Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Toronto Villa on December 11, 2021, 04:58:18 PM
-
A valiant display vs a superb team. We were second best most of the time by a lot. But the second half was a lot better. Stone wall second half pen denied. And Tyrone Mings was outstanding. Got done for the penalty but overall he was a mountain. We’ve now lost against the best two teams by a combined 2 goals. That’s so much better than what was happening at the end of Dean’s time.
Lots of room to build and grow. And Sanson and Buendia will play much bigger roles. Especially our Morgan.
-
Pissed off especially as I had to endure the wanky WM coverage. Fuck the sky 6, fuck Liverpool and fuck Salah the diving cheating prick.
-
Worked hard against a team of soft diving bastards.
-
I’m sure it’s just a coincidence that the three teams at the top of the league get decisive penalties to get three points today
-
We competed. Liverpool are a fantastic team but we gave them a run for their money. They get a dodgy penalty but we get nothing, so we can feel a little unjustly treated by VAR. However, Liverpool had a lot of the ball in the first half. Emi and Mings were excellent. Hopefully, easier games to come and we are no longer the pushovers we were previously. Yes we lost, but there are positives to take out of this defeat.
-
Man City bore you to death with there constant passing and ball retention, these kill you with there pressing and intensity. We did well to stay in it for as long as we did. I knew after the first half that they would get a penalty, daft from Mings to fall for it.
-
Exactly VAR was meant to smooth this out but it’s just perpetuating it!
-
I’m sure it’s just a coincidence that the three teams at the top of the league get decisive penalties to get three points today
Of course! :D
-
Totally outclassed for 75 minutes. We ought to have been feeling the relief of stealing a point because their keeper brought Ings down. No question, that was a penalty.
-
Didn’t expect a result, didn’t get a result. I’m not “upset” so to speak.
I thought Mings and Emi were great, barring the pen.. which was always going to happen when you’ve got a manager clamoring for it every 5 minutes. We’ve got to have more people willing to appeal to the referee, Ash can’t be the only one.
I was encouraged by Buendia and Sanson. They both look much better under SG. It looks like they understand their roles and their work rates are impressive.
I think that was a Rafa Benitez special from Gerrard. Keep it 0-0 for an hour and make your adjustments. Thought we were strong for the last 15 and when things really begin to click we will seize those moments.
No let up against the more realistic chances at taking three points now. Liverpool are gross.
UTV
-
Ours looked a pen thou it was a dodgy river , Liverpool fan next to me said it was and thought theirs wasnt.
-
Despite the penalty brain fart, Mings was my MOTM - He was immense today. Thought we'd get torn apart today, but it took a really good penalty to separate the sides.
Signs that we're definitely making progress after that performance. Cast your mind back to the last few games under Dean - We'd have been on the end of a cricket score coming out of today's game, if changes hadn't have been made.
Speaking of which - Next stop, Norwich! UTV
-
Defended brilliantly, but 1-0 flatters us in all honesty. Third game in a row where we start poorly. Gerrard has to sort this and quickly
-
Goals win games and the ref game them a goal and denied us a goal.
Simple as. The game stinks.
We had them on the ropes for a while.
-
I thought the whole team played with credit. Lots of positives for me.
-
No complaints with the result apart from the fact we should have had a pen. Thought Mings was immense up until the foul that gave them the pen. Luiz is a very frustrating player, lots of good but slow to recognise a good
quick pass and invariably gets caught.
-
We play like that against most teams we will gain points from the vast majority.
-
Nothing to be despondent about here, this was Liverpool and it was at their place, thought for periods in the 2nd half we showed some excellent skill, Steve's doing a fine job, we look a completely different outfit from a few months ago.
Plus that was a pen, no doubt, or at very least should have been looked at, remarkable.
-
If you wanted more evidence of so called top teams getting decisions there is plenty today.
Not much difference in either incident today.
Two great showing by us though against City and Liverpool though.
-
Today was a free hit and anything would have been a bonus. Overall, it looked to be a good performance against one of the best teams in the league. A soft penalty for them, nothing for us at the other end. We just have to make sure we avoid our customary habit of giving away points to teams at the bottom of the table. Anything less than 6 points for the next couple of games would not be acceptable.
-
Didn't see any pre-match build up or kick-off to avoid the inevitable w-nkfest.
Only saw the 2nd half. Very poor. Nothing in midfield. No press no support for Ollie and very little animation from the touchline. 8 goals we scored against this lot last season. With the team set up as it was today we didn't even come near troubling them until they tired. Until Ings and Buendia came on we weren't prepared to have a go. Disappointing. That said the ref/var cheated us out of yet another pen, which I feel sure would have been given the other way had it been 0-0.
Mings, Targett and Ollie all at least tried. Our manager will know now (if he didn't already) what a moaning, whinging cheating bunch of b-stards the red scouse are.
-
Totally outclassed for 75 minutes. We ought to have been feeling the relief of stealing a point because their keeper brought Ings down. No question, that was a penalty.
Agree with all that. Disappointed with our lack of composure on the ball until they scored, from then on we were great.
Mings was fantastic.
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
-
There's no such thing s a 'Good loss' but this is sort of close. Played well against a very good side, no injuries, no sendings off to scupper Xmas team selection. Hopefully easier games to come.
Other results mean we're still very mid-table. We can shrug this result off and take plus points
-
We come away without our pride and our momentum just about intact and that really was the likely outcome. No need to dwell too much on this and look forward to Tuesday instead which I don't think will be as straightforward as we may think.
At least the Liverpool/Gerrard thing is put to bed again for a while.
-
Salah the difference
If he’d be on our side, I think we’d have won by more than one.
-
Not many teams will get a point at Anfield this season. If VAR had done what it's there to do, we may have been one of them.
-
Defended well for 70 mins & improved going forward in the last 20 or so. I guess if you appeal for 20 pens per game you'll eventually get one.
Thought theirs was a pen & ours too. But the game is as biased towards the top teams as it ever was. VAR has made no difference, other than to make it more blatant.
-
Two penalty calls, and of course they get awarded one and we don't.
Played well, just wish we'd gone at them a bit earlier. Like the Man City game, we showed we had the ability to hurt them.
-
Liverpool 1-0 Aston Villa: Mohamed Salah penalty secures win on Steven's Gerrard Anfield return - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59529642
-
No mention of our potential penalty on either the Sky or BBC commentaries and yet so many here are certain it was a penalty. We're still just plucky Villa to them and the script must be followed at all costs
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
Considering he’s an ex Liverpool player I thought he was very measured and complimented us on occasions.
-
Great typo' from the BBC there.
-
Can't complain about their pen, it was definitely a pen.
Thought we should have had one as well though.
I'm always disappointed when we lose and today was disappointing despite the positives.
At least we have this game out of the way now.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
-
Pissed off especially as I had to endure the wanky WM coverage. Fuck the sky 6, fuck Liverpool and fuck Salah the diving cheating prick.
It was a penalty, sorry.
-
If that would have been in the Villa goal area,it would have been checked at least, not enough players causing a fuss
-
https://www.skysports.com/football/liverpool-vs-a-villa/report/446445
-
I didn’t think ours was a pen. Not too upset about that. Just a shame Mings gave a way a pen as Salah was moving towards a less threatening positi
-
No mention of our potential penalty on either the Sky or BBC commentaries and yet so many here are certain it was a penalty. We're still just plucky Villa to them and the script must be followed at all costs
Steven Warnock on Final Score said he thought it was a def penalty for us
-
I didn’t think ours was a pen. Not too upset about that. Just a shame Mings gave a way a pen as Salah was moving towards a less threatening positi
You need to look at it again. It was a clear foul.
-
Salah the difference
If he’d be on our side, I think we’d have won by more than one.
At least we'd have had a shot on target, the only negative from today.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
A little harsh on Cash. He was decent in the last quarter.
-
(https://i.ibb.co/KGhgJWv/FGV6-N-h-Xw-A86-Cn-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KGhgJWv)
I didn't think it was a penalty initially, but....
-
Absolutely a penalty for us today and didn't even go to Var. Absolutely disgraceful but exactly what you would expect hoping to Anfield. The decision to give Chelsea their winning penalty makes Ings look like stonewall penalty of the season
-
(https://i.ibb.co/KGhgJWv/FGV6-N-h-Xw-A86-Cn-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KGhgJWv)
I didn't think it was a penalty initially, but....
This is the view VAR would’ve seen too.
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
Considering he’s an ex Liverpool player I thought he was very measured and complimented us on occasions.
Who was the sycophantic commentator along side him who had his tongue up Liverpool arse all game ?
-
(https://i.ibb.co/KGhgJWv/FGV6-N-h-Xw-A86-Cn-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KGhgJWv)
I didn't think it was a penalty initially, but....
Liverpool fans claiming Ings pushed Matip into Alisson before he was brought down. If so, why didn't the ref give a free kick?
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
Considering he’s an ex Liverpool player I thought he was very measured and complimented us on occasions.
Who was the sycophantic commentator along side him who had his tongue up Liverpool arse all game ?
His pre match Liverpool and Gerrard monologue made me want to throw up.
First half Beglin was very one sided and I'm not sure how many times the fact Liverpool had scored for 30 consecutive games was mentioned but its ingrained in my brain.
-
The team who finishes above That Lot will win the league.
We did well under the circumstances. Needed a bit more quality in the wide areas to really give them summat to worry about.
Decent analysis from Heskey and James on Astro Sports. Not as one eyed and pro Redscouse as you'd expect.
-
When all is said and done it’s another defeat so nothing to celebrate. We need now to win at Norwich.
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
Considering he’s an ex Liverpool player I thought he was very measured and complimented us on occasions.
Who was the sycophantic commentator along side him who had his tongue up Liverpool arse all game ?
It must be part of the T's and C's to let them broadcast from Anfield. Multiple mentions of the Kop (who were quite loud today in fairness) and all the jizz the tourists seem to love.
-
No mention of our potential penalty on either the Sky or BBC commentaries and yet so many here are certain it was a penalty. We're still just plucky Villa to them and the script must be followed at all costs
BBC commentary had a Penalty shout byline in the live text followed with Stephen Warnock stating it was 100% one. Couldn't tell you for sure though as Sky highlights have nothing from our couple of attacks at all.
-
Has any other football club in history ever had such a succession of divers as Liverpool?
Owen
Torres
Suarez
Salad
-
No mention of our potential penalty on either the Sky or BBC commentaries and yet so many here are certain it was a penalty. We're still just plucky Villa to them and the script must be followed at all costs
Steven Warnock on Final Score said he thought it was a def penalty for us
Why the f**k didn't they check it at Stockley Park? Got done by VAR last week with that goal being disallowed. So annoying!
-
They all do it. Young did it today, going down around ten seconds after he realised Van Dyke's arm had been near his head.
Edit: was responding to Jon!
-
(https://i.ibb.co/KGhgJWv/FGV6-N-h-Xw-A86-Cn-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KGhgJWv)
I didn't think it was a penalty initially, but....
Ings should have done a Salah there. Their dope of a keeper was already committed to making a clanger, Ings should have ensured his body was firmly in the way. There was some contact but if Ings was sharper there should have been a lot more.
-
They’re a good side and no shame losing to them. We did ok in spells and I thought sanson did well when he came on and pen aside Mings was fantastic.
Two big games coming up.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
A little harsh on Cash. He was decent in the last quarter.
Thought he was rinsed first half, all their attacks were going down our right. His crossing has gone to pot too.
-
Max's first away game so felt very special for me as a dad for such a rite of passage. My first was Selhurst Park against Wimbledon 100 years ago, so on a day when 3 or 4 of his friends and his cousin have gone with with dad's, I felt immense pride at my big unit with his hat and scarf on talking tactics walking across Stanley Park. Huge thank you to Dorset Villa for the ticket for him.
My self indulgence aside, I think we did alright there. They move the ball so quick and in transition they are lightening. They are one of the best teams in Europe, bit we restricted them. We made it very hard and you could hear the denizens of Cork and Oslo moaning and whinging, because of how hard we worked.
You're going to defend a lot here, but we did it well. Felt their penalty was soft and if anything Mings was fouled. Bar a free header from a corner, Emi doesn't make a save of note 2nd half. That's a credit to us.
You have to stay in the game, but the trade off for us is our full backs don't get up. Gerrard wants to play like them, but as you saw with Southampton, you cannot go toe for toe or you get battered.
As soon as we went with 2 forwards and 1 10, we found that Cash got in behind Robertson and McGinn got in behind Trent Alexander-Arnold and we caused them problems. TAA is for me, absolutely dire at defending, and we created proble.s.
We should have had a penalty. 100% stonewaller. But its pleasing how Gerrard seems to be able to change the approach mid-game to effect.
Plenty to take from these last 3 games. Very difficult set of fixtures and we've given it absolutely everything effort wise and shown some of our class and fearlessness.
Looking forward to Tuesday. The drive back...not so much.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
why so low for Nkamba ?
-
Thought Watkins wasn't involved alot in terms of closing down
-
Hi Ads. Your mum was stood next to me. Glad your lad had a good day. Maybe see you Tuesday.
-
Thought Watkins wasn't involved alot in terms of closing down
He can't do it all on his own.
-
Brontebilly has to be the most tightest of tight when it comes to handing out players ratings. I bet you hand out coal for Christmas! 😉
-
Thought we held on well for most of the game, but took the game to them in the closing stages even though it left us exposed at the back on occasions.
I genuinely cannot understand the decision not to award us a penalty. From the two replays I saw, it was clear that their keeper did not touch the ball, yet made contact with Ings. The sound wasn’t on where I was watching it, so I don’t even know if VAR looked at it.
-
I thouhgt our players were a bit muted for our penalty shout. You need to go mental and get in the ref's face for decisions like that.
-
I thouhgt our players were a bit muted for our penalty shout. You need to go mental and get in the ref's face for decisions like that.
I thought the whole point of VAR is that your players don't need and shouldn't "go mental" at the ref to get a decision? They should trust that the system is fair?
-
Thought we held on well for most of the game, but took the game to them in the closing stages even though it left us exposed at the back on occasions.
I genuinely cannot understand the decision not to award us a penalty. From the two replays I saw, it was clear that their keeper did not touch the ball, yet made contact with Ings. The sound wasn’t on where I was watching it, so I don’t even know if VAR looked at it.
It would have been soft but so was the penalty that won the game. From what I could see Nakamba might have given one away in the first half though.
-
Just wish Mings didn’t try to hoof everything
-
A good effort and we weren’t disgraced by any means.
Mings and Emi were absolutely superb, but I also thought Dougie had his best game for 12 months.
-
They’re a good side and no shame losing to them. We did ok in spells and I thought sanson did well when he came on and pen aside Mings was fantastic.
Two big games coming up.
Strange how different people see it as I thought Sanson was dreadful and fluffed the final pass a fair few times, BUT thought he was really good against M City so if we’re all seeing something there’s cause for optimism there.
-
We did very well against a almost full strength liverpool team.
I dont like to say it, but this is the kind of game we could have used grealish to get something
But overall decent. Mings motm
Sanson looked decent
-
I thouhgt our players were a bit muted for our penalty shout. You need to go mental and get in the ref's face for decisions like that.
I thought the whole point of VAR is that your players don't need and shouldn't "go mental" at the ref to get a decision? They should trust that the system is fair?
The "process" seems to have completed changed over the summer. That ex ref tied himself in knots in the City/Wolves game earlier today to justify the City pen.
-
A good effort and we weren’t disgraced by any means.
A point would have been nice today but 10 points from the next 4 and I'll be happy.
-
Was a though game - but I think we can all see what SG is trying to do. I think we’re lacking on of the 10s in his two ten system - but I guess with Bailey and Bert out we’re a bit limited.
I think our defence struggles with the playing out from the back - so I wonder what happens there - will they change that tactic
Or change the personale in jan. Ironically Cash who should benefit the most from the role he is being asked to play seems to be lacking any kind of composer in the final third
-
Was a though game - but I think we can all see what SG is trying to do. I think we’re lacking on of the 10s in his two ten system - but I guess with Bailey and Bert out we’re a bit limited.
I think our defence struggles with the playing out from the back - so I wonder what happens there - will they change that tactic
Or change the personale in jan. Ironically Cash who should benefit the most from the role he is being asked to play seems to be lacking any kind of composer in the final third
I agree, the short goal kick/pass to Mings or Konsa just isn't working. They get closed down and shit themselves time and time again.
-
Just a game to get out of the way really.
Hopefully we'll be on it v Norwich as they're playing really well v Man. United currently so won't be as easy as looks on paper.
At least 4 points from Norwich/Burnley and we should be top 10 on xmas day which will be nice reading considering the state we were in a month back.
-
That was a great performance against a team who had not failed to score in their previous 30 games - yet it took a penalty to do it for them.
Yes our penalty claim should have required more due diligence - this will come.
We are no longer push overs and every team will be fearful of playing us now.
The next stage of our progression will be the players Mr Gerrard brings in to improve the team, and it would be very interesting to see where we would be in the table had he started the season, (as much as I adored Deano).
-
Gutted we didn't get a point. Played well.
-
On the BBC, Gerrard was asked about the reaction from the Liverpool fans, to which he replied the only reaction he cared about was the one from the Villa fans. Good lad.
-
On the BBC, Gerrard was asked about the reaction from the Liverpool fans, to which he replied the only reaction he cared about was the one from the Villa fans. Good lad.
Would love to know who Gerrard's PR guy is. Given him some great advice so far.
-
Battled well and gave everything, Liverpool are on a different level to us just now but that's we are aiming to be. The standard of refereeing this season ( not just for us) is appalling, var was supposed to stop all this crap it doesn't seem to be doing so.
-
On the BBC, Gerrard was asked about the reaction from the Liverpool fans, to which he replied the only reaction he cared about was the one from the Villa fans. Good lad.
Would love to know who Gerrard's PR guy is. Given him some great advice so far.
Joe needs to have a word with him
-
Their's was not a penalty at all. He went down way too easy. Cheating twunt. Sky couldn't be bothered to show ours. Wankers.
-
I've not seen the penalty award. Everything was fine until my, ahem, service provider went a bit Norman Collier, I rejoin as Salah's placing the ball on the spot. Shame, Mings played well again. Can I guess at him being simply outdone by quicker feet?
-
I've not seen the penalty award. Everything was fine until my, ahem, service provider went a bit Norman Collier, I rejoin as Salah's placing the ball on the spot. Shame, Mings played well again. Can I guess at him being simply outdone by quicker feet?
Initial contact when they came together, but he went down after that. Mings didn’t seem to make any contact when he actually went down.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
why so low for Nkamba ?
Thought he was shite. He's the primary reason we can't keep possession when being pressed. Second touch a tackle a lot of the time, like his daft yellow. Fortunate not to give away a penalty.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
why so low for Nkamba ?
Thought he was shite. He's the primary reason we can't keep possession when being pressed. Second touch a tackle a lot of the time, like his daft yellow. Fortunate not to give away a penalty.
Too harsh, bronte, in my view. He was first to a lot of dangerous balls, and the 'penalty' was a magnificent clearance.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
why so low for Nkamba ?
Thought he was shite. He's the primary reason we can't keep possession when being pressed. Second touch a tackle a lot of the time, like his daft yellow. Fortunate not to give away a penalty.
I think part of the issue is that the players he is surronded with arent that much better a lot of the time. The players seem to have been bought / set up for quick transitions etc, and as a result arent as adept at keep ball
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
why so low for Nkamba ?
Thought he was shite. He's the primary reason we can't keep possession when being pressed. Second touch a tackle a lot of the time, like his daft yellow. Fortunate not to give away a penalty.
I think part of the issue is that the players he is surronded with arent that much better a lot of the time. The players seem to have been bought / set up for quick transitions etc, and as a result arent as adept at keep ball
That's true but Nakambas limitations are exposed badly in that critical pivot/6 role. It's easy to blame Mings for going long but if the alternative is short to Nakamba when he is under pressure then it's an easy decision. Thought Luiz improved our play hugely when he swapped in there.
A few of our attacking players badly need to improve their ability to retain protect the ball in possession aswell....Buendia, Ramsey and Watkins to mention three. Watkins first touch is bang average, seems to stand on the ball a lot. Ramsey and Buendia need to learn how to better position their body to protect the ball. Grealish was a master at that.
-
As soon as i saw Atwell was the referee i feared it was going to be another of those games where we are the wrong end of game changing decisions Stevie G wants t know why neither penalty was checked by VAR Its Anfield Stevie that is why
-
If VARs mandate was to ensure equality and consistency in decision making/review it has been a complete failure.
-
Mings played well but there was no need to get that close to Salah just box him in, the difference in the two sides was glaring, Liverpools movement and ball retention was far superior to ours and clearly Klopp wasn't happy with their movement first half because they lifted the tempo after half time. Sanson looks a very tidy player and he improved us going forward, it will be interesting to see what changes Gerrard will make as he assesses the squad, he seems to be giving them all a chance to perform. I don't rember us having one shot on target all game, that part was disappointing.
-
An OK performance. We weren't humiliated by one of the best teams in the world but I was a bit disappointed with our lack of going forward until we went behind. No shots on target is poor no matter who you are playing
-
Jim Beglin can fuck off
-
Always going to be tough and could have been worse. The one area I do think we need to be better is control in the midfield.
-
Always going to be tough and could have been worse. The one area I do think we need to be better is control in the midfield.
we do lack a cool head Gareth Barry type in the middle
-
Always going to be tough and could have been worse. The one area I do think we need to be better is control in the midfield.
we do lack a cool head Gareth Barry type in the middle
Doug is nearly that player, but he's too wasteful with the ball.
-
Always going to be tough and could have been worse. The one area I do think we need to be better is control in the midfield.
we do lack a cool head Gareth Barry type in the middle
Doug is nearly that player, but he's too wasteful with the ball.
I don’t think he’s got the composure. At times he has other times he too rash
-
Think today will have really pissed Gerrard off and he will even be more driven.
-
To have got anything today we needed either them to play poorly or us to get all the luck. Neither of those things happened. We showed plenty of fight and organisation but the ref took the easy options at the key moments.
-
To have got anything today we needed either them to play poorly or us to get all the luck. Neither of those things happened. We showed plenty of fight and organisation but the ref took the easy options at the key moments.
As I saw it
-
First half I thought we were ok without creating anything. Second half, we looked better once we went behind. I thought taking Nakamba off was a bit odd, but it took a very very soft penalty to beat us.
-
Didn't they beat AC Milan in the week with half a reserve team?
Probably shows you how strong the top 3 actually are currently and one of them will likely win the CL so we're doing o.k.
-
An OK performance. We weren't humiliated by one of the best teams in the world but I was a bit disappointed with our lack of going forward until we went behind. No shots on target is poor no matter who you are playing
I agree, although I reckon Gerrard was trying to keep us in touch for as long as possible.
When we did get further up, they got a bit nervy towards the end.
It was difficult to tell in real time if Salah dived from where we were, but Mane did a dive in the first half without any comeback, but their fans were baying for fouls and getting at the ref throughout the first half.
I thought it was a penalty to us at the end, as did a couple of Liverpool fans whom I heard outside the ground afterwards, but I assumed my judgement must have been awry when there was no VAR.
-
We should have had a pen. They are good, but also c**ts. We did okay. Gerard is still impressing me.
Those is my considered opinion, albeit carte a bottle of Brouilly.
-
Just watched match of the day. Bullshit decisions for both penalties.
-
BBC pundits maintaining the status quo
-
Just watched match of the day. Bullshit decisions for both penalties.
Same here, I don't think either were penalties tbh.
-
Just watched match of the day. Bullshit decisions for both penalties.
Same here, I don't think either were penalties tbh.
I think both were borderline calls and both went against. Still these things even up right?
-
If the Salah one was Watkins no way do we get one.If the Ings one was Salah they 100% get one.
-
Exactly. With the Ings one, I think keeper does touch ball first but then stops Ings getting to loose ball he's just created
-
Thought one camera shot shows it was Salah fouling Mings, but it was always going to be doubtful VAR was going to overturn the decision. Excellent defensively today, improved as an attacking force, when Buendia and Sanson came on, would like to see them both start on Tuesday.
-
I think today showed more than ever that our midfield and "2" behind the forward need to evolve massively to get where we want to. We are not composed or creative enough to keep possession effectively at the moment. The delivery of their full backs is a lesson to us too. Gerrard knows where he wants us, it will be interesting how ruthless he is along the way.
-
We played well it was never a penalty great day out ruined by a Referee.
-
100% Salah is looking for that chance to go down. I've seen them given but sadly rarely to us. Bitter? You bet - it's corrupt and nobody in the Premier League or officials body seem to be interested in delivering a level playing field.
-
The thing is despite massive pressure - over 90min - we managed not to concede a goal - but lost because the ref gave a soft pen. Then didn’t give us a pen.
Shitbucketsmudwank.
-
Battled hard without the ball but our efforts to keep it were risible until we made subs. We were far better when Luiz moved into the middle. Peno was soft enough but Mings allowed himself to be mugged by Salah. Unfortunately he was at fault for that Jota chance too, unable to clear the ball with his right foot. McGinn battled like a trooper and Konsa was outstanding. Encouraging cameo again from Sanson I thought.
Martinez 7, Cash 5, Konsa 9, Mings 6, Targett 7, Nakamba 4, Luiz 6, McGinn 8, Ramsey 5, Young 5, Watkins 5. Sanson 6, Buendia 6, Ings 5
A little harsh on Cash. He was decent in the last quarter.
Thought he was rinsed first half, all their attacks were going down our right. His crossing has gone to pot too.
Me too but I watched the game with two Liverpool-supporting mates and they were absolutely convinced we were inviting all that space down our right on purpose, in order to fool Liverpool into giving the ball to Robertson all the time.
Their opinion of Robertson is, erm, low and we'll leave it at that.
-
Always going to be tough and could have been worse. The one area I do think we need to be better is control in the midfield.
we do lack a cool head Gareth Barry type in the middle
Doug is nearly that player, but he's too wasteful with the ball.
I don’t think he’s got the composure. At times he has other times he too rash
Agree. Luiz could be that player but he won't be.
-
I thought at the start of the season Premier league said they were going to cut out all this play acting & looking for contact & soft penalty’s etc? & the first few games of the season they did just that, refs waved away constant appeals for soft pens & mostly ignored players rolling around on the floor, it was working, games flowed, but now we’re back to all these embarrassing penalty’s, Salah initiated contact with Ming’s & flung himself down, no pen, definitely no more than our shout, it’s ruining the game, players have pushed the boundaries back to a farcical level, something has to be done, I’m pissed off with this defeat, but I’m so encouraged by Gerrard, UTV.
-
I thought at the start of the season Premier league said they were going to cut out all this play acting & looking for contact & soft penalty’s etc? & the first few games of the season they did just that, refs waved away constant appeals for soft pens & mostly ignored players rolling around on the floor, it was working, games flowed, but now we’re back to all these embarrassing penalty’s, Salah initiated contact with Ming’s & flung himself down, no pen, definitely no more than our shout, it’s ruining the game, players have pushed the boundaries back to a farcical level, something has to be done, I’m pissed off with this defeat, but I’m so encouraged by Gerrard, UTV.
Agree on the initiating contact. Shearer said on MOTD that Salah moved his left leg across Mings path which inevitably created the collision. Mings was therefore fouled before falling into Salah.
VAR has done nothing to improve the game changing decisions. It’s still based on the same subjectivity pre technology and remains inherently biased as the Wolves incident also showed.
-
The kicking the ball away at free kicks is also now worse than ever, normally following the rotational fouling too.
-
I agree that was nonsense from Shearer. "It's what they are taught to do get your leg in front of the defender and then Mings fouls him" how can it be a foul by Mings when Salah doesn't make contact with ball but effectively trips him up. Salah has been doing this for years and it's not "clever" Mr Shearer it's cheating. As for the challenge on Ings I agree Allisson gets the ball but I thought that when a defender does that and wipes you out it was still a penalty or is that another interpretation changed? Probably a fair result but they still cheated and they shouldn't be feted on national TV for it
-
first game I didn’t see live one way or another so I’ve only seen match of the Day highlights
Sounds as though we were under pressure the whole game with no shots on target
It might have been a valiant effort but if we had done that under Smith I would have been critical
I don’t mind good defensive displays but you have to offer something in the other half and I think it’s a ball retention and confidence with it that’s the problem
I’ve seen Mings make big mistakes in games but I wouldn’t put yesterdays down as one of them it was salah being very clever and buying the penalty
Can’t comment too much on the game having not seen it but no shots on target tells its own story to be fair
I’m a bit disappointed in the performance from the bits I’ve seen maybe if I’d seen it live it would be different
all season I thought Man City Would win that league I think I might have changed my mind now Liverpool look the team to beat
-
I haven't seen the penalty that was given (BBC R5L commentary saw it as nailed on; but then it was Salah, whom everyone thinks should be given everything), but I didn't think Allison did enough on Ings to warrant a pen (saw that live on TV).
For us to get something out of a game like this, we need to make those times when we are on top (minutes 75-85) count; we didn't force Allison into any meaningful saves during that period.
But, remember: we are 5 games into the manager's time with us, and he needs 2-3 months to really make his mark.
-
Fair result I guess. I suppose with a bit of luck we could have perhaps held out but the reality is this lot are going to end up 35+ points ahead of us come May. We're not in the same ballpark unfortunately but then neither are another 16 teams
-
I haven't seen the penalty that was given (BBC R5L commentary saw it as nailed on; but then it was Salah, whom everyone thinks should be given everything), but I didn't think Allison did enough on Ings to warrant a pen (saw that live on TV).
Did you stop listening to the 5live commentary? They also thought ours was nailed on. They went on about it at some length, not just at the time but throughout and at the end of the game. They mentioned that MOTD would be having a really close look at it (they didn’t).
Also - what Gerrard alluded to but all the commentators, pundits, & in the main, the replays are missing, is the clear shove in the back on Watkins as the ball runs free. If the first isn’t a penalty, the second is.
For all Liverpool’s dominance, they only got the ball in the net from a penalty, & we should have had one too.
-
Very good organised performance from the lads, Liverpool were by far the best team we’ve played this season and only beat us due to a pen. My opinion is it was a genuine pen and Mings at fault there. However, Allison’s clumsy challenge on Ings was a clear pen too-can’t for the life of me see why it wasn’t given.
-
Oh and Jim Beglin can do one.
he’s a bell end.
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Personally I thought their explanation for the Man City Armpit penalty was funnier. Yes it maybe wasn't a penalty but it wasn't a "clear and obvious error" and if the ref hadn't have given it, VAR wouldn't have changed the decision.
And if you believe that...………..
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Would be true if he did make contact with the ball, but he didn’t.
-
How anyone can think that was a penalty when Mings was on the floor before Salah was is baffling.
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Would be true if he did make contact with the ball, but he didn’t.
they say he did and I quote "Alisson clearly pats the ball away"
-
They got the benifit of any doubt on both penalties.
You could see the relief burst out of the ref to give it.
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Would be true if he did make contact with the ball, but he didn’t.
they say he did and I quote "Alisson clearly pats the ball away"
To the feet of Ings, then Watkins!
-
We gave a good account of ourselves. To get anything out of liverpool at the moment you really need them to drop their levels but they didn't. Their high pressing stopped us getting the ball out, penned us back. Which isn't too surprising. We got into the game a little later when their pressing relented a little. We did have chances, and whilst Allison looked suspect yesterday, their backline was solid. Yep both pens very debatable, and the fact neither decision ever looked remotely like going our way is not at all surprising.
The big thing now, is to go into the next two games, where we should be expecting to dominate the ball, and see how we play under that situation. Because we've played teams so far, we'd have expected to lose out to on possession. We look well drilled so let's so how we can develop our possession game more. I'd be tempted to start Sanson and give DOuglas a rest.
-
As regards the pen; that was a cracking shot into the corner.Any let up in power or placement and Emi saves it.
-
As for the challenge on Ings I agree Allisson gets the ball but I thought that when a defender does that and wipes you out it was still a penalty or is that another interpretation changed?
exactly this ,, its a bloody follow through isnt it
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Would be true if he did make contact with the ball, but he didn’t.
they say he did and I quote "Alisson clearly pats the ball away"
To the feet of Ings, then Watkins!
BUT ITS NOT A CLEAR AND OBVIOUS ERROR SO YOU'RE WRONG!!!!11111 8)
You can't win so its not worth trying Amfy. All about Entertainment. They want 3 teams in a title chase hence all of them getting a helping hand yesterday.. If they can get Man U up there as well before Christmas and make it a 4 horse race they will.
-
Overall we gave a good defensive display and changed system when needed to. This bodes well for the future. In a short period of time Gerrard has shown the team the importance of keeping shape and his speed of reaction to change when it’s needed. That’s impressive. I can’t see us getting blown away by any team for the rest of the season. If we can get a strong composed midfielder in Jan I’d be very happy.
-
Well the explanation from the Ref's Union says Allision got the ball first before he makes contact with Ings.
Would be true if he did make contact with the ball, but he didn’t.
they say he did and I quote "Alisson clearly pats the ball away"
To the feet of Ings, then Watkins!
BUT ITS NOT A CLEAR AND OBVIOUS ERROR SO YOU'RE WRONG!!!!11111 8)
You can't win so its not worth trying Amfy. All about Entertainment. They want 3 teams in a title chase hence all of them getting a helping hand yesterday.. If they can get Man U up there as well before Christmas and make it a 4 horse race they will.
Would have been better off having them all fail to win except Man U then...
-
I haven't seen the penalty that was given (BBC R5L commentary saw it as nailed on; but then it was Salah, whom everyone thinks should be given everything), but I didn't think Allison did enough on Ings to warrant a pen (saw that live on TV).
Did you stop listening to the 5live commentary? They also thought ours was nailed on. They went on about it at some length, not just at the time but throughout and at the end of the game. They mentioned that MOTD would be having a really close look at it (they didn’t).
Also - what Gerrard alluded to but all the commentators, pundits, & in the main, the replays are missing, is the clear shove in the back on Watkins as the ball runs free. If the first isn’t a penalty, the second is.
For all Liverpool’s dominance, they only got the ball in the net from a penalty, & we should have had one too.
Yes, amfy, I did stop listening! Arrived at a place that was showing the game live so viewed the last 20 minutes.
-
There was a clear body-check on Watkins from (I think) Matip in the build-up to our penalty-shout - he clearly played the man and was nowhere near the ball.
I don't think it was a penalty for Alyson on Ings but we should have got a direct free-kick 20 yards out. Not that we'd have done much with it....is it worth re-signing Leandro Bacuna? Can't think of a decent free-kick taker since he left...
-
There was a clear body-check on Watkins from (I think) Matip in the build-up to our penalty-shout - he clearly played the man and was nowhere near the ball.
I don't think it was a penalty for Alyson on Ings but we should have got a direct free-kick 20 yards out. Not that we'd have done much with it....is it worth re-signing Leandro Bacuna? Can't think of a decent free-kick taker since he left...
Why not? I've seen a few people say the same and I can't work out why you'd not think, as a Villa fan, that we're very unlucky not to have got that. Clearly has a hand on his hip and and then hits him on the shin with the other. Take the contact away and Ings is clear favourite to get to the loose ball for a shot at an empty net. For me it was the strongest of all the penalty shouts in the game and that the Salah one was given and this one wasn't says a lot about the state of the game right now, Salah went down as he was initiating contact and ot a pen, Ings tried to stay on his feet after contact and got fuck all. Until the officials learn how players abuse the current rules they are just encouraging diving and simulation and need to stop pretending they care about it.
-
There was a clear body-check on Watkins from (I think) Matip in the build-up to our penalty-shout - he clearly played the man and was nowhere near the ball.
I don't think it was a penalty for Alyson on Ings but we should have got a direct free-kick 20 yards out. Not that we'd have done much with it....is it worth re-signing Leandro Bacuna? Can't think of a decent free-kick taker since he left...
Hourihane?
-
How many great free kicks did Bacuna have outside of that one vs Man City?
-
How many great free kicks did Bacuna have outside of that one vs Man City?
Think he scored one vs Cardiff. Can't remember many more.
-
How many great free kicks did Bacuna have outside of that one vs Man City?
Maybe he was saving them for when he played in the Champions League?
-
There was a clear body-check on Watkins from (I think) Matip in the build-up to our penalty-shout - he clearly played the man and was nowhere near the ball.
I don't think it was a penalty for Alyson on Ings but we should have got a direct free-kick 20 yards out. Not that we'd have done much with it....is it worth re-signing Leandro Bacuna? Can't think of a decent free-kick taker since he left...
Hourihane?
D'oh. Conor, of course. All too easily-forgotten at the moment.
-
We didn't have a single shot on target. That's a Steve Bruce statistic.
It's a really shit state of affairs that we didn't get one in 90 minutes of football.
-
We didn't have a single shot on target. That's a Steve Bruce statistic.
It's a really shit state of affairs that we didn't get one in 90 minutes of football.
It took two dodgy penalty decisions for us to lose to the best team in the league, yet here you are, with barely concealed glee, comparing him to Steve Bruce on two threads.
-
We didn't have a single shot on target. That's a Steve Bruce statistic.
It's a really shit state of affairs that we didn't get one in 90 minutes of football.
It took two dodgy penalty decisions for us to lose to the best team in the league, yet here you are, with barely concealed glee, comparing him to Steve Bruce on two threads.
Haha, I knew you'd react like that. I've no doubt I could do a search and find behaviour of yours that's far more reactionary, that will have been quoted on thread after thread about various managers over the years.
As for glee, do me a favour. I'm fucked off. Liverpool is the game I want to win more than any other.
I didn't like the lineup, there was no flair in there, but that's because we set up to defend. You don't win games by trying not to lose.
-
We showed them too much respect. The players did that against Man City and the manager changed it up at half time. Our tactics did that against Liverpool for 70 minutes. Even with Buendia and Ings on we didn't do enough.
I want to win games. Not be the plucky losers.
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
-
We didn't have a single shot on target. That's a Steve Bruce statistic.
It's a really shit state of affairs that we didn't get one in 90 minutes of football.
It took two dodgy penalty decisions for us to lose to the best team in the league, yet here you are, with barely concealed glee, comparing him to Steve Bruce on two threads.
Haha, I knew you'd react like that. I've no doubt I could do a search and find behaviour of yours that's far more reactionary, that will have been quoted on thread after thread about various managers over the years.
As for glee, do me a favour. I'm fucked off. Liverpool is the game I want to win more than any other.
I didn't like the lineup, there was no flair in there, but that's because we set up to defend. You don't win games by trying not to lose.
Sometimes you do. You certainly don't win them by being an utter defensive shambles and shipping two goals a game, as we did under Smith.
So far under Gerrard we've played 5 teams who were above us in the league, and have won three of them, with two very narrow defeats to the two best teams in the league. A bit more composure from Chukwuemeka and a referee doing his job properly, and we probably get a point from each of those as well. I want to see good attacking play, but I'll accept the odd game against the likes of Liverpool when we have to be more compact, especially when two of our three expensive attacking options in Bailey and Traore are perma-crocked and the other in Buendia can't (yet) be trusted not to give balls away in dangerous positions for the opposition.
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
It was 7, and we had Grealish and Barkley in the best form of their lives.
-
Comparisons with Bruce are a bit off, not getting a shot on target against one of the best teams in the world is one thing but doing it against Cardiff or Sheffield Utd is a whole other thing entirely
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
So would I but I can also see the Managers thinking. Gerrard is a pragmatist, that I think is obvious.
-
Comparisons with Bruce are a bit off, not getting a shot on target against one of the best teams in the world is one thing but doing it against Cardiff or Sheffield Utd is a whole other thing entirely
Nah, they're not. Our possession in other games (Brighton, Palace and Man City) has been really low too, we'll create chances against weaker teams playing that way, but against Liverpool the system was exposed.
I'm pleased with everything Gerrard did (e.g. waving to our fans) and said (about the fuss around him being ex-Liverpool) and of course we need to tighten up the chances we gave conceded but I'm surprised at the line-up. effectively 4-5-1 and no width.
-
I think Gerrard said the game plan was to hold on for 70 minutes and then hit them with everything. It didn't work but y'know man for man it was a total mismatch realistically. They'd have to have had a major off-day and us a lot of luck to win or draw it.
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
So would I but I can also see the Managers thinking. Gerrard is a pragmatist, that I think is obvious.
I appreciate your comments Nev.
It's early days and Saturday's performance never mind the result will hopefully be an exception to how we normally play.
Like most Villa fans probably, I've been fed up with Villa 'knowing their place' when playing the sl6 and hardly laying a glove on them. It's been refreshing the last few years ruffling the feathers of the majority of these clubs and taking our place close to if not on the top table. Saturday was a frustrating throw-back for me and one that I hope is rarely repeated.
-
I agree with Nev. I think this was the selection and tactical performance that he felt he had to go with on "Stevee Gee's return to Anfield". A narrow loss was no shame against a very good team who are playing very well at home, anything more than that would've been a massive bonus. The one thing that couldn't happen was for himto take a battering on his first game there in the opposition dugout, that would've become the defining story of our season and bno one wants that.
It just felt like our plan was to kill the game and take all of the circus out of it. It's far from ideal but I think it'll turn out to have been the right choice in the long run. However we now have to win the next 2 to prove it was business as usual and there's no dwelling on it, just like we did after welcoming back the rat.
-
Just listened to a bit of radio in the car. Danny Murphy and Sam Matterface were discussing this match. Matterface was absolutely ruthless in sticking it up Murphy. Murphy stuck to the he got his hand to the ball line whereas Matterface maintained that that doesn't give him a free pass for fouling Ings, Alison was not in control of the ball and if he had not impeded Ings there was a loose ball and an open goal. Gave him some more verbal to say that Salah dived and he is a diver.
We have been done twice on this "touched the ball so no pen" decision this one and last season v Brighton so the foul didn't count. They need to look at this rule.
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
So would I but I can also see the Managers thinking. Gerrard is a pragmatist, that I think is obvious.
I appreciate your comments Nev.
It's early days and Saturday's performance never mind the result will hopefully be an exception to how we normally play.
Like most Villa fans probably, I've been fed up with Villa 'knowing their place' when playing the sl6 and hardly laying a glove on them. It's been refreshing the last few years ruffling the feathers of the majority of these clubs and taking our place close to if not on the top table. Saturday was a frustrating throw-back for me and one that I hope is rarely repeated.
We haven't got the players to go toe-to-toe with Liverpool. When we played them last year, Grealish was head and shoulders the best player in the league at the time, and Barkley had one of his 1 game in 20 worldie matches, and Liverpool couldn't live with them at all. Norwich will be an interesting match, because it's the first game for Gerrard where we're playing a team below us, and one we're expected to beat, and beat well.
-
The Law's fine, it's its implementation that's raising blood pressure.
-
Comparisons with Bruce are a bit off, not getting a shot on target against one of the best teams in the world is one thing but doing it against Cardiff or Sheffield Utd is a whole other thing entirely
Nah, they're not. Our possession in other games (Brighton, Palace and Man City) has been really low too, we'll create chances against weaker teams playing that way, but against Liverpool the system was exposed.
I'm pleased with everything Gerrard did (e.g. waving to our fans) and said (about the fuss around him being ex-Liverpool) and of course we need to tighten up the chances we gave conceded but I'm surprised at the line-up. effectively 4-5-1 and no width.
Possession has not been a strong point of our team for ages. The only league games this season when we had more possession was Watford and Everton and came out of those W1L1. All Gerrard has done is to make us harder to score against and then is that really a surprise being as the players are all Smith's (with a hint of Bruce). Smith could have got us out of the rot if he hadn't persisted with obvious tactics that were not really working but I don't know if we would have had 9 from 15 against the teams we have played.
However the main judgement of Gerrard will be when we see the players he gets in and the positions.
-
Liverpool 1-0 Aston Villa: Mohamed Salah penalty secures win on Steven's Gerrard Anfield return - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59529642
Liverpool fans are a bit "special" aren't they? Lots of them complaining that we didn't all out attack them and how dare we try to stop them scoring at Anfield. Professional victim fc.
-
In that 15 min spell in the second half we really took them apart.
Like to see more of that.
-
It's a tricky one to decide what game-plan to ultimately go for against one of the top three teams. In fairness to Gerrard, he said after the game that maybe he should have been more expansive earlier and it's something that he would reflect on.
I think when you're playing one of the best sides in Europe who are bang in-form, averaging 3 goals a game this season etc. it's understandable to be cautious. When we last played at Anfield in the Spring, Liverpool had lost an unprecendented five or six home games in a row. We were still bombarded by them in the early stages of that game but we settled-down and their confidence dropped with their recent results playing on their mind, no doubt. It needed Ross Barkley not giving two fucks about losing possession and Trent scoring a last minute worldy to win it for them then. I was a lot more gutted about that result/performance as they were actually there for the taking in that second half (Trez had that wonderful chance off the bar/line shortly before coming off with his terrible injury that he's still not back from). On Saturday, Liverpool were in-form and pretty relentless if not as fluid due to our organisation. The most irritating thing is the soft penalty they needed to win the game.
-
Liverpool are a very different team when they're playing to a crowd than when it's behind closed doors. That's a big factor in the 2 recent games there.
-
The ref also playing to the crowd helps too!
-
The ref also playing to the crowd helps too!
That's the biggest deciding factor. 100%.
-
For this game alone the manager had to prioritise not losing. Had he played openly and we'd been dicked 4 or 5 can you just imagine the reaction from the fans? I think he was conscious of the behavior of Houllier and you could see that the way he handled himself on Saturday. That's without the gulf in class between the sides, and poor officiating.
Should we approach games in such a fashion on a regular basis then I will call in question his tactics but for Saturday he gets a pass from me.
...but we did lose.
Our goal led a charmed life and if it wasn't for Tyrone and Emi we could easily have lost by 2 or 3 goals even without the need for their penalty.
I'd sooner have a go at teams, show little respect and lose trying (remember it's not that long ago we scored 8 goals against them).
So would I but I can also see the Managers thinking. Gerrard is a pragmatist, that I think is obvious.
I appreciate your comments Nev.
It's early days and Saturday's performance never mind the result will hopefully be an exception to how we normally play.
Like most Villa fans probably, I've been fed up with Villa 'knowing their place' when playing the sl6 and hardly laying a glove on them. It's been refreshing the last few years ruffling the feathers of the majority of these clubs and taking our place close to if not on the top table. Saturday was a frustrating throw-back for me and one that I hope is rarely repeated.
We haven't got the players to go toe-to-toe with Liverpool. When we played them last year, Grealish was head and shoulders the best player in the league at the time, and Barkley had one of his 1 game in 20 worldie matches, and Liverpool couldn't live with them at all. Norwich will be an interesting match, because it's the first game for Gerrard where we're playing a team below us, and one we're expected to beat, and beat well.
Liverpool were very easy to play against last season. In both games against us really. Maybe they were a bit soft coming back after winning the league but they are a much different team this year. We couldn't cope with their pressing from the front on Saturday but I keep coming back that Nakamba is nowhere near good enough to get turned on the ball against that kind of pressure. Maybe Gerrard should have switched to a 4231 and put Luiz in next to him in the first half.
-
The ref also playing to the crowd helps too!
That's the biggest deciding factor. 100%.
The crowd baying for 5 different penalties or whatever it was and urging their team on definitely makes a difference.
Being bang in-form compared to the losing run they were on last season when we played there also counts for a lot.
-
Having Jurgen in the fourth official's ear all first half probably has an effect, too!