England 2012 Cricket Thread

[fredm]

He'll miss England more than England will miss him. For talk of dressing room unrest read no-one can stand the fecker.

As he demonstrated by celebrating his ton at Headingley by pointing his bat to his wife in the crowd and deliberately not doing so to the dressing room.

[paul_e]

The biggest problem is, there was no need to schedule a test series during the IPL season, I take this as a rather heavy handed attempt by KP to get them to review the decision to host it at that time.

Don't get me wrong, KP is being an idiot over it but it is pretty silly for the ECB to put the players in a position where they miss out on what is far and away the biggest pay day of the year, the IPL is well established now and is clearly something the best players in the world want to be part of, the ECB need to respect the players a little more and let them compete.

[spangley1812]

The biggest problem is, there was no need to schedule a test series during the IPL season, I take this as a rather heavy handed attempt by KP to get them to review the decision to host it at that time.

Don't get me wrong, KP is being an idiot over it but it is pretty silly for the ECB to put the players in a position where they miss out on what is far and away the biggest pay day of the year, the IPL is well established now and is clearly something the best players in the world want to be part of, the ECB need to respect the players a little more and let them compete.

Sorry mate Test Cricket is much more important than the IPL and o/s Asia not too many people care about it anyway
The series is away v New Zealand so the NZ cricket board would have set the dates......

[Dave Cooper please]

Plus the Test schedules are arranged at least two or three years ahead, way before Pietersen started throwing his toys.

[john e]

I guarantee most of the ex cricketers who moan about KP for him wanting to play IPL if they were offered 1.5 mill for a few weeks work would soon have changed there tune

KP does come over as a bit I'd a prick, and I'm sure he's not mr popular with other players, but then they arnt been offered millions to play in India, so it's easy for them to act loyal

iPL is probably here to stay, money will always win out, gota find a way of compromise

[dave.woodhall]

I guarantee most of the ex cricketers who moan about KP for him wanting to play IPL if they were offered 1.5 mill for a few weeks work would soon have changed there tune

KP does come over as a bit I'd a prick, and I'm sure he's not mr popular with other players, but then they arnt been offered millions to play in India, so it's easy for them to act loyal

iPL is probably here to stay, money will always win out, gota find a way of compromise

Every modern generation of cricketers has had a head-turning amount of money thrown at some of them - Packer and at least two apartheid-supporting South African tours come to mind. Some cricketers went for the money, others refused it. Throughout all these tours test cricket was still seen as the most important thing. 

[rutski]

it is tough, the new zealand squad will be decimated by the amount of players that have gone to play in the ipl.
they have already declared they will be putting out a second string.
with regard kp, cricketers are a strange bunch as within playing a team game goes, they are very much individuals within a team and kp is a very talented individual needed for the benefit for the team. But in the long term, the test team will live long after kp has left anyway.

[hilts_coolerking]

Every modern generation of cricketers has had a head-turning amount of money thrown at some of them - Packer and at least two apartheid-supporting South African tours come to mind. Some cricketers went for the money, others refused it. Throughout all these tours test cricket was still seen as the most important thing.

Two things I'd say in response to that are that in the 1970s and 1980s, which are the decades you're talking about, pro cricketers - even the Test regulars - were paid much much less than today's Test players, especially among the major nations.  And the other thing is that Pietersen is adamant this isn't about money.

My feeling is that he has genuine grounds for complaint over the schedule: those who play all 3 forms are over-worked.  But while asking for time away from the schedule is a reasonable request, asking for time away from the schedule so he can go play cricket for someone else is not.  Essentially he wants to have his cake and eat it - plays Tests for England as long as there isn't a big money tournament on somewhere else.  And if it isn't the IPL it'll be the Big Bash.

The ECB is determined that the primacy of Test cricket should be maintained and allowing cricketers to pick and choose when they are available to play Tests is not in line with that objective.  You can't have a team made up of committed Test players plus players who are only committed when there isn't money to be made elsewhere.

[dave.woodhall]

Every modern generation of cricketers has had a head-turning amount of money thrown at some of them - Packer and at least two apartheid-supporting South African tours come to mind. Some cricketers went for the money, others refused it. Throughout all these tours test cricket was still seen as the most important thing.

Two things I'd say in response to that are that in the 1970s and 1980s, which are the decades you're talking about, pro cricketers - even the Test regulars - were paid much much less than today's Test players, especially among the major nations.  And the other thing is that Pietersen is adamant this isn't about money.

My feeling is that he has genuine grounds for complaint over the schedule: those who play all 3 forms are over-worked.  But while asking for time away from the schedule is a reasonable request, asking for time away from the schedule so he can go play cricket for someone else is not.  Essentially he wants to have his cake and eat it - plays Tests for England as long as there isn't a big money tournament on somewhere else.  And if it isn't the IPL it'll be the Big Bash.

The ECB is determined that the primacy of Test cricket should be maintained and allowing cricketers to pick and choose when they are available to play Tests is not in line with that objective.  You can't have a team made up of committed Test players plus players who are only committed when there isn't money to be made elsewhere.

I agree with all of that, although I would say the money is a question of proportion. The early tours offered much more than cricketers could have earned on the county circuit, same as now. The only difference is a nought or two on the end for all of them. Bottom line is that there's too much cricket now.   

[hilts_coolerking]

I agree with all of that, although I would say the money is a question of proportion. The early tours offered much more than cricketers could have earned on the county circuit, same as now. The only difference is a nought or two on the end for all of them. Bottom line is that there's too much cricket now.   

That's true but I think there is a two-tier pay league now that wasn't the case 30 years ago.  It's one thing for Kieron Pollard or Brendon McCullum or Daniel Vettori to miss Tests to play in the IPL because their respective national boards pay them considerably less than their counterparts in Australia, England and especially India.  Pietersen is already among the highest paid players in his sport (in the world top 10 according to the rich list in this month's The Cricketer).  Make no mistake, Pietersen is paid a lot by the ECB and I reckon they're entitled to believe they deserve some loyalty for that money.

[PaulWinch again]

There is far too much cricket now and at the same time Test cricket seems to be taking a back seat. You only have to see England playing that ridiculous one day series against Australia instead of a 5 match Test series with South Africa as evidence of that.

The authorities need to start making Test cricket a lot more attractive financially to reflect its status as the pinnacle of the game. Also there should be a minimum of 4 Test matches in any given series. If 50 over cricket has to go to accomodate this along with a reduce schedule then so be it.

[dave.woodhall]

I agree with all of that, although I would say the money is a question of proportion. The early tours offered much more than cricketers could have earned on the county circuit, same as now. The only difference is a nought or two on the end for all of them. Bottom line is that there's too much cricket now.   

That's true but I think there is a two-tier pay league now that wasn't the case 30 years ago.  It's one thing for Kieron Pollard or Brendon McCullum or Daniel Vettori to miss Tests to play in the IPL because their respective national boards pay them considerably less than their counterparts in Australia, England and especially India.  Pietersen is already among the highest paid players in his sport (in the world top 10 according to the rich list in this month's The Cricketer).  Make no mistake, Pietersen is paid a lot by the ECB and I reckon they're entitled to believe they deserve some loyalty for that money.

Definitely. Then again, I suppose the TCCB or whatever it was called then were entitled to believe that they deserved some loyalty in 1977 from the England captain rather than having him plot behind their backs to set up the WSC. As someone who watches cricket occasionally I believe that the tail is wagging the dog and limited overs has far too much influence. But, of course, that's where the TV ratings, sponsors and therefore the money are.

[Villan For Life]

IPL is losing some of its appeal in India. The 2012 tournament saw gates considerably down on other years. In it's current form it is unsustainable. Maybe KP is looking to cash in before the cash cow is milked dry.

[hilts_coolerking]

Definitely. Then again, I suppose the TCCB or whatever it was called then were entitled to believe that they deserved some loyalty in 1977 from the England captain rather than having him plot behind their backs to set up the WSC. As someone who watches cricket occasionally I believe that the tail is wagging the dog and limited overs has far too much influence. But, of course, that's where the TV ratings, sponsors and therefore the money are.

It's worse than that - it's primarily Indian interest in limited overs formats which is where the money is.  And once their ageing stars retire, and their Test team gets even worse, the problem will only increase.

ETA - And Greig was indeed a rat bastard, not only for leaving England in the lurch but also for helping Packer to poach some of their other players.

[dave.woodhall]

Am I wrong, or are you two immediately above arguing against each other?