Brigada Corner

[dave.woodhall]

I'm still waiting to know what their politics are.

[Clampy]

I was under the impression that they formed to help build an atmosphere at Villa Park. I'm not aware of any other motives either.

[purpletrousers]

Why can you not accept politics and football should be kept separate , hooliganism was tribalism . is politics not the same under a different banner .
   

Because anti-racism and anti-fascism are not about poltics. They're about right and wrong.

As for the rest of your post, you've not bothered addressing any of the questions i put to you, beyond going on about Celtic and politics, which is largely irrelevant here.

And maybe the people who were talking about a Petrov benefit match weren't thinking about politics at all, they were thinking about charity?

I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in sectarian politics, zero. I don't care. I don't even like to see them discussed here, because it always ends up in a gigantic row which is exactly the same as the last row we had about them.

I am, however, able to see the difference between right and wrong when it comes to fascism and racism, and the "i just want to keep ALL politics out of football" is absolutely irrelevant when it comes to that.

These Brigada kids are about standing up, singing a lot and waving banners. It's not the sort of thing I'd be into at my age, but then again, how many 40 something men would be. You seem to have an agenda against them based on them feeling some sort of kinship with Celtic, which you've then spun out to mean that, actually, they're a bunch of British troop hating fenians (and yes, I've seen the banners at some Celtic matches, and I find them abhorrent, too).

Once again, it seems your main objection is to people whose politics might not tally with your own rather than some altruistic desire to keep politics out of football.

Thanks for your reply , I will try and respond as eloquently

Fascism and anti fascism is about beliefs , the right and wrong of those beliefs are in the eye of the beholder.

as I said I dislike both .     as should everyone for the moment they enter AV .

Catholic and Protestants.   Muslims and Jews  what has that got to do with Football .

As for kids  , are you sure ?  without being rude do you sit by them , have you looked at the Videos , they are not young kids , but the ones getting banned from the ground for three years are. 

plenty of 40 year olds in their ranks .

Ineherent contradiction surely.
You dislike racism, therefore you are anti-racsim. You can't dislike both.

That doesn't mean you are going to be anti-racist as part of a compounded far left viewpoint, whilst that is possible.

I think the reason this debate has rolled on a few pages is that people are are surprised at anyone taking issue at anti-racist banners. I just found out last night a friend I live with wouldn't be here, if his 7yo Gran hadn't been sent away out of Nazi Germany on a train full of Jewish children to the UK. The rest of the family left behind were murdered.

I *know* you aren't defending racism/fascism Sunny, but wouldn't there be a risk of politicising something that isn't so obviously political (whilst it might be part of some people's broader Ideology?) Or unhelpfully generalising some people's politics to a whole group of people?

At a time like the Syrian crisis, who'd be a politician? However, every act we take can be seen as a ethical and political act.

Do we buy fair trade coffee?  I do, it doesn't make me a Marxist. Neither does wearing an anti-racist badge.

I'm anti-hate on any level, i take that a bit further than some, i won't even sing anti-Blues or any club songs, yet come away from a match with a croaky voice from getting behind the lads vociferously.

I once joined the Anti-Nazi League as a youngster - appreciated the  pastor Niemölle poem - but then tore up my card when i found they sought to ban books - I'm more for the engage & discuss school of change, not making martyrs.

I have however fantasised about a fan led human rights or anti-racist or anti-homophobia/peaceful football fans/something group that made big patches we could adaptively design to cover over club sponsors we don't particularly want to promote a company on our shirts as fans.

Being alive is political.

Villa, Germany 1938.  The day after the England game when our *national team* were reluctantly pressured into giving the salute, our boys apparently spontaneously after a match of bad atmosphere, refuse to give the Nazi salute, they draw a line (they are forced by diplomats to shift a few days later in Stuggart). Are they being political for not giving a Nazi Salute?
I think we probably all know the story, links here.
http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=46090.0

Barca, anti-Franco...
There was a great Football and fascism documentary on the beeb a few years back... Nazi Germany team, Munich Olympics, we could go on. Fascinating how it obviously is used as a tool by politicians...

I wasn't aware there was a law to keep politics, or indeed more correctly human rights out of football? There is a difference.

Your choice, not mine. Not my rules.

Me, i just stand up for what is right where i can. If it means challenging a fellow Villa fan for being racist or homophobic I've done it and will do it, e.g. shameful racist chanting from some very young Villa lads @WHL a few years back. Is that not allowed?

Incidentally I agree to a degree about breaking rules/laws.
I find it a much more radical idea to do the hard work to change rules

Good luck to those in the long battle to secure safe standing...

[Percy McCarthy]

Great point about Villa in Germany '38. As a club, we nailed our colours to the mast that day, anybody saying we should not continue in that tradition, as fans, players or officials, is sullying the memory of that marvellous gesture.

Congratulations though, to sunny villa and his acolytes: you have posted without doubt the biggest crock of absolute shit I have ever read on H&V, and I've read some of the conspiracy thread.

[Legion]

Link to their site

[Legion]

Following a meeting of like minded Villa supporters on the 14th August an Aston Villa ultras group was formed, the name of this group is Brigada 1874. The group is composed of those who bleed claret and blue and want to bring colour, vibrancy, noise and passion to the terraces.

In the modern game where many a good supporter has been pushed away from the ground by high ticket prices and draconian policing while those who remain are often subject to over zealous stewarding we want to take something back for those who make the game what it is. We aim to follow in the tradition of ultra groups in Europe and learn from the example made by the handful of ultra groups who've been active in the UK over the past few years.

The group is currently in it's embryonic stages and the next few months will be spent setting the foundations of the group, designing displays and making banners and flags. Owing to the fact that those involved are based in various areas of Villa Park our first appearances this season are likely to be at away games.

The group is based upon five basic principles, these are;

-We support the players for the entirety of the game no matter how well or poorly we are playing.
-We stand throughout the game
-We make as much noise and create as big a scene as possible on the terraces.
-We are anti-fascist, anti-racist and non-sectarian. Those who promote division based upon ethnicity, religion or nationality will not be tolerated in the group.
-We act in unsion as a group, while we may have differences of opinion on some issues regarding the club we will always act in unity and back one another up at the game.
 
Those who are interested in getting involved with the group can contact us here via pm or email us at brigada1874 @ gmail . com. Prospective members should agree with the founding principles and bring that spirit into the group. All potential members will be vetted.

Read more: http://brigada1874ultras.proboards.com/thread/618/who#ixzz2dRfQQ43h

[Legion]

[pauliewalnuts]

Fascism and anti fascism is about beliefs , the right and wrong of those beliefs are in the eye of the beholder.

as I said I dislike both .     as should everyone for the moment they enter AV .

You dislike anti-fascism and fascism? What about racism and anti-racism.

And why on earth should people drop their beliefs when they walk into a football ground? We're supposed to spurn anti-racists because we're at Villa Park?

Why do you seem less willing to spurn your views re Brigada's links with Celtic's ultras (which I am imagining goes about as deep as a link on their website) when you enter Villa Park yourself?

If it's alright with you, I'll stay anti-fascist and anti-racist when i attend matches, just as I am sure you don't become Ban-Ki Moon on the subject of sectarianism when you attend.

As Percy said, congratulations, though, the last few pages of this thread truly have delivered some of the most nonsensical guff I've ever read on this site.

[Mister E]

[quote author=pauliewalnuts link=topic=50457.msg2415834#msg2415834 date=1377857451

As Percy said, congratulations, though, the last few pages of this thread truly have delivered some of the most nonsensical guff I've ever read on this site.
[/quote]Seconded - and it takes something gargantuan to have achieved that.

[MarkM]

Link to their site

wow, now if any website needed some guidance on the use of colours its that one!

[Chris Jameson]

Congratulations though, to sunny villa and his acolytes: you have posted without doubt the biggest crock of absolute shit I have ever read on H&V, and I've read some of the conspiracy thread.

Amen, brother.

[paul_e]

Link to their site

wow, now if any website needed some guidance on the use of colours its that one!

Damn you, I felt the need to click it and see for myself after your comment and now the whole world has turned blue and there's blood running from my eyes!

[adrenachrome]

I'm still waiting to know what their politics are.

Usual reds under the beds twaddle from the usual suspects.

[LeeS]

Link to their site

wow, now if any website needed some guidance on the use of colours its that one!

Ouch!

[bruisedshins]

Was sat right by them this evening.
They were no problem at all.
I can only think that there's previous history

Maybe i should not say this, but, i am going to. Previous history there is, and lots of it from what i have learned from reliable people inside the VP security. Threatening letters sent to Stewards and their families from certain people connected with Brigada may not help the situation. Also letters sent to the Club by the same people defying all HSE rules to the point where " We will stand when we want to stand and we will unfurl banners when we want to" type stuff. Doesn't really help them does it. Before anybody umps and says " Prove it, " Contact the Club Security and they will be more than willing to discuss the situation, from what i understand. We all want a good atmosphere at VP, banners , flags, singing, standing, but please do it in the right way. Sending threatening letters is just bloody stupid. Just do what you do, but obey the rules of the club. Not that hard , is it ?

The above is complete and utter, unequivocal nonsense.

Do you really think that people involved in Brigada 1874 would send threatening letters to the club, stewards and their families? Presumably we signed these letters off with a Brigada stamp and a home address? What do you take us for? A bunch of knuckle dragging neaderthals? I really don't know who in the club, if anybody, has given you this information, but it's complete crap.