Lambert in or out? Poll reset with majority 'in', 7th May

[LeeB]

I also wish people would stop talking as if we have been relegated. Its as if folk couldn't wait until we had lost at Arsenal to start ripping into to us again.

This. It's not looking good at the moment but it's not May yet.

As for Roy Keane, i'd rather keep Lambert.

I'd rather have McLeish back.

Time for your medication, Lee.

Rather him than Keane, I meant, but that's like saying I'd rather be shot than stabbed.

[LeeB]

Where we are is unacceptable for us, but as has been said many times, that's not all down to Lambert. Many many factors have contributed to where we are now. And we'll never know if someone else would have done better or worse as it is all purely guess work. I'd take a punt that under Roy Keane or Mowbray for example we'd be worse off. But with the squad and problems we had before Lambert set foot through the door I think we'd have struggled under anyone.

For what it's worth i'm firmly in the undecided camp on what should happen if we did go down.

If lambert stayed post relegation, if we weren't running away with it by the Autumn the knives would be out because of the "we're the big premiership club having a 1 year holiday in the lower leagues dontcha know" factor, regardless of how many of the better players left in the summer. We'd be better off getting a clean slate because if it didn't go exactly to plan he'll do well to get as much leeway as TSM.

However much you wish it, I don't see the club offloading Lambert in the summer. And they'd be wrong to.
Yes, he's executed a high-risk strategy this season that looks like failing.
Yes, he's come across as oburate and inflexible.
Yes, he has failed to address set-piece / last 10 minutes problems.
Yes, there's no question that he could and should have strengthened the back four and defensive MF with experience in the January window.

But:
- the buy / sell strategy and high-wage issue is not of his making.
- it takes time to build a young squad and nurture an inexperienced group.
- he has not been helped in any way by many of his more experienced players (GA and Charles apart, perhaps).
- he has a goood recood of developing squads and getting promotion.

If we go down I genuinely think we can come back stronger and fitter under Lambert. But I'll admit I may just be wearing my rose-tinted glassses.

In my opinion this is the most succinct summation of our situation on this thread.

[Clampy]

You can tell people are not thinking straight when names like Roy Keane and Tony bloody Mowbray pop up.

[pauliewalnuts]

Where we are is unacceptable for us, but as has been said many times, that's not all down to Lambert. Many many factors have contributed to where we are now. And we'll never know if someone else would have done better or worse as it is all purely guess work. I'd take a punt that under Roy Keane or Mowbray for example we'd be worse off. But with the squad and problems we had before Lambert set foot through the door I think we'd have struggled under anyone.

For what it's worth i'm firmly in the undecided camp on what should happen if we did go down.

If lambert stayed post relegation, if we weren't running away with it by the Autumn the knives would be out because of the "we're the big premiership club having a 1 year holiday in the lower leagues dontcha know" factor, regardless of how many of the better players left in the summer. We'd be better off getting a clean slate because if it didn't go exactly to plan he'll do well to get as much leeway as TSM.

However much you wish it, I don't see the club offloading Lambert in the summer. And they'd be wrong to.
Yes, he's executed a high-risk strategy this season that looks like failing.
Yes, he's come across as oburate and inflexible.
Yes, he has failed to address set-piece / last 10 minutes problems.
Yes, there's no question that he could and should have strengthened the back four and defensive MF with experience in the January window.

But:
- the buy / sell strategy and high-wage issue is not of his making.
- it takes time to build a young squad and nurture an inexperienced group.
- he has not been helped in any way by many of his more experienced players (GA and Charles apart, perhaps).
- he has a goood recood of developing squads and getting promotion.

If we go down I genuinely think we can come back stronger and fitter under Lambert. But I'll admit I may just be wearing my rose-tinted glassses.

In my opinion this is the most succinct summation of our situation on this thread.

I'd agree with that. I'd also add that, if you looked at it dispassionately, on paper at least, at Lambert's record here, you'd expect a manager with those results to get sacked.

Despite the anti-Lambert lobby thinking we need "professional help", there isn't a man amongst us who doesn't understand the above.

The thing is, it's not really that simple as looking at the table and judging everything on that. Lambert has been doing his job - a job which involves a total transition of the footballing side of the club - in a very, very difficult environment.

Senior pro's not offering anything, a chairman who doesn't seem arsed any more, a wage bill which has been tackled far too recklessly, two seasons of utter crud (especially last season) under our belts ....

If we get relegated, and Lambert staying looks like the obvious option (and to my eyes at least, it does), then we're just going to have to grin and bear it as best we can and move on, and focus on getting back up as quickly as we can, and being stronger for it.

Honestly, I know we all have our own opinions, and the likes of Greg and Risso obviously feel strongly in their stance, you've got to acknowledge that they've not reached that position without lots of good reason, but what I don't get is the constant re-telling of grim facts - worse manager since whenever, worst season since whenever, lowest points tally etc etc

We all know that, you don't need to tell us it over and over as if we've missed it - we've been as fucked off watching this season unfold as anyone.

We're not saying things aren't awful, we're not saying Lambert is without blame - far from it - we are saying that we can see the situation at the club at the moment, and the problem we'd have if we were to sack him and have to find a replacement whilst in the championship, and the fact that we'd be spunking away yet more money paying off management teams (when we don't have much money to throw around), and given all that, trusting him to get us back quickly is the most sensible option.

[pauliewalnuts]

You can tell people are not thinking straight when names like Roy Keane and Tony bloody Mowbray pop up.

And Gary Megson.

The argument to sack him looks entirely less convincing when you look at the standard of likely replacements.

[LeeB]

I'd agree with that. I'd also add that, if you looked at it dispassionately, on paper at least, at Lambert's record here, you'd expect a manager with those results to get sacked.

Despite the anti-Lambert lobby thinking we need "professional help", there isn't a man amongst us who doesn't understand the above.

The thing is, it's not really that simple as looking at the table and judging everything on that. Lambert has been doing his job - a job which involves a total transition of the footballing side of the club - in a very, very difficult environment.

Senior pro's not offering anything, a chairman who doesn't seem arsed any more, a wage bill which has been tackled far too recklessly, two seasons of utter crud (especially last season) under our belts ....

If we get relegated, and Lambert staying looks like the obvious option (and to my eyes at least, it does), then we're just going to have to grin and bear it as best we can and move on, and focus on getting back up as quickly as we can, and being stronger for it.

Honestly, I know we all have our own opinions, and the likes of Greg and Risso obviously feel strongly in their stance, you've got to acknowledge that they've not reached that position without lots of good reason, but what I don't get is the constant re-telling of grim facts - worse manager since whenever, worst season since whenever, lowest points tally etc etc

We all know that, you don't need to tell us it over and over as if we've missed it - we've been as fucked off watching this season unfold as anyone.

We're not saying things aren't awful, we're not saying Lambert is without blame - far from it - we are saying that we can see the situation at the club at the moment, and the problem we'd have if we were to sack him and have to find a replacement whilst in the championship, and the fact that we'd be spunking away yet more money paying off management teams (when we don't have much money to throw around), and given all that, trusting him to get us back quickly is the most sensible option.

There's been times recently when logging onto this board has felt like being stuck in the cave with Graham Norton on Father Ted.

Let me make this clear, I'm not an apologist for the club or the manager, the situation we're in cutting me up, but just looking to make one individual pay the a succession of poor decisions from the top down looks like the most pointless and self defeating option we could take.

In my opinion, last season's appointment of McLeish was heavily motivated by wanting to get something out those players Houllier had wanted shot of. The high earners, most of which are still bleeding us in exchange for the square root of fuck all.

The subsequent horror show of the most consistently uninspiring, attritional approach to football I can remember set us back more than one season, but that could have been put right soon enough.

The problem that's fucked us this season was the policy of the board back then. Giving that clown the job is something I find impossible to understand, on so many levels, but then to sign the players we did, with the contracts we handed out, when we knew that we needed the wage bill down, and the whole 'second chance' policy with the shitheads has been fucking disastrous.

For me, we've got the right man, trying to do the right job, a year too late and with margins too small to make mistakes.

[Drummond]

You know, I reckon if we'd been relegated last season, Lambert would have been in a much better place. He'd have had a much better opportunity to sort stuff out than he has now. The job is an impossible one, take on a failing squad, crap mentality, full of players that can't be arsed that have been bought by a bunch of managers who are all so disparate in approach.

O'Neill was the last one who was really allowed to build a squad in his own vision and we all know what happened after that; it's been decline. He was allowed to pay top money for players that were distinctly average and at best squad fillers whilst selling the best ones, ever since there hasn't been the opportunity to progress.

Houllier just didn't work out, McLeish was dreadful in approach and Lambert had to follow the lot.

This club needs to be cleared out with a fresh start, Lambert has done that quite well so far with a number of bad influences no longer with us (Collins, Warnock, Hutton and the poor Heskey). However, he's clearly not been able to maintain a standard of results that ensure safety. If we'd been sitting in 14th place and 10 points ahead of where we are now, then I don't think there would be the negativity there is towards him. It's such a fine margin.

I still believe we should stick with him, whether we stay up or go down, because from the glimpses we've seen, there is a lot of promise there and he's never had a failure yet. Relegation, whilst clearly not a preferred option is looking more likely, though I believe we can still do it.

Of the names being bandied about, do people really want us to try and build something under them? I mean, Allardyce, Kean, Megson and Mowbray? Seriously?

[not3bad]

You can tell people are not thinking straight when names like Roy Keane and Tony bloody Mowbray pop up.

And Gary Megson.

I'd add John Gregory to that list.  An ex-hero with a big personality and a love for the Villa I agree, but he hasn't managed in the top flight for longer than Gerard Houllier and the last year of his reign was like watching a Mcleish side.

[Risso]

Of the names being bandied about, do people really want us to try and build something under them? I mean, Allardyce, Kean, Megson and Mowbray? Seriously?

Nobody is saying that those managers would be anybody's first choice, nobody at all.  And actually before Norwich, Lambert's record wasn't anything special at all.

[Clampy]

You can tell people are not thinking straight when names like Roy Keane and Tony bloody Mowbray pop up.

And Gary Megson.

I'd add John Gregory to that list.  An ex-hero with a big personality and a love for the Villa I agree, but he hasn't managed in the top flight for longer than Gerard Houllier and the last year of his reign was like watching a Mcleish side.

I like Gregory a lot. Bearing in mind he was managing Wycombe before he came here, i thought he did a fairly good job. The worst thing he ever did was walk into the Derby job as soon.

[Drummond]

Of the names being bandied about, do people really want us to try and build something under them? I mean, Allardyce, Kean, Megson and Mowbray? Seriously?

Nobody is saying that those managers would be anybody's first choice, nobody at all.  And actually before Norwich, Lambert's record wasn't anything special at all.

They are the names mentioned so far though and let's face it, we surely wouldn't want a short-term appointment?

[German James]

Of the names being bandied about, do people really want us to try and build something under them? I mean, Allardyce, Kean, Megson and Mowbray? Seriously?

Nobody is saying that those managers would be anybody's first choice, nobody at all.  And actually before Norwich, Lambert's record wasn't anything special at all.

A genuine question: who do you think we would be able to attract if Lambert was sacked today? I think it was a bit of a coup to get hold of him, after the last glistening turd of a season. Really: who do you think would come now?

[eastie]

I would expect there will be managers on the continent who probably fancy a crack at managing in england - ralf rangnick would be my choice personally but of course attracting a manager in the premier league would probably be far easier than if we were in the championship- it depends what division we are in as to who we could possibly attract.

There is  no point sacking lambert this late in the day, if it was going to happen it should have been a month ago.

[JUAN PABLO]

I would hope there is a clause in his contract . Takes us down he leaves with no compensation.

I know we needed players , still can not believe he did not buy a CB but signed Dawkins , Bowery etc but we still have enough quality to stay up for me  and If he takes us down , a lot of blame lies with Lambert .

Lets hope he saves us , learns by his mistakes quick but time is running out .

[Dave Clark Five]

I would expect there will be managers on the continent who probably fancy a crack at managing in england - ralf rangnick would be my choice personally but of course attracting a manager in the premier league would probably be far easier than if we were in the championship- it depends what division we are in as to who we could possibly attract.

There is  no point sacking lambert this late in the day, if it was going to happen it should have been a month ago.

Foreign managers are no good without having loads of money made available to them.