Gerard Houllier

[pauliewalnuts]

Compared to players managers are relatively cheap.   Just pick the one you want and make him and his club an offer they cant refuse.   Bill Kenwright is always strapped for cash.   Prise Moyes away from Everton.   

What if David Moyes isn't prepared to shit on Bill Kenwright?

[ozzjim]

Realistically, I think we need to give Houllier to the end of feb then re-assess where we are based on results and league position and games remaining.

2/01 Chelsea (a) 0 pts
5/01 S'land (h) 1 pt
16/01 SHA (a) 0 pts
22/01 Ci££eh (h) 0 pts
25/01 Wigan (a) 1 pt
1/02 ManUre (a) 0 pts
5/02 Fulham (h) 3 pts
12/02 Blackpool (a) 1 pt
26/02 Blackburn (h) 3 pts

I predict a further 9 points during Jan/Feb giving us 29 pts with 10 games to go, so in theory on our way to safety so Houllier keeps his job and gets a summer to fully begin the re-build

I think we will get about 11 points from that bunch of games, giving us 31 ish with 10 to play. We will stay up IMO, and probably finish 45-47 points ish. A win at the sty could give us the momentum to win 3 or 4 of those though and be well out of trouble. Home games are vital, and thankfully we have a few that are ones we can win. Get to the end of then and only have 6-7 points then I will be much more concerned I admit.

[pauliewalnuts]

Realistically, I think we need to give Houllier to the end of feb then re-assess where we are based on results and league position and games remaining.

2/01 Chelsea (a) 0 pts
5/01 S'land (h) 1 pt
16/01 SHA (a) 0 pts
22/01 Ci££eh (h) 0 pts
25/01 Wigan (a) 1 pt
1/02 ManUre (a) 0 pts
5/02 Fulham (h) 3 pts
12/02 Blackpool (a) 1 pt
26/02 Blackburn (h) 3 pts

I predict a further 9 points during Jan/Feb giving us 29 pts with 10 games to go, so in theory on our way to safety so Houllier keeps his job and gets a summer to fully begin the re-build

I think we will get about 11 points from that bunch of games, giving us 31 ish with 10 to play. We will stay up IMO, and probably finish 45-47 points ish. A win at the sty could give us the momentum to win 3 or 4 of those though and be well out of trouble. Home games are vital, and thankfully we have a few that are ones we can win. Get to the end of then and only have 6-7 points then I will be much more concerned I admit.

2/01 Chelsea (a) 0 pts
5/01 S'land (h) 3 pts
16/01 SHA (a) 1 pt
22/01 Man City (h) 0 pts
25/01 Wigan (a) 3 pt
1/02 ManUre (a) 1 pt
5/02 Fulham (h) 3 pts
12/02 Blackpool (a) 1 pt
26/02 Blackburn (h) 3 pts

15 points.

[WikiVilla]

That's 15 pts - optimistic ?

[pauliewalnuts]

That's 15 pts - optimistic ?

Sorry.

2/01 Chelsea (a) 0 pts
5/01 S'land (h) 0 pts
16/01 SHA (a) 0 pts
22/01 Man City (h) 0 pts
25/01 Wigan (a) 0 pts
1/02 ManUre (a) 0 pts
5/02 Fulham (h) 0 pts
12/02 Blackpool (a) 0 pts
26/02 Blackburn (h) 0 pts

0 points.

Relegated by March. I think that's the prevailing point of view. Doomed etc etc.

The fact is, if we can't beat Blackburn or Fulham at home, for example, we don't deserve to be in this league.

[Greg N'Ash]

i reckon we'll get at least 10. only downside is its going to be a high points total for relegated teams this season. mebbe even 44-45

[WikiVilla]

Agree, 40 pts may not be enough this year

[eric woolban woolban]

I'll take one game at a time thank you very much.

Chelsea (a) Nil pois.

[WikiVilla]

Next Prem Manager to go - latest odds Billy Hills

Woy 5/4
Grant 5/2
Houllier 9/2

[old man villa fan]

In my years of following Villa I have seen us relegated many times.  Every relegation we suffered had one thing and one thing only in common.  The correction of our faults was left too late.   The incumbent manager was always given too much time and necessary action was left too late to be effective.

Those of you calling people like Glasses and me idiots because we see the writing on the wall blatantly refuse to answer the single simple straightforward question - what single piece of evidence have you seen since Gerard Houllier was appointed our manager which shows him capable of having a better second half of the season than the first?  Has he showed one spark of effectiveness in team motivation? fitness? mental attitude? building team spirit? asserting psychological domination of our opponents? getting the crowd behind the team? team discipline? team tactics? match tactics? team selection? tapping up targeted players like we have to endure from others? instilling self belief into players? instilling a spirit of fighting for every ball right to the final whistle? making match turning substitutions?   There is no evidence of any kind whatsoever that Gerard Houllier, even if he is given the money, can buy his way out of the pit he has dug for himself.

When you can produce  some evidence that Houllier has the ability NOW not at Liverpool or in France when he was in his prime - NOW, to fight off relegation then you can call those of us who do not share your optimism idiots and compare us to Liverpool fans.

Very well put, Brian.  We are probably about the same age and been through the same highs and lows.

Your right about the one thing in common before each relegation in that things were not recognised and acted on early enough.  I differ from you though in the analysis.  From my memory, it was always the manager not recognising that the players were not up to it and failing to make the change.  Like now, there were also player cliques.

Houllier has, I believe, seen that certain players are not good enough to take us forward from last season and others had peaked and are on the way down.

MON built a squad that he pushed to the limit the season before last and they hit the wall.  He saw the problem and brought in new players in defence but the same thing happened again, they reached the limit which was not quite good enough.  What he failed to do though was to buy a replacement for Carew and Petrov as they had both reached their peak.  Also, in all his time he could not sort out both fullback positions.

We relied last season very much on Collins/Dunne and Milner.  Take away the consistency of the Collins/Dunne combination, take Milner out of the equation and with Carew and Petrov both going backwards (the former dramatically) and you can see the big hole forming down the middle of the team.  Add to this, injuries to Gabby and others and the team has disintegrated.  When you look more closely, you can see why.

I do not believe any of what I have said above is down to Houllier.  He has had to react to it and I tend to agree that he has not handled it too well.  He has tried to use the young players sparingly by switching them around so as not to destroy their confidence and to try and come up with the right combination.

I am concerned about things that he is reported to have said, although I have not heard many of the things on TV or radio.  There are many false rumours being put about, some by our own supporters (how any Villa supporter can take satisfaction from spreading a false rumour that will distress other supporters is beyond me).  GH has upset some players but I do not think it is to the extent that he has 'lost the dressing room'.

I think that GH has found it harder than he expected because like many people he probably thought the players were of a higher calibre and stronger character.  I think it is the wrong time to change the manager because a new manager will not have time to assess the squad and bring in new players.  I trust GH to bring in good players that will be of value to the club in the future, whether he is manager or not.  If, come the middle of February, things have not improved and we are still sliding, then would be the time to change.  Likewise, if GH stays and we only just limp over the line at the end of the season, that may be the time to change.

[Mac]

How come the likes of Everton (Cahill) manage to hang onto their world class players yet we can't
it's very frustrating

Has somebody said "Rooney"  or "Lescott"?  If so I'll delete this when I catch up reading the thread.

[Dave]

How come the likes of Everton (Cahill) manage to hang onto their world class players yet we can't
it's very frustrating

Has somebody said "Rooney"  or "Lescott"?  If so I'll delete this when I catch up reading the thread.

I'd edit it and bring it back on January 10th, but then add Pienaar to it as well.

[WikiVilla]

Cahill, Arteta, Baines, Jagielka. They manage to hold onto players who we'd lose

[pauliewalnuts]

How come the likes of Everton (Cahill) manage to hang onto their world class players yet we can't
it's very frustrating

Has somebody said "Rooney"  or "Lescott"?  If so I'll delete this when I catch up reading the thread.

How come the likes of Everton (Cahill) manage to hang onto their world class players yet we can't
it's very frustrating

Like they held onto Wayne Rooney, you mean?

And Lescott (who isn't world class in the sense that none of the players we've sold recently have been either, but they wanted to keep him)?

*blows imaginary smoke from end of pretend gun finger*

[Dave]

Cahill, Arteta, Baines, Jagielka. They manage to hold onto players who we'd lose

They have lost as many important players to bigger* clubs as we have over the last few years.

You're talking nonsense.

*Edit - richer