Record Losses....

[richardhubbard]

Paulie I hold MON accountable up to point he left but he is not the devil. I hold Lerner totally accountable and Faulkner , god knows what he is doing

[Ad@m]

Adam well do understanding working capital and impact losses have on this?

Is that even a sentence?!

Anyway, if we're sharing work experience to give some weight to our arguments, I'm involved in much more than just the working capital of lots of very significant businesses so I have a pretty thorough understanding of working capital, cashflow, and the accruals concept.  All of which are relevant to this subject - not just the fact the Villa have made record losses; a statement which is bordering on meaningless without understanding the numbers behind it.

[taylorsworkrate]

This man recommended Heskey at £60k p/w for 5 years as good business amongst other similarly fantastic bargains, then left us on the eve of a season with all his own mess strewn across our lawn. Far from winning a court case against the club, he should be dragged through the streets of Birmingham, whipped with stinging nettles as he goes before being scourged and crucified on Hodge Hill.

Are you for real? lets go of MON hatred, we had two shit managers since appointed by a CEO running up losses of 40m per season, fucks sake MON left 18 months ago move on. Your be blaming him for next.

When we are championship skint in 18 months, who fault will it be then .

Lerner and Faulkner appoint the managers, sign the contracts and balance the books, not some Irishman who fucked off 18 months ago.

Remember under the silent one it was champions league footy in 5 years not champonship in 6

So, the current wage bill is nothing to do with a manager who left 18 months ago?

Not quite sure how you work that one out, when players often have contracts up to five years long.

I think its a bit unfair to level the blame for wages totally on MON (aware thats not what your doing).

The vast majority of managers, if given the same free reign that Lerner gave MON, wouldn't give a singular toss about how the high wages were hurting the club.

[dave.woodhall]

Paulie I hold MON accountable up to point he left but he is not the devil. I hold Lerner totally accountable and Faulkner , god knows what he is doing

Bringing in record commercial deals?

Now, how do you hold Randy totally accountable?

[Chico Hamilton III]

Our record loss was 7-0.

[Chico Hamilton III]

Or 8-1 if you include the Cup

[Ad@m]

Adam a trading loss to take 48m of amorisation and depreciation, sorry that would mean a huge write down on value of business or its assets . I have not seen the accounts in detail but business has had 25 million cash injection, regardless of what for and secondly lost 48m some how. It is in trouble that why we are slashing costs and sitting 15th in the table

Where has this £48m loss come from?  You said £40m just. 

Anyway this isn't your run of the mill manufacturing company.  A football club's major assets are its players and big changes in the playing staff (as we've seen over the past couple of years) can have a very significant impact on profit or loss which is completely different to how the cash moves.  We're cutting wages because they were too high.  That is all.  Young and Downing were sold to balance the books because we hadn't been able to cut wages quick enough and to cover the outlay on Bent.

What do you do as a job? It is only my view, but having done this job for 15 years , I would assume losses in cash flow lead to a cash outflow, they always have done unless there is a cash injection from somewhere, there is a direct corrolation to cash and profit .

I'm a senior manager for one of the largest accountancy firms in the world so I think I know a bit about finance.  Profit and cash movement are not as directly related as you might think, which is exactly why it is a requirement for companies which aren't small to present a cashflow statement which generally covers an entire page of A4 plus accompanying notes to explain the reconciliation between the two.

Bottom line is, until we see the accounts there's not a lot we can draw from this.  Reaching for the shotgun is premature to say the least.

[Concrete John]

This man recommended Heskey at £60k p/w for 5 years as good business amongst other similarly fantastic bargains, then left us on the eve of a season with all his own mess strewn across our lawn. Far from winning a court case against the club, he should be dragged through the streets of Birmingham, whipped with stinging nettles as he goes before being scourged and crucified on Hodge Hill.

Are you for real? lets go of MON hatred, we had two shit managers since appointed by a CEO running up losses of 40m per season, fucks sake MON left 18 months ago move on. Your be blaming him for next.

When we are championship skint in 18 months, who fault will it be then .

Lerner and Faulkner appoint the managers, sign the contracts and balance the books, not some Irishman who fucked off 18 months ago.

Remember under the silent one it was champions league footy in 5 years not champonship in 6

So, the current wage bill is nothing to do with a manager who left 18 months ago?

Not quite sure how you work that one out, when players often have contracts up to five years long.

I think its a bit unfair to level the blame for wages totally on MON (aware thats not what your doing).

The vast majority of managers, if given the same free reign that Lerner gave MON, wouldn't give a singular toss about how the high wages were hurting the club.

People will blame MON whatever counter arguments are raised due to the nature of his departure and then the compensation we gave him.  The truth being that he is responsible for a lot of our 'wasted' wages since he left, but he'd also be responsible for us getting a lot more out of the players if he was still here.   

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Adam well do understanding working capital and impact losses have on this?

Is that even a sentence?!

It is if you're Yoda.

[Mazrim]

For the record, Mr Hubbard, I do hold Randy and Faulkner partly responsible for the mess we're in but at least they're still here trying to make it right. I don't recall them sailing off into the night like a champ on the eve of battle after years of fan adoration and huge financial backing.

It's still Randy's fault for giving MON dictatorial powers and if I have a gripe with Faulkner it's that he's too invisible as a CEO and his general communication with the fans is appalling. But I can forgive incompetence.
Treachery and cowardice, not so much.

And he couldn't just leave, he had to come back and take his pound of flesh too. So fuck that bloke.
I'll 'get over it' when all unfortunate traces of his rule have left this great club once and for all.

[Walmley_Villa]

Hard to disagree Maz. I was in hindsight one of the foolish ones that made his way to VP when the rumours of the messiah joining arose.

I now look on him with contempt. Yes it was foolish of the Board to not keep a grip on expenditure but at the same time they had backed the manager. Gambled and lost.

At least plans are in place to resolve the financial problems and I guess "we are now in it together" as the austerity measures bite.

[richardhubbard]

Sorry I am wrong , MON a cowadice traitor for take us to sixth and pissing off when he is unhappy.

Burn him at the gates of hell

Lerner and Faulkner are perfectly fine was running up huge losses year on year .

All is well with  the villa hierachy.

Would Faulkner be in charge of say Tesco's if they had multi million pound losses on his patch? if he was in charge

[Ad@m]

Companies House is showing the accounts as having been filed however they haven't yet scanned them in for inspection.


Ooooh, the tension!!!!

[Hoppo]

I cant wait till April 21st so i can thank Martin for his efforts..

[MarkM]

RL et al have to shoulder a large part of the blame for the situation we are in right now.

We can blame MON for signing the shit he did but he was given the cash to do it.

The board should have had some kind of supervision over what was going on, if they didnt then thats there fault!

As for some comments about MON going and RL staying to sort it out, well MON was only an employee and RL does own the company! Managers come and go, they know the risks they take when joining a club there position is only tenable so long as the owners allows it to be. RL could for instance sack McL today if he wanted to.

So back to my point:

Is MON to blame for signing the players and agreeing the wages he did... YES

Is the board to blame for allowing MON to do what he wanted? YES

The buck stops with the owner on this one I'm affraid