Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: PeterWithesShin on August 19, 2017, 05:01:56 PM
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I reckon the kid deserves his own thread, played well today.
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Looks promising, from the little I saw. The crossbar shot and the one on one in the second half, which was difficult to score from in fairness.
Start the next game.
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I didn't see much of the game as the AVTV stream wasn't playing fair, but from what I did see, it was a great decision to play him. Certainly earned another game.
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He made the ball stick up front today which is something we've been missing for a long time...strong player, holds the ball up well and wins freekicks which relieves pressure on the defence and allows the midfield to come out more. Well played that lad.
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Superb today. As I mentioned on the Match thread, he reminds me of Dalian Atkinson; strong, powerful, great movement, holds the ball up (better than DA) but it's his running at defences that really does it. Potential legend in the making. Certainly in the future it will be easy to answer the question for 'Best Home Debut'.
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Superb today. As I mentioned on the Match thread, he reminds me of Dalian Atkinson; strong, powerful, great movement, holds the ball up (better than DA) but it's his running at defences that really does it. Potential legend in the making. Certainly in the future it will be easy to answer the question for 'Best Home Debut'.
Which will still be Didier Six ;)
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Oh forgot to say...he deserved a goal today for all his good work.
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He might save us a few quid in the transfer market.
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Where have you been these last 20 years.
Looked mean, like he'd been revved up on steak and amphetamines.
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The new Beast.
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Saw him twice now and both appearances have coincided with us playing our best football under Bruce, he has to start for the next few games.
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Oh forgot to say...he deserved a goal today for all his good work.
Green had to wait for his moment and he will too. Nothing good comes easy!
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He made the ball stick up front today which is something we've been missing for a long time...strong player, holds the ball up well and wins free-kicks which relieves pressure on the defence and allows the midfield to come out more. Well played that lad.
Bang on.
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Pace, strength, intelligence. Absolutely brilliant today, and allowed Conor to do what he does best.
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One game against a really, really bad Norwich side. I'll wait after he's played a good season to pass judgement, seen far too many Gardeners and Moores to get carried away yet.
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Kept moving and wanting all you can ask for
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Young and energetic. Bastard.
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I really thought we were making a physical presence up top - presumably why we're after Gallagher
Glad to hear he did so well and sounds like he definitely deserved a goal
Got to start v Bristol
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One game against a really, really bad Norwich side. I'll wait after he's played a good season to pass judgement, seen far too many Gardeners and Moores to get carried away yet.
Well let's hope this is a talent we nurture and grow, because there is obviously real talent there and I liked the fact that he was not intimidated physically.
It was a great performance and so refreshing to see a young Villa player do that.
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He did the same against Brighton last season. Holds the ball up, lays it off and has a turn of pace/strength. Despite hourehans three goals Davis was my man of the match.
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One game against a really, really bad Norwich side. I'll wait after he's played a good season to pass judgement, seen far too many Gardeners and Moores to get carried away yet.
Well let's hope this is a talent we nurture and grow, because there is obviously real talent there and I liked the fact that he was not intimidated physically.
It was a great performance and so refreshing to see a young Villa player do that.
Agree he was awesome on his full debut, involved in virtually everything on the highlights and gutted he never topped it off with a goal. But I'm still waiting on something similar from Grealish.
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So with the talk of us in for Sam Gallacher the dilema is do we loan someone elses talent and spend more money?
Or do we put our own first and save ££ at the risk though that he can't keep it up?
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Strong and confident performance. In fact he was the difference in the whole team performance. His hold up play brought the midfield into the game and also a target to aim for. A pity he didn't get the goal he deserved but I doubt won't be long coming.
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So with the talk of us in for Sam Gallacher the dilema is do we loan someone elses talent and spend more money?
Or do we put our own first and save ££ at the risk though that he can't keep it up?
We should still go in for Gallagher. Gabby is shite and McCormack is a write off, so we need another option in addition to Kodjia, Hogan and Davis.
I'd go for the big man little man combo, with either Davis/Gallagher playing with Kodjia/Hogan...I can see any combination of those pairings working well and should create a consistent style of play.
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One game against a really, really bad Norwich side. I'll wait after he's played a good season to pass judgement, seen far too many Gardeners and Moores to get carried away yet.
They may have been poor, but he's just demolished players vastly more experienced than him. He was so much stronger than his opponent I thought Norwich had signed Ciaran Clark for a while.
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Just seen the highlights. Wow.
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My first notion of him was lacking awareness, as a poor back pass happened, he only looked, and then saw that it was a chance, and started running to late.
Then after that, he showed that he is the real deal, and I was surprised how he made his own space, worked hard, kept the ball, and had some great passing.
For me, he was the MOTM based on being biggest positive. Strong as hell and if they didn't have any respect at start, Norwich surely were shitting them selves after 15 minutes.
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Davies is the new ciaran Clarke
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One game against a really, really bad Norwich side. I'll wait after he's played a good season to pass judgement, seen far too many Gardeners and Moores to get carried away yet.
Thanks for the input, Pollyanna.
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Hold up play was superb.
Well played young man!!
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Brilliant today. Needs to fill out a little and he has a lot of potential
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One of the best full debuts I've seen from one of our own - not fazed in the slightest, even after missing his early chance. We looked a completely different side when the ball was sticking up front. Some of the passing and movement in the first half was really excellent and Davis was at the heart of it.
Glad Bruce took him off in the last few minutes. He deserved his own standing ovation.
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I can see the Dalian Atkinson comparison. Looks a real threat. He doesn't look like he would be fast but every time the ball was played over the top, he scared the life out of their defence. Scored 4 and hit the bar twice, much better threat going forward. Ironic that we start looking more of a threat at the same time our defence look clueless. If we can get it right at both ends of the pitch we might finally start getting somewhere.
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It wasn't his home debut, he played against Brighton at the end of last season and I think in a few games before that.
Held the ball up superbly today and bullied their defenders. Very unlucky not to score.
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Keep it up, keep it up, legend status awaits 😀
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Brilliant today.
Fixed for positivity
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Impressive. Well done Keinan. Give the lad some games. We're in the league to do it. Gabby's time has gone. So if we've got aspirations of playing Premier League football then giving Green, Davis, RHM plenty of experience will hold them in good stead. He's definitely earned a start in the next game. He also offers a good mix of presence and pace up front. His touch was good too. He was unlucky not to score, but he was working the keeper, so that's a positive too.
Keep it up lad!
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We have a big problem with this player!
Keanan Davies will fuck up all ways how his name is spelt(on purpose)
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He was the best player on the pitch by a country mile today. A superb performance.
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He was the best player on the pitch by a country mile today. A superb performance.
As you have any clue? You slept through the game
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Does this mean we can send Gabby on his way?
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He was the best player on the pitch by a country mile today. A superb performance.
As you have any clue? You slept through the game
I do normally but not today. We actually tried to attack!
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Can't praise him enough. Superb at holding the ball and giving their defence grief. The fact that the ref gave them a few free kicks when he was mixing it with defenders was even better as they knew they were in a game. Needs to improve a few things including anticipation but I think we have a gem.
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He was the best player on the pitch by a country mile today. A superb performance.
As you have any clue? You slept through the game
Just having a pop mate ;) - I know - And he absolutely was our MOTM - :) we will celebrate him soon at VP (need my trip there soon)
I do normally but not today. We actually tried to attack!
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It wasn't his home debut, he played against Brighton at the end of last season and I think in a few games before that.
Held the ball up superbly today and bullied their defenders. Very unlucky not to score.
Pretty sure it was his full debut
He was a sub v Brighton
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Just a bit of a shame he's not a product of our academy. Only joined us last year from Biggleswade Town.
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How old is he?
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Brilliant today.
Fixed for positivity
You ok? I'm very comfortable with it my Villa position - positive yet conservative. Sorry but not everything is great
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It wasn't his home debut, he played against Brighton at the end of last season and I think in a few games before that.
Held the ball up superbly today and bullied their defenders. Very unlucky not to score.
Pretty sure it was his full debut
He was a sub v Brighton
It was his first start for us, he's made something like 6 previous league appearances, and 2 in cups, all from the bench. His first appearance at VP was against Preston.
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How old is he?
Turned 19 in Feb.
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I thought he was excellent. The best full debut i've seen by a young un for a while.
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How old is he?
Turned 19 in Feb.
thank you.
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Brilliant today. Needs to fill out a little and he has a lot of potential
Don't know about that TV. The two Norwich CBs were huge, yet Davis manhandled them at times today. Strong, mobile and a good touch. Very impressive.
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Brilliant today.
Fixed for positivity
You ok? I'm very comfortable with it my Villa position - positive yet conservative. Sorry but not everything is great
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Superb all round performance, he did more today for us than Gabby's done in the last 5 seasons.
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Brilliant today. Needs to fill out a little and he has a lot of potential
Don't know about that TV. The two Norwich CBs were huge, yet Davis manhandled them at times today. Strong, mobile and a good touch. Very impressive.
He's 19 mate. Lots of potential. Look at Lukaku. Today an absolute beast. Needs to now work on his game and improve.
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Superb today. As I mentioned on the Match thread, he reminds me of Dalian Atkinson; strong, powerful, great movement, holds the ball up (better than DA) but it's his running at defences that really does it. Potential legend in the making. Certainly in the future it will be easy to answer the question for 'Best Home Debut'.
Reminded me of a young Benteke, actually.
Potentially very good. Why has our manager not played him before?!
One of the hidden benefits of a player like that is that midfielders suddenly get more space to work with (I'm sure Hourihane would agree today!).
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The new Beast.
I asked my lad how he played today, he said he reminded him of Benteke.
If he turns out half as good as the original Beast he'd have saved us £15M
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Brilliant today. Needs to fill out a little and he has a lot of potential
Don't know about that TV. The two Norwich CBs were huge, yet Davis manhandled them at times today. Strong, mobile and a good touch. Very impressive.
He's 19 mate. Lots of potential. Look at Lukaku. Today an absolute beast. Needs to now work on his game and improve.
Yep, definitely agree. I've seen him live a couple of times, but he looked a big unit today and as I said, he outmuscled two physically imposing CBs today. It was his hold up play that was most impressive. He got out of some tight spots at times with good feet and control.
Early stuff yet and as you say he will need to work hard going forward, but he was very impressive today. Easily the best forward performance for us since Benteke left.
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I love his confidence and belief.
He looks like he has 50 starts under his belt.
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Just a bit of a shame he's not a product of our academy. Only joined us last year from Biggleswade Town.
Wasn't he on the bench for a few of our final prem games?
Said it in the match thread but just lovely to see a player coming into a game and seize the opportunity. He's certainly shown he can be a genuine option in the squad this year.
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I didn't see the match and so have only seen the highlights, but he looked the real deal. Powerful, strong and direct, but with skill to match. Did more in one match than Agbonlahor and Hogan have done in dozens.
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I thought he was excellent. The best full debut i've seen by a young un for a while.
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As I said above, I didn't see the game, but from the highlights I'd agree. He looks like the complete package. Impressive, and not in a "has a few tricks, but is a flash in the pan" kind of way.
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I didn't see the match and so have only seen the highlights, but he looked the real deal. Powerful, strong and direct, but with skill to match. Did more in one match than Agbonlahor and Hogan have done in dozens.
It wasn't just what he did himself, it was what his performance allowed others to do as well. A midfielder scored a hat-trick and a number of other players had good chances today.
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Just don't want to heap too much praise on him. He looks the part, the only part of his game that certainly can be improved was his lack of awareness (or surprise) of possible chances that arise. He chasing down of the ball though was excellent.
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He looks to have bulked up since Brighton.
Every time we worked the ball into the channel my anticipation, having been conditioned over many months and years, was for the ball to come straight back. Not with Velcro Davis.
Strong and intelligent, he got into positions to score and really enabled the midfield to add something significant attask wise.
Won everything in the air, mobile although not lacking pace, he just looks downright good. I liked what I saw against Brighton, I am heartened to see him come on further.
Very easy to get carried away, but this lad needs to start at Bristol and he needs to be the man Kodjia partners.
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Never watched the game but watched the highlights and he looked the bollocks would be interesting to see if he could play with kodjia. Look too similar too me but what do I know
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I've seen him a few times for the yoof on AVTV and he looked good but i didnt think he was quite good enough for the first team. He was immense today, for his age anyway.
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday - but he has to be give the chance. Looks quite quick which is a great combo
They did look appalling at the back though so will try not to get carried away
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday -
I think he will, actually; but whether the manager will play again rather than bringing back Hogan as a replacement remains to be seen.
He'd be mad not to play Davis.
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Just a bit of a shame he's not a product of our academy. Only joined us last year from Biggleswade Town.
I wouldn't be too upset if we have a scouting network in place now that can turn up potential gems like him and plug him into the academy/u-23 set-up and bring them through that route.
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The new Beast.
I asked my lad how he played today, he said he reminded him of Benteke.
If he turns out half as good as the original Beast he'd have saved us £15M
And the rest. £15m gets you Chris Wood these days.
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday -
I think he will, actually; but whether the manager will play again rather than bringing back Hogan as a replacement remains to be seen.
He'd be mad not to play Davis.
Davis is better than Hogan despite Hogan's transfer fee.
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday -
I think he will, actually; but whether the manager will play again rather than bringing back Hogan as a replacement remains to be seen.
He'd be mad not to play Davis.
Davis is better than Hogan despite Hogan's transfer fee.
Isn't he a different style of player though?
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Also just seen the highlights but this kid looks like he has it all.
Much less disappointed in the Russian's non-involvement now but hope Audrey and Keinan get a chance playing together for the first team.
For those who watch the youth matches, do those two link up well?
Happy for Brian Green too. He's been Davis' biggest champion. Now we just need RudyCantFail's man, Jordan Lyden to make an impact.
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday -
I think he will, actually; but whether the manager will play again rather than bringing back Hogan as a replacement remains to be seen.
He'd be mad not to play Davis.
Davis is better than Hogan despite Hogan's transfer fee.
Isn't he a different style of player though?
Yes an effective one.
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Hogan scored 13 goals by xmas last year - he's obviously got something even if we ludicrously overpaid for him
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Great full debut.Having a player that can hold the ball up front takes so much pressure off us.
Pedant Alert - the Holte were singing "He's one of our own, he's one of our own , Keinan Davis.."
He was born in Stevenage and we signed him from Biggleswade Town !
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Sounds like a great full debut, now he needs to follow it up.
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Second pedant alert. "One of our own" does not specifically mean he is the product of our youth team. It means we have taken to him. We have adopted him. Like we adopted Gareth Barry and Spinky.
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He really deserved a goal today. Absolutely superb performance from the young lad. Look at what it did for the midfield knowing that the ball was going to stick up front. Brought everyone into play. Obviously Connor thrived. UTV
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Davis up front with kodija in green's role?
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday -
I think he will, actually; but whether the manager will play again rather than bringing back Hogan as a replacement remains to be seen.
He'd be mad not to play Davis.
Davis is better than Hogan despite Hogan's transfer fee.
Isn't he a different style of player though?
Yes. To be fair to Hogan we have not played to his strength. Bruce style suits Davis.
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Davis up front with kodija in green's role?
No Green needs to stay in the team. Kodjia can replace Elmohammady.
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Just watched the highlights as out all day yesterday at Rewind South. Davis looked incredible and he must be wondering how on earth he didn't score which I would say wa mostly down to good goalkeeping and bad luck. Keep it up son!
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He really was involved in almost everything.
He was playing against two centre backs who were plying their trade in the fourth tier of German football last season though. So keen to see if he can do it against better. We all got a bit exited about what hogan and Elmo could do in pre season against a shocking German defence.
He was THAT good however that I'm optimistic
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If playing someone like this means the whole team clicks (from an attacking sense anyway), and Gallagher is a similar player, we need to get him in and we need to make sure one or the other is always in the team. If that means benching Hogan (who i rate very highly at this level) or playing him up with one of those two with Kodjia out wide then so be it. Hogan actually would be really good with a player like this, but on the other hand we all know Kodjia is our best player and scored loads last season. And if Green keeps playing like he did yesterday, that's another consideration.
Lets hope we have this head ache with us winning every week!
I was really chuffed with the result yesterday, and even more chuffed when i realised they'd done it without Jedinak. Once he's back, hopefully it will make us more solid at the other end.
Not sure about Bruce's comments about it not being a crisis, and all that crap. Non Villa fans observing from a distance might be fooled but anyone paying attention over the past 9 months or so knows it was a massive crisis, relegation zone after 3 games whilst serving up absolute shit football. I don't see what else it could have been. Hopefully this is a start in turning things around, i like Bruce and i want him to succeed but lets not start getting cocky yet.
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Superb today. As I mentioned on the Match thread, he reminds me of Dalian Atkinson; strong, powerful, great movement, holds the ball up (better than DA) but it's his running at defences that really does it. Potential legend in the making. Certainly in the future it will be easy to answer the question for 'Best Home Debut'.
Reminded me of a young Benteke, actually.
Potentially very good. Why has our manager not played him before?!
One of the hidden benefits of a player like that is that midfielders suddenly get more space to work with (I'm sure Hourihane would agree today!).
As I wrote on the match thread, he reminded me of Mark Hughes the way he shielded the ball and had it stick to him. Their defenders had no answer other than to foul him.
Also, nice bit of skill to set up Hourihane's first I thought.
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I've seen him a few times for the yoof on AVTV and he looked good but i didnt think he was quite good enough for the first team. He was immense today, for his age anyway.
I would say he was immense full stop.
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Davis up front with kodija in green's role?
No Green needs to stay in the team. Kodjia can replace Elmohammady.
With the amount of games there are, we need to pick according to form and tactics. It's good having the choice between Green/Kodija and Davis/Kodija for instance.
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I agree - ironically Davis's performance may strengthen the case for Gallagher. No way will Davis play every game at 19
It would leave us ridiculously top heavy with strikers though.
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I agree - ironically Davis's performance may strengthen the case for Gallagher. No way will Davis play every game at 19
It would leave us ridiculously top heavy with strikers though.
Agree Matt, but I would look at Kodjia as a possible wide left option as he has had some success there before. We would have Davis and Gallagher as target men, with Kodjia and Hogan as other options, with O'Hare and RHM waiting in the wings. Would hopefully signal to Agbonlahor that his time at the club is up and he needs to move on.
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If RMC is sold or goes out on loan and we sign Gallagher then we'd still have 4 strikers...Davis remains to be a free bonus.
Before:
Kodjia
Hogan
Gabby
RMC
+Davis
After:
Kodjia
Hogan
Gabby
Gallagher
+Davis
The only argument not to sign Gallagher would be a financial one.
It's also worth noting that Hogan is injury prone and there is no certainty that Kodjia won't pick up another injury...we could easily be reduced to having just Davis and Gabby as our options again if we don't bring in another striker.
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The highest compliment I could pay Davis after yesterdays performance was I don't think we would have won without him!
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Just subjected myself to the highlights of the Cardiff game as I couldn't bear to watch until now. What was immediately noticeable was that Gabby never won a single header or 50-50 in the air so the ball just kept coming back. Nuff said
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Of all the good things he did I loved his role in the second goal. Lovely flicked header straight to a Villa player. Thought he showed how much having a big strong centre forward can benefit a side.
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First time I have seem him (maybe he got a run out in pre season? I don't remember). But I love him already. More please.
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Just subjected myself to the highlights of the Cardiff game as I couldn't bear to watch until now. What was immediately noticeable was that Gabby never won a single header or 50-50 in the air so the ball just kept coming back. Nuff said
Agree. It is probably more relevant the lower down the football pyramid in that you need a target man who can not only win headers and hold the ball up, but challenge defenders so that they can't get a clear header on the ball. As you say with Hogan and Agbonlahor, the ball goes up and the defenders pretty much get a free header and the ball is back in our half again. Much better when defenders can't get a clear header and the ball is dropping in their half with our midfielders coming on to it.
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He won't find it as easy to bully Baker next Friday - but he has to be give the chance. Looks quite quick which is a great combo
They did look appalling at the back though so will try not to get carried away
If he performs like he did on Saturday then my money is on Baker not lasting 20 minutes.
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I think his pace will be more of a problem for "Bakesy"
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Watched the highlights again and I can see the comparison with Dalian. He moves in a similar way, picks up speed well and puts himself about but has that bit of skill too. I'm going to heap more pressure on than that though and call him 'the new Drogba'!
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When I watched him on Saturday I was really impressed with him he had no fear and played brilliant with a bit more luck he could have had a goal but goals will come if he keeps performing like he did against Norwich the lad has got a big future in the game.
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A good bit of management by Bruce not tell him until about 2 hours before kick off that he was playing. He reckons if he'd have told him the day before, he might have been awake all night.
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A good bit of management by Bruce not tell him until about 2 hours before kick off that he was playing. He reckons if he'd have told him the day before, he might have been awake all night.
I think he'll have had a pretty good idea himself, given that there was nobody else to play there.
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A good bit of management by Bruce not tell him until about 2 hours before kick off that he was playing. He reckons if he'd have told him the day before, he might have been awake all night.
I think he'll have had a pretty good idea himself, given that there was nobody else to play there.
Hogan was on the bench and could have made it, but even still it was a good idea.
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A good bit of management by Bruce not tell him until about 2 hours before kick off that he was playing. He reckons if he'd have told him the day before, he might have been awake all night.
I think he'll have had a pretty good idea himself, given that there was nobody else to play there.
Hogan Samba was on the bench and could have made it, but even still it was a good idea.
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Just a bit of a shame he's not a product of our academy. Only joined us last year from Biggleswade Town.
I wouldn't be too upset if we have a scouting network in place now that can turn up potential gems like him and plug him into the academy/u-23 set-up and bring them through that route.
Interesting background. Dropped by Kidderminster Harriers and told he'd never make it as a pro. Picked up by Biggleswade, who were set up to give players discarded by other clubs a chance, and then we've seen and signed him.
His attitude is one of a fighter, that drive and passion was what makes the difference.
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Oh, and based on one performance, we can't start thinking about building a team round him.
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Oh, and based on one performance, we can't start thinking about building a team round him.
It was a superb performance, really quite outstanding. But you are quite right, he is bound to have highs and lows and probably also pick up some niggles. I think getting Gallagher in on loan would have been a good idea to share the burden.
I would be very interested to see Hogan play alongside him. I could see that being an excellent partnership.
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Oh, and based on one performance, we can't start thinking about building a team round him.
It was a superb performance, really quite outstanding. But you are quite right, he is bound to have highs and lows and probably also pick up some niggles. I think getting Gallagher in on loan would have been a good idea to share the burden.
I would be very interested to see Hogan play alongside him. I could see that being an excellent partnership.
Absolutely. It was brilliant from what I've seen and heard. But it's much like our team, we need to be consistent. The tougher times, when the opposition have seen what he can do and have figured out a way to play against him where we'll really see what he's made of.
He's a surprise package plucked from obscurity, let's hope he's a diamond.
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Considering how he was bullying the 2 giant centre halves when I got to see him up close he really does look his age so fair play to him.
All the other players came over to pat him on the back and Terry really gave him some praise and he looked a little embarrassed by it as he is so young. If the players respond like that then Bruce would be a moron to leave him out of the next game irrespective of who is fit
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
Free, as far as I am aware, hope we look after them though if he goes on.
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Oh, and based on one performance, we can't start thinking about building a team round him.
fair enough comment unfortunately all my hopes are in the Davis basket there's fuck all else to get exited about
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
Biggleswade Town FC. ;)
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
Biggleswade Town FC. ;)
Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
Biggleswade Town FC. ;)
Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
I noticed that made me giggle.
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Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
Was he practising his ventriloquist routine at the time?
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They actually sound like a club that would appear in one of Bruce's novels
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Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
Was he practising his ventriloquist routine at the time?
No, but he had just finished a gottle of geer
(I'll get me coat)
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How much did we pay Bigglesworth for his services?
Biggleswade Town FC. ;)
Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
I noticed that made me giggle.
Good one Darren good one.
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Is it just me or did Bruce call them Giggleswade in his post match interview at the weekend?
Was he practising his ventriloquist routine at the time?
No, but he had just finished a gottle of geer
(I'll get me coat)
What a load of old gollocks.
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He should definitely play tonight in my view, he'll be pumped to high heaven and raring to go.
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They might be keeping him in a cage and feeding him on raw meat only until Friday.
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We need him Friday, no brainer
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We need him Friday, no brainer
I still would have given him the 1st 45 tonight though, but, hey, what do I know?
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Bruce said he was exhausted after Saturday
If he plays the same again he shouldn't feel the need to score - tho would be nice!
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How did he perform last night?
Given a decent run, from those that have seen him up close, how's many goals do you think we should expect from him this season?
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5 tops. Fairly anonymous last 2 games - not slating him rather our general play. He has had couple of chances that should have been put away though. Suspect he will be an impact sub now JK is back
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From the bits i've seen of him he strikes me as a bit Heskeyish, good for players around him and the team, selfless, but unlikely to score many.
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From the bits i've seen of him he strikes me as a bit Heskeyish, good for players around him and the team, selfless, but unlikely to score many.
I said the same thing to somebody a couple of weeks ago. He's done well in the games he's played but he's not a regular goal scorer.
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I agree, which brings us back to the need to get the players much closer to him. From the team last night we should've had BB and Snoddy cutting inside and Elmo/Taylor providing overlaps along with Houri and Ang playing 1 gets into the box and one holds the edge.
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From the bits i've seen of him he strikes me as a bit Heskeyish, good for players around him and the team, selfless, but unlikely to score many.
I said the same thing to somebody a couple of weeks ago. He's done well in the games he's played but he's not a regular goal scorer.
Uncanny, the guy who sits next to me in the upper Holte said exactly the same last night
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From the bits i've seen of him he strikes me as a bit Heskeyish, good for players around him and the team, selfless, but unlikely to score many.
I said the same thing to somebody a couple of weeks ago. He's done well in the games he's played but he's not a regular goal scorer.
I thought he played as a centre forward?
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Last night I thought that he looked more dangerous when playing wide in a front three
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Last night I thought that he looked more dangerous when playing wide in a front three
I'm not sure that's saying much. He didn't do a lot all game.
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I agree he seems Heskey like
Don't think prolific at under 23 football and the standard there is pretty bad
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Well not really as at least he did score occasionally - Davis carries no individual goal threat whatsoever.
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Bloody Hell, didn't take long for him to assume scapegoat status. He's a young kid who had his first start a few weeks ago.
I like the way he still doesn't hide from the ball and has good strength against older and nastier defenders.
I reckon he could be very good indeed.
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I don't think anyone is making him a scapegoat, just saying that he doesn't look like a 20 goal a year striker. It didn't stop Heskey having a great career and being highly rated by team mates and managers.
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Maybe. It did seem like people were being a little over the top. Maybe I misread the Heskey comparisons.
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Cant believe some of the comments here ....... Davis has played well in each game but he really needs a second player up top with him. He will bring the ball down and get his partner into the game but the problem is our manager only wants to play one up front.
The midfield are too deep so its difficult for Davis to bring them into play ...... plus last two games Brentford put players around him to ensure the effect wasn't there (manager showing tactics) while last night Boro put everyone behind the ball - also Gibson is a 25 million rated player
He may never score 20 a season but he would create for others
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Do you mean Ben Gibson of Boro? If so he definitely won't score 20 a season as he's a defender.
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I mentioned last night some of what Davis does reminds me of Heskey but the positive things - laying the ball off, holding off defenders and working hard, taking defenders away to create space.
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A comparison with Heskey isn't always a bad thing, I certainly didn't intend it as one. If he has a career anywhere near as good as Heskey did I doubt there'll be many complaints.
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He's still raw.
It was OTT after Norwich game. He played brilliantly but way people were going on like he couldn't be dropped and would even stay in when Kodjia was fit.
Kid still has lots to learn.
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He's still raw.
It was OTT after Norwich game. He played brilliantly but way people were going on like he couldn't be dropped and would even stay in when Kodjia was fit.
Kid still has lots to learn.
Yeah agree with that. He played very well against Norwich, but the praise was a bit much. Some were calling him the new Benteke, or the young Dalian Atkinson which is ludicrous after one game.
He's in a situation where he should be learning and improving, rather than having to lead the line.
He clearly has a lot of potential and if managed correctly could be a useful player this season. I think it may be time for a couple of games coming on from the bench
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The fact that the views around this 19 year old lad have done from Benteke / Withe, to he's no threat at all, in the space of about four games, is a bit of an indictment of the modern football fan
Utterly ridiculous
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How many who said he was the new Benteke are now saying he's no threat? Or do different people have different views to other posters, especially now he's played a bit more?
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It probably is different people - it's still ludicrous to reach either judgment after four games
I'm probably overly down on this site at the moment. But then I keep on reading lots of stupid comments (not yours here)
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It's also worth remembering that things have been so crap for so long a lot of us quite possibly will overreact to something positive, which his Norwich performance was.
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sell him , he has had it ;D
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It's also worth remembering that things have been so crap for so long a lot of us quite possibly will overreact to something positive, which his Norwich performance was.
Its not just us though, when I went into work after the Norwich game, the first thing an Arsenal supporter said to me was "were have you been hiding that beast?"
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Maybe. It did seem like people were being a little over the top. Maybe I misread the Heskey comparisons.
Indeed Heskey is generally held up as the example of a rubbish footballer. In reality though he had
a very good career and if Davis manages that he'll have done very well.
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but typically, we bought him at the wrong time
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sell him , he has had it ;D
Agree, worse player I've seen in a Villa shirt! :o
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It's also worth remembering that things have been so crap for so long a lot of us quite possibly will overreact to something positive, which his Norwich performance was.
Its not just us though, when I went into work after the Norwich game, the first thing an Arsenal supporter said to me was "were have you been hiding that beast?"
An Arsenal fan that takes an interest in a 'Championship' game between two non London clubs? That must be a first.
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Football supporter in watches highlights shocker.
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Football supporter in watches highlights shocker.
There are hundreds of hours of decent football to watch each weekend, both live and 'highlights', without having to subject yourself to C5's awful coverage of the 2nd division.
There can't be many Premiership supporters who subject themselves to that, surely?
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Fuck me do you want his number?
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Fuck me do you want his number?
Not really.
What's he said about "The Beast" recently though, having watched the last few weekend's highlights?
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Not a lot, he rates that Diego Jota from Wolves though. Even though Premier League fans aren't strictly supposed to watch lower League highlights. Highly frowned upon.
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Fuck me do you want his number?
Mate if he fucks you he would hardly want the other guy's number?
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Not a lot, he rates that Diego Jota from Wolves though. Even though Premier League fans aren't strictly supposed to watch lower League highlights. Highly frowned upon.
I don't know any PL fans that do it, and take that much interest.
What are your views on Diego Jota and 'The Beast'? Similar to your Arsenal mate? ;)
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You don't know of any fans of Premier League clubs that also watch lower League football? Ok then.
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No. But then I don't have many friends, as you can probably guess. ;)
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I love Keinan. ♥️
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So I guess he's now back to being the next Withe / Benteke?
Great performance
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Going to be some player when he grows up.
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Well done Keinan.
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Glad he's off the mark, after 9/10 games? Let's hope its the first of many!
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Could be some player, particularly if he scores regularly.
He has all the other attributes of a centre forward.
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Well done that young feller.Keep it up, they'll love ya!
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Another very good performance
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Hope he keeps that up and makes me eat my words. Impressive tonight.
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I said after the Naarrich game that he has a bit the Benteke about him, perhaps without the driving pace. He knows when to hold, when to lay off and when to take it on for himself. And, he is not afraid to have a shot from wherever.
I like it, and I thought he played well with Kodjia and Onomah.
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Hope he keeps that up and makes me eat my words. Impressive tonight.
Why were you writing him off after five pro games?
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Hope he keeps that up and makes me eat my words. Impressive tonight.
Why were you writing him off after five pro games?
Not necessarily writing him off, just didn't really rate him or see anything special in my opinion. Hope he continues in tonight's vein though.
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He was excellent.
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Hope he keeps that up and makes me eat my words. Impressive tonight.
Why were you writing him off after five pro games?
Not necessarily writing him off, just didn't really rate him or see anything special in my opinion. Hope he continues in tonight's vein though.
He looks a much better fit for us upfront than either McCormack or Hogan.
I know that much.
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One request, can we please stop singing he's one of our own? He isn't.
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He's one of our own he's one of our oooooown Elmohamady he's one of our own.
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One request, can we please stop singing he's one of our own? He isn't.
Where did we get him from?
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One request, can we please stop singing he's one of our own? He isn't.
Where did we get him from?
Biggleswade apparently at 17. He didn't start in our academy I suppose is the point. For me came through our academy so he's as good as one of our own.
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He could be a really good player. Great that he scored. Keep it up Keinan.
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He is 19 and arrived at 17. He therefore has played the majority of his youth and development football elsewhere. He is most definitely not 'one of our own'.
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He's one of our own he's one of our oooooown Elmohamady he's one of our own.
He's one of our own he's one of our oooooown John Terry he's one of our own.
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He is 19 and arrived at 17. He therefore has played the majority of his youth and development football elsewhere. He is most definitely not 'one of our own'.
He absolutely is.
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Scarper lads, the "one of our own" fuzz are here. We've been rumbled! We would have gotten away with it too if it wasnt for them!
<Sings "he is still one of our own!" as I run down a back alley.
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He's one of our own he's one of our oooooown Elmohamady he's one of our own.
He's one of our own he's one of our oooooown John Terry he's one of our own.
Too far. You've taken my joke and ruined it.
Disappointed in you.
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Massive performance today, growing every match,Beast in the making ! But let's get it right he's not "one of our own" but he is ours !
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Massive performance today, growing every match,Beast in the making ! But let's get it right he's not "one of our own" but he is ours !
He's a million miles from Benteke. He's a kid with potential, but Norwich aside he's looked very average especially recently.
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Massive performance today, growing every match,Beast in the making ! But let's get it right he's not "one of our own" but he is ours !
He's a million miles from Benteke. He's a kid with potential, but Norwich aside he's looked very average especially recently.
Today I thought he was unplayable and improving match by match
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Aye. One thing which will be interesting is what happens when he figures out just how intimidating he is. He doesn't bully defenders yet, even though he can physically. I am curious how he will use that.
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I hate to big up young players because it can all go so wrong so quickly.
This guy is a great prospect.
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So I guess he's now back to being the next Withe / Benteke?
I read that as White Benteke at first and was just a bit puzzled.
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Aye. One thing which will be interesting is what happens when he figures out just how intimidating he is. He doesn't bully defenders yet, even though he can physically. I am curious how he will use that.
I agree, he came across as quite shy in the post match interview. Once he builds his confidence in his own ability he will be a monster
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Agree. When he shook off two defenders and crashed the ball against the bar against Norwich he walked back upfield hanging his head as though he had let everybody down. Great prospect. More John Carew than Peter Withe/Christian Benteke I think.
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There's absolutely bugger all point playing him up front on his own with the likes of Bjarnason and Snodgrass as the only players backing him up. Yesterday worked because the defenders couldn't cope with Davis's strength, and Kodjia's and Albert's speed and trickery.
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Yep as I said earlier in the thread, get people around him and he brings a lot to the team but isolate him 30 yards from anyone and he's not going to give you moments of genius like Kodjia or Benteke have for us, he's just going to look lost.
Having Adomah (who works his tits off) in the side made a big difference in that regard, which is why it pissed me off so much that Bruce seemed so determined to replace him in the summer.
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me too, Albert picks up a lot of undeserved criticism
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There's absolutely bugger all point playing him up front on his own with the likes of Bjarnason and Snodgrass as the only players backing him up. Yesterday worked because the defenders couldn't cope with Davis's strength, and Kodjia's and Albert's speed and trickery.
Good point. Onomah has pace too.
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me too, Albert picks up a lot of undeserved criticism
It's strange isn't it? I'd go as far as saying that Albert is one of my favourites in this current squad. He's talented and definitely a team player. He made alot of Kodjia's goals last year, and for me, would be first choice as a wide player, or just off the front two.
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Aye. One thing which will be interesting is what happens when he figures out just how intimidating he is. He doesn't bully defenders yet, even though he can physically. I am curious how he will use that.
I think he does. Within 90 seconds against Norwich he'd bullied one of their centre halves off the ball and give clean through on goal.
As others have said he needs support. Put people around him and he'll be immense. Leave him isolated and expect him to look lost.
He's also only just 19 so he'll have more off games than on at this stage of his career.
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It's always a sense of joy to me to see the rare occasions where young players get discarded by clubs and refuse to give up their dream, move to the lower leagues, work hard and get picked up by a league club and make a success of it. It doesn't matter which player or which club but, it's so much better when it's the Villa.
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Wasn't he at Kiddy or one of the other higher level non league clubs?
He was far better yesterday, I haven't though he has worked hard enough in the previous two home games. He has to be used thoughtfully.
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Massive performance today, growing every match,Beast in the making ! But let's get it right he's not "one of our own" but he is ours !
He's a million miles from Benteke. He's a kid with potential, but Norwich aside he's looked very average especially recently.
Point for me is he looks the ideal fit for us upfront compared to McCormack and Hogan in the last year.
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He's got 'good potential', for me at the moment. He needs to push on from here, after scoring his first.
I'm not one who shares the view that we can afford to regularly play a centre forward just because 'he holds the ball up well'.
We need someone who will add a good few goals go that aspect of his game, especially when we are without Kodija.
At the moment I would give him a good run of games, ahead of Hogan, to see if he continues to develop.
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Was Bruce looking to offload Albert in the summer?
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Massive performance today, growing every match,Beast in the making ! But let's get it right he's not "one of our own" but he is ours !
No no no Wes. He joined us before he was 18, a mere child, so definitely one of our own and I will not have it any other way unless he disappoints me and then I will disown him just like my dad threatened to do to me once (??) well on many occasions.
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
Apart from the penalty, the ref gave him hardly anything yesterday.
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A bit similar to Barry. Some fans claim he wasn't one of our own even though he signed his first professional contract with Villa on his 16th birthday. Yeah he once sat on Brighton's bench for a reserve match back in the day but he's still one of ours.
Mind you he's dead to me now he's joined that tin pot outfit in the Black Country.
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I don't see how being at the club less than 2 years makes him one of our own. Is Sarkic one of our own as well as an example?
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What he needs to do now, and part of it will be natural is to fill out. Work on his upper body. Work on how to use his body to bully defenders. Look at how Benteke did it while with us. Look at how built Lukaku is now compared to when he first broke through at Anderlecht. Lots of room for growth.
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Strange how things work, he's looking a real promising prospect and yet if it hadn't been for injuries and fat Ross being frozen out he probably wouldn't have made an appearance yet.
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
Apart from the penalty, the ref gave him hardly anything yesterday.
Agreed. Fortunately it was the linesman that gave the penalty.
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He's our Marcus Rashford,only getting a chance through circumstances forcing it & has taken his chance. Looks a really exciting talent,great to see him get his first goal. Always feels better when we have a big striker bullying defences.
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
Apart from the penalty, the ref gave him hardly anything yesterday.
Agreed. Fortunately it was the linesman that gave the penalty.
Which in all fairness is one of the reasons he's there. People tend to lose sight of the fact that there are always three teams out there.
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I'm pleased he got his first goal yesterday he played really well he's only going to get better.
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Kids need football heroes and we have been in short supply just lately
my 9 year old said he wanted Davis on the back of his shirt next time
he's only seen him a couple of times on telly,so he has a lot of our high hopes riding on him from the start maybe a bit unfair but that's where we are
Kodja & Davis could just be the real deal partnership
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Good article here: https://www.thesportsman.com/articles/steve-bruce-turns-to-keinan-davis-to-lead-the-line-for-aston-villa.amp
I agree he's very reminiscent of heskey. I know people will say that's a sleight, but heskey was good enough to play for Liverpool and England
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
Apart from the penalty, the ref gave him hardly anything yesterday.
Agreed. Fortunately it was the linesman that gave the penalty.
Which in all fairness is one of the reasons he's there. People tend to lose sight of the fact that there are always three teams out there.
That's a bit unfair, Dave, you know we love our men in black on here. ;) #hugaref
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Good article here: https://www.thesportsman.com/articles/steve-bruce-turns-to-keinan-davis-to-lead-the-line-for-aston-villa.amp
I agree he's very reminiscent of heskey. I know people will say that's a sleight, but heskey was good enough to play for Liverpool and England
He'll do really well if he becomes the younger version of Heskey and not the lumbering oaf that we acquired.
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They were serving him out first half with grappling and climbing. As he is such a big player he's not going to get the protection. He needs to be treading all over them, digging the elbows in and letting them know he's there and if they want a physical battle, they will lose.
He is exceptional at holding that ball up and his touch has improved too. He was excellent yesterday.
Apart from the penalty, the ref gave him hardly anything yesterday.
Agreed. Fortunately it was the linesman that gave the penalty.
Which in all fairness is one of the reasons he's there. People tend to lose sight of the fact that there are always three teams out there.
That's a bit unfair, Dave, you know we love our men in black on here. ;) #hugaref
Takes out hankie, wipes tears away and feels the love. :-*
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As I said earlier in this thread if he has a career like Heskey he'll have done very well.
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The young Heskey rather than the 2008 version.
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Rumours he’s turned down our first contract offer. His agent earning his corn me thinks.
Release a couple of rumours...check....turn Down first offer...check....release another rumour...wait til December and sign new contract.
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It's what Hepburn Murphy did.
What on earth has happened to him btw. He seems to have been constantly injured for the last year.
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Strange that an offer's made and rejected. Surely the club have several rounds of discussions with the player/their agent, find out what they're looking for, negotiate and only make an offer once agreements have been made and it's quite close to what's been discussed/agreed.
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Did somebody say 'Heskey'?
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Didnt think he played that well yesterday but I always dread it when he’s taken off because we can’t hold onto possession as much because he holds onto the ball so well. He’s become very important to the team in such a short time.
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I actually thought yesterday we launched fewer balls at Davis because the team could see he was being bullied by their two centre halves. Instead more balls were launched at Snodgrass and to a lesser extent Albert.
As a result of that Davis became pretty ineffective. Once he'd gone off and Onomah came on I thought we looked more dangerous.
As soon as it was clear they had two horrible, immobile centre halves whose only tactic was to wrestle our players off the ball the game was crying out for Hogan over Davis. If we'd have shifted to 4-1-4-1 with Hogan up top and Hourihane and Onomah in advanced roles behind him, getting it down on the deck, we'd have smashed them.
At the moment with Snodgrass and Albert playing on the "wrong" wings and only two in centre mid it really narrows our play. And when you're up against a spoiler team like Bolton then you struggle like we did yesterday.
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Agreed, we were a lot more dangerous and created more as we moved it quicker.
Better refereeing would have had their centre halves in the book first half.
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I think he's pulled out of the under 20s, injured 🙄
Anyone got any sense of how serious? Hopefully just his niggles
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So Man United have bid £5M for Keinan according to the Sun to try and steal a march on rivals Arsenal and Everton. Villa have apparently rejected the bid. Surely too early for him to move to the Premier League? I don't think he's signed a new deal offered to him recently, hence such a low bid?
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The guy behind me kept calling him 'Kieron' every time he got near the ball yesterday.
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So Man United have bid £5M for Keinan according to the Sun to try and steal a march on rivals Arsenal and Everton. Villa have apparently rejected the bid. Surely too early for him to move to the Premier League? I don't think he's signed a new deal offered to him recently, hence such a low bid?
This sounds like absolute bollocks
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So Man United have bid £5M for Keinan according to the Sun to try and steal a march on rivals Arsenal and Everton. Villa have apparently rejected the bid. Surely too early for him to move to the Premier League? I don't think he's signed a new deal offered to him recently, hence such a low bid?
This sounds like absolute bollocks
I hope you're right. But, I'm sure the bigger clubs are monitoring Keinan. Concerned that he hasn't committed to a new deal yet, and we could lose him for a nominal fee.
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He'd be a fool to leave regular football for a place on the training pitch. He wouldn't even make a matchday squad at the top teams.
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Yep, great raw potential but still has a lot to learn.
This rumour is just that. What's his contract situation like? Be nice to tie him down to a long term deal given the progress he's made in the last few months.
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You wonder if it's a ploy to get a better offer.
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He'd be a fool to leave regular football for a place on the training pitch. He wouldn't even make a matchday squad at the top teams.
Yes, but look at the crazy money washing round the Premier League clubs. £75k a week for 5 years? Those sort of contracts are the norm in the money league.
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He'd be a fool to leave regular football for a place on the training pitch. He wouldn't even make a matchday squad at the top teams.
Yes, but look at the crazy money washing round the Premier League clubs. £75k a week for 5 years? Those sort of contracts are the norm in the money league.
You see the wages we pay to our players when they have five good games?
He'll probably look at what Micah Richards is conning out of the club and think if he keeps his head down he'll be paid nearly as much here as he'd get at one of the premier league top 6! Or Wolves...
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So Man United have bid £5M for Keinan according to the Sun to try and steal a march on rivals Arsenal and Everton. Villa have apparently rejected the bid. Surely too early for him to move to the Premier League? I don't think he's signed a new deal offered to him recently, hence such a low bid?
This sounds like absolute bollocks
I hope you're right. But, I'm sure the bigger clubs are monitoring Keinan. Concerned that he hasn't committed to a new deal yet, and we could lose him for a nominal fee.
It's something we are going to have to get used to the longer we languish in this league.
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Keith Wyness has tweeted that its rubbish
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It never sounded remotely true
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Just paper talk.
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Sounds like an agent placing a story to try and hurry along contract talks :-) might have been wiser choosing Everton or West Ham rather than a laughable link to Man Utd who buy the finished item not the work in progress.
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Extremely well played this evening. Looks like he's been leading the line for years. What I especially liked though, is his growing attacking threat and all round play. He's not just a tall lad to bounce balls off.
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Love him, bloody love him.
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Liked the way Terry finally got him to smile. Great stuff.
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If he can add some goals then he's going to be a massive asset.
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Awesome
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If we can get up I'd be really excited to see take on the premier league. He would have that unpredictability that Benteke had when he first joined.
Still let's make sure we tie him down to a nice long term deal before we get to that point.
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Well done to Keinan, played really well today. Just keep improving and doing your thing.
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Liked the way Terry finally got him to smile. Great stuff.
Liked also how JT said he's a nightmare to play against in training.
Proper handful.
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He's only played a few games so not going to get too carried away even though he's obviously better than Messi.
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He's only played a few games so not going to get too carried away even though he's obviously better than Messi.
;D
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Is he now one more yellow card off a ban?
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Is he now one more yellow card off a ban?
According to Soccerbase that was his first yellow.
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Is he now one more yellow card off a ban?
According to Soccerbase that was his first yellow.
Ah that's a relief, my mistake, I had it in my head he'd picked up a few already. Checking it appears Hourihane is now only 1 off (on 4) with his additional one tonight.
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I thought only Davis was booked tonight?
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Bruce did the right thing bringing him off when he did and did another right thing by explaining to the lad why he did. Good man management that was.
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Davis is a man mountain, he held up the ball last night so well.
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We don't have any players who are one booking away from suspension.
http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/discipline/suspensions
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Benteke-esque!
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i like him but he needs to score more
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He will.
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He's got great potential he's only going to get better I just hope it with us.
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i like him but he needs to score more
Agreed. He had an absolutely golden chance to open the scoring last night. Showed the difference in experience that Snodgrass's chance was very similar and he stuck his away.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
Instantly?! 20,000 people in the stadium and hundreds of thousands more at home could see the ball was going to be pulled back for him. Even from the point Adomah crossed it, it was rolled across so slowly he still had ages to prepare.
And I don't think it was even that good a save - Davis hit it straight at the keeper. The ball just hit him. Whereas Snodgrass placed it back across the keeper knowing he'd be diving out of the way of it.
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Snodgrass placed it a foot wide of the keeper. If he had adjusted he could have saved it. He also had noone near him. This is not criticising Snodgrass, rather suggesting that people are being overly-critical of Davis' miss. About 50% of the time that would have gone in and nobody would be moaning.
90% of the time his shot against the scum would have gone in. You hit the underside of the bar and it doesn't go in, that's just unlucky. It happens.
Because some idiot commentator failed to notice a Small Heath player inches from the ball when Davis had a shot on Sunday, people are now adopting this "Davis always whacks it when he should place it" as a mantra.
He could easily have placed both shots, had both blocked, and everyone here would be moaning that he should have whacked it.
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Snodgrass chance was definitely a lot easier imo. In part because KD drew the defenders away.
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Snodgrass chance was definitely a lot easier imo. In part because KD drew the defenders away.
Yes, it was an excellent goal. Superb run and perfect pass by Onomah, great dummy run by Davis and excellent finish by Snoddy. It was a goal of real class & beauty.
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Must be quite intimidating to be an experienced older Centre half thinking you are playing against a wet behind the ears kid.
Until he pushes, elbows, gets in your face and skins you
When that tosser confronted him by swinging an arm out in the corner - he shit himself when he turned round and saw Keinan square up to him
best player we have facing back to goal in the club and really brings our team alive
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We don't have any players who are one booking away from suspension.
http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/discipline/suspensions
Thanks for clearing that up cdbullyweefan I think I've been having Villa hallucinations without any known drug ingestion. I don't know if to feel relief or concern... I'm gonna go for a lay down.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
Instantly?! 20,000 people in the stadium and hundreds of thousands more at home could see the ball was going to be pulled back for him. Even from the point Adomah crossed it, it was rolled across so slowly he still had ages to prepare.
And I don't think it was even that good a save - Davis hit it straight at the keeper. The ball just hit him. Whereas Snodgrass placed it back across the keeper knowing he'd be diving out of the way of it.
Davis just needs to learn that he doesn’t have to blast every attempt. He did the same against Blues. That’ll come with experience though.
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Snodgrass chance was definitely a lot easier imo. In part because KD drew the defenders away.
I thought Snodgrass's was harder. The keeper had more space and time to react so Snoddy had to place it the opposite direction of the assumed dive and hit it very low to go under him.
Davis on the other hand went for power and the keepers body was in the way so it bounced off. Although it could just as easily have bounced in.
Really though I give them both a pat on the back. Both were powerful shots both on target.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
Instantly?! 20,000 people in the stadium and hundreds of thousands more at home could see the ball was going to be pulled back for him. Even from the point Adomah crossed it, it was rolled across so slowly he still had ages to prepare.
And I don't think it was even that good a save - Davis hit it straight at the keeper. The ball just hit him. Whereas Snodgrass placed it back across the keeper knowing he'd be diving out of the way of it.
Davis just needs to learn that he doesn’t have to blast every attempt. He did the same against Blues. That’ll come with experience though.
That's true, but it's one of those where hindsight wins. If he'd have tried to place it and it had been tipped round the post there would have been two or three "just put your bloody foot through it!" posts on the match thread.
Like if somebody squares it to a better placed player. If it results in a goal it's "well done", if the next bloke fluffs the chance it's "should have been more selfish".
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Think Davis will be one of those forwards who'll average 10 a season but will also create 10-20 for others with his movement and physicality pulling defenders all over the place and creating space.
I think it's a bit much to expect Benteke scoring levels but if he could step up to that we'd have a serious forward on our hands.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
Instantly?! 20,000 people in the stadium and hundreds of thousands more at home could see the ball was going to be pulled back for him. Even from the point Adomah crossed it, it was rolled across so slowly he still had ages to prepare.
And I don't think it was even that good a save - Davis hit it straight at the keeper. The ball just hit him. Whereas Snodgrass placed it back across the keeper knowing he'd be diving out of the way of it.
Davis just needs to learn that he doesn’t have to blast every attempt. He did the same against Blues. That’ll come with experience though.
That's true, but it's one of those where hindsight wins. If he'd have tried to place it and it had been tipped round the post there would have been two or three "just put your bloody foot through it!" posts on the match thread.
Like if somebody squares it to a better placed player. If it results in a goal it's "well done", if the next bloke fluffs the chance it's "should have been more selfish".
Indeed, but that sort of decision making is what makes a good player great.
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Snodgrass had more time to think about his chance. Davis had to react instantly and, at least, forced a good save.
Instantly?! 20,000 people in the stadium and hundreds of thousands more at home could see the ball was going to be pulled back for him. Even from the point Adomah crossed it, it was rolled across so slowly he still had ages to prepare.
And I don't think it was even that good a save - Davis hit it straight at the keeper. The ball just hit him. Whereas Snodgrass placed it back across the keeper knowing he'd be diving out of the way of it.
Davis just needs to learn that he doesn’t have to blast every attempt. He did the same against Blues. That’ll come with experience though.
That's true, but it's one of those where hindsight wins. If he'd have tried to place it and it had been tipped round the post there would have been two or three "just put your bloody foot through it!" posts on the match thread.
Like if somebody squares it to a better placed player. If it results in a goal it's "well done", if the next bloke fluffs the chance it's "should have been more selfish".
Indeed, but that sort of decision making is what makes a good player great.
but it's also incredibly rare in 19 year olds. Aside from Rooney I can't think of anyone else in the last 15-20 years (in England) who came through as a teenager and just seemed to instinctively make good decisions, Dele Alli maybe but coming through at a lower level helped him a lot in his breakout season.
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i like him but he needs to score more
Agreed. He had an absolutely golden chance to open the scoring last night. Showed the difference in experience that Snodgrass's chance was very similar and he stuck his away.
Big difference in the quality of the pass for me, for Snodgrass goal the ball from Onomah was not bobbled it rolled truly - the ball from Adomah to Davis was definitely bobbling as Davis approached it.
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The goals will flow
Keep him fit and he could be in our top 2 or 3 of leading goalscorers come May
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Welcome to the forum mate. :)
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Its a complete guess but it may be the case that the club are doing all they can to sign him up for the next 4 or 5 years but as his contract expires next June then his agent is advising him not to sign a new contract and see what offers come in for him
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Bloody hell mate after 10 years how on Earth did this issue cause you to post!
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Welcome! :)
Dunno about the contract. It must be in Keinan & his agents court. Maybe he sees the way to advance his career is away from us. I hope not but it seems that way. I am not sure where else he is going to get the wages we pay and a start in the first team.
Maybe he would just be happy on a bigger wage sitting in the reserves for a premier league team? Its happened before.
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Considering we plucked the kid off the scrap heap having been released by the mighty Stevenage, he should have a little look in the mirror, get shot of his frankly stupid agent and sort out the deal. For a kid who at best must have thought he would get some sub appearances this season he has taken his chance well, but has scored 2 in 13, and is a long way from anywhere near the finished article. A bit of gratitude and realisation playing regularly might help.
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He needs to do a lot more for a lot longer to be giving out the billy big bollocks. Badly advised probably.
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Do we get a fee as he’s under 23 if he doesn’t sign a new deal?
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Let's not forget that these rumours may also be a load of bollocks.
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possibly, I'd be surprised if he's kicking off after only half a dozen starts and 2 goals
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Always the agents though isn’t it. Tossers.
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Davis would need to improve massively as a footballer before we worry about losing him. He’s the type of player that makes us a better team, but he has a long way to go before he can be considered a permanent fixture in the team. If we go up, we will need an upgrade
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Davis would need to improve massively as a footballer before we worry about losing him. He’s the type of player that makes us a better team, but he has a long way to go before he can be considered a permanent fixture in the team. If we go up, we will need an upgrade
Or maybe he'll be better in twelve
months time.
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Who has said what?
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Davis would need to improve massively as a footballer before we worry about losing him. He’s the type of player that makes us a better team, but he has a long way to go before he can be considered a permanent fixture in the team. If we go up, we will need an upgrade
Or maybe he'll be better in twelve
months time.
I would say that is an excellent bet, other things being equal.
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possibly, I'd be surprised if he's kicking off after only half a dozen starts and 2 goals
Weren't there similar rumours regarding RHM before he signed so new contract? Davis and his agent could just be playing the same game.
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Exactly the sort of player that E Eaton are desperate for.
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Who has said what?
"Contract Standoff" being reported in the Torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/11/03/aston-villa-reach-impasse-cotract-negotiations-striker-keinan/)
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Welcome to the site. These Scottish League-themed usernames will never catch on.
I'm not too bothered about Davis' contract as it is November. I'm hopefully that his agent has advised him to reject early offers, knowing that he holds all the cards and that we will likely keep going back with higher offers.
He'd be a fool to leave, just to go and sit on a Premier League bench for the next few years. If he stays with us, he could be a legend, and international football is inevitable if he continues his current trajectory.
I'll start to worry if he hadn't signed by March.
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Right from Gareth Farrelly, Lee Hendrie, the Moore’s, even RHM we’ve been obsessed by contracts for young players - for me Davis has had one excellent game and done well in 3/4 others, long way away from position that club need to panic & give into agents demands.
Wouldn’t be surprised if that Hugill arrives in Jan as competition for Davis, Bruce was bigging him up before and after game other night.
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I am a new poster but have followed and donated to the site for over 10 years. Favourite players -McMahon, Godfrey, Mortimer,Gray, Yorke but not too many recently. Ok, you can see I’m old. I’m exiled in Perth, Scotland and a St Johnstone supporter. They are a tiny team with crowds of 3,000 but amazingly have reached Europe in the last 3 or 4 years.
Now, what has driven me to comment when for a long time , I have been happy to laugh at punfests etc.
The big question is why is no one concerned about Keinan’s contract? This is surely a major concern. He is a super find. We need to keep him!
Welcome! Just out of interest, if St Johnstone are tiny, what would that make Berwick Rangers? We had a quick look at their ground on the way up to Edinburgh a couple of weeks ago. It's, erm, "cosy" to put it kindly.
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Who has said what?
"Contract Standoff" being reported in the Torygraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/11/03/aston-villa-reach-impasse-cotract-negotiations-striker-keinan/)
It will all get sorted I reckon.
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Didn’t Bruce drop RHM until he sorted his contract out or was it someone else
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It’s possible the media are making more of this beyond the facts. Not the first time apparently. Davis has quickly become the emerging face of the new Aston Villa. A potential star so it’s news when he hasn’t signed a contract. It’s his right to get the best deal possible, so it might be nothing that it’s not done yet. It certainly hasn’t negatively affected in any way his performance on the pitch.
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Right from Gareth Farrelly, Lee Hendrie, the Moore’s, even RHM we’ve been obsessed by contracts for young players - for me Davis has had one excellent game and done well in 3/4 others, long way away from position that club need to panic & give into agents demands.
Wouldn’t be surprised if that Hugill arrives in Jan as competition for Davis, Bruce was bigging him up before and after game other night.
We used to give Barry a new deal every six months when he was coming through.
I think Kienan will stay here. He's playing week in week out which won't be happening at premier league clubs.
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As others have mentioned, its a big risk to offer him a new championship level contract on the evidence of a few games because as we know we've done it before with youth players and the exciting new prospect rapidly turns into the occasional reserve who's been found out and doesn't progress. However because of how long he's got on his contract he could easily be stolen and for a premiership club it works out at not much of a risk to take in real terms. Maybe the clubs linked to him atm won't turn his head too much but a 3 year contract at a premiership club on say 30k a week is tempting. It's a game of poker at the moment with perhaps us holding the better hand but if we're not looking like going straight up in the new year, he could call our bluff
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Little boy lost today.
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Little boy lost today.
Hogan?
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If it's true, then the reported £2k per week he is on compared to other average first team players that are on in excess of £40k per week would certainly bring about cause for concern for his both Davis and his agent. He's certainly not the finished article by any stretch of the imagination on performances so far, but it's clear he has potential so all we can do is hope that the club offer him a contract and wages that reflect that his potential for many years of service to come...if not, then he'll be on his bike whether it's warming the bench or getting game time for a Premier League club.
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Seems very good with his back to goal, but not very effective facing people up and making runs. Still plenty to develop in him. Don’t think we need to worry about prem teams just yet though, unless they are buying to loan out. I am sure his agent will get him a good deal.
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We didn’t get players to him quick enough when he’d won it, the midfield were too deep and Hogan too wide.
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Didn't have a great game yesterday, but that is going to happen with a young player. We desperately need another option who can perform a similar role to him, so that we can rotate when needed.
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For anyone who takes an active interest in the reserves, did he used to score many goals? It was he used mainly as someone who could 'hold the ball up', as he does now?
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His most effective game in my eyes was against Norwich, that was a case of playing Hotlips pushed up to pick up anything he knocked down, especially outside of the box, he has not had that type of set up since. He is only 19 and I have stated elsewhere that he is not going to put on a 8 out of 10 performance every week and he still has alot to learn.
As for prem clubs, what we have to remember is that half of these twats buy players now, not to play them, but to stop their immediate opposition buying them just in case they come good.
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His most effective game in my eyes was against Norwich, that was a case of playing Hotlips pushed up to pick up anything he knocked down, especially outside of the box, he has not had that type of set up since. He is only 19 and I have stated elsewhere that he is not going to put on a 8 out of 10 performance every week and he still has alot to learn.
As for prem clubs, what we have to remember is that half of these twats buy players now, not to play them, but to stop their immediate opposition buying them just in case they come good.
And, Naaarwich may not have known much about him. Other teams have had a chance to take a look at him since.
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Heads they Win Tails we lose! Why have we got this contract situation with Keinan I hope the club keep their eye on things regarding our young prospects in future. What a shame if we lose Keinan to Man United this summer as is on the cards. Come on Villa "BE PREPARED"
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Heads they Win Tails we lose! Why have we got this contract situation with Keinan I hope the club keep their eye on things regarding our young prospects in future. What a shame if we lose Keinan to Man United this summer as is on the cards. Come on Villa "BE PREPARED"
is it on the cards ?
my lad wants his name on the back of his shirt for Christmas I ain’t doing it if he’s going to Man Utd
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
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He's going nowhere. Stop stressing.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
He came out of nowhere, somewhat luckily to have an opportunity in the first team. He's been excellent in some games non existent in others. He has a lot to learn and he's a long way from the finished article. How is it inevitable that he's going to leave? He's negotiating for the best deal possible which is his right to do.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
He came out of nowhere, somewhat luckily to have an opportunity in the first team. He's been excellent in some games non existent in others. He has a lot to learn and he's a long way from the finished article. How is it inevitable that he's going to leave? He's negotiating for the best deal possible which is his right to do.
I agree Toronto Villa.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
I don't know wether to take this post seriously or not.
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Davis has scored 2 goals at championship level. He has a lot of potential, but its unfathomable he would be on Manchester United's radar at this point.
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Davis has scored 2 goals at championship level. He has a lot of potential, but its unfathomable he would be on Manchester United's radar at this point.
I doubt it very much.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
What you call my missus???😒😃
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
What you call my missus???😒😃
Only when you're at work.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
What you call my missus???😒😃
Only when you're at work.
You mean I'm not the only one?
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He's not played twenty games yet and already we've got him sold to Manchester United, not good enough, arrogant, ruined by his agent and cast off to Walsall. It's a good job we're not judgemental.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
What you call my missus???😒😃
Only when you're at work.
You mean I'm not the only one?
I have to book two weeks in advance.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
Rant? Really?! May be the bit about fucking him off came across a bit strong, but if some would have you believe on here then we won't have that option anyway as he's already half way up to Manchester on the M6. What I was trying to say (and failed miserably) is that he's clearly got some talent that needs to be nurtured, so we need to keep him, offer him a better contract and develop his game into the kind of player that we would all like to see in a Villa shirt. Hope that's not too "ranty" ;)
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If he’d scored at least 10 goals, created loads of chances and been MOTM in most of the games he’s played then I’d be worried about these reports...the fact is that he’s just raised a few eyebrows in the media from a few performances this season. He’s current salary is not in line with what he should or could be earning, but if he and his agent have got ideas above his station of where he could go then fuck him off and let him enjoy his career warming the bench before being sent out on loan back to the lower divisions.
These kind of rants feel like someone shouting at their missus because someone said they fancy her.
What you call my missus???😒😃
Only when you're at work.
You mean I'm not the only one?
I have to book two weeks in advance.
Bloody hell, you must be getting preferential treatment.
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on my farcebook feed apparently young Keinan has signed a new contract until 2020....
UTV
The Doc
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Brilliant. Always thought he would.
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He's going nowhere. Stop stressing.
Nice to be right, for once! 😊
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He's going nowhere. Stop stressing.
Nice to be right, for once! 😊
well played.....you are the Oracle and all mighty and powerful :)
UTV
The Doc
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Good news, at least if anybody should come in for him we will get a bit of dosh. Just hope he continues to progress.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
It's a miracle!
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Would've liked him to sign for longer but guess that's dependent on us moving back up.
Still pleased it's all sorted. There's certainly more to come from him on the pitch.
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I would also have liked him to sign a longer contract but at least now he's signed a contract he can concentrate on his football without any distractions.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
It's a miracle!
a Christmas miracle, well nearly
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Nice! Contract length actually seems fair to me. Lets face it we have had a lot of false dawns with players who we ended up stuck with on long contracts and for him 2020 seems like a time he would want to have a contract revision anyway if he is playing well.
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
So we should have let him leave for nothing?
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I am so pleased that what I heard from Bodymore has not happened. As I said I was so upset with not being able to keep our promising youngsters, it should be easier to keep & attract players when we return to the prem
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
So we should have let him leave for nothing?
I’m obviously not saying that, the optimism that he’ll be staying until 2020 is misguided, that’s all.
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Another deal dealt with very well by the board. No fuss and nonsense in the press, just crack on and reward a player who has earned a bit of a reward for playing fairly well.
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
So we should have let him leave for nothing?
I’m obviously not saying that, the optimism that he’ll be staying until 2020 is misguided, that’s all.
I like your optimism. I tend to the other way. Maybe its the Villa pessimist in me but I look at this as covering our downside for when he inevitably gets injured and "was never the same again" which is what usually happens to our promising players.
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
So we should have let him leave for nothing?
I’m obviously not saying that, the optimism that he’ll be staying until 2020 is misguided, that’s all.
You're making him sound like a world beater. He's done well and he deserves his new contract but there no reason why he shouldnt be still here in 3 years time mainly because we don't know how he or we are going to progress.
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It saddens me to say so, just hope the club become a bit more savy in future, I know it is difficult to stand a chance of keeping our younger future stars where we are at present but I am sure the club should be able to tie them to some sort of contract rather than have them leave for peanuts or nowt
Hope I am wrong with what I have heard but unless a miracle happens it looks inevitable
He came out of nowhere, somewhat luckily to have an opportunity in the first team. He's been excellent in some games non existent in others. He has a lot to learn and he's a long way from the finished article. How is it inevitable that he's going to leave? He's negotiating for the best deal possible which is his right to do.
The panic from some wasn’t justified. He got the best deal he could and those things can take time. I’m glad he’s decided his immediate future lies with us. He has a lot of potential.
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Makes no difference apart from sell on value. Haven’t we already learnt from this many times???
So we should have let him leave for nothing?
I’m obviously not saying that, the optimism that he’ll be staying until 2020 is misguided, that’s all.
Every footballer has a price and every footballer will assess their personal situation in line with the club. How we are doing, our ambitions etc. There’s just no guarantees but by the same token there’s no reason to be pessimistic that he won’t be with us in 3 years time either. That’s not us being naive but just accepting that he absolutely could be.
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Contract length makes sense for me, for both sides, if he carries on improving as we hope we'll be offering him a new deal long before then anyway and if not it's long enough to give both sides time to see where things go without being a huge commitment from either side.
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£20k + per week, i bet he is a happy chappy! the new car has been ordered!
Lets hope that we can keep him grounded and not think that he has made it and becomes billy big time!
It will be interesting to see what role he will play in the team once Kodja is fit??
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It's the way of the game, have to put these kids on big contracts too early to stop them leaving and just hope thay stay grounded.
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I am so pleased that what I heard from Bodymore has not happened. As I said I was so upset with not being able to keep our promising youngsters, it should be easier to keep & attract players when we return to the prem
Not necessarily, had we been in the Prem I’d hazard a guess Davis / O’Hare would have got nowhere near a start, we’d have had a few more over paid mercenaries bloating the squad
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Glad he has signed it, if only because it protects us from having to let him go on the rediculous tribunal fee system next summer. He needs to get his head down and learn to shoot now. Could be a good player if he does that.
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Happy for the lad.
Now lets push Hogan closer to him with Grealish behind, and we might see a better outcome, offensively. There is more to this kid, than just holding on to hoofed balls with his back to goal!!
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£20K per week for a 19 year old - My God that's obscene even if it was Messi. I bet his Mom still buys his clothes.
As an aside - any other oldies remember thinking about dates such as 2020 in the terms of science fiction only - to think it is only 2 and a bit years away. And we still do not have flying cars or holidays on the moon. :(
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£20K per week for a 19 year old - My God that's obscene even if it was Messi. I bet his Mom still buys his clothes.
As an aside - any other oldies remember thinking about dates such as 2020 in the terms of science fiction only - to think it is only 2 and a bit years away. And we still do not have flying cars or holidays on the moon. :(
Space 1999 was slightly off the mark too.
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Bit of a worry for me are the wages that we are continuing to pay out.
A 19 year old striker with about 10 games and 2 goals under his belt in The Championship (not the top level) gets awarded £20,000 a week! Did we really have to pay that?
I dread to think what the following are on:
Lansbury
Jedinak
Hourihane
Bree
Chester
Terry
Taylor
De Laet
Whelan
Snodgrass
Adomah
Elmohamady
Elphick
Kodjia
Hogan
etc.
Plus:
Richards
Agbonlahor
Our promotion strategy seems to be 'sh#t or bust'. And I am very worried that we will just about make the play offs and not get up. Our wages bill must be greater than some of the premierships teams but our lot don't look a cut above their Championship counterparts.
Big worry.
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I’ve just spent £57.95 On a Kids Football shirt with Davis on the back from the club shop
so I’m doing my bit for his new wage boost
(At least Dick Turpin had the decency to hide behind a mask)
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£58 for a t-shirt!
Jesus wept.
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£58 for a t-shirt!
Jesus wept.
it’s got a massive number 39 on as well
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I’ve just spent £57.95 On a Kids Football shirt with Davis on the back from the club shop
so I’m doing my bit for his new wage boost
(At least Dick Turpin had the decency to hide behind a mask)
The club shop’s got big plate glass windows and they saw you coming.
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It's 21 appearances and 2 goals.
He's getting a man's wage now, probably more than any other 19/20 year old in the Championship, so he needs to start scoring goals.
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I’ve just spent £57.95 On a Kids Football shirt with Davis on the back from the club shop
so I’m doing my bit for his new wage boost
(At least Dick Turpin had the decency to hide behind a mask)
The club shop’s got big plate glass windows and they saw you coming.
on line but it’s the same thing
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It's 21 appearances and 2 goals.
He's getting a man's wage now, probably more than any other 19/20 year old in the Championship, so he needs to start scoring goals.
Scoring goals did not seem to trouble Heskey.
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I can see both sides of this. If Keinan looks across at the bench and see's that useless lump hogan sitting there on 40k a week I bet he's thought wtf! I'm keeping this 9m striker out of the team and I'm only on 2k.
However there have been so many lads over the years get the pro contract, get the lamborghini and the bling then dissappear. Isiah Osbourne Chris Herd etc
I heard Hepburn Murphy got 25k a week and hasn't done anything. and probably won't.
On the other hand if you're a young player and you see your mate break through it should give you a bit of a push
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Pretty sensible from the club i'd say. On one hand he's not worth that at his age. On the other someone else would pay that if he went on a free
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It's 21 appearances and 2 goals.
He's getting a man's wage now, probably more than any other 19/20 year old in the Championship, so he needs to start scoring goals.
Scoring goals did not seem to trouble Heskey.
Davis will have done well if he scores 100+ goals at the very top level, like Heskey.
I'd he happy if he could manage a few more at this level.
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Keinan, see the Moore brothers. I remember them both signing big first deals. No idea where they are now.
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It's 21 appearances and 2 goals.
He's getting a man's wage now, probably more than any other 19/20 year old in the Championship, so he needs to start scoring goals.
Scoring goals did not seem to trouble Heskey.
Davis will have done well if he scores 100+ goals at the very top level, like Heskey.
I'd he happy if he could manage a few more at this level.
I wish Heskey had scored more of those goals for us.
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Well we're investing in the future. Its up to the mangement team, and player himself to keep his feet on the ground. The money is a bit silly, but that's just the modern game. Think its a good move from the club on the whole.
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Hopefully will drive him on to improve and learn more, plus we really need him right now.
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Be great if Peter Withe could get involved in his football development, even if it was to endow Keinan with the mystical power of the wrist sweatbands.
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Keinan, see the Moore brothers. I remember them both signing big first deals. No idea where they are now.
I remember them both and a host of others down the years
however and I will stick my neck out even though it’s very early on but Davis impresses me more than any of them
he is my big hope of the future along with Callum O’Hare
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I think he’ll have a very good game today. I find playing on the break with a target man is better away from home. He’ll hold up the play and bring others into the game. The young man has a very good week personally. Would be nice to round off with a goal or three.
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Keinan, see the Moore brothers. I remember them both signing big first deals. No idea where they are now.
I remember them both and a host of others down the years
however and I will stick my neck out even though it’s very early on but Davis impresses me more than any of them
he is my big hope of the future along with Callum O’Hare
But what about Nathan 'going to be better than Gabby' Delfouneso? 😉
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Seems to be a problem with us over the years. Young players get to the stage of breaking into the team and then don't progress which sort of hints at a lack of interest from the coaching at first team level. Obviously some players will only ever be lower league quality but there's quite a few who had the talent to be more than that on ability at least
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I can see both sides of this. If Keinan looks across at the bench and see's that useless lump hogan sitting there on 40k a week I bet he's thought wtf! I'm keeping this 9m striker out of the team and I'm only on 2k.
However there have been so many lads over the years get the pro contract, get the lamborghini and the bling then dissappear. Isiah Osbourne Chris Herd etc
I heard Hepburn Murphy got 25k a week and hasn't done anything. and probably won't.
On the other hand if you're a young player and you see your mate break through it should give you a bit of a push
Doubt Hogan is on 40k
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I can see both sides of this. If Keinan looks across at the bench and see's that useless lump hogan sitting there on 40k a week I bet he's thought wtf! I'm keeping this 9m striker out of the team and I'm only on 2k.
However there have been so many lads over the years get the pro contract, get the lamborghini and the bling then dissappear. Isiah Osbourne Chris Herd etc
I heard Hepburn Murphy got 25k a week and hasn't done anything. and probably won't.
On the other hand if you're a young player and you see your mate break through it should give you a bit of a push
Doubt Hogan is on 40k
I can’t imagine a £12m striker is on much less.
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
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Sounds like he was great
Needs to start scoring though
And whether he can do that twice more this week is a big ask. A very big ask
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
He only had 2 chances that I can recall. The shot where he forced a decent save from their keeper in the first half and the header in the second where he did well to get it anywhere near on target with any sort of power.
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
He only had 2 chances that I can recall. The shot where he forced a decent save from their keeper in the first half and the header in the second where he did well to get it anywhere near on target with any sort of power.
Is that a criticism, or trying to suggest he did well? I can't work it out.
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
He only had 2 chances that I can recall. The shot where he forced a decent save from their keeper in the first half and the header in the second where he did well to get it anywhere near on target with any sort of power.
Is that a criticism, or trying to suggest he did well? I can't work it out.
His all round game was excellent.
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As I've said before I'm not sure he'll be a forward who will score at Kodjia or Benteke rates but he'll create far more for others with his hold up play and movement.
Would Adomah be on 7 playing off Kodjia, he wouldn't be given the ball enough.
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
He only had 2 chances that I can recall. The shot where he forced a decent save from their keeper in the first half and the header in the second where he did well to get it anywhere near on target with any sort of power.
Is that a criticism, or trying to suggest he did well? I can't work it out.
His all round game was excellent.
Good. But it certainly wasn't against Sheffield Wednesday.
If we aim to go up we need a main striker who will score goals, especially when games are tight.
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Great game today, I worry about his lack of finishing though.
He only had 2 chances that I can recall. The shot where he forced a decent save from their keeper in the first half and the header in the second where he did well to get it anywhere near on target with any sort of power.
Is that a criticism, or trying to suggest he did well? I can't work it out.
Neither, just statement of fact.
I guess it's defending him from the lack of finishing criticism if anything.
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I like him but i think its asking a lot for him to be scoring the goals to get us up this season. We could have had 5 today if we had a striker worthy of the name.
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Ffs Davis is only 19! Comparisons with Benteke and others is far too early. He's got a lot to learn.
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He was excellent today. Worked very hard and bullied the defenders which created chances for others.
The goals will come but as important are the opportunities he is creating for the likes of Albert and Snodgrass. It’s no coincidence we’re getting a lot more goals from midfield with Keinan leading the line.
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I agree, when he holds the ball up, it gives the midfielders confidence to make runs beyond him. Once Kodjia is back fit, he can drift in from the left with Davis holding the ball up and Albert on the right.
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Ffs Davis is only 19! Comparisons with Benteke and others is far too early. He's got a lot to learn.
Go back a page and he's Steffan Moore
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whatever he is he’ll do for me
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I thought he was great today.
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whatever he is he’ll do for me
Amen brother.
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I don’t think Adomah or Hourihane would have as many goals this season as they do if Kodjia was our lone striker.
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Just watched the extended qpr highlights
Seriously good performance from Davis
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Just watched the extended qpr highlights
Seriously good performance from Davis
The thing I like about him, and what makes him more than just a target man, is that he's very attack minded. OK they're not flying in for him at the moment, but he's not scared to run at an opponent or have a dribble in the area. He's having chances, we just need them to start converting. I think he's a very good player indeed.
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Just watched the extended qpr highlights
Seriously good performance from Davis
The thing I like about him, and what makes him more than just a target man, is that he's very attack minded. OK they're not flying in for him at the moment, but he's not scared to run at an opponent or have a dribble in the area. He's having chances, we just need them to start converting. I think he's a very good player indeed.
couldn’t agree more
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Count me in on the love in.
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I think he's a good player first and foremost, but to kick on he needs to get a bit better in front of goal. Although in fairness Kane struggled to score much until he popped on in at Villa Park and then he never stopped. We look better with Davis in the side, but we need suitable backup in Jan for him as he can't carry the front line alone until May.
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He's excellent in the air, he's got pace, incredibly strong, excellent touch and can hold off players like a Spartan.
The goals will come.
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He's still learning and so far he seems to be demonstrating that he's been doing his homework. It's a good league to be developing in, rather than the pressure cooker of the top division. Hopefully all good preparation for our promotion!
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I liked this stat from Whoscored's Twitter:
"Keinan Davis: Of strikers to attempt 20+ dribbles in the Championship this season, Davis boasts the best success rate (81%)"
Shows he's not just there to launch long balls at, and is prepared to run at defenders himself.
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The important thing we need to remember and this applies to all our promising youngsters, is that we shouldn't be quick to get on his back when he has bad games.
Consistency is always an issue hence why the premiership is spending an obscene amount of money on players instead of patiently bringing through youth.
I've been seriously impressed with his holdup play, the more he demonstrates this quality the more confidence the rest of the team will have in getting up the pitch to support.
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I liked this stat from Whoscored's Twitter:
"Keinan Davis: Of strikers to attempt 20+ dribbles in the Championship this season, Davis boasts the best success rate (81%)"
Shows he's not just there to launch long balls at, and is prepared to run at defenders himself.
I saw that as well and it really doesn't surprise me. He's seriously strong and has a low centre of gravity for his height so he just doesn't get knocked off the ball easily at all.
For me that's what really sets him apart from the moores and others that have been mentioned. Having decent technical skills can be enough, at many levels, to make you look like a world beater but if you don't have great pace or power then you need to move from decent to excellent to make the step up. Having pace or strength allows you to 'dodge' that need and make the step up easily and quickly. Hence Davis looks like he may well become a regular in the squad and RHM, who was ahead of him until this summer, is struggling to get any game time (although fitness is playing a big part there as well). If he coasts from here he'll have a good career at this level, if he really pushes himself he can be a regular in the premier league for me.
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Agree he’s got a very good touch and good dribbling technique
Definitely needs to focus on finishing though.
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So far so good however crunch time will come when opposition coaches start studying him closely and plan properly to stop him from functioning effectively. It's then he has to deal with that and still make an impact. Signs are that he will develop in to a very good player.
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So far so good however crunch time will come when opposition coaches start studying him closely and plan properly to stop him from functioning effectively. It's then he has to deal with that and still make an impact. Signs are that he will develop in to a very good player.
They've already been doing that - Preston away was a good example - but he is a handful of a player. He will develop into some player, injuries and attitude allowing.
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He's been great. A few more goals would have been nice but hopefully Bruce has told him not to worry about that too much for now.
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Watching the extended highlights you can see how he manages to make space and pick out some good passes. He's bringing so much more to the team than just goals, I reckon the goals will come.
The last thing we need him to do is start shooting at every opportunity because he's getting stressed.
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Watching the extended highlights you can see how he manages to make space and pick out some good passes. He's bringing so much more to the team than just goals, I reckon the goals will come.
The last thing we need him to do is start shooting at every opportunity because he's getting stressed.
There was an incident on Saturday when he tried to score but he should have knocked it across the box to Adomah who was unmarked which would have probably put us 3-1 up. He'll learn from it though.
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So far so good however crunch time will come when opposition coaches start studying him closely and plan properly to stop him from functioning effectively. It's then he has to deal with that and still make an impact. Signs are that he will develop in to a very good player.
That's where being a big fucker, or quick, or having exceptional talent, makes or breaks a player. Davis is Strong and quick enough to be effective even if he's targeted, so long as we have players supporting him and using the space that teams getting tighter on him creates.
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Watching the extended highlights you can see how he manages to make space and pick out some good passes. He's bringing so much more to the team than just goals, I reckon the goals will come.
The last thing we need him to do is start shooting at every opportunity because he's getting stressed.
Agree. It’s more that he did have a header and a chance on the break where he might have scored with more conviction. He’s got the power but I’m not sure you see that often enough in his shooting / heading
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Watching the extended highlights you can see how he manages to make space and pick out some good passes. He's bringing so much more to the team than just goals, I reckon the goals will come.
The last thing we need him to do is start shooting at every opportunity because he's getting stressed.
There was an incident on Saturday when he tried to score but he should have knocked it across the box to Adomah who was unmarked which would have probably put us 3-1 up. He'll learn from it though.
That has to come naturally, if you try to coach that out of his game you ruin him. Strikers have to be arrogant enough to know they can score but humble enough to accept that it's a simpler chance for someone else. Getting that balance right is something that he has to get to naturally and, for now, it's not one I'd worry about.
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I liked this stat from Whoscored's Twitter:
"Keinan Davis: Of strikers to attempt 20+ dribbles in the Championship this season, Davis boasts the best success rate (81%)"
Shows he's not just there to launch long balls at, and is prepared to run at defenders himself.
I saw that as well and it really doesn't surprise me. He's seriously strong and has a low centre of gravity for his height so he just doesn't get knocked off the ball easily at all.
For me that's what really sets him apart from the moores and others that have been mentioned. Having decent technical skills can be enough, at many levels, to make you look like a world beater but if you don't have great pace or power then you need to move from decent to excellent to make the step up. Having pace or strength allows you to 'dodge' that need and make the step up easily and quickly. Hence Davis looks like he may well become a regular in the squad and RHM, who was ahead of him until this summer, is struggling to get any game time (although fitness is playing a big part there as well). If he coasts from here he'll have a good career at this level, if he really pushes himself he can be a regular in the premier league for me.
His awareness of others and weight of pass has also impressed me. I think he's got the lot.
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I wouldn't say "he's got the lot". Especially for our main front man.
Goals and assists - 2 and 1? - in 17 games is hardly someone who's "got the lot".
I know he's only 20 in February, but let's not pretend this guy is anywhere near what we need to get up to, let alone stay up in the top division.
We need Kodjia bag and banging them in or we're going to struggle to catch the top 2. Adomah is not going to carry on as he is, unless he's suddenly become a 50 million pound player.
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I wouldn't say "he's got the lot". Especially for our main front man.
Goals and assists - 2 and 1? - in 17 games is hardly someone who's "got the lot".
I know he's only 20 in February, but let's not pretend this guy is anywhere near what we need to get up to, let alone stay up in the top division.
We need Kodjia bag and banging them in or we're going to struggle to catch the top 2. Adomah is not going to carry on as he is, unless he's suddenly become a 50 million pound player.
Have you been watching the same games as the rest of us? I agree he hasn't 'got the lot' yet. But when he's on form he's unplayable at this level so to suggest "he's nowhere near what we need to get up" is just daft.
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Yep. I've seen him up close and I'm not seeing this "got the lot" player some of you are.
I've heard it all before though. We've been fed so much dog shit, over the last few years, that corned beef now looks like chateaubriand to some.
He has some potential, as we've seen often from young Villa players. But, until he starts scoring goals - something a good striker should he able to do (especially at this level) - then it all seems a little over the top.
He's playing regularly as we don't appear to have a lot of options at the moment. He hasn't disgraced himself, but he's being massively helped by Adomah being in a rich vein of form. If Adomah starts being targeted, or picks up an injury, then we will struggle. At that point the weight will well be in Davis' shoulders.
I can almost guarantee that we will need more than a main striker who "holds the ball up well" as the season hots up. We will need goals.
Sunderland at home, with the team on a high, should be a great time for a young striker to score a couple. Let's hope he does.
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Yep. I've seen him up close and I'm not seeing this "got the lot" player some of you are.
I've heard it all before though. We've been fed so much dog shit, over the last few years, that corned beef now looks like chateaubriand to some.
He has some potential, as we've seen often from young Villa players. But, until he starts scoring goals - something a good striker should he able to do (especially at this level) - then it all seems a little over the top.
He's playing regularly as we don't appear to have a lot of options at the moment. He hasn't disgraced himself, but he's being massively helped by Adomah being in a rich vein of form. If Adomah starts being targeted, or picks up an injury, then we will struggle. At that point the weight will well be in Davis' shoulders.
I can almost guarantee that we will need more than a main striker who "holds the ball up well" as the season hots up. We will need goals.
Sunderland at home, with the team on a high, should be a great time for a young striker to score a couple. Let's hope he does.
You're making an assumption there which ruins the whole argument. I think you can easily replace helped by with integral to in there. Adomah is gambling on things happening in the box and getting himself in where he can do damage. Davis has played a big part in those things happening in the box. Onomah and Snodgrass are benefiting as well, for the same reason.
I agree that he needs to score more, and I doubt anyone will disagree with you there, but as a lone striker with 3 attacking midfielders behind him he has all the right skills to be a great player. Hard work, experience and confidence will decide if he makes it but you can't look at his game and pick technical faults that need to be fixed or physical limitations that are going against him.
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He's brilliant. I'm way too old to have a favourite player. But Keinan is my favourite player.
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He's brilliant. I'm way too old to have a favourite player. But Keinan is my favourite player.
same and same
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He's brilliant. I'm way too old to have a favourite player. But Keinan is my favourite player.
Mine too. And I saw him first, so ner.
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Adomah has had good spells before any of us heard of Davis, as Adomah is a proven player, and goal scorer, at this level.
As I said. He's got promise, but he's nowhere near a decent striker yet. It's all a bit 'Emperors new clothes' for me. I get we're desperate for a new Gary Shaw, but this lads a long way from it. He's not even a Vassell or Agbonlahor yet.
Prove me wrong, Davis. Show the 2nd Division you know how this score. Starting against those bums, Blunderland.
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I saw a player terrorise the entire back four with his pace, power and persistence on Saturday. He created so much room for the equally physical Onomah, Snodgrass and Adomah. The rate of his development from Brighton at home to now is startling.
He's getting into some great positions and given this and how much power he can generate in the air then I think he will score 15 goals this term if he keeps developing and playing.
There's nothing you can do to stop him when he plays like he did on Saturday. He is bigger, quicker, sharper and faster than any centre half in this league. Unless you're employing the dark arts like Bolton, he will bully the life out of you.
Not a decent player? Ok.
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Adomah has had good spells before any of us heard of Davis, as Adomah is a proven player, and goal scorer, at this level.
As I said. He's got promise, but he's nowhere near a decent striker yet. It's all a bit 'Emperors new clothes' for me. I get we're desperate for a new Gary Shaw, but this lads a long way from it. He's not even a Vassell or Agbonlahor yet.
Prove me wrong, Davis. Show the 2nd Division you know how this score. Starting against those bums, Blunderland.
You're right - he's nowhere near the sort of player that Shaw was. Shaw played off a big man. Davis IS the big man.
Davis is in the mould of the Villa version of Benteke: big, strong and aggressive. He has not reached the ptoential that he promises but he has - if you read the weight of opinion here - the wherewithal to become very, very good.
The reason people here are saying that he is already a decent player is that others around him are starting to show their value, and the reason is that Davis is occupying defenders and allowing others to play. I don't think people's reactions on here are hyperbole.
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What was his goal scoring record like for the U21s?
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What was his goal scoring record like for the U21s?
Going by this - https://www.transfermarkt.com/keinan-davis/leistungsdaten/spieler/412660/plus/0?saison=ges - 6 goals and 6 assists in 26 games at U23. Not stellar but reasonable enough to suggest he should make double figures, remember though he was still U18 eligible last year so he was very young even for that level.
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I was privileged to have witnessed his display against Norwich which had us all pleasantly surprised. And I was there on Saturday and witnessed an equally powerful display that definitely unhinged QPR's defenders. But I've also witnessed him being pretty anonymous. Has he "got the lot?" maybe, but he's not yet reached his full potential. Has he got exciting potential? Fucking hell yes. Let's just sit back and enjoy the ride.
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Hell yeh 😃
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I saw a player terrorise the entire back four with his pace, power and persistence on Saturday. He created so much room for the equally physical Onomah, Snodgrass and Adomah. The rate of his development from Brighton at home to now is startling.
He's getting into some great positions and given this and how much power he can generate in the air then I think he will score 15 goals this term if he keeps developing and playing.
There's nothing you can do to stop him when he plays like he did on Saturday. He is bigger, quicker, sharper and faster than any centre half in this league. Unless you're employing the dark arts like Bolton, he will bully the life out of you.
Not a decent player? Ok.
Sheffield Wednesday managed to make him look 15, never mind 19.
By the way, there is a long way between "decent" and "got the lot".
He looks like he could be decent at this level. But, even to achieve that, most clubs insist on a striker who scores. People worrying about Man Utd and the likes pinching him any time soon sums up the level of hyperbole I am referring to. It's bad enough people suggesting we're better off without Kodjia, and i know we live in an era of hype at the blink of an eye, but that kind of talk is ludicrous.
He's done OK in the Championship, "for a 19 year old", without looking like a regular goalscorer, that's about it so far.
Once/if he starts banging in the goals, I'll think about believing some of the hype.
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I don't understand why some folk seem to be negative about a 19 year old, who in his first full season at the club is giving us something to cheer about.
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I saw a player terrorise the entire back four with his pace, power and persistence on Saturday. He created so much room for the equally physical Onomah, Snodgrass and Adomah. The rate of his development from Brighton at home to now is startling.
He's getting into some great positions and given this and how much power he can generate in the air then I think he will score 15 goals this term if he keeps developing and playing.
There's nothing you can do to stop him when he plays like he did on Saturday. He is bigger, quicker, sharper and faster than any centre half in this league. Unless you're employing the dark arts like Bolton, he will bully the life out of you.
Not a decent player? Ok.
Sheffield Wednesday managed to make him look 15, never mind 19.
By the way, there is a long way between "decent" and "got the lot".
He looks like he could be decent at this level. But, even to achieve that, most clubs insist on a striker who scores. People worrying about Man Utd and the likes pinching him any time soon sums up the level of hyperbole I am referring to. It's bad enough people suggesting we're better off without Kodjia, and i know we live in an era of hype at the blink of an eye, but that kind of talk is ludicrous.
He's done OK in the Championship, "for a 19 year old", without looking like a regular goalscorer, that's about it so far.
Once/if he starts banging in the goals, I'll think about believing some of the hype.
You have said "he is nowhere near what we need to get promoted" and "he's nowhere near a decent striker"
None of us think he's Messi, but we've seen enough to suggest he is a very talented lad who has had a fantastic impact on the team in a number of games.
He clearly is decent and could well be what we need to get promoted. It seems to me the person taking an exaggerated stance here is you.
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Keinan has done wonderfully well -three MOM awards for a nineteen year-old? Not bad.
We all need to understand that young players' form tends to fluctuate -in fact, we've all seen that already this season with KD.
We desperately need him not to get injured or suspended before Jan!!
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He's played in 14 league games this season, and we've lost two of them. The record with him playing is W8, D4, L2. If that's repeated over the next 28 games, we'll almost certainly be in the automatic promotion positions.
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I saw a player terrorise the entire back four with his pace, power and persistence on Saturday. He created so much room for the equally physical Onomah, Snodgrass and Adomah. The rate of his development from Brighton at home to now is startling.
He's getting into some great positions and given this and how much power he can generate in the air then I think he will score 15 goals this term if he keeps developing and playing.
There's nothing you can do to stop him when he plays like he did on Saturday. He is bigger, quicker, sharper and faster than any centre half in this league. Unless you're employing the dark arts like Bolton, he will bully the life out of you.
Not a decent player? Ok.
Sheffield Wednesday managed to make him look 15, never mind 19.
By the way, there is a long way between "decent" and "got the lot".
He looks like he could be decent at this level. But, even to achieve that, most clubs insist on a striker who scores. People worrying about Man Utd and the likes pinching him any time soon sums up the level of hyperbole I am referring to. It's bad enough people suggesting we're better off without Kodjia, and i know we live in an era of hype at the blink of an eye, but that kind of talk is ludicrous.
He's done OK in the Championship, "for a 19 year old", without looking like a regular goalscorer, that's about it so far.
Once/if he starts banging in the goals, I'll think about believing some of the hype.
When I said 'he's got the lot', I didn't mean he's the finished article, but that he has a full range of skills not often seen in a player of his size, which at 19 suggests some serious potential.
You seem to have grasped at this quote today as some kind of evidence that every is losing their mind whilst you are the only one moored in reality, whereas actually you're just coming on like a know-nothing sixth form bore.
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What was his goal scoring record like for the U21s?
Going by this - https://www.transfermarkt.com/keinan-davis/leistungsdaten/spieler/412660/plus/0?saison=ges - 6 goals and 6 assists in 26 games at U23. Not stellar but reasonable enough to suggest he should make double figures, remember though he was still U18 eligible last year so he was very young even for that level.
I don't think he'll ever be a goalscorer. But what he will do is chip in with a decent amount but more importantly create space and opportunities for others. What set Benteke apart was his ability to do both. Davis will have done well to get to that level. But right now he's evolving into a very effective CF, and one with a number of other technical skills and assets that are starting to emerge.
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What was his goal scoring record like for the U21s?
Going by this - https://www.transfermarkt.com/keinan-davis/leistungsdaten/spieler/412660/plus/0?saison=ges - 6 goals and 6 assists in 26 games at U23. Not stellar but reasonable enough to suggest he should make double figures, remember though he was still U18 eligible last year so he was very young even for that level.
I don't think he'll ever be a goalscorer. But what he will do is chip in with a decent amount but more importantly create space and opportunities for others. What set Benteke apart was his ability to do both. Davis will have done well to get to that level. But right now he's evolving into a very effective CF, and one with a number of other technical skills and assets that are starting to emerge.
Agreed. I really don't mind of he scores or not. Right now he is this reliable steel up front who allows the rest of the attack to come into play and often score. It works and he is very good at it.
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I don't understand why some folk seem to be negative about a 19 year old, who in his first full season at the club is giving us something to cheer about.
It's an alternative view to "sign him up quick as Man Utd will be poaching him".
I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
We're accepting that it's ok for our main striker not to be a goalscorer - as he's "only 19" and Adomah's on a hot streak - but that view won't last long if we fail to get promoted.
If Kodjia is going to be out all season, and Davis is not a goalscorer (as most seem to agree), I hope to god we have a back up plan, and Bruce isn't also getting suckered into believing the hype. We are going to need goals.
Make no mistake, not going up again this season will be a massive failure. Excuses like "had to rely on a 19 year old striker, so it's not too bad" will not cut it.
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Cheer up, misery arse. Davis is brilliant.
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Cheer up, misery arse. Davis is brilliant.
We obviously have different definitions of "brilliant".
I'll make a deal with you though. I'll cheer up when we're top of the table and Davis is banging the goals in, like a proper striker should. ;)
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The goals will come, of that I'm sure. Compare him to the likes of McCormack and Hogan, who cost the thick end of £25m between the two of them, are probably on at least £50K a week each, and have contributed precisely the square root of fuck all since they arrived.
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Why did you put got the lot in quotation marks to me when I've not said he's "got the lot.". Having scanned through posts I can't see who has said that.
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Why did you put got the lot in quotation marks to me when I've not said he's "got the lot.". Having scanned through posts I can't see who has said that.
LeeB said it, a few posts before yours. I agree with him.
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I'm more inclined to agree with Lee as well.
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I think it is fantastic to watch a player of his age and potential.
Keeping him fit is our biggest concern because we look a lot better team with him.
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Cheer up, misery arse. Davis is brilliant.
We obviously have different definitions of "brilliant".
I'll make a deal with you though. I'll cheer up when we're top of the table and Davis is banging the goals in, like a proper striker should. ;)
Midst all the wind-up posts, the general view here seems to be that Davis is in the mould of the Classic CF: big, strong and aggressive. He has not reached the potential that he promises but he has the wherewithal to become very, very good.
The reason people here are saying that he is already a decent player is that others around him are starting to show their value, and a reason for this is that Davis is occupying defenders and allowing others to play. I don't think people's reactions on here are hyperbole, as long as he stays fit and stays grounded attitudinally.
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The goals will come, of that I'm sure. Compare him to the likes of McCormack and Hogan, who cost the thick end of £25m between the two of them, are probably on at least £50K a week each, and have contributed precisely the square root of fuck all since they arrived.
Quite right, he deserves our support on that alone.
If he continues to improve then even better
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
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Don't worry my friend after the latest brexit vote you will feel no pain, no pain whatsoever!
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
75 just to let you know I’ve posted loads of negative views on here over the years no ones ever tried to stop me
so I think your talking shit with that sort of ‘I’m the victim’ nonsense
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Shut up John you knobber!
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The kids love him, that'll do for me. It's the future, we need the likes of Keinan.
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I said a while back and still think it's the case, he'll be a Heskey type player. Which isn't the insult some will think it is, he won't score loads but the rest of the attackers will love playing with him, and him being on the pitch will make us a better side.
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The kids love him, that'll do for me. It's the future, we need the likes of Keinan.
Glad you clarified that, I still thought we were talking about John.
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
75 just to let you know I’ve posted loads of negative views on here over the years no ones ever tried to stop me
so I think your talking shit with that sort of ‘I’m the victim’ nonsense
I'd rather you didn't use other people's words and put them in my mouth, if you don't mind.
I'm not claiming to be a "victim" - how very dramatic and 21st century - I'm pointing out that there are a number of posters on here who jump on anyone who dares to offer an alternative view to "he's great/everything is fine and dandy", as it's deemed "negative". Not everyone. But some.
I take it you've never seen the "where are all the negative Nancys?", after Villa manage to win a game or two?
I'm offering an alternative view on Davis, nothing more. I appreciate he's the latest favourite, and some take my views as negative, but I'm not claiming to be a victim.
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Shut up John you knobber!
ha ha there’s always exceptions
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
75 just to let you know I’ve posted loads of negative views on here over the years no ones ever tried to stop me
so I think your talking shit with that sort of ‘I’m the victim’ nonsense
I'd rather you didn't use other people's words and put them in my mouth, if you don't mind.
I'm not claiming to be a "victim" - how very dramatic and 21st century - I'm pointing out that there are a number of posters on here who jump on anyone who dares to offer an alternative view to "he's great/everything is fine and dandy", as it's deemed "negative". Not everyone. But some.
I take it you've never seen the "where are all the negative Nancys?", after Villa manage to win a game or two?
I'm offering an alternative view on Davis, nothing more. I appreciate he's the latest favourite, and some take my views as negative, but I'm not claiming to be a victim.
The suspicion is that you offer an alternative view just because it is that, as opposed to having any merit or basis in reality.
I mean, I could offer an alternative view that David Davis looks to be a safe pair of hands in complete control of Brexit negotiations, but it would be bollocks, and I'd be an idiot to then claim that those that disagreed with me were somehow ganging up on me.
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
75 just to let you know I’ve posted loads of negative views on here over the years no ones ever tried to stop me
so I think your talking shit with that sort of ‘I’m the victim’ nonsense
I'd rather you didn't use other people's words and put them in my mouth, if you don't mind.
I'm not claiming to be a "victim" - how very dramatic and 21st century - I'm pointing out that there are a number of posters on here who jump on anyone who dares to offer an alternative view to "he's great/everything is fine and dandy", as it's deemed "negative". Not everyone. But some.
I take it you've never seen the "where are all the negative Nancys?", after Villa manage to win a game or two?
I'm offering an alternative view on Davis, nothing more. I appreciate he's the latest favourite, and some take my views as negative, but I'm not claiming to be a victim.
The suspicion is that you offer an alternative view just because it is that, as opposed to having any merit or basis in reality.
I mean, I could offer an alternative view that David Davis looks to be a safe pair of hands in complete control of Brexit negotiations, but it would be bollocks, and I'd be an idiot to then claim that those that disagreed with me were somehow ganging up on me.
I'm arguing that Davis has not "got the lot" and we don't "have to worry about Man Utd poaching him" any time soon. Taking his 2 goals and 1 assist in 17 games, I'd say that is "reality".
I've also not said anything about people "ganging up on me".
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I know alternative views are not welcome when they are perceived as "negative", but it doesn't automatically make them wrong.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Violence inherent in the system! Violence inherent in the system!
75 just to let you know I’ve posted loads of negative views on here over the years no ones ever tried to stop me
so I think your talking shit with that sort of ‘I’m the victim’ nonsense
I'd rather you didn't use other people's words and put them in my mouth, if you don't mind.
I'm not claiming to be a "victim" - how very dramatic and 21st century - I'm pointing out that there are a number of posters on here who jump on anyone who dares to offer an alternative view to "he's great/everything is fine and dandy", as it's deemed "negative". Not everyone. But some.
I take it you've never seen the "where are all the negative Nancys?", after Villa manage to win a game or two?
I'm offering an alternative view on Davis, nothing more. I appreciate he's the latest favourite, and some take my views as negative, but I'm not claiming to be a victim.
The suspicion is that you offer an alternative view just because it is that, as opposed to having any merit or basis in reality.
I mean, I could offer an alternative view that David Davis looks to be a safe pair of hands in complete control of Brexit negotiations, but it would be bollocks, and I'd be an idiot to then claim that those that disagreed with me were somehow ganging up on me.
I'm arguing that Davis has not "got the lot" and we don't "have to worry about Man Utd poaching him" any time soon. Taking his 2 goals and 1 assist in 17 games, I'd say that is "reality".
I've also not said anything about people "ganging up on me".
Other than the fact that they scouted him a few times according to numerous sources. Signing any 19 year old is done on the basis of the player he might be in 3-4 years rather than who he is today and most people have seen enough to suggest he's got enough about him to be a very good player by then. That includes the FA/national team setup who have pulled him into the under 20s and a lot of pundits who are very positive about him. On top of that one of the most complete scouting tools around is the football manager database and they've improved him massively for the newest release. Everything points to a player with a rapidly growing reputation, which is why people are excited.
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I'm talking about now, not 3-4 years from now, or Football Manager 2018.
Perhaps that's why my opinion is at odds with some on here.
For those lucky enough to watch. How did he do tonight?
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I'm talking about now, not 3-4 years from now, or Football Manager 2018.
Perhaps that's why my opinion is at odds with some on here.
For those lucky enough to watch. How did he do tonight?
He's doing very well. In 3-4 years time we'll probably wave goodbye to McCormack and Hogan.
Thank goodness for Mr Davis.
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I'm talking about now, not 3-4 years from now, or Football Manager 2018.
Perhaps that's why my opinion is at odds with some on here.
For those lucky enough to watch. How did he do tonight?
woeful tonight
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I'm talking about now, not 3-4 years from now, or Football Manager 2018.
Perhaps that's why my opinion is at odds with some on here.
For those lucky enough to watch. How did he do tonight?
Seriously poor. If he hadn't had so many greta games before any outside observer would write him off. Happily we know better but boy he had a bit of a stinker tonight.
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It looks lovely like 2 games in 4 Days is too much for him at the moment.
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He's a young kid and he's going to have games like tonight especially playing as the lone striker but that's ok.
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I agree Clampy - Hogan and Gabby back soon I hope, also any news on Green or RHM ?
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I agree Clampy - Hogan and Gabby back soon I hope, also any news on Green or RHM ?
Hogan is about as useful as a chocolate teapot.
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I agree Clampy - Hogan and Gabby back soon I hope, also any news on Green or RHM ?
Hogan is about as useful as a chocolate teapot.
I know I am always chipping in as a Hogan fanboy, but forgive me. I do think the lad will come good. His stomach issue he had the operation on may have impacted him for some time. I am keen to see how he is when he gets back.
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He's a young kid and he's going to have games like tonight especially playing as the lone striker but that's ok.
Agree and that's why we need another option who can carry out that role.
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There isn't a player in the world that doesn't have a crap game at times, especially a 19 year old that's only started about a dozen games.
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KEINAN DAVIS’ rise to fame at Aston Villa came as a shock to most people.
However, to Dave Northfield, his former manager at Biggleswade FC, it was predictable.
Davis, 19, has cemented himself in Steve Bruce’s starting XI at Villa Park this season.
The striker has netted two goals and chipped in with an assist in 12 Championship starts but the stats don’t do the youngster justice.
His infectious work rate, partnered with his ability to hold the ball up as well as run the channels has made him a valuable member of Villa’s promotion-chasing squad.
Davis was released from Stevenage’s academy in 2015 for being too small and joined Biggleswade Town’s Under-18 side, managed by Northfield.
And the now Biggleswade FC joint-manager realised he had a real player on his hands, especially once he played Davis in his correct position.
“Whilst he was playing at Stevenage, what was obvious was that he was their best finisher but they rarely played him as a centre-forward,” Northfield exclusively told Starsport.
"They often played him as a left winger because he was left footed, which was not where he should be playing. That was obvious from the outset.
“As soon as we picked him up, we played him at centre-forward. Obviously I got that right!
“When he started playing for us, we had Norwich, Ipswich - he actually played a couple of games for Ipswich - and Fulham all after him. They all questioned me and asked ‘Are you sure he is a centre-forward and not a wide player?’
“I told them he was a striker. He can play both ways. He can play with his back to goal, as he’s doing at Villa which is what they love about him, but he can also play on the shoulder and you can play him in.
“He can also run with the ball well and he’d draw in other players. For us, he would go through the middle and pull it back for midfielders to score.”
Davis was then picked up by Villa after they sent scouts to watch the striker on numerous occasions.
However, Northfield says the Villans took their time before deciding to offer the youngster a trial.
“He was spotted in our games, especially in our FA Cup run. Villa had a scout watch him about 10 times,” he added.
“They took a long time to make their decision. Other clubs came in late but Villa had done all the work on him.
“He went and trained at Ipswich before training at Villa. They wanted to sign him on a six-week trial.
“I told them he was going to Villa and we promised him a week there. He did that and he loved it there.”
Davis often cuts a reserved figure and rarely shows emotion when appearing for Villa under Bruce.
And Northfield, whose humility was refreshing when listening to him talk about his former player, revealed he often tells Davis to play with a smile on his face, as that’s when he’s most dangerous out on the pitch.
"He’s a quiet lad, as it’s well reported, I’ve said this to him, he just needs to smile,” Northfield said. “As soon as he got comfortable, then he became the Keinan Davis he is now.
“It’s not down to me, we put him in a friendly environment, where he enjoyed it and there wasn’t the pressure.
“He rarely got a shouting at because that wasn’t what we were looking to do.
“When I speak to him now, I tell him, if you’ve got a smile on your face, people are in trouble.
“If he’s confident, then he will be at the top of his game.”
Davis has been linked with a move away from Villa in recent weeks, with Manchester United and Arsenal tracking the youngster.
Both clubs have sent scouts to watch the dominant striker in action for the Championship giants this season.
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He's a young kid and he's going to have games like tonight especially playing as the lone striker but that's ok.
I imagine that is the first time he has played against a defender with O’Shea’s depth of experience and he looked lost. It didn’t help that we were too slow in getting the ball forward to him but hopefully he will learn from it.
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He looked shattered in the last 10 at QPR and tonight seemed a game too far. Extra days rest for Saturday and I'd play Jack closer to him as well.
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He looked shattered in the last 10 at QPR and tonight seemed a game too far. Extra days rest for Saturday and I'd play Jack closer to him as well.
I think they will work well together and Jack's presence and ability to make space for himself will benefit Davis greatly.
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How refreshing that our only striker had a bad game and we still won.
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How refreshing that our only striker had a bad game and we still won.
to be fair he wasn’t the only one
and we still won. Yaaaay
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He's a young kid and he's going to have games like tonight especially playing as the lone striker but that's ok.
I imagine that is the first time he has played against a defender with O’Shea’s depth of experience and he looked lost. It didn’t help that we were too slow in getting the ball forward to him but hopefully he will learn from it.
Hourihane and Whelan were so deep, that Gibson was able to smother Onomah without pressure so Davis ended up being isolated. Couple that with fatigue and he looked poor. He'll learn and learn quickly though.
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KEINAN DAVIS’ rise to fame at Aston Villa came as a shock to most people.
However, to Dave Northfield, his former manager at Biggleswade FC, it was predictable.
Davis, 19, has cemented himself in Steve Bruce’s starting XI at Villa Park this season.
The striker has netted two goals and chipped in with an assist in 12 Championship starts but the stats don’t do the youngster justice.
His infectious work rate, partnered with his ability to hold the ball up as well as run the channels has made him a valuable member of Villa’s promotion-chasing squad.
Davis was released from Stevenage’s academy in 2015 for being too small and joined Biggleswade Town’s Under-18 side, managed by Northfield.
And the now Biggleswade FC joint-manager realised he had a real player on his hands, especially once he played Davis in his correct position.
“Whilst he was playing at Stevenage, what was obvious was that he was their best finisher but they rarely played him as a centre-forward,” Northfield exclusively told Starsport.
"They often played him as a left winger because he was left footed, which was not where he should be playing. That was obvious from the outset.
“As soon as we picked him up, we played him at centre-forward. Obviously I got that right!
“When he started playing for us, we had Norwich, Ipswich - he actually played a couple of games for Ipswich - and Fulham all after him. They all questioned me and asked ‘Are you sure he is a centre-forward and not a wide player?’
“I told them he was a striker. He can play both ways. He can play with his back to goal, as he’s doing at Villa which is what they love about him, but he can also play on the shoulder and you can play him in.
“He can also run with the ball well and he’d draw in other players. For us, he would go through the middle and pull it back for midfielders to score.”
Davis was then picked up by Villa after they sent scouts to watch the striker on numerous occasions.
However, Northfield says the Villans took their time before deciding to offer the youngster a trial.
“He was spotted in our games, especially in our FA Cup run. Villa had a scout watch him about 10 times,” he added.
“They took a long time to make their decision. Other clubs came in late but Villa had done all the work on him.
“He went and trained at Ipswich before training at Villa. They wanted to sign him on a six-week trial.
“I told them he was going to Villa and we promised him a week there. He did that and he loved it there.”
Davis often cuts a reserved figure and rarely shows emotion when appearing for Villa under Bruce.
And Northfield, whose humility was refreshing when listening to him talk about his former player, revealed he often tells Davis to play with a smile on his face, as that’s when he’s most dangerous out on the pitch.
"He’s a quiet lad, as it’s well reported, I’ve said this to him, he just needs to smile,” Northfield said. “As soon as he got comfortable, then he became the Keinan Davis he is now.
“It’s not down to me, we put him in a friendly environment, where he enjoyed it and there wasn’t the pressure.
“He rarely got a shouting at because that wasn’t what we were looking to do.
“When I speak to him now, I tell him, if you’ve got a smile on your face, people are in trouble.
“If he’s confident, then he will be at the top of his game.”
Davis has been linked with a move away from Villa in recent weeks, with Manchester United and Arsenal tracking the youngster.
Both clubs have sent scouts to watch the dominant striker in action for the Championship giants this season.
Note to Alan Brazil. We won the league in 1981.
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It looks like I'm on my own but I don't think Davis had a shocker last night.
Whilst he didn't do too much with the ball, as soon as he went off nothing stuck up top and we ended up clinging on for 20 minutes, at home to bottom of the league.
I think there's a massive expectation gap here. He's 19 years old and two years ago was on the books of a non-league side. Yes it'd be nice for him to score more goals but his overall play considering his inexperience is fantastic.
All that said, the fact we finished the game with Elmohamady as our lone striker shows that Bruce needs to go shopping in January. The way we play we need someone up front who can hold on to the ball and bring the midfield in to play. Crouchy on loan might be worth a punt...
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Clinging on? I don't think they had another shot.
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Yeah he was poor last night but he's only a kid
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We shouldn’t be getting too excited when he has good games or too down when he has poor ones. The kid has a lot of potential and therefore a lot to learn. Yesterday the whole team looked static and cumbersome, so not just him. It’s absolutely conceivable he could have a very good game again vs Ipswich. What Bruce has to start doing where possible is rotate the starting line up. Though granted at the moment this is a lot more challenging with our forwards or at CB.
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I’d even stick Adomah up front for Saturday with Jack coming in on the left. Give Keinan a little break.
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I’d even stick Adomah up front for Saturday with Jack coming in on the left. Give Keinan a little break.
Tend to agree. But how did we look w Adomah up top? Well have to cut out the direct stuff
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I’d even stick Adomah up front for Saturday with Jack coming in on the left. Give Keinan a little break.
Tend to agree. But how did we look w Adomah up top? Well have to cut out the direct stuff
We looked 2nd best and created absolutely nothing.
Clinging on? I don't think they had another shot.
That says more about them than us. Our possession dropped off a cliff once Davis went off as anything long came straight back at us. Whereas with Davis on the pitch it stuck more often than it didn't.
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I’d even stick Adomah up front for Saturday with Jack coming in on the left. Give Keinan a little break.
Adomah up front on Saturday is not going to work, IMHO.
If Davis doesn't play, I'd actually look to play O'Hare or McKirdy with Jack behind. The brief to the striker would be: run the channels, keep the CB's on the move and open up spaces behind / around you for Adomah and Snod to cut in from the wings. The key to this would be for the team to stop lumping th eball up the park but to find a more subtle passing approach (hmmmm, some hope!).
If Davis does play, he will need someone working alot more closely with him: part of his challenge last night was that he rarely had anyone close to him to take some of the load and also benefit from his knock-downs. O'Hare, again, might be a good option to partner Davis.
The third option would be: play Samba as a striker and push Hutton into CB.
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When I’ve seen McKirdy in the first team he didn’t look at all ready
O’Hare does. But it’s a huge ask for him to make his debut in a position he’s never player before. Plus he’s tiny
Adomah for me. Or as you say, needs must and Samba
I’m not expecting a great performance on Saturday. I’ll take any sort of win
December is going to be really tough, especially the back end where it’s very congested. Vital that RHM and Gabby (!) come back soon
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Looking at the size of him I’m shocked he was released earlier in his career for being too small!!
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I’m astonished some want him rested this weekend. He will have had 4 days of taking it easy. For a 19 year old that’s sufficient to at least have him at 80% which is far bettter than any of the alternatives that are being considered. He has to play, we need him.
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RHM getting first game next week v Sheffield U in a cup game.
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Off-topic but do we know when Andre Green is back?
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If O'Hare or Grealish, can come in as one of a 5 in midfield , but be allowed to alternate with Connor as the player pressing forward to support Davis, ensuring they support through the middle allowing Albert and Snodgrass to keep pressing down the flanks, this would allow Bruce to be safe with his need to cover without the ball, but give Davis much needed support. My only worry using Grealish is his lack of tackling ability.
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I’m astonished some want him rested this weekend. He will have had 4 days of taking it easy. For a 19 year old that’s sufficient to at least have him at 80% which is far bettter than any of the alternatives that are being considered. He has to play, we need him.
This.
A tired Davis is more use to us than Adomah, Elmo, or Samba as the target man.
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I agree. I wouldn't move Albert, he's in form in his current position, so I'd keep him there. Start Davis again, if he's knackered in the second half, then make some changes.
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Davis has to start Saturday. If he gets tired (working on the basis of an unchanged line up) then sling Jedinak up there to play "post.
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I’d be astonished if it’s an unchanged line up
Need to freshen it up
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Davis is wicked man. So no rest for the wicked😊
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Fingers crossed it's only a minor knock.
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Bruce just gave his post match interview, didn't even mention him so assume he's fine.
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My son reckoned he took one in the plums.
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Groin pull I thought?
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Someone pulled his plums? Dirty Ipswich.
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He’s fine according to Bruce.
Thought his hold up play today was superb. We just need some goals from him.
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My son reckoned he took one in the plums.
He got booted in the nuts when a defender followed through on a clearance. But that happened after the decision had been made to take him off.
Funnily enough the physio wasn't too keen to rub it better.
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The goals will surely come. Doesn't matter at the minute as he gives so much to the team. What a find.
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Thought he was pretty sluggish but still showed moments of quality hold up play
I doubt he’ll ever score many goals though
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
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Should have had a brace. Second half he bossed them.
Took one right in the nads too.
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His gonads we can live without. His hamstrings we need intact. Without his gonads he will just be a £50 million player with a squeaky voice.
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
Bent and Davis are literally as far apart as I can imagine in terms of strikers!
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My son reckoned he took one in the plums.
He got booted in the nuts when a defender followed through on a clearance. But that happened after the decision had been made to take him off.
Funnily enough the physio wasn't too keen to rub it better.
I have heard the former physio at Chelsea was always eager to do so.
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The goals will come. The ability to dominate defences and link up play is the key thing.
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My son reckoned he took one in the plums.
Funnily enough the physio wasn't too keen to rub it better.
I have heard the former physio at Chelsea was always eager to do so.
I want to type 'Oh dear!' but I'd be a bit of a hypocrite given some of my posts over the years. But yes, 'oh dear!'
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
I certainly see the comparison with our Christian.
We are playing further up the pitch but it does mean he is sometimes horribly isolated (the Blunderland game was a classic example): when he plays, the rest of the team - and the MF in particular - need to support much better. AA is doing it well; RS is beginning to work better with him; it needs a more coaching-intelligent approach.
But: I think he could become a very, very good player who scores and sets up others.
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
I certainly see the comparison with our Christian.
We are playing further up the pitch but it does mean he is sometimes horribly isolated (the Blunderland game was a classic example): when he plays, the rest of the team - and the MF in particular - need to support much better. AA is doing it well; RS is beginning to work better with him; it needs a more coaching-intelligent approach.
But: I think he could become a very, very good player who scores and sets up others.
The problem against Sunderland was that O’Shea had the experience and craft to dominate him, meaning that he was unable to hold the ball up as well as normal. I am sure he will learn from it.
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
I certainly see the comparison with our Christian.
We are playing further up the pitch but it does mean he is sometimes horribly isolated (the Blunderland game was a classic example): when he plays, the rest of the team - and the MF in particular - need to support much better. AA is doing it well; RS is beginning to work better with him; it needs a more coaching-intelligent approach.
But: I think he could become a very, very good player who scores and sets up others.
The problem against Sunderland was that O’Shea had the experience and craft to dominate him, meaning that he was unable to hold the ball up as well as normal. I am sure he will learn from it.
It was certainly part of the problem, Chris, but he was not well supported; the gap between him and the midfielders was way off.
I mean no criticism of him and - you're right - playing against good CB will undoubtedly help his development.
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He's more in the Heskey mould. Everyone he plays with will love him and say how brilliant he is at bringing them into the game, but he isn't a goalacorer. Yes he's still young but you can see he hasn't got that goalscorer's instinct. He needs someone buzzing around him who is a poacher like Heskey and Owen used to do.
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Heskey was cumbersome and clumsy and Davis is agile, dynamic, balanced and skilful. Other than that they are very similar. :)
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Heskey was cumbersome and clumsy and Davis is agile, dynamic, balanced and skilful. Other than that they are very similar. :)
Love the way you comment on absolutely everything I post. Flattering and cute.
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They need to be careful not to overplay him. His style is very physical and he will pick up injuries .The danger is we become so reliant on on him we play him half fit which I believe is what happened with Gabby and has considerably shortened his career.
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Benteke Davis is most definitely not - but he does hold the ball well, which allows others to come into the mix. As for Gabby - well, the prospect of him playing much longer is truly terrifying, at least at our expense.
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Benteke is a better finisher but other than that i wouldn't swap them. Early days for the lad and he's gonna go off the boil sooner to later and have a dip in form but the potential is there to be far better than Benteke who is very one dimensional as a player. If Liverpool think you're surplus to requirements then there must be a good reason - probably because you have to completely set up a side to play to his strengths and put up with large periods of a game where he looks disinterested or can't be arsed.
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Benteke scored every type of goal for us. Bullet headers, acrobatic volleys, cute finishes, free kicks, the lot. He could hold the ball up, he could win it and pick a pass, he could run at defenders and beat them. I think 'one dimensional' is the last phrase I'd use to describe him.
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Benteke scored every type of goal for us. Bullet headers, acrobatic volleys, cute finishes, free kicks, the lot. He could hold the ball up, he could win it and pick a pass, he could run at defenders and beat them. I think 'one dimensional' is the last phrase I'd use to describe him.
I always thought he was overrated and we've had some very overrated forwards in our time. I think if he was that good he wouldn't be currently residing at the premiership's bottom club
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Benteke scored every type of goal for us. Bullet headers, acrobatic volleys, cute finishes, free kicks, the lot. He could hold the ball up, he could win it and pick a pass, he could run at defenders and beat them. I think 'one dimensional' is the last phrase I'd use to describe him.
I always thought he was overrated and we've had some very overrated forwards in our time. I think if he was that good he wouldn't be currently residing at the premiership's bottom club
We'd have gone down two years earlier without his goals. On that basis he was rated appropriately. Regardless of how you rated him he was anything but one dimensional.
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we would have gone down without Bent's goal as well and i wouldn't class him as much more than one dimensional as you had to set-up the team to play totally to his strengths as well or forget it. I'm just saying for a player who could do "bullet headers, cute finishes, the lot" as you say, it's funny the only top 6 team who've had him dumped him as soon as they could, and i don't reckon there will a queue round the block to buy him in January either
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Well he's evidently not the player he was. I've no idea what went wrong at Liverpool as I don't think I ever saw him play there.
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Heskey was cumbersome and clumsy and Davis is agile, dynamic, balanced and skilful. Other than that they are very similar. :)
Love the way you comment on absolutely everything I post. Flattering and cute.
I know I can’t help it but I hope you are not keeping a count😊
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Anyone got information on how KD and RHM combine together?
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Benteke scored every type of goal for us. Bullet headers, acrobatic volleys, cute finishes, free kicks, the lot. He could hold the ball up, he could win it and pick a pass, he could run at defenders and beat them. I think 'one dimensional' is the last phrase I'd use to describe him.
Absolutely. Benteke was/is quality. The only aspect in question should be his attitude and the fact he listens to that mercenary of an agent.
That said, he couldn't wait to escape the Villa so I won't lose any sleep if he never scores a goal again.
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Heskey was cumbersome and clumsy and Davis is agile, dynamic, balanced and skilful. Other than that they are very similar. :)
Heskey was those things as well when he was 19.
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One dimensional is someone like Gestede. Benteke could do pretty much everything you want a striker to do.
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One dimensional is someone like Gestede. Benteke could do pretty much everything you want a striker to do.
Agreed - the Benteke Villa had was multi-dimensional and at times unplayable. With the right management and coaching, as well as plenty of game time, he could be a seriously good player.
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I have no football background but I'd be showing him videos with Shearer and Les Ferdinand.
Practice heavily on headers and long range shooting. These are things you can improve on with training. He has the running and physique.
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Well he's evidently not the player he was. I've no idea what went wrong at Liverpool as I don't think I ever saw him play there.
He got found out. From being the main man and only real attacking threat at Villa and undroppable as such he went to a club where just scoring isn't enough.. He was no longer indispensible at Liverpool, compared with players who put a shift in for 90 minutes . While i agree he was unplayable at times when he fancied it for Villa, he was often just adequate and kept on just for his goal threat and sometimes just not interested at all. i had a look at the old Benteke thread and its certainly not just me who noticed this during his career and it's certainly not my memory playing tricks. If you compare him to his compatriot Lukaku who probably hasn't the ability Benteke has/had, i'm not surprised he's turned out as the more consistent performer.
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Well he's evidently not the player he was. I've no idea what went wrong at Liverpool as I don't think I ever saw him play there.
He got found out. From being the main man and only real attacking threat at Villa and undroppable as such he went to a club where just scoring isn't enough.. He was no longer indispensible at Liverpool, compared with players who put a shift in for 90 minutes . While i agree he was unplayable at times when he fancied it for Villa, he was often just adequate and kept on just for his goal threat and sometimes just not interested at all. i had a look at the old Benteke thread and its certainly not just me who noticed this during his career and it's certainly not my memory playing tricks. If you compare him to his compatriot Lukaku who probably hasn't the ability Benteke has/had, i'm not surprised he's turned out as the more consistent performer.
I've just watched a you tube video (all his goals for villa) He was brilliant. The Liverpool move was disastrous, largely, I imagine because of the managerial situation.
Love that guy, it was a joy to have him.
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well y'knpw, youtube videos........ the Hogan one is pretty impressive too. 8)
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well y'knpw, youtube videos........ the Hogan one is pretty impressive too. 8)
It was a reminder, I watched him in the flesh. I haven't seen many better strikers in our shirt.
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yeah point taken. i was gonna post a Heskey one, fuck me it's like watching pele.
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yeah point taken. i was gonna post a Heskey one, fuck me it's like watching pele.
Yeah, how is Pele these days?
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He is priceless. He is that magic player who makes those around him deliver what they are capable of. Since he burst into the team we have played thirty yards further up the pitch. Our ability to harvest points from games is entirely in parallel with Davis's emergence. He is doing what Darren Bent did for us. He is doing what Christian Benteke did for us. He is making the difference.
I certainly see the comparison with our Christian.
We are playing further up the pitch but it does mean he is sometimes horribly isolated (the Blunderland game was a classic example): when he plays, the rest of the team - and the MF in particular - need to support much better. AA is doing it well; RS is beginning to work better with him; it needs a more coaching-intelligent approach.
But: I think he could become a very, very good player who scores and sets up others.
The problem against Sunderland was that O’Shea had the experience and craft to dominate him, meaning that he was unable to hold the ball up as well as normal. I am sure he will learn from it.
Also, Gibson sat just in front of him as well putting more pressure on him. If he is isolated up front then teams can just drop a defensive midfielder to shield in front of him, as Brentford also did with that little ginger lad.
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yeah point taken. i was gonna post a Heskey one, fuck me it's like watching pele.
Yeah, how is Pele these days?
still better than Heskey i'm guessing
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When future histories of the club are written and there is a chapter on our all time great strikers, it would be unthinkable if Benteke isn't among them. As lots of people said when he left, his best days were going to be with us.
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Well he's evidently not the player he was. I've no idea what went wrong at Liverpool as I don't think I ever saw him play there.
He got found out. From being the main man and only real attacking threat at Villa and undroppable as such he went to a club where just scoring isn't enough.. He was no longer indispensible at Liverpool, compared with players who put a shift in for 90 minutes . While i agree he was unplayable at times when he fancied it for Villa, he was often just adequate and kept on just for his goal threat and sometimes just not interested at all. i had a look at the old Benteke thread and its certainly not just me who noticed this during his career and it's certainly not my memory playing tricks. If you compare him to his compatriot Lukaku who probably hasn't the ability Benteke has/had, i'm not surprised he's turned out as the more consistent performer.
Yep, one goal in ten show's he's pretty consistent.
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Well he's evidently not the player he was. I've no idea what went wrong at Liverpool as I don't think I ever saw him play there.
He got found out. From being the main man and only real attacking threat at Villa and undroppable as such he went to a club where just scoring isn't enough.. He was no longer indispensible at Liverpool, compared with players who put a shift in for 90 minutes . While i agree he was unplayable at times when he fancied it for Villa, he was often just adequate and kept on just for his goal threat and sometimes just not interested at all. i had a look at the old Benteke thread and its certainly not just me who noticed this during his career and it's certainly not my memory playing tricks. If you compare him to his compatriot Lukaku who probably hasn't the ability Benteke has/had, i'm not surprised he's turned out as the more consistent performer.
Yep, one goal in ten show's he's pretty consistent.
I think these kind of stats are going to be more and more common over the next few years. We've already seen the shift from just being a goalscorer to needing to provide a lot more for the team and that's going to see the quick, goal poacher types shift more and more to playing the wide forward roles where they don't need to contribute as much to the game. Sinclair is a great example of it. What that's going to mean, in turn, is that the pressure on the 9 to be a 20 a season man will drop and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm, until fullbacks who are defenders first becomes the norm again, and then things will shift again.
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I like Davis and think he's got a lot of potential, unfortunately because of our injury crisis I feel a lot is being asked of him and he's tiring. I watched him warm up ahead of the second half Saturday along the cones and he looked laboured. The way he was running he looked injured. His strength in the box his heading. That's where his 2 goals have come from, however I don't think he gets enough service in this area. He needs to work on his shooting as this has proven to be his weakness.
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The best way to wean on very good 18/19 year olds is 6 games rest for 4 week, 12 games rest for 4 weeks and then depending on how they are doing full speed ahead. We have been relying on him whereas he should have been nice to have at this stage.
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Ultimately playing games is only going to be good for him. Too many young English players don't play enough first team football at this age and it costs us at national level.
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Ultimately playing games is only going to be good for him. Too many young English players don't play enough first team football at this age and it costs us at national level.
Until he gets injured because he's still growing and his body can't cope.
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I like Davis and think he's got a lot of potential, unfortunately because of our injury crisis I feel a lot is being asked of him and he's tiring. I watched him warm up ahead of the second half Saturday along the cones and he looked laboured. The way he was running he looked injured. His strength in the box his heading. That's where his 2 goals have come from, however I don't think he gets enough service in this area. He needs to work on his shooting as this has proven to be his weakness.
I think it's no coincidence that since Elmohamady hasn't started, his chances have dried up.
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
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Too much is being asked of him too soon We need to find another combination without him featuring in the short term. Hogan down the middle for starters
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I like Davis and think he's got a lot of potential, unfortunately because of our injury crisis I feel a lot is being asked of him and he's tiring. I watched him warm up ahead of the second half Saturday along the cones and he looked laboured. The way he was running he looked injured. His strength in the box his heading. That's where his 2 goals have come from, however I don't think he gets enough service in this area. He needs to work on his shooting as this has proven to be his weakness.
I think it's no coincidence that since Elmohamady hasn't started, his chances have dried up.
I think that is a very relevant point - and maybe behind tactics Steve's decision on Saturday as I cannot see another reason to make that change
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
Adomah has been in fine goal scoring form, but the rest of the midfield are hardly setting the place alight are they?
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
Adomah has been in fine goal scoring form, but the rest of the midfield are hardly setting the place alight are they?
22 of our 29 goals have come from midfield.
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
It looks like 4 4 1 1 to me with Anomah with a free reign.
Or
#
#
#. #
#. #
#. #. #. #
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
Adomah has been in fine goal scoring form, but the rest of the midfield are hardly setting the place alight are they?
22 of our 29 goals have come from midfield.
Half of them from Adomah, which I've already acknowledged. It certainly doesn't feel to me that that the 3-4 behind the front man score lots of goals. To move the point on, Bruce is failing to get the best out of Hogan who likes balls to feet in the box, but also Davis who likes balls crossed into the area.
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
It looks like 4 4 1 1 to me with Anomah with a free reign.
Or
#
#
#. #
#. #
#. #. #. #
It's not fair as some hashtags are aided by the dot.
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and teams like us with loads of goals from the 3-4 behind the front man will become the norm
Uh, say what now?
Still holds true. Playing 4231 the 3 should all be scoring regularly and when i wrote that Adomah had just hit 5 in 3. I firmly believe that football formations run in cycles and that the next one we'll see will be teams putting their goalscorers into the 'inside forward' role. With a central striker who's job is to play with their back to goal and occupy the centre backs.
It looks like 4 4 1 1 to me with Anomah with a free reign.
Or
#
#
#. #
#. #
#. #. #. #
It's not fair as some hashtags are aided by the dot.
I hope it has not spoiled your enjoyment ;)
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It looks like 4 4 1 1 to me with Anomah with a free reign.
Or
#
#
#. #
#. #
#. #. #. #
I agree, but it shouldn't be.
Half of them from Adomah, which I've already acknowledged. It certainly doesn't feel to me that that the 3-4 behind the front man score lots of goals. To move the point on, Bruce is failing to get the best out of Hogan who likes balls to feet in the box, but also Davis who likes balls crossed into the area.
Indeed, but 12 in 20 is still a better return from midfield than we're used to, a lack of goals from midfield has been a big problem for us pretty consistently since the turn of the millenium so I'm not going to complain if the lot of them are better than a goal a game even if 1 person has contributed the lions share.
I agree completely on the last point though and I think it's a 2 part problem.
The first is that Snodgrass and Adomah are on the wrong sides to go outside and get it in and they also haven't got full backs behind them who can cross so all the crosses we put in are curling into the keeper and are after the winger has cut in so the defence have had time to cut the space. It means the target area for a cross to be dangerous is much smaller.
The second is that Onomah shouldn't be playing as a 10; Grealish, O'Hare, Snodgrass or Hourihane are all much better suited to it (if you go with Snoddy then you can bring in Elmo or O'Hare on the right to add a little more pace). Onomah can then go back alongside Whelan and use his extra mobility to get to the edge of the box late and give us a different option.
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The first is that Snodgrass and Adomah are on the wrong sides to go outside and get it in and they also haven't got full backs behind them who can cross so all the crosses we put in are curling into the keeper and are after the winger has cut in so the defence have had time to cut the space. It means the target area for a cross to be dangerous is much smaller.
Absolutely! It is infuriating to see wingers get into good positions and then have to cut back to get the ball on the strong side. And, it reduces the effectiveness of the ball-heading CF. I'm actually surprised that Adomah and Snodgrass don't at least swap wings from time to time during a game, to keep the opposing FB something to think about.
The second is that Onomah shouldn't be playing as a 10; Grealish, O'Hare, Snodgrass or Hourihane are all much better suited to it (if you go with Snoddy then you can bring in Elmo or O'Hare on the right to add a little more pace). Onomah can then go back alongside Whelan and use his extra mobility to get to the edge of the box late and give us a different option.
I agree that Onomah is ill-suited to that #10 rle (although I think the manager rather hopes that he will provide a robust alternative to Davis). In fact, given his propensity to give away fouls in our half, I'd worry about him playing nearer our goal. With a more forward-minded midfield, I'd be tempted to put Whelan and Jedi together (yes! I know they are old and slow ...).
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I think Onomah is just very raw. He's got loads of potential but there's going to be mistakes but at least his game is suited to the box-to-box role, he hasn't got the vision, passing range or close control to be a 10, even in this league.
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I think Onomah can play 10 away fr home where his pace and general quality help
But against good defences we need more ingenuity. It’s jaxk’s Time
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Matt, should we really be worrying whether we are away from home or not, except for Wolves? I don't think so, we have to influence games, but that is not the managers way of doing things. I really feel we should be looking to win games away from home rather than hoping to sneak it and then go behind and then start showing we can play football (Bristol City, Leeds and even Wolves for example)
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Not even on the bench today. I only hope he's being rested and not injured.
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Not even on the bench today. I only hope he's being rested and not injured.
Ill not injured apparently
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Hopefully refreshed for next week. We missed him badly today.
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Why was he not on my he bench. Big mistake by Bruce
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Why was he not on my he bench. Big mistake by Bruce
He was ill. This one not a mistake by Bruce
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Why was he not on my he bench. Big mistake by Bruce
He was ill. This one not a mistake by Bruce
He has looked like he needed a rest, think he is being over played.
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Why was he not on my he bench. Big mistake by Bruce
He was ill. This one not a mistake by Bruce
He has looked like he needed a rest, think he is being over played.
He was in his bed, vomiting. No doubt he has been overplayed, but doubt this contributed to his illness.
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Why was he not on my he bench. Big mistake by Bruce
He was ill. This one not a mistake by Bruce
He has looked like he needed a rest, think he is being over played.
He was in his bed, vomiting. No doubt he has been overplayed, but doubt this contributed to his illness.
Agreed. And he has looked labored for a few weeks now..
Hope he had a bucket handy.
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Keinan Davis only sent one tweet on Christmas Day And it was to me
Yaaaaay
Tweeted picture of my lad in his new shirt with Davis on the back
hope he rediscovers a bit of form and gets a goal or two in the up coming games
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He really looked lost when he came on, needs to go back to the reserves.
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He really looked lost when he came on, needs to go back to the reserves.
yeah because the rest of them looked well on top of their games
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He's never going to be a 20 goal a season man 10 If he's lucky
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He's never going to be a 20 goal a season man 10 If he's lucky
3 players in particular Davis, Grealish and Hogan need a lot better manager than Bruce to bring them on and get something better out of them
well that's what I think anyroad
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Too early to write him off. A well run club would have used him sparingly but we have nothing else given how we play. you don't expect a 19 year old to score the goals to get you promoted or be a first team regular for that matter.
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He really looked lost when he came on, needs to go back to the reserves.
yeah because the rest of them looked well on top of their games
Doesn't excuse any other player but he has lost the energy of his first few games, his chasing was half hearted, I think he needs to come out of the firing line for his own good.
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I think he can hold the ball up well and bring others into play but he can't score and I can't see that changing.
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He is a poor mans Heskey. He needs a forwards coach to come in an work with him on his finishing 2-3 times a week.
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He was playing non-league football not so long ago and now seems to be taking flack for him having a few good games when he first came into the team. I think I t’s a bit unfair to keep criticising him. This is who he is currently. When he joined he was probably 4/5th choice striker.
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Too early to write him off. A well run club would have used him sparingly but we have nothing else given how we play. you don't expect a 19 year old to score the goals to get you promoted or be a first team regular for that matter.
He wasn't used sparingly because at one point, he was the only fit centre forward we had available. It was nothing to do with how we play.
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He's only 19 and we've looked a lot better team when he's played because he can hold the ball up which allows the midfielders to get forward. It's poor recruitment that we're so reliant on someone who's so young and raw when we've targeted players that aren't strong in these qualities.
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It's astonishing we don't play Davis plus one. Whether that's Gabby, who in the past has done well with target men who win the ball and distribute well, or Hogan. FFS we are the Villa; all our best endeavours in the modern game have involved an inside forward feeding off a centre forward. Davis is not (yet) a 20-plus-goal a season man but stick him with a partner who can exploit what he does and they both damn well could be.
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It's astonishing we don't play Davis plus one. Whether that's Gabby, who in the past has done well with target men who win the ball and distribute well, or Hogan. FFS we are the Villa; all our best endeavours in the modern game have involved an inside forward feeding off a centre forward. Davis is not (yet) a 20-plus-goal a season man but stick him with a partner who can exploit what he does and they both damn well could be.
Agree 100%
Asking a 19 year old boy to be Didier Drogba isn't likely to work too often. His (really) bright start was ace to see and he is a cracking prospect - but needs t play up front with somebody else. The bad part in this plan is that they need to buy that 'somebody else' in because Hogan looks set to be yet another player who turns out to be a bit shit in a Villa shirt and Gabby is finished.
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He should have got two goals when he came on the last day. At least he is getting into promising positions. His hold up play has deteriorated a lot in recent weeks unfortunately.
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Gabby might not be a bad shout actually.
The only positive attribute he seems to have these days is experience and giving Davis someone to learn (some things) from would be better than sticking him 30 yards away from the nearest player and waiting for him to learn by trial and error.
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He shouldn’t play for Villa again, we don’t want our next Villa bargain to get crocked. The price? £51k and all the pies he can eat. Ta.
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He is a poor mans Heskey. He needs a forwards coach to come in an work with him on his finishing 2-3 times a week.
Please don’t mention him in the same breath as our Davis. He is a good player who will flourish under a better manager
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Davis and RHM could be the perfect strikeforce combo.
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I'm just glad RHM is alive.
Until he came on at Boro I thought he was just a Villa player I'd imagined. Where's he been the last year?!
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ICU
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I'm just glad RHM is alive.
Until he came on at Boro I thought he was just a Villa player I'd imagined. Where's he been the last year?!
Just in case you are being serious, he's been injured
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I'm just glad RHM is alive.
Until he came on at Boro I thought he was just a Villa player I'd imagined. Where's he been the last year?!
He’s certainly got a lot bigger since I last saw him, against Newcastle last year. He must have grown four inches and put on a few pounds as well.
He could be just what we need, he was far more physical than I expected and gave Baker a tough few minutes.
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Well played big KD!!
England under 20s captained by Easah Suleiman saw Keinan Davis replacing Rushian Hepburn Murphy and Scored his first international goal, the winning goal, 1-0 away, in Poland.
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Well done Keinan on scoring for England under 20's.
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The big man scores last night .
Anyone say how he played
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The big man scores last night .
Anyone say how he played
Looked good if a little short of fitness, the performance improved massively in the 2nd half after he'd gone off though but I wouldn't blame him. I think the introduction of o'hare was key because, even though he didn't play brilliantly, he was between the lines and they couldn't work our shape out from then.
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Well played big KD!!
England under 20s captained by Easah Suleiman saw Keinan Davis replacing Rushian Hepburn Murphy and Scored his first international goal, the winning goal, 1-0 away, in Poland.
So we have the captain of the England U20 side and I can't recall him even having a sniff of first team action, despite the fact that we have been desperately short in the position he plays.
That said, isn't the opinion that he is a bit small to play CB?
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Well played big KD!!
England under 20s captained by Easah Suleiman saw Keinan Davis replacing Rushian Hepburn Murphy and Scored his first international goal, the winning goal, 1-0 away, in Poland.
When was this, as no mention of this game in the press and media, yesterday or today?
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Well played big KD!!
England under 20s captained by Easah Suleiman saw Keinan Davis replacing Rushian Hepburn Murphy and Scored his first international goal, the winning goal, 1-0 away, in Poland.
When was this, as no mention of this game in the press and media, yesterday or today?
March last year judging by the original post
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I'm glad he's back it will add another dimension to our front line.
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scored last night and a cracker by RHM
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Davis and RHM could be the perfect strikeforce combo.
I very much like to see this develop and be pushed on to first eleven.
They do need to be on consideration.
Saw the Fonz played against Arsenal for Blackpool he 27 and I don't think will ever play prem level now championship if pushed...
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I watched a bit of the U23 game
I thought Davis looked ready to step back into the first team picture. Missed a couple of great chances mind
Didnt think anyone else looked able to step in yet. Need loans
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here's a bold prediction for you
of all the strikers we currently have on the books
Abraham, Kodjia, Hogan, RHM, Green
I predict Davis will turn out to be the best of the lot
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here's a bold prediction for you
of all the strikers we currently have on the books
Abraham, Kodjia, Hogan, RHM, Green
I predict Davis will turn out to be the best of the lot
I might just agree with you pal, I have high hopes for him.
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here's a bold prediction for you
of all the strikers we currently have on the books
Abraham, Kodjia, Hogan, RHM, Green
I predict Davis will turn out to be the best of the lot
I might just agree with you pal, I have high hopes for him.
Helenius for me.
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Davis better tban Abraham?
No way
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Trouble with Davis is he is not a goal scorer .The likes of Abraham,RHM McKirdy and even Mooney put away most of their chances.Davis i am afraid misses far more than he scores.
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here's a bold prediction for you
of all the strikers we currently have on the books
Abraham, Kodjia, Hogan, RHM, Green
I predict Davis will turn out to be the best of the lot
A bold prediction, I hope you are right. It will be interesting to see how he does playing under Smith rather then the more basic Bruce approach.
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Trouble with Davis is he is not a goal scorer .The likes of Abraham,RHM McKirdy and even Mooney put away most of their chances.Davis i am afraid misses far more than he scores.
Still young enough to improve in that regard, he'll never be a 20-25 goal a season striker but if he can get into 1 in 3-4 territory and still give us the hold up play and work rate that we saw last year then he'll be a big part of the squad going forward.
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Trouble with Davis is he is not a goal scorer .The likes of Abraham,RHM McKirdy and even Mooney put away most of their chances.Davis i am afraid misses far more than he scores.
Still young enough to improve in that regard, he'll never be a 20-25 goal a season striker but if he can get into 1 in 3-4 territory and still give us the hold up play and work rate that we saw last year then he'll be a big part of the squad going forward.
Would definitely look at giving him minutes and having him on the bench ahead of Hogan.
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Trouble with Davis is he is not a goal scorer .The likes of Abraham,RHM McKirdy and even Mooney put away most of their chances.Davis i am afraid misses far more than he scores.
Would definitely look at giving him minutes and having him on the bench ahead of Hogan.
I like Davis, and think that if he was played central Kodjia, and Bolasie would score more as his hold up play is excellent. I also think our midfield would play further up the pitch. Wouldn't score as many as Abraham, but I do think more goals would come from elsewhere. Plus he is our player and will not be going at the end of the season (or sooner).
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give him the same amount of chances that Abraham gets in a run of games and we'll see how many he gets
don't forget Tammy misses a few as well but gets loads of chances, the game against WBA he was unbelievabley bad and cost us the game
we won't blame him to much as he's won us the game on more than a few occasions
Davis holds the ball up better as well, and is more of a bully boy in the box or could be given time,
basically I think he could be a better all round footballer
he's not as good as Tammy at the moment, but that's why it was a bold prediction,
As i think he will be
only my opinion and a bit of wishful thinking
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Tammy has missed 9 key chances. Its not dissimilar to Aguero.
I like Davis, but he's not a natural goal scorer.
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The fact that Tammy has scored what he has missed as many as he shows the great positions he always instinctively gets into. Keinan Davis has never struck me as an instinctive player so I’ll happily accept being proven wrong on that. For me he’s a long way behind Tammy Abraham today.
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you all got to hope I’m right about Davis as he’s ours and Tammy’s not
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Tammy has missed 9 key chances. Its not dissimilar to Aguero.
I like Davis, but he's not a natural goal scorer.
so he had a run of games some not full games 23 I think in a Bruce team at the age of what 19
and on that basis you don’t think he’s a natural goal scorer
I think your wrong, I think he can be and will be for us or someone else
time will tell who’s the best judge of a player, bearing in mind Abraham is a pretty safe bet at the moment and it’s me making the bold statements
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I wouldnt be comparing Tammy to Davis just yet. Tammy has scored goals on a regular basis when he's played down in this division. I'm not sure Davis would have scored 16 goals by now.
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On the basis he scored 2 goals? Barnsley and Burton. I can't recall another.
Tammy has 20 in 16 is something daft. Davis is nowhere near as good as Tammy. He has 39 in 60 in this league.
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Looked brilliant when he broke through. Needs a run of games and a few goals like any striker.
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He’s got some really good attributes in terms of holding the ball up and bullying defenders but he’s not a natural finisher.
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I don't think you can compare them because they're very different types of striker, Tammy will got on the end of more chances in the box and is probably 12-18 months further in his development that Davis (despite the age difference being less). On the flip side Davis, used well, is much more capable of being a target man and allowing the team to play off him. Grealish being fit and in form makes a big difference, without him I think there's a case for using Davis to give us a hold on the game because without Grealish the ball doesn't stick in the final 3rd well enough.
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He’s got some really good attributes in terms of holding the ball up and bullying defenders but he’s not a natural finisher.
I think the term natural finisher is a bit misleading here, I'd argue that Tammy isn't one either. What will potentially hold Davis back is his anticipation in the box. strikers like Tammy, Bent, Owen, Shearer, etc do well because they find themselves in the right place more often than not, it isn't luck, it's instinct and is very hard to teach. Davis clearly doesn't have that right now but he'll still get chances so what we can work on is his finishing, if we can get him hitting the target with the chances he gets then he'll score goals in the team/league. If we could get Tammy to hit the target more he'd get 40-50 a season in this league with the amount of opportunities he gets.
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39 goals in 61 games isn't bad for somebody who doesn't find scoring natural!
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I don't think Keinan would score 20 in a full season in the Conference, he just doesn't look like a goalscorer when he plays. He does however look like a player that could make you a better team. I said ages ago, probably on this thread, that he seems very Heskeyish, and that's not always a bad thing despite all the Heskey jokes over the years.
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I'd doubt any 21 year old is a natural goalscorer. He's not doing too bad though.
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I don't think Keinan would score 20 in a full season in the Conference, he just doesn't look like a goalscorer when he plays. He does however look like a player that could make you a better team. I said ages ago, probably on this thread, that he seems very Heskeyish, and that's not always a bad thing despite all the Heskey jokes over the years.
62 England caps, Emile Heskey.
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That's my point, he had a cracking career but never even managed 15 league goals in a season, he only managed 10 five times.
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That's my point, he had a cracking career but never even managed 15 league goals in a season, he only managed 10 five times.
If you mean Heskey, I'm sure he scored nearly 20 one season. I stand correct though.
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That's my point, he had a cracking career but never even managed 15 league goals in a season, he only managed 10 five times.
If you mean Heskey, I'm sure he scored nearly 20 one season. I stand correct though.
14 was his most league goals in a season. He got 22 in all competitions, the only season he scored 15+ even including cup games.
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39 goals in 61 games isn't bad for somebody who doesn't find scoring natural!
For us it's 64 shots to get 16 goals, not a bad return at all, but, as I said, the number of chances he gets (over 3 a game) is the bigger reason for him scoring so many goals. The game where he looked like he was going to put away everything that came to him was Forest and that what I'm getting at, he gets about half his shots on target (the rest miss or are blocked) so that's where he can improve.
Davis won't get that many chances so to score a decent number of goals he needs to be getting 70-80% on target and scoring more like 35-40% of his chances.
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It's less chances than Aguero gets and he's he best forward in the country.
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Wrong thread.
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It's less chances than Aguero gets and he's he best forward in the country.
Only just spotted this, I'm at no point saying Tammy doesn't score goals or is a bad forward, I'm specifically referring to the 'natural finisher' term which I don't think is right. A natural finisher is someone who's putting away 40-50% of the chances they get. Someone like Tammy is more about striker's instinct to just get into the right positions. I think it's an important distinction because you can improve your finishing through practice and hard work, which is where someone like Davis can make big improvements. Finding space in the box and anticipating where the ball will be is far harder to train for and is the reason why the very best strikers cost so much money.
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I like some of Davis's cameos last year but he probably did need to be taken out of the team when he finally was (and not seen again for nearly a year).
I would have to agree with Ads though. He dosen't strike me as a natural striker at all compared to an Abraham type who's a livewire in the 6 yard box.
If he is to make a good living in the game it will be as a Heskey type provider. Not an issue if we play him upfront and we have 2/3 off him capable of double figures but we don't.
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I think in football today, your central striker has to contribute goals. Not necessarily the main goalscorer but into double figures at this level. I am not convinced that Davis has that ability of anticipation/early awareness to get into the positions that, say, Tammy does. To be effective, he has to become stronger, more confident in himself, more wiley (Peter Withe like) and practice his shooting.
It is still early days for him and we shouldn't lose sight of how far he came in a short period.
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Also that he cost a twentieth of what we paid for Hogan or Gatehopper and is probably on a twentieth of their wages.
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I think in football today, your central striker has to contribute goals. Not necessarily the main goalscorer but into double figures at this level. I am not convinced that Davis has that ability of anticipation/early awareness to get into the positions that, say, Tammy does. To be effective, he has to become stronger, more confident in himself, more wiley (Peter Withe like) and practice his shooting.
It is still early days for him and we shouldn't lose sight of how far he came in a short period.
with decent supply from midfield and a strong striking partner he may well find more space to contribute goals.
We don’t know how good his is in a decent side, and it’s far too early to judge based solely on last season’s cameos.
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I am a great believer in the assessment of people by body language. Once last season Davis burst through a defence and slammed a shot against the crossbar. The crowd roared approval but Keinan walked back, shoulders slumped in dissatisfaction at not burying the shot after all his good play. Bolaise would have been waving his arms about.
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But Bolasie hasn't waved his arms about, so you've not read his body language.
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I think in football today, your central striker has to contribute goals. Not necessarily the main goalscorer but into double figures at this level. I am not convinced that Davis has that ability of anticipation/early awareness to get into the positions that, say, Tammy does. To be effective, he has to become stronger, more confident in himself, more wiley (Peter Withe like) and practice his shooting.
It is still early days for him and we shouldn't lose sight of how far he came in a short period.
I agree, the support striker only really works in a 4-4-2.
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Scored 2 goals in training match v walsall this week.
Dean Smith said he's getting minutes to have him match ready and push for place in team.
However I only see him as back up to Tammy Abraham and not a challenge .
I would some how like to see more of him but think maybe be next season his time will come
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I never saw Bolaise burst through the middle shaking of challenges then slamming g the ball against the crossbar. If I had been treated to seeing him do that perhaps I would not have such a faulty assessment of what his reaction might have been.
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Could certainly do a job later in the game if we need to keep the ball away from the defence. Agree can't see him starting before Tammy.
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I never saw Bolaise burst through the middle shaking of challenges then slamming g the ball against the crossbar. If I had been treated to seeing him do that perhaps I would not have such a faulty assessment of what his reaction might have been.
Bolasie had plenty of shots that weren't on target for you to compare with.
As many have said on here - Davis is likeable but sadly is the Heskey of the Championship.
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I never saw Bolaise burst through the middle shaking of challenges then slamming g the ball against the crossbar. If I had been treated to seeing him do that perhaps I would not have such a faulty assessment of what his reaction might have been.
Bolasie had plenty of shots that weren't on target for you to compare with.
As many have said on here - Davis is likeable but sadly is the Heskey of the Championship.
I’m with Brian and I don’t agree with your judgement on Davis
he’s been written off to soon as a goalscoring forward imo
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I think Davis has a lot of plusses, needs to get goals but it wasn't so easy last season tbh. I think him and Tammy could work, Tammy does come a bit deeper sometimes and is clever. There could be games when that will happen maybe more so with Davis as a sub
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I think Davis has a lot of plusses, needs to get goals but it wasn't so easy last season tbh. I think him and Tammy could work, Tammy does come a bit deeper sometimes and is clever. There could be games when that will happen maybe more so with Davis as a sub
Davis had some very good games for us last season, held the ball up really well at times
lacks goalscorer instinct alright but definitely has his uses
Far prefer him coming on than Scott Hogan
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I think Davis has a lot of plusses, needs to get goals but it wasn't so easy last season tbh. I think him and Tammy could work, Tammy does come a bit deeper sometimes and is clever. There could be games when that will happen maybe more so with Davis as a sub
Davis had some very good games for us last season, held the ball up really well at times
lacks goalscorer instinct alright but definitely has his uses
Far prefer him coming on than Scott Hogan
Indeed.
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That game he played against Norwich (iirc) where he could have bagged a hat trick he was unplayable and terrorised them
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I’d quite like to see Tammy moved to the left and Davis given a crack through the middle. Not every game, an experiment. See how it’s goes.
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I’d quite like to see Tammy moved to the left and Davis given a crack through the middle. Not every game, an experiment. See how it’s goes.
Are you Steve Bruce?
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He did all right when he came on as sub against Reading on FIFA last night.
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I’d quite like to see Tammy moved to the left and Davis given a crack through the middle. Not every game, an experiment. See how it’s goes.
Are you Steve Bruce?
In fairness, Tammy himself has said that he prefers playing out wide but I wouldn't be moving him from his position at the moment.
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
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He did all right when he came on as sub against Reading on FIFA last night.
Did we win?
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Sensible move that. Let’s move the leagues top scorer out wide and slot Davis up front in case it works. Honestly!
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He did all right when he came on as sub against Reading on FIFA last night.
Did we win?
2-2 draw. Poor performance. Two very bad goals conceded from a defensive perspective.
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
How about we do whatever we can to score goals and win games, get promoted and then sign Tammy so he doesn't bugger off next season?
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He did all right when he came on as sub against Reading on FIFA last night.
Did we win?
2-2 draw. Poor performance. Two very bad goals conceded from a defensive perspective.
I’m off to the bookies but probably won’t get good odds
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Sensible move that. Let’s move the leagues top scorer out wide and slot Davis up front in case it works. Honestly!
Tammy likes playing wider. I’m not suggesting a permanent switch, merely and opportunity to look at other things. Perhaps a shift from the 451 formation that has not worked for us so far this season. Now that we have Carroll in the mix and Jack coming back.
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
How about we do whatever we can to score goals and win games, get promoted and then sign Tammy so he doesn't bugger off next season?
Like 👍
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
How about we do whatever we can to score goals and win games, get promoted and then sign Tammy so he doesn't bugger off next season?
I’ll go with that. Perhaps we could be winning a few games comfortably so that we could give the likes of Keinan game time?
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
How about we do whatever we can to score goals and win games, get promoted and then sign Tammy so he doesn't bugger off next season?
I’ll go with that. Perhaps we could be winning a few games comfortably so that we could give the likes of Keinan game time?
Why not go on a storming run and get automatic with 5 games to go and then experiment!
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I keep thinking we’ve blown promotion then seeing a win will bring us closer. If and when promotion isn’t possible we can experiment then.
Are YOU Steve Bruce? How about we do whatever we can to score goals and make sure Davis is part of the squad, in readiness of course for Tammy buggering off next season and us being short of fit, in form strikers?
How about we do whatever we can to score goals and win games, get promoted and then sign Tammy so he doesn't bugger off next season?
I’ll go with that. Perhaps we could be winning a few games comfortably so that we could give the likes of Keinan game time?
Why not go on a storming run and get automatic with 5 games to go and then experiment!
Yep, I think that's what we should do. Football is such a simple game.
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This guy is quite a player . I remember JT said he was a handful to play and compete in training last season.
As much as I love Tammy Abraham would have liked more Davis and he certainly could ah as two player strike attack as well as leading line as a hold up player.
Fair play to him today's showing looked capable again .
Maybe as yet not a major goals scorer but a real contributing type to build up play.
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
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I would like to take credit for his performance. I said to the bloke in front of me after he’d been on for 5 mins that he didn’t really look up for it. He agreed and then Keinan immediately started to play really well ! Thought he was great today, really promising.
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Lots more effective thanTammy today
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Lots more effective thanTammy today
Tammy lost the ball cheaply whereas Keinan kept it well
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
How can even mention Lewadowski in the same sentence as Altidore and Murray and expect to be taken seriously?
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
Lukaku was always a goal scorer. Kieran not so much.
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Lots more effective thanTammy today
Tammy lost the ball cheaply whereas Keinan kept it well
I don't think there's been a game where Tammy doesn't lose ball cheaply.
But has a great work rate and scores goals.
For this level he's top end decent .
I think he's wanting in holding ball and that could be a reason why he may end up not achieve proper heights of a top top player. And the fact he misses chances despite scoring many goals . For him hopes he develops though I don't think he will play for a top 6 team next season in prem.
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
That’ll do nicely👍
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
How can even mention Lewadowski in the same sentence as Altidore and Murray and expect to be taken seriously?
All very similar in that they all wear shorts in games 8)
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
How can even mention Lewadowski in the same sentence as Altidore and Murray and expect to be taken seriously?
No that's the potential across the board of similarities that Davis already posses and as a career could carve out.
And btw Altidore had some stunning matches and decent record mls and even national.
What saying is maybe Altidore didn't totally fire in England goals wise (unlucky was in a bad team) but this is what could happen with Davis. It's about a bit luck and having good club to development.
So Davis could be like Murray and eventually show promise at premier league level
He could be a complete superstar and reach Lewadowski levels.
Lukaku has had some magnificent moments and trouble to play against and also been u effective.
Any of these scenario could happen with Davis.
It's that broad in what I'm saying how his career could go.
It makes sense in my head !?
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
How can even mention Lewadowski in the same sentence as Altidore and Murray and expect to be taken seriously?
Prophets are never accepted in their hometown.
Or by people on messageboards who possess eyes.
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He is a bull, a brute, a battering ram and ours. More of Keenan please.
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Very encouraging cameo, unselfish too.
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He is a real team player and read the likeness to a young Heskey and think that is apt. Hopefully over his injury problems and could be crucial in the last few weeks of the season
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Thought he was good today. His hold up play and power was excellent. He will need goals though. A bit of the young Heskey about him.
I see potential Lukaku / Lewadowski /Jozy Altidore / Glenn Murray.
How can even mention Lewadowski in the same sentence as Altidore and Murray and expect to be taken seriously?
No that's the potential across the board of similarities that Davis already posses and as a career could carve out.
And btw Altidore had some stunning matches and decent record mls and even national.
What saying is maybe Altidore didn't totally fire in England goals wise (unlucky was in a bad team) but this is what could happen with Davis. It's about a bit luck and having good club to development.
So Davis could be like Murray and eventually show promise at premier league level
He could be a complete superstar and reach Lewadowski levels.
Lukaku has had some magnificent moments and trouble to play against and also been u effective.
Any of these scenario could happen with Davis.
It's that broad in what I'm saying how his career could go.
It makes sense in my head !?
I think what you're trying to say in way too many words is that Davis could turn out to be:
a) as crap as Altidore.
b) as bang average as Murray.
c) as prolific and powerful as Lukaku.
d) as a skilful goalscoring machine as Lewandowski.
Whatever the case may be, let's enjoy watching him develop and hopefully at more goals to his game as he most certainly has all the other attributes to do so.
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Really pleased that Davis is staying put. Would really like this lad to do well and it seems Smith believes in him which can only be good.
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The manager rates him highly and that must be a confidence boost. Only seen the Charlton game live pre-season and thought he was superb, he is so strong and hold up play was bringing others into play all the time. I hope he gets a few goals and shows he is a good player, love his attitude
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It's a big vote of confidence from the manager that he hasn't been loaned out. Hopefully it does him good.
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In his breakthrough season he was very good. He reminds me of Heskey in his Leicester and early Liverpool days. Good hold up play and helps make space for others.
Think he will surprise a few people this season if he gets some game time.
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In his breakthrough season he was very good. He reminds me of Heskey in his Leicester and early Liverpool days. Good hold up play and helps make space for others.
Think he will surprise a few people this season if he gets some game time.
Heskey used to score back then.
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Smith knows what kind of player Keinan is. His job will be to hold up the ball so the likes of Trezguet, El Ghazi, Jota, Grealish, SJM and Hourihane can storm through.
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Smith knows what kind of player Keinan is. His job will be to hold up the ball so the likes of Trezguet, El Ghazi, Jota, Grealish, SJM and Hourihane can storm through.
Was just about the write the same thing. We are set up to play a certain way and Wes is first choice but Davis plays that exact way also
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
Yep, it's like a mix between a false 9 and a deep target man.
I suspect the idea is that we want all of of players to be 'between the lines' so wingers who attacking between full back and centre back, but with our fullbacks overlapping to stop teams getting too narrow, midfielders and a striker who swap places and generally relying on our movement to create space.
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The season hasn't even started and like the first cuckoo call of spring, we've had the first excuses for a player who isn't actually very good at the main aspect of his job. This always leads to the suggestion of moving them into midfield. Defender not very good at defending? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield! Striker couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield!
:)
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Who's making excuses or talking about moving him into midfield though? He plays up front but won't be picked to score goals but rather to create space and bring other people into the game. I don't see how anyone who's ever seen him play could say that's not accurate for what he brings.
Aside from that I think the idea that a strikers 'main aspect of their job' is scoring goals is a bit outdated. I'm not saying I don't want them to score goals but it really doesn't take much time to look at the top scorer charts across the major leagues in the last 10 years to see that goals from out wide and midfield have become significantly more important than they were and therefore a striker who can bring those players into the game has great value, if they do it whilst being a scoring threat themselves (as I suspect Wesley will be) then great. In this regard Heskey was probably 15-20 years ahead of his time for English football, if he came through now he'd be valued much more highly by fans than he was.
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
that’s very tactical deep and meaningful
did you copy and paste it from somewhere and try and pass it off as your own wisdom ?
it’s good though
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So he's a centre forward playmaker. does that make him a 9 and a half?
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Well I for one am glad Kienan’s getting a chance, now up to him but you never know it might be the making of him and this time next year he will be saving us a lot of money
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The season hasn't even started and like the first cuckoo call of spring, we've had the first excuses for a player who isn't actually very good at the main aspect of his job. This always leads to the suggestion of moving them into midfield. Defender not very good at defending? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield! Striker couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield!
:)
So what is the main aspect of his job?
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The season hasn't even started and like the first cuckoo call of spring, we've had the first excuses for a player who isn't actually very good at the main aspect of his job. This always leads to the suggestion of moving them into midfield. Defender not very good at defending? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield! Striker couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo? I reckon he'd do a job in midfield!
:)
So what is the main aspect of his job?
As a striker, scoring goals.
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
that’s very tactical deep and meaningful
did you copy and paste it from somewhere and try and pass it off as your own wisdom ?
it’s good though
All my own work pal, even a stopped click tells the right time twice a day.
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
that’s very tactical deep and meaningful
did you copy and paste it from somewhere and try and pass it off as your own wisdom ?
it’s good though
All my own work pal, even a stopped click tells the right time twice a day.
digital or analogue click?
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
that’s very tactical deep and meaningful
did you copy and paste it from somewhere and try and pass it off as your own wisdom ?
it’s good though
All my own work pal, even a stopped click tells the right time twice a day.
digital or analogue click?
'kin ell, I thought I'd corrected that!
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I actually think Keinan is a midfielder with a rare and unique strength and ability to hold up 3 defenders off at any one time. His passing and touch is crisp, he looks for teammates and plays the ball correctly, for them to move onto. Try not to think of him as a centre forward, more of an advanced pivot, which is potentially absolutely perfect for the way we set up to play.
that’s very tactical deep and meaningful
did you copy and paste it from somewhere and try and pass it off as your own wisdom ?
it’s good though
All my own work pal, even a stopped click tells the right time twice a day.
digital or analogue click?
'kin ell, I thought I'd corrected that!
You made a good point. I licked it.
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I was channelling my inner South African.
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The problem with Davis and its not his fault as he gives 110% is that he is not good enough at this level. He is given a certain amount of leeway as he is one of our own but please don't let sentiment get in the way
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He’s not really one of our own is he?
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Well, his contribution was insignficant on Saturday.
If he were a new Firmino, happy days! I just don't see that at all.
He is a good footballer and I'd love him to succeed .... but I'm not sure he's quite got it.
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As an impact sub he suits us at the moment. He’s strong, works hard and in the few minutes he was on on Saturday had one turn where he beat a couple of defenders and the keeper made a good save. I think he’s fine in that role for where we are now.
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He always tries hard and always does good things when he comes on but a striker without goals is a luxury we can’t afford. He couldn’t score in the championship so it’s asking a bloody lot for him to turn into a striker who can score in the PL.
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Not so sure.
He is only 21 years old and although his scoring record of 2 goals in 39 appearances doesn’t look at all impressive, his record of 2 goals in 3 England under 20 appearances is a bit better.
I have a feeling that a fair proportion of his Villa appearances have been for substitute cameos of 10 - 20 minutes. I can’t remember him actually having a run in the team to find his feet, and I think he has looked a better player as time has gone on. He looks fitter and his movement is better.
I seem to remember a fair few players that we deemed not good enough or overrated at 21 that seem to have done OK in the end.
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Not so sure.
He is only 21 years old and although his scoring record of 2 goals in 39 appearances doesn’t look at all impressive, his record of 2 goals in 3 England under 20 appearances is a bit better.
I have a feeling that a fair proportion of his Villa appearances have been for substitute cameos of 10 - 20 minutes. I can’t remember him actually having a run in the team to find his feet, and I think he has looked a better player as time has gone on. He looks fitter and his movement is better.
I seem to remember a fair few players that we deemed not good enough or overrated at 21 that seem to have done OK in the end.
Wise words.
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I'd like to see him start ahead of Wesley, I think we'd look far more dangerous going forward.
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I think there's a player in there, but as with any young striker at any club, he really needs to take his chances if he's to make it with us.
He'll continue to get sub appearances in the league and he'll get full games in the cups - if he continues to struggle to put the ball away then there can't really be any suggestion come end of season that he hasn't had the opportunity. Assuming he stays clear of injury between now and then.
Would absolutely love to see him become a player for us, but equally could see him leaving to join a Championship side in the summer. Could go either way, and only he can ensure that doesn't happen.
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Well, his contribution was insignficant on Saturday.
If he were a new Firmino, happy days! I just don't see that at all.
He is a good footballer and I'd love him to succeed .... but I'm not sure he's quite got it.
His shot helped win us three points. If it had been off target Brighton would've taken 40 seconds over the goal kick and it would've finished 1-1.
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Well, his contribution was insignficant on Saturday.
If he were a new Firmino, happy days! I just don't see that at all.
He is a good footballer and I'd love him to succeed .... but I'm not sure he's quite got it.
His shot helped win us three points. If it had been off target Brighton would've taken 40 seconds over the goal kick and it would've finished 1-1.
I haven't seen this discussed anywhere actually (apologies if I've missed it), but I did find myself wanting to ask both during and after the game: Wtf was that bonkers goal-kick tactic they were using for the entire second half?
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Watching the Sheffield United game David McGoldrick actually did a good job as striker who could drop into midfield area and help keep possession and win free kicks.
I remember years back Stoke always playing Sidibe as a second striker and that working quite well for their system.
Hardly any strikers below the elite ones even score 15 goals in premier league these days so I'm a bit bemused people writing him off simply because he dosen't score. Strikers can impact games in other ways.
On Saturday he was away from goal and managed to turn, hold off some defenders and get a good shot on target that was well saved. We then scored 30 seconds later so he helped us get three points.
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https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/premier-league/torschuetzenliste/wettbewerb/GB1/saison_id/2018
This is list of last season.
Just 8 players scored more than 15 league goals and obviously with Aubameyang, Salah, Kane, Mane, Hazard....Vardy etc you're talking about the best attackers in world.
Below that guys like Mitrovic, Ashley Barnes,Rondon, Ayoze Perez, Firmino, Son, Glenn Murray all getting 11-12.
With the greatest will in the world I can't see Kienan getting to that figure but as season progresses if he can score 4-5 goals and say 3 of them are 1-0 winners he'd have done o.k considering he won't be starting many matches.
What the numbers do show is for all the criticism so far Big Wes is doing fine in the scoring stakes. Already 33% there for the 11-12 figure.
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Focusing on Davis he hasn't had the level of coaching at academy to seniors that others have had and sometimes that shows.
It depends how the central striker wants to be used . Sole purpose as a goal machine Keinan is way off. But someone who contributing to overall play and linking up and assisting then he can be that guy.
Certainly it's challenging ,at this level, for him to get 10 goals.
There is growth potential there and it's tricky because his contract is up in the summer.
Ideally he have more playing time experience minutes in say Championship but needs dictate him part of our squad.
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Much to early to write a 21 year old off with as much pace and power as Davis.
I like him and believe he should be getting more game time and putting more pressure on Wesley.
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I’d like to see him get a chance, but it’s the old story of him having to force his way into the team and then making himself difficult to drop. Same with any player really, injuries aside.
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Well, his contribution was insignficant on Saturday.
If he were a new Firmino, happy days! I just don't see that at all.
He is a good footballer and I'd love him to succeed .... but I'm not sure he's quite got it.
His shot helped win us three points. If it had been off target Brighton would've taken 40 seconds over the goal kick and it would've finished 1-1.
Fair enough, and I have always been a fan of Davis', actually: reading comparisons with Firmino, though, need reponding to because that takes the debate way ahead of itself.
Several posters talk about Davis as a 'contributor' rather than scorer: that is how Wesley has been described by people who have known his game previous to being with us. If this is true, we have a like-for-like in Davis and Wesley. At the moment, Wesley has the shirt, has scored 4 Premier League goals and last Saturday's assist in the first goal.
In this reality, Davis is not going to get a start anytime soon; you'd think.
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Heskey used to get slaughtered for being a contributor rather than a scorer.
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The original false number nine, our Emule.
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Heskey used to get slaughtered for being a contributor rather than a scorer.
Still had an amazing career all told. Not saying Kienan is going to have even half of that but there's plenty of demand who there for strikers who don't score many goals.
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Heskey used to get slaughtered for being a contributor rather than a scorer.
Still had an amazing career all told. Not saying Kienan is going to have even half of that but there's plenty of demand who there for strikers who don't score many goals.
Normally from teams who don't win very much.
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Heskey used to get slaughtered for being a contributor rather than a scorer.
In fairness the game has changed a lot since Heskey played for us. Different times.
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Much to early to write a 21 year old off with as much pace and power as Davis.
I like him and believe he should be getting more game time and putting more pressure on Wesley.
Yet there are people who are happily writing off a 22 year old in Wesley - who is new to the league, country and team mates but up till Saturday had returned an average of 1:2
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Much to early to write a 21 year old off with as much pace and power as Davis.
I like him and believe he should be getting more game time and putting more pressure on Wesley.
Yet there are people who are happily writing off a 22 year old in Wesley - who is new to the league, country and team mates but up till Saturday had returned an average of 1:2
Jury still out for me, he is a long way off the finished article if he ever will be. I would like to see a bit more effort for a start.
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I like Keinan Davis.
The thing with strikers is that there is the one big stat that stands above everything else, goals. They can have a great game and do everything they’re asked to do, but if they don’t put it in the back of the net then that’s all people remember. It’s the only position on the pitch where performance is judged solely on one stat.
Because of this, not scoring can have a big impact on confidence and it’s much harder for them to prove themselves with cameo appearances off the bench. They benefit more than most players from consistent starts. A decent Prem striker will get you 12 or more goals a season.
This works out about a goal every 247 minutes of football. To get that many minutes from substitute appearences would take 12 games or more. So it’s far too early to judge a 21yo who is still developing and hasn’t yet had the minutes to prove himself.
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He is still young so you never know but so far I have not seen anything in this lad to excite me.
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Not so sure.
He is only 21 years old and although his scoring record of 2 goals in 39 appearances doesn’t look at all impressive, his record of 2 goals in 3 England under 20 appearances is a bit better.
I have a feeling that a fair proportion of his Villa appearances have been for substitute cameos of 10 - 20 minutes. I can’t remember him actually having a run in the team to find his feet, and I think he has looked a better player as time has gone on. He looks fitter and his movement is better.
I seem to remember a fair few players that we deemed not good enough or overrated at 21 that seem to have done OK in the end.
Exaccerly. He's had one short run of starts (7 or 8?) under Bruceball, scored a couple, missed a couple.
To label him a "non-scoring striker" on the basis of that plus a bunch of 10-15 minute sub appearances seems somewhat premature if not daft. His hold up play and general all round involvement looks better than Wesley's. He makes more of a nuisance of himself. I reckon if given a run of starts in this team, which creates a lot of chances instead of hoofing it at his head, he'd get some goals like Wesley has.
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And from what I remember (probably saw a limited amount, some streaming, some in the flesh)
He is still young so you never know but so far I have not seen anything in this lad to excite me.
I remember it being exciting that Bruce has stumbled across a man who we were impressed was holding the ball up and bringing people into the game unexpectedly well. Maybe it was low expectations, but I recall excitement when he got that run
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He will start against Wolves on Wednesday evening
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He will. And I imagine a decent showing will give him a reasonable chance at keeping his place for next Saturday as well. Did well when he came on today.
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He will start against Wolves on Wednesday evening
I think so too, gives him a good opportunity to show what he can do and put his case forward for a Prem start.
Let’s hope he gets a goal and causes havoc!
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I'd play both Davis and Wesley.
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I'd play both Davis and Wesley.
Agreed. We need something different
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I don't think I would, the midfield has been overrun in most games in the second half as it is.
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I don't think I would, the midfield has been overrun in most games in the second half as it is.
if he plays Wesley as a 10, he can play both.
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I wouldn’t either. While there is obviously room for improvement individually and as a team, we are the fifth top scorers in the division. Don’t think that warrants a change in system currently.
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Forget changing the system, we've done alright this season, getting beaten by arguably the best side in Europe in the second half is no reason to throw the baby out with the bath water. We've competed every single game this season and find ourselves mid table, we are doing fine.We will only go down this year if we do something daft and panic.
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They seem to be struggling at full back but will probably start Traore. I'd play with two wingers to exploit their defence and provide our full backs extra protection. If Grealish isn't fit, we will need the extra creativity, too.
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
I agree. To repeat for the umpteenth time though, what a crazy position to leave us in considering all the other good work in the transfer window. A choice between a youngster from another league struggling to adapt, and a youth player who however promising he is, makes Heskey look prolific.
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
Definitely deserves a proper chance. Might help Wes too, taking him out of the firing line for a bit but coming on to make an impact.
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
Admire your confidence but I’m less certain. He’s look good coming on as a sub and offering a new problem for tiring defenders but if he starts they will ready for him from the off. I’m not for a minute suggesting he definitely can’t do it just that maybe PL standard defenders will offer a new challenge to a striker who I think has only ever scored 3 goals for us.
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I think with Davis, even if he were to start a run of games, we would see similar inconsistent displays as we are with Wesley.
Davis has lots of positive attributes - he’s strong, he has looked very busy in his appearances so far and he can definitely strike a ball - but he is still raw and could do with some work on his decision making and the fa t he seems very one/left footed.
He could definitely do with a run of whole games as opposed to cameo sub appearances, but I probably just about agree with Chris that currently, for his development at least, I’m not certain that would be best done with us in the premier league. It’s a shame we didn’t get anyone else in as a Championship loan would have done him the world of good I think.
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
and those stats saying 39 appearances 2 goals are deceiving
lots of them were cameo appearances thrown on at the end of games sometimes in the last 5 minutes or later
if he had got the same amount of game time and minutes Wesley has got this season I reckon he’d have scored a few goals maybe more than Wes
Wes cost 20m so he needs to be backed,
But my issue is you can generally tell in the first 30 minutes if Wesley is on his game
he should have been swapped at half time in a few games this season when it just wasn’t happening for him and everyone could see that
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I'm convinced that if this lad gets a run, he'll make the shirt his own.
I think we're a better team with him in it, as it stands.
Definitely deserves a proper chance. Might help Wes too, taking him out of the firing line for a bit but coming on to make an impact.
I don't disagree that Davis should start: he's a kid with potential and will stay that way until he's given a few starts.
However, it has been observed elsewhere that Wes appears to be a confidence player so how Smith and the team handle this will be really important.
Wes and Keinan are similar players, similar age. I like them both, for different reasons. My issue with Davis is that his goalscoring record in the Championship was poor; partly - yes - because he did not get enough games, but also because he did not hit the target!
Like-for-like doesn't allow us to change the style of play if we need to. My guess is that we are where we are because we could not land the player we wanted to in the Summer (probably Maupay) and had no available back-up. I'd be amazed if we do not sign someone in January that offers something different.
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Out for 3/4 weeks apparently according to Dean Smith. Shame for him as he did appear to be on the verge of possibly getting more game time.
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I read earlier (sorry, can't remember where) that Luton Town are interested in Keinan on loan when he has recovered
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Very injury prone just like RHM and Green. Does make you wonder.
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There were quite a few interested in taking him on loan in the summer. It would probably be better for his development if he did go somewhere where he would get regular first team football.
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Is he still injured? Supposedly out for 3 to 4 weeks from the 1st November? That's now 7 weeks ? He never seems to stay fit for someone so young; Jamie Vardy at 32 is rarely injured....
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Very injury prone just like RHM and Green. Does make you wonder.
A valid point. We do seem to produce some fragile youngsters. One could even argue Jack is made of similar stuff - as unplayable and naturally talented as he is, has he ever had a season to date without a significant injury?
What sort of conditioning training do we do with these guys, is what I want to know. If true that we basically converted Oli Stevenson to a strength and conditioning coach because we couldn't be arsed hiring an experienced one, it's no wonder these younger fellas break like glass when introduced to a high-pressure first-team environment.*
*Edit: I do appreciate Oli has done some great work with Jack over the last year or two to toughen him up, and he does get hacked all over the pitch, but regardless of that you would still wonder.
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Very injury prone just like RHM and Green. Does make you wonder.
A valid point. We do seem to produce some fragile youngsters. One could even argue Jack is made of similar stuff - as unplayable and naturally talented as he is, has he ever had a season to date without a significant injury?
What sort of conditioning training do we do with these guys, is what I want to know. If true that we basically converted Oli Stevenson to a strength and conditioning coach because we couldn't be arsed hiring an experienced one, it's no wonder these younger fellas break like glass when introduced to a high-pressure first-team environment.*
*Edit: I do appreciate Oli has done some great work with Jack over the last year or two to toughen him up, and he does get hacked all over the pitch, but regardless of that you would still wonder.
Steve Bruce was quoted a few weeks back as saying we couldn't afford to hire one so Stevenson retrained as one. Which is quite telling if true...(same manager signed Scott Hogan so I have my doubts re affordability). A series of promising youngsters plagued with muscle injuries couldn't be a coincidence, mind.
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Is he still injured? Supposedly out for 3 to 4 weeks from the 1st November? That's now 7 weeks ? He never seems to stay fit for someone so young; Jamie Vardy at 32 is rarely injured....
I don’t think he is going to make it as a top footballer.
The first and absolute requirement is to be able to take the field of play regularly and this bloke can’t.
To be this troubled with injuries at this age is a huge problem.
It’s also a great shame because there is a real talent there.
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I do think that young players get over played and over trained whilst their body’s are still developing.
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I don't think RHM has had any serious fitness issues in the last eighteen months.
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I don't think RHM has had any serious fitness issues in the last eighteen months.
Yes, but what about Diane Abbott?
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He's back in training and so is Mings and both could be in contention for Watford. I give it until Jan 29th before Keinan is injured again.
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He's back in training and so is Mings and both could be in contention for Watford. I give it until Jan 29th before Keinan is injured again.
Might just be the boost we need
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So we're into week nine since he pulled a hamstring against Wolves, Dean's estimate was he'd be out for 3 to 4 weeks?? These figures are straight out of a Diane Abbott book on Maths!
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So we're into week nine since he pulled a hamstring against Wolves, Dean's estimate was he'd be out for 3 to 4 weeks?? These figures are straight out of a Diane Abbott book on Maths!
Yep, and not in the 18 today either.
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My guess is he'll play v. Fulham
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My guess is he'll play v. Fulham
Which season?
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Still out injured today at Burnley? Didn't make the bench....will he ever get fit?
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My guess is he'll play v. Fulham
Which season?
Ha.
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My guess is he'll play v. Fulham
Which season?
Ha.
I'm afraid he won't be playing against Fulham. DS confirmed Davis still has tightness in his hamstring so he won't be risked. Mid to late January is his expected return date now! Ffs at this rate McGinn will be back before him!
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So two and a half / three months to get back from a hamstring injury. I'd be interested to know what's gone on here, or if the player is just, unfortunately, very injury prone.
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Kids made of glass
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So two and a half / three months to get back from a hamstring injury. I'd be interested to know what's gone on here, or if the player is just, unfortunately, very injury prone.
Obviously more than the normal ham string, Mings 3 weeks Davis 3 months.
So either mis diagnosed or mis treated.
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Or Davis is just injury prone and also takes longer to recover from them rather than it being the club's fault.
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Or Davis is just injury prone and also takes longer to recover from them rather than it being the club's fault.
This. Some players do take longer to come back than others unfortunately.
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Or Davis is just injury prone and also takes longer to recover from them rather than it being the club's fault.
It’s an awful long time for a hamstring strain, so I guess it was a serious tear or something else. Or he tried to come back and went again.
Sometimes Doctors get it wrong, that’s not the clubs fault.
When I was playing I started to get Hamstring strains and was regularly getting treatment so I got to find out quite a lot about them.
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Or Davis is just injury prone and also takes longer to recover from them rather than it being the club's fault.
It’s an awful long time for a hamstring strain, so I guess it was a serious tear or something else. Or he tried to come back and went again.
Sometimes Doctors get it wrong, that’s not the clubs fault.
When I was playing I started to get Hamstring strains and was regularly getting treatment so I got to find out quite a lot about them.
c.f. Harry Kane's torn hamstring and the sppurrrrss media meltdown.
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I never had a hamstring injury
I played a lot in my younger days but was a old fashioned goal hanger like Gary Lineker or Darren Bent
so never did a lot which is probably why
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Thanks for your input
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Davis still not training according to DS. I'll say it again: John McGinn will be back ahead of Davis!
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Is Davis still alive?
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Davis still not training according to DS. I'll say it again: John McGinn will be back ahead of Davis!
3 weeks ago it was "he's fully fit", 2 weeks ago it was "he's back in training" and today it's "he's not even training". I wonder what we'll be fed next week?
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Davis still not training according to DS. I'll say it again: John McGinn will be back ahead of Davis!
3 weeks ago it was "he's fully fit", 2 weeks ago it was "he's back in training" and today it's "he's not even training". I wonder what we'll be fed next week?
I don't know if we get fed more rubbish than other clubs, but they do seem to make it up as they go along.
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Perhaps he's such an unreliable crock that the situation changes by the day. He must have a bout of the Sturridges.
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Perhaps he's such an unreliable crock that the situation changes by the day. He must have a bout of the Sturridges.
That's probably right sadly. I don't think he'll ever make it as a regular premier League striker, he's just too injury prone.
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I dare say I could read back through this thread, but frankly can't be arsed. Does he seem to pick up the same injury, or related injury, over and over again?
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Why do his hamstrings take three times as long as ever other players to heal.
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Because he's young. And they are probably still developing. Steven Gerard had awful injury issues at the start of his career with back and hamstrings due to his body and frame not being fully developed and then stressing it with mens football. Davis needs a bit of time, and then some regular games somewhere to prove to himself he can stay fit.
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I had always associated hamstrings with later career injuries.
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His previous spell out with injury was for a groin problem. But he seems to be injury prone. He looked visibly distressed when forced off against the Wolves.
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He’s more injury prone than Evel Knievel. See also: Staas, Ivo
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Because he's young. And they are probably still developing. Steven Gerard had awful injury issues at the start of his career with back and hamstrings due to his body and frame not being fully developed and then stressing it with mens football. Davis needs a bit of time, and then some regular games somewhere to prove to himself he can stay fit.
Yes I remember Gerrard seeming to be crocked all the time.
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When was Gerrard crocked. A quick look at Wiki, after his breakthrough season in 98, these were the number of games he played in:
1999 - 31
2000 - 50
2001 - 45
2002 - 54
2003 - 47
2004 - 43
2005 - 53
2006 - 51
2007 - 52
And so on. Can't see much in common with Keinan there to be honest.
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I believe it would have been around 2002 I had that perception. Didn't he miss the World Cup finals through injury?
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I believe it would have been around 2002 I had that perception. Didn't he miss the World Cup finals through injury?
2002
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When was Gerrard crocked. A quick look at Wiki, after his breakthrough season in 98, these were the number of games he played in:
1999 - 31
2000 - 50
2001 - 45
2002 - 54
2003 - 47
2004 - 43
2005 - 53
2006 - 51
2007 - 52
And so on. Can't see much in common with Keinan there to be honest.
Around the 2001 period he had growing pains in his body when he shot up to over 6ft.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/3014015/Gerrards-career-transformed-by-French-osteopath.html
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He was hardly crocked all the time though was he? Seeing as managed to play an average of about 48 games a season around then. Don't think Davis will manage that total in the next five years.
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It was more a point young players can have issues with their body developing which causes numerous issues.
Ultimately Davis does seem a slow recoverer from any injury he picks up. Last season his first game of the season was v Swansea in the FA cup. He then didn't play again until March 16th and then after that 13th April.
Can't remember what injuries he had last season but he certainly picks up many of them.
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It was more a point young players can have issues with their body developing which causes numerous issues.
Ultimately Davis does seem a slow recoverer from any injury he picks up. Last season his first game of the season was v Swansea in the FA cup. He then didn't play again until March 16th and then after that 13th April.
Can't remember what injuries he had last season but he certainly picks up many of them.
He's 21 now. At what point do we stop referring to players as 'young'? Young for a goalkeeper perhaps, not that young for a striker realistically. And the body is fully grown/developed by 18.
I would love to see more from Davis and hope he does well for us, but unfortunately the chances of that happening are dwindling by the day. At this rate I'd be giving Vassilev a chance (as a sub for now obviously) ahead of him because we just cannot afford to be relying on actual crocks in future seasons, in light of our general bad luck with injuries.
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I was listening to a podcast last night and they were talking about the U23 league. Interesting points were raised, mainly that it's a bit of a graveyard for younger players and if you are 21 and still playing regularly in that league, your chances of making it in the Premier league were reduced heavily. I know this doesn't apply to Davis, but still interesting.
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That is a fault with the premier league not a rule of football in general. In the premier league most teams are willing to play exceptional young players but otherwise they will sign players to fill gaps more than using their academy. That doesn't mean there quality isn't there, there are plenty of players in the premier league and championship who were released from big clubs as U23 and have gone on to have good careers. The top scorer in the league was nearly 26 when he first played in a professional league having been dumped as a 16 year old. Our own goalkeeper was dropped by Man United as a 24 year old and we've just signed a midfielder they also deemed not good enough as a 21 year old. Even Kane only really started being a regular for Spurs when he was 21.
Outside of the premier league, and the richer clubs in Europe, players breaking through in their early 20s is much more common with a lot of clubs having those sort of players as the backbone of their squad.
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Apparently available for selection tonight according to the meaning evil! Lord be praised.
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I thought he only started training a week ago. I hope they ease him back very gently, we can't really afford for him to have another setback.
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He's a seriously unlucky boy, timing his return with the debut of our new centre forward.
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I thought he had a good game when he came on tonight.
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This lad is a good player. Able to physically mix it with any defender, makes the ball stick up front and good to run with the ball. May never be the biggest goal threat in the box but can be an effective player if over his injury problems.
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And me, I look forward to seeing if he can build on it in his next appearance. Which will probably be his testimonial.
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He is a good player. I just hope he can stay fit and get some time to polish his game. Tonight he skinned 3 players then arrived in the box looking a bit lost.
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He's a seriously unlucky boy, timing his return with the debut of our new centre forward.
It's the Villa Way. I had him down to score the winner.
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One word. Promising.
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I hope he can stay fit because I think he's got what it takes to be a proper player.
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I thought he did alright considering how long he's been out.
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He did very well when he came on against Brighton and would be a serious option for starting games if he could prove his fitness.
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This lad has everything.
Please get fit and make it happen.
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I rate him very highly as well and I hope that his injury problems are more about him bulking out and getting used to adult football than the sign of an underlying issue. I'm fine with him as one of our 3 strikers long term and I suspect that he will add a few more goals to his game going forward, his touch, pace and strength are enough to cause problems for most defences.
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I think he's a good player, but he is about as threatening as an out of form Heskey. Our lack of options up front mean we are desperate for him to do well, and he's clearly worked hard to get back from injury but he has to look like he's a threat on goal a bit more.
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I do completely understand the concerns regarding his goal scoring, but in Keinan’s slight defence his only real run in our first team came in a Bruce side short of its best player.
Given Bruce’s tactics of keep it tight and hope someone delivers a bit of magic or nick a goal from a set piece (see his strikers record this season for further proof) it is conceivable that Davis might be more prolific in a Dean Smith team with a fit Jack Grealish.
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I do completely understand the concerns regarding his goal scoring, but in Keinan’s slight defence his only real run in our first team came in a Bruce side short of its best player.
Given Bruce’s tactics of keep it tight and hope someone delivers a bit of magic or nick a goal from a set piece (see his strikers record this season for further proof) it is conceivable that Davis might be more prolific in a Dean Smith team with a fit Jack Grealish.
Good point. He looked very lively on Tuesday.
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I do completely understand the concerns regarding his goal scoring, but in Keinan’s slight defence his only real run in our first team came in a Bruce side short of its best player.
Given Bruce’s tactics of keep it tight and hope someone delivers a bit of magic or nick a goal from a set piece (see his strikers record this season for further proof) it is conceivable that Davis might be more prolific in a Dean Smith team with a fit Jack Grealish.
I'd add that the ball sticks very well to Davis and he brings other players into play.
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and he was 19 at the time as well, there aren't many strikers who were prolific as 19 year olds playing first team football.
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I think he suffers in goalscoring because he's so good with his back to goal. If he were to play another way he probably would score more goals - for example in line with the last defender or making runs in to get on a cross, however I think he's taking one for the team to keep the ball and bring in other people. I really rate him, he's lively and a handful and reasonably quick. Yet to see what his real shooting boots are like and heading ability but I'm sure it will come.
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I’ve always liked him probably more than anyone on the site
(maybe equal with Leeb) and have always pushed his cause
but fuck me he does get injured a lot and at the really worse times
just when he could have had a little run in the team he’s out injured then when comes back we’ve just invested in a new striker with maybe more to come
that’s as bad luck as you can get when you need a few games to try and prove your credentials
so I’m still a big believer in him but he’s going to need game time which I can’t see happening
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Yeah agree Chris, he just needs to find some scoring boots
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Yeah agree Chris, he just needs to find some scoring boots
To be fair to him, he strikes the ball cleanly, he's not one that looks like he's left his boots in the box.
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Yeah agree Chris, he just needs to find some scoring boots
To be fair to him, he strikes the ball cleanly, he's not one that looks like he's left his boots in the box.
Agreed Lee but I did say "scoring"
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Yeah agree Chris, he just needs to find some scoring boots
To be fair to him, he strikes the ball cleanly, he's not one that looks like he's left his boots in the box.
Agreed Lee but I did say "scoring"
It will come my friend.
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He reminds me of Heskey
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I wish. We’d have some player if he looked like a young Heskey.
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I wish. We’d have some player if he looked like a young Heskey.
We have 'some player', in my opinion.
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He reminds me of Heskey
the same Heskey that Villa fans didn't really appreciate?
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I wish. We’d have some player if he looked like a young Heskey.
We have 'some player', in my opinion.
We might. But at the same age Heskey was miles better and having done superbly at Leicester on the verge of a move to Liverpool.
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He reminds me of Heskey
the same Heskey that Villa fans didn't really appreciate?
Probably because he was utter shite by the time we signed him. Doesn't mean he wasn't good earlier in his career.
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Yeah agree Chris, he just needs to find some scoring boots
To be fair to him, he strikes the ball cleanly, he's not one that looks like he's left his boots in the box.
Agreed Lee but I did say "scoring"
It will come my friend.
Well that's good enough for me mate
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When Heskey was 19 he looked an absolute beast and played like the finished article. Davis is nowhere near tbat level
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I like him as a player but feel he needs to add a little composure to his finishing, he seems to do the hard part to get into scoring positions but then ends up hitting it straight at the keeper or hitting the bar. That can improve with coaching and experience and if it does then he can have a really decent career.
Which is why he should be out on loan in the Championship or League One, rather than on the bench or starting at Villa.
He has Heskey-like moments/runs but needs a season banging them in at a lower level........if he can
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For starters, he's nothing like Heskey. He's brilliant at holding the ball and has bags of skill.
Secondly, we'll get nothing from loaning him out to the lower leagues. The time is now. Play him.
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When Heskey was 19 he looked an absolute beast and played like the finished article. Davis is nowhere near tbat level
Agreed, I forget the year but there was the one game when he absolutely tore us a new one while playing for Leicester. He then had a couple of very good years scoring-wise at Liverpool, before suddenly turning into a "defensive striker". ie not scoring any more.
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When Heskey was 19 he looked an absolute beast and played like the finished article. Davis is nowhere near tbat level
Agreed, I forget the year but there was the one game when he absolutely tore us a new one while playing for Leicester. He then had a couple of very good years scoring-wise at Liverpool, before suddenly turning into a "defensive striker". ie not scoring any more.
I think it was 1996-97. We were title contenders, Leicester had just got promoted and they turned up at Villa Park with this unknown monster that our defenders were bouncing off all afternoon.
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Is that the game when Ellery gave a very soft penalty in Heskey's favour ?
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For starters, he's nothing like Heskey. He's brilliant at holding the ball and has bags of skill.
Secondly, we'll get nothing from loaning him out to the lower leagues. The time is now. Play him.
Amen brother.
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Put it this way, I'd much much rather have a 21 year old Heskey than a 21 year old Davis.
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Put it this way, I'd much much rather have a 21 year old Heskey than a 21 year old Davis.
At 21, Heskey had played over a 100 first-team games, most as a starter. Keinan's played about 40, most of them as a sub, and most of those in the season when he was still 19/20. He spent last season injured or behind Tammy (quite rightly), and this season either injured or behind our record signing.
The little run he had in the side in the 17/18 season showed he's clearly got some ability, but whether he's ever going to be prolific at this level, I don't know. I've got no issue at all with him getting a few 30 min run outs for a tiring Samatta in the coming weeks, and if he's 100% fit I think he could give tiring defences a really torrid time.
He might not score many, but he WILL get us good possession in the final third allowing other players to do their thing.
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I was very impressed with his cameo on Tuesday night.
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how much do people think Davis is worth in the current transfer market ?
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£350m.
To us, right now with only Samata left....
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I was very impressed with his cameo on Tuesday night.
Agreed. Looked very strong and always prepared to chase/battle. If he can stay fit and work on his finishing then he could be very valuable to us for the rest of the season.
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I was very impressed with his cameo on Tuesday night.
Agreed. Looked very strong and always prepared to chase/battle. If he can stay fit and work on his finishing then he could be very valuable to us for the rest of the season.
He could be as good as Iheanacho.
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Keinan was good for half a year in the championship before his form, as happens with youngsters, tailed off. He's done okay this season in his appearences. His biggest issue seems to be injuries and at frustrating times. I like him. He needs to score more and I get the impression people will say that about him for the rest of his career. But, he works hard, brings people into play. He's got a bit of presence and I think with midfielders like Grealish, AEG, Trezeguet and Hourihane, he'll be an asset to play off. He won't score but he'll create opportunities for the midfield to score.
As has been said, it's now or never really. Play him. There will be games Samatta may struggle where Davis could be useful off the bench. If he scores 3 or 4 and contributed to another 3-4, he'll have done alright by the end of the season.
Comparisons with Heskey are a little unfair. It was rare in those days to have that combination of size, strength and pace Emile had. You still had Mickey Quinn ambling around at the end of his career when Heskey was starting out. The vast majority of players are complete gym monsters now and if not, lithe a.f and CH'S are generally quicker (though on the flip side, also lighter). He also got played young, and played often and was well established by the time Leicester got up. His goal record at Leicester was prolific (by latter Heskey standards).
I just hope Keinan stays fit.
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Keinan was good for half a year in the championship before his form, as happens with youngsters, tailed off. He's done okay this season in his appearences. His biggest issue seems to be injuries and at frustrating times. I like him. He needs to score more and I get the impression people will say that about him for the rest of his career. But, he works hard, brings people into play. He's got a bit of presence and I think with midfielders like Grealish, AEG, Trezeguet and Hourihane, he'll be an asset to play off. He won't score but he'll create opportunities for the midfield to score.
As has been said, it's now or never really. Play him. There will be games Samatta may struggle where Davis could be useful off the bench. If he scores 3 or 4 and contributed to another 3-4, he'll have done alright by the end of the season.
Comparisons with Heskey are a little unfair. It was rare in those days to have that combination of size, strength and pace Emile had. You still had Mickey Quinn ambling around at the end of his career when Heskey was starting out. The vast majority of players are complete gym monsters now and if not, lithe a.f and CH'S are generally quicker (though on the flip side, also lighter). He also got played young, and played often and was well established by the time Leicester got up. His goal record at Leicester was prolific (by latter Heskey standards).
I just hope Keinan stays fit.
If he scores or contributes to 5 winning goals then he'll do for me!
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I am a fan, he has ability strength and decent speed.
It’s his injuries that are holding him back.
He is a great asset to bring off the bench.
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His all round game is decent. But he's never looks like scoring. Not even a hint of it. A squeek. A mere shimmer. He's just not a natural striker. Villa clearly have huge faith in him, and I can see him getting a few starts in coming weeks, but he simply has to add a goal threat to his game.
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I am a fan, he has ability strength and decent speed.
It’s his injuries that are holding him back.
He is a great asset to bring off the bench.
Injuries and almost total lack of goal threat.
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I am a fan, he has ability strength and decent speed.
It’s his injuries that are holding him back.
He is a great asset to bring off the bench.
Injuries and almost total lack of goal threat.
It will come imo
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I hope so John. He's seemingly got everything you need to be a success in this league. He's quick, strong and skilful. He just forgets to kick the ball towards the goal!
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I hope so John. He's seemingly got everything you need to be a success in this league. He's quick, strong and skilful. He just forgets to kick the ball towards the goal!
Or get into the box.
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Someone likened him to Heskey and I think that's a fair shout. Apart from that one season up at Liverpool where he scored about 18, he was never prolific either and wasn't the type of striker who was instinctive in front of goal. Davis is the same but he has other attributes to his game. I like him a lot.
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I hope so John. He's seemingly got everything you need to be a success in this league. He's quick, strong and skilful. He just forgets to kick the ball towards the goal!
Can't argue with that
Like I said in a previous post it's a crying shame he was injured just when he would have been given a proper run of games starting rather than cameo's
but it wasn't to be, the lads been unfortunate hope his luck changes for all our sakes
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He improved us today when he came on.
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Should have buried his chance, but he is certainly effective.
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He looked good when he came on, but I'd be surprised if he scores a single goal this season. It just isn't in him.
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If he could score goals he would be a hell of a player. Causes defences all kinds of problems, goalkeepers, not so much.
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He’s doing ok and is a young player making his way. He shouldn’t be in the position of having to be our back up striker though. That’s a recruitment fuck up. Also you’re only going to go so far as a striker if you don’t score goals.
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Great to hold up the ball and bring others into the game. Useless at scoring goals.
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Would quite like to see him start up front with Samatta and then Jack in behind them as our front three in at least some of our upcoming games.
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We might as well play with then then, because he can't score - it's as simple as that.
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Would quite like to see him start up front with Samatta and then Jack in behind them as our front three in at least some of our upcoming games.
That wouldn't be a bad tactic, let Keinan batter the opposition for most of the game then bring on AEG or Trez later on when tiredness is setting in, if we need to push for a win, (what am I saying, we always need to push for a win).
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We seem to have a good goalkeeping coach who has done wonders for Nyland. Have we a striker's coach? I feel sure that Davis would benefit from some coaching on finishing with his head and especially with his feet (imo this is the weakest area of his game). Even an ex-professional PL striker on the payroll for the next 2 weeks might benefit him.
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Would quite like to see him start up front with Samatta and then Jack in behind them as our front three in at least some of our upcoming games.
That wouldn't be a bad tactic, let Keinan batter the opposition for most of the game then bring on AEG or Trez later on when tiredness is setting in, if we need to push for a win, (what am I saying, we always need to push for a win).
Agree with this, I think it would benefit Samatta swell
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I'd be happy with that too, especially at home.
A more genuine 343.
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Would quite like to see him start up front with Samatta and then Jack in behind them as our front three in at least some of our upcoming games.
me too, that front 3 would see Jack in his best role, and keep shite like El Ghazi and Trez on the bench.
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Would quite like to see him start up front with Samatta and then Jack in behind them as our front three in at least some of our upcoming games.
me too, that front 3 would see Jack in his best role, and keep shite like El Ghazi and Trez on the bench.
Yep seems like the correct solution currently, particularly El Ghazi who’s a waste of a shirt. Trez for some lively running as a super sub.
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Thought he did well yesterday, put himself about a bit. Technically an assist for the goal? What I liked about the lead up to the goal was how Jack was perfectly happy playing it to his feet in the box with his back to goal, and it stuck. It's been missing from our build-up play, and gives us another option when we're attacking teams who are behind the ball. He should have done better with his proper chance, but while he's getting chances and creating a bit of havoc, I'm happy enough. I think there's a valuable squad player in there, definitely...
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I think he would do well alongside Samatta the two of them together would cause problems for the opposition.
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He has started for the U23 side against WBA.
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And promptly gets injured! Goes off holding his hamstring. FFS!!
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And promptly gets injured!
oh ffs
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Christ on a bike.
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He's made of tissue paper and gossamer threads.
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I'm getting to the point where anytime one of our players moves, I think they'll get injured.
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I hope that fella from Swansea is good.
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Most unsuprising injury news in years.
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And promptly gets injured! Goes off holding his hamstring. FFS!!
A tackle by Brunt apparently, haven't seen it so can't comment.
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If he's injured, the failure to get in a proven striker in January is even more of a gamble. It just highlights how the whole recruitment policy has been questionable at best.
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FAAAAAAK.
Jesus fucking Christ.
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Brilliant news. The gamble really is paying off. Well done villa 👌
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I'm getting to the point where anytime one of our players moves, I think they'll get injured.
It seems to be a bit more likely if that player is K Davis esquire.
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He should be called Glass
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Whats up with our youngsters? Green davis RHM all bloody injured most of the season.
Their fitness levels are atrocious
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There's clearly an underlying issue with Keinan. What was it, approx 16 weeks for the last injury? I was surprised he'd made the squad so quickly as I thought he only started traing a couple of weeks ago.
I feel desperately sorry for him.
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He’s the new Blancmange Ron
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If he's injured, the failure to get in a proven striker in January is even more of a gamble. It just highlights how the whole recruitment policy has been questionable at best.
We should have got a proven striker (or two) in the summer.
An unproven Wesley, a past-it Kodjia and an injury-prone kid who can't find the net was always a risky strategy to get us through a season.
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If he's injured, the failure to get in a proven striker in January is even more of a gamble. It just highlights how the whole recruitment policy has been questionable at best.
We should have got a proven striker (or two) in the summer.
An unproven Wesley, a past-it Kodjia and an injury-prone kid who can't find the net was always a risky strategy to get us through a season.
Bought 2 in January, one who has scored on his Premier League Debut. Scoring goals isn't the problem, letting them in at the other end is.
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There's clearly an underlying issue with Keinan. What was it, approx 16 weeks for the last injury? I was surprised he'd made the squad so quickly as I thought he only started traing a couple of weeks ago.
I feel desperately sorry for him.
There must be a doubt over his ability to continue his career as a Professional Footballer.
Maybe his body just aint up to it, very sad.
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If he's injured, the failure to get in a proven striker in January is even more of a gamble. It just highlights how the whole recruitment policy has been questionable at best.
We should have got a proven striker (or two) in the summer.
An unproven Wesley, a past-it Kodjia and an injury-prone kid who can't find the net was always a risky strategy to get us through a season.
Bought 2 in January, one who has scored on his Premier League Debut. Scoring goals isn't the problem, letting them in at the other end is.
If we'd bought two in the summer, we'd have had alternatives/someone to bring on from the bench all through the first half of the season.
Maybe we'd have nicked a few more points that might be the difference between us going down and staying up. And meant we wouldn't have played most of January without a recognised striker.
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He makes Sturridge look like Cal Ripken*
*One for UKR and about half a dozen others
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He makes Sturridge look like Cal Ripken*
*One for UKR and about half a dozen others
Bit optimistic?
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Must be so frustrating for the lad. I really like the look of him but I fear he will never stay fit long enough to play many games.
Who will get injured next?
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Davis again, probably.
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I think he’s made of spiders webs and magic.
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Some mighty unpowerful magic.
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If he ever had a proper run of games there’s a lot to like about Davis. But right now I’m wondering whether that’s ever going to happen for him.
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I think he’s made of spiders webs and magic.
He’s made of whatever is the complete opposite of Graphene.
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it's ok
We have a Swansea reject to get us out the shit !
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I hope that fella from Swansea is good.
My daughters fiancé who is a swans ST holder says fans saying they’re laughing that his wages are off their books. Was shocking for them , however service to him was poor and signs are there if he gets crosses... so u never know !!
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And promptly gets injured! Goes off holding his hamstring. FFS!!
WTF villa?.
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Why play him two days after a PL appearance? We are cursed. Cursed I tells ya.
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Why play him two days after a PL appearance?
Does seem a bit stupid.
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Or it was to help with his match fitness considering he's been out for ages and we don't play again for a couple of weeks.
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Or it was to help with his match fitness considering he's been out for ages and we don't play again for a couple of weeks.
I am sure that was the idea.
But after such a long period out with a hamstring you would have thought that would have tried to nurse the situation.
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I could see the reason behind it but playing him so soon after Saturday was a little odd but it's been done before I'm sure.
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Why play him two days after a PL appearance? We are cursed. Cursed I tells ya.
Because he only played a few minutes and needs to get match fit.
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There’s nothing wrong with playing a professional athlete in a game a few days after the last one...we’ll never know if he was fully recovered or if he needed more rest, and a repeat injury could easily have happened in training. Unfortunately Davis is injury prone, and could be plagued with these type of injuries throughout his career.
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Or it was to help with his match fitness considering he's been out for ages and we don't play again for a couple of weeks.
I am sure that was the idea.
But after such a long period out with a hamstring you would have thought that would have tried to nurse the situation.
He had a 25 minute run out with the U23s. How do you nurse the situation better than that, hook him after 20?
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I presume our medical team had mapped a programme out for him and playing last night was part of it. Whilst it's frustrating for everyone I suspect they know more about rehab than most of us. Lets just put it down to misfortune and not mismanagement.
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Oh well our new man has some time to train with the first team to get ready - I think we can write young Kienan off for the season - he's just not cut out for this.
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He makes Sturridge look like Cal Ripken*
*One for UKR and about half a dozen others
Ripken was an embarrassment at the end, putting himself above what was best for his team just to keep his consecutive game streak going
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I presume our medical team had mapped a programme out for him and playing last night was part of it. Whilst it's frustrating for everyone I suspect they know more about rehab than most of us. Lets just put it down to misfortune and not mismanagement.
Chris totally agree with you, they're the experts, not us
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His body just doesn't seem capable of being used for professional football.
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Do we know how serious it is yet? Perhaps he was just taken off as a precaution and it's nothing serious?
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Jesus Christ this fella is a crock.
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Reports suggesting it's the same hamstring as last time. If it is, I don't imagine we'll see him again this season.
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We need to cash in come the summer. We just can't rely on him. For a kid his age he shouldnt be as injured as much as he is
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Do we know how serious it is yet? Perhaps he was just taken off as a precaution and it's nothing serious?
From what I've seen he came off in discomfort rather than completely crocked and he's now having a scan done to see what's going on. I don't think anyone will know until near the end of the week but the optimisitc outlook is that he's just over-stretched a little and will be fine but they're, correctly, being very cautious with it.
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We need to cash in come the summer. We just can't rely on him. For a kid his age he shouldnt be as injured as much as he is
"Cash in" might be a bit optimistic on a player who has 2 goals in 39 games (most of which at a level below) and a horrific injury record.
Can't see clubs starting a bidding war.
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Can't see clubs starting a bidding war.
But surely if someone triggers his release clause?
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Can't see clubs starting a bidding war.
But surely if someone triggers his release clause?
…..and dips into their war chest.....
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Reports suggesting it's the same hamstring as last time. If it is, I don't imagine we'll see him again this decade.
Fixed.
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Can't see clubs starting a bidding war.
But surely if someone triggers his release clause?
…and dips into their war chest…
There'll be no need to swoop. A leisurely saunter down will snag him.
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He'd probably have tried to run it off in a Premier League game, for the U23s even the slightest twinge should result in a 1st team player coming off.
It could be bad, it could just be a tweak, until we know more, suggesting it's poor management etc just doesn't make sense does it?
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Didn’t Vardy come off with a hamstring injury but was back on the pitch against us just a couple of weeks later? It’s a set back but hopefully this one might not be as bad as we’re all expecting.
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I haven’t actually seen the incident or direct quotes. Optimistically, might just be a tweak and come off cautiously. Or did he look properly crocked?
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We need to cash in come the summer. We just can't rely on him. For a kid his age he shouldnt be as injured as much as he is
"Cash in" might be a bit optimistic on a player who has 2 goals in 39 games (most of which at a level below) and a horrific injury record.
Can't see clubs starting a bidding war.
I believe his current contract is due to expire in the summer.
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I haven’t actually seen the incident or direct quotes. Optimistically, might just be a tweak and come off cautiously. Or did he look properly crocked?
As I said earlier, what I saw suggested he was holding his hamstring and walked off in discomfort rather then being helped off the field (that's how the local papers are reporting it and I've seen a couple of comments from people who were there as well, i think someone on here said they'd been in the reserves thread so maybe they can clarify).
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I haven’t actually seen the incident or direct quotes. Optimistically, might just be a tweak and come off cautiously. Or did he look properly crocked?
Ashley Preece, who was at the match:
Ashley Preece
@PreeceObserver
·
17h
overriding concern is Keinan Davis’ hamstring injury, striker will now have scan & await severity of strain. Same hammy which ruled him out for 3 months. It occurred after taking powerful strike which hit post. KD appeared in discomfort before heading in. A big blow.
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What's interesting with that is that he makes no mention of a Brunt challenge but a few other places have said there was a challenge and he came off immediately afterwards. That's pretty important because pain after a shot is much more likely to be muscle damage.
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Didn’t Vardy come off with a hamstring injury but was back on the pitch against us just a couple of weeks later? It’s a set back but hopefully this one might not be as bad as we’re all expecting.
I think Vardy's injury was to his Gluteus Maximus and not his Hamstring.
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Didn’t Vardy come off with a hamstring injury but was back on the pitch against us just a couple of weeks later? It’s a set back but hopefully this one might not be as bad as we’re all expecting.
I think Vardy's injury was to his Gluteus Maximus and not his Hamstring.
Technical term is sprained arse isn't it?
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Didn’t Vardy come off with a hamstring injury but was back on the pitch against us just a couple of weeks later? It’s a set back but hopefully this one might not be as bad as we’re all expecting.
I think Vardy's injury was to his Gluteus Maximus and not his Hamstring.
Technical term is sprained arse isn't it?
Yeah, I'm surprised SJM doesn't suffer from it.
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Didn’t Vardy come off with a hamstring injury but was back on the pitch against us just a couple of weeks later? It’s a set back but hopefully this one might not be as bad as we’re all expecting.
No, Vardy had a glute muscle injury
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Thanks Paul _e and adrenachrome
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Out for another three weeks …..disappointing
The fella really does appear to be injury prone.
Not his fault I know but the club needs to make a decision on him
We are left short in the squad once again
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This spanish chap will take his place on the bench I would guess.
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I certainly wouldn't be extending his contract if I was the club. Absolutely pointless paying somebody to sit in the treatment room all year.
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When is his contract up?
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Out for another three weeks …..disappointing
The fella really does appear to be injury prone.
Not his fault I know but the club needs to make a decision on him
We are left short in the squad once again
They said three weeks last time. Better wrap Sama in cotton wool, otherwise we're down to Swansea's third choice striker.
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When is his contract up?
End of the season, I believe.
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It's a whole new ball game these days but look back and see what injuries some players played with back in the day - ok , it probably shortened their careers but the rewards were less then
I'm thinking, Dublin, Hateley, Andy Gray, Peter Withe
I don't subscribe to penalizing players if they are injured or ill but paying £thousands to players to continually sit on the sidelines seems an expensive way to operate a business - it's not like they can do other "work" other than be ambassadors for their club - or be the dressing room jester or Christmas Santa
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I seem to remember Withey playing for England with a broken cheekbone. He's a tougher man than me.
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He's made of Cheerios
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He's 22 this month, I'm sure the club has kept a close eye on his injuries as he's been growing over the last few years. If they don't think he can stay fit, I imagine he'll be off, but I'd have no problem with him staying beyond the summer as a backup/ impact sub. He won't be on big money, and has shown glimpses that if fit he can contribute.
Given the money we've wasted on forwards in recent years, I'd have no issue throwing a few grand a week at keeping him. It would be a relatively low-risk, high-potential-reward situation.
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Yeah, frustrating as the injuries are I'd give him one more season to prove himself.
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I agree. We need to remember that two years ago, it was barely possible for Hepburn-Murphy and Green to stay fit for three consecutive games. that isn't true anymore.
Perhaps Keinan will get over his problems as well.
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https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2020/05/04/epl-invitational-second-edition
Come on Big KD dont get injured
They will have an interview with him pre match too and hopefully he'll win!
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Great stuff big man. 6-1
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Finished Liverpool 1 Villa 6. It's just like real life!
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We out the bottom 3 now?
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Think he has been using his injury lay off time wisely.
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Okay, that counts as our game in hand. You can end the season, now.
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2-0 up! go on Keinan.
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4-0 HT
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p08c6s2l/epremier-league-invitational-tournament-quarterfinals-keinan-davis-aston-villa-v-charlie-taylor-burnley
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4-1, typical DS team talk.
5-1
6-1
7-1
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FT
Burnley 1 Aston Villa 8 (Eight)
into the semi-final against Maddison (Lei)
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He's quite good at this game. Mon Keinan.
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Semi and finals will be played tomorrow
Sky, BBC , YouTube , premier league all showing !
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Fxukin 'ell, all this exposure has got to add a few mill to Keinan's value if we choose to sell.
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Why the surprise? - he's had so much time off with injury that you'd expect him to be a 10th dan master black belt at this stuff.
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This includes the full QF game
https://www.premierleague.com/news/1666543
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Pleased to have only just found out that Villa extended Keinan Davis' deal by 12 months as club triggered a 12-month extension to his contract. Read this news today but was announced week or so ago escaping me and maybe here?? What with life.
So he's here contractually at least to next summer 2021.
Club and player both protected with that deal and we were all seeing signs again of his effectiveness in his hold up and team play before the break and especially after returning (yet again ) from injury seemed very direct and using power and such a handful
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That's good news, I'm convinced that if stays fit he's going to become a very good player for us, he uses his physicality very intelligently and is a proper team player.
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Link for live coverage of the semi final which is about to start
https://www.premierleague.com/news/1664233
Or if anyone would prefer iplayer https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/football/52504387
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Come on, hurry up! What time's kick-off? Have I got time to go and get more cake?
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And we're off, get into 'em!
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1 up
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1-1 right at HT
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SCORRRRRRRRRRCHIO
2-1
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2-1, Davis with a second himself
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3-1
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Captain Jack. Left peg
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3-2
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Villa doing a Villa late on. Now 3-2
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3-3 ffs
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Davis OUT. FFS So very Villa
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FT.
Golden goal time.
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That formation change worked out well!
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Honestly though. You just knew it was going to happen.
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Lost 4-3. ffs
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He's definitely Villa.
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Fucking hell man. 3 goals in less than 10 minutes
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Sell him. He's dead to me now.
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fkn useless.
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Typical Villa, snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory!
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2020 truly has been shit.
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Davis a chump to lose that at 3-1 doesn't need to go safety.
He so much better but let btec Grealish get back in and then flounder the golden goal match.
Disappointing really as Davis conceded equalising goals at crucial time send of first half and then that 91st minutes .
Paid for his laid back style when really he's fully in control of things. And losing to that Maddison is gauling
Oh well next tournament please .
Don't know if they'll squeeze out another.
But up the villa
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Concede in stoppage time of each half. Needless substitution with 9' left.
Sherwood Davis out.
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I don't play Fifa so can someone explain can you just win games by constantly doing drag backs which seem impossible to defend against
Still that aside Keinan screwed himself with the change to 5 at the back
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Did he manage 90 minutes?
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Did he manage 90 minutes?
and about a minute of extra time ...
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So that’ll be the ‘going nuclear’ option with those two up front?
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Pleased to see him start his first ever prem game
Felt he has everything but a goal scorers touch. Real handful. Best striker on the pitch today .
Needed another alongside him.
Shame he didn't score though !
Good effort KD .
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Yes thought he was excellent. A real handful for defenders.
He has to start against Chelsea on Sunday.
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He definitely worries defenders. Goalkeepers, not so much.
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I like him, the team plays better with him as we play higher up the pitch and the ball sticks up the right end.
However needs to play with a second striker as doesn't score many.
Reminds me of Heskey when he was good.
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Thought he did pretty well. Might have also been down to tiredness but we certainly didn’t look as threatening after Samatta came on.
Must also be remembered it’s his first start for about two and a half years I think, so don’t think he should be judged too harshly.
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We're a better team when Davis plays.
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We're a better team when Davis plays.
Just needs a goalscorer alongside him.
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We're a better team when Davis plays.
Just needs a goalscorer alongside him.
Yep.
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I always hoped it would be RHM.
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We're a better team when Davis plays.
Just needs a goalscorer alongside him.
Yep.
Will need to be the midfielders though you’d imagine. Almost zero chance Smith suddenly starts playing with two strikers.
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He played v well. He should have scored the header but his other half chances were good efforts. A goal would do him the world of good.
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It will be interesting to see how he does in the remaining games, now that teams know we are going to be playing long ball football - also he is a centre forward therefore he will be judged on the number of goals that he scores (he does seem to struggle in that area of his game) and his big problem is will he remain fit?
He has the next 9 games to prove he can be a premier league centre forward.
I am not convinced.
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He's definitely in the Heskey mould. As a side we link attack and midfield better and his hold up is great. I feel like he's a ticking time bomb with hamstrings etc (like Emile).
Trouble is, we needed far more running from Hourihane yesterday. If you sacrifice a goal scoring forward (though the jury is out on Sama on that front I suppose), your goal scoring midfielders need to be breaking beyond.
I think the issue will be, can we play Davis where he's most effective, and still play Samatta alongside?
Lets see how Keinan does against Chelsea. I think it's important he plays regularly to see if his body will hold up to it. It's those big chances Davis gets that you have to be putting away (like the header from 6 yards), and he tends to fluff his lines. If he gets 2-3 goals in the last games it'll do him the world of good though.
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Playing him from the start was a clever bit of thinking in hindsight. They were probably expecting to be up against Samatta so that may have thrown them a bit. He did ok, maybe should have done better with the header he had though.
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3 clear chances for Davis.
Samatta would have buried 1 of them.
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If he starts all of our remaining fixtures I'll be absolutely amazed.
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If he starts all of our remaining fixtures I'll be absolutely amazed.
I doubt very much he will.
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We should be 'celebrating' his first PL goal this morning when he bounced Nyland into his own net.
Other than that, Henderson made a respectable stop from him.
Can't help but think that Samatta might have got to El Ghazi's low driven cross ( the only decent thing he did).
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I thought he did well overall but should have scored with the header he put over.
Henderson made a good save.
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Can't help but think that Samatta might have got to El Ghazi's low driven cross ( the only decent thing he did).
Usain Bolt nevermind Samatta wouldn't have got to it, there was too much power on the cross. Whether a less powerful cross would have beaten both the keeper and defender is another matter but I don't blame Davis for not getting on the end of it.
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Davis' main attributes are that he can hold the ball up better than any other forward we have. He's also decent in the air. He's not a natural when it comes to scoring though. The best move of the whole match should have been put away. An instinctive striker would have been in a better position to finish that chance.
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Like many others in the squad, Davis is not of the quality required to keep us in the top flight which is why I fear we will go down - playing a forward/striker who doesn't score goals is a recipe for failure
-
He's also decent in the air.
I can’t agree with this. Like Kodjia before him he jumps under every high ball whilst making it look like he’s making an effort. He does however get his body in between ball and defender and hold it up very well. Let’s hope he stays fit and we can capitalise on the extra possession in the opposition’s half.
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Liverpool fan at work commented today that the villa striker looked a real handful. He had no idea who he was but said he stood out as a threat.
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He just doesn't score goals though does he, I'm really uncomfortable with forwards who don't score. I don't think we have enough goals in the rest of the side to carry a forward who won't bag many. To stay up we have to score a fair few goals.
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To be fair one of his efforts yesterday was really good and took a fine save to deny him.
My biggest issue is that if we’re going to play him we have to get more players in and around him on a consistent basis.
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He's a really good player and I'd love to see him alongside Samatta. How we work this with Dean Smith I don't know, he doesn't seem to play two up top.
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I like him and think he’s got something. I wish Dean would try two up front.
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The thing we him ‘not scoring’ is the only decent run in the team we have to base that on was almost two and a half seasons ago went he was 19. His overall game seems decent so I’m be prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt for a while.
Also, Sheffield United started with a pair of strikers that have scored three and four goals all season. And also brought on one that has scored at all. They’ve managed ok.
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Good point Luke, I'd like to see him have a run, I really like him.
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Also, Sheffield United started with a pair of strikers that have scored three and four goals all season. And also brought on one that has scored at all. They’ve managed ok.
Scoring lots of goals isn't as important if you have a decent defence. We've conceded more than twice (56) as many as they have (25).
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The thing we him ‘not scoring’ is the only decent run in the team we have to base that on was almost two and a half seasons ago went he was 19. His overall game seems decent so I’m be prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt for a while.
Also, Sheffield United started with a pair of strikers that have scored three and four goals all season. And also brought on one that has scored at all. They’ve managed ok.
Spot on mate.
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He gave more than Samatta, looked to provide options held the ball up well, but he is not a natural finisher.
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I like Samatta as a player, but he offers fuck all in our team unless he gets support, which he almost never does. Davis generates his own support by giving the midfield time to catch up with him.
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He's also decent in the air.
I can’t agree with this. Like Kodjia before him he jumps under every high ball whilst making it look like he’s making an effort. He does however get his body in between ball and defender and hold it up very well. Let’s hope he stays fit and we can capitalise on the extra possession in the opposition’s half.
Think you mean Wesley not Kodjia .
He scored some great headers and was decent enough. Though some of his jumping suspect it never to Wesley proportions of ineptness.
Anyway I think Davis is ok in the air or at least developing. Has missed a few shooting wise but other types of headers for flicks and lay offs not too bad.
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I know what I meant. Flicked headers and nod ins are most welcome for goals scored. But I can assure you Kodjia never put his head on any ball booted clear by the defenders or goalkeeper which in my opinion is a must for a player leading the line. You’re usually quite well informed so go back and watch any games and note how many time he jumps under the ball allowing defender to clear.
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I think Keinan is the future of the club,if we go down I think we'd struggle to keep both samatta and wesley ,I think Keinan and Samatta could work well but we know stubborn Dean won't try that
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I think Keinan is the future of the club,if we go down I think we'd struggle to keep both samatta and wesley ,I think Keinan and Samatta could work well but we know stubborn Dean won't try that
Do we now? Could you lend us your crystal ball for a week so I can have a look?
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It's a bit harsh writing off a striker who has only made one start in the Premier League. I've seen enough of Keinan to suggest he has a chance to become a decent striker, if not a prolific goalscorer. The main challenge will be staying fit.
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When he got a run of games under Bruce, we looked better as a side because he was able to hold the ball up and give the midfield chance to catch-up. I hope the goals start to come, given a chance. He does remind me a fair bit of Heskey though, which with how the game has changed over the years may not be a bad thing now. He was really unlucky that he didn't score the other night though and that was a good instinct to charge into the box and throw himself at the pullback.
Samatta looks like a striker, in ways that Wesley doesn't. I actually wouldn't mind seeing a front 3 of Wesley - Davis - Samatta in the right circumtances.
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Given that we saw Daivs defensing quite well form the front on Wednesday, I really would like to see him and Samatta together - perhaps at the expense of AEG in the starting line-up - because I think we'd be more muscular and dynamic when moving forwards.
I like AEG but he is too in and out at the moment.
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I think Keinan is the future of the club,if we go down I think we'd struggle to keep both samatta and wesley ,I think Keinan and Samatta could work well but we know stubborn Dean won't try that
I admire your positivity .....however if Davis is the " future" we won't be troubling the Premier League anytime soon - we need to be looking at better players than KD
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A video of how Antonio played last night for West Ham against Chelski should be shown to Keinan Davis and our defenders every day for the rest of their career.
Fantastic performance. Getting to the ball first, either shielding it and bringing others into play, laying it off or winning a free kick and so on.
Major difference, the long balls played into Antonio had purpose, precision and gave him a chance to perform.
Mings in particular, needs to stop piddling around on the ball for that extra 2 or 3 seconds (trying to look pretty) before aimlessly hoofing it up the field and hoping for the best.
When possible, all our defenders need to show more urgency, purpose and precision when playing that long ball. I know it is not an ideal way to play football but at the moment it's all we have. :-\
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When he got a run of games under Bruce, we looked better as a side because he was able to hold the ball up and give the midfield chance to catch-up. I hope the goals start to come, given a chance. He does remind me a fair bit of Heskey though, which with how the game has changed over the years may not be a bad thing now. He was really unlucky that he didn't score the other night though and that was a good instinct to charge into the box and throw himself at the pullback.
Samatta looks like a striker, in ways that Wesley doesn't. I actually wouldn't mind seeing a front 3 of Wesley - Davis - Samatta in the right circumtances.
I know I'm not the biggest Wesley fan, obviously a nice guy but god almighty he is terrible at a 3rd of what was paid for him.
But as he is injured no one will be buying him, so we have to make him work some how.
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they won't get ten goals between them all season.
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I like him but he's never gonna be a striker imo, so unless his play creates goals for others, and makes up the shortfall from him then you have to play him with a striker or not at all.
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I know I'm not the biggest Wesley fan, obviously a nice guy but god almighty he is terrible at a 3rd of what was paid for him.
But as he is injured no one will be buying him, so we have to make him work some how.
Washing cars, or maybe grazing on the pitch. Not exactly worth £50k a week but better than playing him!
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I don’t see anything in this lad at the moment to convince me he is a top flight footballer.
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I don’t see anything in this lad at the moment to convince me he is a top flight footballer.
Agreed
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It would be interesting to know what happened during the lockdown period, because Samatta was the first choice striker, and starting to look half decent.
Then after a few training sessions, Davis is in and starting.
Obviously we’re not privvy to what’s happening at BMH but maybe Dean saw something in Ally he wasn’t happy with. To be fair, when Samatta has come on, he’s shown signs to me that he’s not exactly busting a gut for the cause, who knows, another head turned and looking for the exit door?
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I know I'm not the biggest Wesley fan, obviously a nice guy but god almighty he is terrible at a 3rd of what was paid for him.
But as he is injured no one will be buying him, so we have to make him work some how.
Washing cars, or maybe grazing on the pitch. Not exactly worth £50k a week but better than playing him!
I’m not exactly a fan of his either but it would be interesting to look at the results with and without him in the team. Sometimes it can be that the individual does not shine but the team functions better. I cannot see any functionality at all with Keenan or Samatha.
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I think he's clearly doing it in training. He holds it up well, just doesn't get much chance to lay it off to anyone. I'd like to see him with Grealish and McGinn much closer to pick up the pieces and have a shot. Hourihane even.
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Not enough quality when looking to score. at the moment he’s one for the future (championship)
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His body language suggests a gentle giant. Wish he had a bit of the Deeney devil in him.
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Good grief. He just doesn't have it at all.
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He did brilliantly to get into position, showing what he is good at, ie holding the ball up, and holding the defender off. Then he showed while he'll never make it as a Premier League striker. Scuffed it horribly when it looked easier to score.
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Works so hard, troubles defenders and gets in good positions but fcuk me he’s got a finish like watered down varnish.
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He did brilliantly to get into position, showing what he is good at, ie holding the ball up, and holding the defender off. Then he showed while he'll never make it as a Premier League striker. Scuffed it horribly when it looked easier to score.
Their GK seemed to move to one side of the goal and he still missed
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He did brilliantly to get into position, showing what he is good at, ie holding the ball up, and holding the defender off. Then he showed while he'll never make it as a Premier League striker. Scuffed it horribly when it looked easier to score.
The keeper actually moved out of the way, horrible to watch. So much of his game is strong but deary me that effort was equally as bad as AEGs last week
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He's not a striker. He has other good non-striker attributes though. I'm beginning to think Smith hates him as much as Samatta. One thing that worries me about smith is he seems to have got a blind spot about certain players and that never turns out well in the long run.
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
I can think of some comparables but Drogba wouldn’t be one of them
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He just dosen't believe he can score in those situations. Martinez actually gave him a huge chunk of the goal to aim for with his positioning and he still could get it on target. Also if he had a right foot it would've been an easy curl into the far corner.
He needs a loan whatever division we're in next season.
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
I can think of some comparables but Drogba wouldn’t be one of them
At the same age as KD is Drogba was struggling to score in the French second division, so i'm assuming that's what Dante means. Drogba didn't start banging them in until he was 24.
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If we stay up, there's no way Davis can lead the line for us next season, or this heart attack I'm having will all have been for nothing.
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Keinan Davis is not about to become the next Didier Drogba.
He's Heskey Lite and I don't see him making it at Prem level.
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I can't see him ever scoring 10-15 goals, he just dosen't have the knack.
Even compare him to someone like Kozak who wasn't that good but had 4 in 6 for us before his bad injury as he knew how to score a sruffy six yard box goal.
The odd goal would be nice though. Hopefully he's saving that for Sunday.
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He's not remotely close to Heskey at any point in his career and certainly not a young Heskey who was outstanding
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I genuinely thought when he was put through that it would be the turning point for Davis. But he didn't even hit the target.
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
I can think of some comparables but Drogba wouldn’t be one of them
True, which is fairly unusual. Most players who haven’t made it by 22/23 won’t make the big time. Always exceptions such as Vardy but Davis looks a bit lumbering for me. Holds the ball up well but just lacks the all round game. Drogba was always fast and powerful, Davis isn’t. Hope he proves me wrong.
At the same age as KD is Drogba was struggling to score in the French second division, so i'm assuming that's what Dante means. Drogba didn't start banging them in until he was 24.
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Thought the goalkeeper was in the perfect position, left no angle at all.
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
I can think of some comparables but Drogba wouldn’t be one of them
At the same age as KD is Drogba was struggling to score in the French second division, so i'm assuming that's what Dante means. Drogba didn't start banging them in until he was 24.
Exactly PWS. That type of player often doesn’t hit their fighting weight until they’re a bit older. I’d guess it’s hard to physically bully defenders when you feel like a kid.
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I just think smith is cutting off his nose to spite his face. There is a good attacking midfielder there. Why destroy a young lads confidence like that?
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His finishing aside, he has to start Sunday for me. West Ham are full of hulks and Samatta's just going to keep handing them the ball. I see Smith's tactic is to put him on at the end of games to bully tired defenders but we ought to be proactive.
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He hit it with the wrong foot. But thats because he only has one.
Love his heart and application but he isn't good enough, I'm afraid
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I still rate him. That said, a loan might help him next season to get a run of games and hopefully improve his finishing.
It took Drogba a few years to realise he was a beast and hopefully Davis can develop into a similar player, but for that he needs confidence.
I can think of some comparables but Drogba wouldn’t be one of them
At the same age as KD is Drogba was struggling to score in the French second division, so i'm assuming that's what Dante means. Drogba didn't start banging them in until he was 24.
Good point, dat.
Also, I distinctly remember Chelsea fans being less than impressed with his early appearances.
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He just dosen't believe he can score in those situations. Martinez actually gave him a huge chunk of the goal to aim for with his positioning and he still could get it on target. Also if he had a right foot it would've been an easy curl into the far corner.
He needs a loan whatever division we're in next season.
When I was at uni I played with a lad who would get into that sort of position fairly regularly but he never scored from them, I think he did get a couple of goals from the edge of the box but it was like his brain broke when he was one-on-one and he'd either smash it at the keeper or miss like Davis did tonight. Every time we trained or went for a kick about between lectures though he'd breeze through and nail them into the bottom (or sometimes top) corner without fail. Most frustrating person I've ever played with.
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bottom line is even if you think he's the next Drogba, you don't keep him in firing line if his confidence is shot. see also samatta
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bottom line is even if you think he's the next Drogba, you don't keep him in firing line if his confidence is shot. see also samatta
Not much we can do about that for now though.
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bottom line is even if you think he's the next Drogba, you don't keep him in firing line if his confidence is shot. see also samatta
So we play with no striker then in a game we really want to win?
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But I don't think either is playing like their confidence is shot. They lack quality, not commitment. For now, anyway.
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We have plenty of midfielders that can score however bobbins they may be overall. Just because someone has an imaginairy F or S on their back doesn't mean you HAVE to play them whatever.
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I actually though Samatta was better tonight as well, I think he did a good solid job for the team and worked his tits off. I don't hav much faith in either of them to score but if they run themselves into the ground pressing defenders trying to bring other people into play then I'll take it for 1 more game. I would like the wild card of a proper goalscorer on the bench as well though so I'd have Barry there for if we desperately need a goal in the last 10-15mins.
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bottom line is even if you think he's the next Drogba, you don't keep him in firing line if his confidence is shot. see also samatta
Thought Samatta did OK tonight. KD was a bit of a liability at times tonight though, giving the ball away in bad areas. KD has had some decent enough appearances this season, but doesn't look at all convincing in front of goal.
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I actually though Samatta was better tonight as well, I think he did a good solid job for the team and worked his tits off. I don't hav much faith in either of them to score but if they run themselves into the ground pressing defenders trying to bring other people into play then I'll take it for 1 more game. I would like the wild card of a proper goalscorer on the bench as well though so I'd have Barry there for if we desperately need a goal in the last 10-15mins.
Yeah i thought he was a bit better. Like you, i don't fancy the chances of him actually scoring though...........
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We have plenty of midfielders that can score however bobbins they may be overall. Just because someone has an imaginairy F or S on their back doesn't mean you HAVE to play them whatever.
McGinn. He could do it.
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A long loan for Keinan next season at a lower level. He needs to learn how to score first, before he can learn how to score in the Premier League.
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We have plenty of midfielders that can score however bobbins they may be overall. Just because someone has an imaginairy F or S on their back doesn't mean you HAVE to play them whatever.
McGinn. He could do it.
well yeah. id trust most of the midfield with a 2 yard tap in before Samatta and Davis.
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We have plenty of midfielders that can score however bobbins they may be overall. Just because someone has an imaginairy F or S on their back doesn't mean you HAVE to play them whatever.
McGinn. He could do it.
well yeah. id trust most of the midfield with a 2 yard tap in before Samatta and Davis.
I meant start him up top. He can hold the ball at least as well as either of Samatta or Davis.
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Thought the goalkeeper was in the perfect position, left no angle at all.
Agree. It was not that easy a chance.
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We have plenty of midfielders that can score however bobbins they may be overall. Just because someone has an imaginairy F or S on their back doesn't mean you HAVE to play them whatever.
McGinn. He could do it.
well yeah. id trust most of the midfield with a 2 yard tap in before Samatta and Davis.
I meant start him up top. He can hold the ball at least as well as either of Samatta or Davis.
yep, we've had god knows how many games since the re-start and none of the recognised strikers for whatever reason have done nowt. Even tonight when both of them were a little better its still a handicap we're lumbering ourselves with. Try something ffs.
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Agree it wasn’t as easy a chance as it looked but I think the point is he should have at least made the keeper save it. The kind of chance that can wriggle under if you just get a clean contact.
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But it'd take some bollocks to be in our position and line up without a 'recognised' no.9. I think it's an easier decision to make when you're me sat on my sofa than when you're Dean Smith!
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Thought the goalkeeper was in the perfect position, left no angle at all.
Agree. It was not that easy a chance.
Disagree, watch it again. The keeper moves the wrong way giving him acres to aim at. A clean connection and that rolls into the net. Instead he scuffed it, which took it wide of the post.
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I’m sorry but that was a sitter he missed tonight. The win is great but bloody hell let’s not sugar coat that miss.
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He’ll come good.
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I’m sorry but that was a sitter he missed tonight. The win is great but bloody hell let’s not sugar coat that miss.
It was dreadful. He has 3/4 of a goal to aim at.
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But it'd take some bollocks to be in our position and line up without a 'recognised' no.9. I think it's an easier decision to make when you're me sat on my sofa than when you're Dean Smith!
well that true.....All I will say is what ive said for the last 8 games or so.. Anyone expecting Davis or Samatta to score next game? I presume Smith is hoping Davis is due his 1 goal every 16 games or so...........
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If only it was one in 16
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But it'd take some bollocks to be in our position and line up without a 'recognised' no.9. I think it's an easier decision to make when you're me sat on my sofa than when you're Dean Smith!
well that true.....All I will say is what ive said for the last 8 games or so.. Anyone expecting Davis or Samatta to score next game? I presume Smith is hoping Davis is due his 1 goal every 16 games or so...........
There is a bit of me that thinks Smith is letting himself be hampered by doubt* forcing him into trying to fudge a side around a non-scoring cf, rather than playing, dare I say it, Grealish there and then getting us to play more in the way he'd really like us to.
*don't know if doubt is the right word. Expectation or tradition might be more apt.
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But it'd take some bollocks to be in our position and line up without a 'recognised' no.9. I think it's an easier decision to make when you're me sat on my sofa than when you're Dean Smith!
well that true.....All I will say is what ive said for the last 8 games or so.. Anyone expecting Davis or Samatta to score next game? I presume Smith is hoping Davis is due his 1 goal every 16 games or so...........
There is a bit of me that thinks Smith is letting himself be hampered by doubt* forcing him into trying to fudge a side around a non-scoring cf, rather than playing, dare I say it, Grealish there and then getting us to play more in the way he'd really like us to.
*don't know if doubt is the right word. Expectation or tradition might be more apt.
mebbe, but things aren't working up front. its not like it's a rash decision. It's been 9 games since we came back. half the bloody squad probably started off as strikers as kids and probably all of them still secretly believe they're Pele's 2nd coming. I just wonder what Smith will think if we end up going down because we couldn't score a sitter because the guy up front's confidence is down the pan.
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He may or may not have potential but I hope when the transfer window shuts we've strengthened to the point where Davis is Plan D or E.
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If we loaned him to west ham I’m sure he’d score Sunday to break his duck :)
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He is like Bambi on ice - an awful miss! that could of cost us the game,
He needs to be gone in the summer, I am sure that Walsall are looking for a centre-forward
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He is like Bambi on ice - an awful miss! that could of cost us the game,
He needs to be gone in the summer, I am sure that Walsall are looking for a centre-forward
He played very well last night, yes he seems to fluff his lines when it comes to scoring, but he certainly wasn’t Bambi on ice (falling over and uncoordinated). Really had the defenders fully occupied and bullied IMO. Not sure if he’ll make the grade as scoring is quite important.
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Fair enough, he missed the chance, but it was his strength that got him in that position.... Samatta would have just bounced off that defender.
But yeah, he's not going to set the Premier League alight - Think back to how Gabby and Vassell exploded onto the scene. I'd put Davis in the Luke/Stefan Moore brothers category.
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Fair enough, he missed the chance, but it was his strength that got him in that position.... Samatta would have just bounced off that defender.
But yeah, he's not going to set the Premier League alight - Think back to how Gabby and Vassell exploded onto the scene. I'd put Davis in the Luke/Stefan Moore brothers category.
Players develop at different rates though. Drogba, for example, was a one goal in five games French second division striker until he was 23/24.
Davis clearly isn’t the finished article but he’s got a lot of decent attributes and I think there is plenty of scope to improve given he has only actually started about twenty games in his career (and the majority of them were nearly three years ago)
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Yes, bit of a sitter I’m afraid.
I guess he was caught in two minds, do I bang it, or roll it in? In the end he scuffed it.
That’s inexperience and confidence.
I still think he could be a good player for us, though. Never going to be prolific, but a steady 10/15 a season with a main scorer alongside him.
Next season get him out on loan at a decent championship/ league one team to help him find the back of the net.
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you might be right but you don't need to be mystic meg to know he's not a striker.
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We have to remember he's never had a full season because of injuries. If he could gain his confidence in front of goal he'd be massive handful and a great asset to us.
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He has every attribute to be a top striker but for the main one. That chance he had should have been hit with the outside of his left foot. If he does that he scores. As a striker he would know that surely?
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He has every attribute to be a top striker but for the main one. That chance he had should have been hit with the outside of his left foot. If he does that he scores. As a striker he would know that surely?
Not sure I would use that technique, there was a lot he could have done but was never set to take the chance, he just ran onto it and tried to belt it.
That is about confidence.
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He'll never be prolific but I think he's worth hanging on to as a squad player. He'll come on and play his part just like he did last night.
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He'll never be prolific but I think he's worth hanging on to as a squad player. He'll come on and play his part just like he did last night.
yep, I like him and he might at some point work out where the back of the net is.
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Sadly...he'll never be a Premier League level striker as long as he's got a hole in his arse!
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He has every attribute to be a top striker but for the main one. That chance he had should have been hit with the outside of his left foot. If he does that he scores. As a striker he would know that surely?
Not sure I would use that technique, there was a lot he could have done but was never set to take the chance, he just ran onto it and tried to belt it.
That is about confidence.
That was the easiest way of scoring assuming he has the technique. If he sees himself as a striker you'd expect him to have that ability. What he tried was more difficult and gave him less chance of scoring which obviously he didn't. I get that he may lack some confidence but even so he has to do much better in such situations. At least make sure the keeper has a shot to save.
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He could have summoned the spirit of Henry and opened his body and stroked it with the inside of his right foot.
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The comparison that sprung to mind after that miss last night was the goal Son scored against us at Villa Park after Engels had slipped up. Son always looked totally in control when he went through and it was almost inevitable that he would score. In contrast, Davis just never really looked in control and didn't look at all convincing.
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Thought Samatta did a good job closing & pressing their defenders to stop them stepping out with the ball but never looked likely to get into a goal scoring position - Keinan on other hand was def more involved with the ball but when they had it he didn’t seem willing or able to pressure them.
Would stick with same line up Sunday personally
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I think he's just got to get a feel for his stride and his positioning - he's only young and I think if he was more in control of his body he'd score more. I think he'll come good but if we survive there's no place for him as we need yet another striker.
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...Would stick with same line up Sunday personally
Me too
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He has every attribute to be a top striker but for the main one. That chance he had should have been hit with the outside of his left foot. If he does that he scores. As a striker he would know that surely?
If he had a right foot that he could shoot with then an Henry style curl into the far corner would've been pretty simple as no way Martinez would've got to it with the gap he left.
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Has every attribute to be one of those useful strikers that does everything but score
I'm sick of those - give me a goal hanging bastard scoring tap ins every day of the week
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As previously, I think he has potential but he should do his growing whilst on loan.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
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Tries hard and has most attributes bar the ability to actually put the ball in the back of the opposition's net. Please prove me wrong on Sunday.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
He scored a similar chance v Everton start of the season so probably would've.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
Agreed. As well as Heaton in goal and a fully fit, uninjured McGinn.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
Agreed. As well as Heaton in goal and a fully fit, uninjured McGinn.
Yep, agreed, that's where we've been unlucky this season, 3 horrible injuries to key players.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
Agreed. As well as Heaton in goal and a fully fit, uninjured McGinn.
Yep, agreed, that's where we've been unlucky this season, 3 horrible injuries to key players.
The fixture list was a bit cruel too. Lots of winnable games at the start of the season when we were still adapting to the higher level and a mostly new squad getting used to eachother.
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I honestly think Wesley would of netted that.
I also honestly think if Wesley had played the full season he would of got enough goals for us not to be here on the final game
Agreed. As well as Heaton in goal and a fully fit, uninjured McGinn.
Yep, agreed, that's where we've been unlucky this season, 3 horrible injuries to key players.
That and it taking Luiz a while to get used to playing first team football with us.
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If we sell Keinan in the summer, maybe we could retire his shirt number?
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We should retire his shirt number, in honour of Birmingham City's average attendance.
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Let's wait for him to get four league goals first.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
I think Wesley was actually quite good at holding the ball up, so in that he's not massively different from Davis. Where they do differ is that whilst not being exactly prolific, Wesley was averaging a goal every four games, give or take, compared to Davis's one every 375,634 or whatever it is.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
I think Wesley was actually quite good at holding the ball up, so in that he's not massively different from Davis. Where they do differ is that whilst not being exactly prolific, Wesley was averaging a goal every four games, give or take, compared to Davis's one every 375,634 or whatever it is.
Once in a Lifetime.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
I think Wesley was actually quite good at holding the ball up, so in that he's not massively different from Davis. Where they do differ is that whilst not being exactly prolific, Wesley was averaging a goal every four games, give or take, compared to Davis's one every 375,634 or whatever it is.
Once in a Lifetime.
He always looks like he's on the Road to Nowhere.
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If we take the p*ss enough will he score a hat trick on Sunday?
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If we take the p*ss enough will he score a hat trick on Sunday?
It seems to work quite well with Trezeguet.
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Wesley also put himself about a lot (which Samatta did really well on Tuesday) Davis seems less eager to chase blind causes. I also think Wesley is a good finisher and his lack of goals was because he wasn't getting in the box enough rather than because he was missing chances. Going by the stats on whoscored he averaged just over 1.5 shots per game and hit the target with a little over half (with the others missing or blocked). The top scoring strikers in the league have a similar percent on target but are more like 2.5-3 shots per game. That's what we need to work on with Wesley, get him into better positions and backing himself more often.
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Ultimately Wesley is our best striker. Davis just doesn't score which is sort of the point.
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Davis seems less eager to chase blind causes.
That really boiled my piss on Tuesday.
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He looked like he’d seen a ghost after his miss.
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Davis seems less eager to chase blind causes.
That really boiled my piss on Tuesday.
Samatta does the headless chicken stuff, tires out their defenders and Davis come on afterwards to beat em up....Sadly neither seem to have been told to score goals.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
I think Wesley was actually quite good at holding the ball up, so in that he's not massively different from Davis. Where they do differ is that whilst not being exactly prolific, Wesley was averaging a goal every four games, give or take, compared to Davis's one every 375,634 or whatever it is.
Once in a Lifetime.
He always looks like he's on the Road to Nowhere.
He’s looked good in training though, in the sprints he’s been burning down the Hause.
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Losing SJM and Heaton meant losing 2 of our 3 best players at the time.
Also agree about Wesley. He’s clearly not prolific but I think he would have had enough good games in him to get us more points. And he’s such a strangely specific type of striker a lot of our our coaching presumably went out the window when he got injured since he was playing every game.
I think Wesley was actually quite good at holding the ball up, so in that he's not massively different from Davis. Where they do differ is that whilst not being exactly prolific, Wesley was averaging a goal every four games, give or take, compared to Davis's one every 375,634 or whatever it is.
Once in a Lifetime.
He always looks like he's on the Road to Nowhere.
He’s looked good in training though, in the sprints he’s been burning down the Hause.
Take him to the river; wash him in the water.
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Big Wes seems to be getting better the more games he misses! I thought in the majority of games he played for us his hold up play, movement and general ability were average/poor. He was going well in that game v Burnley when he got injured unfortunately but you can't ignore a lot of what went before. There were a number of games in which we were effectively playing with 10 men given how poor he was. Unfortunately Samatta seems to be continuing in the same vein of late.
Davis adds a lot to our midfield play, he makes the ball stick up front and holds his own physically with any defender. His scoring record can't be ignored unfortunately but maybe it will just take a goal or two for it all to click. He gets into scoring positions anyway but maybe that calmness to finish just can't be taught into someone. Someone like Robbie Keane for Ireland could be our worst player for most of a game but the ball might break around the box and you just knew he would be there. Fowler, Lineker, Yorke, Tammy last season any of them just would not panic. Our options this season are all snatching at chances.
I like Davis, and hope on Sunday he can make amends with a goal or assist.
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Same here his hold up play was awful, the ball seemed to bounce away from him, and for a big guy he didn't win high balls. I remember a lot of criticism on this site, so to say he would have made a big difference is really stretching it.
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Big Wes was less shit than Samatta (post-lockdown) and Davis all season.
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Big Wes seems to be getting better the more games he misses! I thought in the majority of games he played for us his hold up play, movement and general ability were average/poor. He was going well in that game v Burnley when he got injured unfortunately but you can't ignore a lot of what went before. There were a number of games in which we were effectively playing with 10 men given how poor he was. Unfortunately Samatta seems to be continuing in the same vein of late.
Davis adds a lot to our midfield play, he makes the ball stick up front and holds his own physically with any defender. His scoring record can't be ignored unfortunately but maybe it will just take a goal or two for it all to click. He gets into scoring positions anyway but maybe that calmness to finish just can't be taught into someone. Someone like Robbie Keane for Ireland could be our worst player for most of a game but the ball might break around the box and you just knew he would be there. Fowler, Lineker, Yorke, Tammy last season any of them just would not panic. Our options this season are all snatching at chances.
I like Davis, and hope on Sunday he can make amends with a goal or assist.
Same here his hold up play was awful, the ball seemed to bounce away from him, and for a big guy he didn't win high balls. I remember a lot of criticism on this site, so to say he would have made a big difference is really stretching it.
Not sure anyone's trying to make out Wes is a worldbeater in terms of overall play but a goal from our striker every 4 games as he was averaging, rather 1 goal in 13 games (Samatta) or 0 goals (Davis) would have made quite a big diiference.
Completely agree re: Davis. Hopefully one will go in soon and boost his confidence.
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Same here his hold up play was awful, the ball seemed to bounce away from him, and for a big guy he didn't win high balls. I remember a lot of criticism on this site, so to say he would have made a big difference is really stretching it.
He was getting there before the injury, he’d really improved his all round game outside the box. It’s attacking the ball in the box which is his weakness I think, for a guy of his size, he prefers low crosses and balls slid through.
I think he will be a big player for us, it will have taken time what with the injury as well but I think he’s got lots of potential and when given a decent opportunity his finishing is good.
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Same here his hold up play was awful, the ball seemed to bounce away from him, and for a big guy he didn't win high balls. I remember a lot of criticism on this site, so to say he would have made a big difference is really stretching it.
This is how I remember it, he was just awful except for his last game. He may come good eventually and yes it would have been better to have him as an option, but he was frustratingly crap and he couldn't even use his size to his advantage. A terrible signing for the position we were in.
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Wes may not be the greatest centre forward we’ll ever see but Davis would not have scored any of the goals he scored before injury. And Wes would most likely have scored at least 3 of the chances Davis has spurned. I also think Grealish’s game was better with Wes in the team.
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Wes was excellemt in the Burnley game he got injured. Overall Play, the goal and he won a penalty I think
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I don't think anyone is re-writing history and claiming Wes was brilliant, just that he was a lot better than anybody we've fielded since he's been out.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
True, although that doesn't carry as much cachet as it once did.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
True, although that doesn't carry as much cachet as it once did.
Still, there’s obviously something there.
I also don’t think he was as bad as some made out at the time, but also say he’s probably not been as good as I wanted him to be, but he deserved a good season to settle in. It wasn’t his fault we went into this season so light upfront. That was the biggest mistake me made.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
so is David Luiz
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I don't think anyone is re-writing history and claiming Wes was brilliant, just that he was a lot better than anybody we've fielded since he's been out.
It's not difficult to be much better than Samatta and Davis :D
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
so is David Luiz
Who’s also played in sides who have faired quite a bit better than us over the last decade.
But yes, he’s still a useless twat, I’ll give you that!
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Should have recalled Hogan :)
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
True, although that doesn't carry as much cachet as it once did.
Still, there’s obviously something there.
I also don’t think he was as bad as some made out at the time, but also say he’s probably not been as good as I wanted him to be, but he deserved a good season to settle in. It wasn’t his fault we went into this season so light upfront. That was the biggest mistake me made.
He can’t head a football, call me old fashioned but I like big centre forwards to be able to head a football.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
True, although that doesn't carry as much cachet as it once did.
Still, there’s obviously something there.
I also don’t think he was as bad as some made out at the time, but also say he’s probably not been as good as I wanted him to be, but he deserved a good season to settle in. It wasn’t his fault we went into this season so light upfront. That was the biggest mistake me made.
He can’t head a football, call me old fashioned but I like big centre forwards to be able to head a football.
Neither could Wesley. And like Wesley can't score.
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Wesley is a year older than Keinan and has scored over 50 goals, Keinan has scored 4. Trying to say they both don't score is a bit saft.
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Wesley is a year older than Keinan and has scored over 50 goals, Keinan has scored 4. Trying to say they both don't score is a bit saft.
Fair point, but I should have said don't score even close to what they should and from what I've seen isn't likely too. Yes, it can take time to adjust from one league to another.
Wesley can hold the ball up and that seems to be it.
At least Keinan makes more runs into the box, and his chance against Arsenal, wasn't as easy as might have looked.
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I should have said a bit harsh rather than saft, sorry.
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I should have said a bit harsh rather than saft, sorry.
No worries, wasn't sure what saft was, but guessed it might have been 'daft' as the s & d are next to each on the keyboard :D
But I'll try not to be saft in future ;)
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I think people need to realise 20 million is not actually that much money anymore. One in four is not a bad return. Thinking about didn’t we sell Downing for 20 mil about 10 years ago?
Also a big favourite with us was Juan Pablo Angel who’s record was very hit and miss.
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I should have said a bit harsh rather than saft, sorry.
No worries, wasn't sure what saft was, but guessed it might have been 'daft' as the s & d are next to each on the keyboard :D
But I'll try not to be saft in future ;)
It's yam yam for daft. I don't think they had keyboards when they started using it, in fact i'm pretty sure keyboards still haven't made it there yet.
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My argument is not that he will never become a good player as we've seen with Luiz it takes some players longer to settle into the premiership, but at time of his injury he had not been up to it. You could make the same argument for Samatta, he puts himself about and you can see he is trying but i think the pace of the game is troubling him.
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It will be interesting to see what happens when he finally does score, whether he kicks on or not, next season. I wouldn’t bet against him scoring at West Ham, assuming he’s features.
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He was good enough to be picked for Brazil.
True, although that doesn't carry as much cachet as it once did.
Still, there’s obviously something there.
I also don’t think he was as bad as some made out at the time, but also say he’s probably not been as good as I wanted him to be, but he deserved a good season to settle in. It wasn’t his fault we went into this season so light upfront. That was the biggest mistake me made.
He can’t head a football, call me old fashioned but I like big centre forwards to be able to head a football.
Neither could Wesley. And like Wesley can't score.
I mean Wes, Davis is ok in the air.
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It will be interesting to see what happens when he finally does score, whether he kicks on or not, next season. I wouldn’t bet against him scoring at West Ham, assuming he’s features.
The world shut down by a global pandemic and then Davis scoring. Plagues of locusts and raining frogs next I reckon.
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If we're to progress in this league then neither Wesyley, Samatta or Davis are nowhere near good enough.
Striker overhaul needed this summer. Regardless of league.
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If we're to progress in this league then neither Wesyley, Samatta or Davis are nowhere near good enough.
Striker overhaul needed this summer. Regardless of league.
Wesley has a role to play going forward, but he needs decent support-strikers to work with him. And, the manager needs variety in his forward line to change things up when required. We don't have that currently.
My gut-feel is that neither Davis nor Samatta are quite good enough, and I'd be looking to bring in two new strikers as soon as possible.
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I can't help but feel Keinan is payback for all those that used to criticise Bent for doing nothing but scoring.
He's the polar opposite, good lad, works hard, does a job but he's a striker who doesn't score goals at the end of the day.
Maybe he can be converted into something else in the squad.
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Not sure if its just him coming on against tired legs or what have you, but I have tended to think we look more likely to score with him playing. Samatta has looked lost if the ball is anywhere near his feet. and I'm not sure comparing players at different ages is really that helpful, (Vardy was playing in the conference at 22, Rooney was a seasoned international). Besides that Davis has missed so much time through injury (or simply not being picked) he still feels like a young prospect.
Even if there is a diet Heskey lurking deep within him, I don't think we can realistically offer him enough minutes in the first team to ever really develop him.
Id love to see him loaned out and played 90 minutes every game, for his own sake and just to see if there is anything more to come from him.
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I’ll stick my neck and say that I think Keinan will come good and may one day even make the England squad. I bet there are a few PL defenders around who don’t fancy playing against him already. Sure he’s not scoring but its not been for the want of trying, he just needs a bit of luck to get the monkey off his back. If you remember in the U21s RHM was the big hope and KD was always the raw talent but getting goals regularly (hopefully our regular U21 watchers can back me up on this)
We know he’s a confidence player and if we get better players around him I honestly think he can become a lynchpin to our team.
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If KD is making the England squad we're fucked. He's not a kid anymore and when you compare him now to some of the really good, talented English strikers out there he'd a million miles away.
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I like him, he brings strength and guile to the forward line. He is not prolific but that does not mean he is finished as a footballer at this level.
He may develop his goal scoring technique. I would not be writing him off just yet.
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I like him, he brings strength and guile to the forward line. He is not prolific but that does not mean he is finished as a footballer at this level.
He may develop his goal scoring technique. I would not be writing him off just yet.
Not prolific is a bit of an understatement. He's scored, like, two league goals, ever. In the championship.
His last league goal was in September 2017. 40 league appearances since then, zero goals.
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Comparing KD with Kane, who was EPL top scorer for 3 (?) seasons is off-your-tits madness!
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comparing Kane with Davis is truly absurd. One scores goals in his sleep and the other can only dream of scoring.
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Yes Harry Kane is at peak whereas Davis is
4 /5 years younger
Comparable to peers in premier league this season and what's noticeable is the lack of consistency.
And that if Davis played in any of those teams he could hold his own as a replacement - maybe not in goals tally -but in link up and what he brings to the team.
Abraham Chelsea
Patrick Cutrone Wolves
Gabriel Jesus Man City
Richarlison Everton
Solanke Bournemouth
And Wesley
Davis- don't forget does not have the south American natural ability or brought through the top club academy systems in Italy or England
He's quite a laid back character and hasn't had to have the major competitive streak to get into and survive at a proffssional club at a young age more he was chosen and picked up from non league. What he has shown is determination and Villa seem to have a lot of faith in him. Several coaching staff now have liked him.
He's been unfortunate with injuries.
Give him the next 4 years to reach 26 and see then if he is actually cut out for a high end career. Maybe he won't break goal records but he has a chance to bring something different to the England team.
I do think he still shows some of his non league ability but given game time and development he could well outshine English players who have had more money invested in their football education since a young age like Abraham and Solanke.
Out of all those around 22 years old Jesus and Richarlison are exceptional and Barca wanted and may still want Richarlison.
Those 2 can perhaps become world class but Davis can be a solid striker in premier league for a good few years.
Think that's fair assessment
I don't think it's a fair assessment at all. To be a solid striker you have to score the occasional goal. Keinan has a goal tally that the average reserve goalie would be ashamed of.
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Peter Schmiechel has scored more Premier League goals for us.
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Yes Harry Kane is at peak whereas Davis is 4 /5 years younge.
Comparable to peers in premier league this season ...
Think that's fair assessment
Sorry footy: I think you're trying very hard to big him up ... and agree that KD shows flashes of potential.
But that's all it is at the moment: potential.
He has no success record whatsoever and - frankly - needs a season in the championship with a team that will give him 30 starts.
That will finally nail whether the boy has 'got it'.
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Yes Harry Kane is at peak whereas Davis is
4 /5 years younger
You do realize that 5 years ago Kane won the EPL Golden Boot, scoring 26 times in the process, right ? They are not even close.
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He needs to be loaned out.
Our striker recruitment will have gone wrong yet again if he still has a decent chance of starting games from middle of September.
Yes we could keep him and give him 15 minute cameos but I couldn't see his career kicking on enough in that scenario.
Find him a mid table club in championship where there's less pressure and hope he stays fit for 15-20 games and then we'll see what he's all about. If he can score all the better and so we bring him back in the January as a much more confident player.
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Just checked, because it feels like Keinan played a fair amount this season. But he was on the pitch for precisely 534 minutes in total this season in the premier league. That's not even 6 full matches.
Samatta played more than double that, and Wesley more than three times that amount.
I'm not defending Keinan, or saying he'll ever be a prolific scorer, but I think we have to put his "non-scoring" premier league season into the context of it being less than 6 games in total. At that level of playing time, one or two goals makes a big difference to how you're perceived. He's missed good chances, definitely, but we've also seen a lot of good stuff from him, and I'm not willing to write off a striker who's effectively played six games in the premier league.
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Just checked, because it feels like Keinan played a fair amount this season. But he was on the pitch for precisely 534 minutes in total this season in the premier league. That's not even 6 full matches.
Samatta played more than double that, and Wesley more than three times that amount.
I'm not defending Keinan, or saying he'll ever be a prolific scorer, but I think we have to put his "non-scoring" premier league season into the context of it being less than 6 games in total. At that level of playing time, one or two goals makes a big difference to how you're perceived. He's missed good chances, definitely, but we've also seen a lot of good stuff from him, and I'm not willing to write off a striker who's effectively played six games in the premier league.
Yep, agreed.
He just needs one to go in. I'd also like to see him play in a 2 up front.
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Just checked, because it feels like Keinan played a fair amount this season. But he was on the pitch for precisely 534 minutes in total this season in the premier league. That's not even 6 full matches.
Samatta played more than double that, and Wesley more than three times that amount.
I'm not defending Keinan, or saying he'll ever be a prolific scorer, but I think we have to put his "non-scoring" premier league season into the context of it being less than 6 games in total. At that level of playing time, one or two goals makes a big difference to how you're perceived. He's missed good chances, definitely, but we've also seen a lot of good stuff from him, and I'm not willing to write off a striker who's effectively played six games in the premier league.
Good post Smithy
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maybe they're all toss?
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Iv'e been one of his biggest defenders on here and still am
but even I'm struggling with the Harry Kane comparison
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
like Emile Heskey was
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
That is about as accurate a description as I could ever wish to read of a player.
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
like Emile Heskey was
No. You might want to look up Heskey on YouTube at the same age.
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I'm sure he's a nice bloke but as a footballer he's 100% no fart and no shit.
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
He needs a season in the championship with a team that will give him at least 30 starts, because that will finally nail whether the boy has 'got it'. He has no success record whatsoever, either in the 2nd tier or last season in his 530 minutes (he had plenty of chances to score!).
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
That is about as accurate a description as I could ever wish to read of a player.
Ha ha, a perfect summary.
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Keinan Davis has all the attributes to become a high quality centre forward until he arrives in the penalty area when he becomes like a eunuch entering a whorehouse.
like Emile Heskey was
No. You might want to look up Heskey on YouTube at the same age.
Hope there's not x-rated vids of Heskey womanising on such a public platform.
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Keinan is a v. promising player with good touch, movement and physical power.
His ability to retain and recycle the ball will lead to goals for others, including the one that just kept us up!!
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Can’t ever see him scoring but we were often better when he played. Upgrade and loan him out? He always looked ok to be fair to him
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I sense a re-run of the old Bent/Benteke debate, where a player who 'only' scores goals actually 'takes away' from the team's total.
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I sense a re-run of the old Bent/Benteke debate, where a player who 'only' scores goals actually 'takes away' from the team's total.
The massive difference being Bent actually scored goals.
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Yes, but he hardly ever made them!! Thus, it was argued on here, his goals are 'taken' from the team.
The Beast of course, was rather useful at doing both.
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As the song goes "if Keinan plays for England so can I"
He is not a premier league forward, therefore why are we a premier league club having him in our 1st team squad?
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Could he be useful as an attacking midfield player behind a central striker?
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Could he be useful as an attacking midfield player behind a central striker?
You’d still want them to chip in with the odd goal though?
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absolutely, I don't think he'll ever make it as a CF but I can see he does have attributes, not least the ability to bring people into play.
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Not too sure about him being an attacking midfielder to be honest.
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Not too sure about him being an attacking midfielder to be honest.
There are two statements that almost guarantee a player isn't going to make it at Villa, and they are:
"There's a player in there somewhere." and
"I wonder if we should try him as a defensive midfielder [if a defender] /on the wing [if a full back] /an attacking midfielder [if a non-scoring striker]."
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I think he's a handful, he creates opportunities for others and causes defences a lot of concern.
However, he really needs to score some goals. I'd like him to stay, but to be a substitute that gives us something different and perhaps to take the pressure off. I wonder whether one going in will lead to more, or not.
We desperately need someone who is an out and out striker though.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Hang on, you've agreed with me? Am I in a parallel universe? ;)
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He should get one more season to prove himself. In my opinion.
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He should get one more season to prove himself. In my opinion.
Is he really going to develop a striker's instinct for goal in the next 5 weeks? I don't think so as much as I wish it would happen for him. I'd still keep him though on the basis that he might be a late developer or something.
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If we can get a couple of strikers in then I'd say he needs to go on loan to a half-decent Championship side where he is going to get chances to score. He has definitely got something about him, he's holds the ball up well and I think he has good vision, and we certainly looked better with him in the team over the last few games, but as a centre forward he has got to be scoring goals.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Pretty much how I see it. If he’s content to be a squad player, coming off the bench to do a job then he’s worth holding on to, if he wants regular football then he might need to move on.
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He's 22 now, and while that it is still young, it's getting to the age where you wouldn't really expect most players to start massively changing their game. I just don't think he's got any sort of goal scoring instinct unfortunately, as good as his all round game is. I agree that a half or full season loan at a decent Championship team would do him the world of good. Somebody like Norwich possibly, who have a good manager, and a natural finisher like Pukki who he could watch and learn from.
The trouble is at Villa that we haven't really got a forward player worthy of the description at the moment, so it's hard for the youngsters to learn from anybody else. "Come here Keinan, watch how Samatta does it." *Header goes hopelessly high and wide* "Ummm, that's how not to do it."
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i atually thought we'd found someone who could head the ball in Samatta especially after the CF. obviously I was wrong.
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I got the feeling he just needed one to go in off his arse followed by another spooning in off his shin and he'd go on a bit of a run. I am an optimist when it comes to Villa players though.
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Could he be useful as an attacking midfield player behind a central striker?
Or as a central defender ? He wouldn't be the first big unit to switch from forward to defence.You wouldn't have to worry about own goals either.
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Could he be useful as an attacking midfield player behind a central striker?
Or as a central defender ? He wouldn't be the first big unit to switch from forward to defence.You wouldn't have to worry about own goals either.
He did a good job of forcing Nyland over his own line...
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a four year old could do that.
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It, quite clearly, never crossed the line.
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He'd be a good striker, in league one. :)
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He'd be a good striker, in league one. :)
Why, are the goals bigger?
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He’s just simply not good enough to be a squad player on this league. Sell.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Gives opposition defenders something to think about, yes, "this isn't difficult" and effectively gives opposition goalkeepers the day off.
I am sure there is a player in there, too, but from what I've seen, it's not at Championship level, and it's certainly not at Premier League level.
Acceptance of this level of dross needs to change if we are going to get even remotely near achieving our potential.
How many other top flight sides would he get a game in?
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How many other top flight sides would he get a game in?
None.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Gives opposition defenders something to think about, yes, "this isn't difficult" and effectively gives opposition goalkeepers the day off.
I am sure there is a player in there, too, but from what I've seen, it's not at Championship level, and it's certainly not at Premier League level.
Acceptance of this level of dross needs to change if we are going to get even remotely near achieving our potential.
How many other top flight sides would he get a game in?
If he played for a mid tier Belgian side we'd be all over him with a four year, £60K a week contract.
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He's a good player. He may not be a centre forward, but anyone that can pass, hold the ball and cause problems for opponents at this level is worth sticking with, especially as he's cost us peanuts so far and he's still young.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Gives opposition defenders something to think about, yes, "this isn't difficult" and effectively gives opposition goalkeepers the day off.
I am sure there is a player in there, too, but from what I've seen, it's not at Championship level, and it's certainly not at Premier League level.
Acceptance of this level of dross needs to change if we are going to get even remotely near achieving our potential.
How many other top flight sides would he get a game in?
If he played for a mid tier Belgian side we'd be all over him with a four year, £60K a week contract.
The two Belgian league forward players we have bought both scored goals at their former clubs. Davis has no idea what that is.
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He needs a loan. Will do him good and it would push him on much more than sticking around here and getting 10-15 minutes at end of games.
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I think it's increasingly hard to make a case for a forward who hasn't scored for 2 years. If we don't want a relegation battle again then you need forwards with a threat. He wouldn't get in any other Premier League teams side.
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He's a good player. He may not be a centre forward, but anyone that can pass, hold the ball and cause problems for opponents at this level is worth sticking with, especially as he's cost us peanuts so far and he's still young.
He's being played as a centre forward though. He needs to go out on loan because if we go into the new season with him still as our main back up it's going to be another long, hard season.
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As a player off the Bench to hold the ball up when we are protecting a lead is a very useful asset to have.
It’s a bit to simple to just judge him by his goals.
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He's a good player. He may not be a centre forward, but anyone that can pass, hold the ball and cause problems for opponents at this level is worth sticking with, especially as he's cost us peanuts so far and he's still young.
He's being played as a centre forward though. He needs to go out on loan because if we go into the new season with him still as our main back up it's going to be another long, hard season.
I honestly think he's ended up as a centre forward because of his freakish ability to hold on to the ball under pressure, and he's been the only player at the club that can do it since he made his debut, except for the six months we had Grabban.
We've seen a few players this season that look like they really struggle to keep up with the increased speed of the top flight, but Davis has not. I agree that a loan might be worthwhile, but I'd be loathe to offload him just yet.
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He has a lot of good attributes, but 34 months since his last league goal is one hell of a goal drought.
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A good striker would have bagged the two great chances he had against Sheffield United and we'd have all not aged quote so badly watching the West Ham game.
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simply nowhere near good enough - once Wesley returns and we purchase more fire power will end up in league one.
Thanks for the Effort Keinan - just not good enough
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He has a lot of good attributes, but 34 months since his last league goal is one hell of a goal drought.
It is, but he played the equivalent of less than 6 league matches all season (he didn't start a single game before the lockdown). I'm not willing to write off a 22 year old forward with less than 6 premier league matches under his belt. Not yet, anyway.
A strikers job is to put the ball in the net at the end of the day, and he isn't doing that. But he excels at lots of other elements of that position, and I'd like to see if in time he can become a 10 goal a season player - which for someone whose main attribute is holding the ball and bringing in others in the final third would be more than respectable.
I've no idea if he can become that player, but I'm certainly not writing him off yet. I can't help but wonder how the restart might have gone for him if Henderson hadn't made that great save from him at his near post against Sheff Utd...
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Get him out on a season-long loan to a good tier-two side where he will get 30+ games and let's see.
The recent mini-league* demonstrated that him coming off the bench did not add much to us at all.
* I cannot bring myself to refer to the Re-start - how can it be a re-start when so many factors had changed?
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He has a lot of good attributes, but 34 months since his last league goal is one hell of a goal drought.
It is, but he played the equivalent of less than 6 league matches all season (he didn't start a single game before the lockdown). I'm not willing to write off a 22 year old forward with less than 6 premier league matches under his belt. Not yet, anyway.
A strikers job is to put the ball in the net at the end of the day, and he isn't doing that. But he excels at lots of other elements of that position, and I'd like to see if in time he can become a 10 goal a season player - which for someone whose main attribute is holding the ball and bringing in others in the final third would be more than respectable.
I've no idea if he can become that player, but I'm certainly not writing him off yet. I can't help but wonder how the restart might have gone for him if Henderson hadn't made that great save from him at his near post against Sheff Utd...
Deano ?
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He has a lot of good attributes, but 34 months since his last league goal is one hell of a goal drought.
It is, but he played the equivalent of less than 6 league matches all season (he didn't start a single game before the lockdown). I'm not willing to write off a 22 year old forward with less than 6 premier league matches under his belt. Not yet, anyway.
A strikers job is to put the ball in the net at the end of the day, and he isn't doing that. But he excels at lots of other elements of that position, and I'd like to see if in time he can become a 10 goal a season player - which for someone whose main attribute is holding the ball and bringing in others in the final third would be more than respectable.
I've no idea if he can become that player, but I'm certainly not writing him off yet. I can't help but wonder how the restart might have gone for him if Henderson hadn't made that great save from him at his near post against Sheff Utd...
Deano ?
Yes? I mean...er no. That's not me.
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No lack of effort but for impact file under Carruthers & Delfounesso. Next.
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No lack of effort but for impact file under Carruthers & Delfounesso. Next.
This.
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No lack of effort but for impact file under Carruthers & Delfounesso.
That's all that needs to be said really even though he's better than both.
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I rate him a lot.
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It seems obvious to send the boy out on loan, to the champ or possibly one of the newly promoted teams, hopefully bagging a few goals then integrate him back at Villa and he finds some kind of momentum. However Villa triggered an extra one year extension on his contract, his deal expires next season, if he played and scored elsewhere you'd imagine he would want to stay there, and why would you give someone an extra year just to loan them out?
Smith and co seem to rate him despite his dismal returns if they plan to keep him beyond summer 2021 the deal should be heavily incentivized with goal scoring bonus's and low basic.
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No lack of effort but for impact file under Carruthers & Delfounesso. Next.
This.
No way.
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As a player off the Bench to hold the ball up when we are protecting a lead is a very useful asset to have.
It’s a bit to simple to just judge him by his goals.
Can't we have a big lump who runs around and holds the ball up but isn't also terrified of scoring the occasional goal?
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As a player off the Bench to hold the ball up when we are protecting a lead is a very useful asset to have.
It’s a bit to simple to just judge him by his goals.
Can't we have a big lump who runs around and holds the ball up but isn't also terrified of scoring the occasional goal?
Or at least having the occasional shot?
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He has a lot of good attributes, but 34 months since his last league goal is one hell of a goal drought.
He's been injured for about 20 months of that in fairness.
It's frustrating as when you look at that Arsenal chance he made exactly the right sort of run and timed it right (so the pass from Jack looked simple when it wasn't), held off Rob Holding with ease and got it out of his feet and shot at the right moment when Martinez was committed.
The problem was overthinking the shot and putting too much spin on the finish when a simple right foot curler (if he had a right foot) or even a toe poke would've probably done the trick.
The basics are there but he needs to go down to the championship to learn how to finish.
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I like him, he is good off the bench and gives opposition defenders something to think about. Goal scoring is a problem but he is still young and learning.
I would love to see him score and develop a bit of confidence.
Gives opposition defenders something to think about, yes, "this isn't difficult" and effectively gives opposition goalkeepers the day off.
I am sure there is a player in there, too, but from what I've seen, it's not at Championship level, and it's certainly not at Premier League level.
Acceptance of this level of dross needs to change if we are going to get even remotely near achieving our potential.
How many other top flight sides would he get a game in?
If he played for a mid tier Belgian side we'd be all over him with a four year, £60K a week contract.
Ha ha, yes, if he's currently playing for FC Stroopwafel in the Belgian league, I rate him.
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some Brentford ITK's think he's going to them as part of the Watkins deal.
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some Brentford ITK's think he's going to them as part of the Watkins deal.
He's into the last year of his contract here. I can't see the point of loaning him out if that state of affairs isn't changed pronto, he'd simply end up coming back to us in May already out of contract and under no obligation. Might then be best all round if he was to make a permanent move now to somewhere where they think they can get something from him.
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some Brentford ITK's think he's going to them as part of the Watkins deal.
Not a bad shout, particularly if we get first dibs on buying him back (do a Citeh - Douglas type deal?).
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I know he has had a bad injury and he has some strong attributes like as others say holding the ball up, but he isn't going to be a 10 goal a season man never mind a 20 in the premier league. I think best to move him on and if he is used in a swap deal to get a better player in then even better.
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The least likely player to score a goal since Fernando Nelson.
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No lack of effort but for impact file under Carruthers & Delfounesso. Next.
This.
No way.
Way, dude.
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Ten out of ten for effort, but he ain’t ever a PL striker in a zillion years. Get him a move and wish him well.
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Ten out of ten for effort, but he ain’t ever a PL striker in a zillion years. Get him a move and wish him well.
Amen
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some Brentford ITK's think he's going to them as part of the Watkins deal.
Not a bad shout, particularly if we get first dibs on buying him back (do a Citeh - Douglas type deal?).
Sounds like a very good deal, especially if a loan. We should, at the minimum, include a buy back option or sell on clause as there’s definitely a player in there.
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I think there's a good Premier League striker in there, but he needs to be paying regularly and develop his finishing somewhat. I'd favour offering him a 1 year extension and a loan out to a good championship side. If he develops an instinct he'll be an incredible asset. If he's not at least getting double figures of goals at that level, sell him on.
His other attributes mean he can get away without being prolific, but he still needs to be chipping in as many goals as you'd expect from a midfielder - and creating as many - otherwise we may as well not bother with having a centre forward at all.
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I'd loan him out until January.
Either he comes back full of confidence and so we give him a new deal or we sell him on for a couple of million with perhaps a buy back clause.
Just keeping him around here getting the odd 15 minute run out isn't going to advance him much.
Keep Samatta as back up and get in two new strikers with one being able to play wide.
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I'd rather keep Davis as back up than Samatta to be honest.
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I still agree with Smithy.
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I'd rather keep Davis as back up than Samatta to be honest.
Same here.
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Same probably. He’s useful as a late game addition where we’re hanging on. If we’d been able to throw him on instead of the hare in that spurs game we’d have won.
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I'd like to see him stick around. I know he didn't score (and he should have) but he played his part helping us stay up and there's still time on his side to improve. It will be interesting to see if he makes the bench though now it's gone back to five subs, especially once Wesley is back.
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Keinan is a good young player with lots of natural ability, sadly missing the ability to score goals. This may come, it probably won't, but you never know. Samatta is just rubbish, looks strictly a lower league sort of player.
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Keinan is a good young player with lots of natural ability, sadly missing the ability to score goals. This may come, it probably won't, but you never know. Samatta is just rubbish, looks strictly a lower league sort of player.
I thought Samatta looked great in those first couple of games. The lockdown seem to set him back a bit and he didn't seem the same player when we returned. I would persevere with him unless we were offered our money back and had someone else lined up.
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Well, sounds like Davis keeps missing his chances on that Barclays advert, so he isn’t getting any better.
Seriously though, I was impressed with his hold up play and work ethic. I can forgive a striker for not scoring goals when as isolated as he was through the run in, but he needed to be converting some of the set piece chances. Suspect the best way for him to kick on is for a loan spell at a top half championship team, but not prepared to write him off yet.
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I'd rather keep Davis as back up than Samatta to be honest.
Same here.
Thirded.
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The way Samatta took his goal at Wembley really impressed me. And his movement pre-Lockdown offered glimpses of talent. I'd be loathe to write him off on the basis of the final ten games when the team was set-up to grind out results.
Set against that, we only play with one striker and we are surely going to buy a new one; Wesley will return at some stage and Davis was far more effective than Samatta upon the resumption. On that basis, if we get offers close to what we bought him for, I would bid him adieu.
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Bin the pair of them.
Our remit is changing.
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Davis plays as a striker who never strikes. Being able to hold the ball up and nothing else is a luxury we can do without. We need to bring in players demonstrably better than those we already have and Davis falls into that category.
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Davis out for a season-long loan; Samatta sold.
Bring in Watkins and C Wilson. We will have massively improved out striking potential and taken pressure off Wesley.
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No point loaning him unless he signs a new contract, he's into the last year of his current deal. I still think he could make it so would be up for giving him an extra couple of years, loaning him to a Championship club who will play him every week, and see how he gets on. If he doesn't sign a new deal, sell him. No point in allowing our players to develop their game elsewhere if we are never going to play them or make any money from selling them.
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Their careers haven't followed an exact trajectory but Peter Crouch was much maligned at Villa before he went on loan to Norwich, got some confidence and came back for the second half of the season in 2003/04. Along with Solano, he was a big part in our upturn in form that took us up to 6 and with an outside chance of Champions League.
O'Dreary then sold him to Soton whilst we had Cant Control firing blanks for us instead.
Crouch was older then than Davis is now. Like Crouch, Davis has some nice touches and good holdup play, doesn't look out of his depth in the top flight and doesn't seem to have an attitude problem.
As a young player coming through the ranks he'll hardly be on mega money either. This is one of the shit things about modern football, fans will demand loyalty, but with a player like Davis it will be 'bin him/ fuck him off.' I'd hope we have better options starting next season but can still see a route back for him if he gets a run of games in the Championship.
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The way Samatta took his goal at Wembley really impressed me. And his movement pre-Lockdown offered glimpses of talent. I'd be loathe to write him off on the basis of the final ten games when the team was set-up to grind out results.
Set against that, we only play with one striker and we are surely going to buy a new one; Wesley will return at some stage and Davis was far more effective than Samatta upon the resumption. On that basis, if we get offers close to what we sold him for, I would bid him adieu.
Completely agree with this.
Interesting that the much lauded Chris Wilder, kept preserving with the non scoring McGoldrick up front for most of last season. I think there is a place for Keinan off the bench, not as the main man. We have to get 2 in for me and winger, if we do that somethings got to give as we’re not going to have for example Callum Wilson, Ollie watkins, Wes, Davies and Samatta.
I also thought Samatta looked decent when he first came and I’m sure it’s been tough for him isolated in a foreign country and then asked to play the lone striker role, but I think he’ll be the one to make way.
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Maybe if he hadn't persevered with McGoldrick, they might then have scored more goals than us, not fewer.
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Maybe if he hadn't persevered with McGoldrick, they might then have scored more goals than us, not fewer.
Yes good point. But wilder obviously thought he gave the team something as I think Davies did for us, especially coming off the bench for the last few games. For me he definitely stopped the ball coming back at us so quickly later in games. But as others have said, he doesn’t score, so major issue with him being a main striker and is why I think we need two in
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* Davis, not Davies !
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* Davis, not Davies !
My mistake!
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Their careers haven't followed an exact trajectory but Peter Crouch was much maligned at Villa before he went on loan to Norwich, got some confidence and came back for the second half of the season in 2003/04. Along with Solano, he was a big part in our upturn in form that took us up to 6 and with an outside chance of Champions League.
O'Dreary then sold him to Soton whilst we had Cant Control firing blanks for us instead.
Crouch was older then than Davis is now. Like Crouch, Davis has some nice touches and good holdup play, doesn't look out of his depth in the top flight and doesn't seem to have an attitude problem.
As a young player coming through the ranks he'll hardly be on mega money either. This is one of the shit things about modern football, fans will demand loyalty, but with a player like Davis it will be 'bin him/ fuck him off.' I'd hope we have better options starting next season but can still see a route back for him if he gets a run of games in the Championship.
Can't argue with much of that.
I reckon he scores loads in training and Smith is waiting for the first to go in. When it does, you'll see Grealish, McGinn, Hourihane and the rest mobbing him.
He's got undoubted talent, he just needs that first goal
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Their careers haven't followed an exact trajectory but Peter Crouch was much maligned at Villa before he went on loan to Norwich, got some confidence and came back for the second half of the season in 2003/04. Along with Solano, he was a big part in our upturn in form that took us up to 6 and with an outside chance of Champions League.
O'Dreary then sold him to Soton whilst we had Cant Control firing blanks for us instead.
Crouch was older then than Davis is now. Like Crouch, Davis has some nice touches and good holdup play, doesn't look out of his depth in the top flight and doesn't seem to have an attitude problem.
As a young player coming through the ranks he'll hardly be on mega money either. This is one of the shit things about modern football, fans will demand loyalty, but with a player like Davis it will be 'bin him/ fuck him off.' I'd hope we have better options starting next season but can still see a route back for him if he gets a run of games in the Championship.
Crouch had scored for fun for Portsmouth though in a lower division before joining Villa. That for me is the BIG difference. Davis should be loaned out to see if he can do the same. I'd love for Davis to turn into the complete striker, but we simply can't go into the new season relying on him, or it'll be another relegation battle for us. He also isn't going to improve making a handful of sub appearances, so a loan to a good Championship team would make perfect sense for both parties.
If he adds goals to his game, then that would be great, see you next year. If he doesn't, then we let him go.
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Totally agree Martin. He is still young and even a six month loan to a lower league to get some goals and gain some confidence may be beneficial for him.
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But unless we give him another contract extension, by next season's end he won't be our player.
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But unless we give him another contract extension, by next season's end he won't be our player.
Well we either extend his contract by a year and loan him out, or we let him go in my opinion.
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I would extend his contract by a year and loan him out for six months to see how he goes.
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If we use him as we did in the final few games, coming on to give the main strikers a rest then he’s worth a place in the squad. He’s never going to be a prolific striker as lacks the composure needed but he can hold the ball up well, link with others and give defenders a hard time. Obviously this all depends on us signing players who will score goals.
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I get that he’s not a natural goalscorer but there’s more than enough there for us to work with before we consider moving him on. He has strength, hold up play is good, has some pace and works hard. If he could sharpen up his finishing he’d be a massive handful.
Would’ve been a great foil for an old fashioned goal poacher back in the day when everyone played 4-4-2.
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I'd say Tammy was down and out at Chelsea until he had a loan spell with a Championship club, and even then only made it into their side because they had a transfer ban. A season out with a good Championship side would be a good test for Keinan, appreciating that his contract may stymie that.
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I'd say Tammy was down and out at Chelsea until he had a loan spell with a Championship club, and even then only made it into their side because they had a transfer ban. A season out with a good Championship side would be a good test for Keinan, appreciating that his contract may stymie that.
I'd be inclined to offer him a year's extension, with the idea that he spends this season playing Championship football. I'd be inclined to give him that chance - he's getting to the age where he really needs to seen as a viable option up front for us. As others have said, he seems to be brilliant in everything except scoring goals.
He doesn't need to be prolific, but if he's not scoring roughly the same number of goals that you'd expect from an attacking midfielder, that's an issue. Get a bit of confidence in him, though, and I think they'll come.
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I'd say Tammy was down and out at Chelsea until he had a loan spell with a Championship club, and even then only made it into their side because they had a transfer ban. A season out with a good Championship side would be a good test for Keinan, appreciating that his contract may stymie that.
The season with us was his third consecutive out on loan, during which time he'd scored over 50 league goals and signed a new 5 year contract. "Down and out" is maybe stretching things a bit.
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If we use him as we did in the final few games, coming on to give the main strikers a rest then he’s worth a place in the squad. He’s never going to be a prolific striker as lacks the composure needed but he can hold the ball up well, link with others and give defenders a hard time. Obviously this all depends on us signing players who will score goals.
The last sentence is obviously the clincher. I'd be fine with bringing him on if we're 2-0 up, but if we're 0-0 or 1-0 down you'd get more goal threat from bringing on a defender at the moment.
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I’d keep him. We wouldn’t get much for him in any case , and I can’t imagine his wages are huge ( compared to footballers, not me and you)
Definitely loan him out and see how he gets on in championship. It may do him the world of good.
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I'd give him a new 3 year deal, and then loan him out for the next 6 months.
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Really? A bit generous...would preserve his transfer value though, I guess.
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His wages will be sod all by PL standards, and if he doesn't improve to PL standard there'll still be buyers. If he does improve then we've got him on an ok contract. Extend it by less and if he does suddenly start banging them in while out on loan then by next summer you're back to he's got 1 year left.
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I'd keep him, like others, as his wages will be bugger all and he may come good. The only part of his game missing to my mind is finishing - I know that's a pretty big part of being a striker, and no idea at all how much it can be taught. Would certainly keep him over Samatta, who looked utter pish after the restart (I can think of at least three more-or-less free headers from about 8 yards out, none of which went on target and all of which should have been goals / great saves).
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He’s hold up play will surely get us 8m if he does go.
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He’s hold up play will surely get us 8m if he does go.
I reckon you’d be lucky to get that currently. A season in the championship scoring 15-20 goals and you’d have a £15m player, especially considering his all round game. A three year contract might be a £2-4m investment so a pretty good gamble I think.
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He was taking the piss, I believe.
Anyway, I'm up for the extend deal and loan him scheme. Don't loan him anywhere scummy though, for once. I like to be able to cheer on our loanees.
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He’s hold up play will surely get us 8m if he does go.
I reckon you’d be lucky to get that currently. A season in the championship scoring 15-20 goals and you’d have a £15m player, especially considering his all round game. A three year contract might be a £2-4m investment so a pretty good gamble I think.
Exactly, if we can loan him out to say a Preston, bang in 8 -10 goals and with his all round ability and effort we can be demanding 8-10m
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He’s hold up play will surely get us 8m if he does go.
I reckon you’d be lucky to get that currently. A season in the championship scoring 15-20 goals and you’d have a £15m player, especially considering his all round game. A three year contract might be a £2-4m investment so a pretty good gamble I think.
Exactly, if we can loan him out to say a Preston, bang in 8 -10 goals and with his all round ability and effort we can be demanding 8-10m
If he adds goalscoring to his all round ability and effort, why would we want to sell him? He'd be an ideal Premier squad player then.
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Based on what I’ve seen for the last few seasons 8-10 goals in the championship wouldn’t change my mind - however based on market value of this return and his apparent all round ability I would snap anyone’s hand off for any price ending in a million.
I would actually eat my hat if he got to double figures In the second division.
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Based on what I’ve seen for the last few seasons 8-10 goals in the championship wouldn’t change my mind - however based on market value of this return and his apparent all round ability I would snap anyone’s hand off for any price ending in a million.
I would actually eat my hat if he got to double figures In the second division.
You don't like him. You could have mentioned it.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
By why didn't you declare your dislike sooner? You really should have said.
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Based on what I’ve seen for the last few seasons 8-10 goals in the championship wouldn’t change my mind - however based on market value of this return and his apparent all round ability I would snap anyone’s hand off for any price ending in a million.
I would actually eat my hat if he got to double figures In the second division.
You don't like him. You could have mentioned it.
ha ha
The mans obsessed, livin rent free and all that
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Haven’t I declared it ? Apologies.
I’ve met Keinan a few times and he’s a nice chap. I think that’s already been declared.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
He's actually paid to turn up to training every day and to do what's asked of him. Just like you're paid to point out holes in the ground or erect fences around dogging hotspots or whatever it is that you do.
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74 posts and I reckon I could count on 1 hand the amount where you don't have a dig at Davis, maybe change the record.
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Where there’s an opinion on one side isn’t a counter argument allowed?
I’m sure if we had a peep at most post match threads last season our forwards didn’t shine.
For the record Davis can take Samatta with him. Happy to contribute to his persecution too.
And yes I’m a Wesley fan btw.
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Where there’s an opinion on one side isn’t a counter argument allowed?
I’m sure if we had a peep at most post match threads last season our forwards didn’t shine.
For the record Davis can take Samatta with him. Happy to contribute to his persecution too.
And yes I’m a Wesley fan btw.
There nothing wrong with having an opinion, sharing that opinion over and over again whenever anyone disagrees and on threads where it's not really relevant annoys people though.
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Some of my best friends are strikers.
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so Davis isn't a mate then?
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Davis has definitely got some mates on here by the looks of it!!
Or has multiple accounts.
Seriously, I hope he proves me wrong as I’m the only person that’s thinks he has nothing to offer us.
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so Davis isn't a mate then?
You should wait a bit and not jump to conclusions... 😉
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We would laugh if he was at another club with his goalscoring record. Obviously he'd score against us though.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
He's actually paid to turn up to training every day and to do what's asked of him. Just like you're paid to point out holes in the ground or erect fences around dogging hotspots or whatever it is that you do.
Is there any need for comments like this? Differing opinions don’t require replies like this!
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I think it's fair enough. There are indeed people who are paid to do both of those things.
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Where can i get one of these jobs?
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Where can i get one of these jobs?
Apply at AVFC. Candidates need to have HND in Hitting Bovine Rump With Stringed Instrument Level 1.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
He's actually paid to turn up to training every day and to do what's asked of him. Just like you're paid to point out holes in the ground or erect fences around dogging hotspots or whatever it is that you do.
Is there any need for comments like this? Differing opinions don’t require replies like this!
Thanks for the gesture yammers - I don’t get involved with childishness- I don’t think he’s the full deck of cards anyway without a name like that - seems obsessed with dogging / sexual names etc. etc.
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Cum over here and say that.
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He’s at it again. Not sure if I’m scared of a beating or something more intimate.
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You've pulled.
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Cum over here and say that.
He's not hard enough.
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Massive tit though.
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I base my opinion on facts.
A striker who has scored 1 goal in years doesn’t improve my
Club.
It’s subjective about his all round play and I may be wrong on that - however he’s paid to score.
He's actually paid to turn up to training every day and to do what's asked of him. Just like you're paid to point out holes in the ground or erect fences around dogging hotspots or whatever it is that you do.
Is there any need for comments like this? Differing opinions don’t require replies like this!