International Rugby

[paul_e]

A large part of me wants Scotland to win this now. We have been the Burnley of Rugby today.

We have been like that for too long now.  Compounded by the fact that there’s such a wealth of talent.  The 9/10 axis needs a rethink.

8 as well, Vunipola was shit and more importantly fucking lazy today. Anyone who watches that today and thinks Simmonds wouldn't be a massive upgrade needs to give their head a wobble. Sadly the guy picking the team is one of them.

[taylorsworkrate]

A large part of me wants Scotland to win this now. We have been the Burnley of Rugby today.

I'll never want them to lose but if it means Jones completely rethinks everything he's done since the world cup I'll accept it because we've been sub-standard ever since SA did a number on us.

I think Jones is too arrogant for that. He shot his mouth off over the criticism after we narrowly beat the French 3rd team.

[luke:lamf]

The weirdest thing, and I swear this is true, is that around the 60 minute mark I realised I had no idea who the England centres were. Couldn't say who was 12 and 13 as didn't see them get near the ball. I presume Slade was 13, but who was 12 ?

[paul_e]

The weirdest thing, and I swear this is true, is that around the 60 minute mark I realised I had no idea who the England centres were. Couldn't say who was 12 and 13 as didn't see them get near the ball. I presume Slade was 13, but who was 12 ?

Ollie Lawrence, got 1 touch in 6o odd minutes and then got subbed off, he'll probably get dropped to put farrell back there because Jones has lost the fucking plot.

[luke:lamf]

Also, has Billy V made a single yard with ball-in-hand since 2018 ? I remember saying during the WC that he looked unrecognisable from the wrecking ball of old, and today all I saw was a yellow card from a chunky doppelganger.

[PaulWinch again]

How many times is it that Jones has come out saying he hasn’t prepared the team properly? Didn’t he say exactly the same after we lost to France last year? Just what the fuck are you playing at then Eddie?

[Gareth]

Surely there is an English scrum half better than Youngs?? Even in his pomp (if he ever had one) he was a half decent replacement for last 25 minutes.

Billy V is shot on that performance, just lumbered round like it was a vets match.

If that is the way Jones wants England to play they might as well pick 12 forwards because box kicking everything means there is zero chance 10,12 or 13 get a chance to do anything.

Scotland walked that on passion alone

[taylorsworkrate]

How many times is it that Jones has come out saying he hasn’t prepared the team properly? Didn’t he say exactly the same after we lost to France last year? Just what the fuck are you playing at then Eddie?

It's a tired, easy get out to not have to admit that our shit anti rugby tactics have been exposed by a team that wanted to play rugby. We've scraped past some poor teams playing it and Jones takes that as all is well in the camp.

There is way too much talent in the English game for the  national team to play so soullessly

[nigel]

Also, has Billy V made a single yard with ball-in-hand since 2018 ? I remember saying during the WC that he looked unrecognisable from the wrecking ball of old, and today all I saw was a yellow card from a chunky doppelganger.

I’ve been saying for some time now that Sam Simmonds should be in.

[paul_e]

Surely there is an English scrum half better than Youngs?? Even in his pomp (if he ever had one) he was a half decent replacement for last 25 minutes.

Billy V is shot on that performance, just lumbered round like it was a vets match.

If that is the way Jones wants England to play they might as well pick 12 forwards because box kicking everything means there is zero chance 10,12 or 13 get a chance to do anything.

Scotland walked that on passion alone

Dan Robson, allowed to play his natural game, is a massive upgrade at 9 and there's 3-4 options for the bench that are better than youngs as well Randall and Mitchell being the 2 that are around the England squad. So long as he ignores Spencer (who would just be in for his box kick) I don't think he could get it all that wrong by picking any club except Leicester and picking their best English 9, it'd probably be an upgrade.

Vunipola has lost the bit of mobility he had and just can't get round the pitch now, Wilson was fucking shit as well. Willis, Earl and particularly Simmonds should be joining Underhill and Curry as the back row options.

The biggest problem is the insistence on picking kickers that he trusts in the backs. I'd give this lot the rest of this 6N and if they're still kicking the ball away I'd replace pretty much all of them. Ford, Farrell, Slade, Watson and Daly probably all need to be left out for a while:

Robson, Smith; Lawrence, Marchant; Odogwu, May, Furbank

would be my backline on current form with Michell/Randall, O'Connor, Malins as the replacements. I know May was awful today but he's been one of the 3-4 best wingers in the world in the last 2 years so he has credit in the bank with me.

Props, Locks and Curry were fine today, George looked short of matches (and threw terribly) but again has credit in the bank. With the props we have to come back and Launchbury to come into the mix I'm fine with that part of the field, even if the scrum struggled today, I put most of the fault there with Jones for picking players that just weren't fit.

[nordenvillain]

Sorry, for all you have been championing Robson, I thought he was awful and far worse than Youngs today. England either have to play a kicking game that puts pressure on the opposition back 3 or develop a better running game.  Ford at least has the ability to get the runners over the gainline and through gaps. Farrell is nowhere near a top class 10 these days, he's better at 12 now on the international stage.

[Dante Lavelli]

This 6-Nations will be weird regardless.  Saracens players will be under-cooked, no crowds etc.  It’d be a shame if we use this period to trot down the same path, rinse and repeat.  It’d be better if we told Itoje, Farrell and Vinipola to take a year off.  The vacuum would create opportunities and encourage players to step up.

[Dante Lavelli]

Amongst my (our) whingeing, it has to be said Scotland were superb.  I’d be happy if they can maintain it and win the 6-nations.

[paul_e]

Sorry, for all you have been championing Robson, I thought he was awful and far worse than Youngs today. England either have to play a kicking game that puts pressure on the opposition back 3 or develop a better running game.  Ford at least has the ability to get the runners over the gainline and through gaps. Farrell is nowhere near a top class 10 these days, he's better at 12 now on the international stage.

Robson today wasn't the player who's been running games for Wasps for the last few years, he kicked a lot more and the runners around him were awful. He is a proper 9 though, mainly because his passes generally go into 'the box' rather than being head high, knee high or 2 yards in front of the player which are all Youngs specialities.

[paul_e]

Amongst my (our) whingeing, it has to be said Scotland were superb.  I’d be happy if they can maintain it and win the 6-nations.

Scotland were excellent but their 2 best players are Hogg and Russell and we played in a way that gave those 2 time and space to control the match.