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Author Topic: Ahmed Elmohamady - released  (Read 59508 times)

Offline peter w

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #240 on: July 26, 2017, 08:26:51 AM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

Offline eamonn

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #241 on: July 26, 2017, 08:53:57 AM »
We saw in the second half against Brighton how much better we are as an attacking force when Davis played hold up. Hogan and Kodjia need a pivotal player to play off.  Holding the ball on the edge of the opposition box might even encourage our midfield to make a dart or two.

Agreed, have been very impressed with Davis' ability to hold the ball when I've seen him. The fact he's got some pace too makes him a real talent but I guess we'll only see him in cameos.

Offline Matt Collins

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #242 on: July 26, 2017, 10:47:25 AM »
I didn't see Davis v Brighton

From pre season he didn't look great / ready to me. Held it up against weak challenges, but seems very one footed and not sure he's the technique. But can't judge on pre season

Offline LeeB

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #243 on: July 26, 2017, 11:03:36 PM »
I didn't see Davis v Brighton

From pre season he didn't look great / ready to me. Held it up against weak challenges, but seems very one footed and not sure he's the technique. But can't judge on pre season

Being very one footed hasn't hindered virtually every left footed player ever born.

Offline pauliewalnuts

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #244 on: July 26, 2017, 11:05:57 PM »
I know he's a kid, and I know he's had barely a look in, but I thought Davis looked like a fan who'd wandered onto the pitch when I saw him play (against Brighton). He seemed extremely slow and ponderous.

Offline Lastfootstamper

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #245 on: July 26, 2017, 11:14:47 PM »
I didn't see Davis v Brighton

From pre season he didn't look great / ready to me. Held it up against weak challenges, but seems very one footed and not sure he's the technique. But can't judge on pre season

Being very one footed hasn't hindered virtually every left footed player ever born.

Online Toronto Villa

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #246 on: July 26, 2017, 11:15:35 PM »
I know he's a kid, and I know he's had barely a look in, but I thought Davis looked like a fan who'd wandered onto the pitch when I saw him play (against Brighton). He seemed extremely slow and ponderous.

Thought the same in the recent games in Germany. I didn't see what the fuss was all about. I can see what people see in Green, RHM has done it at a lower level so the jury is out. JDH looked excellent and the most exciting of them all.

Offline tomd2103

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #247 on: July 26, 2017, 11:52:00 PM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

I just can't see Hogan and Kodjia hitting it off to be honest Peter.  I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede and was running on to his flick ons.  I think Hogan would be more suited to playing with someone like Grealish who can get the ball on the turn in the final third and pick out his runs.  Don't think Kodjia will be fit for the start of the season, so I would go with Grealish and Hogan against Watford on Saturday and see how that goes.

Offline pauliewalnuts

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #248 on: July 26, 2017, 11:55:01 PM »
I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede

In fairness, Stephen Hawking would look relatively dangerous playing next to Gestede.

Online paul_e

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #249 on: July 27, 2017, 12:30:32 AM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

I just can't see Hogan and Kodjia hitting it off to be honest Peter.  I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede and was running on to his flick ons.  I think Hogan would be more suited to playing with someone like Grealish who can get the ball on the turn in the final third and pick out his runs.  Don't think Kodjia will be fit for the start of the season, so I would go with Grealish and Hogan against Watford on Saturday and see how that goes.

I think They can become a good partnership but it means hard work on the training ground getting them used to how the other plays.  Kodjia naturally draws defenders out of position because he's capable of making half a yard and then has the ability to hit the target once he's has that space.  This should open gaps for Hogan to run into but he needs to learn to time those runs and Kodjia needs to know that he'll make them.  Last season our entire attack looked like they only played together on match days so everything was utterly disjointed.  That's why I don't accept the idea that Bruce deserved a pass and should be judged from now.  A proper plan in training could've had problems like this solved well before the end of the season and now injury means they'll not have worked together all summer so nothing will have changed and we know from experience that it won't happen during the season.

Offline tomd2103

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #250 on: July 27, 2017, 12:38:21 AM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

I just can't see Hogan and Kodjia hitting it off to be honest Peter.  I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede and was running on to his flick ons.  I think Hogan would be more suited to playing with someone like Grealish who can get the ball on the turn in the final third and pick out his runs.  Don't think Kodjia will be fit for the start of the season, so I would go with Grealish and Hogan against Watford on Saturday and see how that goes.

I think They can become a good partnership but it means hard work on the training ground getting them used to how the other plays.  Kodjia naturally draws defenders out of position because he's capable of making half a yard and then has the ability to hit the target once he's has that space.  This should open gaps for Hogan to run into but he needs to learn to time those runs and Kodjia needs to know that he'll make them.  Last season our entire attack looked like they only played together on match days so everything was utterly disjointed.  That's why I don't accept the idea that Bruce deserved a pass and should be judged from now.  A proper plan in training could've had problems like this solved well before the end of the season and now injury means they'll not have worked together all summer so nothing will have changed and we know from experience that it won't happen during the season.

Having watched them play together a few times last season Paul, I think there is always going to be a lack of a focal point with those two playing together.  Kodjia likes to drift into wide areas and Hogan really plays on the shoulder of defenders.  There isn't that target man type or a 'number 10' who can get the ball to feet and create things. 

Offline Matt Collins

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #251 on: July 27, 2017, 06:32:40 AM »
I agree - neither a target man or number 10 in that partnership.

That can work, but it's why I don't think we'll play  both upfront together week in and week out. But I do think a proper no 9 would be a good squad addition (not convinced gabby or Davis can offer this)

Offline passitsideways

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #252 on: July 27, 2017, 08:10:12 AM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

I just can't see Hogan and Kodjia hitting it off to be honest Peter.  I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede and was running on to his flick ons.  I think Hogan would be more suited to playing with someone like Grealish who can get the ball on the turn in the final third and pick out his runs.  Don't think Kodjia will be fit for the start of the season, so I would go with Grealish and Hogan against Watford on Saturday and see how that goes.

I think They can become a good partnership but it means hard work on the training ground getting them used to how the other plays.  Kodjia naturally draws defenders out of position because he's capable of making half a yard and then has the ability to hit the target once he's has that space.  This should open gaps for Hogan to run into but he needs to learn to time those runs and Kodjia needs to know that he'll make them.  Last season our entire attack looked like they only played together on match days so everything was utterly disjointed.  That's why I don't accept the idea that Bruce deserved a pass and should be judged from now.  A proper plan in training could've had problems like this solved well before the end of the season and now injury means they'll not have worked together all summer so nothing will have changed and we know from experience that it won't happen during the season.

Having watched them play together a few times last season Paul, I think there is always going to be a lack of a focal point with those two playing together.  Kodjia likes to drift into wide areas and Hogan really plays on the shoulder of defenders.  There isn't that target man type or a 'number 10' who can get the ball to feet and create things.

Jack's the number 10 - his off-the-ball movement's fine, and he should be the one who benefits the most from Terry's ability to pass through the lines. Of course, the issue with him is what he does once he gets on it - his decision-making and speed of thought can be so rubbish.

Offline tomd2103

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #253 on: July 27, 2017, 08:58:41 AM »
I agree - he was our season and without him we were toothless. So you develop an alternative. The problem I had and still have is that we were an eggs in one basket team. The style he plays (Kodjia) means he is difficult to play in a 4-4-2 as he very much likes to drift wide meaning that other players need to get into the box, also rendering the wide player useless for much of the time unless they too have a physical presence in the box, or can finish.

Seeing the goals and chances Hogan scored/attempted v Duisburg it is clear that he is a player who does his best work in the box, a finisher. We have two distinct different forwards and we have to try and see if they can play together because we will destroy teams if they can. If they can't we then have to go back and look at our set-up and think which player as the forward option is best for the team and how we play. i think that is Hogan. Players tried to get into the box on Sunday, and it'll be interesting to see how we go v Watford. I'd be tempted to stick Gabby and Hogan up front and ask Gabby to drift left a la Kodjia to see if the team can play with the shape we would need if Hogan and Kodjia were up top together.

I just can't see Hogan and Kodjia hitting it off to be honest Peter.  I thought Kodjia looked most dangerous last season when he was partnered with Gestede and was running on to his flick ons.  I think Hogan would be more suited to playing with someone like Grealish who can get the ball on the turn in the final third and pick out his runs.  Don't think Kodjia will be fit for the start of the season, so I would go with Grealish and Hogan against Watford on Saturday and see how that goes.

I think They can become a good partnership but it means hard work on the training ground getting them used to how the other plays.  Kodjia naturally draws defenders out of position because he's capable of making half a yard and then has the ability to hit the target once he's has that space.  This should open gaps for Hogan to run into but he needs to learn to time those runs and Kodjia needs to know that he'll make them.  Last season our entire attack looked like they only played together on match days so everything was utterly disjointed.  That's why I don't accept the idea that Bruce deserved a pass and should be judged from now.  A proper plan in training could've had problems like this solved well before the end of the season and now injury means they'll not have worked together all summer so nothing will have changed and we know from experience that it won't happen during the season.

Having watched them play together a few times last season Paul, I think there is always going to be a lack of a focal point with those two playing together.  Kodjia likes to drift into wide areas and Hogan really plays on the shoulder of defenders.  There isn't that target man type or a 'number 10' who can get the ball to feet and create things.

Jack's the number 10 - his off-the-ball movement's fine, and he should be the one who benefits the most from Terry's ability to pass through the lines. Of course, the issue with him is what he does once he gets on it - his decision-making and speed of thought can be so rubbish.

Agree and if Grealish can start having the kind of impact we all hope he will, he could really be the difference this season.  He really should be too good for this league and should be regularly contributing both goals and assists.  As I said before, I would start him and Hogan together on Saturday. 

Offline old man villa fan

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Re: Ahmed Elmohamady - SIGNED
« Reply #254 on: July 27, 2017, 09:05:52 AM »
[quote author=passitsideways

Jack's the number 10 - his off-the-ball movement's fine, and he should be the one who benefits the most from Terry's ability to pass through the lines. Of course, the issue with him is what he does once he gets on it - his decision-making and speed of thought can be so rubbish.
[/quote]

He wants to make things happen but he needs players to be moving into space.  Just moving the ball on for the sake of it doesn't create good opportunities.  Speed of thought/instinctiveness relies on vision but is totally reliant on other players movement.  Similarly, decision making requires options.

His best spell and possibly his only consistent spell was working with Benteke and Delph when Sherwood came in.  There was movement all around him that took players away from him and gave him options.

 


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