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Author Topic: International Rugby  (Read 335695 times)

Online paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4230 on: September 18, 2023, 02:51:23 PM »
I seem to remember a brief comment on a podcast in reference to the Rugby scene in Portugal improving. Is that the case?

I think they're the fastest improving nation in the world right now, even 4 years ago they were nowhere near the standard needed for the world cup and this weekend they made Wales earn a win that would've been routine in the past. In any other group I could've seen them sneaking a win, which would be an incredible achievement.

Online AV84

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4231 on: September 18, 2023, 02:52:21 PM »
The inclusion of club teams in competitions also helps. You could see the difference in Japan and Argentina when they had teams in Super Rugby. And now you can see it with Fiji, Samoa/Tonga having teams play there.

Georgia are a team that have long been neglected by World Rugby. They won't let them into the 6 Nations, but if they can have South African teams playing in Europe why not invest some money in a Georgian club side so the players don't have to move to French clubs.

If any of these tier 2/3 nations ever achieve anything it feels like its inspite of World Rugby rather than because of them.

Offline Jon Crofts

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4232 on: September 18, 2023, 03:09:16 PM »
Iíve long been a believer that the 6N needs to introduce relegation, over a 3 year period and whoever averages the lowest points tally over the 3 years drops to Tier 2 6 Nations and up comes say a Georgia and the cycle starts again so every 3 years the lowest average points gets you relegated. Tier 2 6 Nations would benefit Portugal, Romania and Georgia and Northern hemisphere rugby hugely.

It would also be hilarious to see Wales get the R.

Online paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4233 on: September 18, 2023, 03:14:11 PM »
The inclusion of club teams in competitions also helps. You could see the difference in Japan and Argentina when they had teams in Super Rugby. And now you can see it with Fiji, Samoa/Tonga having teams play there.

Georgia are a team that have long been neglected by World Rugby. They won't let them into the 6 Nations, but if they can have South African teams playing in Europe why not invest some money in a Georgian club side so the players don't have to move to French clubs.

If any of these tier 2/3 nations ever achieve anything it feels like its inspite of World Rugby rather than because of them.

Black Lion (georgian champions) are in the challenge cup this season.

Offline Exeter 77

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4234 on: September 18, 2023, 03:26:52 PM »
We were talking about that last night. How far, if at all, are Georgia behind Italy. I'd be interested to see a test between the two.

Offline Rudy Can't Fail

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4235 on: September 18, 2023, 04:14:25 PM »
I watch Rugby in the same way imagine some Rugby fans watch Football, sometimes engaged but other times mocking and scornful, but I think that's also because by and large for my entire life England have always been shit to watch, even when they were good.

And even with my untrained eye I can see it's not the case elsewhere, as I've enjoyed watching games they don't play in. It really feels like it's engrained in the culture to focus entirely on the physicality of the game at the expense of any kind of flair.

If it's excitement you want, Portugal is where it's at. Not a second wasted, 110% effort, I couldn't take my eyes off the screen for the full game. That said, it was like watching a Villa U21 team against a top PL team, they fill your heart with promise but the result is pretty predictable. Like football, money is king and there's little chance for 2nd tier countries to grow and develop when new competitions are designed for maximum revenue rather than the good and future of the game.

The key for teams like Portugal (and even more established sides like Fiji, Tonga, etc) is for them to get more regular games against the top sides and that isn't a fault of the format of competitions (although reforming the 6N and championship would help) but rather the process of setting up tours and friendlies which see the same 9-10 countries playing each other and the 'smaller' nations struggling to find games because of it. During the game last night they gave a stat of the number of games each team had played since the last world cup and England were more than double that of Japan. Covid played a part in that but even without that England, etc have far more opportunities to give out caps and try things than the teams who are trying to catch up.

That's pretty much what I've been hearing, Paul. Apparently next year (?) there will be a new tournament with the 6 nations and the best from the southern hemisphere. Same old, same old. Of course it's great to see but it's a bit of a closed shop for Tier 2 countries trying to grow the game - in Portugal's case, almost from scratch (again). A proper, not half arsed European Championship, even if only every 4 years would be so much more beneficial to the game down here at least.


This time it feels a bit different, real progress has been made and the foundations have been laid. Sadly, as you point out, without getting to play the bigger teams, construction will be put on hold.
Until then I'll just enjoy the games with hopefully a victory against Georgia in the final game. That's where we're setting our hopes/dreams.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2023, 05:13:27 PM by Rudy Can't Fail »

Online AV84

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4236 on: September 18, 2023, 04:59:49 PM »
I wonder could they do some kind of Lions thing where a touring side made up of Tier 1 players went and played Georgia and Romania during the summer. Put some restrictions of the players who can be selected for the "Lions", like less than x International caps or something like that. You'd still get a decent team together and it would guarantee the tier 2 teams get to play "better" teams on a regular basis. We had an "Emerging Ireland" tour last year but they went to South Africa and played club sides.

I guess the long and short of it is there's lots of things World Rugby could be doing to build up these sides if they really wanted to.

Offline UK Redsox

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4237 on: September 22, 2023, 02:42:55 PM »
Dupont has a fractured cheekbone

Waiting for medical advice as to whether he'll be available should France make the semis or final

Online paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4238 on: September 22, 2023, 02:53:35 PM »
Big blow that.

Online AV84

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4239 on: September 22, 2023, 02:58:34 PM »
Bernard Jackman on Irish TV last night mentioned someone playing a week or so after surgery on a fractured jaw. Said he played against medical advice, but he did play. Still, I wouldn't expect to see Dupont unless they make the final, and even then you'd question it.

Online paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4240 on: September 22, 2023, 03:09:14 PM »
It really depends on the severity of it. I broke my jaw (after being kicked in the face charging down a kick) about 20 years ago (lost a couple of teeth as well) and it was about 2-3 weeks before I could eat comfortably and 5 before all the pain was completely gone and I was happy to play. I can't remember exactly but I think the hospital gave me 5-6 weeks as expected recovery time. If he's done similar that would see him available just in time for the final.

I know of people who've come back from jaw and cheek fractures a lot sooner though, I just didn't see the point of risking it.

Online AV84

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4241 on: September 22, 2023, 03:17:52 PM »
I think it'll bring up the question of player welfare, depending of course on the medical advice. Especially when a lot of the changes to laws have supposedly been designed around protecting players from head injuries.

Of course we could save everyone the problem by beating them in the QF 😉

Online Brazilian Villain

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4242 on: September 22, 2023, 06:53:38 PM »
Of course we could save everyone the problem by beating them in the QF 😉

I'd probably prefer if we didn't have to (in the QF at least).

Online AV84

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4243 on: September 22, 2023, 07:09:25 PM »
Of course we could save everyone the problem by beating them in the QF 😉

I'd probably prefer if we didn't have to (in the QF at least).

I'm 50/50 on it, to be honest. It's going to be tough either way. And we'll probably have to beat them both at some point.

Offline PaulWinch again

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #4244 on: September 22, 2023, 08:08:18 PM »
I donít know if at his age he can find his mojo again, but it feels like Eddie Jones should have taken a longer break post the England job. Heís showing exactly the same tired tropes he rolled out with us. Itís always building to a future that never arrives.

 


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