Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Footy-Vill on July 16, 2022, 07:20:38 PM
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What would you consider to be our strongest team from the squad
GoalKeepers: Martinez, Olsen.
Defenders: Cash, Chambers, Guilbert, Young, Mings, Carlos, Konsa, Hause, Augustinsson, Digne
Midfielders: Kamara, Coutinho, J Ramsey, Luis, McGinn, Sanson, Buendia, Iroegbunam, Nakamaba
Forwards: Ings, Watkins, Archer, Bailey, Traore, Davis
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4-3-3
Martinez
Digne
Mings
Carlos
Cash
McGinn
Kamara
Ramsey
Coutinho
Bailey
Ings
I rate Ings over Watkins, Bailey could be Buendia and Ramsey or McGinn swap with Luiz- quality wise I think all are similar
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Sorry for being thick, what does (M) mean?
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Sorry for being thick, what does (M) mean?
Mens?
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Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara.
Ramsey. Luiz.
Buendia. Coutinho.
Watkins
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Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamala.
Ramsey. Luiz.
Buendia. Coutinho.
Watkins
Kamara is probably Biden his time.
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Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamala.
Ramsey. Luiz.
Buendia. Coutinho.
Watkins
Kamara is probably Biden his time.
😂
Flippin spell checker
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For me: 4231
Martinez
Cash
Carlos (having never seen him play)
Mings
Digne
Kamara
Luiz
Ramsey
Coutinho
Buendia
Watkins
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Davis is a shoo-in if strength is the criterion. Also Martinez and lots of central defenders.
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4231
Martinez
Cash
Carlos
Mings
Digne
Kamara
Ramsey
Buendia
Coutinho
Bailey
Watkins
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Sorry for being thick, what does (M) mean?
Massive, you know cos we’re massive
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For me: 4231
Martinez
Cash
Carlos (having never seen him play)
Mings
Digne
Kamara
Luiz
Ramsey
Coutinho
Buendia
Watkins
This for me, except the new CM is a replacement for Douglas Luiz. Potentially, keep him and play him further forward.
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4-1-2-3
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
Lots of alternatives though and could see the diamond with Coutinho at 10 and two up front with Ings /Watkins combo
But Bailey possesses exceptional attacking ability
as well as incredible speed and excitement so he's in my 11.
Ahead of Buendia and Ings.
When it comes to the various match ups against the opposition as well as substitutions during games, it's a likelihood that different line-ups will be utilised.
It will be interesting to watch whether Gerrard would start players like Ings, Buendia, Bailey, and Traore in a strongest 11.
Its also interesting for all the many viewpoints and the preferences of what we each feel is our strongest starting line up.
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Davis is a shoo-in if strength is the criterion. Also Martinez and lots of central defenders.
Davis? No thanks.
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Martinez 100%
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If it’s weight over bodyweight I reckon Dougie.
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Sorry for being thick, what does (M) mean?
1,000.
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Metres
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If our strongest X1 includes Watkins, we have a problem.
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Metres
You should know better as a teacher. Metres is a little "m".
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4-1-2-3
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
This for me too currently but to give us a better chance, I’d like a top striker in, with Watkins or Bailey dropped depending on whether we go 4-3-3 or 4-3-1-2, and a top DM in with 2 from McGinn, Kamara and Ramsey depending on tactics / injury / loss of form etc
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Lower case.
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Sorry. Don't think it can be done. We only have three - Martinez, Mings and McGinn. Mind you, if you could pick an all-time Villa 11 of players beginning with M, what a side we might have.
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I'm sick so have an excuse to try this. Full backs were tricky
Martinez
Milner
McGrath
McNaught
Mings
McGinn
Mortimer
McMahon
Merson
L Moore
Morley
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I'm sick so have an excuse to try this. Full backs were tricky
Martinez
Milner
McGrath
McNaught
Mings
McGinn
Mortimer
McMahon
Merson
L Moore
Morley
Luke Moore rather than Peter McParland? Or Alan McInally?
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Martinez
Cash Mings Carlos Digne
Luiz Kamara Nakamba
Buendia Coutinho
Traore
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If our strongest X1 includes Watkins, we have a problem.
It doesn't and we don't.
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Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Ramsey Kamara McGinn
Buendia Coutinho
Archer
Second best 11
Olsen
Guilbert Konsa Mings Augustinsson
Sanson Nakamba Irogbunam
Bailey Ings Watkins
Both of those teams look OK, and there is still Hause, Davis, Kessler Hayden, Philogene Bidace, Chukwuemeka, Chrisene, Feeney etc available as well. Think we are in for a good season.
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Martinez
Cash Mings Carlos Digne
Luiz Kamara Nakamba
Buendia Coutinho
Traore
El Tel's Christmas Tree formation!
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Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Ramsey Kamara McGinn
Buendia Coutinho
Archer
Second best 11
Olsen
Guilbert Konsa Mings Augustinsson
Sanson Nakamba Irogbunam
Bailey Ings Watkins
Both of those teams look OK, and there is still Hause, Davis, Kessler Hayden, Philogene Bidace, Chukwuemeka, Chrisene, Feeney etc available as well. Think we are in for a good season.
I don't think Carny will kick a ball for us again.
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Possibly harsh on Ramsey, but I'd be interested to see us play with a double pivot
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara Luiz
Buendia Coutinho Bailey
Ings
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What I like about the squad this season, is that we can put out decent teams for multiple different formations. The last few seasons there has not been a single formation we can play that didn't leave a glaring weak spot where we had no suitable player to fill a key role. Loads of good players but no good combinations.
Now we have enough players to mix up formations it will be interesting to see how flexible Gerrard is, but already in pre-season we have seen a few different formations tried out, with adjustments made mid game.
We have a robust enough set of midfielders to play two in midfield and wingers, a good enough set of defenders and fullbacks to go three at the back, enough attacking players to play two tens, or two strikers, or an attacking three. None of those set ups worked properly last season. Exciting times.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Buendia Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Buendia Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I like the ambition, but my immediate thought is that is putting a hell of a lot on Kamara.
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I'm sick so have an excuse to try this. Full backs were tricky
You left out Buendia.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Buendia Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I like the ambition, but my immediate thought is that is putting a hell of a lot on Kamara.
Yes sadly I think it's going to be very tricky to squeeze Buendia, Bailey & Coutinho into the starting line up. We can try the double pivot I mentioned, but losing Ramsey is probably too big a price to pay. I suspect the reality is Buendia / Bailey will see a lot of time on the bench.
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Martinez (rush goalie)
Garcia
Kamara
McGinn
Bailey
Buendia
Ramsey
Coutinho
Traore
Mbappe
Archer
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I think well go with:
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I would be tempted to have Ings over watkins
I think McGinn and Watkins/Ings are the weakest links
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara Luiz
Beudia
Bailey Ings Coutinho
But I cant see us dropping both Ramsey and McGinn
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Konza Digne
Kamara
McGinn Luiz
Buendia Coutinho
Ings
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Buendia Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I like the ambition, but my immediate thought is that is putting a hell of a lot on Kamara.
Ramsey and Buendia aren't averse to getting stuck in though.
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I think well go with:
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I hope not. I know VAR is shit, but I'd hope they'd at least let us start with 11.
<assume you meant to add McGinn and yes that does look quite a likely set up. I'll be gutted if Buendia isn't starting regularly though>
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Not convinced re new signings, so ....
Martinez
Cash Konsa Mings Digne
Kamara/AN Other
McGinn Chukumeka Ramsey
Buendia
Watkins
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
I think Buendia can improve over last season, so he'd start - if there's only 1 place up for grabs behind the forwards.
And I'm far from being the only one of that opinion ... you pays your money etc etc
Enjoy your tea
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
It also has to be the quickest and most unjust write off of new signings in the history of write off of new signings.
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Back 5 picks itself, the front 6 has dozens of possible combinations/formations.
If you start with the possibility of the 5 subs brought on being
Bailey, Archer, Ings, Traore and Sanson I'd say we have a pretty good squad.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
It also has to be the quickest and most unjust write off of new signings in the history of write off of new signings.
Not really. It just reflects my opinion that our existing players are better than many give them credit for and the new players are unproven.
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
It also has to be the quickest and most unjust write off of new signings in the history of write off of new signings.
Not really. It just reflects my opinion that our existing players are better than many give them credit for and the new players are unproven.
Coutinho unproven?
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
It also has to be the quickest and most unjust write off of new signings in the history of write off of new signings.
Not really. It just reflects my opinion that our existing players are better than many give them credit for and the new players are unproven.
Coutinho unproven?
yeh we should send Phil on loan to Swindon to get some experience.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara ?
Buendia Bailey
<Coutinho>
Watkins
Konsa as back up to the 2 cbs.
We need another player to fill the "?" role (like a Soucek)
Nakamba as back-up to either Kamara or "?"
With 2 full backs who like to get forward we need 2 proper dcms to fill in for them.
Coutinho to float right and left behind Watkins and occasionally to interchange with Buendia and Bailey.
Bailey is in for his pace, but he really needs to step up otherwise Ramsey to take his place.
Ings/Archer to back-up Watkins (who needs to return to the form of his 1st season in the pl).
McGinn/Luiz (if he stays) to sub-in for Buendia/Coutinho.
Jobs a good one, welcome home FA cup!
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
I do worry that Watkins doesn’t really suit emi and Phil . I would be tempted to have Bailey in for Emi - or another CF in
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
I do worry that Watkins doesn’t really suit emi and Phil . I would be tempted to have Bailey in for Emi - or another CF in
This is fair, but I think this could work to our advantage. I like Jim's setup, but the front three (maybe four) positions could involve any of Watkins, Ings, Archer, Davis, Bailey, Coutinho, Traore - maybe McGinn and Ramsey depending on the formation - plus hopefully a new signing or two and the kids that stick around. There has to be a few decent combinations in that lot. If Watkins with Emi and Phil isn't working, we can change it. There will be some CBs that don't give Ings an inch, but Watkins or Archer might be able to run ragged. We've seen Emi get kicked off the park before, so give Bailey a run at them. Even Coutinho has had periods where he's been pretty ineffective - we have options to change things if it's not working for him.
The onus is on the manager to set us up - hopefully changing it around depending on the game situation or the opposition. I don't want to go into this season with a 'strongest 11'. I want us to play the team that is going to win that week, and those two teams won't always be the same.
We're at a level where we aren't good enough to dominate any opposition that we play, like Liverpool or Man City. But we have a much deeper squad than a lot of our mid-table rivals. That's where we have an advantage, and that's what we need to use to get ahead of them.
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You’re probably the only Villa fan in the world that wouldn’t play Coutinho. I won’t comment on the other issues as my teas ready, but there are a few.
Chuck for Phil ;D
It also has to be the quickest and most unjust write off of new signings in the history of write off of new signings.
Not really. It just reflects my opinion that our existing players are better than many give them credit for and the new players are unproven.
Coutinho unproven?
yeh we should send Phil on loan to Swindon to get some experience.
I'd answered the Coutinho point earlier in the thread. But as you're bringing it up again, yes - I think Countinho's ability to perform for 90 minutes in the premier league for 30+ games a season is unproven. The last time he played more than 30 league games for anybody was 2018-19.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
I do worry that Watkins doesn’t really suit emi and Phil . I would be tempted to have Bailey in for Emi - or another CF in
That's my worry with Buendia and Coutinho as the support attacking players in a front three. They are both very similar and not especially quick, relying on nimble feet and pin point passing rather than out-and-out pace. That would be OK if Watkins didn't have the first touch of a baby elephant playing with a beach ball.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
I do worry that Watkins doesn’t really suit emi and Phil . I would be tempted to have Bailey in for Emi - or another CF in
That's my worry with Buendia and Coutinho as the support attacking players in a front three. They are both very similar and not especially quick, relying on nimble feet and pin point passing rather than out-and-out pace. That would be OK if Watkins didn't have the first touch of a baby elephant playing with a beach ball.
Yeah, and Ings has better technique and no pace
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Not convinced re new signings, so ....
Martinez
Cash Konsa Mings Digne
Kamara/AN Other
McGinn Chukumeka Ramsey
Buendia
Watkins
Not convinced by the new signings who haven't started a competitive game for us yet? Fair enough.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
I love the look of this.
I do worry that Watkins doesn’t really suit emi and Phil . I would be tempted to have Bailey in for Emi - or another CF in
That's my worry with Buendia and Coutinho as the support attacking players in a front three. They are both very similar and not especially quick, relying on nimble feet and pin point passing rather than out-and-out pace. That would be OK if Watkins didn't have the first touch of a baby elephant playing with a beach ball.
Ha! That last sentence has tickled me.
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Martinez
Konsa Carlos Mings
Cash Digne
Kamara
Buendia/Bailey Coutinho
Ings
Or/And after subs
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Bailey Coutinho
Watkins
There's loads of choice now to do lots of different things. What excites me is the amount of clever players and movement we have at our disposal.
Olsen, Sanson, Luiz, Nakamba, Iroegbunam, Hause, Chambers, Young, Augustinsson, Archer, Davis, AEG and the other Academy players like O'Reilly, Chrisene, Feeney, Azaz show we have strength in depth. There will be a couple loaned out and sold from that list but it won't weaken it (barring maybe Luiz).
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Martinez
Konsa Carlos Mings
Cash Digne
Kamara
Buendia/Bailey Coutinho
Ings
Or/And after subs
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey
Bailey Coutinho
Watkins
There's loads of choice now to do lots of different things. What excites me is the amount of clever players and movement we have at our disposal.
Olsen, Sanson, Luiz, Nakamba, Iroegbunam, Hause, Chambers, Young, Augustinsson, Archer, Davis, AEG and the other Academy players like O'Reilly, Chrisene, Feeney, Azaz show we have strength in depth. There will be a couple loaned out and sold from that list but it won't weaken it (barring maybe Luiz).
First team takes some bollocks to pull off - starting with 8 players is a real sign of intent
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FFS. In editing mode I've deleted a row!!
McGinn and New signing/Luiz were in there.
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We have quite the flexibility upfront. We can swap in quite a few depending on form and fitness as the year goes on. For now, I'd probably like to see something like:
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara McGinn/Luiz
Buendia/Bailey Coutinho Ramsey
Ings/Watkins
I think a Buendia/Coutinho/Ings trio would work well together, and then we could swap in Baily/Watkins as subs later in the match to burn teams with pace when the opposition's legs start to get heavy. McGinn/Luiz is probably the weakest link in the team, but you could go with either depending on form.
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Sorry for being thick, what does (M) mean?
Metric...this is an anti-imperial forum.
How to solve the Buendia/Coutinho, Ings/Watkins, Luiz/McGinn riddles will continue to puzzle our smartest I suspect. This mid season World Cup debacle will surely ensure a record number of managers get potted mid season. Gerrard's primary objective has to be that he avoids being one of them.
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
I can see why, although I'd probably put Buendia in the middle, behind Archer. It would have a lot of pace and speedy ball-moving.
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
I can see why, although I'd probably put Buendia in the middle, behind Archer. It would have a lot of pace and speedy ball-moving.
I like this team Risso but I’d swap as above. I really think Chambers could seal the spot with Carlos this season. I love Mings, but Chambers calm influence and distribution is so much better.
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Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Sanson Kamara Luiz
Bailey Watkins Buendia
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
Yep. It’s time to move on.
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It's just nice to have options everywhere isn't it?
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
Yep. It’s time to move on.
This is mine too. The front three would all be capable of rotating positions too
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I'd struggle to include Coutinho given his lack of involvement in most games that I've seen him involved in.
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
Chambers for Mings with Carlos moving across is definitely a real prospect. Chambers has looked very good when he’s had the chances and Carlos is going to start as well, given the level he’s been playing at and the transfer fee.
I think that midfield is weak though personally and I wouldn’t play Luiz. We need another signing still.
Buendia has looked good but I think he’ll start the season as understudy to Coutinho, who seems to be getting one or two grumbles already in here. Coutinho is the most talented player in the squad and can have the same level of impact Grealish had, maybe even a bit more if we get him at his absolute best. He has to start the season but I agree that if other players outshine him continually in the position he can’t expect to keep playing.
No to Archer being first choice either. Very, very promising and I think I’d sooner keep him around now than send him on loan but it’s a big ask for the lad to be anything but an impact sub initially.
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I’m going to sit on the fence slightly with a couple a players, it’ll depend how they start the season but;
Martinez
Cash
Digne
Carlos
Mings
New player
2 from McGinn, Kamara, Ramsey
Coutinho
Bailey
Watkins
Or
Chambers
Carlos
As CB pair
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I'd seriously consider this as a starting 11 now:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Coutinho Buendia
Archer
Chambers for Mings with Carlos moving across is definitely a real prospect. Chambers has looked very good when he’s had the chances and Carlos is going to start as well, given the level he’s been playing at and the transfer fee.
I think that midfield is weak though personally and I wouldn’t play Luiz. We need another signing still.
Buendia has looked good but I think he’ll start the season as understudy to Coutinho, who seems to be getting one or two grumbles already in here. Coutinho is the most talented player in the squad and can have the same level of impact Grealish had, maybe even a bit more if we get him at his absolute best. He has to start the season but I agree that if other players outshine him continually in the position he can’t expect to keep playing.
No to Archer being first choice either. Very, very promising and I think I’d sooner keep him around now than send him on loan but it’s a big ask for the lad to be anything but an impact sub initially.
I think you could play either McGinn or Luiz next to Kamara. You get more of a physical presence and tackling from McGinn, you get better passing and ball retention from Luiz. Or perhaps Sanson is going to surprise us all?
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I think that is probably our best line up - though think we need a new holding midfielder if we are to play that.
Its a shame that Gerrards statement signing plays in the same position as our recording signing - as it still feels like we have an unbalanced team - and to get them both in we may have to push out JJ, who is a real talent if used right.
Not complaining out Coutinho, hes a great player and it would be stupid not too - but we need a Forward and midfielder more.
I wonder if we were expecting to move more players on - as I was expecting more business based on what was said around the end of the summer.
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Based on what I have seen / heard / read during this pre season I would start on 6th the following:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Luiz Kamara
Bailey Buendia Coutiniho
Watkins
Then our real strength is a bench with many options
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Based on the Oz trip and gut feelings I suspect the following are soon to be surplus to requirements:
Hause
Guilbert
Nakamba
Chuck
El Ghazi
Philogene-Bidace
Traore
We could get rid of these and bring in one more midfielder and 1 more striker, then we are done.
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Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara.
Ramsey. Luiz.
Buendia. Coutinho.
Watkins
I’m still edging towards my original line up above.
But, if I was to tweak it slightly, given what I’ve heard and read so far, I probably move Carlos across (as he played on the left for Saville) and bring in Chambers, who has always impressed when played.
I can’t see us lining up without Ramsey, so Bailey to start on the bench
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Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Ramsey Kamara McGinn
Buendia Coutinho
Archer
Second best 11
Olsen
Guilbert Konsa Mings Augustinsson
Sanson Nakamba Irogbunam
Bailey Ings Watkins
Both of those teams look OK, and there is still Hause, Davis, Kessler Hayden, Philogene Bidace, Chukwuemeka, Chrisene, Feeney etc available as well. Think we are in for a good season.
Both of those teams look OK, and there is still Hause, Davis, Kessler Hayden, Philogene Bidace, Chukwuemeka, Chrisene, Feeney etc available as well. Think we are in for a good season.
After the pre-season games thus far I am revising this to
Martinez
KKH Chambers Carlos Digne
Sanson Kamara Ramsey
Buendia Bailey
Archer
Second best 11
Olsen
Cash Konsa Mings Augustinsson
Luiz Iroegbunam McGinn
Coutinho Ings Watkins
I'd now have KKH in ahead of Cash, and Bailey in ahead of either Coutinho or Buendia (tough call which). I wouldn't have had Luiz in the second 11, but have been pleasantly surprised with his effort considering the uncertainty over him staying. I'd have Sanson in the first 11 ahead of McGinn on the pre-season efforts thus far too.
We look much better, with good competition across the whole pitch.
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I don't get the Sanson love-in that so many on here seem to have. Can't remember him ever doing anything vaguely noteworthy in between his injuries. Hopefully he proves me wrong.
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I don't get the Sanson love-in that so many on here seem to have. Can't remember him ever doing anything vaguely noteworthy in between his injuries. Hopefully he proves me wrong.
I think Sanson is a bit like Bailey, in regards he never really got going last season.
Showed flashes of what he was capable of then got injured again.
Another who will benefit from a full pre season and a run of games
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I don't get the Sanson love-in that so many on here seem to have. Can't remember him ever doing anything vaguely noteworthy in between his injuries. Hopefully he proves me wrong.
I think Sanson is a bit like Bailey, in regards he never really got going last season.
Showed flashes of what he was capable of then got injured again.
Another who will benefit from a full pre season and a run of games
Absolutely agree. Given an injury free run, I think we could have some player on our hands - Best player on the pitch against Chelsea. Seems to have bulked up a bit over the summer too.
Here's my Bournemouth starting eleven. And if Coutinho doesn't perform 1st half, hook him for McGinn/Ramsey and push Buendia further forward:
Martinez
Cash Chambers Diego Carlos Digne
Kamara
Sanson Buendia
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
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It'll be very interesting to see the starting lineup aginst Rennes, as that will almost certainly be the team that starts against Bournemouth you'd think.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
Buendia Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
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It seems quite a few of us now have Mings out. I think i'd stick my neck out too and go with Chambers/Carlos with Mings to come back in if either of those aren't performing. It's a good position to be in that's for sure. I'd still have the likes of KKH, Archer, Buendia and Sanson on the bench initally though but again, based on what they've shown pre season we'll look strong on the bench. Just need that slight brute of a signing in midfield. If we're not getting the performances from the strikers we could try to address in January with a signing there.
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If we were going to base it purely on the pre-season games so far, I think our team would be:
Matinez
KKH
Chambers
Carlos
Digne
Kamara
Iroegbunam/Luiz
McGinn/Sanson/Ramsey (I don't think any of these have done much of note from what I've seen)
Bailey
Buendia
Archer
I don't think he will leave out all of Cash, Mings, McGinn, Ramsey, Coutinho, Watkins and Ings, but I'm not sure any of them have shown much so far, with the obvious caveat that this is just pre-season and so does it really matter. What would be more concerning, though, is that a lot of the issues with these players have carried on from last season (other than Cash who was very good last year) - Mings makes mistakes, the midfield don't get a grip of the game and the forwards aren't dangerous enough.
We need to have flexibility in our first team. I hope we can see Emi, Leon and Phil in the team together, but I also want to see what McGinn and Ramsey can do in front of Kamara. I am hoping that the changes that we are making during pre-season is a sign that we are working to have a few different set-ups at our disposal, rather than that we don't know what our best team is. We've surely learned a few things -
Two up front doesn't work
Bailey offers us something things no one else in the team can - pace and decent set piece delivery
Archer is our most natural goal scorer
KKH isn't far off being ready for the first team
I genuinely have no idea how we will line up for our first game, which is quite exciting. You could make a reasonable argument for quite a few different formations and combinations of players, which will hopefully make it more difficult for the opposition. Two years ago it was a case of "stop our best player and you'll get something out of the game" - now I don't even know who our best player is.
A good manager would do wonders with this squad, particularly with a couple of extra additions. We're about to find out if we have a good manager or not.
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Mings makes mistakes, the midfield don't get a grip of the game and the forwards aren't dangerous enough.
A good manager would do wonders with this squad, particularly with a couple of extra additions. We're about to find out if we have a good manager or not.
Yep i think the 3 things you mention were the main issue, the midfield being the biggest problem and Mings being the least, but we've definitely addressed that one, Chambers and Carlos likely to be good enough to be a new pairing. We've gone some way towards addressing the midfield situation with Kamara but need to do more. Forwards wise, my hope is that we get more consistency from Coutinho, that Bailey will finally get his act together and be a big player for us and that an improved Beundia will be there in the background as well. This should mean more opportunities for the strikers, we now have Archer involved and hopefully at least one of the three will prove to be a real goal threat in every match.
Good point about Gerrard too, a big season for him. Even with what we have there should be some improvement on 14th, with one or two more you'd hope we'd be well inside the top half.
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Mings makes mistakes, the midfield don't get a grip of the game and the forwards aren't dangerous enough.
A good manager would do wonders with this squad, particularly with a couple of extra additions. We're about to find out if we have a good manager or not.
Yep i think the 3 things you mention were the main issue, the midfield being the biggest problem and Mings being the least, but we've definitely addressed that one, Chambers and Carlos likely to be good enough to be a new pairing. We've gone some way towards addressing the midfield situation with Kamara but need to do more. Forwards wise, my hope is that we get more consistency from Coutinho, that Bailey will finally get his act together and be a big player for us and that an improved Beundia will be there in the background as well. This should mean more opportunities for the strikers, we now have Archer involved and hopefully at least one of the three will prove to be a real goal threat in every match.
Good point about Gerrard too, a big season for him. Even with what we have there should be some improvement on 14th, with one or two more you'd hope we'd be well inside the top half.
Yeah, I really hope Mings can iron out the few issues he has. There isn't much wrong with his game, but the things that are wrong can be incredibly damaging. If he could cut out the mistakes, and if he has easier outlets when he's playing it out from the back then he could become one of the best defenders in the league - if he carries on as he is, though, he can be a liability. Very fine margins.
I think he has been a victim of having to take too much responsibility in the past. He can over commit because he thinks "If I don't win it, who will?". Plus playing it out from the back has been difficult with our lack of DM. Playing with Carlos and Kamara may be the making of him, but he hasn't shown enough sign of that so far in pre-season. Important to remember that he has only been playing Centre Back for a few years - there is hope that he can improve.
As it is, though, Carlos and Chambers are probably our best pairing. It's nice having options - hopefully Tyrone and Ezri can keep them on their toes and take their chances when they get them. It's great having a proper squad!
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I’ll always be a fan of Mings and never forget how brilliant he was helping us get promoted. It’s just that I can’t help thinking there are 2 better CB’s at the club now but we’ll see. Maybe it’ll help him improve too, which was the other point of bringing another good CB in.
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I've been surprised how little gametime Sanson got this pre-season. I've assumed he's almost certainly on his way, but every time I've seen him play he's been pretty good. I still think we'll move him on but I'd like to have seen more from him.
As for starting line up I would like to see the same line up as Hooky (although I'd prefer Ings but can't see it happening):
Martinez
Cash Chambers Carlos Digne
Luiz Kamara
Bailey Coutiniho Buendia
Watkins
But I just can't see him dropping McGinn or Ramsey, so would be surprised if we don't start with this:
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
McGinn Kamara Ramsey
Bailey (Buendia) Coutiniho
Watkins
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The Christmas Tree formation is just so narrow - pin the full backs in their own half and we have no attacking threat.
4231 for me as per the above.
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The Christmas Tree formation is just so narrow - pin the full backs in their own half and we have no attacking threat.
4231 for me as per the above.
You say that but I'd expect Bailey in particular to move out wider as opposed to playing as a 10.
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Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
Buendia Ramsey
Bailey Watkins Coutinho
I'd definitely go with this choice.
Bailey and Buendia deserve starts from what I have seen so far.
Ramsey deserves to keep his place but must add more consistency which im sure he will to keep his place and I think Mings deserves to keep his place for now.
Ings doesn't really impress me and if he doesn't score he can go missing and Watkins will be under pressure from Archer hopefully.
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The Christmas Tree formation is just so narrow - pin the full backs in their own half and we have no attacking threat.
4231 for me as per the above.
You say that but I'd expect Bailey in particular to move out wider as opposed to playing as a 10.
That's the thing. With Bailey and Watkins, we have plenty of pace to stretch defences. Buendia and Coutinho should be able to exploit that space with Ramsey doing a lot of running forward too.
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Looks like McGinn needs adding to a lot of teams!!!
So....
Martinez
Cash Carlos Mings Digne
Kamara
McGinn Ramsey/Luiz/Sanson/Buendia
Bailey Coutinho
Watkins
Given we feel Kamara gets a game, and McGinn too it leaves a lot of competition for the remaining one of three.
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The stats you posted earlier Drummond show that he's good at tackling, so stick him in a two next to Kamara, with orders not to try a pass any longer than two feet.
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SJM plays much better in an advanced role for Scotland, but I can’t see how he can play that role for us when we have the likes of Bailey/Buendia/Phil.
I think it will be back to the 4-3-3 we saw last season, with the starting midfield of Kamara,SJM and JJ.
My only worry with this is that it is Kamara’s first season, so may be throwing him at the deep end somewhat if he has to hold on his own.
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Unless anyone gets crocked against Rennes, I expect Bournemouth to be:
Martinez
Cash
Carlos
Mings
Digne
Kamara
McGinn
Ramsey
Bailey
Coutinho
Watkins
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I think one of the key things will be the five subs, it's going to allow a lot more tactical change in a game (that idea of starters and finishers). So the concept of a rigid best eleven starts to become mute. I recall Gerard talking about players been adept at tactical change during the game, which we've struggled with over the recent seasons (moving Luis mid game for example). All in all, serious competition is no bad thing, just something we're really not used to.
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Unless anyone gets crocked against Rennes, I expect Bournemouth to be:
Martinez
Cash
Carlos
Mings
Digne
Kamara
McGinn
Ramsey
Bailey
Coutinho
Watkins
You are probably right but I think it's bonkers that we arent building our attacking play around Buendia.
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The stats you posted earlier Drummond show that he's good at tackling, so stick him in a two next to Kamara, with orders not to try a pass any longer than two feet.
That makes sense.
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I 'd be pissed off if Mings doesn't start, definitely one of the best two centre half's we possess. Plus he can move the ball out.
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McGinn captain seems to take away a lot of the flexibilty I was hoping to see. I guess that means no double pivot, Luiz and Sanson fighting over scraps and no chance of seeing Bailey & Buendia in the same team.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
Yes, I'd like to see something like this, but I feel you need two more defensively minded players in the double pivot, so think Luiz would be a better bet than McGinn. I guess it's unliely as it would also restrict Ramsey's gametime.
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
Yes, I'd like to see something like this, but I feel you need two more defensively minded players in the double pivot, so think Luiz would be a better bet than McGinn. I guess it's unliely as it would also restrict Ramsey's gametime.
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
Ive been dying to see Beundia and Coutinhio in the same side. I know it hasn’t worked on one or two occasions, Arsenal at home back in March springs to mind, but there we’re other factors such as the whole team under performing and no proper CDM.
With the McGinn captain situation, i think its more unlikely now, although it could be with Traore looking like he might be bombed out, EmiB might be competing with Bailey for a starting spot.
I think the team for Bournemouth will be
Martinez
Cash. Chambers. Carlos. Digne
Kamara
Ramsey. Mcginn
Bailey. Watkins. Coutinhio
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I think that to get Buendia, Coutinho, Bailey and Watkins or Ings in the same team you have to have 2 solid defensive players in centre mid. Nakamba is one option but for the most part he's not that good, McGinn another but we know he's better further forward and Kamara the third who is untested as yet. Luiz and Sanson i wouldn't even entertain for that role, too lightweight. The best hope is that Kamara becomes the defensive mid we've been needing and that Nakamba finds the form he showed under Gerrard until he got injured. Then your leaving out the club captain. I just don't see it, unless we buy someone who's excellent at it to go in with Kamara and not play McGinn.
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I think that to get Buendia, Coutinho, Bailey and Watkins or Ings in the same team you have to have 2 solid defensive players in centre mid. Nakamba is one option but for the most part he's not that good, McGinn another but we know he's better further forward and Kamara the third who is untested as yet. Luiz and Sanson i wouldn't even entertain for that role, too lightweight. The best hope is that Kamara becomes the defensive mid we've been needing and that Nakamba finds the form he showed under Gerrard until he got injured. Then your leaving out the club captain. I just don't see it, unless we buy someone who's excellent at it to go in with Kamara and not play McGinn.
I think Luiz would be great in a double pivot role. But it means leaving McGinn and Ramsey out, which just isn't happening.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
I think the team for Bournemouth will be
Martinez
Cash. Chambers. Carlos. Digne
Kamara
Ramsey. Mcginn
Bailey. Watkins. Coutinhio
I think so too, other than he might keep Mings in for Chambers. Based on current squad.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
I think the team for Bournemouth will be
Martinez
Cash. Chambers. Carlos. Digne
Kamara
Ramsey. Mcginn
Bailey. Watkins. Coutinhio
I think so too, other than he might keep Mings in for Chambers. Based on current squad.
Think this is the line up well see for the first few games. Think he use the 5 subs to give Emi2 and Luiz plenty of game time too
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I think that to get Buendia, Coutinho, Bailey and Watkins or Ings in the same team you have to have 2 solid defensive players in centre mid. Nakamba is one option but for the most part he's not that good, McGinn another but we know he's better further forward and Kamara the third who is untested as yet. Luiz and Sanson i wouldn't even entertain for that role, too lightweight. The best hope is that Kamara becomes the defensive mid we've been needing and that Nakamba finds the form he showed under Gerrard until he got injured. Then your leaving out the club captain. I just don't see it, unless we buy someone who's excellent at it to go in with Kamara and not play McGinn.
I think Luiz would be great in a double pivot role. But it means leaving McGinn and Ramsey out, which just isn't happening.
Luiz is one of those who is decent with the ball, so useful when we have plenty of possession but weak when we haven't got the ball and like a passenger. Against the teams with good ball retention he's a bit pointless, even more so if they're quick and aggressive. He's like most of our centre mids, decent footballer who needs to play further forward to have any chance of being effective, with a strong and quick player (or even two at times) sitting behind them.
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Yet probably his best game was against Man City last season.
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In terms of the home game i recall him being utterly dreadful first half when they were all over us, but we came out second half chasing the game and had a good go and he was excellent. In fact i remember it because i thought at the time that if he played like it for 80%+ of the time he'd be the first midfielder on the team sheet.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
I think the team for Bournemouth will be
Martinez
Cash. Chambers. Carlos. Digne
Kamara
Ramsey. Mcginn
Bailey. Watkins. Coutinhio
I think so too, other than he might keep Mings in for Chambers. Based on current squad.
Agree.
I can't see him dropping Mings for Chambers, especially having just taken the captaincy away from him.
The 'kick a man when he's down' phrase comes to mind.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
I think I'm just trying to squeeze Buendia in to a starting line up as he's my favourite player and this seems the only likely way with Coutihno now inked in
I think the team for Bournemouth will be
Martinez
Cash. Chambers. Carlos. Digne
Kamara
Ramsey. Mcginn
Bailey. Watkins. Coutinhio
I think so too, other than he might keep Mings in for Chambers. Based on current squad.
Agree.
I can't see him dropping Mings for Chambers, especially having just taken the captaincy away from him.
The 'kick a man when he's down' phrase comes to mind.
I think the two things might be interrelated, in terms of Gerrard possibly planning to take Mings out for first few games, so retaining him as captain would make little sense. Would be harsh though.
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I think that to get Buendia, Coutinho, Bailey and Watkins or Ings in the same team you have to have 2 solid defensive players in centre mid. Nakamba is one option but for the most part he's not that good, McGinn another but we know he's better further forward and Kamara the third who is untested as yet. Luiz and Sanson i wouldn't even entertain for that role, too lightweight. The best hope is that Kamara becomes the defensive mid we've been needing and that Nakamba finds the form he showed under Gerrard until he got injured. Then your leaving out the club captain. I just don't see it, unless we buy someone who's excellent at it to go in with Kamara and not play McGinn.
I think Luiz would be great in a double pivot role. But it means leaving McGinn and Ramsey out, which just isn't happening.
Luiz is one of those who is decent with the ball, so useful when we have plenty of possession but weak when we haven't got the ball and like a passenger. Against the teams with good ball retention he's a bit pointless, even more so if they're quick and aggressive. He's like most of our centre mids, decent footballer who needs to play further forward to have any chance of being effective, with a strong and quick player (or even two at times) sitting behind them.
This was when all the defensive duties were on his shoulders. His defence isn't that bad, he's just not cut out as a lone 6. I think in a two with Kamara he would be very good. And playing in a two gives more opportunity to step forward, just like Rice and Soucek do.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
McGinn has proven routinely that he isn't suited to that deep role. That's not to say Gerrard wont try it again, mind but McGinn isn't suddenly going to be able to get him bum roll working against better players nor execute successful passes from deep. Coutinho was really poor when he played anywhere but no.10 last season, it's Buendia's best position too but would make a better fist of it coming in off the left I think.
We are looking at a shoe horn job no matter what way you look at it. 433 means no no.10, 4231 means McGinn most likely next to Kamara. Diamond four in midfield will see our full backs getting rinsed down the flanks and centre backs getting dragged over to cover.
If Luiz ends up staying, I think he'll end being a regular again at 8. He's a better footballer than given credit for on here.
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Something like this 4-2-1-3?
Martinez
Cash. Carlos. Mings. Digne
Kamara. McGinn
Buendia/Coutinho
Bailey/Buendia Watkins/Ings Coutinho/Ramsey
McGinn has proven routinely that he isn't suited to that deep role. That's not to say Gerrard wont try it again, mind but McGinn isn't suddenly going to be able to get him bum roll working against better players nor execute successful passes from deep. Coutinho was really poor when he played anywhere but no.10 last season, it's Buendia's best position too but would make a better fist of it coming in off the left I think.
We are looking at a shoe horn job no matter what way you look at it. 433 means no no.10, 4231 means McGinn most likely next to Kamara. Diamond four in midfield will see our full backs getting rinsed down the flanks and centre backs getting dragged over to cover.
If Luiz ends up staying, I think he'll end being a regular again at 8. He's a better footballer than given credit for on here.
Indeed, I’m still pinching myself that we are able to field 3 top Brazilians in our team now!
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With DC now out our strongest 11 will have to be revised.
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Emi
Cash
Chambers
Mings
Digne
Kamara
McGinn
Luiz
Ramsey
Buendia
Watkins
Subs - Konsa, Augustinsson, Young, Tim, Phil, Ings, Bailey, Archer, Olsen
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Think SG will want another centre-back and will plump for Feeney.
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EMI
Cash chambers Mings Digne
Kamara Luiz
Bailey Buendia Coutinho
Watkins
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People say SG is not sure of his strongest starting 11.
But Gerrard himself said it's a 16 man game . A squad game
And he also said it's horses for courses picking players and team for each match so can certainly see rotation going on.
I do wonder if we had won at Bournemouth and then varied on winning this season if the same eleven predominantly or exclusively would be starting though.
Introduction of Sarr makes it furthermore interesting on what exactly is our strongest 11.