moment in time.
Quote from: ASHTONVILLA on July 08, 2020, 02:45:59 PMQuote from: LeeB on July 08, 2020, 02:06:40 PMMaybe the task is beyond him, but maybe the task we had was beyond most managers, rebuilding a squad in a couple of months in the wealthiest league in the world. Are they all 'shit'? It's backwards thinking, it means throwing the baby out with the bathwater every time and it will lead to us being shit for another 10 years if we don't find the magic unicorn that will fix all of our ills.Anyway, weren't you calling for Smith's head when we lost at home to the baggies last season? After what, 4 months in the job?Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is a definition of madness. Smith has to go. Any manager doing this badly would have to go. Did lambert get any better for being kept on at least a season too long? Should we have kept McNeil, Turner, Venglos, Garde? Do you think Leicester regret binning off Pearson, Ranieri and Shakespeare even though they all improved them before faltering? Maybe Man Utd should have kept hold of Moyes for another few years?Plenty of managers have taken teams up and kept them there on less resource. We shouldn't be aspiring to having a manager that 'isn't shit', we should be aiming for good.We should have sacked Taylor in 89. And Little for taking us so close to relegation. And Saunders when we were going backwards after 77 etc. Everton should have sacked Kendall, blah de blah.And choosing Man Utd as an example in this case is probably not the wisest.Anyway, it's all just scapegoating, the mob have had enough and they want a head. In football it's usually the manager, and to hell with trying to sort out the real issues we'll just bring in the next scapegoat that will fail to meet expectations.It just feels dumb.
Quote from: hilts_coolerking on July 08, 2020, 03:01:54 PMIt never ceases to amaze me how much moaning goes on about the perceived moaning or pessimism. As if there's something incomprehensible about why people are pessimistic at this particular moment in time.It's not the pessimism that's difficult to understand; it's the relentlessness.