Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: UK Redsox on July 03, 2023, 03:44:29 PM
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Since we had a thread for this last season.
Has anyone other than KKH gone out on loan yet ?
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Since we had a thread for this last season.
Has anyone other than KKH gone out on loan yet ?
Viljami Sinisalo has gone to League One side Exeter City
He's a Goalkeeper 21-year-old from Finland and has a season long loan
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Did well on his last loan to Ayr, wasn't it?
Good chance for him at Exeter?
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Take this with as much salt as you want but the Birmingham Mail say Reven and A Ramsey could be going out on loan after the US trip. Championship interest in Ramsey, and Reven possibly only in US because of lack of LB options.
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Not a massive surprise if that happens. They are both very young and neither look first team ready for PL or Europe. Another good year for Ramsey in the Championship or maybe League One for Revan will do them good.
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What is happening with Finn Azaz?
He never seems to get mentioned in all this.
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Midfield seems the one area where we really do have a multitude of options, so sending Ramsey jnr on loan makes total sense.
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What is happening with Finn Azaz?
He never seems to get mentioned in all this.
Plymouth want to buy him, apparently.
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What is happening with Finn Azaz?
He never seems to get mentioned in all this.
I was wondering the same thing (I follow Plymouth a bit because son lives there). His form dipped a bit after injury last season. But seems he may go back to Plymouth. They are interested, and apparently he has been seen there in recent days.
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Not a massive surprise if that happens. They are both very young and neither look first team ready for PL or Europe. Another good year for Ramsey in the Championship or maybe League One for Revan will do them good.
Ramsey looked too good for the Championship. I wouldn't say he's not ready and we need to meet the quote for homegrown talent in the Conference League.
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Emery comments today strongly suggestive that Duran and Archer will stay. Pleased with that. May indicate that despite looking lively vs Saudis Philogene is most likely of the attacking fringe to get more time in the Championship (with or without the Bidace)?
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It might be Bailey vs Philogene rather than Cam/Duran vs Philogene.
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Can't we loan Aaron to a minnow in the PL, like Palace or Forest? He's proven in the Ch'shit now.
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Can't we loan Aaron to a minnow in the PL, like Palace or Forest? He's proven in the Ch'shit now.
Everton maybe?
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We don't want them to stay up again though, surely?
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Yes, he would give Dyche the thrust he needs.
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Yes, he would give Dyche the thrust he needs.
A sight nobody should have to endure.
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One of those clubs would need to make an enquiry and we would have to be confident that they wouldn't rot on the bench the way El Ghazi did when he went on loan to Everton.
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They do put a great deal of research into the youngster's placings, making sure they are a fit for the team and manager and that they will have a good opportunity to thrive.
With El Ghazi, it was more a case of having an opportunity to get his wages off the books for a bit as he edged nearer and nearer the exit.
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They do put a great deal of research into the youngster's placings, making sure they are a fit for the team and manager and that they will have a good opportunity to thrive.
With El Ghazi, it was more a case of having an opportunity to get his wages off the books for a bit as he edged nearer and nearer the exit.
Not disagreeing but has Jedinak been replaced in his loan coach/monitor role?
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They do put a great deal of research into the youngster's placings, making sure they are a fit for the team and manager and that they will have a good opportunity to thrive.
With El Ghazi, it was more a case of having an opportunity to get his wages off the books for a bit as he edged nearer and nearer the exit.
Not disagreeing but has Jedinak been replaced in his loan coach/monitor role?
He has.
Tony Carss, who managed the Under-21 group last season, will transition across to the role vacated by Mile Jedinak and become the club's new Emerging Talent Programme Manager.
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>:(
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>:(
Woah there! I was backing you up that time. All for one and all that.
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>:(
Woah there! I was backing you up that time. All for one and all that.
Well, alright then!
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Down, boy!
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Louie Barry has gone on loan to Stockport.
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Louie Barry has gone on loan to Stockport.
New contract as well.
Another lower league loan. Doesn’t seem to be improving much.
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What's the story with Chrisene?
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Louie Barry has gone on loan to Stockport.
New contract as well.
Another lower league loan. Doesn’t seem to be improving much.
Another one being "fattened up for slaughter".
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There's nowt on the lad so he'll need plenty of fattenin'-up. I say he's far from ready for the slaughter! Seven stone wet-through.
I do miss Fred. Elliott - not Flinstone.
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What's the story with Chrisene?
He had a bad injury at Kilmarnock so think the Walsall friendly was his first game since around Christmas - guess it depends how far he is towards full match fitness whether he goes out on loan again or is kept till January in the u23s
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Cheers, hopefully it's not derailed his progress too much.
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There is talk from Southamptons side that they want Bogarde on loan to replace Lavia.
He would compete for the position with another of their players called Shea Charles.
I think he came from their feeder academy Man City.
Could be a good option for the kid.
They tend to treat young players quite well.
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There is talk from Southamptons side that they want Bogarde on loan to replace Lavia.
He would compete for the position with another of their players called Shea Charles.
I think he came from their feeder academy Man City.
Could be a good option for the kid.
They tend to treat young players quite well.
That'd be a good move for him, he's versatile enough to play in 2-3 different positions so should be able to get plenty of gametime and they have a good enough squad to be right int he mix to come back up.
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Southampton at least have a history of developing good young players so you'd think they'd be a decent place for one of our lot to go. They should be fighting for promotion as well I'd have thought.
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Bump.
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Great goal from LB:
https://x.com/itvfootball/status/1698085399522935000?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
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Looks like he might be starting to mature.
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This is a quote from an Argyle fan about Kesler-Haydens performance against Crystal Palace...
Incredible performance last night against palace. Very strong defensively and going forwards. Very confident on the ball and didn't tire all game. Stayed on the pitch after all other players had left and walked the pitch clapping the fans.
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This ties in with what I've been told about KKH from someone who knows him.
Seems a decent bloke who's willing to put himself out to help people.
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Aston Villa can confirm Oliwier Zych has joined Puszcza Niepołomice on a season-long loan.
The young goalkeeper heads back to his homeland to join the Polish top-flight newcomers in his first loan move away from the club.
Zych joined Villa in the summer of 2020 from Zagłębie Lubin, having previously been on the books at Arka Gdynia.
A youth international for Poland, he was part of the Villa squad who won the FA Youth Cup in 2021.
The deal is subject to international clearance.
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My Exeter-supporting mate assures me that the Grecian Massif absolutely love having Viljami Sinisalo on loan.
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My Exeter-supporting mate assures me that the Grecian Massif absolutely love having Viljami Sinisalo on loan.
Would be great if he could come back in Jan or summer and be that number 2 and eventual successor to Emi
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Aston Villa can confirm Oliwier Zych has joined Puszcza Niepołomice on a season-long loan.
The young goalkeeper heads back to his homeland to join the Polish top-flight newcomers in his first loan move away from the club.
Zych joined Villa in the summer of 2020 from Zagłębie Lubin, having previously been on the books at Arka Gdynia.
A youth international for Poland, he was part of the Villa squad who won the FA Youth Cup in 2021.
The deal is subject to international clearance.
A Polish chap I know is a supporter of his new club & reckons he will get plenty of practice in as they are a bit shit...
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Stuart, I both hope(desperately) and believe (rationally) that Sinisalo will be the number two 'keeper -hopefully next season!
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This ties in with what I've been told about KKH from someone who knows him.
Seems a decent bloke who's willing to put himself out to help people.
Always comes across as decent lad (and fantastic player) but there are some on here who say different....
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Chisom Afoka Has just come in to make his Bradford debut.
I had no idea that Mark Hughes was their manager
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Chisom Afoka Has just come in to make his Bradford debut.
I had no idea that Mark Hughes was their manager
Yes, he's been there about 18 months, but he may not be there for much longer.
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Exeter lost their first game of the season conceding 2 goals, first game Sinisalo hasn't played in.
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Chisom Afoka Has just come in to make his Bradford debut.
I had no idea that Mark Hughes was their manager
He's quite a big lad...
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Chisom Afoka Has just come in to make his Bradford debut.
I had no idea that Mark Hughes was their manager
He's quite a big lad...
He was a centre forward, he had to be.
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Exeter lost their first game of the season conceding 2 goals, first game Sinisalo hasn't played in.
Quite a few games in the lower leagues called off due to international call ups, so why did Exeter play ?
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Exeter lost their first game of the season conceding 2 goals, first game Sinisalo hasn't played in.
Quite a few games in the lower leagues called off due to international call ups, so why did Exeter play ?
No idea. Seems it was one of only two played today.
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Don't you have to be missing at least three players for a game to be postponed?
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5 in 5 for Louie Barry for Stockport County
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Another clean sheet for Sinisalo at Exeter. They're back up to 1st. Might make them my second team this season, I've become very invested in them already.
Looks like there was about 20 mins of stoppage time in their game too, so Sinisalo getting lots of game time on loan.
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Is Sinisalo the best of our young keepers? Feel like one of them might actually come through.
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Is Sinisalo the best of our young keepers? Feel like one of them might actually come through.
I think so, I'd argue he's already a better keeper than Olsen and I think the plan is for him to get another year of experience under his belt before coming back as our backup keeper for next year.
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Is Sinisalo the best of our young keepers? Feel like one of them might actually come through.
I've been having a nosy on the Exeter City fan site and they seem very impressed. Interestingly they weren't happy with the signing initially and there was a lowlights video of him doing the rounds, I think taken from his loan spell last season, which didn't go well. He didn't play well in the first preseason game he featured in, but they seem to have accepted that was a team effort at being shit, and since the season started they're all very happy with him. There's a couple of "don't fall in love with a loan player" posts, and some of them have praised how vocal he is. There's footage from the Reading game where he's shouting in the pre-match huddle to pump them all up.
No idea what the quality of teams are like in League 1 but they've kept a lot of clean sheets, and I think their only loss was last week when he was on international duty. I think they're joint 1st at the moment, so hopefully they'll be pushing for promotion all season. But all in all he seems to be doing very well. At the very least we might be able to sell him for 15mil to a newly promoted side next summer.
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My daughters boyfriend goes to Exeter every home game and says he’s been superb for them so far.
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If they do get promoted, it will be tempting to let him go back there on loan next season.
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If they do get promoted, it will be tempting to let him go back there on loan next season.
I guess it depends on where we stand in terms of bringing in an experienced backup keeper, and if we've got European football again. No point bringing him back here if he's never going to get to play. Would be a sensible progression for him, Lg1 to Championship and then back to us for Prem.
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5 in 5 for Louie Barry for Stockport County
My mate the MK fan sent me a text saying "he never played like that for us!"
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it's not just the number of goals he's scoring but the quality of the finishes, too.
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it's not just the number of goals he's scoring but the quality of the finishes, too.
I thought that was about Sinisalo for a second there, was thinking ‘fuck me he MUST be good’.
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Ha!
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No idea what the quality of teams are like in League 1 but they've kept a lot of clean sheets, and I think their only loss was last week when he was on international duty.
I think when Southampton spent a lot of millions on Bazunu he'd only played a season and a half in League One, so there's definitely precedent.
Whether that precedent can be seen as making a success of it or not...
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No idea what the quality of teams are like in League 1 but they've kept a lot of clean sheets, and I think their only loss was last week when he was on international duty.
I think when Southampton spent a lot of millions on Bazunu he'd only played a season and a half in League One, so there's definitely precedent.
Whether that precedent can be seen as making a success of it or not...
It's similar for Trafford who had 18months with Bolton before becoming a premier league number 1.
Sinisalo had a very good spell with Ayr where he got 7 clean sheets in 22 as an 18/19 year old before having a tough time at Burton last year but I think there's a lot of context around that which suggests their defence was a bit fucking shit.
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I suppose it will all depend on how good he is with the ball at his feet...
I cant say that I know too much about that aspect of his game.
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No idea what the quality of teams are like in League 1 but they've kept a lot of clean sheets, and I think their only loss was last week when he was on international duty.
I think when Southampton spent a lot of millions on Bazunu he'd only played a season and a half in League One, so there's definitely precedent.
Whether that precedent can be seen as making a success of it or not...
It's similar for Trafford who had 18months with Bolton before becoming a premier league number 1.
Good point, I had it in my head that he was in the Championship last season, but you're right.
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Don’t forget, Trafford also won the U21 tournament. That wouldn’t have raised his profile a fair bit and possibly more than the performances at Bolton.
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Don’t forget, Trafford also won the U21 tournament. That wouldn’t have raised his profile a fair bit and possibly more than the performances at Bolton.
Especially his "heroic" performances at that u21 tournament.
I don't think they conceded a goal all tournament & he saved a pen late in the final to win the whole tournament.
Boosted his profile a lot...
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Was the deal with Burnley not already agreed before the U21s though?
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Was the deal with Burnley not already agreed before the U21s though?
I have no idea...
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It was announced afterwards, no idea when the deal was negotiated.
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It was announced afterwards, no idea when the deal was negotiated.
I'm sure it was done before because people on here were watching the tournament and saying we should sign him but he was already going to Burnley at that point. Doesn't matter, I suppose, in terms of the point of Lg1 experience and making the jump to Prem.
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Barry. Stockport 3rd goal.
Azaz. Plymouth 4th goal.
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Azaz assist for a 5th.
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We've found some good loan moves for our kids this season.
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a goal and an assist for each of them on the end, not a bad day for our loanees.
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Bad day for Sinisalo and Exeter. 3-0 loss to Oxford, although 2 were penalties in the last 10 minutes.
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Barry scoring six in six well done and Azaz scoring for Plymouth also well done.
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Why was HKK not starting?
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I've assumed this thread is more for the young lads on loan, but does anyone know anything about the Qatar league or how/when Coutinho will be playing over there?
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KKH started in midweek. Perhaps he's picked up a knock.
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I've assumed this thread is more for the young lads on loan, but does anyone know anything about the Qatar league or how/when Coutinho will be playing over there?
I can imagine interest will be minimal
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I've assumed this thread is more for the young lads on loan, but does anyone know anything about the Qatar league or how/when Coutinho will be playing over there?
I can imagine interest will be minimal
He's still our player and has 2 years left on his contract when the loan is up, so at the very least I'd be interested to know if we might get some money for him eventually.
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He'll be retired before then
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He'll be retired before then
Hadn't thought of that.
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I doubt we'd get enough to cover the cost of the plasters and glue we've had to provide to keep him together.
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Yep . I suspect he’ll disappear a wealthier man
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Barry. Stockport 3rd goal.
Azaz. Plymouth 4th goal.
Barry's goal was a bit special. Picked the ball up just outside the centre circle, burst forward, and beat three players before drilling a low shot past the keeper. A really excellent goal. Yes, it's only League Two, but he's doing very well indeed this season. He also seems to have grown an inch or two since last season, so I wonder if he's now physically better prepared for men's football?
I also wonder if his form continues like this, if the club will do something like they did with KKH a while back and bring him back in January to send him out again to a side in a higher league? If he keeps scoring, and is comfortably in double figures by Xmas (he's on 6 already), I'd expect there would be a few Championship clubs that would be willing to take a punt on him for the second half of the season?
Anyway, after 18 months where it was starting to look like his development had stalled, I'm delighted to see him finally showing what he's capable of.
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Barry. Stockport 3rd goal.
Azaz. Plymouth 4th goal.
Barry's goal was a bit special. Picked the ball up just outside the centre circle, burst forward, and beat three players before drilling a low shot past the keeper. A really excellent goal. Yes, it's only League Two, but he's doing very well indeed this season. He also seems to have grown an inch or two since last season, so I wonder if he's now physically better prepared for men's football?
I also wonder if his form continues like this, if the club will do something like they did with KKH a while back and bring him back in January to send him out again to a side in a higher league? If he keeps scoring, and is comfortably in double figures by Xmas (he's on 6 already), I'd expect there would be a few Championship clubs that would be willing to take a punt on him for the second half of the season?
Anyway, after 18 months where it was starting to look like his development had stalled, I'm delighted to see him finally showing what he's capable of.
I saw a story this morning saying that we're already considering exactly that.
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Good assist for Barry as well. Giving off Notts County-era Joe vibes in todays game.
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Where's this footage of Bazza yesterday or are you all watching Ch5 at 2am for the lower league highlights? You should be out drinking and dancing.
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Good assist for Barry as well. Giving off Notts County-era Joe vibes in todays game.
The difference is Joe was only 17ish at the time.
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Where's this footage of Bazza yesterday or are you all watching Ch5 at 2am for the lower league highlights? You should be out drinking and dancing.
Sky EFL highlights. Watched the Plymouth game to see Azaz’s good goal as well.
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Good assist for Barry as well. Giving off Notts County-era Joe vibes in todays game.
The difference is Joe was only 17ish at the time.
Yes, 18 I think. He was destroying 'The Mighty Reds YNWA' at Wembley at 19.
Re LB - a tweet from a Stockport fan made me smile: “Nothing to see here Villa”.
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I think over time Barry will develop and have a Calum O'Hare type ascendency up the leagues.
When O'Hare was 20 he was on loan at Carlisle I think. With better structural development we could've trained him up as a Grealish replacement and saved ourselves 30m odd on someone like Buendia when you see how well O'Hare has done at Coventry. If not for a serious injury he'd probably be playing in the prem for Burnley now.
Louie probably struggled from going somewhere like Ipswich too early. Promotion favourites and had 5-6 attacking options already so he wasn't even making the bench and lost a bit of confidence from that.
He's far too good for league 2 so you'd think he'll eventually settle into top half league 1 and then championship player.
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KKH only on the bench yesterday, coming on for the last 10 minutes.
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Sinisalo in action tonight against Luton. Not quite Man City, but still a bit more of a test than a League 1 side.
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Exeter win 1-0. Luton have only scored 3 goals this season, so maybe it's not that impressive, but all good experience for Sinisalo.
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Barry took the penalty....and scored!
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Phil made Hull's goal today.
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Phil made Hull's goal today.
Hull's player, not a loan.
With respect to our "sell them but can just buy them back again" policy.
Maybe we need a general "players who aren't ours but could be ours if we wanted" thread.
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"Purchase option players"?
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It could help.
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"Purchase option players"?
Here's probably fine. Or they do all have their own threads.
I'm just being a pernickety twat.
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There's an Archer thread in general football, could probably change the title and lump them all in there.
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"Purchase option players"?
Here's probably fine. Or they do all have their own threads.
I'm just being a pernickety twat.
I think we could cover all of them in the one thread...
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Looking at how bad t'Blades are, I wonder how much of the ball Archer is going to see this season.
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Looking at how bad t'Blades are, I wonder how much of the ball Archer is going to see this season.
Yeah, that was the worry with him going there.
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Even still it's good experience and will serve him better than sharing minutes with Duran.
The Burnley game showed how important it will be for AJ as well, the first Newcastle goal came because he took far too much time to deal with what was a fucking awful pass to him.
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It sounded like if Sheffield United get relegated, we'll be able to bring Archer back for pretty much what they paid for him. At that point he should be a more rounded player having had a year of Premier League experience. We can then either integrate him or sell him again and renew the 3 year FFP cycle for the money.
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Did we sell Philogene or loan him?
Anyway, him and Aaron Ramsey both in the England U21 squad announced this afternoon.
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Sold.
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With a buy-back clause?
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With a buy-back clause?
Pretty sure there was yes but less widely reported compared to the other two. Anyone know for sure?
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Im sure there is.
Its a shame he left as he could have had a fair bit of game time with Ramsey missing.
He was probably the most natural replacement for Jacob Ramsey, other than Aaron Ramsey...
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There definitely is because the Hull owner was talking about it. Something like £10m.
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Philogene scores his first goal for Hull.
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And then an assist.
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Nice. The fact he forced the move to get regular football is a sign how determined he is.
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Yes, compare his attitude with that of Harry McGuire.
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I have a ticket for Harrogate Town Vs Stockport County on Saturday... interesting to watch our Louie.
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If you see Chris Jameson, ask him to come back.
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Louie Barry
https://x.com/total_villa/status/1709512493264171423?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
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I enjoyed that Percy. Fantastic from your Barry.
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Louie Barry has been named as League Two player of the month for September. Well done Louie!
https://twitter.com/SkyBetLeagueTwo/status/1712707769210405114
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Jeez some really nice finishes in there
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He's obviously settled in well there. We might let him stay there for the second half of the season too, continue what he's been doing and if he gets them promoted, we could let him go back there next season and continue developing at a higher level too. Whatever we do, it's good to see him doing well and starting to look like the player we hoped he would become.
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He turned 20 in the summer, so he's not young-young. If he keeps this form up ( or even halves it), I wonder should we fix him up with a League 1 club in January.
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If you see Chris Jameson, ask him to come back.
I will, but he lives in Newcastle now so I doubt I'll see him.
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Louie Barry
https://x.com/total_villa/status/1709512493264171423?s=46&t=GdM6cpVxe5IloByNCRheWA
the commentator seemed to shoot his wad on the 6th goal.
Scored more both feet; nice.
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He turned 20 in the summer, so he's not young-young. If he keeps this form up ( or even halves it), I wonder should we fix him up with a League 1 club in January.
If he keeps scoring at this rate I think a Championship loan wouldn't be out of the question for the second half of the season. Look what Cam did for a not-that-great Preston side when he was 20. There is no reason to think Louie couldn't do something similar. He's clearly technically good enough to play at a higher level, and he seems to have filled out a bit now too. I haven't seen any of his stockport games, so I don't know how involved he is in the general play, and whether he's holding his own on the physical side, but clearly he's already better than League Two.
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He turned 20 in the summer, so he's not young-young. If he keeps this form up ( or even halves it), I wonder should we fix him up with a League 1 club in January.
If he keeps scoring at this rate I think a Championship loan wouldn't be out of the question for the second half of the season. Look what Cam did for a not-that-great Preston side when he was 20. There is no reason to think Louie couldn't do something similar. He's clearly technically good enough to play at a higher level, and he seems to have filled out a bit now too. I haven't seen any of his stockport games, so I don't know how involved he is in the general play, and whether he's holding his own on the physical side, but clearly he's already better than League Two.
Yeah, it is quite noticeable that he must have either eaten his Weetabix or spent a bit of time in the gym.
This has always been my biggest concern with Barry.
I didn't think he could fill out much more, so if he has added a bit of strength to what is already a pretty mobile & technically gifted footballer base, he could be a bit of a late bloomer.
It will be interesting to see how he develops further over the next 12 months or so, but I don't think a League 1 loan would be out of the question...
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He turned 20 in the summer, so he's not young-young. If he keeps this form up ( or even halves it), I wonder should we fix him up with a League 1 club in January.
If he keeps scoring at this rate I think a Championship loan wouldn't be out of the question for the second half of the season. Look what Cam did for a not-that-great Preston side when he was 20. There is no reason to think Louie couldn't do something similar. He's clearly technically good enough to play at a higher level, and he seems to have filled out a bit now too. I haven't seen any of his stockport games, so I don't know how involved he is in the general play, and whether he's holding his own on the physical side, but clearly he's already better than League Two.
Yeah, it is quite noticeable that he must have either eaten his Weetabix or spent a bit of time in the gym.
This has always been my biggest concern with Barry.
I didn't think he could fill out much more, so if he has added a bit of strength to what is already a pretty mobile & technically gifted footballer base, he could be a bit of a late bloomer.
It will be interesting to see how he develops further over the next 12 months or so, but I don't think a League 1 loan would be out of the question...
I think he was always likely to be a bit late breaking through because even a year ago he still looks like a kid who was too easily bullied. Where the previous loans have clearly helped is in making him realise what he needs to do to physically cope with senior football. It's still a massive jump from L2 to even our bench but now it looks possible whereas I didn't think he'd ever make it a year ago.
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Players develop at different rates. We had him sign a long-term contract (normally means 5 years) before he went on loan to Stockport so it looks like we believe he can offer something and we're prepared to give him time.
https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial/status/1684821316673662976.
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He turned 20 in the summer, so he's not young-young. If he keeps this form up ( or even halves it), I wonder should we fix him up with a League 1 club in January.
If he keeps scoring at this rate I think a Championship loan wouldn't be out of the question for the second half of the season. Look what Cam did for a not-that-great Preston side when he was 20. There is no reason to think Louie couldn't do something similar. He's clearly technically good enough to play at a higher level, and he seems to have filled out a bit now too. I haven't seen any of his stockport games, so I don't know how involved he is in the general play, and whether he's holding his own on the physical side, but clearly he's already better than League Two.
Yeah, it is quite noticeable that he must have either eaten his Weetabix or spent a bit of time in the gym.
This has always been my biggest concern with Barry.
I didn't think he could fill out much more, so if he has added a bit of strength to what is already a pretty mobile & technically gifted footballer base, he could be a bit of a late bloomer.
It will be interesting to see how he develops further over the next 12 months or so, but I don't think a League 1 loan would be out of the question...
I think he was always likely to be a bit late breaking through because even a year ago he still looks like a kid who was too easily bullied. Where the previous loans have clearly helped is in making him realise what he needs to do to physically cope with senior football. It's still a massive jump from L2 to even our bench but now it looks possible whereas I didn't think he'd ever make it a year ago.
Yeah, exactly the same thoughts here too...
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Players develop at different rates. We had him sign a long-term contract (normally means 5 years) before he went on loan to Stockport so it looks like we believe he can offer something and we're prepared to give him time.
https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial/status/1684821316673662976.
Absolutely, my worry with Barry was that he was a perfect example of why performances and results at U18 and U21 aren't really what matters. Every time I've seen him play at either level he's looked too quick and too talented for defenders to cope with and in most cases they haven't been able to make up for that by bullying him whereas at senior level he's looked like a little boy still. It's good that he and the club seem to have recognised that and worked to resolve it.
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The long-term contracts is also an insurance policy for getting a good transfer fee should we sell (i.e Archer, Ramsey and Philogene). Wouldn't be surprised if he was our next buy-back player sold next summer if he does well enough for a Ch'ship team to come in for him.
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Was listening to an EFL podcast earlier and they described Barry as being the best player in the division and way too good for League 2.
Off to the Championship in Jan IMO
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The long-term contracts is also an insurance policy for getting a good transfer fee should we sell (i.e Archer, Ramsey and Philogene). Wouldn't be surprised if he was our next buy-back player sold next summer if he does well enough for a Ch'ship team to come in for him.
Yeah, trying not to get too attached to the kids now, cos i think there's a good chance they'll be off on a buy-back deal. Which is i guess fair enough from the club's perspective, but i can't say it speaks to my more romantically inclined nature.
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Me neither. Randy sought "romantic nourishment" from the Villa per his leaving statement, probably just as well that he sold-up.
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Watched Louie Barry as Stockport beat Harrogate 3-1. Firstly, the home team were not great: sat too deep and allowed Stockport far too much space. As for our lad, well he had 2 great scoring chances in the first 16 minutes (one a header taken between the centre backs; the other a well-taken through ball which he tried to dink over the keeper and overhit it). For the rest of the first half he was bullied by the Harrogate rightback and played no real part in proceedings.
Second half (until he was subbed around 70 minutes' in) he was probably the best player on the pitch, setting up the second goal and being much more involved. The Stockies clearly love him. What was good was his ability to run effortlessly with the ball (think Grealish in his heyday, but without the inevitable fallover at the end of a run): he has a very balanced running style with a low centre of gravity. And, he sees the game in front of him well, so spots a pass early and executes well.
Is he top-flight quality? - hmmm; needs a more challenging gig for the second of the season, in my opinion.
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"Grealish in his heyday"...enough to make you weep..
Glad that Louie is showing more to his game though.
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They’re top of the league now. Go on the Stockies!
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Stockport 2-0 up already. First goal a pen from our man.
Why did Barry take the penalty?
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And then they got another one, but somebody else missed. So seriously, why didn’t Barry take the penalty?
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Stockport 2-0 up already. First goal a pen from our man.
Why did Barry take the penalty?
Ha ha good one
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Barry scores again in second half.
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Barry scores again in second half.
He’s having an incredible season.
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Get him down the Villa, if only just to cheer us on.
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9 league goals and we're still in October. He's flying right now. Also, Stockport got a second penalty in the first half, but Louie didn't take it, despite scoring one already, and the guy who did take it actually missed.
I wonder if the Stockport forums in fifteen years will be asking "Why didn't Barry take the penalty?"
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9 league goals and we're still in October. He's flying right now. Also, Stockport got a second penalty in the first half, but Louie didn't take it, despite scoring one already, and the guy who did take it actually missed.
I wonder if the Stockport forums in fifteen years will be asking "Why didn't Barry take the penalty?"
I beat them to it about five posts ago.
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9 league goals and we're still in October. He's flying right now. Also, Stockport got a second penalty in the first half, but Louie didn't take it, despite scoring one already, and the guy who did take it actually missed.
I wonder if the Stockport forums in fifteen years will be asking "Why didn't Barry take the penalty?"
I beat them to it about five posts ago.
Ha! That'll teach me not to post without going back a page first!
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I'm glad for the second post as I just thought it was the standing H&V Barry penalty joke.
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Barry got injured scoring the winner.
Hope he's okay.
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Louie Barry feature on Sky website
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12990932/louie-barry-interview-aston-villa-loanee-discusses-la-masia-comparisons-with-jamie-vardy-and-being-inspired-by-harry-kane
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Louie Barry stretchered off after 20 mins tonight. Looks like his hamstring went. Terrible news for the kid. Hopefully it's not a Moreno level injury, but either way, I'd expect him to be back with us for his rehab?
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Absolutely rotten luck when he'd been doing so well.
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Their manager: "Louie Barry is in pain. It looks a bad one. We are trying to look at positives, but he is still in pain and can’t walk at the mo. We would hope we’ll see him again this season. He can look at someone like Woots & use his experience to come back stronger."
Sounds like a bad injury, poor lad, just as things were going right for him.
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Needs an op on his hamstring apparently.
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Torn hamstring and likely out for several months.
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That is disappointing.
He finally finds his feet & has them taken out from under him...
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Same injury as Moreno. Moreno's been out for over 5-months and still 2-3 weeks away. That's the lad's season over.
It's not one that you want to rush either otherwise you end up with a De Bruyne situation (same injury), where he came back too soon and ended up being out for months again. He'll come back to Villa now.
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Looking at four month out per Da Beeb
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67228430
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He'll do very well to get back in 4 months.
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Saw Viljami Sinisalo at Derby on Tuesday.
Did well with his hands but will need to upgrade his footwork to impress El Maestro.
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Saw Viljami Sinisalo at Derby on Tuesday.
Did well with his hands but will need to upgrade his footwork to impress El Maestro.
I reckon that's why he's on loan, to get a bit more experience and learn how to be part of the play outside of shot-stopping. If he can do it I think he gets a chance to come back as number 2.
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I agree.
He's certainly already loud enough to be a 'keeper!!
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Azaz a goal and assist to reverse a Middlesbrough lead.
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Couple of assists for Bogarde for Brizzle Rovers in the Cup today.
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Azaz a goal and assist to reverse a Middlesbrough lead.
A good goal too. From the little bits I’ve seen he looks quite classy.
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Yeah, it was a beauty.
Good to see KKH still getting game-time as well.
It was a really good match to watch. I didn't realise that Burrah were still in mid-table, though that will be down to their terrible start.
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Azaz a goal and assist to reverse a Middlesbrough lead.
A good goal too. From the little bits I’ve seen he looks quite classy.
Interesting piece about Azaz. I've been following his progress the last couple of seasons.
https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/ongoing-aston-villa-agreement-continues-to-work-wonders-for-plymouth-argyle/
At 23 already will he ever be a regular for us, if not how much can we expect to sell him for? Seems like he's a more than capable Championship player, with potential to kick on.
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Has ever been to Bodymoor Heath?
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Has ever been to Bodymoor Heath?
Yes, he even played a couple of friendlies last summer and looked decent before Gerrard sent him out to Plymouth for the first time.
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Anyone know how Morgan Sanson is getting on?
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Anyone know how Morgan Sanson is getting on?
9 starts and 2 sub appearances out of 11, for Nice who are top of the table. You'd therefore assume he's doing quite well.
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Anyone know how Morgan Sanson is getting on?
9 starts and 2 sub appearances out of 11, for Nice who are top of the table. You'd therefore assume he's doing quite well.
Solid ratings on whoscored and sofascore as well but no goals or assists.
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Anyone know how Morgan Sanson is getting on?
9 starts and 2 sub appearances out of 11, for Nice who are top of the table. You'd therefore assume he's doing quite well.
Solid ratings on whoscored and sofascore as well but no goals or assists.
Nice have only scored 13 goals all season, which is half as many as the 2nd place team. But they've only conceded 4, so I guess they're quite solid defensively.
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I still want him back.
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Anyone know how Morgan Sanson is getting on?
9 starts and 2 sub appearances out of 11, for Nice who are top of the table. You'd therefore assume he's doing quite well.
Solid ratings on whoscored and sofascore as well but no goals or assists.
Seems he's doing more of the Kamara role there than the Luiz one.
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I still want him back.
Based on what? Sanson seems like someone who got better the more he didn't play for us.
Clearly not suited to prem imo
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I like his technique, he's comfortable with the ball and would offer more than the Donk and perhaps an inconsistent Tielemans when we want to give Luiz, Kamara or McGinn a breather.
Unlikely to happen at this stage, I know. He needed to/wanted proper game-time.
If Nice maintain their impressive start, we should at least get something half-decent for him in the summer.
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I like his technique, he's comfortable with the ball and would offer more than the Donk and perhaps an inconsistent Tielemans when we want to give Luiz, Kamara or McGinn a breather.
Unlikely to happen at this stage, I know. He needed to/wanted proper game-time.
If Nice maintain their impressive start, we should at least get something half-decent for him in the summer.
Tielemans has been more than decent in his last few outings and shown much more than sanson ever did for us. He was here for ages and no manager ever fancied him, or played him and nor did he take any opportunity so let's move on eh
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Sanson played for Nice against Montpelier (0-0) tonight.
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I like Sanson & think there is a decent player in him, but I don't think he will ever show that at Villa. He will move permanently back to France soon, I would imagine.
Hopefully we don't just continue to loan him out until his contract ends & then end up getting fuck all for him.
French clubs piss me off with that. They charge us the earth when English clubs come calling for their players, (see Guendouzi as a prime example), but as soon as they want one of our players, they refuse to pay what the player is deemed worth & we end up having to loan out the player over & over & take a loss on the player.
Personally, I would rather we sold him for peanuts to a Championship club, rather than give in to the way some European clubs want to do business.
Especially as they then cry about the amount English clubs spend, after THEY charge us the earth for players they then ask for peanuts from another European country outside of England.
£40+ mil they wanted from us for Guendouzi.
They gave him to Lazio for £22m...
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Levelling up, innit?
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According to whom?
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According to whom?
It was reported quite a lot during the summer.
I think the basis for a lot of the multiple copy & paste job articles came from L'equipe.
But I did get the amount wrong.
It was reported as €40m.
Not £40m.
So thats £35m for Villa versus £22m for Lazio...
So my point remains.
Obviously, there are no official figures, unless its Galatasaray trying to show their fans what a great deal they negotiated.
But the multiple reports during the summer pretty much quote the amounts above...
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There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
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There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
Didn't he say that in January?
But hey, you might be right & I might be wrong.
I don't think my overall point about European clubs charging Prem clubs more than other European clubs is incorrect though...
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There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
Didn't he say that in January?
But hey, you might be right & I might be wrong.
I don't think my overall point about European clubs charging Prem clubs more than other European clubs is incorrect though...
You are correct in that we get charged more but there’s a rather large element in that all PL clubs are considerably richer than all but a handful of clubs in Europe and they’re invariably keen buyers of talent and the market dictates that that means we’ll pay more. It might seem unfair but when our economic power is being used to buy all the talent it can surely be no surprise the owners of said talent will want a premium?
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There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
Didn't he say that in January?
But hey, you might be right & I might be wrong.
I don't think my overall point about European clubs charging Prem clubs more than other European clubs is incorrect though...
Probably, but as per the post above this one - that seems reasonable enough. I'd try and force every last penny out of a club like us, too.
And as for Guendouzi, I think the most likely scenario is that we didn't actually want to sign him. Because if we did, we'd have signed him ahead of Lazio. Maybe if Tielemans had chosen to go somewhere else we'd have chucked £20m at him.
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Also, the papers might have quoted €40m but if they sold to Lazio for £22m then they’d be crackers not to have sold to us for £25m. They’re not going to refuse to sell to a Premier League club just because we won’t pay 50% more for their player. Add the fact that our wage package would be higher and the player would be livid if they didn’t accept our offer. All that boils down to, we probably weren’t really after him in the summer, particularly once we’d signed Tielemans.
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There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
Didn't he say that in January?
But hey, you might be right & I might be wrong.
I don't think my overall point about European clubs charging Prem clubs more than other European clubs is incorrect though...
You are correct in that we get charged more but there’s a rather large element in that all PL clubs are considerably richer than all but a handful of clubs in Europe and they’re invariably keen buyers of talent and the market dictates that that means we’ll pay more. It might seem unfair but when our economic power is being used to buy all the talent it can surely be no surprise the owners of said talent will want a premium?
Oh, I see the logic in it from them & every club has to look after its own interests.
It just annoys me that after charging us the earth, they then go on & complain about our spending being unfair.
And I suppose with our sales & being forced to loan out because some clubs wont pay a players valuation, thats our fault for either asking too much or caving in.
Like I said, I would rather we gave Sanson to the likes of Middlesbrough for £500k than fuck about with loan after loan & then get fuck all for him because his contract has run down.
Same thing happened with Guilbert. The fans of the clubs that loaned him had him down as one of the best in their division. But their club wouldn't pay hardly anything for him & his value dropped off as his contract dwindled away with loan after loan...
There were loads of reports, followed afterwards by their chairman saying we'd never bid for him in the first place.
So while one could say "well, we didn't bid because we wouldn't offer what they were asking", it does cast a little bit of doubt on all those reports that were oh so sure we were trying to buy him.
Didn't he say that in January?
But hey, you might be right & I might be wrong.
I don't think my overall point about European clubs charging Prem clubs more than other European clubs is incorrect though...
Probably, but as per the post above this one - that seems reasonable enough. I'd try and force every last penny out of a club like us, too.
And as for Guendouzi, I think the most likely scenario is that we didn't actually want to sign him. Because if we did, we'd have signed him ahead of Lazio. Maybe if Tielemans had chosen to go somewhere else we'd have chucked £20m at him.
I think the truth probably falls somewhere in the middle.
We contacted his agent, he told us the valuation, for us, & we moved on.
The player himself during the summer mentioned that he was happy to stay in Marseille, so the transfer to Lazio seemed a bit strange.
But hey ho, its all done with now...
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I don’t reckon Sanson would be all that enamoured with the prospect of playing for Middlesbrough and the like…
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Transfer prices always seem to be artificially inflated above reality. Sky are a big reason why. They want to be able to crow at the end of the window about how Premier League clubs spent over £1bn whether it's true or not. I think they may have started a running totalizer that's on their straps throughout the summer too. You only have to look back at some of the reports over the summer of what we were supposedly paying for Pau Torres with what we apparently actually spent.
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Transfer prices always seem to be artificially inflated above reality. Sky are a big reason why. They want to be able to crow at the end of the window about how Premier League clubs spent over £1bn whether it's true or not. I think they may have started a running totalizer that's on their straps throughout the summer too. You only have to look back at some of the reports over the summer of what we were supposedly paying for Pau Torres with what we apparently actually spent.
Yes, I heard that the true fee we paid for Ings was way off as well.
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I understand that other leagues may look at the riches available in the PL and feel envious.
Having said that, Serie A didn't apologise for having all the money and signing the world's best players in a previous period of dominance. Now the shoe is on the other foot.
Within our own league, we have a deep-seated resentment of the Oil Clubs. Many would have been pleased that we got £100m for Grealish, even though I thought they'd got a bargain at the time. Now that the incompetence of Pep has reduced the value of the player to a fraction of his cost, it even strikes me as quite funny. Compare this with the enhanced value of almost all the Villa players since UE came in!
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Azaz puts Plymouth 2 - 0 up.
K-H also playing.
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Philogene on the mark again for Hull.
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Sadly not on loan though. We're unlikely to get him back based on the transfer clause (we have to be in the same division?). I think if he had bid his time a bit more, he could have got a run and made a stronger impression than Zaniolo.
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Sadly not on loan though. We're unlikely to get him back based on the transfer clause (we have to be in the same division?). I think if he had bid his time a bit more, he could have got a run and made a stronger impression than Zaniolo.
I don’t recall the ‘same division’ clause.
Seems a bit if a cock up, if true, as the low fee suggested we were trying to maintain some control of the player’s future.
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Sadly not on loan though. We're unlikely to get him back based on the transfer clause (we have to be in the same division?). I think if he had bid his time a bit more, he could have got a run and made a stronger impression than Zaniolo.
I don’t recall the ‘same division’ clause.
Seems a bit if a cock up, if true, as the low fee suggested we were trying to maintain some control of the player’s future.
Their chairman confirmed it recently.
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Then they have cocked up well & good there...
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Not sure about a same division clause. I've seen qhat the chairman said and it read to me that if we pay £10m for him, he comes back to us.
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Not sure about a same division clause. I've seen qhat the chairman said and it read to me that if we pay £10m for him, he comes back to us.
"If we're promoted, Villa will have the right to buy him back for £15m," explained Kesler.
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That doesn't mean that's the only situation we can buy him back in though, does it? If they're not promoted can we buy him back for less?
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I guess it's not impossible, but the syntax of that quote doesn't suggest it to be the case.
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That doesn't mean that's the only situation we can buy him back in though, does it? If they're not promoted can we buy him back for less?
I think that's the only scenario in which we can enforce the buy back. There are more details in the Hull bloke's full quote.
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Not sure about a same division clause. I've seen qhat the chairman said and it read to me that if we pay £10m for him, he comes back to us.
"If we're promoted, Villa will have the right to buy him back for £15m," explained Kesler.
And if they don't get promoted, it's £10m.
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Not sure about a same division clause. I've seen qhat the chairman said and it read to me that if we pay £10m for him, he comes back to us.
"If we're promoted, Villa will have the right to buy him back for £15m," explained Kesler.
And if they don't get promoted, it's £10m.
I don't think anybody has suggested that that's the case. Where have you seen that?
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Not sure about a same division clause. I've seen qhat the chairman said and it read to me that if we pay £10m for him, he comes back to us.
"If we're promoted, Villa will have the right to buy him back for £15m," explained Kesler.
And if they don't get promoted, it's £10m.
I don't think anybody has suggested that that's the case. Where have you seen that?
I don't think anyone is suggesting that it definitely exists, just that the phrasing of the Hull chairman leaves it open to interpretation that such a clause exists. He's trying to "big up" his negotiating skills so it makes sense he would only mention the highest possible price we could ever pay for him.
I'm not saying we can buy him back from the Championship, I'm just saying it would be a strange buy-back clause if we couldn't, and the wording of the chairman doesn't rule it out. He could easily have said, quite literally "Villa can only buy him back if we get promoted", but he didn't. My suspicion is that his words were very deliberate.
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Philogene scores again for Hull who are 3-0 up at half-time.
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The goal was a cheeky backheel as well.
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I mis-remembered what he said. This was the quote I saw -
“It’s pretty simple. The buy-back clause can be interpreted negatively or very positively. If the player is yours and you feel you don’t have the right to control it all the way along (through the contract) but you can also look at being able to get that kind of talented player you create a win-win situation, and share certain rights so that you can get it done and beat the competition.
“What we did in my opinion and for our fans to (understand) our decisions for the future, we’re not just buying players and then their previous clubs can buy them back from us, it’s a mechanism where we create a win-win situation.”
“There is a value that has been put on an identified performance, which is good. Maybe he can never reach there or he can bypass there, but at least for the market, for the industry, we know what he can be worth to leave our club.
“If someone comes in and offers less than his buy-back value, do we consider it? Should we consider it? Probably not. It’s a good thing. And having another big club on your side and being able to have some part in Jaden’s development plan is good.
“If we promote (to the Premier League), Villa have the right to buy him back for £15m. Having said that, if we have another offer that’s worth more than £15m then we would have the right to discuss it, it’s not like we’re forced to sell to Villa but they would have the first choice and that’s part of our agreement.
Seems like we've just got first option for him and the figure just establishes a market value. He could still go for less, or he could go for more.
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Another goal for Philogene.
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Still not on loan.
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I mis-remembered what he said. This was the quote I saw -
“It’s pretty simple. The buy-back clause can be interpreted negatively or very positively. If the player is yours and you feel you don’t have the right to control it all the way along (through the contract) but you can also look at being able to get that kind of talented player you create a win-win situation, and share certain rights so that you can get it done and beat the competition.
“What we did in my opinion and for our fans to (understand) our decisions for the future, we’re not just buying players and then their previous clubs can buy them back from us, it’s a mechanism where we create a win-win situation.”
“There is a value that has been put on an identified performance, which is good. Maybe he can never reach there or he can bypass there, but at least for the market, for the industry, we know what he can be worth to leave our club.
“If someone comes in and offers less than his buy-back value, do we consider it? Should we consider it? Probably not. It’s a good thing. And having another big club on your side and being able to have some part in Jaden’s development plan is good.
“If we promote (to the Premier League), Villa have the right to buy him back for £15m. Having said that, if we have another offer that’s worth more than £15m then we would have the right to discuss it, it’s not like we’re forced to sell to Villa but they would have the first choice and that’s part of our agreement.
Seems like we've just got first option for him and the figure just establishes a market value. He could still go for less, or he could go for more.
What is the "identified performance"?
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A brilliant Tango to Mousse T’s “I’m Horny” at Hull’s famous Ritzy nightclub after 3 sambucas, a double vodka red bull and two tokes on a bottle of poppers…
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A brilliant Tango to Mousse T’s “I’m Horny” at Hull’s famous Ritzy nightclub after 3 sambucas, a double vodka red bull and two tokes on a bottle of poppers…
Hot n Juicy are Brummies so I thought they should be credited.
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Another goal for Philogene.
He's not ours anymore sadly .
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A brilliant Tango to Mousse T’s “I’m Horny” at Hull’s famous Ritzy nightclub after 3 sambucas, a double vodka red bull and two tokes on a bottle of poppers…
Hot n Juicy are Brummies so I thought they should be credited.
My brother swears blind he shagged one of them.
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A brilliant Tango to Mousse T’s “I’m Horny” at Hull’s famous Ritzy nightclub after 3 sambucas, a double vodka red bull and two tokes on a bottle of poppers…
Hot n Juicy are Brummies so I thought they should be credited.
My brother swears blind he shagged one of them.
Lucky boy.
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https://x.com/OfficialECFC/status/1729635538468999549?s=20
Viljami Sinisalo interviewed here, speaking absolutely spectacular English with a West Midlands tinge to it.
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Philogene scores again for Hull who are 3-0 up at half-time.
Superb, two goals well.
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Anyone know how Coutinho is getting on in Qatar? Finding it quite difficult to get any real info on that league, but it appears that he hasn't played for them since early November, not even on the bench.
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https://x.com/OfficialECFC/status/1729635538468999549?s=20
Viljami Sinisalo interviewed here, speaking absolutely spectacular English with a West Midlands tinge to it.
Blimey, how confident does he come across in his first couple of sentences?!
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Aston Villa's French midfielder Morgan Sanson, 29, wants to make his loan move to OGC Nice a permanent one. (Get France Football News)
Have to admit I thought we had already sold him.
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Azaz 2 goals and an assist in a 3 - 2 win.
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Can we sell him for £10m (Finn, and Morgan too, sadly)?
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the Azaz situation is weird. I doubt he will ever play for Villa but we need to offer him a new contract so he doesn’t leave on a free. Each year he steps up a level at Plymouth and is probably loving life yet they’d never afford the £10m he is currently worth (and that could still increase).
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He may even be worth keeping to see how he does. I know he's 22/23, but he only really started playing 3 years ago, and has stepped up a league successfully each year.
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He's doing really, really well, I hope he continues to do so and gets considered in terms of staying here. I imagine two years at Plymouth in a team which has done alright is proper on-the-job training.
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They fucking love him down here...
"He can do things the other players cant" is a direct quote from my brother in law who is a season ticket holder & travels to every away game with my nephew...
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On-loan goalkeeper Vili Sinisalo was the Exeter hero with a stoppage-time penalty save to ensure his side ended a 13-match winless run with a victory against Wycombe.
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Wasn't sure where to put this, but Birmingham Live have copied an article from The Sun about Philogene-Bidace & they reckon that the buy-back option we have is £15m IF they get promoted...
Im not sure any of those things will be happening in the near future.
Which is a shame cos he has 11 goal contributions in 14 games so far this season & I think he is perfect to cover Ramseys on his left of mid role.
Maybe the club needs to be a bit more selfish when it comes to having squad cover & competition from the academy.
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I came see any of the likes of Philogene, Archer or Ramsey coming back now. We’ve moved up several notches since they were fringe players
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Isn't the Philogene "15mil if we're in the same league" thing based off something their owner said? I think he said something that some people interpretated as being the only way we could buy him back, but I think he was talking about their own financial situation and was keen to get the idea across that they could potentially do well out of their deal for him.
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Isn't the Philogene "15mil if we're in the same league" thing based off something their owner said? I think he said something that some people interpretated as being the only way we could buy him back, but I think he was talking about their own financial situation and was keen to get the idea across that they could potentially do well out of their deal for him.
He was pretty specific about the clause, and said that our right to buy him back kicks in if they get promoted, and how they can sell him to somebody else but we have first refusal. It wasn't a general point about their finances. That wouldn't make any sense anyway.
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Wasn't sure where to put this...
I'd probably have gone with the near-600 post thread titled "Jaden Philogene - sold".
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He was pretty specific about the clause, and said that our right to buy him back kicks in if they get promoted, and how they can sell him to somebody else but we have first refusal. It wasn't a general point about their finances. That wouldn't make any sense anyway.
He (the chairman) was talking about the thinking behind their transfer negotiations, and he said...
“It’s pretty simple. The buy-back clause can be interpreted negatively or very positively. If the player is yours and you feel you don’t have the right to control it all the way along (through the contract) but you can also look at being able to get that kind of talented player you create a win-win situation, and share certain rights so that you can get it done and beat the competition.
“What we did in my opinion and for our fans to (understand) our decisions for the future, we’re not just buying players and then their previous clubs can buy them back from us, it’s a mechanism where we create a win-win situation.”
“There is a value that has been put on an identified performance, which is good. Maybe he can never reach there or he can bypass there, but at least for the market, for the industry, we know what he can be worth to leave our club.
“If someone comes in and offers less than his buy-back value, do we consider it? Should we consider it? Probably not. It’s a good thing. And having another big club on your side and being able to have some part in Jaden’s development plan is good.
“If we promote (to the Premier League), Villa have the right to buy him back for £15m. Having said that, if we have another offer that’s worth more than £15m then we would have the right to discuss it, it’s not like we’re forced to sell to Villa but they would have the first choice and that’s part of our agreement.
You can probably interpretate that in different ways, but given he's trying to explain their deals to their own fans, it sounds to me like they have a clause that means IF they are promoted, and IF we want him back, we have to pay £15mil for him. It doesn't really say that that is the only circumstances in which we can buy him back, or that we have to pay £15 mil for him.
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He was pretty specific about the clause, and said that our right to buy him back kicks in if they get promoted, and how they can sell him to somebody else but we have first refusal. It wasn't a general point about their finances. That wouldn't make any sense anyway.
He (the chairman) was talking about the thinking behind their transfer negotiations, and he said...
“It’s pretty simple. The buy-back clause can be interpreted negatively or very positively. If the player is yours and you feel you don’t have the right to control it all the way along (through the contract) but you can also look at being able to get that kind of talented player you create a win-win situation, and share certain rights so that you can get it done and beat the competition.
“What we did in my opinion and for our fans to (understand) our decisions for the future, we’re not just buying players and then their previous clubs can buy them back from us, it’s a mechanism where we create a win-win situation.”
“There is a value that has been put on an identified performance, which is good. Maybe he can never reach there or he can bypass there, but at least for the market, for the industry, we know what he can be worth to leave our club.
“If someone comes in and offers less than his buy-back value, do we consider it? Should we consider it? Probably not. It’s a good thing. And having another big club on your side and being able to have some part in Jaden’s development plan is good.
“If we promote (to the Premier League), Villa have the right to buy him back for £15m. Having said that, if we have another offer that’s worth more than £15m then we would have the right to discuss it, it’s not like we’re forced to sell to Villa but they would have the first choice and that’s part of our agreement.
You can probably interpretate that in different ways, but given he's trying to explain their deals to their own fans, it sounds to me like they have a clause that means IF they are promoted, and IF we want him back, we have to pay £15mil for him. It doesn't really say that that is the only circumstances in which we can buy him back, or that we have to pay £15 mil for him.
Yep, that's how I read it. He's selling the deal to the fans, and the £15m price is the highest we could possible pay, and ONLY if they've been promoted to the Premier League (which makes sense, as he'd technically be a premier league player at that point). I suspect we have the right to buy him back for less if they're NOT promoted, but he didn't mention it because the deal would look worse if he did.
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Wasn't sure where to put this...
I'd probably have gone with the near-600 post thread titled "Jaden Philogene - sold".
Oddly, that was my first thought.
It didn't pop up when I did a search for it though...
Got three pages of other stuff.
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Well obviously the only part of a loan deal that people worry about are clauses that can be enforced. So if we definitely want Philogene back and then they'd prefer not to sell, then we have to pay Hull £15m (if they're promoted) and they have to sell. In that way it's similar to when Man City had the buy back clause with us for Luiz If they wanted him in the first two years after they sold him. The agreement said they had to pay £25m or £30m (forget which). Obviously they could have offered less, and we could have accepted it, but that's not all that interesting or relevant really.
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The agreement said they had to pay £25m or £30m (forget which). Obviously they could have offered less, and we could have accepted it, but that's not all that interesting or relevant really.
My understanding at the time was that it was £25m after the first season, then £30m after the second. As it wasn't activated, I don't know it that was the case.
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The agreement said they had to pay £25m or £30m (forget which). Obviously they could have offered less, and we could have accepted it, but that's not all that interesting or relevant really.
My understanding at the time was that it was £25m after the first season, then £30m after the second. As it wasn't activated, I don't know it that was the case.
Yes, I think that was it.
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Finn Azaz just scored a beautiful, cushioned volley. Possible the hardest finish to pull off! Definitely got talent.
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Finn Azaz just scored a beautiful, cushioned volley. Possible the hardest finish to pull off! Definitely got talent.
A goal or assist every 160 minutes this season for him.
https://x.com/itvfootball/status/1741904373175992705?s=20 (https://x.com/itvfootball/status/1741904373175992705?s=20)
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That’s sublime, what a finish.
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Finn Azaz just scored a beautiful, cushioned volley. Possible the hardest finish to pull off! Definitely got talent.
Just about to post the same. A mate watches a lot of Plymouth and thinks Azaz could play a role for us in the second part of the season.
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That Azaz goal is a belter.
Recall him!
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Mate that’s talent. He’s been good for the last 2 seasons on loan.
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I am the worst judge of footballing ability there is. I saw Silas play for Uniao de Leiria against Porto, and thought he was going to be a world beater. He signed for Wolves and made no impact whatsoever.
I wonder if Azaz is a Hourihane type player. Conor brought a good number of goals and assists, but was frequently criticised for his inability to prevent the opposition walking through our midfield. I thought he would find a new club near the top of the championship to move to, but ended up at Derby in League 1.
I think it would be the unrealistic to think that Azaz could come in to the first team squad and push us on towards our current targets. He only has half a season in the championship, and hasn’t even played in the EPL yet.
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Finn Azaz has consistently developed every season, while playing at ever-higher levels;
2020-21 L2 1 goal / 1 assist in 27 appearances.
2021-22 L2 7 goals / 6 assists in 34 appearances.
2022-23 L1 8 goals / 8 assists in 24 appearances.
2023-24 Ch 7 goals / 5 assists in 21 appearances.
144 professional appearances at 23 years old is impressive and his consistent adaptation to higher divisions is a sign of his potential. Whatever he does next season, he needs to be wherever offers him the right environment to keep on that impressive upwards trajectory.
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An erudite post, I was merely drawing attention to the quality of his finish XD
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Finn Azaz has consistently developed every season, while playing at ever-higher levels;
2020-21 L2 1 goal / 1 assist in 27 appearances.
2021-22 L2 7 goals / 6 assists in 34 appearances.
2022-23 L1 8 goals / 8 assists in 24 appearances.
2023-24 Ch 7 goals / 5 assists in 21 appearances.
144 professional appearances at 23 years old is impressive and his consistent adaptation to higher divisions is a sign of his potential. Whatever he does next season, he needs to be wherever offers him the right environment to keep on that impressive upwards trajectory.
Those are very impressive numbers coming from midfield too.
I like him.
He has a physicality about him to go with that touch & I think he could certainly become a squad player.
But, I think he is being fattened up Hansel & Gretal style, so we can make some FFP farce savings.
I think that has been the plan all along & his great form is most welcome for the incoming numbers to the accountants & that alone.
I might be wrong though...
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Finn Azaz has consistently developed every season, while playing at ever-higher levels;
2020-21 L2 1 goal / 1 assist in 27 appearances.
2021-22 L2 7 goals / 6 assists in 34 appearances.
2022-23 L1 8 goals / 8 assists in 24 appearances.
2023-24 Ch 7 goals / 5 assists in 21 appearances.
144 professional appearances at 23 years old is impressive and his consistent adaptation to higher divisions is a sign of his potential. Whatever he does next season, he needs to be wherever offers him the right environment to keep on that impressive upwards trajectory.
Those are very impressive numbers coming from midfield too.
I like him.
He has a physicality about him to go with that touch & I think he could certainly become a squad player.
But, I think he is being fattened up Hansel & Gretal style, so we can make some FFP farce savings.
I think that has been the plan all along & his great form is most welcome for the incoming numbers to the accountants & that alone.
I might be wrong though...
I agree. Those numbers are a £20-25m player in the current market and that would be all profit. I could even see someone like Sheff Utd being interested in this window if we can agree to recall him.
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I am the worst judge of footballing ability there is. I saw Silas play for Uniao de Leiria against Porto, and thought he was going to be a world beater. He signed for Wolves and made no impact whatsoever.
I wonder if Azaz is a Hourihane type player. Conor brought a good number of goals and assists, but was frequently criticised for his inability to prevent the opposition walking through our midfield. I thought he would find a new club near the top of the championship to move to, but ended up at Derby in League 1.
I think it would be the unrealistic to think that Azaz could come in to the first team squad and push us on towards our current targets. He only has half a season in the championship, and hasn’t even played in the EPL yet.
I think we've passed the point where promising youth products are valued based on whether or not they could get into our first team.
We're at a level now where, realistically, we might produce one or two players every few years that have the potential to be in our first team squad. We might get incredibly lucky and have two or three of them all come through at the same time. The reality is that the best youth products each year will now be sold on to help our FFP position a la Archer, Philogene, Chuk, Ramsey Jnr and so on.
If some of them break through into OUR side, then great, but it's also good for us as a club if players like Azaz thrive in the Championship, as it could mean the difference between a player leaving for nothing at the end of his contract (which has traditionally been the way with our youth products) and getting a few million for them to help with FFP. Even averaging £10m a year from youth sales would give us the ability to pay two new players £100k a week.
Honestly, I don't really like looking at it this way. I'm more of an old romantic who loves seeing youth players making an impact in our team. I've always had far more affinity for those players than anyone bought in. My earliest memories of youth players breaking through were Gary Shaw, Tony Daley, Mark Walters. And that carried on with the likes of Barry, Hendrie, Vassell, Gabby and Jack. But I'm also a realist, and I recognise that if we're going to have the financial muscle to compete at the top end of the table in the long-term, then we're probably going to need our youth system to be churning out players we can sell at a profit. I don't like it, but I accept it that's the reality these days.
What happens with Finn Azaz will be an interesting insight into how the club sees this sort of player moving forward.
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Finn Azaz has consistently developed every season, while playing at ever-higher levels;
2020-21 L2 1 goal / 1 assist in 27 appearances.
2021-22 L2 7 goals / 6 assists in 34 appearances.
2022-23 L1 8 goals / 8 assists in 24 appearances.
2023-24 Ch 7 goals / 5 assists in 21 appearances.
144 professional appearances at 23 years old is impressive and his consistent adaptation to higher divisions is a sign of his potential. Whatever he does next season, he needs to be wherever offers him the right environment to keep on that impressive upwards trajectory.
Those are very impressive numbers coming from midfield too.
I like him.
He has a physicality about him to go with that touch & I think he could certainly become a squad player.
But, I think he is being fattened up Hansel & Gretal style, so we can make some FFP farce savings.
I think that has been the plan all along & his great form is most welcome for the incoming numbers to the accountants & that alone.
I might be wrong though...
I agree. Those numbers are a £20-25m player in the current market and that would be all profit. I could even see someone like Sheff Utd being interested in this window if we can agree to recall him.
I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
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Finn Azaz has consistently developed every season, while playing at ever-higher levels;
2020-21 L2 1 goal / 1 assist in 27 appearances.
2021-22 L2 7 goals / 6 assists in 34 appearances.
2022-23 L1 8 goals / 8 assists in 24 appearances.
2023-24 Ch 7 goals / 5 assists in 21 appearances.
144 professional appearances at 23 years old is impressive and his consistent adaptation to higher divisions is a sign of his potential. Whatever he does next season, he needs to be wherever offers him the right environment to keep on that impressive upwards trajectory.
Those are very impressive numbers coming from midfield too.
I like him.
He has a physicality about him to go with that touch & I think he could certainly become a squad player.
But, I think he is being fattened up Hansel & Gretal style, so we can make some FFP farce savings.
I think that has been the plan all along & his great form is most welcome for the incoming numbers to the accountants & that alone.
I might be wrong though...
I agree. Those numbers are a £20-25m player in the current market and that would be all profit. I could even see someone like Sheff Utd being interested in this window if we can agree to recall him.
I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
His record this season is comparable to Archer at Boro and we got £20m there. His record is better than Alex Scott who went for around £25m. I get that both are younger but he's genuinely one of the top 10-12 attacking players in the championship and that's the market value for that group.
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I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
It probably is for us, because we don't appear to see the value in potential.
Take Philogene-Bidace for example, the fee we let him go for was ridiculous for a player of his ability.
What was it? £5m?
Hull fans now reckon that he is worth about £30m to them.
Whether we bring him back & sell him on for around that amount remains to be seen, especially as it will actually cost us £10m for the privilege, IF, the conditions of the clause are met.
Another one, in Archer, what was he? £20m?
Again, for a player with his numbers, ability & potential, I don't think we have added potential into the valuation.
Whether that happens again with Azaz, is more than likely, in my humble opinion...
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I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
It probably is for us, because we don't appear to see the value in potential.
Take Philogene-Bidace for example, the fee we let him go for was ridiculous for a player of his ability.
What was it? £5m?
Hull fans now reckon that he is worth about £30m to them.
Whether we bring him back & sell him on for around that amount remains to be seen, especially as it will actually cost us £10m for the privilege, IF, the conditions of the clause are met.
Another one, in Archer, what was he? £20m?
Again, for a player with his numbers, ability & potential, I don't think we have added potential into the valuation.
Whether that happens again with Azaz, is more than likely, in my humble opinion...
I think the price you get if you want a buy-back is ALWAYS going to be less than if you sell without one. Could we have got more for the likes of Archer? Probably. But we would have had to sacrifice the buy-back clause to do so.
I will be DELIGHTED to be proven wrong with Azaz, but I think the absolute best we can expect is Ramsey Jnr style money and more realistically something around £10m. Unless he has an incredible second-half to the season and gets close to 20 goals from midfield, then all bets are off :-)
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His record this season is comparable to Archer at Boro and we got £20m there. His record is better than Alex Scott who went for around £25m. I get that both are younger but he's genuinely one of the top 10-12 attacking players in the championship and that's the market value for that group.
Sheffield United were gambling with their Premier League money though, so yes he could be worth that if one of the newly promited teams want to take a chance. If it's a Championship team it would be less like Philogene at Hull, but possibly a deal done in our favour.
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His record this season is comparable to Archer at Boro and we got £20m there. His record is better than Alex Scott who went for around £25m. I get that both are younger but he's genuinely one of the top 10-12 attacking players in the championship and that's the market value for that group.
Sheffield United were gambling with their Premier League money though, so yes he could be worth that if one of the newly promited teams want to take a chance. If it's a Championship team it would be less like Philogene at Hull, but possibly a deal done in our favour.
Yep, that's exactly who I was talking about when I said it.
I agree. Those numbers are a £20-25m player in the current market and that would be all profit. I could even see someone like Sheff Utd being interested in this window if we can agree to recall him.
Next summer is more likely and I could see someone like Ipswich being interested or one of the clubs that manage to dodge relegation but see 1-2 of their better players go out (Forest if Gibbs-White goes for example).
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I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
It probably is for us, because we don't appear to see the value in potential.
Take Philogene-Bidace for example, the fee we let him go for was ridiculous for a player of his ability.
What was it? £5m?
Hull fans now reckon that he is worth about £30m to them.
Whether we bring him back & sell him on for around that amount remains to be seen, especially as it will actually cost us £10m for the privilege, IF, the conditions of the clause are met.
Another one, in Archer, what was he? £20m?
Again, for a player with his numbers, ability & potential, I don't think we have added potential into the valuation.
Whether that happens again with Azaz, is more than likely, in my humble opinion...
I think the price you get if you want a buy-back is ALWAYS going to be less than if you sell without one. Could we have got more for the likes of Archer? Probably. But we would have had to sacrifice the buy-back clause to do so.
I will be DELIGHTED to be proven wrong with Azaz, but I think the absolute best we can expect is Ramsey Jnr style money and more realistically something around £10m. Unless he has an incredible second-half to the season and gets close to 20 goals from midfield, then all bets are off :-)
Granted, that is an element that will reduce the price, so I accept that as a valid point, but I don't think it warrants such a reduction in price to totally remove potential from the finalised fee.
Take Alex Scott for example.
He had nowhere near the numbers of Aaron Ramsey & he played a shit ton more games.
But he still went for £25m, mostly due to his potential...
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I think £25m for Azaz is a pipe dream. We've had youth players at teams contributing heavily towards a promotion push from the Championship, and still only getting £15m-£20m.
If he carries on like he has been so far this season, I think he'll be worth £5-£10m, which is perfectly acceptable if we get a buy-back of about double that if he happens to find himself in the premier league and still contributing and scoring at his current rate.
I think the kid (can we still call him a kid at 23?) has the potential to play in the top flight, but I don't think someone is going to pay £20m+ to take him there.
It probably is for us, because we don't appear to see the value in potential.
Take Philogene-Bidace for example, the fee we let him go for was ridiculous for a player of his ability.
What was it? £5m?
Hull fans now reckon that he is worth about £30m to them.
Whether we bring him back & sell him on for around that amount remains to be seen, especially as it will actually cost us £10m for the privilege, IF, the conditions of the clause are met.
Another one, in Archer, what was he? £20m?
Again, for a player with his numbers, ability & potential, I don't think we have added potential into the valuation.
Whether that happens again with Azaz, is more than likely, in my humble opinion...
I think the price you get if you want a buy-back is ALWAYS going to be less than if you sell without one. Could we have got more for the likes of Archer? Probably. But we would have had to sacrifice the buy-back clause to do so.
I will be DELIGHTED to be proven wrong with Azaz, but I think the absolute best we can expect is Ramsey Jnr style money and more realistically something around £10m. Unless he has an incredible second-half to the season and gets close to 20 goals from midfield, then all bets are off :-)
Granted, that is an element that will reduce the price, so I accept that as a valid point, but I don't think it warrants such a reduction in price to totally remove potential from the finalised fee.
Take Alex Scott for example.
He had nowhere near the numbers of Aaron Ramsey & he played a shit ton more games.
But he still went for £25m, mostly due to his potential...
Yes, potential plays a big part, I agree, but Alex Scott is also a very talented player who does far more than score and assist. He's a Grealish-style dribbler, and was the Championship Young Player of the Year in the 22/23 season at 19 (and got in the team of the season), despite playing for a team that finished 14th. He's very highly rated by the people who've played against him. I'll be surprised if he's still at Bournemouth in a couple of years.
That's not to say Azaz isn't a very good player in his own right. I just think comparing him to someone like Alex Scott is a bit unfair on him. Not every promising midfielder thriving in the Championship is worth £25m.
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Yes, potential plays a big part, I agree, but Alex Scott is also a very talented player who does far more than score and assist. He's a Grealish-style dribbler, and was the Championship Young Player of the Year in the 22/23 season at 19 (and got in the team of the season), despite playing for a team that finished 14th. He's very highly rated by the people who've played against him. I'll be surprised if he's still at Bournemouth in a couple of years.
That's not to say Azaz isn't a very good player in his own right. I just think comparing him to someone like Alex Scott is a bit unfair on him. Not every promising midfielder thriving in the Championship is worth £25m.
Oh, Im not comparing Scott to Azaz.
Apologies if my piss poor communication skills led you down that road.
I was more talking about Scott in relation to his price being inflated due to his potential, compared to Aaron Ramsey who had far higher stats for goals & assists in a shorter period of games, along with the influence he had on Middlesbrough in that as soon as he got injured, their form dropped off a cliff.
Now I don't disagree with Scotts price. I think it's fine because despite his relatively poor stats, he is worth a fair whack due to his potential.
I just think that Villa as a club, don't appear to use potential of the player to inflate the valuation.
As for Azaz, at 23, (24 by the start of next season in Sept), I would think that the "potential" selling point wouldn't be so strong.
His fee should probably be around the £15m-£20m mark, if he keeps up his form...
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Yes, potential plays a big part, I agree, but Alex Scott is also a very talented player who does far more than score and assist. He's a Grealish-style dribbler, and was the Championship Young Player of the Year in the 22/23 season at 19 (and got in the team of the season), despite playing for a team that finished 14th. He's very highly rated by the people who've played against him. I'll be surprised if he's still at Bournemouth in a couple of years.
That's not to say Azaz isn't a very good player in his own right. I just think comparing him to someone like Alex Scott is a bit unfair on him. Not every promising midfielder thriving in the Championship is worth £25m.
Oh, Im not comparing Scott to Azaz.
Apologies if my piss poor communication skills led you down that road.
I was more talking about Scott in relation to his price being inflated due to his potential, compared to Aaron Ramsey who had far higher stats for goals & assists in a shorter period of games, along with the influence he had on Middlesbrough in that as soon as he got injured, their form dropped off a cliff.
Now I don't disagree with Scotts price. I think it's fine because despite his relatively poor stats, he is worth a fair whack due to his potential.
I just think that Villa as a club, don't appear to use potential of the player to inflate the valuation.
As for Azaz, at 23, (24 by the start of next season in Sept), I would think that the "potential" selling point wouldn't be so strong.
His fee should probably be around the £15m-£20m mark, if he keeps up his form...
To be fair I sort of did, not to compare their ability but rather to show that young players who do well in the championship go for those sort of fees.
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He seems to have handled every step up well so would have good value to a Championship side either in Jan or summer. Odd that he has looked good yet hasn’t made a debut for a poor Ireland side yet just one u21 cap I believe
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And word is out! Azaz being suggested as of interest to Boro and Southampton.
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And word is out! Azaz being suggested as of interest to Boro and Southampton.
I'm not sure if a mid-season switch is in his best interest, although with the manager leaving Plymouth, maybe that changes things for him. If he's settled and enjoying his football at Plymouth, and doing well, you'd think he'd be unlikely to move for another loan at the same level. If it's a permanent move, then potentially that would be better, especially if there's a chance of promotion and being in the PL next season.
You'd be pissed off if you were a baggies fan though. We took him off their hands on a free transfer and loaned him straight out for three seasons and now stand to make a big profit on a player we've barely lifted a finger on!
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Southampton would be a step up. Also if they gain automatic promotion he might get his first taste of premiership football with them.
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What type of player is he - obviously he has an eye for a goal and seems to have a great shot on him but in general play what are his strengths? Is he reliable/useful off the ball etc. ?
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And word is out! Azaz being suggested as of interest to Boro and Southampton.
I'm not sure if a mid-season switch is in his best interest, although with the manager leaving Plymouth, maybe that changes things for him. If he's settled and enjoying his football at Plymouth, and doing well, you'd think he'd be unlikely to move for another loan at the same level. If it's a permanent move, then potentially that would be better, especially if there's a chance of promotion and being in the PL next season.
You'd be pissed off if you were a baggies fan though. We took him off their hands on a free transfer and loaned him straight out for three seasons and now stand to make a big profit on a player we've barely lifted a finger on!
Stoke are a decent bet due to previous Muff' manager Schumacher knowing & trusting Azaz from their time together...
It all depends on whether we can recall him now to send him to Stoke.
Although sending him to Stoke is not exactly a reward, as its sending him to Stoke, & while Plymouth isn't the greatest city in the world (they unironically accuse Birmingham of being a grey shit-hole, yet they actually spray a lot of their houses with grey concrete), but close to Plymouth via a short cycle ride, you can visit a couple of lovely beaches, & a car ride can take you to some real beautiful scenic places, so its not the worst area in the country to live...
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Given how consistent he's been for the last couple of years and how rubbish Ireland are, can any of our Irish brethren shed any light on why his international career consists of one solitary under-21 cap?
He's too old now, but given there's a guy currently in the U-21s who plays in the third tier in Belgium, you'd think he'd have played a bit in the last few years.
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What type of player is he - obviously he has an eye for a goal and seems to have a great shot on him but in general play what are his strengths? Is he reliable/useful off the ball etc. ?
Plymouth have used him as an 8 or a 10, mostly.
At a push they have also used him left mid.
He is physical, about 6'1", has a bit of pace, skilful, presses high, works hard, creates chances, scores (bangers), assists, etc.
Defending isn't his strong point, but he does it anyway.
My brother in law & nephew, who go to all home & away games, say he "can do things that others cant" (direct quote), & they absolutely love him.
My cleaner & her family, who go to a lot of games & have ties to the club going back decades, absolutely adore him & apparently he appears to be a decent young man who wants to keep pushing & learning.
They all think that he is too good for the Championship...
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Yeah, I don't get that either. Stephen Kenny must have tried that many players in his tenure, I'm surprised that he didn't give Conor Hourihane's toddler a go (top dribbler, etc.).
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Given how consistent he's been for the last couple of years and how rubbish Ireland are, can any of our Irish brethren shed any light on why his international career consists of one solitary under-21 cap?
Stephen Kenny doesn't know his arse from his elbow.
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Azaz is going to Middlesbrough for £2m apparently.
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Azaz is going to Middlesbrough for £2m apparently.
Has that come from Football Insider though? That's the only place I've seen it and if so... well. ::)
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From £20m to £2m in the blink of an eye. Bet he scores the winner against us on Saturday too...
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From £20m to £2m in the blink of an eye. Bet he scores the winner against us on Saturday too...
Like finding out you've won the lottery then phoning up and 10 others have the same numbers.
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From £20m to £2m in the blink of an eye. Bet he scores the winner against us on Saturday too...
Like finding out you've won the lottery then phoning up and 10 others have the same numbers.
Or Wayne Rooney has become your financial manager.
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Chishom Afoka Has been returned to Villa from his loan to Bradford.
From £20m to £2m in the blink of an eye. Bet he scores the winner against us on Saturday too...
Like finding out you've won the lottery then phoning up and 10 others have the same numbers.
Or Wayne Rooney has become your financial manager.
Translator...
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£20m? Whatever you lot are taking, I'd like some too.
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I know it can be the nature of the beast, but I do feel we have to be fair to clubs like Plymouth who give our young players a real chance. They're fighting for survival at a new level and losing him will be a big blow. We have to be careful we don't get a reputation for screwing these types of club over, or we will find it harder to get the best loan placements.
Unless the player himself is pushing to leave or we desperately needed the £2m, I'd ask whether it is worth it mid-season for such a small gain. Especially when his value could be higher with a full season of Championship football under his belt.
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I am guessing Plymouth can't afford it Dogtanian, or they would bid too.
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Azaz is going to Middlesbrough for £2m apparently.
Has that come from Football Insider though? That's the only place I've seen it and if so... well. ::)
So... Football Insider told the truth? :o
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Sometimes you just need to ask whether the story's credible.
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£2m for seemingly one of the best young players in the Championship does sound low to me.
Christ, we paid nearly £6m for Aaron Tshibola.
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Finn Azaz signed a contract extension in August 23 according to AVFC.CO.UK and then went on loan to PA.
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He's worth a bit more than £2m surely, that can't be right?
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Surely we won’t let him sign so he can play on Saturday? That would be asking for trouble :-)
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He's worth a bit more than £2m surely, that can't be right?
It does seem low, especially if he's not in the last year of his contract or anything. That's nothing at all for a midfielder with 7 goals to his name, especially as he's playing in a struggling team. I mean, that Dewsbury-Hall at Leicester is very highly rated, and he's only got 8 playing for the league leaders.
For that little, you'd think there's be something of a bidding war going on, unless we've put a similar provision in like Philogene at Hull.
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He's worth a bit more than £2m surely, that can't be right?
It does seem low, especially if he's not in the last year of his contract or anything. That's nothing at all for a midfielder with 7 goals to his name, especially as he's playing in a struggling team. I mean, that Dewsbury-Hall at Leicester is very highly rated, and he's only got 8 playing for the league leaders.
For that little, you'd think there's be something of a bidding war going on, unless we've put a similar provision in like Philogene at Hull.
I think the point is, outside of the top flight or the clubs with parachute payments, nobody has a pot to piss in.
The key is getting these players to a level where those clubs are interested, then it's payday. Shunting off Azaz when he seems to be approaching that level for what in football terms is a few bob seems a bit strange.
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He's worth a bit more than £2m surely, that can't be right?
It does seem low, especially if he's not in the last year of his contract or anything. That's nothing at all for a midfielder with 7 goals to his name, especially as he's playing in a struggling team. I mean, that Dewsbury-Hall at Leicester is very highly rated, and he's only got 8 playing for the league leaders.
For that little, you'd think there's be something of a bidding war going on, unless we've put a similar provision in like Philogene at Hull.
That would be my guess. "You can have him, and below his current market value, but we want a decent chunk of any profit and/or a buy-back if he turns into prime Lampard"
But honestly, for £2m, it hardly seems worth it, unless the club have looked closely at him and decided he's never going to be more than a Championship player? Which would be surprising given he's met every challenge put in front of him so far!
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At 23 the thought is probably that he won't be ready for the Prem for another year or two and that is too long. There may well be a buy back/sell on clause, or both. It's probably best for the player though, a settled situation at a good club will allow him to develop without the constant switching of coaching and playing styles. I wish the lad all the best and hope he scores a consolation goal to make it 1-5 at the weekend.
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At 23 the thought is probably that he won't be ready for the Prem for another year or two and that is too long. There may well be a buy back/sell on clause, or both. It's probably best for the player though, a settled situation at a good club will allow him to develop without the constant switching of coaching and playing styles. I wish the lad all the best and hope he scores a consolation goal to make it 1-5 at the weekend.
Reminds me a little of the Jonathan Hogg experience: Azaz is clearly a decent Championship player but has probably passed the age where we'd spend more time on his development. However, it's not inconceivable that he might join a club that then gets promoted and he proves himself to be a reliable if unspectacular player in said team.
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Well, we’ve definitely recalled him from his loan at Plymouth according to his own posts on social so he’s going somewhere. Not sure how comfortable I am in a world where “Footy Insider” is accurate though.
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Well, we’ve definitely recalled him from his loan at Plymouth according to his own posts on social so he’s going somewhere. Not sure how comfortable I am in a world where “Footy Insider” is accurate though.
https://x.com/argyle/status/1742621988286308517?s=46&t=bVpftFYUKG9FXkQ-mcgjPw
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If it's £2.5m as reported, then I think it's a lowball offer, but I can only assume the club either really needs the FFP help for a January signing (which would be surprising), or they simply don't think he's going to be worth much more than he currently is.
I hope there is some sort of sell-on clause involved, because if he continues being a goal-scoring midfielder at the top end of the Championship, he'll be worth a lot more than £2.5m in a year or two.
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If it's £2.5m as reported, then I think it's a lowball offer, but I can only assume the club either really needs the FFP help for a January signing (which would be surprising), or they simply don't think he's going to be worth much more than he currently is.
I hope there is some sort of sell-on clause involved, because if he continues being a goal-scoring midfielder at the top end of the Championship, he'll be worth a lot more than £2.5m in a year or two.
Looks like the contraxt extension in the summer was only for a year so the offer reflects the fact that he could go on a free in a few months.
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If it's £2.5m as reported, then I think it's a lowball offer, but I can only assume the club either really needs the FFP help for a January signing (which would be surprising), or they simply don't think he's going to be worth much more than he currently is.
I hope there is some sort of sell-on clause involved, because if he continues being a goal-scoring midfielder at the top end of the Championship, he'll be worth a lot more than £2.5m in a year or two.
Looks like the contraxt extension in the summer was only for a year so the offer reflects the fact that he could go on a free in a few months.
It runs until 2025, so a year and a half.
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If it's £2.5m as reported, then I think it's a lowball offer, but I can only assume the club either really needs the FFP help for a January signing (which would be surprising), or they simply don't think he's going to be worth much more than he currently is.
I hope there is some sort of sell-on clause involved, because if he continues being a goal-scoring midfielder at the top end of the Championship, he'll be worth a lot more than £2.5m in a year or two.
Looks like the contraxt extension in the summer was only for a year so the offer reflects the fact that he could go on a free in a few months.
It runs until 2025, so a year and a half.
then £2.5m is ridiculously low, the contract was the only thing I could see to justify it.
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Could there be add ons to that? They get promoted we get another million. I'd hope a sell on clause too. Maybe that's the only way Middlesbrough could afford it?
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Carrick has stated that Azaz should be available to play against us on Sat...
There are a couple of small details to tie up & he will be a Boro player soon.
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Carrick has stated that Azaz should be available to play against us on Sat...
There are a couple of small details to tie up & he will be a Boro player soon.
Nailed on to score then
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Azaz has joined Boro for an "undisclosed fee".
If he went for anything under £10M, without a buy-back & sell on fee, then whoever did the negotiating needs shooting into the centre of the sun.
But as we don't know the details, (wonder why?), I will just wish the kid good luck & hope that he develops & we get a shitload of cash out of his development at a later date...
Moving on, Ben Chrisene has joined Blackburn on loan until the end of the season...
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A few million profit after being here two and a half years and never threatening to be near the first team. Decent business and I doubt we'll be lamenting him leaving. That said, good luck to him for the future.
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End of the day, the market decides a player's value. You can point to examples of what other players went for but there was a buyer prepared to meet the asking price. If there was someone offering £10m, we wouldn't be entertaining offers of £2.5m. We recruited a player without paying a fee for him, he's been out on loan pretty much the whole time so won't have paid much in way of salary and then sold him for a couple of million. And we've probably got some clauses that cover us in the event that he develops further.
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Moving on, Ben Chrisene has joined Blackburn on loan until the end of the season...
Considered to be a rising star until he knackered a medial ligament when on loan at Kilmarnock last January, so he's lost 12 months of development.
This could be a great opportunity for him to show Unai that he's worth bringing into the first team squad next season as backup to Moreno - if we decide to sell Digne.
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A few million profit after being here two and a half years and never threatening to be near the first team. Decent business and I doubt we'll be lamenting him leaving. That said, good luck to him for the future.
Indeed, picked him up for nothing, taught him how to play the game for a bit, sent him on loan, made several million pounds out of him.
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Not eligible for tomorrow for ’boro.
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A few million profit after being here two and a half years and never threatening to be near the first team. Decent business and I doubt we'll be lamenting him leaving. That said, good luck to him for the future.
Plus Plymouth probably paid his wages for the bulk of the two and a half years he was here.
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Very happy to see Chrisene get a loan, really really hope he gets the rest of the season injury free as for me he was the actual star of the Youth Cup winning team, Carney etc got all the plaudits but Chrisene was head and shoulders for me.
Not sure left back is where he will finish up, think he will end up in the middle of the park.
Great opportunity now at a really good club
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Great to see Villa recalling players because they are wanted on loan at a higher level. Same Ben Chrisene and for Lemar Bogarde. Good to see these players being tested at a higher level and Villa doing the right thing by our assets.
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Shows what a state the Championship is in, that a club like Plymouth, who presumably would have loved to have kept him, can't afford £2m.
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Think I read Bogarde might be going to Sunderland on loan which would be a good step up.
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Shows what a state the Championship is in, that a club like Plymouth, who presumably would have loved to have kept him, can't afford £2m.
In fairness Plymouth haven't played at this level in donkeys years so they're always going to be out-muscled financially by almost every other club in that division. It is true though that beyond the parachute money of the former PL clubs, most other ones are treading water. I was actually surprised in the summer that Hull could afford the £5.8m that they paid for Philogene.
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Shows what a state the Championship is in, that a club like Plymouth, who presumably would have loved to have kept him, can't afford £2m.
All of the Argyle fans that I know are gutted to fuck that they couldn't bring him in.
Every single one of them...
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Ben Chrisene to Blackburn is a good level loan. Interesting to see players in their first experience of Championship football. Good luck!
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Sousa on the bench for Plymouth.
Chrisene started for Blackburn.
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Have I missed something? Has Louie Barry been abducted by aliens? 👽
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Have I missed something? Has Louie Barry been abducted by aliens? 👽
I think he is out injured at the moment
Here is an interview with him about it
https://www.stockportcounty.com/an-interview-with-louie-barry/
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Yeah, bad injury. Shame, he was smashing it in that league.
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Have I missed something? Has Louie Barry been abducted by aliens? 👽
I think he is out injured at the moment
Here is an interview with him about it
https://www.stockportcounty.com/an-interview-with-louie-barry/
Ta.
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Barry tore his Hamstring.
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[b]Ben Chrisene - 5[/b]
Had spells where he looked composed and others where he struggled. Was let off by Dembele after failing to deal with a cross from the opposite side.
https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/24117978.blackburn-rovers-ratings-mcfadzean-impresses-attack-struggles/
He was playing on the left side of a back 3. Could this be where he ends up as a central defender?
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Good to see him playing again.
He looks big enough to cope in the middle.
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Not a loan but a buy back option Philogene seems to be making a name for himself.
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https://x.com/tylerAV_1/status/1757515708420767951?s=20
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It will be interesting to see whether we activate his buy-back.
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Don't they need to get promoted and other clubs can outbid us so there's no real weight to it.
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Think we've dropped a bollock here
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Don't they need to get promoted and other clubs can outbid us so there's no real weight to it.
I've seen this discussed a lot. I've also gone back and looked at the exact words used by the Hull chairman which led this story. My view? I think the chairman was being very clever with the fans, who weren't sure buying players who can be taken away again is a good thing.
Now, Do I think there is a buy-back clause that if they get promoted we can get him but only for £15m? Yes, I'm certain there is. But, do I think that is the ONLY circumstance in which we can buy him (them getting promoted)? No, I VERY much doubt it.
I'm sure the buy-back has all sorts of variables, based on whether they get promoted, how long he's been there, if he gets International recognition, and so on.
My view is that their chairman only mentioned the circumstances in which they would get the absolute maximum from the deal - which is if we're buying back a premier league player. In which case, £15m is fair enough.
I would be absolutely amazed if there isn't something in the buy-back deal that allows us to buy him from them while they're still a Championship side, but I also completely understand why he wouldn't mention that in an interview specifically designed to get the fans onside with the deal.
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Don't they need to get promoted and other clubs can outbid us so there's no real weight to it.
I've seen this discussed a lot. I've also gone back and looked at the exact words used by the Hull chairman which led this story. My view? I think the chairman was being very clever with the fans, who weren't sure buying players who can be taken away again is a good thing.
Now, Do I think there is a buy-back clause that if they get promoted we can get him but only for £15m? Yes, I'm certain there is. But, do I think that is the ONLY circumstance in which we can buy him (them getting promoted)? No, I VERY much doubt it.
I'm sure the buy-back has all sorts of variables, based on whether they get promoted, how long he's been there, if he gets International recognition, and so on.
My view is that their chairman only mentioned the circumstances in which they would get the absolute maximum from the deal - which is if we're buying back a premier league player. In which case, £15m is fair enough.
I would be absolutely amazed if there isn't something in the buy-back deal that allows us to buy him from them while they're still a Championship side, but I also completely understand why he wouldn't mention that in an interview specifically designed to get the fans onside with the deal.
Yeah, was going to write something similar but you've worded it better than I have.
I suspect Bidace in particular is closer in spirit to a loan than it is to a proper transfer - the main difference being that Hull will (hopefully) receive some financial benefit out of it.
Dunno about anyone else, but I've felt for a bit uncomfortable with us getting all the money from the Azaz deal, whilst Plymouth - who are basically the ones who've made him saleable - have got bugger all. I mean, it's the deal they signed up to and so on, but it just seems a bit unfair to me that we get the benefit from a player who's never played for us, was never likely to play for us, and we have had limited-if-any involvement in his development.
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But then again, with regards to Azaz, they likely didn't pay any loan-fee for him, he contributed greatly to their promotion and consolidation in the Ch'ship and we've sold him for an almost nominal amount, which would have been within the range of most Ch'ship teams budgets. Unfortunately not for Plymouth but they clearly don't bear grudges, with Lino Sousa going straight there on-loan from us after we signed him from Arsenal. We've just got Kessler-Hayden back from them too so it's clearly a fruitful relationship for both parties.
These are the most recent quotes I can see regarding Philogene (from last week):
Hull City vice-chairman Tan Kesler has reiterated the club's agreement with Aston Villa over the terms of Jaden Philogene's £5m move last summer.
Kesler, speaking at the 1904 Club's live podcast event hosted by Hull Live, reaffirmed the situation that Villa could only attempt to sign Philogene, if the Tigers were in the Premier League, and even then, the Birmingham outfit would have to match any other bids submitted from rival clubs. Villa's buy-back fee stands at £15m, but if another club were to offer £20m, then City would be able to accept that unless Villa matched it.
"He's not their player, he's a Hull City player for sure, that I can tell you for sure," Kesler said when it was put to him Villa fans were taunting their Tigers counterparts. "I love social media, I'm starting to love it even more. I've been open from the beginning and also you need to know, that if we promote Villa have agreed to a buy-back but only if we promote and we're in the Premier League.
"They still have to agree with the player and they still have to match, and this is very important, they still have to match if we receive another offer. I think when the time comes, it would be a hefty deal for Villa to get him back, but they're our friends so I'm not saying anything that I shouldn't be saying here."
City's vice-chairman also confirmed that the buy-back offer stands for the duration of Philogene's contract, which has two more years to run this summer, with the club holding the option of a further 12 months.
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He reminds me of Eze. If he turns out that good I hope we get him back.
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The crucial thing will be whether Philogene wants to come back to Villa, where he'll be competing with Bailey and Diaby for a place.
He went to Hull to get the first team football he wasn't getting with us. Unless he's going to be a first choice player, I doubt he'll choose to come back.
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The biggest thing with Philogene, for me, is that we'll need to have a lot of reminders that he's chosen to drop the Bidace part of his surname.
I agree with Smithy that I can't see the 'in the same league' thing as being the only trigger for the buy-back, we'll see but I maintain that I'd be surprised if he isn't back at Villa within 18months (from now).
Finally a few years ago I saw him in a reserve/U18 game and told everyone I knew that he could be a superstar but he needed more end product, this season has shown that he's developing that and if he carries on I'd be amazed if he doesn't end up with England caps.
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It would be really odd if we could only buy him back if they get promoted. We have an automatic buy back for Archer when Sheffield get relegated. Maybe we also have an automatic but back if they don’t get promoted?! 😂
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The crucial thing will be whether Philogene wants to come back to Villa, where he'll be competing with Bailey and Diaby for a place.
He went to Hull to get the first team football he wasn't getting with us. Unless he's going to be a first choice player, I doubt he'll choose to come back.
There are agreements in place between the club and the players with buy-back clauses about the terms and conditions in the event of their return I think. I recall that the announcement about the middle Ramsey brother was held up while this was negotiated.
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The crucial thing will be whether Philogene wants to come back to Villa, where he'll be competing with Bailey and Diaby for a place.
He went to Hull to get the first team football he wasn't getting with us. Unless he's going to be a first choice player, I doubt he'll choose to come back.
There are agreements in place between the club and the players with buy-back clauses about the terms and conditions in the event of their return I think. I recall that the announcement about the middle Ramsey brother was held up while this was negotiated.
Indeed, a buy-back isn't a buy-back if the player can just say "no thanks". All three parties have to agree in advance, otherwise it's pointless. Which is one of the reasons why I take someof what the Hull City bloke says with a giant pinch of salt.
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Tbf, the Hull chairman is only going to talk in context of getting promoted. He's not going to say 'and if we don't get promoted, this is the situation...' Can't imagine that would go down well with their supporters.
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I’d be happy for him to spend another year at Hull before bringing him back (assuming we have the option). Between Bailey and Diaby we already have two similar players.
I don’t think having a third will make much difference and he will improve more playing each week at Hull.
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Did anyone watch the Plymouth game last night?
I didn't see it, but checked Whoscored this morning, and Sousa got a 7 and an 88% pass success rate, the highest for Plymouth and second-highest for both teams.
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I watched the first half of the Plymouth game, he was ok. He was playing left midfield by the look of it and got in a couple of decent crosses.
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Lino Sousa 7 - The 19-year-old Aston Villa loanee gave Argyle good attacking impetus in his role as left wing-back. For a full debut it was one which offered lots of promise for the rest of the season. He should only get better with more game-time after only joining the Pilgrims on transfer deadline day. Sousa provides good competition with Mickel Miller for that position.
https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/sport/football/plymouth-argyle-player-ratings-2-9098738
Good start
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Sounds good!
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Heard Chrisene did well last night. Anyone watch the Blackburn-Newcastle game?
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Only caught extra-time. I was looking forward to seeing him take a penalty but alas, he never got the chance.
The commentator (Drury maybe? Not Mowbray anyway, some other dunderhead) was singing his praises towards the end. He also pronounced his surname in a way I didn't expect. I though it was "Kri-seen", but I think he went for "Kri-sen-ay". I presume he's correct. Don't want another Iroegbunam/roo-bun-em situation...
Anyway, I did see Ben make a lovely run up the centre of the pitch towards the end and was chopped-down for which Longstaff received a booking.
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The commentator (Drury maybe? Not Mowbray anyway, some other dunderhead) was singing his praises towards the end. He also pronounced his surname in a way I didn't expect. I thought it was "Kri-seen", but I think he went for "Kri-sen-ay". I presume he's correct. Don't want another Iroegbunam/roo-bun-em situation...
There's no accent on the last 'e' so I'd say you're right. You don't hear people saying something is "se-ren-ay".
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When I read it, I think of it as 'Kri-sen-ay'.
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Thought the lad looked decent, comfortable receiving the ball in tight spaces, dynamic and put in some goal saving challenges.
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And so begins the Philogene hype, which I suspect will continue until such time as he's back with us, or playing in the Premier League for someone else... https://www.teamtalk.com/news/tottenham-sign-hull-starlet-aston-villa-buyback-clause
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Is that a new quote from their chairman?
It is more detailed than I previously remember, and if true, not the most robust buy back option.
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No, it's an old quote from last Sep. More recent one from their vice-chairman was posted a few weeks ago.
We've lost him forever, he's gotten too good too quickly.
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Has anyone seen any updates on Louie Barry? I remember when he did his hamstring they said it was bad and he'd be out for four months, but we're passed that and not seen any mention of him anywhere? He was flying in League Two with Stockport, so it would be great if he could get back playing before the season is over and regain the form he was showing.
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4 months is a tad optimistic for a complete hamstring tear. Moreno was out for about 6 months when he did his.
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Marschall has been missing from the MK first team through injury, but was back on the bench at the weekend as the Dons got stuffed 5-0 by Stockport.
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
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Has anyone seen any updates on Louie Barry? I remember when he did his hamstring they said it was bad and he'd be out for four months, but we're passed that and not seen any mention of him anywhere? He was flying in League Two with Stockport, so it would be great if he could get back playing before the season is over and regain the form he was showing.
I’m sure I read he’s back training now.
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Ben Chrisene has looked ok-ish in the first half for Blackburn. Although he did almost stick the ball in the net or help with og, but for an offside.
Its not hugely his fault as the tactics have been sit deep, win the ball, take ages to get the ball forward to the wide men, & then refuse to cross for the 5'7" single striker against two 6'5" centre backs.
He has looked comfortable on the ball though, has made a few simple passes & a couple of tackles.
Blackburn look a bit shit though.
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
Who's that?
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
Who's that?
Kid we picked up from West Brom...
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
Who's that?
Kid we picked up from West Brom...
Could you narrow it down a bit please?
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
Who's that?
Kid we picked up from West Brom...
'Rico is NOT a crime', as AOC might put it.
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Rico Richards has scored for Stockport.
Who's that?
They are the team from just outside Manchester that ManCity fans used to support. Not to be confused with ManU, who aren't in Manchester either but Chelsea fans used to support.
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Sebastian Revan scored and provided an assist to ensure Rotherham weren't relegated today.
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Seb Revan starting for Rotherham in tonight's game, Lino Sousa on the bench for Plymouth.
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Good to see that Louie Barry got an assist and hit the post after coming on as a 64th minute sub for Stockport against Notts County. Final score 2-5 to Stockport who get promoted as Champions of League Two.
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Good to see that Louie Barry got an assist and hit the post after coming on as a 64th minute sub for Stockport against Notts County. Final score 2-5 to Stockport who get promoted as Champions of League Two.
Didn't realise he was back playing, which is good to hear.
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Good to see that Louie Barry got an assist and hit the post after coming on as a 64th minute sub for Stockport against Notts County. Final score 2-5 to Stockport who get promoted as Champions of League Two.
Didn't realise he was back playing, which is good to hear.
Great to see him back with an assist, but he hit the post from a penalty, so not "that" great.
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Good to see that Louie Barry got an assist and hit the post after coming on as a 64th minute sub for Stockport against Notts County. Final score 2-5 to Stockport who get promoted as Champions of League Two.
Didn't realise he was back playing, which is good to hear.
Great to see him back with an assist, but he hit the post from a penalty, so not "that" great.
Ah, so Barry DID take the penalty?
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It's harder to hit the post from a penalty than score, so well done Louie-Louie!
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It's harder to hit the post from a penalty than score, so well done Louie-Louie!
Side-bar Challenge
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Good to see that Louie Barry got an assist and hit the post after coming on as a 64th minute sub for Stockport against Notts County. Final score 2-5 to Stockport who get promoted as Champions of League Two.
I saw the goal on SlySports & it looked to me liked he had grown a couple of inches.
Anybody else see or heard anything similar?
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He did look to have filled out, and was scoring some brilliant goals, before he got injured.
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Morgan Sanson scored in Nice's win over Lorient tonight.They are now just behind Lille. Can we get any reasonable fee for him at the end of the season? He's been a regular in their side.
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Good article on BBC Sport football pages with Exeter manager saying Sinisalo "Will go on to have an incredible career". After starting in goal for all but one of their league games before last one tomorrow.
Nice story about him cancelling a holiday and turning up at 5.30 in the morning at a gym before anyone else in the squad and makes it sound like he's built a real connection with their supporters. Just a lovely thing to read on a Friday morning!
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Morgan Sanson scored in Nice's win over Lorient tonight.They are now just behind Lille. Can we get any reasonable fee for him at the end of the season? He's been a regular in their side.
Yeah, so let's bring him back.
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Morgan Sanson scored in Nice's win over Lorient tonight.They are now just behind Lille. Can we get any reasonable fee for him at the end of the season? He's been a regular in their side.
Yeah, so let's bring him back.
He's more or less signed already - he moves automatically for £4m if he starts 17 or more games (already done) and they finish higher than eighth (currently fifth, seven points clear with four games left).
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A shame, always thought there was a player there and he would have got starts for us in the last few months but good luck to him.
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Agreed on all counts. Always seemed like a decent bloke, too.
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I remember his debut, I think his first touch was taking a player out with a cruyff-style turn from a clearance, and I thought, "Oooh, we have a player here!". Injuries clearly screwed up his time with us, which is a shame, as I think Emery could have done something with him. Still another one off the books, means room for a new one in!
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Good article on BBC Sport football pages with Exeter manager saying Sinisalo "Will go on to have an incredible career". After starting in goal for all but one of their league games before last one tomorrow.
Nice story about him cancelling a holiday and turning up at 5.30 in the morning at a gym before anyone else in the squad and makes it sound like he's built a real connection with their supporters. Just a lovely thing to read on a Friday morning!
From what I've seen I think he's a fantastic prospect, I hope we give him a chance, good to see his attitude is spot on as well. Completely irrelevant but he has a brummie accent as well, which is awesome.
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Viljami Sinisalo had a very lovely farewell from the Exeter City crowd yesterday. Sounds like he’s loved there. Some of my friends say he’s been superb. The club also posted a a nice message on social media. He sounds like he’s got a very bright future ahead of him.
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I followed some Exeter games at the start of the season to see how he was doing and the fans weren't that happy with his signing initially. Think it was based on a video of "highlights" from his previous loan spell, which by all accounts didn't go well. They had a very good run early on this season, and conceded very few goals for ages. Great to see he obviously won them over.
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He won six awards with them tonight including players player and fans player of the year. Great stuff. 14 cleans as well for them.
https://x.com/officialecfc/status/1784695192093618586?s=46&t=XDFpLxLCLXUUdLEoZEcA2Q
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Would it be beneficial to leave him there another season, I wonder, or should we be looking at moving him up a level? Or maybe even bringing him back to Villa.
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My Exeter-supporting mate has been fulsome in his praise of Viljami all season.
I imagine he'll go to a championship club as the next step.
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Exeter would love him to stay that’s for sure, however I reckon we’ll step up his career with a move to the 2nd division as Dave said above.
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Ironically, with goalkeepers, do we want them going to a slightly worse team, one that will have to do a lot of defending, and therefore give them far more experience during their time there? Or does it not matter? It feels counter-intuitive to send them to a side not expecting to do that well, but would it be better for thier long-term development?
I imagine a goalkeeper at the top of League One does about half the amount of actual goalkeeping done by a keeper at the bottom of League One?
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Ironically, with goalkeepers, do we want them going to a slightly worse team, one that will have to do a lot of defending, and therefore give them far more experience during their time there? Or does it not matter? It feels counter-intuitive to send them to a side not expecting to do that well, but would it be better for thier long-term development?
I imagine a goalkeeper at the top of League One does about half the amount of actual goalkeeping done by a keeper at the bottom of League One?
Martinez was encouraged by the manager (would that have been Emery?) and chose to go on loan to Oxford United for that very reason.
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Ironically, with goalkeepers, do we want them going to a slightly worse team, one that will have to do a lot of defending, and therefore give them far more experience during their time there? Or does it not matter? It feels counter-intuitive to send them to a side not expecting to do that well, but would it be better for thier long-term development?
I imagine a goalkeeper at the top of League One does about half the amount of actual goalkeeping done by a keeper at the bottom of League One?
Martinez was encouraged by the manager (would that have been Emery?) and chose to go on loan to Oxford United for that very reason.
Nah, Wenger still had nearly half a decade at Arsenal after Emi had his time at Oxford.
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Ironically, with goalkeepers, do we want them going to a slightly worse team, one that will have to do a lot of defending, and therefore give them far more experience during their time there? Or does it not matter? It feels counter-intuitive to send them to a side not expecting to do that well, but would it be better for thier long-term development?
I imagine a goalkeeper at the top of League One does about half the amount of actual goalkeeping done by a keeper at the bottom of League One?
Its a fine line. You dont want their nerves to be shot through after a season at the foot of the league.
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The flip side is that if you sent him to a good side then we can see whether he can go through quiet spells and then make important saves when called upon.
The main thing is probably sending him somewhere that plays out from the back to make sure he's comfortable with the ball at his feet, which has become such an important part of modern day football.
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The keeper being able to play with your feet is so critical in the modern game esp at elite level. You’d have to say there are more and more teams who realise the benefits of playing out from the back but how prevalent is it even in the Championship?
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Ironically, with goalkeepers, do we want them going to a slightly worse team, one that will have to do a lot of defending, and therefore give them far more experience during their time there? Or does it not matter? It feels counter-intuitive to send them to a side not expecting to do that well, but would it be better for thier long-term development?
I imagine a goalkeeper at the top of League One does about half the amount of actual goalkeeping done by a keeper at the bottom of League One?
Plenty of action is a positive thing when developing, although sometimes periods of quiet are welcome because you want to know if a player can keep his wits about him when he is suddenly called into action after doing fuck all for 89 mins...
Edit;- Sorry OCD, I didn't see your comment saying similar to my own thoughts before I posted it. But, if its not a 100% accurate representation, I agree with you. 😂 And I agree on the feet thing too. Good point.