International Rugby

[peter w]

It's disappointing as well seeing how much everyone was interested in seeing Italy this year genuinely believing that they could win one or maybe even two. Now with Georgia breathing down their necks they need to come up with something in the next two games.

As for their tactics? Well I don't care really. you don't score 15 points and should have had more if you're just spoiling the game and stopping the other team. They had a plan and by making it disjointed they gave themselves every chance. they brought us down to their level and with 15 minutes or so to go it was by no means a guaranteed victory.   

[cheltenhamlion]

They will change the rules about that in the not too distant future.

[Jon Crofts]

They will change the rules about that in the not too distant future.

The 'get stuck into the ruck you big Nancy rule'

[nigel]

It's disappointing as well seeing how much everyone was interested in seeing Italy this year genuinely believing that they could win one or maybe even two. Now with Georgia breathing down their necks they need to come up with something in the next two games.

As for their tactics? Well I don't care really. you don't score 15 points and should have had more if you're just spoiling the game and stopping the other team. They had a plan and by making it disjointed they gave themselves every chance. they brought us down to their level and with 15 minutes or so to go it was by no means a guaranteed victory.

12 of those points were easily avoidable, though.
I'm not taking away any credit from the players who scored, they did really well, but, It wasn't Italy's brilliance, It was more to do with England being inept.

[Dave Cooper please]

Wasn't one of Italy's tries that once a season chance of hitting the posts and it falling perfectly for an Italian? So hardly inepness from England or a tactical masterclass from Italy, just pure luck (unless he aimed for it in which case ben fatto!).

[peter w]

You could argue that, but the point also that the italians were only 20 yards away or so and kicking for 3 points which they turned into 7. Plus they missed, what, 3 other very kickable penalties in the first half. They should have given England a mountain to climb second half so its not as if they were hanging on 5-0 down or summat.

[Jon Crofts]

Add Mike Brown's tackle dodge on Campagnaro and there's another 5 points you can take off Italy.

[nigel]

Wasn't one of Italy's tries that once a season chance of hitting the posts and it falling perfectly for an Italian? So hardly inepness from England or a tactical masterclass from Italy, just pure luck (unless he aimed for it in which case ben fatto!).

It was inept from England as the Italian ran between 3 or 4 players to get to the ball.
England players didn't react, that, for me, at that level is inept.

[Dave Cooper please]

Wasn't one of Italy's tries that once a season chance of hitting the posts and it falling perfectly for an Italian? So hardly inepness from England or a tactical masterclass from Italy, just pure luck (unless he aimed for it in which case ben fatto!).

It was inept from England as the Italian ran between 3 or 4 players to get to the ball.
England players didn't react, that, for me, at that level is inept.

Maybe, but you just don't expect it. I played for several years and I can only recollect something similar happening once or twice, the one time I really recollect is when the rebound fell towards me and the only thing I could think to do was hoof it on the volley out of play! Prevented a try mind as two opposition players were bearing down on me. Okay so professional players should be more alert but I doubt they teach that in training much, they would all have been thinking about the restart and the next possession.

[nigel]

Wasn't one of Italy's tries that once a season chance of hitting the posts and it falling perfectly for an Italian? So hardly inepness from England or a tactical masterclass from Italy, just pure luck (unless he aimed for it in which case ben fatto!).

It was inept from England as the Italian ran between 3 or 4 players to get to the ball.
England players didn't react, that, for me, at that level is inept.

Maybe, but you just don't expect it. I played for several years and I can only recollect something similar happening once or twice, the one time I really recollect is when the rebound fell towards me and the only thing I could think to do was hoof it on the volley out of play! Prevented a try mind as two opposition players were bearing down on me. Okay so professional players should be more alert but I doubt they teach that in training much, they would all have been thinking about the restart and the next possession.

If that was the case they shouldn't be playing international rugby, Dave.
Yes, I doubt they train for that sort of thing, but, they should have been aware that it could happe.
I played at a decent standard, no where near these guys, though, and it was second nature to watch the kick.

[paul_e]

On that kick I think England switched off a little because it was a simple 3 pointer, even accounting for conditions a kick from the edge of the 22 10-15m wide of the posts has got to be points in the bag at international level.  Add to that the fact that there was so little time left on the clock that it was effectively half time in a game where they'd been out thought and I think they did just switch off a touch.  I'm much more forgiving of that one than I am with Ford allowing himself to be shrugged off with minimal effort and Brown deciding to, I assume, tie his laces instead of making a tackle.

Moving on, I see the try tracker thing on the rfu site has Daly down as the 'key influencer' for England.  For anyone who's never seen it they basically smash together all the stats for the players and work out who had the biggest effect on the result.  The way it works is really good because it takes some focus away from the amount of involvement and looks more at the quality of those involvements which gives people like wingers a much fairer 'crack' than they often get because their position requires them to not get involved in the stuff on the floor, etc.

It's here: http://www.englandrugby.com/trytracker/fixtures/943/2017/20170226/899466/#/keyinfluencers

I'm glad that the numbers back up my opinion that Daly was the best player on the pitch.

[cheltenhamlion]

Billy V back in the match day squad for Saturday.

[Jon Crofts]

Rumour has it he's in the starting 15.

[cheltenhamlion]

That would be daft given the results in his absence and his lack of rugby. Let him bully the Sweaties for 25 minutes off the bench.

[Dante Lavelli]

Rumour has it he's in the starting 15.

At the moment Hughes' greater mobility strikes me a more effective weapon as a 'finisher' anyway.  Plus it must be hard to know at what point Billy will start blowing out his arse, so better to have someone ready to come on for him rather than introduce him in the 50th minute only to learn he has 20 minutes in the tank.