Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on February 16, 2019, 04:42:43 PM
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Just where do you start?
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Once upon a time there was a football club, and it was quite good....
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Fortress Villa Park.
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VP used to be my Paradise City, but now the grass is green and the Villa's shitty.
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How you can expect to start with 10 men and get results.
Either Smith has no other options or ideas.
Either way we are down here for a long time.
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Just where do you start?
Question is, where does it end?
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Albion won’t get it easier the rest of this season. Aside from a chance Tammy should have taken that was fucking easy for them. We are a disgrace.
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If Aston Villa aren't leading the Championship after half a dozen games next season, there won't be a lot of patience left. Mine ran out this week.
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Has it finished then?
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Bad bad and bad
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Has it finished then?
Yeah. The game kicked off.
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At least we're not Stoke ''lol''
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Deserved result, not good enough.
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Are 44 Pts enough to stay up ?
If so try anything and everything until we find a spark . Kodja up front in middle and Tammy out wide. Hause mings and tommy back 3 type stuff !?
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I left at half time because I simply can't take the hassle of the M6 and Villa's predictable crap any longer. Worse than anything under RDM and Bruce. Smith's a busted flush, it was etched all over his face when the second goal went in.
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Big hairy bollocks.
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We're playing much like we did in the relegation season. No form, fight, idea, spark. The season's played out and everyone at the club is marking time until we can reset. It's an awful feeling that I hoped never, ever to have to experience again. Yet here we are.
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Smith has that paralysed rabbit in a headlights look that Garde had. Out of his depth, unable to change anything or galvanise the team.
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Oh dear! This is Grimm. Can we forfit the remaining fixtures and just move on to next season already
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If it’s wasnt Dean, a man who who understands us, we would be voting with our feet and throwing cabbages at him by now, but for some insane reason I still feel we should give him time, not least because we know he’s had these dips at his previous clubs. Not sure our new(ish) owners will be so patient though !
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Season over on 16th February. All I can hope for now is smethwick don’t make it.
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Did anyone really believe that we would get a result with that formation again?
It hasn't worked for weeks yet the manager persists with it. If he'd tried something else and we had lost then at least he can use it as some sort of defence. I said on Wednesday, a feeling I had from the SU game, that he is all at sea, he's getting further and further out now.....
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Double post.
Got an error message with my first attempt
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What excuse this week Dean?
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I think Smith needs a good hard look at what he is dishing up...
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I think the manager should be questioned for not getting a hint of a tune out of this squad, it’s been absolutely pathetic for so long now that he can’t be allowed to hide anymore. Yes he inherited a shipwreck but hells bells surely he can at least get them to put their shorts on the right way round.
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Meh. Couldn't give a flying feck, like the players.
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Big hairy bollocks.
Wrong forum mate, will send you a recommendation via PM.
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I'm not sure I trust a man who, when the players he has can't play the system he wants, sticks with the system.
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It's just not good enough to say we can't judge Smith til he has his own players, as if he gets a free pass til then. He's the manager of this club right now, not in six months, or twelve months. Fucking sort it out Smith.
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All over em before they scored then just went to pot. We’re low on confidence but wasn’t shambolic at all. Brentford and Wigan were
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I just don't understand why he doesn't mix it up and ditch the ''wingers or nothing'' attacking idea, it's not working for us at the moment and it doesn't suit his philosophy. Get El Khazi in the hole and lets try play through the middle every once in a while.
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Three seasons down here and this season is going to be the worse of the lot. I really want Dean to succeed, but how much worse is it going to get before it gets better?
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Oh dear! This is Grimm. Can we forfit the remaining fixtures and just move on to next season already
What - and skip the excitement of an impending relegation battle? How VERY dare you.
As for that utterly pathetic capitulation today: words actually fail me.
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Right now thank fuck there will likely be three teams worse than us in this league. We are on relegation form, or at minimum have a relegation defence. From the highs of Derby and Boro we have collapsed in remarkable fashion.
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That second half today was the worse of the lot for me. Ok we didn’t capitulate and lose 4 or 5 but the lack of effort from a lot of the players and generally lack of any ability to do anything to get a foothold in the game was unforgivable.
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Three seasons down here and this season is going to be the worse of the lot. I really want Dean to succeed, but how much worse is it going to get before it gets better?
We're only 15 points clear of the relegation spaces. Just saying.
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I think the most infuriating thing and whats turning people against Smith is for what say 2 months now we have been playing horrendous football. Yet for 2 months straight its the same players same formation same results.
If something is clearly not working you do something, anything to try fix it. Not just do the same thing. Its not magically gonna start working. Have a few ideas try something different ffs, he's obviously got none.
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Reading away, Brentford away and today have made me lose my faith. Players, manager & club look lost. We are a poor championship team with a championship manager.
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Personally I can see us being peripherally involved in a relegation struggle. It might be one lf those 'if the stars align' things but I can't see more wins than losses between now and May.
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There's no chance we're going down. Even if we lost every game for the rest of the season it's highly unlikely we'd drop.
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I just don't understand why he doesn't mix it up and ditch the ''wingers or nothing'' attacking idea, it's not working for us at the moment and it doesn't suit his philosophy. Get El Khazi in the hole and lets try play through the middle every once in a while.
Great idea about sticking El Khazi in a hole. Just make it a deep one eh - so we can chuck the rest of our useless feckers in there with him.
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As a club for years we haven't raised the bar but continually lowered the bar. What worries me is how low the bar can go....oh and just have to get this off my chest....fuck off villa
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There's no chance we're going down. Even if we lost every game for the rest of the season it's highly unlikely we'd drop.
Mind you it's fucking ridiculous that it even has to be considered if it's a possibility.
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Abysmal.
Kalanic/Steer - Not rating either as standing between those sticks is like being given a bottomless bucket on a sinking Titanic
Hause - Better than the last game, and would stick with him over Taylor
Mings/Elphick - Didn't really notice either. Fault mostly lies with midfield, not these guys
Hutton - Effort is there, but that's about it
Whelan - Best of a bad bunch in that DM slot
Hourihane - Fuck off
McGinn - Looked ready to lose it today. Frustration finally appears to be creeping in, and was expecting him to see red if I'm being honest (Suspended now for Derby/Stoke games too - fuck!)
Green - Effort was there, but no real end product
Elmohamady - Useless
Abraham - Should have tucked the early chance away, and was then stranded up top on his own for most of game.
Subs
Ramsey - Showed more in that 30mins than Hourihane all season
Kodjia - Looked lively, but should have been on the pitch from the start.
Shocking performance. Personnel AND formation change needed for next game or Smith's number is up.
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I think the most infuriating thing and whats turning people against Smith is for what say 2 months now we have been playing horrendous football. Yet for 2 months straight its the same players same formation same results.
If something is clearly not working you do something, anything to try fix it. Not just do the same thing. Its not magically gonna start working. Have a few ideas try something different ffs, he's obviously got none.
This is what puzzles me, perhaps he's waiting for Jack to be fit and slot straight back in? If he is he deserves the sack.
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Terrible
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I just don't understand why he doesn't mix it up and ditch the ''wingers or nothing'' attacking idea, it's not working for us at the moment and it doesn't suit his philosophy. Get El Khazi in the hole and lets try play through the middle every once in a while.
Wayheyyyyyy, highlight of the day time
(https://media.balls.ie/uploads/2014/01/york.gif)
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How you can expect to start with 10 men and get results.
It was 10 against 12. We've seen some crap refs over the last couple of years but today was a new low.
Albion are still a team of dirty bastards. Football wise, Dean Smith needs to find a way to unblock the toilet that is our midfield. With the exception of McGinn, nobody looks to cut inside and go past a player, it's forever recycling the ball back 30 yards through the central defenders, on to Whelan and back again. No bloody ambition.
Hopefully we keep Mings, he looks a class apart, Hause a big improvement but other than that very few positives other than not being as shit as we've been recently. Albion were nothing special and the 2-0 half time lead flattered them, the dirty bastards.
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There's no chance we're going down. Even if we lost every game for the rest of the season it's highly unlikely we'd drop.
Mind you it's fucking ridiculous that it even has to be considered if it's a possibility.
Blackburn went down with 51 points 2 years ago.
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I'm sick of talking about Championship refs. They're shit, and they're shit for everyone. Just be the better team and achieve despite them.
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There's no chance we're going down. Even if we lost every game for the rest of the season it's highly unlikely we'd drop.
Mind you it's fucking ridiculous that it even has to be considered if it's a possibility.
Blackburn went down with 51 points 2 years ago.
Lump on at the bookies if you think any of the bottom 3 are making it to 50 points this season.
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There's no chance we're going down. Even if we lost every game for the rest of the season it's highly unlikely we'd drop.
No that’s probably true, but we are 15 points off relegation, just think about that, that’s terrible & we are
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In all honesty, I have no idea whether the bottom three are capable of 50 points. I can't stomach looking at the table. I don't watch highlights, I don't watch Match of the Day. Beyond the ninety plus minutes of huffing and puffing of a Villa game I'm totally out lf love with the sport in general.
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Which is why I added the second bit. It's fucking ridiculous it was even a thought for any of us but that's where we are at the moment. No chance we're dropping though.
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In all honesty, I have no idea whether the bottom three are capable of 50 points. I can't stomach looking at the table. I don't watch highlights, I don't watch Match of the Day. Beyond the ninety plus minutes of huffing and puffing of a Villa game I'm totally out lf love with the sport in general.
Considering 4 still haven't broken the 30 point barrier it's a safe bet.
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Lump on at the bookies if you think any of the bottom 3 are making it to 50 points this season.
I don't think we will. We'll be a lot closer to going down than going up though.
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Looking to finish in our lowest position in the football league for how many years?
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We were fine for the first 30 mins, then spent the rest of the game playing Bruceball. Mings, Elphick and Hause did well.
I suspect that as the results are not coming, Smith is getting more and more defensive to 'prevent the loss'...he's turning into Steve Bruce. If he mentions kebabs in the post-match interview the transformation will be complete.
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Which is still very different to being involved in a relegation fight.
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In all honesty, I have no idea whether the bottom three are capable of 50 points. I can't stomach looking at the table. I don't watch highlights, I don't watch Match of the Day. Beyond the ninety plus minutes of huffing and puffing of a Villa game I'm totally out lf love with the sport in general.
Considering 4 still haven't broken the 30 point barrier it's a safe bet.
That actually makes me feel a little bit better. Good job, sir.
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Looking to finish in our lowest position in the football league for how many years?
13th 2 years ago, before that it was 14th in 1972. And before that it was division 3.
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Looking to finish in our lowest position in the football league for how many years?
13th 2 years ago, before that it was 14th in 1972. And before that it was division 3.
14th the Second Division in 1973 - 74, which did for Vic Crowe. Replaced him with some bloke called Saunders.
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One of the very few plus points from today is the Ramsey seemed decent, I hope we see more of him.
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Looking to finish in our lowest position in the football league for how many years?
13th 2 years ago, before that it was 14th in 1972. And before that it was division 3.
14th the Second Division in 1973 - 74, which did for Vic Crowe. Replaced him with some bloke called Saunders.
Ooops, typo'd the season.
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Quite possibly the worst game of football we'll see this season. Utterly mind numbing from both sides.
The Positives
It was quite warm today.
The Negatives
Smith's persistence with a system that does not work with these players.
Smith's persistence with certain players.
Hourihane. Utterly atrocious. One of the worst excuses for a performance I've seen from a midfielder. The prick taking an age to get off our pitch. I'd love that to be the last time the useless twat plays for us, but he'll be back next week doing absolutely, fuck all.
He's so poor off the ball, so lightweight, offers nothing. A shocking player.
Whelan. Another I wish to never see playing for us again. He's so slow it's embarrassing. Everything he does takes an absolute age. He's so deep, he effects the positioning of the side, he effects the tempo of the side.
Elmo. What was Smith thinking? Another utterly slow and past it waste of space. Leeds should have been his last game. Why is this useless prick starting on the fucking wing of all places?
Can't beat a man, is an utter coward in the tackle and he didn't put a single ball of quality into the box at all today. Utter shite.
Hutton. Fucking clown. 8 fucking years nearly that shower has been here. Fuck me.
Abraham completely isolated. Our slow midfield didn't show from their deep position so the defence resorted to knocking percentage diagonal balls.
We switched off at the throw and Hourihane, fuck me, for the 2nd and were never likely to get back in it.
The Albion I thought had probably been worse than us up to that point, but we huffed and puffed all second half.
The Albion camped 11 men behind the ball and when your glacial slow as we are, it's easy to make us look clueless.
McGinn now out for 2 games. Joy.
Smith has to stop persisting with this system and these players. Get radical.
And Steve Bruce, you're a fat fucking sack of shit, you balloon headed ******. Elmo, Whelan, Hourihane and the like. Thank you very fucking much for spending all our money and nearly taking us to the wall so we could fucking fail and wave off our best players who we didn't fucking own. ******.
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Pretty even til 0-1. Dropped off 2nd half. They weren't as good as I expected them to be, but they didn't need to be.
Hause was better today. So was Whelan. Mings good again. Green tried but didn't get much luck and was at fault for one of their goals. Elmo a bit anonymous.
Hourihane is an utter disgrace and shouldn't play for us again. To see the twat jogging off at 0-2 when he was subbed... Whelan had to chivvy him on, sounded like he was getting dog's abuse?
As others have said, that ref was a joke, particularly in the first half when several of their dirty bastards should've gone in the book.
Agree with those saying stick with Smith, but he does need to start planning for next season now, which means bomb-squadding the deadwood and playing some of the kids. It can't be much worse than this, and surely we've done too much already to go down?
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It's hard to believe we won our first two games this season. Seems a lifetime ago.
Grealish getting injured cost us.
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The referee was shite. How do you get booked for a tackle where you win the ball, like McGinn, but the referee seems it reckless. Yet escape a booking for a foot off the ground where you kick somebody in the head.
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Smith sounded pretty exasperated during his interview but didn't say anything you wouldn't expect him to.
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Quite possibly the worst game of football we'll see this season. Utterly mind numbing from both sides.
The Positives
It was quite warm today.
The Negatives
Smith's persistence with a system that does not work with these players.
Smith's persistence with certain players.
Hourihane. Utterly atrocious. One of the worst excuses for a performance I've seen from a midfielder. The prick taking an age to get off our pitch. I'd love that to be the last time the useless twat plays for us, but he'll be back next week doing absolutely, fuck all.
He's so poor off the ball, so lightweight, offers nothing. A shocking player.
Whelan. Another I wish to never see playing for us again. He's so slow it's embarrassing. Everything he does takes an absolute age. He's so deep, he effects the positioning of the side, he effects the tempo of the side.
Elmo. What was Smith thinking? Another utterly slow and past it waste of space. Leeds should have been his last game. Why is this useless prick starting on the fucking wing of all places?
Can't beat a man, is an utter coward in the tackle and he didn't put a single ball of quality into the box at all today. Utter shite.
Hutton. Fucking clown. 8 fucking years nearly that shower has been here. Fuck me.
Abraham completely isolated. Our slow midfield didn't show from their deep position so the defence resorted to knocking percentage diagonal balls.
We switched off at the throw and Hourihane, fuck me, for the 2nd and were never likely to get back in it.
The Albion I thought had probably been worse than us up to that point, but we huffed and puffed all second half.
The Albion camped 11 men behind the ball and when your glacial slow as we are, it's easy to make us look clueless.
McGinn now out for 2 games. Joy.
Smith has to stop persisting with this system and these players. Get radical.
And Steve Bruce, you're a fat fucking sack of shit, you balloon headed c***. Elmo, Whelan, Hourihane and the like. Thank you very fucking much for spending all our money and nearly taking us to the wall so we could fucking fail and wave off our best players who we didn't fucking own. c***.
Totally agree there Ads apart from the positives. I was asked to work today but instead of saying bollocks I gave my ticket away and worked instead. A pleasant day in the sunshine That's what villa have done to me.
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Without Grealish we can’t break the lines which is why we go side to side. Not once did we get behind them so we inevitably look slow and ponderous.
He’d be better off going more direct and 4-4-2 until he gets the players to play the way he wants.
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Sky highlights (https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/competitions/championship/11639440/aston-villa-0-2-west-brom)
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OS post match interview https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial/status/1096825836261519363
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We really are shit aren't we ? One of the worst sides I have seen wearing the claret and blue - looks like we are potentially turning another manager into a nervous wreck
I wonder what the owners are thinking right now?
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Well the manager has got to be brave and do something different then. Simply putting by and large the same 11 out each week in the same manner won't see anything different happen. He needs to get a grip, get a fucking plan and start making something happen. Same players same formation week in week out wont wash. I know it's not his squad, but it's his team and he's got to make do with them at the moment, it's his job to make the best out of this bunch, that's what he's fucking paid for, not passing off responsibility for everything on to a previous manager which some do as an excuse.
He's been abysmal 90% of the time for 2 months now. GET A FUCKING GRIP SMITH.
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Good post Ads. Adversity brings the best out of your observations.
I personally have the problem now that I shall never see us back in the top flight. If Dean Smith started to get his mojo back tomorrow it will take him at least two seasons to make us look as good as Brentford. The reality is that he will stagger and stumble TSM1, TSM2, Lambert, Sherwood, Garde, Black, RDM and Bruce like until he gets the sack in the middle of next season and is replaced by Wagner.
The big difference between us being utter shit now and utter shit when we went down to Division 3 is that back then we KNEW we would return back to the very top. I suspect that self belief has gone.
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That was a bit shite really. No passion or desire and I think we may need to do yet another rebuild as if we did go up with our current lot (not very likely this year) I can't see us tearing up the prem. It doesn't feel like a positive but if we get a decent pre season and get rid of the dead wood, I do think we would be better off than we are now with loans and players who are just a collection of individuals and not a team. We can then start to actually find a system and stick to it rather than playing not to lose because at the moment, whatever smith is coaching the players seems to be beyond either their capabilities or fitness or intelligence but the basic skills seem to have vanished. It can't all be down to smith can it?
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It can't all be down to smith can it?
No-one at the club has a greater influence on how we play and how the players perform.
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It can't all be down to smith can it?
No-one at the club has a greater influence on how we play and how the players perform.
Than Steve Bruce.
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Fairly even through the first twenty then I noticed a drop off in effort it was as if they all said can we have a bit of a rest, not long after Albion scored and the game was over. I don't care who he plays in midfield as long as it isn't the two who have failed all season.
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It can't all be down to smith can it?
No-one at the club has a greater influence on how we play and how the players perform.
Than Steve Bruce.
Nope. Too easy. Smith is in charge, it's his responsibility now. You can't tell me that Smith absolutely could do no better than how we're performing and the results we're getting now. His points per game is almost identical to Bruce's. He's made no improvement at all.
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Eventually the mistakes started to totting up in the first half, Goalkeeper booting it into touch, a few stray passes and we go from looking the most likely to momentum changing towards them and then they score.
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Reme Garde got the sack for a run not dissimilar to the current one.
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As soon as Tammy missed that first chance, I could tell how the afternoon would pan out. And so did, I suspect, the team.
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It can't all be down to smith can it?
No-one at the club has a greater influence on how we play and how the players perform.
Than Steve Bruce.
Nope. Too easy. Smith is in charge, it's his responsibility now. You can't tell me that Smith absolutely could do no better than how we're performing and the results we're getting now. His points per game is almost identical to Bruce's. He's made no improvement at all.
The squad is shot and lost its 2 best players and the best defender played with injured , the question/criticism is should Smith have tried to play a different way based on the resources he has had?
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Reme Garde got the sack for a run not dissimilar to the current one.
He should have said he was a Villa fan.
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I think it's entirely justified to criticise if the players would be more coherent playing another way and you persist with a different one. Particularly if the inference is that loads of them will be dumped in the summer anyway.
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Maybe Reme was as shit at his job as Remi was? :P
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As soon as Tammy missed that first chance, I could tell how the afternoon would pan out. And so did, I suspect, the team.
Indeed. But unlike us, the players & the manager had the opportunity to do something different - and they did sweet FA. Again.
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I suppose the problem is if DS switched the way we play it nullifies bringing him in as the whole point was to improve the style of play. And yes I know, it's a goal so open even Hogan could bury that one.
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
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It can't all be down to smith can it?
No-one at the club has a greater influence on how we play and how the players perform.
Than Steve Bruce.
Nope. Too easy. Smith is in charge, it's his responsibility now. You can't tell me that Smith absolutely could do no better than how we're performing and the results we're getting now. His points per game is almost identical to Bruce's. He's made no improvement at all.
Our players seem incapable of the style smith wants us to play. Be it lack of fitness or even understanding. I think that next season would be a true test if smith is capable of getting his style of football at villa. The players are at best a collection of individuals rather than a team. There seems massive lack of passion at the moment and that is a worry that our most passionate players seem to be loans.
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
And here you are on cue to gloat, and you still get every stat wrong.
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When will the nightmare end?
West Brom were nothing special either.
Our midfield is non-existent.
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I think the case for us turning to shit once we lost Grealish and Axel is largely specious. Axel only played for half a season the first time we had him on loan and looked almost totally anonymous every time he played. He fared better this time round once he was put in his rightful position, but was still no game changer. Grealish too, missed half of last season and was hugely influential once he started to play - less so, I think this year up to the injury, mainly through the events of the summer and loss of a bit of form.Dean has to make changes to the formation, in game tactics and his choice of substitutions starting now, as if he only oversees two or three more wins until season's end, he's history.
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
And here you are on cue to gloat, and you still get every stat wrong.
Utterly pathetic.
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Sorry, auto correct. I am not saying Garde did not deserve the sack, I am saying that the the managerial incompetence at Villa goes back a long way. Besides, if all the post MON managers had had the same amount to spend as Garde was given we would not have been flirting with liquidation when we lost the play off final. Yes Garde, in results terms, was a shit manager but he was a cheap shit manager.
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he was treated badly Brian by a beyond egregious owner and management team. Ultimately every career ends in failure, especially at Aston Villa
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My question is , who and how is going to radically change our midfield.
It looks like we have strengthened the defense with Mings and Hause, the goalkeeper is still a problem and we are left with a choice of
Adomah Almo Whelan Hutton Holigram Kodija aEl ghazi cover 5 outfield positions and therein lies the problem.
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Is Hause capable of getting up and down the touchline and supporting the team going forwards though? We need pace, movement and mobility.
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Sorry, auto correct. I am not saying Garde did not deserve the sack, I am saying that the the managerial incompetence at Villa goes back a long way. Besides, if all the post MON managers had had the same amount to spend as Garde was given we would not have been flirting with liquidation when we lost the play off final. Yes Garde, in results terms, was a shit manager but he was a cheap shit manager.
He was well dressed cheap shit manager, I liked his suits and that draw to man city.......best I can say about him!
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Is Hause capable of getting up and down the touchline and supporting the team going forwards though? We need pace, movement and mobility.
From what I saw today, yes.
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Is Hause capable of getting up and down the touchline and supporting the team going forwards though? We need pace, movement and mobility.
Seemed to be doing that in the first half and linked up well with Green who looked lively but faded after they scored.
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How many games have our new owners witnessed in the flesh?
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Someone related to me has subsequently met RG. He does not have a bad word to say about Villa. He simply repeats what he said shortly before he left us. He arrived in a taxi and should have arrived in an ambulance.
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You know I just don't care about results at the moment. Whatever happens the squad will look almost totally different next season and we have to build towards that. Smith needs the time to build a side that can cope with the way he wants to play.
Funniest thing is, I have one text from a Tesco bag tonight, who is looking forward to reading this place tonight. Says all you need to know about Albion. Pulis spent his whole time there obsessed, they sing about if every week before they support their own side and don't seem to get that actually Albion are all a bit shrug to us.
Hope they go up, it will give them something else to bleat about.
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Has Smith taken us as far as he can?
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Has Smith taken us as far as he can?
I think it is too early to find out.
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Has Smith taken us as far as he can?
He’s taken us nowhere yet
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It says something when the opposition barely get in our half in the second half, and yet our centre halves touched the ball more than our forwards.
If that’s not the epitome of negative football, I don’t know what is.
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Thats because with the exception of SJM the midfield is non-existent, slow and incompetent.
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You know I just don't care about results at the moment. Whatever happens the squad will look almost totally different next season and we have to build towards that. Smith needs the time to build a side that can cope with the way he wants to play.
Funniest thing is, I have one text from a Tesco bag tonight, who is looking forward to reading this place tonight. Says all you need to know about Albion. Pulis spent his whole time there obsessed, they sing about if every week before they support their own side and don't seem to get that actually Albion are all a bit shrug to us.
Hope they go up, it will give them something else to bleat about.
Stripey mate of mine apologised for the win and genuinely embarrassed how easy it was. He decent fan however and not obsessed with villa . The Rest of the smethwick obsessive...let them have their moment as they are not that significant really and they won their cup final and enjoyed a day out. Some days you are the pigeon, some days the statue and we will come good again. What is important is we have stability and a sound foundation. We ain't going up but we ain't going down either. Just need to grind out rest of season, cull the dead heads in the squad and start afresh as this season hasn't really been ours as we are finishing it how we started it. It's shit but we have been worse
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Thats because with the exception of SJM the midfield is non-existent, slow and incompetent.
So here’s a radical thought try something different! Or try and coach players to do something different? If coaches can’t change things, or players can’t be coached err, what’s the point of coaches?
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5th season out of the top flight incoming.
The most seasons we've spent out of the top division is 7.
Having said that, if yo-yo clubs like Norwich, albion, and Middlesbrough can manage promotion, then so can we.
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4th, Stu.
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5th season out of the top flight incoming.
The most seasons we've spent out of the top division is 7.
Having said that, if yo-yo clubs like Norwich, albion, and Middlesbrough can manage promotion, then so can we.
Next season will be the 4th, the most is 8 in a row.
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You know I just don't care about results at the moment. Whatever happens the squad will look almost totally different next season and we have to build towards that. Smith needs the time to build a side that can cope with the way he wants to play.
Funniest thing is, I have one text from a Tesco bag tonight, who is looking forward to reading this place tonight. Says all you need to know about Albion. Pulis spent his whole time there obsessed, they sing about if every week before they support their own side and don't seem to get that actually Albion are all a bit shrug to us.
Hope they go up, it will give them something else to bleat about.
With you on this one.
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I think they will go up, they remind me of us under Bruce when we were on one of our decent runs, unfortunately we look like we did under Bruce on one of our bad runs.
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Thats because with the exception of SJM the midfield is non-existent, slow and incompetent.
So here’s a radical thought try something different! Or try and coach players to do something different? If coaches can’t change things, or players can’t be coached err, what’s the point of coaches?
Try what, though? We're slightly hamstrung by having to play to Association Football rules, which seems to be becoming harder and harder with each passing week for many of our so-called "players". They were never that good to start with, now most of them are old, so very, very old, and they're just going to get shitter and shitter as time goes by.
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Thought we played well for the first 30 minutes and had a gilt edged chance to go ahead, but once they scored it was game over. To be fair to Albion they press well and knew how to shut up shop, and without Jack we simply didn't have the creativity in the middle to break them down.
Haven't seen replays of the goals yet but thought Kalinic may have done better for the first (I stand to be corrected as I thought it had gone over the bar at the time), but another howler from horror show Hourihane gifted them a second.
Positives - Mings looks quality, Hause looked better, Mcginn (obvs), season ticket price freeze announcement
Negatives - Hourihane, the referee (obvs)
Meh - all the rest
We'll miss SJM in the next two, but at least he'll be back and rested for the Bloose game, when hopefully Jack will be back as well
Realistically that's season over. Roll on the summer clear out and Deano gets the chance to mould a squad which can play the way he wants them to
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Can someone tell me why all our free kicks are sideways or backwards, except around the oppositions 18 yard box, never forward?
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After witnessing that shambles it's safe to say we have many cowards in our team who are happy with the prestige and pay they take from our club. I want to give Smith time and let him build his own side,however if performances don't improve drastically can't see him being here in the summer.Fucking grim.
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Just got home, disappointed with the result.
Until they scored I thought we were the better team but the 2 quick goals seemed to suck the life out of us.
The second half we offered nothing, there was only the long range effort from SJM that I remember.
The ref was total shit and should have booked at least 3 albion players before he finally gave one of them a yellow card.
Had totally forgot that Barry played for them.
Hope Kalinic is OK. Was it a foul on him that caused the injury or a 'coming together' type incident?
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Just got home. The best I can say is appalling. Need a huge transformation and improvement.
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Second half it was eleven men behind the ball and us far too pedestrian in moving it. We could still be there now and we wouldn't have scored. Only Ramsay broke the lines in the 91st minute.
We need to stick with him. It's not good enough, not close to good enough, but a purge is coming. The fat kulaks who have been parasitic to the lifeblood of the club will meet their end this summer. Never has a club wasted so much in wages for such negligible output.
The squad won't be recognisable and I'm praying the football won't be either. It's going to require patience and perseverance and that's tough to ask for sometimes. Hopefully we see something a bit different to replenish the optimism.
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When the f**king hell is Jack coming back?
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May well be on the bench for Stoke.
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Grealish, Lansbury and Carroll back for the next game?
How long are Chester and Tuanzebe out for?
I've hated this season, it's been abysmal.
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May well be on the bench for Stoke.
I fucking hope so, even bringing him on for 15 minutes at the end will give everybody a much needed boost.
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I thought Mings and Hause did well enough, the rest were a shambles. Not convinced by our goalie and thought on first viewing that
he should have done better for both goals. The bitters'vocal support was sh-t for a winning team in a local derby. The ref was useless as was the lino on the trinity side. The stewards too were useless again in and around L9 sorting out a problem in the boxes above. VTID. UTV!
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May well be on the bench for Stoke.
I fucking hope so, even bringing him on for 15 minutes at the end will give everybody a much needed boost.
We could put the bench itself onto the pitch and it would have more mobility that Hourihane and Whelan or fucking Elmo.
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Absymal. Almost on a par with 030303. Smith isn't seeing what we're all seeing. Why isn't he changing things? Why are we worse than when he took over? Why do we persist with this constant goalie pass to centre half pass to full back with a suicide ball, he turns back, passes back to the goalie, passes to the other centre half, out to the other full back, back inside ad inifinitum! It's fucking shite. This really is the almost lowest I can recall in my lifetime, and is a total disgrace. We've just been fucked by that pile of shite from up the road, at home, and every single one of us knew it was coming.
Dean you're not winning any friends here son, and Hourihane should hang his head in shame for ambling off that pitch today, the fucking useless backpassing end of a bell.
Disgrace. Where's Suso today, ffs? What has JT brought to the table? Today and any match? What the fuck are we doing treading water in February?
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Grealish, Lansbury and Carroll back for the next game?
How long are Chester and Tuanzebe out for?
I've hated this season, it's been abysmal.
If that's right about the others two, at least it's options.
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I keep hoping Kalinic will get better, much as i did with Nyland. He doesn't. His distribution makes Johnstone's last year look world class.
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I keep hoping Kalinic will get better, much as i did with Nyland. He doesn't. His distribution makes Johnstone's last year look world class.
Steer is just as good. Another few million wasted.
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I didn't think we were that bad but not that great either. An early goal in the second half might have made them wobble but we didn't really look like getting it. Disappointing because I didn't think they were great either. As for the ref, it looked like it was his first game. He was awful.
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Nyland did, and I think Kalinic will be fine. Keepers are the least of my worries.
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I think Kalinic will be ok as well.
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what? He's part of the problem! A totally dysfunctional defence. Kalinic was woeful today, really awful.
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I didn't think we were that bad but not that great either. An early goal in the second half might have made them wobble but we didn't really look like getting it. Disappointing because I didn't think they were great either. As for the ref, it looked like it was his first game. He was awful.
Not that bad? Jesus.
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I don't think we were that bad either tbh, if it had ended 0-0 then nobody could really complain, we've been alot worse than today.
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I didn't think we were that bad but not that great either. An early goal in the second half might have made them wobble but we didn't really look like getting it. Disappointing because I didn't think they were great either. As for the ref, it looked like it was his first game. He was awful.
Not that bad? Jesus.
You missed out where I put we was not great either.
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what? He's part of the problem! A totally dysfunctional defence. Kalinic was woeful today, really awful.
He’s barely been here anytime and he played pretty well in mid week.
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what? He's part of the problem! A totally dysfunctional defence. Kalinic was woeful today, really awful.
How did Steer play? Oh you wouldn't know, you buggered off home and didn't get behind your team for the second half. Each to their own mind.
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what? He's part of the problem! A totally dysfunctional defence. Kalinic was woeful today, really awful.
How did Steer play? Oh you wouldn't know, you buggered off home and didn't get behind your team for the second half. Each to their own mind.
Steer had nothing to do. Game was up.
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They seemed to open us up very easily in the first half although it was fairly even, they scored and shut up shop and we really looked second best from that point, yes we are missing a Jack but no one else in this league have one either.
Pedestrian passing and a complete lack of being able to up the tempo. We look old, tired and jaded, like a decent boxer out of retirement for one last pay day but too knackered to do himself justice, taking a pummelling on the ropes.
I’m unimpressed by Smith. He doesn’t seem able to effect anything on the field during a game.
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M6 is absolutely fine. Sub 1:45 times now J18-19 is open season. J16-18 coming next month. An absolute dream after 3 years of shite.
Only got to wait till 2022 to get a clean run at the fucker. Leaving because of a motorway. #Snowflake
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M6 is absolutely fine. Sub 1:45 times now J18-19 is open season. J16-18 coming next month. An absolute dream after 3 years of shite.
Only got to wait till 2022 to get a clean run at the fucker. Leaving because of a motorway. #Snowflake
Meaning?
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Meaning the M6 is as good as it's been in 3 years and I'm overjoyed it's going to get better. If somebody left at half-time because of that, they're a fanny.
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Come on mate, no need for that like.
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What I've seen of Kalinic he is not good enough, but having seen the highlights, he was clearly affected by the knock he took with Livermore before he conceded the 2 goals, so I feel the criticism he has received today is a bit unfair.
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I don't know Ad's journey to and from but mine is just 31 miles using the M from unction 2 northbound and it's always a nightmare as it was today. But I made the effort and decided to leave after a truly appalling first half display. That was my prerogative, as it was anyone else's to stay. Please stop the name calling it's juvenile and unnecessary. And in my opinion Kalinic was awful before the incident.
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Sorry for getting you in the feels Frodo. Your choice to do what you like and mine to cock an eyebrow.
My journey north was a dream. I probably killed some evil polar bears with increased emissions around the Holmes Chapel region.
Honestly though, just lie next time and say you went because it was shit. Leaving because of a motorway.
My journey is about 90 odd miles, so 180 odd there and back. Every week. Since 2010 when I moved up here, right in time for us to turn to shit.
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Think of those that fly in for every single game, home and away.
Why is it okay for you to "cock an eyebrow" as you call it, be childish as I would call it?
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Oh yeah there's a bloke on here from Dorset that's up and down every week. I did Bournemouth to Newcastle for Lambert's first point in charge of us. That's quite the journey. Was even longer driving down to Taplow to swap my car, then back north. Having only in at 5am from the stag do I had been on.
There's a chap, Corky whose over from Belfast, mid-week and all.
I spend a lot of time, effort and money. Some spend even more of those than me. Frodo and fucking off because of a motorway and a heinous 31 mile journey makes me cock an eyebrow. Maybe living up here makes my lip a bit stiffer.
His prerogative of course. There's loads of reasons you might want to leave at half time; catch a flight, you have had enough, you're on a promise, you have work. Motorways? Fucking hell.
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Positives: that bloke at half time who won a season ticket for kicking the ball onto the disc, well done mate.
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Positives: that bloke at half time who won a season ticket for kicking the ball onto the disc, well done mate.
Poor bastard!
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Positives: that bloke at half time who won a season ticket for kicking the ball onto the disc, well done mate.
Hmm. Depends on our midfield next season.
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Positives: that bloke at half time who won a season ticket for kicking the ball onto the disc, well done mate.
The ones that missed got 5 year season tickets.
(https://i.imgur.com/ekQpV59.gif?noredirect)
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We have witnessed a decade of decay and people expect it to be turned around in 3 months. When Smith was selected the owners knew his football philosophy and that its the polar opposite of Bruce and the expensively assembled squad that had constructed to play Bruceball which at its core is Defensive football, keep it tight and hope a moment of genius nicks a game.
Trying to re-construct a squad in the January transfer window against a backdrop of FFP was never going to be the best time to do that but picking up players who have been injured or have no game time all season suggests these were loaned with the long term in mind (Carroll and Hause).
I hope Dean succeeds but the major criticism that should be leveled at him is that after Jacks injury he has just continued to play the same way with the same players that its clear are incapable of carrying out his instructions or just can't be bothered. He should either have changed the formation or dropped the dross for younger kids because they could not have been worse. These players know that the writing is on the wall for many of them, they will be hoping their Gravy train stops in Sheffield next.
UTV
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I doubt anyone expected everything to be turned around straight away, I doubt anyone expected us to still be very shit after 4 months either.
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It's not been 4 months of shit though. It's more like we interupt this Steve Bruce season to bring you some decent football.
Now back to your scheduled programming.
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It's not been 4 months of shit though. It's more like we interupt this Steve Bruce season to bring you some decent football.
Now back to your scheduled programming.
Must say that I liked the interruption a lot and am hoping for further such interruptions in the future.
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I listen via wm. even when we win they make it sound like we are shit. I wish I went home at half time...
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Just got back in. I thought we looked ok until the first goal and then we fell away quite quickly as their second goal looked deflected. New Street after wasn't much fun watching the away support waltz through like they'd won the pools. Season is done and we need to try and finish well. Two up front is a must as Abraham blows hot and cold and is isolated, I thought Hourihane and Whelan didnt know what to do going forward. Mings looks good, Hause did ok but we need better in most positions. And the ref was crap today. Absolute nothing to cheer.
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I listen via wm. even when we win they make it sound like we are shit
They'll make it sound like we are shit in 5 years time when we're 5 up at HT in the European Cup final.
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I listen via wm. even when we win they make it sound like we are shit
They'll make it sound like we are shit in 5 years time when we're 5 up at HT in the European Cup final.
"Conor Hourihane may have scored 4 and assisted the other, but the way he missed that penalty was very poor"
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Paul Franks at HT in that game, "typical Villa fans talking about the European Cup. Anyway, what's better Blues fans, winning the European Cup twice or the EFL Trophy for a third time?"
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It's not been 4 months of shit though. It's more like we interupt this Steve Bruce season to bring you some decent football.
Now back to your scheduled programming.
Very nearly 4 months of shit, & certainly feels like many months of shit
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I listen via wm. even when we win they make it sound like we are shit
They'll make it sound like we are shit in 5 years time when we're 5 up at HT in the European Cup final.
"Conor Hourihane may have scored 4 and assisted the other, but the way he missed that penalty was very poor"
Our friends in bbc wm did shut down a stripey in the phone in who was pretending to be villa and went on about European cup. Bless them
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He's not been here 4 months yet has he?
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He's not been here 4 months yet has he?
Yep, since 10th October.
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Paul Franks at HT in that game, "typical Villa fans talking about the European Cup. Anyway, what's better Blues fans, winning the European Cup twice or the EFL Trophy for a third time?"
Or finding Sherlock street?
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I listen via wm. even when we win they make it sound like we are shit
They'll make it sound like we are shit in 5 years time when we're 5 up at HT in the European Cup final.
"Conor Hourihane may have scored 4 and assisted the other, but the way he missed that penalty was very poor"
Our friends in bbc wm did shut down a stripey in the phone in who was pretending to be villa and went on about European cup. Bless them
My Albion mate at work knew the exact date that we won it. He's 22. I didn't have a fucking clue.
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I had the 26th in mind for some reason.
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I had the 26th in mind for some reason.
That was the night we lost at QPR.
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Positives: that bloke at half time who won a season ticket for kicking the ball onto the disc, well done mate.
Second prize was two season tickets......
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His first game was on the 20th.
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I had the 26th in mind for some reason.
10th of October he joined us, it’s now 16th February, so yes he has been here for 4 months. Whilst that is a very short time to call a manager, overall I don’t think it has been good. The last few games especially have been very poor. If you think he will turn it round, fine, that’s your opinion, I am very concerned, as we approach a fourth season in this division, that we have become a very average championship team, with a very average championship manager.
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I think it's been 2 decent months and 2 Brucey months as we've had the pick of Brucey's best midfield buys.
We'll come good with Jack and a few back. Not good enough for the play offs mind.
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It's not been 4 months of shit though. It's more like we interupt this Steve Bruce season to bring you some decent football.
Now back to your scheduled programming.
Very nearly 4 months of shit, & certainly feels like many months of shit
10 years of shit actually
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Thought I’d give it a bit of time before offering up my thoughts. I fucking hate the stripey filth so was probably advisable.
I’m still angry but the worrying thing is that the defeat today was in no way unexpected.
The questions that bother me are:
1) It’s going to take at least £100 million to sort out the shower currently masquerading as our squad. Will will be allowed to spend that amount?
2) Do I trust Dean Smith to spend it wisely?
The fact is I just don’t know the answers to either.
Being a Villa fan, on the whole, has never been the easiest but lately it’s horrible with no hope in sight.
The things I do know:
- We are right now a mid table Championship side at best with a rich football history. ( See also Forest)
- Not one of our current squad appears motivated in any way shape or form. They’ve given up with 3 months of the season left.
- We’re going to be stuck in the Championship for a long time unless some drastic squad changes happen in the Summer.
-I’ll be renewing my season ticket. I’m a Villa fan no matter how bad we get or how worse we become I’ll still go. No matter what division.
Up the Villa, always.
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It's really not going to take an awful lot of money at all.
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It was more a good 5 weeks, Bolton (Nov 2nd) to the last minute of the Bitters away(7th Dec), and since then it's been mainly crap with the odd decent spell in games.
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100 million and 10 years+ are two myths on here.
9 years ago we finished 6th in the prem, 8 years ago we finished 9th in the prem.
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I'm not sure throwing on Jacob Ramsey was too good an idea either. Don't get me wrong, he was fine and he didn't embarrass himself but I think maybe putting a kid like that on when we're 3-0 up in a game would be better rather than today. I didn't think it was the right time.
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It was more a good 5 weeks, Bolton (Nov 2nd) to the last minute of the Bitters away(7th Dec), and since then it's been mainly crap with the odd decent spell in games.
Second half at Swansea was decent. After a poor first half. Good 25 minutes against QPR. Good last 15 against Sheffield United. We need somebody whose good at stats to work it out. Stuart?
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It was more a good 5 weeks, Bolton (Nov 2nd) to the last minute of the Bitters away(7th Dec), and since then it's been mainly crap with the odd decent spell in games.
That period was to me actually the most enjoyable I've found it down here in our three seasons. So many entertaining games and in big games we actually looked to have a swagger that we never really had last season save for Wolves at home.
Think of going up to Boro and utterly demolishing them rather than just pinching a 1-0 and also should've done the same to WBA on their ground.
Shocked by how bad things have gone since. Guess the turning point was the way we lost to Leeds. I naively thought at the time we weren't really fighting for top 2 so could quickly write that one off but clearly not with how bad our form has been since.
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I'm not sure throwing on Jacob Ramsey was too good an idea either. Don't get me wrong, he was fine and he didn't embarrass himself but I think maybe putting a kid like that on when we're 3-0 up in a game would be better rather than today. I didn't think it was the right time.
So you never want him to make his debut then?
(https://i.imgur.com/ekQpV59.gif?noredirect)
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Those 5 weeks were ace.
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100 million and 10 years+ are two myths on here.
9 years ago we finished 6th in the prem, 8 years ago we finished 9th in the prem.
Point taken. O’Neill’s last season was 09-10. That was when the shit began. Although it wasn’t as shit as the last eight years.
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100 million and 10 years+ are two myths on here.
9 years ago we finished 6th in the prem, 8 years ago we finished 9th in the prem.
I'm still not sure how that happened. I remember the eve of our last two games, praying that we didn't go down!
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
And here you are on cue to gloat, and you still get every stat wrong.
OK 1 win in 13 (14 if you include the FA Cup)
Is that better. Hey because 13 is sooo much better, as it's only 13 in the league how wrong I was to question Smith he is our saviour
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How do you manage to get each of your posts even more cringeworthy than the last?
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Give it a rest.
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Trolls are best left starved.
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I Thought there wasn't that much between the teams today except they took two of their chances and we didn't. Defence played pretty well except for losing Robson-Kanu on the first. Hourihane's fuck up gifted them the second and it looked like the keeper could and should have stopped the first. Other than that they weren't particularly threatening or impressive and I don't think we were as bad as some seem to think.
Agreed our midfield is so poor at the moment, McGinn aside, that we aren't going to create much, let alone score many. Even then we hit the bar and Abraham continued his habit of missing a sitter every game, whilst not continuing his habit of burying one or two.
Smith is very limited in his choices but he does need to try something different to get more out of them.
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I Thought there wasn't that much between the teams today except they took two of their chances and we didn't. Defence played pretty well except for losing Robson-Kanu on the first. Hourihane's fuck up gifted them the second and it looked like the keeper could and should have stopped the first. Other than that they weren't particularly threatening or impressive and I don't think we were as bad as some seem to think.
Agreed our midfield is so poor at the moment, McGinn aside, that we aren't going to create much, let alone score many. Even then we hit the bar and Abraham continued his habit of missing a sitter every game, whilst not continuing his habit of burying one or two.
Smith is very limited in his choices but he does need to try something different to get more out of them.
Careful, that last bit sounds like you are questioning Smith. That is not allowed on this forum.
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Grow up.
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Grow up.
Prove I'm wrong
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Quite easy. There are plenty of posts questioning the appointment of Smith and his record so far.
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Quite easy. There are plenty of posts questioning the appointment of Smith and his record so far.
And every one of those is jumped on like a pack of wolves
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Quite easy. There are plenty of posts questioning the appointment of Smith and his record so far.
And every one of those is jumped on like a pack of wolves
Discussed and debated. As it should be. Nothing is deleted.
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So you therefore agree that it is allowed?
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What gets jumped on is you boring everybody shitless by pretending nobody is ever allowed to question the manager and seemingly loving it when we lose, as you don't like Smith.
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As I said to my son at the game what a difference with the first game against them only 2 months ago - significant that I think only 4 from that game started today and it showed as little cohesion going forward.
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Hopefully next season we'll be back challenging or at least building. And hopefully, Luke UK, we can do so in a proper Villa shirt with blue sleeves. The novelty of looking like Hearts wore off very quickly and to me is another wound in a sour season.
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What gets jumped on is you boring everybody shitless by oretneisnf nobody is ever allowed to question the manager and seemingly revealing in us losing.
You know what bores me shirtless Going to games and watching pathetic performance after pathetic performance, after the honeymoon under Smith it seems there is 2 results loss and draw. It's like wins don't exist.
The thing I find hilarious is that the Cult Of Smith members will always say he isn't beyond question then will go on to explain why he shouldn't be questioned.
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
And here you are on cue to gloat, and you still get every stat wrong.
OK 1 win in 13 (14 if you include the FA Cup)
Is that better. Hey because 13 is sooo much better, as it's only 13 in the league how wrong I was to question Smith he is our saviour
Still incorrect stats. It's a rare talent to be incapable of getting it right.
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What gets jumped on is you boring everybody shitless by oretneisnf nobody is ever allowed to question the manager and seemingly revealing in us losing.
You know what bores me shirtless Going to games and watching pathetic performance after pathetic performance, after the honeymoon under Smith it seems there is 2 results loss and draw. It's like wins don't exist.
The thing I find hilarious is that the Cult Of Smith members will always say he isn't beyond question then will go on to explain why he shouldn't be questioned.
Not a single person is saying any of that are they. They question things and then say why despite that they are prepared to be patient. Even for you that shouldn't be difficult to understand.
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What gets jumped on is you boring everybody shitless by oretneisnf nobody is ever allowed to question the manager and seemingly revealing in us losing.
You know what bores me shirtless Going to games and watching pathetic performance after pathetic performance, after the honeymoon under Smith it seems there is 2 results loss and draw. It's like wins don't exist.
The thing I find hilarious is that the Cult Of Smith members will always say he isn't beyond question then will go on to explain why he shouldn't be questioned.
Any minute now I'm going to find pressing the button that says 'Ban' hilarious.
'
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Smith's reign so far is a bit like that film "Awakenings". Woke us from our catatonic state and all seemed good and positive for a while. Only for the effect to prove very temporary and the patient to slip back into zombieland. I hope the doctor has a long term cure up his sleeve.
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I'm not sure throwing on Jacob Ramsey was too good an idea either. Don't get me wrong, he was fine and he didn't embarrass himself but I think maybe putting a kid like that on when we're 3-0 up in a game would be better rather than today. I didn't think it was the right time.
Regardless, he was better than than that ****** Hourihane.
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Lets be honest,while we have the likes of Hutton,Elamo ,Whelan and Hourihane playing we are going to struggle .In the first half it was obvious that they were playing on Hutton like all the other sides do.Their number 70,i think it was Murhpy should have scored at least once maybe twice .Kalinic i have to say i thought could have done better with both goals.Is that three goal less games on the bounce now, so much for Smith and his guaranteed to score remark,more like guaranteed to concede sadly
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The first goal was a cracking header that I doubt many would have saved and the second was a deflection. He had a few ropey moments but I don't think he was to blame for either goal.
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The most gutless display in a local derby I have ever seen.
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The most gutless display in a local derby I have ever seen.
I assume you were not at Villa v Blues in 1986. Blues played crap but were still worth their 3-0 win. One fan from the Trinity shouted "Spunk (Nigel Spink) at one end, Semen (David Seaman) at the other, and 20 wankers in between!"
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How do you manage to get each of your posts even more cringeworthy than the last?
A cunning stunt, to be sure...
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Hopefully next season we'll be back challenging or at least building. And hopefully, Luke UK, we can do so in a proper Villa shirt with blue sleeves. The novelty of looking like Hearts wore off very quickly and to me is another wound in a sour season.
It’s the least of our problems I know but I agree. This kit hasn’t grown on me one bit.
Looking forward to seeing the back of it and this season now. I just pray we don’t lose to Blose.
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Salifou > Hourihane
Whether he deserved the reception leaving the field or not, he is fucking shit. He didn't help himself by trotting off the pitch when we were losing 0-2 either. He gets assists because he takes nearly all of the free kicks and corners. From open play he's a passenger and the game passes him by.
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A very hard watch. But after Tuesday, I wasn't expecting much. Difficult to see where DS goes from here, for the rest of the season. Maybe Jack will turn things around. Can't wait for Stoke away next week??
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The defence looked stronger but with such a diabolical midfield in front of them its difficult to cope for ninety minutes. I want to know when the penny will drop that Hourihane is not a midfielder the pre-requisite is that you know how to tackle and win the ball he is an out and out receiver, boo him all you like but that's what you get by playing players out of position. When you look at the forward structure only McGinn shows the Hunger needed, without Grealish we do not have a player that can break the lines and that to me is the sole reason for the drop in results.
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1 win in 14, another awesome game Smith is really a hero isn't he
And here you are on cue to gloat, and you still get every stat wrong.
OK 1 win in 13 (14 if you include the FA Cup)
Is that better. Hey because 13 is sooo much better, as it's only 13 in the league how wrong I was to question Smith he is our saviour
Do us all a favour and grow up. Lots of frustration on here, work with people instead of being childish eh?
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The most gutless display in a local derby I have ever seen.
I assume you were not at Villa v Blues in 1986. Blues played crap but were still worth their 3-0 win. One fan from the Trinity shouted "Spunk (Nigel Spink) at one end, Semen (David Seaman) at the other, and 20 wankers in between!"
I was at the 4-0 defeat at The Sty in Autumn '68. Scarred me for life.
You people don't know how good you have it.
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Maybe Reme was as shit at his job as Remi was? :P
Nowhere near as shit as Remy was though.
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Maybe Reme was as shit at his job as Remi was? :P
Nowhere near as shit as Remy was though.
Who's Remy?
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Maybe Reme was as shit at his job as Remi was? :P
Nowhere near as shit as Remy was though.
Who's Remy?
Remy Martin has a lot to answer for in my experience. Still, I enjoyed it at the time.
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Livin' La Vida Loca was shite.
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Yeah that was ghastly, no doubt.
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That's pish Villa, by the way.
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Yes, it was mince minus.
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It's not been 4 months of shit though. It's more like we interupt this Steve Bruce season to bring you some decent football.
Now back to your scheduled programming.
Must say that I liked the interruption a lot and am hoping for further such interruptions in the future.
Hope is a lie.
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That second half was a painful watch. Reminded me of a boxer holding a smaller guy at arms length and laughing at him swinging wildly with absolutely no chance of landing a punch. Pathetic.
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A very good analogy Des.
The complete and utter lack of variation in our play is frightening.
Pretty much every single ‘attack’ consists of trying to get the ball to our wide players and then cross it, regardless of who or how many are in the box.
One of the things Smith commented on after his first few games was how we varied our balls into the box and tried to mix things up and always look to play it to a player.
Now it just completely aimless....literally.
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If I am allowed a bit of positivity I was pleased at the way the Villa fans applauded Barry & Johnstone. Very different to the time at the Hawthorns when on the 19th minute support for Petrov they booed a man fighting leukemia.
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If I am allowed a bit of positivity I was pleased at the way the Villa fans applauded Barry & Johnstone. Very different to the time at the Hawthorns when on the 19th minute support for Petrov they booed a man fighting leukemia.
I don't think they booed, just that most of them didn't join in with the applause.
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A very good analogy Des.
The complete and utter lack of variation in our play is frightening.
Pretty much every single ‘attack’ consists of trying to get the ball to our wide players and then cross it, regardless of who or how many are in the box.
One of the things Smith commented on after his first few games was how we varied our balls into the box and tried to mix things up and always look to play it to a player.
Now it just completely aimless....literally.
Spot on Andy. Elmo was the worst culprit yesterday. He'd get into a decent position, then almost look like he was closing his eyes before crossing. It was like a winger's version of pin the tail on the donkey.
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That should be easy at Villa Park with so many donkeys to choose from.
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If I am allowed a bit of positivity I was pleased at the way the Villa fans applauded Barry & Johnstone. Very different to the time at the Hawthorns when on the 19th minute support for Petrov they booed a man fighting leukemia.
I don't think they booed, just that most of them didn't join in with the applause.
I was in the stand next to them - there was loud booing.
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The most gutless display in a local derby I have ever seen.
I assume you were not at Villa v Blues in 1986. Blues played crap but were still worth their 3-0 win. One fan from the Trinity shouted "Spunk (Nigel Spink) at one end, Semen (David Seaman) at the other, and 20 wankers in between!"
I was at the 4-0 defeat at The Sty in Autumn '68. Scarred me for life.
You people don't know how good you have it.
Yeah I was there, that was hard to take, but the return fixture was brilliant, 1-0 win with the late Dave Simmons scoring the winner for us. 53,000 were there, I remember the atmosphere was electric.
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I’m at the stage now where I was in our relegation season. Dreading the next game.
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
Blindly supporting him is spot on, If any other manager had the current record of Smith there'd my huge uproar (again Bruce Out thread had appeared by now had that run wasn't as bad as this one) I bored of arguing it now because deep down everyone can see it now no matter how some will try and hide it. When people were screaming for Smith when Bruce was in charge i warned that managing Villa is massively different than managing Brentford. You have no idea how much I wanted to be proven wrong but at the moment it's not looking like i will be.
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
Blindly supporting him is spot on, If any other manager had the current record of Smith there'd my huge uproar (again Bruce Out thread had appeared by now had that run wasn't as bad as this one) I bored of arguing it now because deep down everyone can see it now no matter how some will try and hide it. When people were screaming for Smith when Bruce was in charge i warned that managing Villa is massively different than managing Brentford. You have no idea how much I wanted to be proven wrong but at the moment it's not looking like i will be.
If you're bored of arguing about it, then I presume this will be your last post on the matter? I doubt it though.
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
Blindly supporting him is spot on, If any other manager had the current record of Smith there'd my huge uproar (again Bruce Out thread had appeared by now had that run wasn't as bad as this one) I bored of arguing it now because deep down everyone can see it now no matter how some will try and hide it. When people were screaming for Smith when Bruce was in charge i warned that managing Villa is massively different than managing Brentford. You have no idea how much I wanted to be proven wrong but at the moment it's not looking like i will be.
If you're bored of arguing about it, then I presume this will be your last post on the matter? I doubt it though.
yeah i'm also Bored of watching shit performance after shit performance, I Presume yesterday will be the last? but i very much doubt it will be
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
Blindly supporting him is spot on, If any other manager had the current record of Smith there'd my huge uproar (again Bruce Out thread had appeared by now had that run wasn't as bad as this one) I bored of arguing it now because deep down everyone can see it now no matter how some will try and hide it. When people were screaming for Smith when Bruce was in charge i warned that managing Villa is massively different than managing Brentford. You have no idea how much I wanted to be proven wrong but at the moment it's not looking like i will be.
You’re a wanker. I’m sorry to be so blunt, but you insist on stereotyping a whole swathe of Villa fans just so you can go “I told you so” like some little sixth form bore.
Fuck off.
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It's like this Stuart. Just because you think something, doesn't mean that everyone else should think the same. Sorry about that but it's the way it is.
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It's a case of you get what you paid for, Hire a mid table Championship manager so is it any surprise that we are going to finish mid table in the championship. The highest a Dean Smith team has finished is mid table when we played HIS team on Wednesday they were 18th but people go on and on as if he created a squad that's fighting for the league title. I think people need to ignore the fact he's one of our own. Remember the Bruce Out thread had been created by this point of his reign and this is the worst we've played whilst i've supported Villa. Cue the it's not worse than our relegation year rubbish replies but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
So do you have any bright ideas about how we might address our protracted decline: or are you just gonna rant on about how shit you think DS is (and those you attest that are apparently blindly supporting him)?
Blindly supporting him is spot on, If any other manager had the current record of Smith there'd my huge uproar (again Bruce Out thread had appeared by now had that run wasn't as bad as this one) I bored of arguing it now because deep down everyone can see it now no matter how some will try and hide it. When people were screaming for Smith when Bruce was in charge i warned that managing Villa is massively different than managing Brentford. You have no idea how much I wanted to be proven wrong but at the moment it's not looking like i will be.
Perhaps folk have concluded - albeit painfully - that junking another manager after 5 minutes is not the answer to the plethora of rot in & around the club, which is clear for all to witness? I've no doubt you - like everybody else who supports this brilliant club - want to see us turn things round after several years of misery, but surely calling for yet another manager's head isn't the solution to the complexity of problems?
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"Just a quick observation for those that want Dean Smith to go. When Martin O'Neill was appointed, we went 9 games unbeaten when he started and then won 4 out of the next 22 games. I cannot recall the clamour for O'Neill to go because, back then, even though results were saying to the contrary, people wanted him to succeed and were happy to give him some time.
How times change, eh?"
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Just because there was a Bruce Out thread, doesn't mean there should be a Smith Out thread. Stuart is acting like a petulant 14 year old who can't get his own way. I think he's going to scream and scream until he is sick.
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Sorry you're so bored of arguing your point Stuart. Here's an idea: why don't you try reading what other people are actually saying, rather than repeatedly spouting immature bollocks about not being allowed to criticise the manager and the 'Cult of Smith'. Better still, do what Lee suggested at the end of his post. In fact, do it once for each time you've posted the same boring crap, and then a couple more times for luck.
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After not having posted since the game yesterday, I thought I'd better put in my pennyworth.
First half, we played reasonably well till the legs went at about 35 minutes. Then, we stopped pressing and gave them the space to attack, which they did.
Second half - after the first 10 minutes - was like a training match, but with no invention and no spark.
The lack of energy and passion suggests to me that there is a swathe of players whose contracts are due to expire or who have been told are going to be offloaded, and they are just not putting in the effort required to compete at this level or who are not prepared to play to the Smith script.
It's as bad as it's been but I do not subscribe to Stuart's assertion that it is all down to the manager. I think we're seeing the 'Houllier factor' where we have a manager wanting to do something very different and a bunch of players who don't fancy it.
The close-season should be fascinating as we offload the dead wood in bucketloads and re-shape the squad completely.
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Having got rid of owners, managers and players with no real discernible improvement in the football you can sort of see that this has to be a combinatorial thing of having all the right things in place at the same time - right owners, right manager and right players.
I think maybe having the right owners is the most important followed by the right manager/coaches and then the right players
I hope we have ticked the first two boxes - as bad as it seems I’m hoping that we just need a proper rebuild with the right young players this summer and a good pre-season
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Agreed Barry. It’s February but I have never looked forward to a pre season so much.
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Fairly adequate (compared to recent form) first 40 minutes, with Hause looking very decent IMHO followed by two avoidable goals.
Piss poor second half where the Baggies said 'come and have a go' and we fannied around doing the square root of fuck all in the main.
Kalinic 5 jury still out for me
Hutton 4 still as shit as ever
Mings 7 class above, finally have a CB that can bring the ball out like Axel
Elphick 5 he's not the answer and never will be
Hause 6 especially good in the first half, but when you relying on him to get forward and provide crosses you've lost the plot
Whelan 4 he's tidy, he's also very very limited and has no gears
Hourihane 3 woeful
McGinn 5 does what he does. hopefully the two match ban will let him recharge his batteries which has been long overdue
Elmo 4.5 i've always had a soft spot for him, but his time is up
Green 5 hoped the goal against Sheff Utd would boost his confidence, didn't really see many positives truth be told
Abraham 5 not a good day, still works hard but nah
Kodjia 5 another whose day is close to being over
Steer ? did he even touch the ball ?
Ramsey 5 few good touches, few bad touches. looked willing. audible groans around me when he lost the ball the first time. that'll help the lad
Smith 5 we all know this rabble are crap but i would have hoped he'd get them fighting for the shirt a bit. whether that's down to him not being able to motivate them (like a footballer should need motivating) or they just can't be fucking arsed i don't know. i suspect the latter
Crowd 5 in terms of numbers we can't be faulted, in terms of getting behind the team we can
The season is officially over. No idea what we can do now as the better kids are out on loan so not much hope of seeing any new blood etc. Wish the season could end right now and that we could start the massive clear out
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I think we are very easy to play against at the moment. This was summed up by the second half display yesterday.
Albion dropped into 2 banks of four, knowing we have not got the legs / skill to get round them or go through them.
Unfortunately I can't see any fit options at the moment.
I know we could go long, maybe with 2 upfront but I don't think this will ever be Dean Smith's style (and it still does not stop us getting overrun when we don't have the ball).
Grealish is the big miss, even if he does not play well, most opponents put a man on him all game. This freed up space for the likes of El Ghazi, especially if Grealish beats his marker. Effectively this kept our opponents 'honest'.
No one needs to be tight on Whelan/Hourihane because they are both too cautious when deep and have no pace whatsoever.
What really worries me is the abuse our players are getting. Hause was hammered by our support at Brentford on his first start and there were even a few groans at young Ramsey yesterday.
We are now going down the road of no parachute payments and a tight budget. The only thing that will stop us trying to build a good footballing team is the crowd pressure of expectation bringing a fear to the younger players (especially if they are not one of our own).
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It's like this Stuart. Just because you think something, doesn't mean that everyone else should think the same. Sorry about that but it's the way it is.
A bit rich...
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but remember we were losing / struggling against Premier League squads then we are now struggling again shit Championship squads.
yes we're struggling against championship squads with a championship squad. if we were struggling with a premiership squad i'd be more concerned
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It's like this Stuart. Just because you think something, doesn't mean that everyone else should think the same. Sorry about that but it's the way it is.
A bit rich...
I'm not sure what you are getting at. If people disagree with me, that's fine. I may disagree back and that's fine as well. Stuart is moaning that there isn't a Smith Out thread and has done with mostly every post.
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All about opinions and we've all got em'
what I want is to be patient for a change and give him the summer to re build.
That means giving him and his staff time for a longer term development.
I'm hoping the owners will give him time and I'm hoping supporters will to.
Smith has an opportunity to develop the side and unlike Brentford, not have to sell every year.
Will it work or not? I don't know but I'd like to see him given a chance.
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When in the cold light of day you look at our squad and take into account who is on loan to us it is both frightening and so fuckin annoying when you consider the amount of money we have flushed down the pan in the last 3 years. We definitely don't have the nucleus of a team we can start to rebuild around next season......so we basically start from scratch and that takes time not just one season. I could cry looking back at the way we have been so poorly managed ( from top to bottom). There is no quick fix and therefore I think we will have to accept us as being a championship side for sometime to come.
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When in the cold light of day you look at our squad and take into account who is on loan to us it is both frightening and so fuckin annoying when you consider the amount of money we have flushed down the pan in the last 3 years. We definitely don't have the nucleus of a team we can start to rebuild around next season......so we basically start from scratch and that takes time not just one season. I could cry looking back at the way we have been so poorly managed ( from top to bottom). There is no quick fix and therefore I think we will have to accept us as being a championship side for sometime to come.
Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
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Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
Leicester City are a small club that have spent the vast majority of their history in the lower leagues, 10 years out the top flight was normal for them. Aston Villa are a far bigger team, and should not be using shit clubs like Leicester as a bench mark.
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Leicester have won 3 trophies since we last won anything.
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Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
Leicester City are a small club that have spent the vast majority of their history in the lower leagues, 10 years out the top flight was normal for them. Aston Villa are a far bigger team, and should not be using shit clubs like Leicester as a bench mark.
Don't talk shite.
You evolve and adapt or you die out. Rome dominated the ancient world as everytime they came across a power with a good idea, regardless of how big or small their for was,
they adopted it.
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Don't talk shite.
You evolve and adapt or you die out. Rome dominated the ancient world as everytime they came across a power with a good idea, regardless of how big or small their for was,
they adopted it.
So you think we can learn from Leicester by copying them and spending a decade out of the top division do you? How many managers did they get through in that 10 years? They kept changing until it worked. They also changed out the manager that won them the Premier League as it was not working.
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You learn from what made them successful and what did not.
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You learn from what made them successful and what did not.
What made them successful was dumping a manager that got them promoted when it was not working, and appointing Ranieri. They then dumped him after he won them the league when it was not working and appointed another manager.
I agree, when a manager is clearly not doing well the answer is sometimes to replace them and try something different.
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Well, not quite, they dumped him after he got it working having stuck by him when it was not. You're attempt at being smart failed there with your ignorance of history.
Probably the same sort of ignorance that leads you to conclude "we're Aston Villa, we're fucking massive, we don't need to copy [clubs significantly better ran than we have been recently]"
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At this rate we'll get promoted when the DfS sale ends.
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You learn from what made them successful and what did not.
What made them successful was dumping a manager that got them promoted when it was not working, and appointing Ranieri. They then dumped him after he won them the league when it was not working and appointed another manager.
Who was sacked after less than eight months.
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You learn from what made them successful and what did not.
What made them successful was dumping a manager that got them promoted when it was not working, and appointing Ranieri. They then dumped him after he won them the league when it was not working and appointed another manager.
Who was sacked after less than eight months.
And there they still are, doing alright in the Premier League. As are Watford, who are on their 5th manager in 4 years. Obviously stability when things are working is a good thing. Sticking with a manager when things aren't, isn't such a good idea. Part of our trouble now is down to not potting Bruce in the summer. "Give him some time, he deserves until Christmas" was the oft-repeated sentiment on here. Not working out very well now, that idea.
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I don't think that was the sentiment, it was more that the club was potentially going bust and a managerial change seemed the last thing we needed. Then when the new owners came in, did they know what they were doing? Perhaps not which is why we got Purslow and he binned him in 6 weeks.
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I don't think that was the sentiment, it was more that the club was potentially going bust and a managerial change seemed the last thing we needed. Then when the new owners came in, did they know what they were doing? Perhaps not which is why we got Purslow and he binned him in 6 weeks.
It absolutely was the sentiment, no question.
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You learn from what made them successful and what did not.
What made them successful was dumping a manager that got them promoted when it was not working, and appointing Ranieri. They then dumped him after he won them the league when it was not working and appointed another manager.
Who was sacked after less than eight months.
And there they still are, doing alright in the Premier League. As are Watford, who are on their 5th manager in 4 years. Obviously stability when things are working is a good thing. Sticking with a manager when things aren't, isn't such a good idea. Part of our trouble now is down to not potting Bruce in the summer. "Give him some time, he deserves until Christmas" was the oft-repeated sentiment on here. Not working out very well now, that idea.
We weren’t happy with just doing all right in the premier league if I remember rightly.
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When in the cold light of day you look at our squad and take into account who is on loan to us it is both frightening and so fuckin annoying when you consider the amount of money we have flushed down the pan in the last 3 years. We definitely don't have the nucleus of a team we can start to rebuild around next season......so we basically start from scratch and that takes time not just one season. I could cry looking back at the way we have been so poorly managed ( from top to bottom). There is no quick fix and therefore I think we will have to accept us as being a championship side for sometime to come.
Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
Wolves. Neither time or patience. Just cunning and money in one pre season.
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Wolves going up had as much to do with a Champions League player in their central midfield.
Lots of ways to skin rabbits. But the Dingles, Leicester, Norwich, Huddersfield...all seemed a lot more mobile than us.
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Wolves going up had as much to do with a Champions League player in their central midfield.
Lots of ways to skin rabbits. But the Dingles, Leicester, Norwich, Huddersfield...all seemed a lot more mobile than us.
We had a champions league player in our defence last year but didn’t go up.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
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The 3-4-3 formation worked a treat for Wolves last season.
Their is no set formula really. We've tried buying our way out of this division with the supposed best attacking players at this level and it's been a complete failure.
After the play off final we really should've settled on trying to build a team organically even if that took two seasons but a fresh cash injection and SB couldn't resist loading us with more short term fixes in Bolasie and Abraham (done very well but obviously going to lose him in three months).
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Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
Leicester City are a small club that have spent the vast majority of their history in the lower leagues, 10 years out the top flight was normal for them. Aston Villa are a far bigger team, and should not be using shit clubs like Leicester as a bench mark.
Exactly. I think prior to being relegated a few seasons ago we’d only spent something like 13 seasons outside the top division in English football. The state of the club is a fuckin disgrace.
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Leicester City spent 10 years out of the top flight and that included one season in league one. 2 years after getting back to the premier League they won it. It takes time and patience to rebuild a football club. We're only just starting out on our journey.
Leicester City are a small club that have spent the vast majority of their history in the lower leagues, 10 years out the top flight was normal for them. Aston Villa are a far bigger team, and should not be using shit clubs like Leicester as a bench mark.
There’s no point in discussion if you just resort to calling Premier League clubs shit. That’s just offensive. I’d argue that only one club has been properly run recently.
And that’s not us.
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Ask anybody who has ever acted in any scouting capacity and the club they most admire and respect for finding talent is Leicester City.
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Wolves going up had as much to do with a Champions League player in their central midfield.
Lots of ways to skin rabbits. But the Dingles, Leicester, Norwich, Huddersfield...all seemed a lot more mobile than us.
All of those clubs, plus a few others who are now regulars in the Premier League all had the luxury of having supporters who would give them time because they were used to little better. Tell a Huddersfield supporter in 2014 that no matter how unlikely it'd seem for the next two years, they'd get promoted in the third and they'd have bitten your hand off. Give us the same deal in 2016 and we'd have told you to go and bollocks - because we're used to the Premier League whereas it's a magical place if you're Huddersfield.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
If he'd been there last season instead of a bloke who finds a team mate 6 times out of 10, we'd be in the Premier League right now.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
If he'd been there last season instead of a bloke who finds a team mate 6 times out of 10, we'd be in the Premier League right now.
Well he wasn’t and we aren’t. My point is that Wolves did more than sign one champions league midfielder. They changed a manager, a philosophy and three quarters of a team in one off season. And they used money and know how to do it. I would kill someone’s first born to be the in their position now. The irony is I think we would have the money but I’m not sure about the know how. I mean, how the hell did wolves become attractive to Nuno? It’s a rhetorical question by the way, so I don’t really need an explaination.
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Surely everyone knows by now why Nuno went there?
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Wolves - and Leeds for that matter - had to kiss a lot of frogs before they found their handsome prince. Why are they doing so well now? It's probably connected to the reason why the longest-running joke in English football is now the most successful.
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Surely everyone knows by now why Nuno went there?
Apparently he had a dream
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Ask anybody who has ever acted in any scouting capacity and the club they most admire and respect for finding talent is Leicester City.
Southampton have to be the best in recent years, surely?
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Ask anybody who has ever acted in any scouting capacity and the club they most admire and respect for finding talent is Leicester City.
Southampton have to be the best in recent years, surely?
Liverpool seem to think so.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
If he'd been there last season instead of a bloke who finds a team mate 6 times out of 10, we'd be in the Premier League right now.
Well he wasn’t and we aren’t. My point is that Wolves did more than sign one champions league midfielder. They changed a manager, a philosophy and three quarters of a team in one off season.
Aswell as a Champions League midfielder, they also got a Champions League manager, defender and winger. They also did this during the summer.
If Nuno had come in half way through the previous season (as Smith has at Villa) he would of been coaching Jack Price, Dave Edwards, Dominic Iorfa, Noaha Dicko, Danny Batth, Kourtney Hause, Joe Mason instead. Would they have been patient with him trying to get his style across with players nowhere near the level he coached at Porto or now?
Thankfully for them he came in the Summer and we all know what followed. Frustratingly for us we were unable to make a change in the summer and had to do it mid season (again)
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
If he'd been there last season instead of a bloke who finds a team mate 6 times out of 10, we'd be in the Premier League right now.
Well he wasn’t and we aren’t. My point is that Wolves did more than sign one champions league midfielder. They changed a manager, a philosophy and three quarters of a team in one off season.
Aswell as a Champions League midfielder, they also got a Champions League manager, defender and winger. They also did this during the summer.
If Nuno had come in half way through the previous season (as Smith has at Villa) he would of been coaching Jack Price, Dave Edwards, Dominic Iorfa, Noaha Dicko, Danny Batth, Kourtney Hause, Joe Mason instead. Would they have been patient with him trying to get his style across with players nowhere near the level he coached at Porto or now?
Thankfully for them he came in the Summer and we all know what followed. Frustratingly for us we were unable to make a change in the summer and had to do it mid season (again)
And we still gave them a spanking at Villa Park. Too bad we couldn’t follow it up.
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We had Jedinak at the bottom of our midfield. They had a 22 year old Champions League player.
Great. That’s all we need to do then. Put a Champions League player in our midfield and sorted.
If he'd been there last season instead of a bloke who finds a team mate 6 times out of 10, we'd be in the Premier League right now.
Well he wasn’t and we aren’t. My point is that Wolves did more than sign one champions league midfielder. They changed a manager, a philosophy and three quarters of a team in one off season.
Aswell as a Champions League midfielder, they also got a Champions League manager, defender and winger. They also did this during the summer.
If Nuno had come in half way through the previous season (as Smith has at Villa) he would of been coaching Jack Price, Dave Edwards, Dominic Iorfa, Noaha Dicko, Danny Batth, Kourtney Hause, Joe Mason instead. Would they have been patient with him trying to get his style across with players nowhere near the level he coached at Porto or now?
Thankfully for them he came in the Summer and we all know what followed. Frustratingly for us we were unable to make a change in the summer and had to do it mid season (again)
He also inherited likes of Conor Coady and Matt Doherty. Coady was just another average defensively midfielder, Nuno moved him into a back 3 as the ball playing defender and he's been a revelation. Doherty was nothing special but is also crucial to Wolves system and been one of best wide players in premier league this season.
Helder Costa and Ivan Cavaliero were actually at Wolves in 16/17. Have a guess which Scottish manager had Wolves losing six in a row even with those players in the ranks...
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
I thought it looped well over him and he stood no chance.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
I thought it looped well over him and he stood no chance.
I haven't seen any footage of yesterday (I don't want to), but the times I've seen Kalinic so far I've thought that it's a good job he's tall because he doesn't seem able to jump.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
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It was a brilliant header. I refuse to watch any replays though, so I stand to be corrected.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
The people around me all thought the cross were straight in but it was a header that changed the ball trajectory late.
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Peter Crouch could have been stood on his shoulders and it would still have gone in.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
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Header was speculative and Kalinic made zero attempt at jumping or backpeddling
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If Tammy had done his job then we’d have been 1-0 up at the time, but the cross was whipped in and Kalinic was caught flat footed because it was unexpected. There was no time to back peddle but he did attempt to jump and tip it over. It was unlucky to end up being such a well placed header and you can’t really blame the keeper.
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Keeper is suspect and it’s a very dark day when Robson-Kanu scores against you and even worse if he manages to score with a header.
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Helder Costa and Ivan Cavaliero were actually at Wolves in 16/17. Have a guess which Scottish manager had Wolves losing six in a row even with those players in the ranks...
Yeah but had the good sense to bin him early rather than wait several years to give him time. Every club makes bad appointments, some look fine on paper but just don't work out, some are just baffling. But well run clubs do not hang about giving too much tie when it becomes obvious a manager is not going to work.
Our biggest mistake in recent years has not been a lack of patience, it has been sticking with duds too long and then changing them part way through the season not giving the replacement enough time to do transfer business.
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Header was speculative and Kalinic made zero attempt at jumping or backpeddling
The Blackburn keeper, David Raya , saved a a very similar one yesterday. He looks much more agile and is only 23.
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Helder Costa and Ivan Cavaliero were actually at Wolves in 16/17. Have a guess which Scottish manager had Wolves losing six in a row even with those players in the ranks...
Yeah but had the good sense to bin him early rather than wait several years to give him time. Every club makes bad appointments, some look fine on paper but just don't work out, some are just baffling. But well run clubs do not hang about giving too much tie when it becomes obvious a manager is not going to work.
Our biggest mistake in recent years has not been a lack of patience, it has been sticking with duds too long and then changing them part way through the season not giving the replacement enough time to do transfer business.
I don’t see how you can make that distinction when everything we have tried has failed in recent years. I think this time we are doing things differently due to the structure put in place by the new owners. This is their first managerial appointment and they are naturally going to give him time to deliver on their vision.
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The proof of the pudding will be in the summer. If it looks and feels like more of the same then it's exactly that. We have to be doing something different.
The scouting has been abysmal for years.
The youth coming through hasn't been either good enough or managed well.
The contracts have been ridiculous.
We've taken far too many risks on players with poor injury records.
The training has been weak. We look too formulaic going forwards and unorganised and unconcentrated without the ball.
The transfers have been bland, painting by numbers dirge, throwing huge amounts of money without thought of how players fit in to systems.
I want to see us working hard, we've used money instead of hard work for years now. We need brains. We've had plenty come in and say 'we are implementing this and that'' but there's been no change.
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I don’t see how you can make that distinction when everything we have tried has failed in recent years. I think this time we are doing things differently due to the structure put in place by the new owners. This is their first managerial appointment and they are naturally going to give him time to deliver on their vision.
Look lets be clear, I want things to turn around and was pleased when we appointed Smith. However if this form does not pick up before the end of the season then he should not get the start of next season. The form is abject and there are no signs of the football improving, no sign of the coaching making a difference, no sign of any tactical acumen. The transfer business also looks questionable although under this new structure we also have to point at 'Suso' for that.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
I agree. He just seemed to jump a bit from his standing position. It was a bit of a freak header though, most times they just go over the bar from that position.
Not sure why he's being blamed for second as that took massive deflection.
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I don’t see how you can make that distinction when everything we have tried has failed in recent years. I think this time we are doing things differently due to the structure put in place by the new owners. This is their first managerial appointment and they are naturally going to give him time to deliver on their vision.
We really don't know anything much about the new owners though. I do believe Edens has been quite ruthless at his NBA team though, sacking a relatively successful manager who he was also friends with. We're not going to get into the play offs this season, but if there's at least an upturn in fortunes, then I think Smith will be given the chance to have a good go at it next season. If things continue as they are though, with no wins in the next four or five games, then I think he'll be potted.
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He looks a bit of a broken man already.
He does need to be given time to sort things out, but if he doesn't sort things out, he should be sacked.
He certainly shouldn't be given as long as the bad managers of our past were given, and if there are better candidates out there, they should be brought in instead.
I think, deep down, he'll be ok. I hope so anyway.
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I don’t see how you can make that distinction when everything we have tried has failed in recent years. I think this time we are doing things differently due to the structure put in place by the new owners. This is their first managerial appointment and they are naturally going to give him time to deliver on their vision.
Look lets be clear, I want things to turn around and was pleased when we appointed Smith. However if this form does not pick up before the end of the season then he should not get the start of next season. The form is abject and there are no signs of the football improving, no sign of the coaching making a difference, no sign of any tactical acumen. The transfer business also looks questionable although under this new structure we also have to point at 'Suso' for that.
Can't argue about our form. The change since the Baggies away is baffling and shocking. However I don't agree about the transfer window. It was nothing but a trolley dash to try to shore up the shambles of a defence left by Steve Bruce. They have not had a proper chance to overhaul the squad yet so I think people should give Smith & co the opportunity to do so before being too critical.
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The transfer window was by and large shit. The biggest problem, midfield, we got a guy to keep our physios busy.
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The transfer window was by and large shit. The biggest problem, midfield, we got a guy to keep our physios busy.
??
Biggest problem by far was left side of defence and that was sorted!!
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Midfield is everything. It makes a side function. It assists and facilitates the attack while bolstering the defensive line. When was the last time we had a midfield unit to be proud of? Defensive duties become markedly easier with decent screening. Scott Hogan was made to look like Paolo Rossi thanks to decent service. The snake, Miliner and Gaz Baz are still like demi gods. High time we recognised the real issue we have. Jack and John is a start but we need a couple more.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
I agree. He just seemed to jump a bit from his standing position. It was a bit of a freak header though, most times they just go over the bar from that position.
Not sure why he's being blamed for second as that took massive deflection.
Beaten at the near post for the first, a decent keeper keeps that out.
His kicking is shit aswell. Not convinced.
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Personally I think the keeper has let some soft goals in, a lot of money for a not very good keeper (at the moment)
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
I agree. He just seemed to jump a bit from his standing position. It was a bit of a freak header though, most times they just go over the bar from that position.
Not sure why he's being blamed for second as that took massive deflection.
Beaten at the near post for the first, a decent keeper keeps that out.
His kicking is shit aswell. Not convinced.
Beaten at the near post? No he wasn't. The header was way out of range for him to come for. If anything the defender could have done better. The ball looped wildly in the air and dropped at the far post. I'm not convinced by him myself but for that goal i dont blame him. It's ridiculous to blame him for that one.
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It was terrible goalkeeping for the first goal, positioning was awful. He's made some good saves but hasn't looked commanding at all. He's been a slight upgrade on Nyland for me.
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I thought Nyland was looking better before his injury.
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It was terrible goalkeeping for the first goal, positioning was awful. He's made some good saves but hasn't looked commanding at all. He's been a slight upgrade on Nyland for me.
I disagree but its all about opinions. And you know what they say about opinions.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
I agree. He just seemed to jump a bit from his standing position. It was a bit of a freak header though, most times they just go over the bar from that position.
Not sure why he's being blamed for second as that took massive deflection.
Beaten at the near post for the first, a decent keeper keeps that out.
His kicking is shit aswell. Not convinced.
Beaten at the near post? No he wasn't. The header was way out of range for him to come for. If anything the defender could have done better. The ball looped wildly in the air and dropped at the far post. I'm not convinced by him myself but for that goal i dont blame him. It's ridiculous to blame him for that one.
You might want to review the tape.
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The highlights do not show how he stepped forward initially before the ball looped over his head. He misjudged the flight of the ball. Even still, he's had a fair few questionable goals past him since he's been here. I can't imagine there's too many goalies in this league that cost £7m.
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Our keeper looked crap for the first goal. He really doesn't seem the most agile.
Bit harsh. I don't think any keeper could of saved that. The angle the ball took when it looped into the net made it almost impossible to save.
seemed to me that he had enough time to sort his feet out, get back and tip it over. The header was struck from a decent distance out.
I agree. He just seemed to jump a bit from his standing position. It was a bit of a freak header though, most times they just go over the bar from that position.
Not sure why he's being blamed for second as that took massive deflection.
Beaten at the near post for the first, a decent keeper keeps that out.
His kicking is shit aswell. Not convinced.
Beaten at the near post? No he wasn't. The header was way out of range for him to come for. If anything the defender could have done better. The ball looped wildly in the air and dropped at the far post. I'm not convinced by him myself but for that goal i dont blame him. It's ridiculous to blame him for that one.
You might want to review the tape.
I have several times. At full speed. The only place he could have been standing to make a successful save would have been on his line right where the ball dropped in off the cross bar. If the ball went in anywhere else he would have gor pelters from people like yourself along the lines of " why the fuck was he stood on his line towards the far post and leaving the near post completely unprotected"
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It's ancient history now but quite why it's acceptable from the mods on here to allow posters to label others 'wankers' on this thread and nothing is done is beyond old me. Some foul abuse just allowed to ride because, I assume, they're 'mates'.