Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: dave.woodhall on January 31, 2017, 12:16:56 PM
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It's getting exciting, this last day thing.
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On his way to Villa for a medical. Can't say I know much about him, but obviously he's fantastic!
Actually his scoring record is very good.
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Am i right in thinking he had some worrying recurring injuries last season or the one before ?
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Am i right in thinking he had some worrying recurring injuries last season or the one before ?
Both seasons
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Am i right in thinking he had some worrying recurring injuries last season or the one before ?
Couple of bad knee injuries.
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Gives an extra frisson of excitement to tonight's game as well.
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I did a bit of scouting on YouTube last night and I thought he looked quite strong, good turn of pace, quality finisher but also looked like he gets his head up and looks for team mates. Albeit YouTube clips :-)
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I think Van Nistelrooy had some knee problems early in his career but obviously recovered sufficiently, let's hope it's the same for him.
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We are spending insane money, given we most likely won't go up this year. I hope I am wrong but I hope the finances are being planned carefully. We all loved Randy when he was spending out the arse...Then we realised it was reckless.
I hope Dr and his equations are sustainable!
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Can we sing "we've got Scotty Hogan" to the tune of Glad All Over please? Fits better than Rangers singing it about Joey Garner.
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Love it!!! Hogan has been superb this season. The thought of Kodjia and Hogan together up front has just caused a stir in my loins.
Assuming this means he won't play against us tonight?
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I think Van Nistelrooy had some knee problems early in his career but obviously recovered sufficiently, let's hope it's the same for him.
Indeed. A medical should show up any concerns anyway of course
Fingers crossed it goes through
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I reckon we all watched the same Youtube clips then.
He looks very calm and assured in front of goal is what I noticed.
I also thought he looked about 38 so googled him to see he is only 24.
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Love it!!! Hogan has been superb this season. The thought of Kodjia and Hogan together up front has just caused a stir in my loins.
Assuming this means he won't play against us tonight?
He'd have to get back down the M1 pretty sharpish after his medical, if he was. You know what that rush hour can be like from Watford onwards.
Seriously though, he'd been pulled from the squad already.
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
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Will The Hote end be blasting out "I am a real American" instead of "theres only one Scotty Hogan" :-/
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
Rumored to be 9 million rising to 15 million with adds on...insane. But then again we could get £11million for Gestede and Westwood.
What's our net spend? About £5 million? That's nothing...and great business.
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We'll have outbid West Ham to get him, it's going to be a lot. Gives the chance for the porn barons to talk about us on Sky Sports News though.
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
Rumored to be 9 million rising to 15 million with adds on...insane. But then again we could get £11million for Gestede and Westwood.
What's our net spend? About £5 million? That's nothing...and great business.
Throw in the 5m we'll be getting in the Ayew deal and we are even.
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I would be happy if we sign him he's done well at Brentford.
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
Rumored to be 9 million rising to 15 million with adds on...insane. But then again we could get £11million for Gestede and Westwood.
What's our net spend? About £5 million? That's nothing...and great business.
Throw in the 5m we'll be getting in the Ayew deal and we are even.
Yes forgot about that....sad to see him go I like him but hey ho..the squad issues have been addressed for nothing in transfer fees then.
Already social media is awash with, we're trying to buy the league...
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I think Van Nistelrooy had some knee problems early in his career but obviously recovered sufficiently, let's hope it's the same for him.
I remember everyone saying that God had dodgy knees as well. That turned out OK.
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
Rumored to be 9 million rising to 15 million with adds on...insane. But then again we could get £11million for Gestede and Westwood.
What's our net spend? About £5 million? That's nothing...and great business.
Throw in the 5m we'll be getting in the Ayew deal and we are even.
Yes forgot about that....sad to see him go I like him but hey ho..the squad issues have been addressed for nothing in transfer fees then.
Already social media is awash with, we're trying to buy the league...
good. I want us to go up or at least have a board willing to put up a fight to get there. It's a nice feeling after so many years of decline to have a board seem so committed to achieving something positive, and even if we don't go up we will be very strong favourites next season.
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So if Hogan signs then we will play 2 up front, him and Kodja
4-4-2
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On his way to Villa for a medical.
Why? We're on our way to Brentford!
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I mentioned him in the summer - no, really - or before the end of last season. out for ages then was scoring for fun for them. Got a mate who is a Brentford fan and thinks he's the dogs bollocks.
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Oh, but for christs sake can we not call him 'Scotty'. We'll leave that kind of nonsense to the Redknapps.
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I hope he's more Kodjia than McCormack
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Anyone heard what the likely fee will be?
Rumored to be 9 million rising to 15 million with adds on...insane. But then again we could get £11million for Gestede and Westwood.
What's our net spend? About £5 million? That's nothing...and great business.
Throw in the 5m we'll be getting in the Ayew deal and we are even.
better than that because we also get that Swansea defender.
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Watched him quite closely when Brentford came to VP earlier in the season, as there had been quite a bit of talk about him. Was busy, worked hard and had good movement. More of a central striker and should be a good foil for Kodjia.
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Am i right in thinking he had some worrying recurring injuries last season or the one before ?
No that was the infamous Jimmy Hogan.
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On his way to Villa for a medical.
Who has reported this? The mail (I know) have said that we're locked in talks?
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Sky Sources now.
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Reading his wiki page, there is a touch of the Jamie Vardy story about him so will be pretty hungry I would think
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Sky Sources now.
Ah cool. Thanks.
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He strikes me as a bit similar to Shane Long. If he's as good we've got a bargain at this level.
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Reading his wiki page, there is a touch of the Jamie Vardy story about him so will be pretty hungry I would think
Huh, I thought it was Ross with the eating disorder?
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Crivens! These are really exciting times for a change. Here's hoping there ain't any late-doors spanners in the works & Brucie & Co get their man. :)
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This little snippet worried me slightly.
And with the pending sales of Ashley Westwood to Burnley and Jordan Ayew to Swansea, Villa now have enough cash to make a down-payment to Brentford for their prized asset.
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This deal needs to happen now....Gabby injured in training! Torn leg muscle apparently. Down to just Kodjia upfront.
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If he doesn't comr I won't post ! I sure they can convince him invite him into dressing room tonight! Its good that have Brentford tonight in a way can help him on team coach back to villa
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This deal needs to happen now....Gabby injured in training! Torn leg muscle apparently. Down to just Kodjia upfront.
Not happy about that. He was actually doing ok and had worked hard to get back into shape. He would have been very useful off the bench for the rest of the season. Need to RHM tied down, and we do have Keinan Davies too.
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He strikes me as a bit similar to Shane Long. If he's as good we've got a bargain at this level.
Physically maybe but I think Hogan actually has a turn of pace and scores lots of goals, unlike Shane Dung.
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I'd be stunned if the fee is as high as they're saying it is. It does sound a lot.
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Can't help but wonder if Hogan will be another resident at the Aston Villa Home for Formerly Prolific Championship Strikers. By chance alone, we are due one that continues to be prolific with us.
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you mean like Kodjia? He hasn't turned-out too shabby.
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I hope he's half decent, I'll settle for half decent.
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This signing is more exciting than Jordan Rhodes
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This signing is more exciting than Jordan Rhodes
Hearing that Gabby is injured today I wouldn't be surprised to see him at Villa Park on loan last min. Weirder things have happened.
Edit: In fact I've now just seen a post with an article on the transfers thread saying exactly that lol
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Hulkamania!
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Is he actually know as 'Hulk' or is it something we have made up?
And if we are to make up a name for him from a fictitious character why not use his Christian name - Scott and nickname 'Tracy' after the Thunderbird 1 pilot?
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Deal done according to a number of sources.
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Deal done according to a number of sources.
wow is that 7 players this window , I thought Bruce said minor surgery ??
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He's signed according to the Daily Mail and Star??
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He's signed according to the Daily Mail and Star??
According to the Daily Heil :.....................Godzvilla!
Scott Hogan completes £12m move to Aston Villa in deadline day deal
Aston Villa have signed Brentford striker Scott Hogan in a £12m deal
Hogan undertook a medical at the club's Bodymoor Heath training ground
The transfer is believed to be worth an initial £9m with the remainder in add-ons
Hogan's former club Rochdale will receive a cut of the transfer fee
West Ham had been linked with the striker all month and were expected to bid
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like it!
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Scott Hogan sounds like a wrestler to me :)
UTV
The Doc
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Can't help but wonder if Hogan will be another resident at the Aston Villa Home for Formerly Prolific Championship Strikers. By chance alone, we are due one that continues to be prolific with us.
This. Since Guy Whittingham, everyone (except Kodjia) who's been a prolific champo striker has flopped. Crouch, Gestede, McGate. Hope he's not one of them
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Apparently Rochdale have a 20% sell on fee so a nice little earner for them.
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Thrills, spills, goals and skills.
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Benteke of course was not a flop
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Worth every penny if it means Gabby won't play
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Benteke of course was not a flop
No, but neither was he signed from the Championship.
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Is he actually know as 'Hulk' or is it something we have made up?
And if we are to make up a name for him from a fictitious character why not use his Christian name - Scott and nickname 'Tracy' after the Thunderbird 1 pilot?
Let's hope we don't have to dub him Paul Hogan's most revered character...
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I'd like to put in a left field nickname and go with the 'Bard of Thomond'
Michael Hogan (31 October 1828 – 1899) was an Irish poet. He was known as the “Bard of Thomond”.
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Worth every penny if it means Gabby won't play
Why does every deal have to turn into a dig at one of our players? (not just you) We all know Gabby is shit, Westwood was limited etc. Do we have to bring it up at every turn?
It's just pointless nonsence for the sake of it.
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I'd like to put in a left field nickname and go with the 'Bard of Thomond'
Michael Hogan (31 October 1828 – 1899) was an Irish poet. He was known as the “Bard of Thomond”.
If Hogan signs, i'm going to insist on us all calling him Colonel Klink
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Ben would be good. A sporting superstar as we all hope Scott will become.
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I'd like to put in a left field nickname and go with the 'Bard of Thomond'
Michael Hogan (31 October 1828 – 1899) was an Irish poet. He was known as the “Bard of Thomond”.
If Hogan signs, i'm going to insist on us all calling him Colonel Klink
I was also thinking of Sgt Schulz but he looked too much like McCormack.
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BTW - The Helga in HH was even hotter than the Helga in AA
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Was he Brentford captain? If not, I block, veto and generally tut about this deal.
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At the moment of all the websites I've checked it's only the Daily Mail, who have said he's passed a medical and has signed for us. A few minutes ago Sky Sports have said Villa have agreed terms with him, but no mention of him passing a medical. So I'm not 100% certain he's passed his medical and would not want to rely on just the Mail that the deal is complete.
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Gone a bit quiet, is he still coughing for the doc (our other doc), or problems producing a sample?
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Well this came as a bit of a surprise. He seems to have been linked to all and sundry this last month but I never saw him ever linked to us.
Does this mean Bruce has managed to get pretty much everyone he targeted this window? Can't think of anyone he's missed out on.
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Well this came as a bit of a surprise. He seems to have been linked to all and sundry this last month but I never saw him ever linked to us.
Does this mean Bruce has managed to get pretty much everyone he targeted this window? Can't think of anyone he's missed out on.
Roads.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
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Well this came as a bit of a surprise. He seems to have been linked to all and sundry this last month but I never saw him ever linked to us.
Does this mean Bruce has managed to get pretty much everyone he targeted this window? Can't think of anyone he's missed out on.
Roads.
Many reports are saying Hogan was Bruce's first choice. Now he has him he's cooled his interest in Rhodes so I'm not sure that's a case of missing out on him as such.
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Rhodes undergoing medical at Sheffield Wednesday according to SSN.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Brilliant!
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
´
BTTF
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
I am pretty sure I stole it from here years ago!
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He certainly seems to know where the net is, his injury history worries me a bit though especially with some of the figures mentioned as a fee for him.
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Well this came as a bit of a surprise. He seems to have been linked to all and sundry this last month but I never saw him ever linked to us.
Does this mean Bruce has managed to get pretty much everyone he targeted this window? Can't think of anyone he's missed out on.
Roads.
Many reports are saying Hogan was Bruce's first choice. Now he has him he's cooled his interest in Rhodes so I'm not sure that's a case of missing out on him as such.
There were links to Hogan earlier on in the window but they stopped, once WHU became interested. That is when the Rhodes stories started.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
You are a colossus.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
You are a colossus.
We might need an Atlas though.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
I am pretty sure I stole it from here years ago!
back to the future ?
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
I am pretty sure I stole it from here years ago!
back to the future ?
A man who gets a good metaphor.
The wife has done that to me in ages.
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Just parked up in Brentford.
This is something of a surprise!
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TalkSHITE have just said Hogan's transfer has gone through...
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Happy days, like the look of this fella.
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Where we are going, we don't need Rhodes.
Bravo. Unless it's plagiarised of course.
I am pretty sure I stole it from here years ago!
Yes, it's an Agean quote.
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Blimey, just read his wiki page and his injury record. Gulp. Hope our medical boys know what they are doing. Only played 35 games for Brentford in 2.5 years, 25 of them this season. A risk thats for sure which presumably is what SVC was on about on twitter earlier.
Good luck Scott. You need to perform, we have had enough charlatans at VP these last few years
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Just parked up in Brentford.
This is something of a surprise!
A keener eh? I like it.
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It's a double bonus given he's not playing against us tonight. Welcome to Villa Scott.
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Rhodes undergoing medical at Sheffield Wednesday according to SSN.
It's great having this squad refresh but I'm greedy and when heard about hogan today I wanted Rhodes as the extra surprise
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It's a double bonus given he's not playing against us tonight. Welcome to Villa Scott.
Ain't it just! Here's hoping we can take advantage of the situation & properly get this show on the road.
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Good signing. He could be our Vardy hopefully. He just keeps on going. Good finisher. I can also seeing him playing well with Kodjia in a 2, but likewise, if we go for 3 up top both Kodjia and Hogan are capable of operating in the wide position and coming in. I prefer this to Rhodes to be honest.
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I assume that there'll be an embargo on an official announcement until after the game
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Watching the kid on YouTube ( I know) reminds me of Robbie Fowler
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Someone turn off the wifi at villa park incase be tunes in
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If the lad has any sense he will stay where he is
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Watching the kid on YouTube ( I know) reminds me of Robbie Fowler
Doing coke?
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The lad is mental if he signs for us.
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Getting battered allover here
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Doesn't look like Brentford will miss him with that fella absolutely roasting us to pieces up front.
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Hoof
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The lad is mental if he signs for us.
Not f he wants to earn considerably more dosh. Good motivator, it seems. People can't get enough of the stuff.
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Don't understand what's holding up the completion of the signing. It's getting a bit worrying, there must be a doubt, whether the transfer is going through.
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He's doing that move you see in cartoons with his legs going at 100 miles an hour, before he skedaddles.
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we need Hulk Hogan nevermind Scott.
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He's changed his mind halfway up the M40
(https://media.giphy.com/media/tFjKJTVUVIxmU/giphy.gif)
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Full details of the fee announced:
£9m + 3 points.
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Taking their time announcing this one.
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For no reason whatsoever I dont think this transfer will be a success.
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I'm starting to panic.
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He's had a couple of dodgy knee injuries, which is a worry.
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8 minutes.
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It was probably confirmed hours ago.
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Bruce said he'd signed in the pre match interview
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As long as the deal sheet is in by 11 it can be ratified after the deadline.
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Hasn't the Doc already tweeted 100%?
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The Doc posted his formulae hours ago saying everything was 100%. I, and others took that to mean all deals that they wanted to do have been done. The press office is probably as slow as our defence.
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Hasn't the Doc already tweeted 100%?
It still hasn't been announced officially though.
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Signed yonks ago today. Taylor was only officially revealed an hour ago and that deal was done 2 days ago.
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They announced Taylor in and Ayew leaving after the game but no mention of Hogan. Maybe he's trying to convince Dean Smith to take him back.
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Sky said that the deal was close that was about half an hour ago.
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The London Evening Standard have just confirmed it's done.
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Poor bloke. All aboard the shit train.
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Apparently if you've filled out deadline day transfer form and the player has signed it you've got till 1am to complete the deal.
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We're a big club. We go by our watch.
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Apparently if you've filled out deadline day transfer form and the player has signed it you've got till 1am to complete the deal.
That's a Premier League rule, if you've got that info from watching Sky. I don't know if it applies to our division.
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We're a big club. We go by our watch.
Like everything at the club it's slow and behind everyone else.
/baddumtish
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its probably still dependent on McCaramac going. He's undergoing a medical according to sky. That'll be interesting.
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Have we spent £77 million this season?
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We're a big club. We go by our watch.
Like everything at the club it's slow and behind everyone else.
/baddumtish
Mickey Mouse got an Aston Villa watch for Christmas, etc...
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The manager is saying we've signed him, so I would hope we have.
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Sky said that the deal was close that was about half an hour ago.
In the immediate pre-match interview on Sky Sports, SB confirmed the signing.
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Better hope he signs, the last striker to score for us was Kod before he went to the AFCoN,
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Still 50 mins left of the Scottish transfer window. Maybe Clyde have made a late bid for Hogan
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London Evening Standard (http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/brentford-striker-scott-hogan-completes-aston-villa-move-for-15m-fee-a3455056.html)
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London Evening Standard (http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/brentford-striker-scott-hogan-completes-aston-villa-move-for-15m-fee-a3455056.html)
That article is just repeating what the managers said before the game. Seems strange they both talked as though it's a done deal and yet neither club has announced it as an official transfer.
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I really don't know....if the deal is signed or not?? We have one out of form striker left as it stands. Three strikers off loaded, RHM banished, Gabby crocked. Be par for the course if the deal doesn't happen!
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Still 50 mins left of the Scottish transfer window. Maybe Clyde have made a late bid for Hogan
So long as they don't go for McCormack.
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Apparently if you've filled out deadline day transfer form and the player has signed it you've got till 1am to complete the deal.
That's a Premier League rule, if you've got that info from watching Sky. I don't know if it applies to our division.
Yeah, from Sky. Can't remember if they said it was exclusively a PL rule.
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So we've now spent nearly £40m on strikers this season. I do hope we start scoring some goals soon.
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Sky said that the deal was close that was about half an hour ago.
In the immediate pre-match interview on Sky Sports, SB confirmed the signing.
He didn't. He said it was close.
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Apparently if you've filled out deadline day transfer form and the player has signed it you've got till 1am to complete the deal.
That's a Premier League rule, if you've got that info from watching Sky. I don't know if it applies to our division.
Yeah, from Sky. Can't remember if they said it was exclusively a PL rule.
They mentioned it being "Premier League Rule..." followed by a number. They never said it was exclusively a Premier League rule or that a similar arrangement is in place for the Football League, so I don't know.
I'd imagine they'd have said the deal was off if we definitely hadn't got it through in time. Dunno though.
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One thing I have noticed about sky is that the Championship doesn't appear to exist. They were going to a reporter at man citeh even though they've known there would be no signings there for days.
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Here we go...
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They just say they are waiting for confirmation.
Sigh.
And awaiting confirmation of the McCormack to Forest deal, though they have made an improved offer.
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Sky still saying deal not confirmed yet. The Docs quiet.
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They've got no thought for me at all. They serve up that shit tonight and now are keeping me up.
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Confirmed
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Phew
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Are you just trying to send me to bed?
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Aston Villa Football Club is delighted to announce the signing of Scott Hogan from Brentford.
The striker moves to Villa Park for an undisclosed fee and has put pen to paper on a four-and-a-half-year deal.
Hogan has found the net 14 times in the Championship this term and can't wait to start life at Villa.
The 24-year-old said: “I’m delighted to be at a club like Aston Villa.
“With its history and tradition I can’t wait to start working hard and helping the team.
“It all happened quite quickly and now I'm looking forward to meeting my new team-mates tomorrow and beginning a new chapter in my career."
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Confirmed
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Pic of him in the shirt.
https://twitter.com/AVFCOfficial/status/826573289820717056
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Brum Mail (http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-boss-steve-bruce-12537473)
Aston Villa boss Steve Bruce: Why I signed Scott Hogan
Gregg Evans was speaking to the manager after the defeat to Brentford tonight
ByGregg Evans
23:05, 31 JAN 2017
Steve Bruce revealed his delight at landing Scott Hogan after stressing: “I was not going to miss out on him again.”
The Villa boss swooped to land the 24-year-old from Brentford in a deal potentially rising to £15million, subject to clearance in these closing few minutes of the window.
On a night where Bruce was vexed at losing 3-0 to Hogan’s former club, the one positive he could take was finally getting his man.
Villa have had a busy transfer window and another high-profile move on deadline day saw Jordan Ayew leave for Swansea with Neil Taylor and around £4million heading in Villa’s direction.
Ashley Westwood also completed a £5million move to Burnley and Kevin Toner left on loan to Bradford.
Villa bolstered their youth ranks by landing 17-year-old youngster Jacob Bedeau in a £1million deal and Bruce was pleased with how the window panned out.
“I’m delighted with what we’ve done,” he said
The Villa boss swooped to land the 24-year-old from Brentford in a deal potentially rising to £15million, subject to clearance in these closing few minutes of the window.
On a night where Bruce was vexed at losing 3-0 to Hogan’s former club, the one positive he could take was finally getting his man.
Scott Hogan
“I’ve watched him for a long time, and I watched him when he was at Rochdale and regret not taking him.
“I genuinely thought he was going to West Ham and when Premier League clubs are in for the players you like, it’s always going to be difficult.
“But when West Ham pulled out, we put our energy into seeing if we could do something,”
Villa have had a busy transfer window and another high-profile move on deadline day saw Jordan Ayew leave for Swansea with Neil Taylor and around £4million heading in Villa’s direction.
Ashley Westwood also completed a £5million move to Burnley and Kevin Toner left on loan to Bradford.
Villa bolstered their youth ranks by landing 17-year-old youngster Jacob Bedeau in a £1million deal and Bruce was pleased with how the window panned out.
“I’m delighted with what we’ve done,” he said.
“We’ve now got to start re-paying it and fighting.
“It’s no good talking about the past because we’re still in it.
“What we have witnessed the past few games shows that mentally we’re still fragile.
“I’ve got to try and change that and given time I believe I can do it.”
Asked specifically what Hogan, the big-money arrival, can bring, Bruce said:
“He’s got a hunger and is desperate to do well.
“He’s a good goalscorer, he’s a good finisher and he’s got a bit of pace.
“He’s got a humbleness about him which I like. He’ll be good for us.”
Villa also signed Birkir Bjarnason, Henri Lansbury, Conor Hourihane and Sam Johnstone on loan over the course of the month.
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Welcome, Scott.
You big tease.
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Welcome Scott! For fuck sake Bruce sort this mess!!
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Welcome Scott. You can fuck off to Forest now McFatfuck.
Thanks Doc I might get a bit of kip now without this evenings abysmal performance giving me nightmares.
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Welcome aboard an all that!
On his youtube montage most his goals seem to come from good midfield build up play, we need to find away of getting our midfield within the same postcode as our strikers to get the best out of him.
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Please don't go shit on us, like so many have in the past. It's not a big ask is it?
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Welcome
look forward to seeing you at right back on saturday
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Welcome.
Don't be shit.
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For no reason whatsoever I dont think this transfer will be a success.
Probably based on all the other transfers we've done.
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Only Villa can sign a multi million pound striker but have the fans so utterly fucking pissed off that they aint really bothered right now.
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Kodjia could have done with somebody close to him last night. They could have pressed the their deep playmaker a fair bit too.
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Kodjia could have done with somebody close to him last night. They could have pressed the their deep playmaker a fair bit too.
Absolutely, but if he plays the same formation it's surely going to be Kodjia left, Hogan centre and either Adomah or Green right, all too spaced out and far apart and it'll be the same problems again.
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It's got to be horses for courses.
Last night Gardner should have played and screened the back four with Lansbury and Hourihane able to move forwards without leaving acres of space.
With Jedinak injured and no other forward available it limited his options. The three we played were too attack minded. Lansbury wasn't disciplined enough to screen because he has a lot more to offer.
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Now has the number 9 shirt. Finally a proper striker wearing that number.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
Or it's exactly as it reads. That in January they didn't want to lose a key player and if someone wanted to buy him there was a value met by the buyer.
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They played rather well without their key player last night I thought.
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the whole of the Brentford team last night should of worn scott Hogan masks then we could of asked how much for all of them job lot
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Welcome.
Don't be shit.
Don't be shit and please stay fit
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Score lots of goals Scott.
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Watching clips on youtube a lot of his goals where he shrugs off a defender and shows a turn of foot reminds me a bit of Rambo. Fingers crossed.
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Get him up there with Kodjia, work hard, score goals. There; easy!!
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If he's like Rambo that's great, if he's like Deano that's great, too.....but if he's like McCormack OMG.
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I'm glad we've got him welcome Scott.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
I spoke to 3 blokes in the pub before the game and they reckoned the fee was ridiculous, he would be good for us in this division but wouldn't be good enough "when you go up". They seemed decent blokes but I assumed they were binge drinking.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
I spoke to 3 blokes in the pub before the game and they reckoned the fee was ridiculous, he would be good for us in this division but wouldn't be good enough "when you go up". They seemed decent blokes but I assumed they were binge drinking.
The above could well be true, but as we've definitely got at least one more season down here (and maybe a few more) i'll take it. Rhodes would've been exactly the same and he's even but up to the PL and been found out if you take them letting go so soon as proof
Hogan ... who knows what'll happen
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Great interview with him on AVTV appears to have a fantastic attitude, talks about rising through the leagues and recovering from his injury after 21 months. If he plays as well as he comes across in that interview I think quite of few of us will be very happy.
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
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Yes, it looks more like a Deano than a Rambo now.
he should be able to pick up all the scuffs and mis-kicks that Kodjia and Adomah (especially) seem to miss out on.
Good Luck Mr Hogan.
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Works hard from the looks of him. That will be a big thing up front for us, because we don't get in the channels and press the ball as we should that allows us to push up. He will be an interesting signing. As for what he can do if we go up, most of us on here turned our noses up at Vardy when Sherwood wanted him. He got 24 last season. If you work hard as a striker in the premier league you can score a fair few goals. Until then if he scores 1 in 2 for us in the Championship hes worth the money.
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Good luck to him and we definitely need to improve the press up top, so hopefully he'll do that.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
I thought new signings had to have a least 70 minutes under their belt before someone moaned about them.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
I thought new signings had to have a least 70 minutes under their belt before someone moaned about them.
Even I gave Westwood, Bennett, Lowton etc 90 minutes before I wrote them off (albeit in a friendly).
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I didn't mind Lowton too much. He wasn't great but he wasn't terrible either.
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He was always an upgrade on Hutton.
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Even I gave Westwood, Bennett, Lowton etc 90 minutes before I wrote them off (albeit in a friendly).
Yep. Those terrible players, two of which are playing for mid-table Premier League Burnley and really shit Bennett who's level on points with us at Cardiff. I wouldn't argue that Westwood isn't shit mind.
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Lowton was abysmal. No pace and no idea about his positioning.
Bennett was weak and easily bullied.
They were shit and still are shit. Westwood is utter shite too.
It's garbage like that that saw us into the position we are now.
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I'm sure when Vardy was playing for Fleetwood people would have laughed if you said one day he would have had a premiership winners medal. So let's hope Hogan can win the same ....with us obviously
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Lowton was abysmal. No pace and no idea about his positioning.
Bennett was weak and easily bullied.
They were shit and still are shit. Westwood is utter shite too.
It's garbage like that that saw us into the position we are now.
Yep.
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I heard the manager of Brentford say last night when asked about the transfer "we placed a valuation on the player and that figure was met".
(Translation- We placed an exorbitant valuation on him and fuck me Villa have been silly enough to pay it.) He at least had the good manners to keep a straight face.
I spoke to 3 blokes in the pub before the game and they reckoned the fee was ridiculous, he would be good for us in this division but wouldn't be good enough "when you go up". They seemed decent blokes but I assumed they were binge drinking.
Off their tits on mind bending drugs, more like.
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Is that why a pint in London costs so much? Fair enough.
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Impressed by him and I assume it wasn't Villa fans chanting 'what a waste of money'.
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He'll do for me.
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Looks good. Shame about some of the others.
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Reminded me a bit of Dean Saunders in style and work rate. He'll score plenty provided Kodjia passes to him.
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He looked decent. We'll soon knock that out of him.
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He looked decent. We'll soon knock that out of him.
Yes, that's the spirit.
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unlucky not to score . He will be a great signing.
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He was excellent and will be a top player for us. Kodjia should see the run Hogan made for his goal and realise it is a team game.
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Thought Scott looked good today. He was the only one who closed down players properly and actually harried them on the ball.
I'm sure we can coach that nonsense out of him over the next few weeks at BMH.
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Even I gave Westwood, Bennett, Lowton etc 90 minutes before I wrote them off (albeit in a friendly).
Yep. Those terrible players, two of which are playing for mid-table Premier League Burnley and really shit Bennett who's level on points with us at Cardiff. I wouldn't argue that Westwood isn't shit mind.
They're all fuckin shit, a blind man could tell you that. Burnley won't last that long in the PL with crap like that in their team believe you me. Signing players like that over a 6 year period got us relegated. Have you not learned anything since 2010??
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Hogan looks really good, I hope we don't wreck him by providing no ammunition and/or changing the system and tactics every week.
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Should have scored at least one.
I like him. Nippy, stocky, good movement.
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I liked his debut the only query I have is everything seemed to go through Kodja and he is greedy.
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Hogan can play. Don't worry about him. Home debut goal at the weekend.
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2017/feb/10/scott-hogan-angry-young-man-jamie-vardy-aston-villa
Good to know he can play for Ireland too.
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Was glad to see that Hogan chose the number 9 shirt, not 28 or whatever. It's nothing to be afraid of after all.
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2017/feb/10/scott-hogan-angry-young-man-jamie-vardy-aston-villa
Good to know he can play for Ireland too.
Another article that states it was a transfer that could rise to £15m, I thought it was £9m with possible add ons up to £12m.
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
The poor fucker must wonder what the hell he has done signing for our pile of shite.
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I said when we signed him that the majority of his goals came from good midfield build up, he now plays for a club that by pass the midfield at every opportunity.
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2017/feb/10/scott-hogan-angry-young-man-jamie-vardy-aston-villa
Good to know he can play for Ireland too.
Has declined MON's efforts to date I believe
Pity as we dont have many options up top
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
The poor fucker must wonder what the hell he has done signing for our pile of shite.
Along with a few others I'm sure.
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He wants to score 15 goals this season! He won't even get 15 chances.
No service at all today.
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
The poor fucker must wonder what the hell he has done signing for our pile of shite.
Along with a few others I'm sure.
Felt sorry for him today Kodja is so greedy Hogan is the future you can see the way he peels off defenders
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
The poor fucker must wonder what the hell he has done signing for our pile of shite.
Along with a few others I'm sure.
Felt sorry for him today Kodja is so greedy Hogan is the future you can see the way he peels off defenders
You are right but he can peel all he wants.
If we can't/don't play to his strengths he may as well not bother.
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Bruce needs to sit them both down together and demand they form a partnership as right now Kodja is only playing for personal glory.
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We will ruin him like we did with mccormack.
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Saw some positive signs today though not sure him and kodija will work
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I think you're right but then I can't see kodjia working with anybody.
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He'll be the size of Fat Barry Austin within six months.
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Saw some positive signs today though not sure him and kodija will work
I think we'll lose Kodjia in the summer anyway. There will be a Stoke / Albion type side who will want him.
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He'll be the size of Fat Barry Austin within six months.
That long?
as an aside fuck me the size of some of those ipswich players
the quality of this league and its officials is fucking appalling i hate it
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I think the following says it all concerning the referee today:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/row-zed/luton-midfielder-cameron-mcgeehan-booked-9555532
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I think the following says it all concerning the referee today:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/row-zed/luton-midfielder-cameron-mcgeehan-booked-9555532
Notwithstanding that I didn't see the game today so cannot comment on the referee but, that story is a load of bollocks. No referee would book a player for punching the pitch. I would suggest that he booked him for the tackle that resulted in the broken leg. He could have handled it better; in a more discreet manner perhaps but, punching the pitch? not a hope. Bullshit journalism again.
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Saw some positive signs today though not sure him and kodija will work
I think we'll lose Kodjia in the summer anyway. There will be a Stoke / Albion type side who will want him.
I don't think we will, he's not good enough and is not of the age where he is likely to improve. Good championship striker at best.
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Hogan's come from a team that threads the ball quickly and intelligently through midfield and play for each other to a team that likes clumsy centre backs to do all the forward passing/hoofing and he plays alongside a strike partner who wears blinkers and never once spotted Ross McCormack in his time here.
Good luck Scott, but wrong career move.
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Saw some positive signs today though not sure him and kodija will work
I think we'll lose Kodjia in the summer anyway. There will be a Stoke / Albion type side who will want him.
I don't think we will, he's not good enough and is not of the age where he is likely to improve. Good championship striker at best.
I agree. You nee to be aware you have team mates and are allowed to pass to them to be a really good player.
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We will ruin him like we did with mccormack.
m
Just Ross? Pretty sure we've ruined many, many more that that.
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Saw some positive signs today though not sure him and kodija will work
I think we'll lose Kodjia in the summer anyway. There will be a Stoke / Albion type side who will want him.
I don't think we will, he's not good enough and is not of the age where he is likely to improve. Good championship striker at best.
I agree with you but then Rudy is back playing in the Prem
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Kodjia's not that old is he.....his surname isn't spelt with a C!
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No, he's only 24 but he has been too deferential towards Kodjia and needs to quietly play much more for himself from now on ( because he knows it is a team game that does not include Kodjia )
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Get well soon Scott.
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Hope it's not as bad as it looked.
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His career has been punctuated by bad injuries.
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Hogan and Kodjia seem on totally different wave lengths, Hogan looked a little overawed tonight imo pre-injury, needs a goal soon
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Hope it's not a bad injury.
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Hogan and Kodjia seem on totally different wave lengths, Hogan looked a little overawed tonight imo pre-injury, needs a goal soon
Zero service
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He's a Villa player, of course it's a bad one.
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Bamjaxed sine dubio.
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As I said on the match thread, I did that three times playing basketball. You get a nudge in the air, you come down on the side of your ankle, and all your weight goes onto the joint, and it buckles and goes 90 degrees.
If he's avoided dislocation and bone damage, the ligaments will be torn or severely stretched. Best case - walking again in six weeks, running in twelve. But the joint will be horribly weak and will need serious strapping so it doesn't go again next time he jumps.
If he's dislocated or broken it, more like 6 months or more.
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I've had many ankle injuries before I eventually needed both ankles to be surgically reconstructed with 4 screws in one foot and 3 in the other being fixed. I agree with Dave's post and it's most likely his season over.
In terms of tactics, he was totally isolated all game. There were no runners from midfield getting up to play with him. With Jedinak holding and Lansbury/Hourihane in front of him, I would have thought we would have runners. Horribly poor how they switch off at the back though.
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Thats another one busted then. Jesus. Feel bad for him and us.
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I mostly agree other than I've broken mine like that and was back after 5 weeks. The club physio at the time (who was also a surgeon so knew his stuff) said I was lucky the bone went because if it hadn't and I'd dislocated it and/or torn the ligaments I'd have been out for much, much longer. It depends entirely on where the break is, mine was on the fibula about an inch above the joint which is fairly easily cast and heals 'clean'. A break in your foot is much harder to get set and so takes a lot longer.
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Looked really nasty. Fingers crossed it's not as bad as feared. Chin up Scott.
2 other things. Credit to the Newcastle fans for applauding him off. Also, I notice only Hutton went over to him. Shows little team spirit
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The injury looked bad, the sad thing is that was the only time in the second half you knew he was on the pitch, I am not saying it his fault but our number 9 was totally anonymous for most of the game.
Something not right.
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something's not right is the understatement of this or any other century.
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Nice of his teammates to rush over and check how he was doing. When one did eventually trot over, it was Hutton. I reckon Hogan was lucky the clumsy one didn't tread on the ankle.
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First thought when he went off on a stretcher was that sitting at home Gabby must have been thinking I am now guaranteed a starting place in the team for the next few months!!!
Hutton only went over to get a drink!
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off down Kozak Way?
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First thought when he went off on a stretcher was that sitting at home Gabby must have been thinking I am now guaranteed a starting place in the team for the next few months!!!
Hutton only went over to get a drink!
thankfully, Gabby is injured.
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First thought when he went off on a stretcher was that sitting at home Gabby must have been thinking I am now guaranteed a starting place in the team for the next few months!!!
Hutton only went over to get a drink!
thankfully, Gabby is injured.
Whilst he's past his best, being glad a player is injured is astonshing really.
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I think the implication was not revelling in a player being hurt, more the relief that Gabby cannot be considered for selection. That's the way I read it anyway.
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maybe RHM will come into the fold now?
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maybe RHM will come into the fold now?
We have to try him. On the plus side he might not feel the pressure as much as a new signing. That's my hope anyway. I hope Hogan has a speedy recovery but to be honest I don't know what we'll miss if we are going to miss him.
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I think RHM is injured or he was but yes, i'd give him a go as well.
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Cruel thing to say but it may be a blessing in disguise for Scott. There are some horrible times ahead for us in the run in. Some players careers may well be broken by them. I wonder what we would have been saying about Richie De Laet if he had been playing through this period.
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First thought when he went off on a stretcher was that sitting at home Gabby must have been thinking I am now guaranteed a starting place in the team for the next few months!!!
Hutton only went over to get a drink!
thankfully, Gabby is injured.
Whilst he's past his best, being glad a player is injured is astonshing really.
Gabby is a freeloading twat, he can do one. He's a grown man who has trousered millions whilst partying around like snoop dogg and about as out of shape as you can get as a professional athlete. He doesn't care, therefore fuck him, I hope he's out for the rest of the season.
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Kozak's out for the season ( forever, then) so we are looking very light up top.
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Kozak is a carthorse anyway, offers nothing, the bloke is finished.
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Nice
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Regarding the comments that we won't be missing much - we've started creating chances again, which is something at least but there's very little supply and we're playing 1 up top and then not having runners from midfield.
Luckily the talk is that it's a sprain, in which case we've got off lightly and it's best case scenario.
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Hogan could be an enormous asset to us if only we could play to his strengths - long, high, hopeful punts will not be exploited by a player who prefers to use his considerable pace with the ball on the ground, through the channels. Seeking to use the full backs to provide the killer pass (or, even worse, the CB) is not a strategy favouring either Hogan or Kodjia.
I hope he gets fit, and I hope that RHM (if / when fit) also gets a meaningful run-out.
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Hogan could be an enormous asset to us if only we could play to his strengths - long, high, hopeful punts will not be exploited by a player who prefers to use his considerable pace with the ball on the ground, through the channels. Seeking to use the full backs to provide the killer pass (or, even worse, the CB) is not a strategy favouring either Hogan or Kodjia.
I hope he gets fit, and I hope that RHM (if / when fit) also gets a meaningful run-out.
Spot on. Same can be said for many of our players I.e. not playing to their strengths.
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He looked in agony last night stamping his left foot down repeatedly while holding his head with his hands.
If he's got away with no ligament damage then that's good news.
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If his foot's just sprained, that is brilliant news. He hasn't contributed what he's clearly worth yet, but if he's able to play at all this season, Bruce has to find a spot for him rather than just an add-on. Kodjia is not going to be prolific enough to get us out of this, while Hogan was at Brentford. Why he's persevered with Kodjia being his main goalscorer I can't work out.
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If his foot's just sprained, that is brilliant news. He hasn't contributed what he's clearly worth yet, but if he's able to play at all this season, Bruce has to find a spot for him rather than just an add-on. Kodjia is not going to be prolific enough to get us out of this, while Hogan was at Brentford. Why he's persevered with Kodjia being his main goalscorer I can't work out.
I would probably argue that buying Hogan in the first place suggests Bruce does not see Kodjia as the long-term main goal threat. The fact that we are still so disjointed and aren't using Hogan to his strengths is probably symptomatic of our current plight, rather than an indication that Bruce expects Kodjia to remain the main goal scorer.
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Kodjia's got a move to a mid-table PL side nailed on imo.
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Everton at a guess.
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Kodjia is nowhere near mid table Premier League standard.
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I humbly beg to differ - he could do a useful job at any number of lower status PL clubs
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I humbly beg to differ - he could do a useful job at any number of lower status PL clubs
Agree, he is far better than Ayew and he got a move to the Prem league albeit not a mid table one at the moment.
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No chance, there's a reason why he's 28 and spent his career in France and at the arse end of the Championship, he doesn't have the awareness to play at a higher level.
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No chance, there's a reason why he's 28 and spent his career in France and at the arse end of the Championship, he doesn't have the awareness to play at a higher level.
I agree with you there - there certainly doesn't appear to be any coaching that has improved him in his time with us.
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One of the reasons he is 28 and has been around the lower sides is that he is training to graduate with an accountancy degree from the Sorbonne. He is not your average booze, bling and birds young footballer.
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He's a Watford player if ever i've seen one.
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I just don't understand two things. One, why get rid of 3 strikers in the transfer window and sign only one (leaving us with Gabby and kids as back up)? And two, why only sign a striker who's main trait is to feed off through balls when we don't play that way and what we needed was someone who could hold the ball up and bring our other forward players into the game (or even play with Hogan in a front two)?
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I just don't understand two things. One, why get rid of 3 strikers in the transfer window and sign only one (leaving us with Gabby and kids as back up)? And two, why only sign a striker who's main trait is to feed off through balls when we don't play that way and what we needed was someone who could hold the ball up and bring our other forward players into the game (or even play with Hogan in a front two)?
because we are Villa and generally seem to have no strategy in our transfer policy (glass half empty). Either that, or there is a clear plan on how we want to play and it is just taking a while for us to bed that down and get the players clicking etc. (glass half full)
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I think the implication was not revelling in a player being hurt, more the relief that Gabby cannot be considered for selection. That's the way I read it anyway.
You read it correct, Brian.
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First thought when he went off on a stretcher was that sitting at home Gabby must have been thinking I am now guaranteed a starting place in the team for the next few months!!!
Hutton only went over to get a drink!
thankfully, Gabby is injured.
Whilst he's past his best, being glad a player is injured is astonshing really.
Who is glad a player is injured? I'm not :)
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Gabby actually done ok in his last match and I wish he was fit and ready for action. We might bloody well need him soon.
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We need that goal scoring phenomenon.
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Gabby and his flapping arms as he runs off shouting his own name.....gabby! Gaahby......gahhhhhbeee......if he I our only hope, we might as well get big mac from forest
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I feel very sorry for Hogan but a striker coming in January to a dysfunctional side like ours was always going to be a massive challenge for him. He is better off out of it till the summer when the club can regroup, hopefully in this league.
In the meantime Bruce needs to concentrate on the shape he needs to persist with. Gabby as the target man (and he was showing some sparks of his capabilities before his injury) in a 4-3-3 or 4-5-1. He is the only striker we have left who can play the kind of role which best suits the way this side needs to set up.
My hope is that Hogan's misfortune will force Bruce's hand - and hope is all I have.
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If that means relying on gabby we're fucked
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Kodjia is the main forward. We are short. I think RHM and Gabby will both play a role when fit.
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Back within 4-5 weeks is what I'm hearing on Twitter
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that would be great news
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Back within 4-5 weeks is what I'm hearing on Twitter
Where you getting this from? Just did a quick scan and all that has been stated so for is the Mail saying, "Scott Hogan could be back within a month if scan results reveal his ankle injury is not as bad as first feared."
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Has there been any official word on Hogan's injury?
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I'd be surprised if we see him again this season.
Hopefully it won't be the sort of injury that eats into pre season otherwise that will mess him up for next year aswell.
Big thing again is how do we get the best out of him. From what I saw v Barnsley he was certainly playing through the middle and Kodjia was out wide where he likes to drift anyway so to me it looks a better fit than McCormack trying to be fitted into the team.
He just needs a goal I think and then he'll be scoring at a decent rate.
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Has there been any official word on Hogan's injury?
Amazed at how long it's taking the club to announce what the injury is and estimated time on the sidelines.
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Has there been any official word on Hogan's injury?
Amazed at how long it's taking the club to announce what the injury is and estimated time on the sidelines.
Maybe they don't know themselves and why does everything have to be announced as soon as possible?
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I'd imagine we will find out at SB press conference tomorrow.
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That Villa Transfers guy on Twitter reckons the scans don't look too bad but no prognosis yet. He was spot on with anything medical related during the January window.
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Has there been any official word on Hogan's injury?
Amazed at how long it's taking the club to announce what the injury is and estimated time on the sidelines.
Isn't it normal practice with that type of injury, have to let some of swelling go down before doing scans?
Not sure that's a Villa problem
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Villa shouldn't shoulder the blame for Mother Nature, just some of her bastard offspring.
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I don't think you can say that, these days, can you ? Is there such a thing any longer. I don't think so.
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Has there been any official word on Hogan's injury?
Amazed at how long it's taking the club to announce what the injury is and estimated time on the sidelines.
Isn't it normal practice with that type of injury, have to let some of swelling go down before doing scans?
Not sure that's a Villa problem
Yeah, you can't do the scans for about 48 hours when there's a lot of swelling.
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It might've been aswell the initial scan was inconclusive and they wait a day to do another one. You get that sometimes with injuries....main thing for me hopefully is this won't be a real serious injury...he was out of 18 months with one at Brentford wasn't he?
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It might've been aswell the initial scan was inconclusive and they wait a day to do another one. You get that sometimes with injuries....main thing for me hopefully is this won't be a real serious injury...he was out of 18 months with one at Brentford wasn't he?
I think he's had 2 serious injuries in the last few seasons.
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It's always a worry as the knees are weakened then with all the operations but guess you take the risk on players who can make a difference...it worked out very well with Sir McGrath and we got a decent 18 months out of Laursen.
I'm not optimistic with Hogan than I was with McCormack....I think Scott will poach goals for us so hopefully he can get fit and chip in with a few before the end of the season so that can give him confidence for next year.
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4-5 weeks I heard yesterday.
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Good news
Injury news: Steve Bruce confirms @ScottHogan_9 injury not as bad as first feared - could be out for 4-5 weeks. #AVFC
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That's still 6 to 8 games
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But not career threatening as originally feared by some. Let's hope he comes back into a much more settled side / vibe and lives up to the hype
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Good news for Scott.
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4-5 weeks I heard yesterday.
We'll have a new manager by then.
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4-5 weeks I heard yesterday.
We'll have a new manager by then.
And have a poll running to determine whether he should be sacked.
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4-5 weeks I heard yesterday.
We'll have a new manager by then.
And have a poll running to determine whether he should be sacked.
Can I be the first to say "Ranieri Out!"
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Can I be the first to say "Ranieri Out!"
If Tone could persuade Ranieri to come to Villa, I say fire Bruce today
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Can I be the first to say "Ranieri Out!"
If Tone could persuade Ranieri to come to Villa, I say fire Bruce today
Because he's been brilliant at motivating an under performing team in a terminal slide?
Right...
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I like Ranieri but I don't think he'd turn us around either.
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he's the guy we should have gone after when MON walked out, but not now.
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he's the guy we should have gone after when MON walked out, but not now.
Who Mark Hughes....have a feeling his time at Stoke is coming to an end.
I reckon with a big budget he'd be tempted to drop down a division.
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he's the guy we should have gone after when MON walked out, but not now.
Who Mark Hughes....have a feeling his time at Stoke is coming to an end.
I reckon with a big budget he'd be tempted to drop down a division.
He'd need a big budget to take all the staff he does to the clubs he takes on. Rumour is he takes 100 or so backroom staff, totally clears out the whole clubs. I rate the bloke, but not sure he'd do any better than Bruce at the moment with what we've got
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he's the guy we should have gone after when MON walked out, but not now.
Who Mark Hughes....have a feeling his time at Stoke is coming to an end.
I reckon with a big budget he'd be tempted to drop down a division.
He'd need a big budget to take all the staff he does to the clubs he takes on. Rumour is he takes 100 or so backroom staff, totally clears out the whole clubs. I rate the bloke, but not sure he'd do any better than Bruce at the moment with what we've got
Good point. Big Fat Sam is much the same, although on a lesser scale. These geezers have lasting trust in all manner of back room staff which is anathema to the likes of us. MoN walked out with an army of less than 8 and we were fucked for a decade and possibly two.
The Tinker Man: Aaaah. Yeeeeeaaaaahhs. Perrrrivate Schulz has goooone rrrrrrong in heees mental tank and I hava referrrrred heeem to our sports psycowlergees.
AVFC employee: Yowm avin a fookin laff aintya ya daft wazzock! Fuckin magick spunge will gerrit done.
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Injury update
but Scottie Hogan is a bit of a plus. He might be just a couple of weeks now, rather than the months which we first though
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Do we know what is up with Hogan and if he'll be ok for Tuesday? Hope his injury isn't anything serious would like him to really bed in and get going for the remainder of this season.
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Apparently nothing serious but a bit of a twinge on the ankle he injured at Newcastle. I really would just wrap him in cotton woll and leave well alone now. What really is the point and benefit of risking further injury?
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Apparently nothing serious but a bit of a twinge on the ankle he injured at Newcastle. I really would just wrap him in cotton woll and leave well alone now. What really is the point and benefit of risking further injury?
Ah good news. Yeah not worth risking causing any lasting damage but I'm sure he would like to kick start his Villa career and get some more goals under his belt (he definitely seemed to enjoy his first) and also gain a better understanding with JK and his new team mates. In his initial interview Scott Hogan seemed pretty keen to get going - and he did seem genuine even to my increasingly sceptical mind. I think he'll be a really big player for us next season (injury permitting).
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Watched him closely in the pre match warm up and when he came on for a short stint (where he barely got a touch) .
He`s a stocky lad and doesn't appear to have much pace - slightly overweight?
It was interesting watching him having shots in on the keeper - he was shocking , poor control, mis-hit most of his shots at goal and didn't look too interested .
Hopefully he will pick up fitness pre-season and get some vital goals for us next year.
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If you watch his goals on YouTube they're mostly good finishes but definitely don't look the sort of goal you'd get in the premier league or involve much skill etc
I hope I'm wrong but I haven't seen anything to suggest he's worth what we paid
With kodjia, frustrating as he can be, you could tell he had something from day one
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Bloody hell give him a chance.
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Bloody hell give him a chance.
Like somebody who is for some of us , class. JG
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Hogan isn't slow.
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Watched him closely in the pre match warm up and when he came on for a short stint (where he barely got a touch) .
He`s a stocky lad and doesn't appear to have much pace - slightly overweight?
It was interesting watching him having shots in on the keeper - he was shocking , poor control, mis-hit most of his shots at goal and didn't look too interested .
Hopefully he will pick up fitness pre-season and get some vital goals for us next year.
I am not too sure about these comments tbh
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If you watch his goals on YouTube they're mostly good finishes but definitely don't look the sort of goal you'd get in the premier league or involve much skill etc
I hope I'm wrong but I haven't seen anything to suggest he's worth what we paid
With kodjia, frustrating as he can be, you could tell he had something from day one
What sort of goals do you get in the premier league?
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He's shown (in this league) he can score with his head and with either foot. If he gets through one on one he can certainly find the back of the net (seemed to get a lot of his goals this way). He set up JK's first goal with a great pass before he went off injured against Norwich I wouldn't write him off just yet.
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If you watch his goals on YouTube they're mostly good finishes but definitely don't look the sort of goal you'd get in the premier league or involve much skill etc
I hope I'm wrong but I haven't seen anything to suggest he's worth what we paid
With kodjia, frustrating as he can be, you could tell he had something from day one
What sort of goals do you get in the premier league?
Not generally ones where you can stand in the middle of he box and be found by a simple through ball. You probably need an outstanding attribute to get a lot of goals: pace, heading ability, finishing ability, skill, power etc
I will very much give him a chance and could easily be wrong, but it's an opinion that's all
Edit: actually I'm being a bit unfair - I thought he did have some moments of real quality in the Forest game. But the pass through to Kodjia against Norwich really wasn't anything special - I'd expect any player to be able to do that. With the exception of gestede and NRC
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I think Hogan shows real goal scoring instincts ... let's give him the chance to prove it.
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Didn't I read that a poster had discussed Hogan with some Brentford fans who opined that whilst he would score all day at Championship level, they didn't think he'd cut it in the Prem?
Let's cross that bridge when we come to it, I hope we can put together a very competitive side for next year and we will then need to think about a major rebuilding project if we go up.
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From what I have seen of him so far, I think he would be far better suited to a formation with a 'number 10' style playmaker. He makes some good runs off the ball, but there isn't really anyone in the side at the moment to put him in. He isn't going to be the sort who you can pump balls up to and expect it to stick.
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Yup, he'd probably do best with Jack in the team. Then again, I said that about McCormack.
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I haven't seen enough of him yet to say what I think of him so far. He's probably still settling in to his new suroundings.
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Looked hopeless today.
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Yup, he'd probably do best with Jack in the team. Then again, I said that about McCormack.
McCormack and jack want to play in the same position
I think at Brentford he did play lone striker with a link man behind
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Looked hopeless today.
No.he didn't, he looked completely isolated and starved of any chances or support.
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I've not really a big fan of forwards who desperately need others to create chances for them.
In the modern game you need your central striker to be so much more than that if you want to advance as a team.
We saw that with Darren Bent. Very good with Young and Downing either side of him but as soon as both left he became a bit of a luxury player as if he wasn't tapping them in it was very much 10 men on the pitch as he hardly touched the ball.
I much prefer forwards like Benteke and Kodjia who can create chances out of nothing with their pace and trickery. Even Gabby when he was bothered could do this.
That said I'm still willing to give Hogan a chance as it's been a bit stop start so far with injuries and having to play understudy to Johnny K. I do think he'll chip in with his fair share next season and be a much better player for the club than McCormack has been.
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If he's going to create chances for himself then he needs the ball.
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No service whatsoever today. Need to play through the channels to benefit him.
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If he's going to create chances for himself then he needs the ball.
He's playing with the same players Kodjia is?
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If he's going to create chances for himself then he needs the ball.
He's playing with the same players Kodjia is?
and they don't create chances for him either.
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If he's going to create chances for himself then he needs the ball.
He's playing with the same players Kodjia is?
and they don't create chances for him either.
The goal on Tuesday was a chance created for Kodjia.
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Hogan is a strange one for me in that I don't really get why Bruce wanted him. He's not quick enough to chase things down and score with breaks from the halfway line and he's not big enough or strong enough to hold it up and make chances for people arriving late. If you're going to play as deep as we do then you need strikers that fit 1 of those. It's not like Bruce has has huge success with 'fox in the box' type strikers before, and certainly not playing 1 of them up front on his own.
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Hogan is a strange one for me in that I don't really get why Bruce wanted him. He's not quick enough to chase things down and score with breaks from the halfway line and he's not big enough or strong enough to hold it up and make chances for people arriving late. If you're going to play as deep as we do then you need strikers that fit 1 of those. It's not like Bruce has has huge success with 'fox in the box' type strikers before, and certainly not playing 1 of them up front on his own.
Yes I worry it was a lazy signing like RDM did with McCormack e.g. just look at how is up there in the championship goal scoring charts and sign them without any real idea how to fit them into the team.
SB has a hit and miss record with strikers at previous clubs but then I suppose most managers are like that.
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Hogan is a strange one for me in that I don't really get why Bruce wanted him. He's not quick enough to chase things down and score with breaks from the halfway line and he's not big enough or strong enough to hold it up and make chances for people arriving late. If you're going to play as deep as we do then you need strikers that fit 1 of those. It's not like Bruce has has huge success with 'fox in the box' type strikers before, and certainly not playing 1 of them up front on his own.
Yes I worry it was a lazy signing like RDM did with McCormack e.g. just look at how is up there in the championship goal scoring charts and sign them without any real idea how to fit them into the team.
SB has a hit and miss record with strikers at previous clubs but then I suppose most managers are like that.
A lot of our transfers feel like that. We've been ripped off for most of them. Only Kod and Chester look like value for money players
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There is an extreme case of verbal diarrea on this thread. A real steaming pile of fly infested horseshit.
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Their does seem to be a lack of paitence with new players nowadays if they don't hit the ground running.
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Mmmm...horseshit
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Their does seem to be a lack of paitence with new players nowadays if they don't hit the ground running.
Absolutely. His time with us has been disrupted by injuries, until he has had an unbroken run of games and the chance to develop a partnership with Kodjia then we cannot form any sort of informed judgement.
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Watched him closely in the pre match warm up and when he came on for a short stint (where he barely got a touch) .
He`s a stocky lad and doesn't appear to have much pace - slightly overweight?
It was interesting watching him having shots in on the keeper - he was shocking , poor control, mis-hit most of his shots at goal and didn't look too interested .
Hopefully he will pick up fitness pre-season and get some vital goals for us next year.
I am not too sure about these comments tbh
These were my observations on the night - I was sitting at the front of the Holte and had a very good view. To be blunt I didn't recognise him at first - I honestly thought he was one of the coaching staff at first, as his technique and physique did not marry up with my idea of a professional footballer.
He sounds like the kind of striker who will thrive on playing alongside another and will not shine as a lone striker.
I hope he comes good but my first observation of him was disappointing.
Yesterday, as Tuesday it sounds like he had little service - not his fault, but surely SB and the coaches must know his strengths by now - however my recollection in front of goal, pre match Tuesday was that he did not appear interested - just my opinion :)
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Their does seem to be a lack of paitence with new players nowadays if they don't hit the ground running.
Absolutely. His time with us has been disrupted by injuries, until he has had an unbroken run of games and the chance to develop a partnership with Kodjia then we cannot form any sort of informed judgement.
Be nice to get the occasional player who just got on with things. We've been told to be patient with loads of players who then just don't amount to anything.
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Their does seem to be a lack of paitence with new players nowadays if they don't hit the ground running.
Absolutely. His time with us has been disrupted by injuries, until he has had an unbroken run of games and the chance to develop a partnership with Kodjia then we cannot form any sort of informed judgement.
Be nice to get the occasional player who just got on with things. We've been told to be patient with loads of players who then just don't amount to anything.
Well Kodjia has and Chester settled in ok.
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There is an extreme case of verbal diarrea on this thread. A real steaming pile of fly infested horseshit.
Please do clarify which posts don't meet your standards and, if you like, share an opinion yourself.
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Their does seem to be a lack of paitence with new players nowadays if they don't hit the ground running.
Absolutely. His time with us has been disrupted by injuries, until he has had an unbroken run of games and the chance to develop a partnership with Kodjia then we cannot form any sort of informed judgement.
I don't think any forward would be able to develop an understanding with Kodjia, he does his own thing. They combined well for Kodjia's goal last week mind but I don't see that being a regular occurrence.
Playing with two up top leaves us very short in midfield particularly if the duo are Jedinak and Lansbury who aren't the most mobile.
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Wasn`t at the game so am unable to comment on his performance - did he miss a sitter?
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No. It was a chance he should have scored, but it wasn't a sitter.
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He does look a poor one footed player with very bad first touch. However I hope we can get something out of him to justify big transfer fee.
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There have been lots of changes in personnel this season and maybe they haven't gelled yet but some have been quite disappointing to say the least.
My comments of the 6th and 9th April about Hogan are based upon a very short observation of him I admit but I wasn't impressed with his body language or ball control.
Lets hope he comes good next season -
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No. It was a chance he should have scored, but it wasn't a sitter.
He is good at possibly one thing and the reason we bought him. He should have at least hit the target. He has so far been a complete and utter waste of a lot of money.
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Nothing like giving the bloke a chance
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Without a doubt need to give me next season to see if he cuts the grade or not. Some substance in stating that it may be difficult to play with Kodjia. There again I am not a qualified football coach so will leave it to the professionals to work that one out.
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Nothing like giving the bloke a chance
For 12 million I'd expect him at least to hit the target. He's a professional footballer, his position is striker. We bought him because he's was good at that for his last club so it's reasonable to expect him to at the very least hit the target bearing in mind it's his forte. He offered nothing else to the team during his stint on the pitch.
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No. It was a chance he should have scored, but it wasn't a sitter.
He is good at possibly one thing and the reason we bought him. He should have at least hit the target. He has so far been a complete and utter waste of a lot of money.
He scored goals for fun in a team that knew how to get the ball from midfield to the forwards quickly, we're never going to be that team under Bruce.
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Nothing like giving the bloke a chance
For 12 million I'd expect him at least to hit the target.
He didn't set the price, his last club did.
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Nothing like giving the bloke a chance
For 12 million I'd expect him at least to hit the target.
He didn't set the price, his last club did.
Even Gareth Bale misses the target sometimes & he cost 80 million
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He does look a poor one footed player with very bad first touch. However I hope we can get something out of him to justify big transfer fee.
He has a good goalscoring record though mate, so obviously has something. Don't you think we should be starting him now?
imilarly, Houriane was excellent for Barnsley and one of the best players in the division, not looks average.
Maybe the manager should play to the players strengths? That said, he should have scored with that chance
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Yes I agree both Hogan and Hourihane should play regularly in their preferred positions so that we can maximise our strength.
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Yes I agree both Hogan and Hourihane should play regularly in their preferred positions so that we can maximise our strength.
Yep, I'd try to find a way to let Hourihane and Lansbury play 10 yards further up the pitch and let Hogan play much closer to Kodjia. Until we give that a go we're not going to see how any of them can settle in.
I'd be tempted to try getting Jedi to sit and then play Hourihane, Lansbury and Grealish as a 3 in front (sort of like a diamond) with Kodjia and Hogan ahead of them. All three are capable of making a yard and getting crosses in so they can drift in to out to find bits of space and create gaps for each other. We'd need to train them as a unit though and that's where any attacking plans fall down because the training either isn't there or isn't effective.
What I can't accept is the idea that the players themselves aren't good enough. Most of the squad we have now are players who've done it this level or better and yet many of them look lost, I just don't see how that isn't the fault of something other than their own abilities.
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I was so impressed with Hogans movement at Forest, we need to find a way to get him and Kodjia together and we need to do it now.
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To be fair to all the signings, they've come in to a team that are set up to play defensively.
Hogan, Lansbury, Hourihane, they are going to look like different players when they are in a set up that prioritises keeping the opposition out rather than attacking as a team.
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I am all for tough defences, but we have some talented players for this division and I am worried that the manager is more about nullifying teams that should really be bullied
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Yes I agree both Hogan and Hourihane should play regularly in their preferred positions so that we can maximise our strength.
Yep, I'd try to find a way to let Hourihane and Lansbury play 10 yards further up the pitch and let Hogan play much closer to Kodjia. Until we give that a go we're not going to see how any of them can settle in.
I'd be tempted to try getting Jedi to sit and then play Hourihane, Lansbury and Grealish as a 3 in front (sort of like a diamond) with Kodjia and Hogan ahead of them. All three are capable of making a yard and getting crosses in so they can drift in to out to find bits of space and create gaps for each other. We'd need to train them as a unit though and that's where any attacking plans fall down because the training either isn't there or isn't effective.
What I can't accept is the idea that the players themselves aren't good enough. Most of the squad we have now are players who've done it this level or better and yet many of them look lost, I just don't see how that isn't the fault of something other than their own abilities.
I agree that those are probably the strengths we should play to, but it does feel like a bit of a headache to fit those 5 in the same team, in their preferred positions - it's, what, either a 3-5-2 or a 4-4-2 diamond? In both of those you need fullbacks to provide width in attacking areas, and I'm not sure I'm ready to complicate things with the fullbacks we've currently got just yet.
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I've got 100% confidence that Hogan will come good and bang in 20 next season (as long as he's starting)
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I've got 100% confidence that Hogan will come good and bang in 20 next season (as long as he's starting)
Me too.
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I have just seen a picture of him on the express and star website, is it me or does he look fat. If so what do our fitness coaches do? Gabby Richards McCormick etc
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I have just seen a picture of him on the express and star website, is it me or does he look fat. If so what do our fitness coaches do? Gabby Richards McCormick etc
I've just been to China and the Mrs's family fed me very well. I've probably put on 10 stone in 2 weeks and largely from eating barbecued meat in huge quantities.
Maybe it's Dr Tony showing some of that famous Chinese hospitality.
Mind you we've had fat bastards in the squad for a few years now. Quite what's gone on here is strange. The squad hasn't been fit for years.
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If he's fat I'm worried.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k4MWkk/aston_villa_v_ipswich_town_sky_bet_championship_villa_park_752x501.jpg) (http://ibb.co/k4MWkk)
easy photo upload (http://imgbb.com/)
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If he's fat I'm worried.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k4MWkk/aston_villa_v_ipswich_town_sky_bet_championship_villa_park_752x501.jpg) (http://ibb.co/k4MWkk)
easy photo upload (http://imgbb.com/)
Put the chips down chubby.
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I have just seen a picture of him on the express and star website, is it me or does he look fat. If so what do our fitness coaches do? Gabby Richards McCormick etc
I think it's just you. He's a fit as a fiddle, and last time Gabby played he was built like a brick shit house without an ounce of fat on him.
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Watching his YouTube videos and his goals, he is obviously a 'fox in the box' type player.
We are going to have to make sure we have a damn sight more action in the 18 yard area, than we are used to, to get the most from him.
The poor bloke must wonder what the fuck he has done.
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
I think Hogan was on his bike at that time trying to catch Gabby. It was Chester, I think that the animal kicked out at as he began his chase to catch Gabby. If he punched Hogan, I didn't see it.
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
presumably because he was available - but you are spot on - if we can't play to his strengths.
The options open to us now would be to sell him which would be just plain stupid
Sell Kodja and get someone in who Hogan can link up too
Buy a third striker and rotate - with the number of games we play in the Championship would be an option.
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I was in the 3rd row of the Trinity and very close to the 'action', Hogan was getting more and more visibly frustrated at the punts up field in his general direction. He was never that kind of striker at Brentford, It's becoming clear that we didn't do extensive homework on him before we signed him and that our management will never play the kind of football needed to get the best out of him. It smacks once again of signing somebody based on there scoring record without thinking if he'd be a fit for the way that the club wants to play.
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I was in the 3rd row of the Trinity and very close to the 'action', Hogan was getting more and more visibly frustrated at the punts up field in his general direction. He was never that kind of striker at Brentford, It's becoming clear that we didn't do extensive homework on him before we signed him and that our management will never play the kind of football needed to get the best out of him. It smacks once again of signing somebody based on there scoring record without thinking if he'd be a fit for the way that the club wants to play.
Yeah, I got that impression from the Upper Holte too. Gabby said something to him when he came on (probably instructions from the bench), and his body language suggested it wasn't well received!
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Didn't play to his strengths which was frustrating as I'd backed him to score
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
He definitely punches James Chester. I wonder if the FA will get involved.....
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
He definitely punches James Chester. I wonder if the FA will get involved.....
More likely that they will ban Chester for running into Robinsons hand and foot
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
presumably because he was available - but you are spot on - if we can't play to his strengths.
The options open to us now would be to sell him which would be just plain stupid
Sell Kodja and get someone in who Hogan can link up too
Buy a third striker and rotate - with the number of games we play in the Championship would be an option.
We need a good CF who can hold the ball up - this would benefit both Hogan and Kodjia.
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I don't think I've seen someone run around as much as he did yesterday. Never stopped.
Didn't actually do anything attacking-wise, but he never stopped chasing them down.
I suppose a defensive striker is Bruce's kinda guy!
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
He definitely punches James Chester. I wonder if the FA will get involved.....
More likely that they will ban Chester for running into Robinsons hand and foot
is the correct answer
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My optimistic view is that Bruce wants to play decent football - he constantly talks about the need to pass the ball better. And that Wil play to hogan's strengths
But in the meantime he's a pragmatist who will sacrifice style for solidity
Whether he can actually deliver a quality team is another question
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Does Paul Robinson punch Hogan after we score? Hard to tell on the replay.
He definitely punches James Chester. I wonder if the FA will get involved.....
More likely that they will ban Chester for running into Robinsons hand and foot
Knowing the FA they'll probably give Kodjia a 6 month ban for it.
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We need a decent wide player in the summer.
Adomah is hit and miss and has gone off the boil massively lately so we practically have nothing on the flanks with Green injured and still inexperienced at this level.
Need to make a similar statement signing to Newcastle signing Matt Ritchie last summer.
Do that and I imagine Hogan will start getting on the end of some crosses like he did with his goal at Wigan.
Play the same way though and I fail to see how he's going to score consistently. With the negative football a forward like Kodjia with his tricks and unpredictability is really the only sort of forward who can do anything.
That's why I think Bruce needs a pre season before he can be properly judged. No pressure of points but friendlies and trainings to get a style of player that gets both strikers in the game.
If it's still happening start of next season, then I'd imagine the owner would be pretty unhappy his big investment isn't scoring.
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
I'm still wondering why we paid a considerable amount of obey for a striker who is totally not suited to the way we play. I sit in the North Stand and watch him quite closely, and he makes some really good runs which are often totally wasted. He needs to be in a side where the ball is kept on the floor and he has got players behind him who can thread passes through for him. We don't play that way and would be far better off with a more physical striker up there, who will play as a target man and will hold the ball up.
Having a striker like that up there would help the likes of Lansbury and Hourihane as well.
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We need a decent wide player in the summer.
Adomah is hit and miss and has gone off the boil massively lately so we practically have nothing on the flanks with Green injured and still inexperienced at this level.
Need to make a similar statement signing to Newcastle signing Matt Ritchie last summer.
Agree about a wide man and would prefer a naturally left sided one. A player like that along with Adomah, Green, Grealish and maybe Bacuna would give us some options.
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My optimistic view is that Bruce wants to play decent football - he constantly talks about the need to pass the ball better. And that Wil play to hogan's strengths
But in the meantime he's a pragmatist who will sacrifice style for solidity
This is the last grain of hope that we can all hold on to, and Bruce will have the summer to fine tune the squad to his liking and get things right down at BMH. He walked into a right shitfest with the initial aim of moving us away from the relegation zone and further up the table, so with that now achieved, hopefully he can utilise the players he has bought in the manner in which they should be played...if he can't get them performing and getting results within the first couple of months, then we will all know he's definitely not the right man for the job and will suffer his turgid football until Dr X calls time on his tenure.
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My optimistic view is that Bruce wants to play decent football - he constantly talks about the need to pass the ball better. And that Wil play to hogan's strengths
But in the meantime he's a pragmatist who will sacrifice style for solidity
This is the last grain of hope that we can all hold on to, and Bruce will have the summer to fine tune the squad to his liking and get things right down at BMH. He walked into a right shitfest with the initial aim of moving us away from the relegation zone and further up the table, so with that now achieved, hopefully he can utilise the players he has bought in the manner in which they should be played...if he can't get them performing and getting results within the first couple of months, then we will all know he's definitely not the right man for the job and will suffer his turgid football until Dr X calls time on his tenure.
With Baker and Jedinak in the spine of the side, we are never going to be a build from the back type of side. We are going to be direct and yet we are missing the type of striker needed to play that style effectively.
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We need width yes, but also pace. Half of the problem with us going forward is that take Kodjia out and we're very much a flat track team. We can't counter or attack with any tempo. i also think the team is a bit unbalanced. Albert needs to be replaced when we go up but is okay as a sub for what we need next season.
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
I'm still wondering why we paid a considerable amount of obey for a striker who is totally not suited to the way we play. I sit in the North Stand and watch him quite closely, and he makes some really good runs which are often totally wasted. He needs to be in a side where the ball is kept on the floor and he has got players behind him who can thread passes through for him. We don't play that way and would be far better off with a more physical striker up there, who will play as a target man and will hold the ball up.
Having a striker like that up there would help the likes of Lansbury and Hourihane as well.
I wouldn't be surprised to see us take Murphy off Newcastle's hands. They bought him for this league and will be looking to upgrade now they are promoted.
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Hogan will play better with a target man in the side.
Hogan and his MF colleagues should be given video footage of the way that Vardy, David Villa, Kenny Dalglish and Brian Little used to play as smaller, nippier forwards.
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Brady is completely unlike any of those others!
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We need three things; pace, pace and pace.
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We had Pace but we let him go to Sheffield United where he became a legend.
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We had Pace but we let him go to Sheffield United where he became a legend.
Ian?
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Why did we buy him? We won't play it to his feet so he's wasted.
I'm still wondering why we paid a considerable amount of obey for a striker who is totally not suited to the way we play. I sit in the North Stand and watch him quite closely, and he makes some really good runs which are often totally wasted. He needs to be in a side where the ball is kept on the floor and he has got players behind him who can thread passes through for him. We don't play that way and would be far better off with a more physical striker up there, who will play as a target man and will hold the ball up.
Having a striker like that up there would help the likes of Lansbury and Hourihane as well.
I wouldn't be surprised to see us take Murphy off Newcastle's hands. They bought him for this league and will be looking to upgrade now they are promoted.
Yup, that would make a good deal of sense.
Based on our current M.O though, I expect us to throw £15m a pop at Chris Wood, Tammy Abraham and Glenn Murray.
It's what we do, after all.
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We had Pace but we let him go to Sheffield United where he became a legend.
Ian?
Derek, always seemed to score against us for Sheffield Utd.
I can remember things from that far back, but not from yesterday.
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We had Pace but we let him go to Sheffield United where he became a legend.
Ian?
Derek, always seemed to score against us for Sheffield Utd.
I can remember things from that far back, but not from yesterday.
Aahhh, I was meaning Ian Hamilton. :-[
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I'm wondering if it's more one from Hogan or Jimmy Danger up front rather than both.
Hogan looks decent up by himself with player like Grealish or Lansbury behind .
Similar Jk with adomah supporting or grealish
Elmo providing ammunition for Hogan looks promising so I wondering how both hogie and kodjia fit.
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Yes they won't have had a chance to work on a partnership at all in pre season which is a potential problem
I reckon they may play together as split strikers running the channels sometimes
Kodjia may play wide sometimes
We may rotate between them as Newcastle did last year - it's a long season
But I don't really know
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Yes they won't have had a chance to work on a partnership at all in pre season which is a potential problem
I reckon they may play together as split strikers running the channels sometimes
Kodjia may play wide sometimes
We may rotate between them as Newcastle did last year - it's a long season
But I don't really know
I still think we might see a forward coming in before the window "slams shut" (Jim White, Sky Sports). I can't see Kodjia featuring too much in the early part of the season, so the onus will be very much on Hogan.
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Yes they won't have had a chance to work on a partnership at all in pre season which is a potential problem
I reckon they may play together as split strikers running the channels sometimes
Kodjia may play wide sometimes
We may rotate between them as Newcastle did last year - it's a long season
But I don't really know
I still think we might a forward coming in before the window "slams shut" (Jim White, Sky Sports). I can't see Kodjia featuring too much in the early part of the season, so the onus will be very much on Hogan.
You forgot the goal machine. Gabriel.
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If the onus will be on Hogan the anus will be on Gabby.
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If the onus will be on Hogan the anus will be on Gabby.
Our best sphincter forward, in my opinion.
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He's not a good outlet.
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Kodjia is back in training isn't he? I'm hoping he might make the bench at least pretty soon
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Yes they won't have had a chance to work on a partnership at all in pre season which is a potential problem
I reckon they may play together as split strikers running the channels sometimes
Kodjia may play wide sometimes
We may rotate between them as Newcastle did last year - it's a long season
But I don't really know
I still think we might a forward coming in before the window "slams shut" (Jim White, Sky Sports). I can't see Kodjia featuring too much in the early part of the season, so the onus will be very much on Hogan.
You forgot the goal machine. Gabriel.
The one you rated at £15 million plus a couple of years ago?
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If the onus will be on Hogan the anus will be on Gabby.
Our best sphincter forward, in my opinion.
Wasn't he once linked with Arsenal?
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He's not a good outlet.
.....good movement though
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If the onus will be on Hogan the anus will be on Gabby.
Will he play in the hole?
[Cue MMc, late of Wolves.]
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(https://media.balls.ie/uploads/2014/01/york.gif)
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25minutes, that's a bit slow.
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25minutes, that's a bit slow.
Whilst he's been a great servant, it looks like age is catching up with him and it may be time to move him on, bring in some fresh gif blood.
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If the onus will be on Hogan the anus will be on Gabby.
Then The Vertigo will kick in and he will be off to Vegas to recuperate.
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This is beginning to look like a very poor signing.
Not quick, easily moved off the ball, not great in the air,poor touch and looks completely lost.
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I'm not saying he's great by any means but I do think he's wasted in our team. He's shown he can score goals in this league and I think he's too intelligent for the players around him. He was playing with a good, creative player like Jota and now he's playing with Gabby and Bacuna who haven't got a brain cell between them.
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Agreed.
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Hogan moved as well as a Subbuteo player all game.
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I'm not saying he's great by any means but I do think he's wasted in our team. He's shown he can score goals in this league and I think he's too intelligent for the players around him. He was playing with a good, creative player like Jota and now he's playing with Gabby and Bacuna who haven't got a brain cell between them.
Like that Carlos Gill fella?
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Almost scored a great goal and a lovely touch for gabby's chance
But I agree he struggles to latch into a lot of balls and I do wonder if it will ever seem the right fit
Luckily we have Kodjia
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I'm not saying he's great by any means but I do think he's wasted in our team. He's shown he can score goals in this league and I think he's too intelligent for the players around him. He was playing with a good, creative player like Jota and now he's playing with Gabby and Bacuna who haven't got a brain cell between them.
Should he really look so out of his depth though?
I keep hearing what he did at Branford, maybe he is a one trick pony that can only function in a certain set up.
I do not think that we are going to build that set up around him though.
So you have to ask why the fuck did we spend all that money on him?
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I'm not saying he's great by any means but I do think he's wasted in our team. He's shown he can score goals in this league and I think he's too intelligent for the players around him. He was playing with a good, creative player like Jota and now he's playing with Gabby and Bacuna who haven't got a brain cell between them.
Should he really look so out of his depth though?
I keep hearing what he did at Branford, maybe he is a one trick pony that can only function in a certain set up.
I do not think that we are going to build that set up around him though.
So you have to ask why the fuck did we spend all that money on him?
In answer to your last question, I have no idea. Bruce knows his style of play is that of a dinosaur and it won't change so I don't know why he thought Hogan would suit it. When we played Brentford away they ripped us apart and you could easily see how Hogan would fit into that side.
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No movement hogan - perhaps if he suddenly becomes Roy race over night then we are talking.
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I thought he did alright.
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I'm not saying he's great by any means but I do think he's wasted in our team. He's shown he can score goals in this league and I think he's too intelligent for the players around him. He was playing with a good, creative player like Jota and now he's playing with Gabby and Bacuna who haven't got a brain cell between them.
Brentford only got Jota back in January so someone else was setting it up for him.
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By Christ he's slow. I'm sure that Steve Bruce did his homework on him that extended to more than just one good half a season with Brentofrd, but he looks poor.
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Good first half and almost scored a great goal
Poor second
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I thought he was good in the first half but unsurprisingly once we did nothing in the second half he disappeared.
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We have no idea how to play any semblance of attacking football - he was running his heart out, no help from the midfield.
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We have no idea how to play any semblance of attacking football - he was running his heart out, no help from the midfield.
Apart from the 5 brilliant chances you mean?
Sorry but it's really doing my head in. It wasn't great today. It wasn't appalling. But everyone has to reach to extremes
How many chances do you think Wednesday, or Boro, or readings created today. I bet you hands down it wasn't as many as us
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I like the look of him. He's not static, he doesn't wait for the ball to come to him, he chases through balls. He should have maybe put one one of his chances away today mind, but the goals will come.
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I like the look of him. He's not static, he doesn't wait for the ball to come to him, he chases through balls. He should have maybe put one one of his chances away today mind, but the goals will come.
Totally agree with this. I thought that today, for the first time, we played to his strengths and his ability began to shine through. Confidence is a massive thing to forwards so I suspect he will improve with a goal or two under his belt.
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No movement hogan - perhaps if he suddenly becomes Roy race over night then we are talking.
No movement? Did you watch the game? He moved but the brains of other players did not keep up
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Much more like it from him today than what he showed last season. Get up and running with a goal or two against Colchester and see how he flies.
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I like the look of him. He's not static, he doesn't wait for the ball to come to him, he chases through balls. He should have maybe put one one of his chances away today mind, but the goals will come.
Yep really odd for people to say he demonstrated no movement. He was constantly on the shoulder and trying to find space. I can think of serveral clever runs he made, one of which nearly presented a chance for Gabby but for a great last ditch tackle.
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I'm not a fan, his touch is abysmal.
He's not had too many chances made for him but I'm fearful we have bought a pup.
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You not see his touch when he beat a couple of players in the area and but for an excellent save from McGregor he would have scored an excellent goal.
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He won't complement Kodjia and isn't an option to play up top by himself. Bruce claimed he had scouted him since his Rochdale days but I severely doubt it.
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You not see his touch when he beat a couple of players in the area and but for an excellent save from McGregor he would have scored an excellent goal.
Yes he did well there, his toUch under any kind of pressure is poor though.
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He won't complement Kodjia and isn't an option to play up top by himself. Bruce claimed he had scouted him since his Rochdale days but I severely doubt it.
Oh that's that then.
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We have no idea how to play any semblance of attacking football - he was running his heart out, no help from the midfield.
Apart from the 5 brilliant chances you mean?
Sorry but it's really doing my head in. It wasn't great today. It wasn't appalling. But everyone has to reach to extremes
How many chances do you think Wednesday, or Boro, or readings created today. I bet you hands down it wasn't as many as us
Then it's even more appalling that we only scored one. You appear to be at the other extreme.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Sorry Olaf, can't agree with that. A couple of nice touches to nearly set himself up in the first half, but I thought he was increasingly ineffective as the game went on. I accept it's not all his fault as we don't play to his strengths, but there is little point in playing him if we are going to continue to play the way we did today,
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Sorry Olaf, can't agree with that. A couple of nice touches to nearly set himself up in the first half, but I thought he was increasingly ineffective as the game went on. I accept it's not all his fault as we don't play to his strengths, but there is little point in playing him if we are going to continue to play the way we did today,
I half-agree with both of you about today. But in general there seems to be a collective shrug of the shoulder and 'Bruce can't have seen him at Brentford or he would't have bought him' vibe around this. We're talking about the most expensive player Bruce has ever bought. It's madness. Hogan's a good player, but to put him in a Bruce side is like dousing a Quail's egg in salad cream to make your Uncle Kevin's sandwiches to take to work on his pig farm in the winter. Bruce has wasted £15m of his employer's money (and potentially ruined a good player's career). It's practically gross misconduct.
We could've got Akinfenwe for a couple of pork pies and a handjob* and he'd have contributed way more under this manager.
*I know that for a fact.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Sorry Olaf, can't agree with that. A couple of nice touches to nearly set himself up in the first half, but I thought he was increasingly ineffective as the game went on. I accept it's not all his fault as we don't play to his strengths, but there is little point in playing him if we are going to continue to play the way we did today,
I half-agree with both of you about today. But in general there seems to be a collective shrug of the shoulder and 'Bruce can't have seen him at Brentford or he would't have bought him' vibe around this. We're talking about the most expensive player Bruce has ever bought. It's madness. Hogan's a good player, but to put him in a Bruce side is like dousing a Quail's egg in salad cream to make your Uncle Kevin's sandwiches to take to work on his pig farm in the winter. Bruce has wasted £15m of his employer's money (and potentially ruined a good player's career). It's practically gross misconduct.
We could've got Akinfenwe for a couple of pork pies and a handjob* and he'd have contributed way more under this manager.
*I know that for a fact.
I agree, I still can't quite work out why he spent so much money on him, as he wasn't the type of striker we needed last season and still isn't this one. That seemed to be the general way of doing things last season though - sign players who have 'done a job' in the division without any real plan on how they will fit in to the side or way of playing.
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If he comes good I will be the first to hold my hands up and apologize but I've seen nothing in Hogan to suggest he'll be a success at Villa.
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I will do the same. Seen nothing at all to inspire confidence in him.
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Thought he looked ok tbh.
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Bruce bought him because he'd scored a fuckload of goals so he thought "he must be good".
I thought he was OK yesterday and if one of his half-chances goes in we win the game and everyone says he's turned a corner. Such is life.
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When Lansbury was getting close first half, he looked effective and should have had a brace.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Sorry Olaf, can't agree with that. A couple of nice touches to nearly set himself up in the first half, but I thought he was increasingly ineffective as the game went on. I accept it's not all his fault as we don't play to his strengths, but there is little point in playing him if we are going to continue to play the way we did today,
I half-agree with both of you about today. But in general there seems to be a collective shrug of the shoulder and 'Bruce can't have seen him at Brentford or he would't have bought him' vibe around this. We're talking about the most expensive player Bruce has ever bought. It's madness. Hogan's a good player, but to put him in a Bruce side is like dousing a Quail's egg in salad cream to make your Uncle Kevin's sandwiches to take to work on his pig farm in the winter. Bruce has wasted £15m of his employer's money (and potentially ruined a good player's career). It's practically gross misconduct.
We could've got Akinfenwe for a couple of pork pies and a handjob* and he'd have contributed way more under this manager.
*I know that for a fact.
But a handjob is all the butchery brings cos fame isn't easy as him
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Did he do that step-over deliberately? If so, that is bloody impressive anticipation. Hendrie used to do it to good effect on occasion back in the day (for Dion and JPA in particular).
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I will do the same. Seen nothing at all to inspire confidence in him.
You were saying he would score 25 goals last week.
It bemuses me people are saying he's going to score 20-25 as I've seen little to suggest that. At best hopefully he can get about 10-15 with some of them being winning goals so still contributing positively but not hitting the heights Kodjia will when he gets back.
SB bringing Hogan in is very similar to McCormack e.g. a manager lazily looking at the championship scoring charts, picking one of the leading scorers and thinking they could just do the same in this team without actually analyzing how he actually scored the goals and what positions he took up.
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Hogan will only ever be effective in a front two, and with someone to play off. Playing him on his own will only serve to knacker his confidence.
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Hogan will only ever be effective in a front two, and with someone to play off. Playing him on his own will only serve to knacker his confidence.
Kodjia isn't interested in playing in a front two so there's your problem when he's fit again.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Did he do that step-over deliberately? If so, that is bloody impressive anticipation. Hendrie used to do it to good effect on occasion back in the day (for Dion and JPA in particular).
Yes watching from middle of upper North how I saw it and watch his reaction as soon as he did that.
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I said last week that if the balls were put to him low and hard and frequently he could score 25 goals a season. Because I have never seen him given the ball low and hard and frequently in the box (other than the excellent goal he scored in Germany) I have never seen him in the flesh justify the money spent on him.
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Hogan was very good today. Gabby should have squared it to him when clean through and he superbly stepped over to let the ball to Gabby to score. I think he needs to be more greedy.
Sorry Olaf, can't agree with that. A couple of nice touches to nearly set himself up in the first half, but I thought he was increasingly ineffective as the game went on. I accept it's not all his fault as we don't play to his strengths, but there is little point in playing him if we are going to continue to play the way we did today,
I half-agree with both of you about today. But in general there seems to be a collective shrug of the shoulder and 'Bruce can't have seen him at Brentford or he would't have bought him' vibe around this. We're talking about the most expensive player Bruce has ever bought. It's madness. Hogan's a good player, but to put him in a Bruce side is like dousing a Quail's egg in salad cream to make your Uncle Kevin's sandwiches to take to work on his pig farm in the winter. Bruce has wasted £15m of his employer's money (and potentially ruined a good player's career). It's practically gross misconduct.
We could've got Akinfenwe for a couple of pork pies and a handjob* and he'd have contributed way more under this manager.
*I know that for a fact.
But a handjob is all the butchery brings cos fame isn't easy as him
I can't tell you how much I enjoyed that reference. Come rescue, rescue me.
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I said last week that if the balls were put to him low and hard and frequently he could score 25 goals a season. Because I have never seen him given the ball low and hard and frequently in the box (other than the excellent goal he scored in Germany) I have never seen him in the flesh justify the money spent on him.
As I've said before I'm not convinced that Bruce picked Hogan or Hourihane, I just don't see how either of them fit into how he plays.
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I said last week that if the balls were put to him low and hard and frequently he could score 25 goals a season. Because I have never seen him given the ball low and hard and frequently in the box (other than the excellent goal he scored in Germany) I have never seen him in the flesh justify the money spent on him.
As I've said before I'm not convinced that Bruce picked Hogan or Hourihane, I just don't see how either of them fit into how he plays.
Are you suggesting someone else signed them, like Xia perhaps?
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Paul McGrath valued his performance yesterday tweeting:
Brilliant Scott Hogan ran yourself into the ground great example #Respect.
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He did. He will, however, not succeed until we do something about the fact that every one (literally all) of our attacking midfield/wide attackers/secondary strikers are crap. Grealish, Bacuna and Lansbury because they don't apply themselves and are half arsed and Green, Adomah, Hourahane and Bjarnnason because they don't have the quality. What Onomah and Elhomody do remains to be seen...
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He did. He will, however, not succeed until we do something about the fact that every one (literally all) of our attacking midfield/wide attackers/secondary strikers are crap. Grealish, Bacuna and Lansbury because they don't apply themselves and are half arsed and Green, Adomah, Hourahane and Bjarnnason because they don't have the quality. What Onomah and Elhomody do remains to be seen...
What's this piss about not having the quality? One thing to say they haven't played well at Villa so far, but Adomah was good enough to be first-choice at a team that actually got promoted from this league, and Hourihane was the best midfielder in this league until he signed for us, you don't set up 10 goals in half a season if you don't have the requisite quality. And Green's played half a dozen games in the first team and he's 19 years old.
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I said last week that if the balls were put to him low and hard and frequently he could score 25 goals a season. Because I have never seen him given the ball low and hard and frequently in the box (other than the excellent goal he scored in Germany) I have never seen him in the flesh justify the money spent on him.
As I've said before I'm not convinced that Bruce picked Hogan or Hourihane, I just don't see how either of them fit into how he plays.
Are you suggesting someone else signed them, like Xia perhaps?
Round at a guess. I might be wrong but I honestly don't think Bruce has watched them both play and thought they're exactly the players I need to get promotion because he seemingly has no idea how to play them.
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Bruce said when he signed him that he'd watched him at Rochdale and Brentford.
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Bruce said when he signed him that he'd watched him at Rochdale and Brentford.
Which i don't believe because if that's true then he wouldn't have signed him to play the role he is.
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Bruce is a liar then.
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He did. He will, however, not succeed until we do something about the fact that every one (literally all) of our attacking midfield/wide attackers/secondary strikers are crap. Grealish, Bacuna and Lansbury because they don't apply themselves and are half arsed and Green, Adomah, Hourahane and Bjarnnason because they don't have the quality. What Onomah and Elhomody do remains to be seen...
What's this piss about not having the quality? One thing to say they haven't played well at Villa so far, but Adomah was good enough to be first-choice at a team that actually got promoted from this league, and Hourihane was the best midfielder in this league until he signed for us, you don't set up 10 goals in half a season if you don't have the requisite quality. And Green's played half a dozen games in the first team and he's 19 years old.
What a fucking half cocked, bag of shite argument that is. I couldn't give a shite what they did before they came here, they've not done it for us, that's all I'm bothered about. So, what you're saying is, every signing we've made (or anyone else in the history of football for that matter) throughout our history who had let's say 50 good games for someone else, but then not done it for their new club must really be a quality player and should be considered so for the rest of their career? So you would consider that because Tony Cascarino scored countless goals for Millwall it was unfair to describe him as a cart horse after he joined us? What about Mark Kinsella, starred in a World Cup for Ireland and looked like a park player after he came here? Bosko Balaban was a bright young prospect, must have had something before we signed him. I could go on and on...
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Bruce is a liar then.
Or he chucks players together and hope it works out as in " me I don't do tactics".
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Bruce is a liar then.
Pretty much everyone accepts that when Sherwood said similar things about players only to change his mind that he was lying so why can't Bruce be.
To flip it round though do you think Hogan fits in with how we're playing and do you think he's ever been played in this setup before?
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Bruce said when he signed him that he'd watched him at Rochdale and Brentford.
Which i don't believe because if that's true then he wouldn't have signed him to play the role he is.
Bruce specifically said he'd watched him at Rochdale, came close to signing him, regretted not doing so and didn't want to make that mistake again.
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He did. He will, however, not succeed until we do something about the fact that every one (literally all) of our attacking midfield/wide attackers/secondary strikers are crap. Grealish, Bacuna and Lansbury because they don't apply themselves and are half arsed and Green, Adomah, Hourahane and Bjarnnason because they don't have the quality. What Onomah and Elhomody do remains to be seen...
What's this piss about not having the quality? One thing to say they haven't played well at Villa so far, but Adomah was good enough to be first-choice at a team that actually got promoted from this league, and Hourihane was the best midfielder in this league until he signed for us, you don't set up 10 goals in half a season if you don't have the requisite quality. And Green's played half a dozen games in the first team and he's 19 years old.
What a fucking half cocked, bag of shite argument that is. I couldn't give a shite what they did before they came here, they've not done it for us, that's all I'm bothered about. So, what you're saying is, every signing we've made (or anyone else in the history of football for that matter) throughout our history who had let's say 50 good games for someone else, but then not done it for their new club must really be a quality player and should be considered so for the rest of their career? So you would consider that because Tony Cascarino scored countless goals for Millwall it was unfair to describe him as a cart horse after he joined us? What about Mark Kinsella, starred in a World Cup for Ireland and looked like a park player after he came here? Bosko Balaban was a bright young prospect, must have had something before we signed him. I could go on and on...
Think you should take a look in the mirror at your own argument, mate.
I'm saying it's silly to suggest so conclusively that a player lacks the requisite quality and will continue to lack that quality just because they've played a stretch of ordinary games, and generally not been helped by the circumstances. Been a bit longer than that with Adomah, but he still literally set up more goals than anyone else in the league last season except for Hourihane, the other fella that's been mentioned. Assists aren't everything but, again, you'd think someone short of the requisite quality wouldn't even sniff those kinds of numbers.
Those examples you've picked, you're working with the benefit of hindsight.
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I like him. I think he'll end up our top scorer.
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I thought he was alright yesterday, worked very hard and didn't quite get the break. Couple of goals and I think he'll do well this season.
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Bruce is a liar then.
Pretty much everyone accepts that when Sherwood said similar things about players only to change his mind that he was lying so why can't Bruce be.
To flip it round though do you think Hogan fits in with how we're playing and do you think he's ever been played in this setup before?
We created chances for him first half. The system worked very well.
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Bruce is a liar then.
Pretty much everyone accepts that when Sherwood said similar things about players only to change his mind that he was lying so why can't Bruce be.
To flip it round though do you think Hogan fits in with how we're playing and do you think he's ever been played in this setup before?
We created chances for him first half. The system worked very well.
we created 1 chance for him and he created 1 from nothing for himself which is one of the best games he's had for us, what about the other 13 games he's played for us where he's had about 5 decent chances?
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How we come into this season and what we do is what holds relevance. We had a system and a means of attacking which looked effective.
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How we come into this season and what we do is what holds relevance. We had a system and a means of attacking which looked effective.
For about 35-40 minutes.
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How we come into this season and what we do is what holds relevance. We had a system and a means of attacking which looked effective.
For about 35-40 minutes.
And then the opposition decided to play.
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Then we wrestled back control and should have won it. We cannot afford to make a habit of dropping points.
We need to beat Cardiff. The biggest issue last season was the away form. 4 points are necessary from the next two.
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Then we wrestled back control and should have won it. We cannot afford to make a habit of dropping points.
We need to beat Cardiff. The biggest issue last season was the away form. 4 points are necessary from the next two.
The 'should have won it' bit is where we disagree. Green missed a very good chance, I don't deny that, but that doesn't mean we should've won, it means we had a chance to retake the lead and we missed it. Just as they had a very good chance to equalise before half time and they missed it.
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Cardiff will be very tough, looks like another draw to me as Warnock will make it another war of attrition although we should have the 11 to cope with that this time.
More fancy us to beat Reading as we usually do well at the Madjeski and Norwich have a terrible record at Villa Park so that's another very winnable game.
I wanted 11 points from our first 5 games to spend a statement so we're struggling to do that if we don't win on Saturday. Not good dropping points in winnable home games.
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Injured again! Is he another expensive injury prone dud? Seems to have a weak ankle.....not encouraging.
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Works hard, has talent and seems to have the right attitude.
Maybe we don't play to his preferred style of play but fuck me the lads made of glass.
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I like him. I think he'll end up our top scorer.
With 3 goals
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Awful signing.
Complete waste of money.
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I was worried that we wouldn't be able to replace Kozak.
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Do we know what the extent of the injury is yet?
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He certainly has the air of a luckless forward. Hitting the keeper constantly when one-on-one, stretching to and nearly getting his toe on crosses and always getting injured when he starts to get a run of starts.
Don't really think it's going to happen for him here but still time to prove me wrong.
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I like him. I think he can do very well after Bruce is gone and he is played correctly. Agree about his injuries though, I do hope this is a short term one.
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He certainly has the air of a luckless forward. Hitting the keeper constantly when one-on-one, stretching to and nearly getting his toe on crosses and always getting injured when he starts to get a run of starts.
Don't really think it's going to happen for him here but still time to prove me wrong.
Someone compared him last season to Gary Penrice and it's a comparison that has really stuck with me. He works hard but has absolutely no impact on the game at all.
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Hogan looked pretty good at Brentford comes to B6 and seems to have forgotten everything he knows. Meanwhile I'm watching Scott Sinclair playing for Celtic and slotting away goals in the Champions league. He's doing the same as Hogan in reverse. Wtf happens to players when they come to the Villa?
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I think Hogan depends more on the team around him than most strikers. I imagine he'll be really effective in a team that actually passes the ball. It seems Bruce just looked at goals scored and signed him on that rather than thinking he may need the right service around him. Kodjia only gets away with it under Bruce because he's such a good individual talent.
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I think Hogan depends more on the team around him than most strikers. I imagine he'll be really effective in a team that actually passes the ball. It seems Bruce just looked at goals scored and signed him on that rather than thinking he may need the right service around him. Kodjia only gets away with it under Bruce because he's such a good individual talent.
See also Di Matteo and McCormack.
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I'm still hoping he will come good, but we massively overpaid for him. The fact that we out bid West Ham for him, combined with his patchy fitness record made me nervous about it at the time. When you see that Mounié cost Huddersfield less having scored a similar number of goals to Mbappe and Balotelli in Ligue 1, emphasises it further.
Barry Glendenning said last season that it was unsurprising that Sunderland had such a high wage bill, and had overpaid for so many of their squad, because they had for a number of years been buying from a position of weakness. They often signed players in the January window to help a relegation fight. I think we are in the same situation - and it's a difficult tail spin to get out of.
Scott Hogan for £12m in January doesn't form part of a sustainable long term recruitment process.
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Hogan looked pretty good at Brentford comes to B6 and seems to have forgotten everything he knows. Meanwhile I'm watching Scott Sinclair playing for Celtic and slotting away goals in the Champions league. He's doing the same as Hogan in reverse. Wtf happens to players when they come to the Villa?
I think there might be a psychological thing around the club now because failure is so ingrained, it doesn't matter who the manager/players/board are, they've been replaced several times, we've been so bad for so long that minor setbacks become big ones because you sense the self doubt and negativity straight away. I knew we needed to get off to a good start immediately but as soon as we conceded the equaliser in the first game and dropped points you could feel the pessimism again, 'only' being 2 points off, then four and now eight, one draw becomes two defeats. We regularly go on long runs of defeats, we cannot bounce back and snap out of it quickly enough.
Hopefully other posters know what I mean.
I wouldn't mind seeing Dr. Steve Peters working with the club to be honest.
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Hogan looked pretty good at Brentford comes to B6 and seems to have forgotten everything he knows. Meanwhile I'm watching Scott Sinclair playing for Celtic and slotting away goals in the Champions league. He's doing the same as Hogan in reverse. Wtf happens to players when they come to the Villa?
I think there might be a psychological thing around the club now because failure is so ingrained, it doesn't matter who the manager/players/board are, they've been replaced several times, we've been so bad for so long that minor setbacks become big ones because you sense the self doubt and negativity straight away. I knew we needed to get off to a good start immediately but as soon as we conceded the equaliser in the first game and dropped points you could feel the pessimism again, 'only' being 2 points off, then four and now eight, one draw becomes two defeats. We regularly go on long runs of defeats, we cannot bounce back and snap out of it quickly enough.
Hopefully other posters know what I mean.
I wouldn't mind seeing Dr. Steve Peters working with the club to be honest.
It's a shame Dr. Harold Shipman can't work his magic on a few of them.
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I just don't think he fancies it. His tracking was half arsed at best the other night.
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I just don't think he fancies it. His tracking was half arsed at best the other night.
That might be because he was probably trying to run off the tackle which eventually forced him to go off.
I like him, he never stops running and with the right service, he'd be very useful.
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I agree with Smirker that it has become a psychological issue. Many of us posted through the summer that the first half dozen games of this season were among the most important and pivotal games in the history of the club. It was of paramount importance that the focus of the manager and the coaches was on physical, tactical and mental readiness. Instead we had the rolling circus of the completely pointless Terry signing with an undercard of knee jerk equally unnecessary transfers like buying in a worn out defensive midfielder with attitude we did not need and selling a loyal, perfectly adequate championship back up central defender we did need. We took our eye off the ball.
The only proven way to overcome the problems posed by the players who are spooked by lack of confidence or lack of luck or the magnitude of expectations at a club of our size is to play young, fresh players whose youth and appetite for the game make them oblivious to everything but the game and the ball at their feet. But Bruce does not do youth. He wants gnarled old sweats to slug out one nils.
I very much suspect, know even, that there is at Villa what in the police is called a canteen culture. Since Colchester, Cardiff and Reading the canteen culture has been at its most dominant. The old sweats, Bruce, Wyness, Round, Calderwood and Clemence have been in a huddle, ostensibly seeking on pitch improvement but in reality presenting some sort of fire wall between themselves, the owner and the fans. In short, their jobs are the issue, not us being bottom of the second division.
If Bruce is allowed to stumble on thanks to a win or a draw against Norwich this season is lost. Like a forest fire our crisis will burn on until there is nothing left to burn and we can start all over again from scratch just like Leicester, Southampton, Bournemouth, Swansea and the other progressive, ambitious clubs have done.
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I just don't think he fancies it. His tracking was half arsed at best the other night.
That might be because he was probably trying to run off the tackle which eventually forced him to go off.
I like him, he never stops running and with the right service, he'd be very useful.
I was referring more to his running before his injury. I found it so bemusing that I started to only track his running! It was Ray Wilkins running. Just sideways, expending lots of effort for very little reward. In fact no reward at all.
In Germany, he scored a couple of belters, so I know there is a good player in there somewhere. Touching on Brian's point, above, maybe he can't handle the pressure? The foul on Tuesday looked just as innocuous as the one he got against Brighton, yet he went off both times. In fact he walked off both times, with an injured ankle...
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I agree with Smirker that it has become a psychological issue. Many of us posted through the summer that the first half dozen games of this season were among the most important and pivotal games in the history of the club. It was of paramount importance that the focus of the manager and the coaches was on physical, tactical and mental readiness. Instead we had the rolling circus of the completely pointless Terry signing with an undercard of knee jerk equally unnecessary transfers like buying in a worn out defensive midfielder with attitude we did not need and selling a loyal, perfectly adequate championship back up central defender we did need. We took our eye off the ball.
The only proven way to overcome the problems posed by the players who are spooked by lack of confidence or lack of luck or the magnitude of expectations at a club of our size is to play young, fresh players whose youth and appetite for the game make them oblivious to everything but the game and the ball at their feet. But Bruce does not do youth. He wants gnarled old sweats to slug out one nils.
I very much suspect, know even, that there is at Villa what in the police is called a canteen culture. Since Colchester, Cardiff and Reading the canteen culture has been at its most dominant. The old sweats, Bruce, Wyness, Round, Calderwood and Clemence have been in a huddle, ostensibly seeking on pitch improvement but in reality presenting some sort of fire wall between themselves, the owner and the fans. In short, their jobs are the issue, not us being bottom of the second division.
If Bruce is allowed to stumble on thanks to a win or a draw against Norwich this season is lost. Like a forest fire our crisis will burn on until there is nothing left to burn and we can start all over again from scratch just like Leicester, Southampton, Bournemouth, Swansea and the other progressive, ambitious clubs have done.
I agree with you Brian. For too long we have played every game where a win was needed and we have been frightened to lose. Cup tie football every week means that you play safe and you do not change things very much. What this has meant is that we have circled the plughole getting weaker and weaker as a team as the good players have been replaced by lesser players who have then been replaced by poorer players.
This has to stop but the only way it will stop is if the fans accept not having immediate success. Last season was the perfect time to do it with a new owner. The slate could have been wiped clean. It may not have given us promotion last year but we would have been in a far better position this season.
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I just don't think he fancies it. His tracking was half arsed at best the other night.
That might be because he was probably trying to run off the tackle which eventually forced him to go off.
I like him, he never stops running and with the right service, he'd be very useful.
I was referring more to his running before his injury. I found it so bemusing that I started to only track his running! It was Ray Wilkins running. Just sideways, expending lots of effort for very little reward. In fact no reward at all.
So it's gone from half arsed to expending lots of effort for little reward. If there's one thing I can't accuse Hogan of being is half arsed.
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I just don't think he fancies it. His tracking was half arsed at best the other night.
That might be because he was probably trying to run off the tackle which eventually forced him to go off.
I like him, he never stops running and with the right service, he'd be very useful.
I was referring more to his running before his injury. I found it so bemusing that I started to only track his running! It was Ray Wilkins running. Just sideways, expending lots of effort for very little reward. In fact no reward at all.
So it's gone from half arsed to expending lots of effort for little reward. If there's one thing I can't accuse Hogan of being is half arsed.
I define half arsed as inadequate, doing a poor job.
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Agree OMVF. Once Eric Black allowed the remnants of the relegation side to dangle in the wind all plans for an immediate return to the Premiership were lost and replaced by baseless expectation. We were so bad when we were relegated and the club in the Lerner bale out vacuum was such a mess, and in many respects continues to be a mess, it was clearly going to be a long haul. I have always thought 3 to 5 years of rebuilding and have seen nothing to make me change that view. The throwing of money at problems wantonly has to stop. The effectiveness of money is only as good as the judgement of those spending it. Our judgement has been very poor. No, it has been downright irresponsible.
As I posted yesterday, and as you underscore OMVF our circling of the plughole has become unstoppable as Villa become regarded as a trough of money for increasingly second rate players to get their noses in. On Saturday I would pick Davis ahead of Agbonlahor. He is a better, younger, faster, stronger player than Gabby and can only grow into money for us. I bet Davis gets less than a twentieth of Gabby's wages. But who will Bruce pick? Gabby.
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Agree OMVF. Once Eric Black allowed the remnants of the relegation side to dangle in the wind all plans for an immediate return to the Premiership were lost and replaced by baseless expectation. We were so bad when we were relegated and the club in the Lerner bale out vacuum was such a mess, and in many respects continues to be a mess, it was clearly going to be a long haul. I have always thought 3 to 5 years of rebuilding and have seen nothing to make me change that view. The throwing of money at problems wantonly has to stop. The effectiveness of money is only as good as the judgement of those spending it. Our judgement has been very poor. No, it has been downright irresponsible.
As I posted yesterday, and as you underscore OMVF our circling of the plughole has become unstoppable as Villa become regarded as a trough of money for increasingly second rate players to get their noses in. On Saturday I would pick Davis ahead of Agbonlahor. He is a better, younger, faster, stronger player than Gabby and can only grow into money for us. I bet Davis gets less than a twentieth of Gabby's wages. But who will Bruce pick? Gabby.
You're right on the money Brian. The only promising aspect of the side that came out in pre-season was the promising young players that bossed the games in Germany. O'Hare and Bree both did enough against Colchester to have earned a start, but both were dropped, so we had to watch Lansbury and Hutton trudge their way through another defeat.
The lack of imagination shown by the manager, coaches and Wyness is pathetic. I would say it is unbelievable, but unfortunately it's anything but. Tediously predictable. Translate that into Latin and put it on the badge.
On a more positive note, however, if we can use some of the younger players in conjunction with the cloggers, I'm sure we could still make a decent side out of what we have. Add a centre back with pace next to Chester, some creativity in midfield and we're pretty much there once Kodjia comes back.
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The lack of imagination shown by the manager, coaches and Wyness is pathetic. I would say it is unbelievable, but unfortunately it's anything but. Tediously predictable. Translate that into Latin and put it on the badge.
moleste praevidere
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Criticsing Hogan at this stage seems akin to having a go at Fernando Alonso for not winning because McLaren have forgot to put any fuel in his car.
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Isn't it his job to look at the fuel gauge?
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Hogan probably feels like he's competing against McLarens and Bentleys in a Fiat Cinquecento at the moment.
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Agree OMVF. Once Eric Black allowed the remnants of the relegation side to dangle in the wind all plans for an immediate return to the Premiership were lost and replaced by baseless expectation. We were so bad when we were relegated and the club in the Lerner bale out vacuum was such a mess, and in many respects continues to be a mess, it was clearly going to be a long haul. I have always thought 3 to 5 years of rebuilding and have seen nothing to make me change that view. The throwing of money at problems wantonly has to stop. The effectiveness of money is only as good as the judgement of those spending it. Our judgement has been very poor. No, it has been downright irresponsible.
As I posted yesterday, and as you underscore OMVF our circling of the plughole has become unstoppable as Villa become regarded as a trough of money for increasingly second rate players to get their noses in. On Saturday I would pick Davis ahead of Agbonlahor. He is a better, younger, faster, stronger player than Gabby and can only grow into money for us. I bet Davis gets less than a twentieth of Gabby's wages. But who will Bruce pick? Gabby.
You're right on the money Brian. The only promising aspect of the side that came out in pre-season was the promising young players that bossed the games in Germany. O'Hare and Bree both did enough against Colchester to have earned a start, but both were dropped, so we had to watch Lansbury and Hutton trudge their way through another defeat.
The lack of imagination shown by the manager, coaches and Wyness is pathetic. I would say it is unbelievable, but unfortunately it's anything but. Tediously predictable. Translate that into Latin and put it on the badge.
On a more positive note, however, if we can use some of the younger players in conjunction with the cloggers, I'm sure we could still make a decent side out of what we have. Add a centre back with pace next to Chester, some creativity in midfield and we're pretty much there once Kodjia comes back.
I said in pre-season that the better performances seemed to coincide with an increased number of kids starting the games because they were bringing movement and energy that was missing otherwise. The games we've seen this season just back that up.
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Hogan is never going to thrive at Villa and if he does I will eat my season ticket. So there.
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He might if Bruce is given the hoof and is replaced by Dean Smith.
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Criticsing Hogan at this stage seems akin to having a go at Fernando Alonso for not winning because McLaren have forgot to put any fuel in his car.
He has had chances though this season and hasn't converted them.
I know he's feeding on scraps but considering he cost 12m is it too much to ask for him to convert his one on ones with the keeper?
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When he plays on the last man he waits and waits for an intelligent player to put a through ball in to run onto.
He suffers because we have players who have the speed of thought equivalent of Kirk off Coronation Street.
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Criticsing Hogan at this stage seems akin to having a go at Fernando Alonso for not winning because McLaren have forgot to put any fuel in his car.
He has had chances though this season and hasn't converted them.
I know he's feeding on scraps but considering he cost 12m is it too much to ask for him to convert his one on ones with the keeper?
Nope. Presumably 6 months of feeding off scraps and almost no goals does dent the confidence a lot
He's only had 6 good months at this level tho so we don't really know his true quality. Aside from style and stature, I do also have concerns that he struggles with the pressure of playing for a much bigger club than he's used to.
Look at the way he swept in those goals in Germany. He looks a million miles from that player again now
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no pressure then though - the wick's up to max already and he looks like a headless chicken
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Wasn't he all set to sign for West Ham and they dropped their interest fairly sharpish?
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Is there any injury update on him or Elmo etc
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Is there any injury update on him or Elmo etc
From what I can remember, Hogan may feature, Jedinak and Elmo are both ready.
Elmo had 33 stitches in his mouth wound
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Is there any injury update on him or Elmo etc
From what I can remember, Hogan may feature, Jedinak and Elmo are both ready.
Elmo had 33 stitches in his mouth wound
Ali broke Nortons jaw mid fight and he still fought on - pussy get back in the team
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Is there any injury update on him or Elmo etc
From what I can remember, Hogan may feature, Jedinak and Elmo are both ready.
Elmo had 33 stitches in his mouth wound
Ali broke Nortons jaw mid fight and he still fought on - pussy get back in the team
You can be harsh
;D
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Is there any injury update on him or Elmo etc
Elmo had 31 stitches but is ready to play, Hogan isn't as bad as first thought and could even be in contention tomorrow.
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Hogan isn't as bad as first thought and could even be in contention tomorrow.
He can't possibly be any worse. Boom, tish.
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I would put Lenny the Lion in for Hogan.
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I think there's definitely a good player in Hogan, he just needs someone to play intelligent through balls to him.
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intelligent through balls
Que
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I think there's definitely a good player in Hogan, he just needs someone to play intelligent through balls to him.
I agree in part but surely a striker at this level should have more than one attribute. If it's all down to receiving a particular type of pass then the opposition would know exactly how to stop him.
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I think there's definitely a good player in Hogan, he just needs someone to play intelligent through balls to him.
I agree in part but surely a striker at this level should have more than one attribute. If it's all down to receiving a particular type of pass then the opposition would know exactly how to stop him.
Not really. His strength is that he's sharp when he has people near him. It's not that he needs specific passes, it's that he needs people within 10 yards of him so his runs find gaps and create others. He's the exact opposite of Gabby in that he's very quick over a few metres but has no great pace over longer distances and we're playing passes which are forcing him to run 20-30m.
I get what you're saying but if he had the sharpness but was also quick over distance he'd be playing in the top half of the PL. If he was quick over a few yards and a beast he'd be basically Benteke and comfortably good enough to play higher level. The championship is full of players who are one-trick ponies.
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A fit Scott Hogan provided with the right type of service will score lots of goals. Punt it 60yds in the air to him like we were doing made no sense. As much as his second goal last night was superb I loved his first. Good cross and poachers finish to get on the end of it.
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I think we've got ourselves a very good player. It does seem to me more of a confidence thing with him rather than quality but I like him a lot.
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I think we've got ourselves a very good player. It does seem to me more of a confidence thing with him rather than quality but I like him a lot.
I agree. He looked really good in his first game for us away at Forest. If we can play a way that gets the most out of him he will do the job for us.
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A fit Scott Hogan provided with the right type of service will score lots of goals. Punt it 60yds in the air to him like we were doing made no sense. As much as his second goal last night was superb I loved his first. Good cross and poachers finish to get on the end of it.
THIS. All day long
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I think we've got ourselves a very good player. It does seem to me more of a confidence thing with him rather than quality but I like him a lot.
I agree. He looked really good in his first game for us away at Forest. If we can play a way that gets the most out of him he will do the job for us.
Agreed I really though he played well in that game but your right we need to play to his strength to get the best out of him which we haven't been doing so hopefully we have turned a corner with him.
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I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do against Bristol City on Friday, now he's got a bit of confidence back.
These are the big games, where we need our big players to start doing the business.
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Two cracking goals, just like in Germany. But against poorer opponents. I really hope he can step up... I like us scoring four goals each game!
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Very pleased he got a brace and could have had more
But Wigan made 11 changes. Davis still has to start on Friday
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he's doubtful apparently as is the Jedi and Mutton - although in the case of the latter that's a positive thing.
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I think Hogan will score goals if we can stop isolating him. If we can get the ball to stick then we can push up twenty yards and midfielders can create space for Hogan to flourish.
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First off Hogan has to stay injury free.
Then he can get a run of games, and hopefully the chances will start to come and goals start flowing.
So far it has all been very stop - start for him and he hasn't really had a chance to play himself in.
He has got to stop getting crocked.
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Surely Davis showed in the game v Norwich how much superior he is holding up the ball and linking up with the other attacking players?
Hogan comes alive when the ball is bobbling around the area and edge of the box but from what I've seen he massively struggles to even hold onto the ball when it's played up to him.
I presume we'll only play one out and out striker tomorrow so I'd fully expect Davis to continue.
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I like to see both Hogan and Davis with a midfield of Jedinak, Whelan, Hourihane and Green.
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I like to see both Hogan and Davis with a midfield of Jedinak, Whelan, Hourihane and Green.
I would like two up front , but you then lose
Hourihanes strength with him too wide in that formation??
A diamond would lose Green in that
Not sure what's best???
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I like to see both Hogan and Davis with a midfield of Jedinak, Whelan, Hourihane and Green.
We dont need Jedi and Whelan, replace one of the two, I'd play Whelan, with Onomah. Agree with Davis and Hogan.
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Surely Davis showed in the game v Norwich how much superior he is holding up the ball and linking up with the other attacking players?
Hogan comes alive when the ball is bobbling around the area and edge of the box but from what I've seen he massively struggles to even hold onto the ball when it's played up to him.
I presume we'll only play one out and out striker tomorrow so I'd fully expect Davis to continue.
I do hope we don't. Imagine Peter Withe playing on his own. What'd be the point?
Davis brings intent, and Hogan carries threat. I want to see them play together.
Mind you, once JK is fit, waddayado?
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Sell him , joking 😃 Jk is very individual and is a bit of a free spirit
We have never really got him working in a cohesive team
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Surely Davis showed in the game v Norwich how much superior he is holding up the ball and linking up with the other attacking players?
Hogan comes alive when the ball is bobbling around the area and edge of the box but from what I've seen he massively struggles to even hold onto the ball when it's played up to him.
I presume we'll only play one out and out striker tomorrow so I'd fully expect Davis to continue.
I do hope we don't. Imagine Peter Withe playing on his own. What'd be the point?
Davis brings intent, and Hogan carries threat. I want to see them play together.
Mind you, once JK is fit, waddayado?
If Davis is fit then that is thr formation that suits the players we have best, particularly in midfield. Hourihane, Onomah and Lansbury are better in a more advanced role, whereas Whelan and Jedinak are more suited to a holding role.
As for Kodjia, I could see him playing on the left when he comes back.
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Sell him , joking 😃 Jk is very individual and is a bit of a free spirit
We have never really got him working in a cohesive team
I genuinely don't know! For JK to score how many he did, just fucking wow! But could he link with Davis? Probably more up to how Davis develops.
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First off Hogan has to stay injury free.
Then he can get a run of games, and hopefully the chances will start to come and goals start flowing.
So far it has all been very stop - start for him and he hasn't really had a chance to play himself in.
He has got to stop getting crocked.
That is an essential skill of of a target man who can can play with his back to the ball and hold things up: don't get crocked. Anticipate the tackle from behind and go down and roll over. He does not have that in his locker.
Don't play him in that role is the answer which springs to mind.
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As for Kodjia, I could see him playing on the left when he comes back.
Exactly, I'm not sure we're that short on the left when you think of Green and Kodjia with Grealish to come back too.
We've a number of options.
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I hope never to see Grealish on the left again. He contributes zilch and doesn't provide any support to whoever is playing at left back!
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As for Kodjia, I could see him playing on the left when he comes back.
Exactly, I'm not sure we're that short on the left when you think of Green and Kodjia with Grealish to come back too.
We've a number of options.
Decent attacking options. I feel sorry for whoever is playing left back with those options ahead of them.
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Surely Davis showed in the game v Norwich how much superior he is holding up the ball and linking up with the other attacking players?
Hogan comes alive when the ball is bobbling around the area and edge of the box but from what I've seen he massively struggles to even hold onto the ball when it's played up to him.
I presume we'll only play one out and out striker tomorrow so I'd fully expect Davis to continue.
I do hope we don't. Imagine Peter Withe playing on his own. What'd be the point?
Haven't we just scored eight in two matches playing with one up front?
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Strong target man supported by runners from midfield?
It will never catch on
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Surely Davis showed in the game v Norwich how much superior he is holding up the ball and linking up with the other attacking players?
Hogan comes alive when the ball is bobbling around the area and edge of the box but from what I've seen he massively struggles to even hold onto the ball when it's played up to him.
I presume we'll only play one out and out striker tomorrow so I'd fully expect Davis to continue.
I do hope we don't. Imagine Peter Withe playing on his own. What'd be the point?
Davis brings intent, and Hogan carries threat. I want to see them play together.
Mind you, once JK is fit, waddayado?
We've got a million midfielders on the books now so unless we shift a couple in the next week I'd imagine we'll be playing five for the foreseeable future.
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I hope never to see Grealish on the left again. He contributes zilch and doesn't provide any support to whoever is playing at left back!
Totall
against the unwashed he was picking the ball up wide left ten yards inside his own half where he is going to be able to fuck all. Number ten all day for me hasnt got the pace to play wide
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Likewise for the second half against Brighton behind Crash Davis. Exploiting opportunities on the edge of the opposition box is his natural game.
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Likewise for the second half against Brighton behind Crash Davis. Exploiting opportunities on the edge of the opposition box is his natural game.
Absolutely
Makes him difficult to pick up and draws fouls. Him playing wide left is a dogs dinner
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Think he will be the one to benefit from the Snodgrass signing
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Is it just me or does he have a habit of miskicking in front of goal, especially in front of the holte end?
Wish we'd gone for assombalonga
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I thought he looked quite average against our mediocre defence the other night. No better than what we have really.
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i still don't know why we bought Hogan
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I thought he looked quite average against our mediocre defence the other night. No better than what we have really.
Not a world beater. But has pace, power and a knack for goals. Can lead the line unlike hogan
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i still don't know why we bought Hogan
We needed another striker and he was proven to do that at this level ?
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Yes.
But it was obvious that what we needed was a proper number 9. Bruce spent months talking about playing Kodjia wide, using gabby up front, and it not really working
We then go and spend almost all of our remaining transfer budget on a diminutive striker with half a good season under his belt
The only justification I can see for this is either:
a) he wanted to pair hogan and Kodjia, but has since decided that 442 or 352 don't suit us
b) he thought hogan could lead the line if we transformed to a fluid, Brentford style outfit
A) looks like an expensive mistake. B) looks stupid
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exactly why I can't understand why we bought him - he's the wrong player for us
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A panic buy with no thought to it whatsoever.
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A panic buy with no thought to it whatsoever.
No, Bruce was quite clear that h's followed his career for a while and had wanted him previously, or at least that's the argument that was made when I suggested he was a panic buy based on looking at the top scorer charts and working our way down. The odd bit is that if he really did know of him before then his complete inability to work out how to use him is even more mystifying and makes Bruce look even less capable in my mind.
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If he had Grealish playing 10 yards behind him, with Kodjia free to roam, then Hogan would have scored a lot more.
As he's spent most of his time like a man more isolated than Matt Damon's character in the Martian, he's not done much.
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If he had Grealish playing 10 yards behind him, with Kodjia free to roam, then Hogan would have scored a lot more.
As he's spent most of his time like a man more isolated than Matt Damon's character in the Martian, he's not done much.
Easy to say but there's not much in the way of evidence for Grealish laying on lots of assists.
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I think Hogan will score a lot of goals, he's devoid of confidence and will come good once he nest a couple.
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If he had Grealish playing 10 yards behind him, with Kodjia free to roam, then Hogan would have scored a lot more.
As he's spent most of his time like a man more isolated than Matt Damon's character in the Martian, he's not done much.
Easy to say but there's not much in the way of evidence for Grealish laying on lots of assists.
However Grealish is another who suffered last season from the midfield being too deep because it meant he was creating space and beating men on halfway rather than in the final 3rd.
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If he had Grealish playing 10 yards behind him, with Kodjia free to roam, then Hogan would have scored a lot more.
As he's spent most of his time like a man more isolated than Matt Damon's character in the Martian, he's not done much.
I agree with this.
If I was more with it I would just have said:
This
But I'm not.
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I think Hogan will score a lot of goals, he's devoid of confidence and will come good once he nest a couple.
you think the bird will come home to roost, then? I hope you don't get egg on your face with this comment.
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I maintain I think there's a good player in Hogan, I'm just worried that we do not have the right team to utilise that player.
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Quality player, just bought with no plan of how to use him.
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I maintain I think there's a good player in Hogan, I'm just worried that we do not have the right team to utilise that player.
I agree 100%.
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Quality player, just bought with no plan of how to use him.
Bruce could be fired for the Hogan signing alone, absolutely bizarre and a shocking indictment of his scouting of players. Granted he has a decent scoring record at this level but he is a very limited player, penalty box poacher at best. It's telling that it was the dildo salesmen in stratford that were our only competition for him.
In comparison, Benitez last season clearly saw limited players like Clark, Gayle, Daryl Murphy as able to fit into the tactical construct he was putting together to get promotion.
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He's good, definitely should be doing well in this league, we just don't know or can't like most of our signings make him fit.
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He's had chances though. A couple in the Hull game although the ball maybe didn't quite run for him at those crucial moments (sums up his Villa career). Through early on at Cardiff and hit Etheridge. Mis kick the other night from 6 yards.
Let's not say he's been completely starved of opportunities this season.
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A panic buy with no thought to it whatsoever.
See also R. McCormack. In the region of £25m spent on those pair in one season. Don't mind Hogan and he seems a decent lad, but he just looks so ineffective at the moment.
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He needs 2 or 3 decent ones in a game to give him the belief the next one will come. Then he might not snatch so much. Kid needs a break.
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Hogan fan here. Go for it!
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A panic buy with no thought to it whatsoever.
See also R. McCormack. In the region of £25m spent on those pair in one season. Don't mind Hogan and he seems a decent lad, but he just looks so ineffective at the moment.
Just think what we could have done with the cash wasted on this pair.
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TBH, I'm not worried about him at all. Needs a decent #10 and some decent possession football.. he'll come good I'm sure of it.
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TBH, I'm not worried about him at all. Needs a decent #10 and some decent possession football.. he'll come good I'm sure of it.
With a decent no 10 plus Kodjia he won't be in the team surely?
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TBH, I'm not worried about him at all. Needs a decent #10 and some decent possession football.. he'll come good I'm sure of it.
I really don't think he will. He won't get a game at all if Kodjia stays fit, other than as a sub maybe. He has no pace, no real presence and he looks to me like one of those limited players that is OK when he has the a lower league team built around him as was the case at Brentford. He's another waste of cash, sadly.
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He's like a cheap Michael Owen without the pace
A good finisher (I do think better than he's showing) and can run in behind, but really doesn't seem to have the all round game
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He hasn't shown much in the time that he's been here so far, so I would like to think that we haven't seen the best of him yet simply because we haven't played to his strengths...more worrying for me is that he blatantly isn't good enough for the Premier League should we somehow manage to get promoted so he's one of the many players that are going to have to be sold on if and when we do. Saying that, a lot of them are still yet to prove that they are good enough for us in the Championship.
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I want to like him and believe he's better than his current Vila career suggests. His movement and desire to get behind defences is admirable: the current coaching set-up and / or players don't seem able to deliver a style of play that exploits his game.
I think with a more assured defence, the introduction of a more dynamic and mobile holding MF and a more offensive gameplay, Hogan would flourish.
... so, we won't see it under the current regime, then!
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TBH, I'm not worried about him at all. Needs a decent #10 and some decent possession football.. he'll come good I'm sure of it.
With a decent no 10 plus Kodjia he won't be in the team surely?
Davis is currently ahead of him in the pecking order as well.
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I'm sure Bruce's replacement will have a plan. For him and the squad.
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TBH, I'm not worried about him at all. Needs a decent #10 and some decent possession football.. he'll come good I'm sure of it.
I really don't think he will. He won't get a game at all if Kodjia stays fit, other than as a sub maybe. He has no pace, no real presence and he looks to me like one of those limited players that is OK when he has the a lower league team built around him as was the case at Brentford. He's another waste of cash, sadly.
yep.
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A panic buy with no thought to it whatsoever.
See also R. McCormack. In the region of £25m spent on those pair in one season. Don't mind Hogan and he seems a decent lad, but he just looks so ineffective at the moment.
Just think what we could have done with the cash wasted on this pair.
Wasted it on more Bruce tat if current evidence is anything to go by.
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He's a very strange looking footballer. All torso with short legs. When he's trying to get a sprint on, you can see his legs are going ten to the dozen, but to very little effect with all defenders catching him no trouble.
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I like him. Give him the opportunities and he will come good
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He's a very strange looking footballer. All torso with short legs. When he's trying to get a sprint on, you can see his legs are going ten to the dozen, but to very little effect with all defenders catching him no trouble.
I know a bloke that sitting at a table his head is above every one else, then when he stands up he is the shortest person in the room.
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I know a bloke that sitting at a table his head is above every one else, then when he stands up he is the shortest person in the room.
Maybe he just has a big cushion.
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or he could be an alien in disguise
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He looked good when he came on. Pity that through ball from Onomah was a bit too heavy.
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He looked good when he came on. Pity that through ball from Onomah was a bit too heavy.
Oh yes. That ball was superb, just a fraction too far in front of Hogan but what brilliant vision from Onomah.
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It's one league goal in something like 19 appearances now, which is pretty crap whatever excuses there are.
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Or finished the game
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Or finished the game
I suspect the not finishing games is a direct correlation of not scoring in them.
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Only the old uns will remember him but Ron Wylie had the same physique. He was a very canny player and more than made up for his physical shortcomings with intelligence and became a very valuable team member. Hogan will find his niche.
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Or finished the game
I suspect the not finishing games is a direct correlation of not scoring in them.
It's very hard to score when in about 75% of those appearances he's not had the ball. But why not make yet another player a scapegoat
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Only the old uns will remember him but Ron Wylie had the same physique. He was a very canny player and more than made up for his physical shortcomings with intelligence and became a very valuable team member. Hogan will find his niche.
Quite Brian. Wylie was a very intelligent player for us, sometimes too intelligent for his team mates; if there can be such a thing. As you know, but maybe others don't, he went on to have a fairly decent career for the noses after he left us.
I've just checked his age, he's 84 and our old friend Wiki tells us that his grandson Alex Grove is a Scottish international at Rugby Union. I didn't know that.
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Are 12m strikers immune from scoring from the bench?
He started the first 3 games. Didn't score. Tough.
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Or finished the game
I suspect the not finishing games is a direct correlation of not scoring in them.
It's very hard to score when in about 75% of those appearances he's not had the ball. But why not make yet another player a scapegoat
Sacapegoat, fickle, zzzzzz. Andy- is back, rejoice!
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It's not great but how many of those has he actually started in ?
Or finished the game
I suspect the not finishing games is a direct correlation of not scoring in them.
It's very hard to score when in about 75% of those appearances he's not had the ball. But why not make yet another player a scapegoat
Sacapegoat, fickle, zzzzzz. Andy- is back, rejoice!
Who would win a fight or bake-off between AC/DC and Belle and Sebastian?
Those were the days, my friends.
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
I concur
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
Correct, or once we've worked out how he likes the ball delivered to him. Shouldn't be hard to ask him
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Could take a while...Bruce doesn't know how to use email apparently, so may be someone could communicate the messages via radio or social media for him.
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
Correct, or once we've worked out how he likes the ball delivered to him. Shouldn't be hard to ask him
Or maybe, and I might be going out on a limb here, we should have done some research on the player in whom we were investing so much dosh, and maybe got our scouting network to compile some reports and shit. Dossiers have a bad name post Bliar and his Iraq disaster, but they still come in useful sometimes, other things beng equal.
Brucey has said that he followed the player for a long time, but fuck knows what that means in practice. I followed Jennifer Connelly for a long time, but I don't know how she likes it delivered.
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
Correct, or once we've worked out how he likes the ball delivered to him. Shouldn't be hard to ask him
Or maybe, and I might be going out on a limb here, we should have done some research on the player in whom we were investing so much dosh, and maybe got our scouting network to compile some reports and shit. Dossiers have a bad name post Bliar and his Iraq disaster, but they still come in useful sometimes, other things beng equal.
Brucey has said that he followed the player for a long time, but fuck knows what that means in practice. I followed Jennifer Connelly for a long time, but I don't know how she likes it delivered.
I'm guessing on the ground to her feet
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Once we are playing with confidence Hogan will start scoring.
Correct, or once we've worked out how he likes the ball delivered to him. Shouldn't be hard to ask him
Or maybe, and I might be going out on a limb here, we should have done some research on the player in whom we were investing so much dosh, and maybe got our scouting network to compile some reports and shit. Dossiers have a bad name post Bliar and his Iraq disaster, but they still come in useful sometimes, other things beng equal.
Brucey has said that he followed the player for a long time, but fuck knows what that means in practice. I followed Jennifer Connelly for a long time, but I don't know how she likes it delivered.
I'm guessing on the ground to her feet
You'd be wrong, she likes it long and to chase. Or with her back to goal.
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meanwhile Hogan is still poor - he was isolated again last night, ran around unproductively a lot, and had a couple of chances which he predictably muffed .BTW, Jennifer says hello.
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8 months on and Bruce still hasn't worked out that hoofing the ball up to a small fella doesn't work. £12m on a player that you rarely, if ever, use right is ridiculous.
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Can't play Hogan on his own up front or with no support from midfield. Feel sorry for the guy...think he's a decent player that's being mismanaged..
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Agree completely I think he's being mismanaged terribly.
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He played upfront in a 451 for Brentford - that's the thing that perplexes me a bit. Obviously different style. But even so he still just doesn't look capable of playing that role at all for me
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It's like watching Tyrion Lannister running into battle.
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He and Bruce had words when Hogan was substituted last night, and by the look of body language they were not very friendly
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It's like watching Tyrion Lannister running into battle.
Spot on. That made me 😂. I needed cheering up after last night. Thanks.
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He's a very strange looking footballer. All torso with short legs. When he's trying to get a sprint on, you can see his legs are going ten to the dozen, but to very little effect with all defenders catching him no trouble.
Tyrion Lannister? (shamelessly nicks someone else's quote)
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Feel sorry for him, SB has bought him and has no idea what to do with him....also see Hourihane and Lansbury.
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It's like watching Tyrion Lannister running into battle.
Brilliant analogy, probably needs Jamie or even Gregor Clegane to play off
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
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Guess who's recently binge watched GoT
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
He's one of those forwards that can't really make chances for himself (see J.Kodjia) and needs goals handed to him on a plate (see D.Bent) so requires the correct service. He'll continue to be a waste of time and money unless Bruce starts to use him correctly.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Can't fault his effort he does his best to close down defenders. But he has no real turn of pace so the only way he can be effective for us is to keep putting the ball into danger areas where he can try to anticipate and get on the end of them. Sadly for him I just don't see that happening. Bruce is going with the all round threat that Kodja & Davis provide.Brentfords style of play suited his abilities far better. A signing that Bruce just gave little to no thought on integrating into the team. I wouldn't be too happy if it was my 12 million he spent.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Can't fault his effort he does his best to close down defenders. But he has no real turn of pace so the only way he can be effective for us is to keep putting the ball into danger areas where he can try to anticipate and get on the end of them. Sadly for him I just don't see that happening. Bruce is going with the all round threat that Kodja & Davis provide.Brentfords style of play suited his abilities far better. A signing that Bruce just gave little to no thought on integrating into the team. I wouldn't be too happy if it was my 12 million he spent.
As others have said, it's not all his fault but he offers absolutely nothing in terms of what you would expect from a forward. He doesn't offer a target, he doesn't hold the ball up, he doesn't challenge in the air, he doesn't work the channels, he doesn't drop deep and doesn't link play up. I do feel for the guy, but at the moment he just looks so ineffective. I would rather have Agbonlahor up front and that is saying something.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Can't fault his effort he does his best to close down defenders. But he has no real turn of pace so the only way he can be effective for us is to keep putting the ball into danger areas where he can try to anticipate and get on the end of them. Sadly for him I just don't see that happening. Bruce is going with the all round threat that Kodja & Davis provide.Brentfords style of play suited his abilities far better. A signing that Bruce just gave little to no thought on integrating into the team. I wouldn't be too happy if it was my 12 million he spent.
As others have said, it's not all his fault but he offers absolutely nothing in terms of what you would expect from a forward. He doesn't offer a target, he doesn't hold the ball up, he doesn't challenge in the air, he doesn't work the channels, he doesn't drop deep and doesn't link play up. I do feel for the guy, but at the moment he just looks so ineffective. I would rather have Agbonlahor up front and that is saying something.
Agree 100% Tom apart from your last sentence.
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He played upfront in a 451 for Brentford - that's the thing that perplexes me a bit. Obviously different style. But even so he still just doesn't look capable of playing that role at all for me
Look at the goals he scored. The ball was played through to him. Brentford played with midfielders and forwards close together not fucking miles apart. He's being asked to do a role that just doesn't suit him. For a "manager" and I'm going to use that term loosely for Bungle Bruce, not to know that, or to have spent that much money and not play to his strengths just shows how utterly out of touch he is.
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Through balls from midfield... all a bit alien for us.
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All those through balls.....
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All those through balls.....
He is a goal poacher, wants to hang around and get played in, that's his game, a one trick pony, unfortunately he is playing for a manager that is not going to feed the pony.
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Had Bruce looked at his goals? And how to get the best out of him? I doubt it....When Jack is fit Hogan might thrive as he is more likely to get the right service. But, Bruce doesn't always play Jack in his strongest position!
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Can we sign this fella?
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Had Bruce looked at his goals? And how to get the best out of him? I doubt it....When Jack is fit Hogan might thrive as he is more likely to get the right service. But, Bruce doesn't always play Jack in his strongest position!
Has he looked at him? You're having a laugh. If this was Football Manager I wouldn't use a lump it up to him tactic and I manage Villa in my boxers. So why is so called professional football manager?
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He and Bruce had words when Hogan was substituted last night, and by the look of body language they were not very friendly
Someone said the same about Elphick. Player mutiny might be the easiest way of getting rid of our fucking manager. Isn't that what did for Dolly? And Garde in a way.
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Had Bruce looked at his goals? And how to get the best out of him? I doubt it....When Jack is fit Hogan might thrive as he is more likely to get the right service. But, Bruce doesn't always play Jack in his strongest position!
Might help if Hogan could actually finish his one on ones.
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Are we sure we haven't signed the famous Jimmy Hogan instead?!
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Can we sign this fella?
Ive watched that and I can't see a single goal where the centre half or goalie get the assist via a long hoof down the middle.
On that basis he's clearly no good to us!
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Interesting watch.
Plenty of goals there where the ball is bobbling around the six yard box from corners and crosses and he gets on the end of them, that's the sort of goal poacher I was expecting but the ball just hasn't run for him.
People were posting the McCormack YT videos this time last year which made him look world class (in fairness there were some great long range strikes in there) but it just hasn't happened for him here like it hasn't for Hogan.
It happens to all clubs and we've had more than our share of forwards in the past who've suffered the same fate.
Kodjia is excellent we know that and Davis is developing nicely so I'm happy enough for those two to take up the burden up to xmas.
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Can we sign this fella?
He's good; very good.
Not all of the goals are tap-ins: several require him to do stuff!
It beggars belief that we are struggling for goals and cannot get the best out of this fella.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Remember Guy Whittingham? Didn't we sign him on the back of a 40+ goal season? Then when he played for us he simply didn't fit. Left us with single figure goals.
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Big Ron tried to play him in a three, never worked. Same goes for when Sir Brian signed Collymore.
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What formation did Brentford play Scott Hogan in? I assume they played 2 up front?
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to be fair any time we buy somebody who looks great , they come here and turn into rubbish, the club seems cursed .
every unknown Benteke we sign there seems to be 30 players who just devalue as soon as they put a villa shirt on.
It would help If Bruce played him to his strengths instead of just hoofing it up to him . I mean its took SB long enough to realise you need to support Davis instead of leaving him on his own 40 yards up the pitch.
in fact I have no idea what SB does here .
I think there is a good player in Hogan and most teams in this division would kill for a Hogan , Davis and Kodja forward line. We just need a manager who can actually play them to their strengths.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Remember Guy Whittingham? Didn't we sign him on the back of a 40+ goal season? Then when he played for us he simply didn't fit. Left us with single figure goals.
Certainly do. Gary Penrice was another one.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Remember Guy Whittingham? Didn't we sign him on the back of a 40+ goal season? Then when he played for us he simply didn't fit. Left us with single figure goals.
Certainly do. Gary Penrice was another one.
To be fair to Whttingham and Penrice they both came from a lower division. Whittingham was only given 25 games and Penrice just twenty (I actually though Penrice played even less than that). You can also guarantee that in both cases those totals included coming on as sub a fair few times.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Remember Guy Whittingham? Didn't we sign him on the back of a 40+ goal season? Then when he played for us he simply didn't fit. Left us with single figure goals.
Certainly do. Gary Penrice was another one.
To be fair to Whttingham and Penrice they both came from a lower division. Whittingham was only given 25 games and Penrice just twenty (I actually though Penrice played even less than that). You can also guarantee that in both cases those totals included coming on as sub a fair few times.
Fair point. I think it is probably worth noting that Hogan was playing non-league football four years ago.
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Had Bruce looked at his goals? And how to get the best out of him?
To be fair to Bodger Bruce, he only saw the one goal from that video, the one where they hoof the ball into the box and Scott scores with a header.
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I am struggling to think of a player I have seen play for us who has had less impact on a game than Hogan. I understand that the service wasn't great again last night, but he had absolutely no affect on the game whatsoever. I fully understand it must be difficult when the service is so limited, but he doesn't make it difficult for defenders at all and they seem to have such an easy time against him.
Remember Guy Whittingham? Didn't we sign him on the back of a 40+ goal season? Then when he played for us he simply didn't fit. Left us with single figure goals.
Certainly do. Gary Penrice was another one.
To be fair to Whttingham and Penrice they both came from a lower division. Whittingham was only given 25 games and Penrice just twenty (I actually though Penrice played even less than that). You can also guarantee that in both cases those totals included coming on as sub a fair few times.
Fair point. I think it is probably worth noting that Hogan was playing non-league football four years ago.
The way things are going for him, the team, it's style of play and the manager at the moment just sit back and enjoy all the punchlines to your post roll in.
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Was the away game at Bristol City straight after the Wigan cup match? I could just check, but I'm lazy.
For me, in the Wigan game where he scored a brace, he looked sharp and his second was a beautiful finish. He should have been the first name on the team sheet for the Bristol City game. If we had a proper manager who plays to win, Hogan would've been.
Instead he was reduced to the status of a late sub. For what reason? Was he injured in the Wigan game? If so, why was he even in the squad for the Friday night match?
Bruce has contributed hugely to Hogan's lack of form.
A crap manager. Get rid.
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I spoke to a Brentford fan about him a few weeks ago
He said: good player, couldn't believe how much we paid for him, has only really had one good half season at this level, and was very injury prone
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I spoke to a Brentford fan about him a few weeks ago
He said: good player, couldn't believe how much we paid for him, has only really had one good half season at this level, and was very injury prone
But look at that video a few pages back. He looks great, and his record stacks up, too. Imagine a manager with a brain and real tactical nous, a manager who could pair him and Kodjia/Davis(or all three) and wreck havoc in this division.
Once Bruce departs, hopefully someone will come in and rejuvenate Hogan. I think he's a decent player.
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I like what I've seen of Hogan too.
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It could be interesting to see him partnered with Davis, although he is behind Kodjia at the moment in those stakes. Davis could do the kind of work he doesn't do well, leaving him to concentrate on his strengths.
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Was the away game at Bristol City straight after the Wigan cup match? I could just check, but I'm lazy.
For me, in the Wigan game where he scored a brace, he looked sharp and his second was a beautiful finish. He should have been the first name on the team sheet for the Bristol City game. If we had a proper manager who plays to win, Hogan would've been.
Instead he was reduced to the status of a late sub. For what reason? Was he injured in the Wigan game? If so, why was he even in the squad for the Friday night match?
Bruce has contributed hugely to Hogan's lack of form.
A crap manager. Get rid.
We were playing Wigan reserves.
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Was the away game at Bristol City straight after the Wigan cup match? I could just check, but I'm lazy.
For me, in the Wigan game where he scored a brace, he looked sharp and his second was a beautiful finish. He should have been the first name on the team sheet for the Bristol City game. If we had a proper manager who plays to win, Hogan would've been.
Instead he was reduced to the status of a late sub. For what reason? Was he injured in the Wigan game? If so, why was he even in the squad for the Friday night match?
Bruce has contributed hugely to Hogan's lack of form.
A crap manager. Get rid.
We were playing Wigan reserves.
Which didn't stop people using it, at the time, as a sign that Bruce had worked out how we should play. That's why I don't count any of the cup games in when talking about his record, because the teams that play those games don't really represent the team you see in the league, certainly not in the first few rounds of this cup.
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We have so many options, a real embarrassment of riches but there's nothing to stop us at least at home playing 4-3-3 with a front line of Hogan, Davis and Kodja supported my a midfield of Jedi or Whelan protecting the back line with two runners in front, Houriane and Onomah.
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&feature=share
Through balls from midfield... all a bit alien for us.
That is NOT the same Scott Hogan we have signed. There must've been a mix up at the hospital.
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Was the away game at Bristol City straight after the Wigan cup match? I could just check, but I'm lazy.
For me, in the Wigan game where he scored a brace, he looked sharp and his second was a beautiful finish. He should have been the first name on the team sheet for the Bristol City game. If we had a proper manager who plays to win, Hogan would've been.
Instead he was reduced to the status of a late sub. For what reason? Was he injured in the Wigan game? If so, why was he even in the squad for the Friday night match?
Bruce has contributed hugely to Hogan's lack of form.
A crap manager. Get rid.
We were playing Wigan reserves.
You can only beat what's in front of you, though. As much of a cliche as that sounds, it does hold an element of truth.
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&feature=share
Through balls from midfield... all a bit alien for us.
That is NOT the same Scott Hogan we have signed. There must've been a mix up at the hospital.
same player just this is a team that creates
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Youtube compilations are no guarantee of quality.
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&feature=share
Through balls from midfield... all a bit alien for us.
That is NOT the same Scott Hogan we have signed. There must've been a mix up at the hospital.
same player just this is a team that creates
I know really
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I thought the initial fee for SH was £9m.
As he hasn't exactly scored a shitload of goals and we haven't been promoted yet, presumably we haven't had to pay any extras, as I write.
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Been called up for the Republic Of Ireland.
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Been called up for the Republic Of Ireland.
Good maybe they can get him scoring!
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He's chose Ireland now so he can look forward too International football now.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
Looks like it:
FW Shane Long 22 January 1987 (age 30) 76 17 England Southampton
FW Kevin Doyle 18 September 1983 (age 34) 63 14 United States Colorado Rapids
FW Jonathan Walters 20 September 1983 (age 34) 51 14 England Burnley
FW Daryl Murphy 15 March 1983 (age 34) 28 1 England Nottingham Forest
FW David McGoldrick 29 November 1987 (age 29) 6 0 England Ipswich Town
FW Seán Maguire 1 May 1994 (age 23) 0 0 England Preston North End
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Welcome aboard Scotty! You'll be eating Tayto sandwiches and driving Opels instead of Vauxhalls in no time!
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We have so many options, a real embarrassment of riches but there's nothing to stop us at least at home playing 4-3-3 with a front line of Hogan, Davis and Kodja supported my a midfield of Jedi or Whelan protecting the back line with two runners in front, Houriane and Onomah.
I don't think that would work - there's absolutely no width there which would allow the opposition to stifle us much too easily when we're attacking and would leave our fullbacks horribly exposed when the opposition is attacking.
Hogan needs to play in a front two. Ideally it would be Hogan and Davies up top, with Kodjia left and Albert right. Then Whelan plus Onomah/Hourihane/Lansbury in the middle with licence to push forward. I am absolutely certain based on zero managerial experience that that team would smash the living daylights out of every other team in this division.
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Pleased they called him up and hope he plays so that he can get match fit for us ;)
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We have so many options, a real embarrassment of riches but there's nothing to stop us at least at home playing 4-3-3 with a front line of Hogan, Davis and Kodja supported my a midfield of Jedi or Whelan protecting the back line with two runners in front, Houriane and Onomah.
I don't think that would work - there's absolutely no width there which would allow the opposition to stifle us much too easily when we're attacking and would leave our fullbacks horribly exposed when the opposition is attacking.
Hogan needs to play in a front two. Ideally it would be Hogan and Davies up top, with Kodjia left and Albert right. Then Whelan plus Onomah/Hourihane/Lansbury in the middle with licence to push forward. I am absolutely certain based on zero managerial experience that that team would smash the living daylights out of every other team in this division.
Agree on the 433. Wouldn't work
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Great attitude when he came on.
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I think right style of play hogan will score many. A cross between Jamie vardy and shane long.
I don't think Bruce plays to Hogan abilities.
Kodija already showed his impact on how he's distracting and troubling defenders with his play. Hogan is a useful impact sub at this moment.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
I think he sneezed when he was outside Molly Malone's once.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
Given that the news here this morning that Kevin Doyle has retired from all football with immediate effect on health grounds, I would say yes.
Doyle is suffering from constant headaches which he attributes to heading the ball, he has also suffered two concussions so far this season. He's being very wise IMO.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
He has Irish grandparents. Grandparents count in most cases, as far as International football selection goes.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
He has Irish grandparents. Grandparents count in most cases, as far as International football selection goes.
I would have thought his surname was enough proof of lineage.
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Thanks. We'll good luck to him,!! Villa players with republic Ireland often have a connection.
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If I were Hogan I's be looking for a move - things are not working out for him at VP.
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
He has Irish grandparents. Grandparents count in most cases, as far as International football selection goes.
I would have thought his surname was enough proof of lineage.
Exactly. He's called Hogan!
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Are Ireland really that short of strikers
He wasn't too interested in playing for Ireland not too long ago. The cynic in me is a little sceptical of Scotty (Sean) Hogans motives here.
Out of interest what is the Irish heritage and thus link for his eligibility
I believe the Irish FA have what is called a "flexible approach" when it comes to that question for any decent player. Bless em :)
He has Irish grandparents. Grandparents count in most cases, as far as International football selection goes.
I would have thought his surname was enough proof of lineage.
Exactly.
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If I were Hogan I's be looking for a move - things are not working out for him at VP.
I agree. Playing under Bruce is destroying his confidence and reputation.
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If I were Hogan I's be looking for a move - things are not working out for him at VP.
I agree. Playing under Bruce is destroying his confidence and reputation.
It's just not happening, and it's not for the want of effort. I'd wonder if we could cut a deal with Brentford, send him back and take the little ginger lad in midfield, if only to stop the fucker bossing us like Paul Scholes.
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I think Hogan is a good player but could do with a run in the team of three or four games to give him a decent chance of getting some chances and goals. Added to the fact Bruce doesn't seem to know how to play to his strengths - despite buying him - it's very difficult for him to get opportunities in 15-20 minute cameos.
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I think Hogan is a good player but could do with a run in the team of three or four games to give him a decent chance of getting some chances and goals. Added to the fact Bruce doesn't seem to know how to play to his strengths - despite buying him - it's very difficult for him to get opportunities in 15-20 minute cameos.
There's no way either Davis or Kodjia is going to be dropped for Hogan at the moment.
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He can offer something different like he did Saturday. He's never going to be a holder up of the ball but can get in behind defences if the right balls are delivered to him. He might as well not be there if as we have done previously just lumped balls in his general direction. As Risso has stated, Davis and Kodja are our starters every time.
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If I were Hogan I's be looking for a move - things are not working out for him at VP.
I agree. Playing under Bruce is destroying his confidence and reputation.
It's just not happening, and it's not for the want of effort. I'd wonder if we could cut a deal with Brentford, send him back and take the little ginger lad in midfield, if only to stop the fucker bossing us like Paul Scholes.
Agree with that, he's just not suited to the style we play and looks terribly ineffective as a result. We desperately need another option like Davis in the squad to rotate with him when needed. I do feel for him, but as you say, it just isn't working.
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Hogan offers something different to what we have. I'm hoping that they (Calderwood /Bruce) are urgently working on the training ground to play to Hogan's strengths or that when Grealish returns he'll help. Imagine if we had some tactical flexibility/variation?
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Hogan offers something different to what we have. I'm hoping that they (Calderwood /Bruce) are urgently working on the training ground to play to Hogan's strengths or that when Grealish returns he'll help. Imagine if we had some tactical flexibility/variation?
It's a nice idea, but we don't currently have that. The problem is that Hogan coming on in tight games like Saturday means that we will find ourselves under increasing pressure as the ball won't stick up front. As I said before, I feel for him but he is currently not what we need.
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Hogan offers something different to what we have. I'm hoping that they (Calderwood /Bruce) are urgently working on the training ground to play to Hogan's strengths or that when Grealish returns he'll help. Imagine if we had some tactical flexibility/variation?
It's a nice idea, but we don't currently have that. The problem is that Hogan coming on in tight games like Saturday means that we will find ourselves under increasing pressure as the ball won't stick up front. As I said before, I feel for him but he is currently not what we need.
I think he is being brought on mainly to add energy and press
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Hogan is better suited to the counter attacking style. Good movement, pacey. None of our forwards are particularly good at the long ball stuff. Keinan might be if he has players around him but that's not really the game plan for the long ball I guess. I'd like to see Hogan and Keinan rotated in terms of starts. Both very useful players.
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Whenever he brings Hogan on he takes both Davis and then Kodjia in quick succession leaving poor Hogan on his todd again
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Hogan offers something different to what we have. I'm hoping that they (Calderwood /Bruce) are urgently working on the training ground to play to Hogan's strengths or that when Grealish returns he'll help. Imagine if we had some tactical flexibility/variation?
It's a nice idea, but we don't currently have that. The problem is that Hogan coming on in tight games like Saturday means that we will find ourselves under increasing pressure as the ball won't stick up front. As I said before, I feel for him but he is currently not what we need.
I think he is being brought on mainly to add energy and press
Unfortunately he does neither. It just looks so easy for defenders against him at the moment. As pointed out above, it doesn't help that he is usually up front on his own when he comes on. I'd like to see how he fares alongside Davis at some point.
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Still looks a very poor signing.
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Poor signing in the sense that he's been bought for a huge fee and no plan how to use him but he's a very good player and the one I really feel sorry for because we appear to have found a winning formula without him in the team. I really think this one was a ridiculous panic buy. I've absolutely no doubt he'll do well for us if we can accommodate him and if not he'll do very well for someone else at this level certainly, maybe higher.
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Poor signing in the sense that he's been bought for a huge fee and no plan how to use him but he's a very good player and the one I really feel sorry for because we appear to have found a winning formula without him in the team. I really think this one was a ridiculous panic buy. I've absolutely no doubt he'll do well for us if we can accommodate him and if not he'll do very well for someone else at this level certainly, maybe higher.
Fully agree with this. There are 'poor' signings where the player is just crap, and whoever scouted him (if at all) was misguided, and there are signings where the player is obviously a good footballer (as Hogan clearly is) but individual and system just don't fit well together. I'd love to see him do well for us, but I simply have reservations as to whether or not Bruce is capable of playing in the style Hogan needs to get service as a striker.
Seems like a decent bloke and works hard - part of me wouldn't begrudge him moving on if he can get back to the form he's shown elsewhere.
Ideally though we'd be able to adapt the way we play so we can utilise him a bit better when needed. Ideally.
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Whenever he brings Hogan on he takes both Davis and then Kodjia in quick succession leaving poor Hogan on his todd again
My thoughts exactly. He is all on his own feeding on ball that is largely in the air, I don’t understand the thought process in signing a big money forward and never playing to his strengths
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The problem I see is that even when the ball is played to his feet he loses possession.
I Am assuming that he can only operate with the ball played in front of him which is pretty limiting.
This might be ok against lower level opposition but you cannot build a team on it.
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Whenever he brings Hogan on he takes both Davis and then Kodjia in quick succession leaving poor Hogan on his todd again
My thoughts exactly. He is all on his own feeding on ball that is largely in the air, I don’t understand the thought process in signing a big money forward and never playing to his strengths
From the highlights there's one 'chance' he has which highlights how poor a job we're doing with him:
https://youtu.be/A0GH3CoRric?t=7m28s (https://youtu.be/A0GH3CoRric?t=7m28s)
That's not a shooting opportunity but could've been a really good chance if we'd had someone busting a gut to get into the box. I get that they were all in our half but that's exactly the problem, we always slip into that 451 when he comes on and it means he regularly gets the ball in places like that.
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Poor signing in the sense that he's been bought for a huge fee and no plan how to use him but he's a very good player and the one I really feel sorry for because we appear to have found a winning formula without him in the team. I really think this one was a ridiculous panic buy. I've absolutely no doubt he'll do well for us if we can accommodate him and if not he'll do very well for someone else at this level certainly, maybe higher.
It was a panic buy absolutely. I’m also not sure that he’s a very good player, as to me he looks like a one trick lower league pony who has won the lottery after a good half season with Brentford.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
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I like him and still have a hope that he will come good for us.
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Poor signing in the sense that he's been bought for a huge fee and no plan how to use him but he's a very good player and the one I really feel sorry for because we appear to have found a winning formula without him in the team. I really think this one was a ridiculous panic buy. I've absolutely no doubt he'll do well for us if we can accommodate him and if not he'll do very well for someone else at this level certainly, maybe higher.
It was a panic buy absolutely. I’m also not sure that he’s a very good player, as to me he looks like a one trick lower league pony who has won the lottery after a good half season with Brentford.
I am also confused by the " very good player" comments I keep seeing.
If you play up front, you have to be able to hold the ball up and he doesn't.
Great technique? Strength? Good in the air? Lots of pace ? Nope.
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I think Hogan is a good player but could do with a run in the team of three or four games to give him a decent chance of getting some chances and goals. Added to the fact Bruce doesn't seem to know how to play to his strengths - despite buying him - it's very difficult for him to get opportunities in 15-20 minute cameos.
Would weaken us though.
For how we actually play week in week out Kodjia and Davis for different reasons are ideal strikers in the final third for us. Davis can properly hold it up and in the games when we're clueless going forward individualism from Kodjia creates chances and goals.
Hogan can't do either from what I've seen.
In a funny way he reminds me of Collymore (without all the baggage). Week after week people were saying this would be the game where Stan would score and he'd go on a run but it just never happened bar a couple of good weeks when we were top of the league in 1998.
I think it's not far off when we'll have to cut our losses on him like McCormack.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
Considering how we play a much better signing would've been giving Newcastle 4m for Daryl Murphy in January.
No one can argue he's a 12m player anyway. That sort is someone who could step up and do well in the prem and I see little that suggests he could hurt premier league defences.
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We definitely paid way more than market rate
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How much did Brentford sell Jota for, 6m?
That's the sort where you can pay and if it dosen't come off you can get most of your money back.
12m really needs to be an all round forward who can hold it up, score and also be good enough to step up as/when promotion happens.
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We definitely paid way more than market rate
There was a bit of a bidding war that drove up the price. I'm sure West Ham had bid about £8m at one point. At the time it looked to me like we were desperate to make a big signing, any big signing, to show that we still had some clout. Hogan never looked a Bruce type player. He was just a statement signing; unfortunately that statement was 'we haven't got a fucking clue what we're doing.'
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He'd just have been another Snodgrass if he'd moved to West Ham.
There's another club who just sign players for the sake of it.
Bilic signed Snodgrass and then asked him just before he came on for his debut where he played.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
1 league goal in twenty odd appearances is a pathetic return, whatever the mitigating circumstances.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
1 league goal in twenty odd appearances is a pathetic return, whatever the mitigating circumstances.
It's not been a good return no, but it still doesn't mean it was a panic buy.
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We keep coming back inevitably to the plain truth that in football, time is a luxury you can't afford. While you are fart arsing around trying to structure a team to bring out the best in an individual player the season's games are being ticked off. The real cost of a player is not only what we paid for him in purchase price and wages but what he costs us by being unable to do what we paid for.
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Like Gestede and Sherwood, I suspect someone had decided that Hogan was the answer and went out and bought him for whatever they could; in this case, a whopping £12m.
Problem is: what was the question they were providing an answer for?
- Kodjia, IMO, is not a target man, so Hogan would always struggle to work off him
- Villa did not / does not have a MF general, able to thread the ball through to Hogan through the channels
- the current set-up does not move the ball quikcly, pullling defences out of position, creating space for Hogan to run into
Like several before him, Hogan is a misfit in the current set-up.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
1 league goal in twenty odd appearances is a pathetic return, whatever the mitigating circumstances.
It's not been a good return no, but it still doesn't mean it was a panic buy.
How do you think Bruce intended to utilise him?
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Like Gestede and Sherwood, I suspect someone had decided that Hogan was the answer and went out and bought him for whatever they could; in this case, a whopping £12m.
Problem is: what was the question they were providing an answer for?
- Kodjia, IMO, is not a target man, so Hogan would always struggle to work off him
- Villa did not / does not have a MF general, able to thread the ball through to Hogan through the channels
- the current set-up does not move the ball quikcly, pullling defences out of position, creating space for Hogan to run into
Like several before him, Hogan is a misfit in the current set-up.
I do think we're forgetting that Grealish is still out. With him in the side (and if earlier comments by the manager are true) and the central force of our attacking play, he's intelligent enough to play Hogan through.
I do think that Hogan will come good, I also think that Kodjia will start scoring from free play again soon too. When that all clicks we'll be more than ok, especially with the goals coming from midfield right now.
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Like Gestede and Sherwood, I suspect someone had decided that Hogan was the answer and went out and bought him for whatever they could; in this case, a whopping £12m.
Problem is: what was the question they were providing an answer for?
- Kodjia, IMO, is not a target man, so Hogan would always struggle to work off him
- Villa did not / does not have a MF general, able to thread the ball through to Hogan through the channels
- the current set-up does not move the ball quikcly, pullling defences out of position, creating space for Hogan to run into
Like several before him, Hogan is a misfit in the current set-up.
Have to agree with that. We play an awful lot of long passes up to the front players, so having someone up there who is mobile, can challenge and hold the ball up is a must. We definitely need another player like that in the squad, as it will be tough for Davis to lead the line all season.
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We definitely paid way more than market rate
and as he's not one for the future, you would have to say he was a panic buy, especially as funds were limited.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
1 league goal in twenty odd appearances is a pathetic return, whatever the mitigating circumstances.
It's not been a good return no, but it still doesn't mean it was a panic buy.
How do you think Bruce intended to utilise him?
I don't know but I still don't think it was a buy out of desperation. I do like him coming off the bench though and if he wasn't here, our other striker would just be Gabby.
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I'm not so sure about him being a panic buy. There's not much evidence of that really to be honest. I think he's a very good player as well. It's just not happened for him here yet unfortunately.
1 league goal in twenty odd appearances is a pathetic return, whatever the mitigating circumstances.
It's not been a good return no, but it still doesn't mean it was a panic buy.
How do you think Bruce intended to utilise him?
I don't know but I still don't think it was a buy out of desperation. I do like him coming off the bench though and if he wasn't here, our other striker would just be Gabby.
To be honest Gabby has offered a lot more (1 goal, 1 assist) than Hogan this season even in his fleeting appearances. Hogan seems the classic misfit.
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Misfit, yes. Talentless, no.
He's not the complete striker by any stretch of the imagination but he has two real strengths, vision and a burst of pace to find space in behind defences and a talent for knowing where the goal is.
The first of these is almost completely useless the way Bruce has us set up. He needs Davis alongside him and creative midfielders behind him.
The second of these we'll only see the benefit of if he's given a run of games. He's clearly rusty when he comes on because he hardly ever plays but then you can't justify playing him if he's not scoring goals because he does nothing else.
I think flogging him before his value drops too much more would be best for everyone.
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We overpaid for him and his market value has dipped
I'd be surprised if anyone would pay £5-6m+ for him at the moment so we may as well keep him and see if he can regain some form
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Misfit, yes. Talentless, no.
He's not the complete striker by any stretch of the imagination but he has two real strengths, vision and a burst of pace to find space in behind defences and a talent for knowing where the goal is.
The first of these is almost completely useless the way Bruce has us set up. He needs Davis alongside him and creative midfielders behind him.
The second of these we'll only see the benefit of if he's given a run of games. He's clearly rusty when he comes on because he hardly ever plays but then you can't justify playing him if he's not scoring goals because he does nothing else.
I think flogging him before his value drops too much more would be best for everyone.
Agree with pretty much all of that Adam, but I'm not sure he has that real burst of pace that you mention. I too would like to see him partnered with Davis as well, as it is abundantly clear that he can't really play up front on his own. From the brief snippets I've seen of them playing together, he seems to have a decent understanding with O'Hare and might be suited to playing with Grealish as well.
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I keep the faith with him. Still reckon he will come good.
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How is he going to come good? He had his chance in the team when Kodjia was out for ages, and didn't take it. Now either Bruce doesn't know what to do with him, or Hogan isn't very good and was massively over-priced. Either way, Kodjia and Davis are playing well, and god forbid one of them gets an injury, how is Hogan going to come good? Brentford apparently based their whole way of playing around him, and Bruce just isn't going to do that, or doesn't know how. A baffling signing.
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I'd sell him in the summer and recoup whatever money we can on him. Every year will see his value drop less and less. He won't be forcing himself in to the side any time soon, how could he? What does he bring to the table that we need?
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How is he going to come good? He had his chance in the team when Kodjia was out for ages, and didn't take it. Now either Bruce doesn't know what to do with him, or Hogan isn't very good and was massively over-priced. Either way, Kodjia and Davis are playing well, and god forbid one of them gets an injury, how is Hogan going to come good? Brentford apparently based their whole way of playing around him, and Bruce just isn't going to do that, or doesn't know how. A baffling signing.
Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
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I'd stick with the guy as well. He'll play his part at some point this season.
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Agree with pretty much all of that Adam, but I'm not sure he has that real burst of pace that you mention.
I'm not talking Gabby-style fast, but he has enough over 10 yards to get away from that last defender and give himself enough room for an unchallenged shot.
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How is he going to come good? He had his chance in the team when Kodjia was out for ages, and didn't take it. Now either Bruce doesn't know what to do with him, or Hogan isn't very good and was massively over-priced. Either way, Kodjia and Davis are playing well, and god forbid one of them gets an injury, how is Hogan going to come good? Brentford apparently based their whole way of playing around him, and Bruce just isn't going to do that, or doesn't know how. A baffling signing.
Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
At best, Grealish has been inconsistent, and most of the time he's been disappointing or injured. Another example of a player being out of the team getting much better. Considering we bought the player with the most assists at the time in Hourihane, how come he's not able to slot balls through to Hogan, but Grealish will suddenly start? How many assists has Grealish got in his time with us?
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I'd sell him in the summer and recoup whatever money we can on him. Every year will see his value drop less and less. He won't be forcing himself in to the side any time soon, how could he? What does he bring to the table that we need?
I think we might have to consider it in January to be honest, maybe as part of a swap for another striker.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
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At best, Grealish has been inconsistent, and most of the time he's been disappointing or injured. Another example of a player being out of the team getting much better. Considering we bought the player with the most assists at the time in Hourihane, how come he's not able to slot balls through to Hogan, but Grealish will suddenly start? How many assists has Grealish got in his time with us?
Your assessment is depressingly accurate about all the players mentioned!
Damn you for being so bubble-burstingly objective!
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I don't see anything in Grealish that says he's better than Hourihane.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I agree. Him actually coming in to play in a confident and competent team, as opposed to a shambles might help him somewhat too.
He's the catalyst, the fluid that makes a good team great. If he gets going he's the best player in this division by a country mile.
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The trouble with Grealish is that I think he practically HAS to play in a 4-3-3 and that just doesn’t seem to suit us. He’s a very talented lad, but when he’s not on his game we might as well start with 10 men.
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The trouble with Grealish is that I think he practically HAS to play in a 4-3-3 and that just doesn’t seem to suit us. He’s a very talented lad, but when he’s not on his game we might as well start with 10 men.
I don't think he'd struggle on either flank in the current set up, but you're right in that he's much better in that formation, behind the centre forward.
I do think though having Davis to play off would could be a big plus for him. His runs would be found and vice versa.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I don't see anything in Grealish that says he's better than Hourihane.
Not really like-for-like those two though. Grealish would play in a bit more of an advanced position than Hourihane.
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Hourihane does not have the same type of ability as Grealish to take players on and look to play strikers in.
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MON on Hogan
Relevant bit "He has the ability in the box to forge a chance for himself and score,” said O'Neill. “I think that he can improve greatly on his hold-up play outside the penalty area and I have said that to him. But I definitely think that he is a goalscorer,” he added."
http://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2017/10/05/martin-oneill-shares-the-honest-message-he-has-given-to-aston-vi/
Whatever one thinks of MON I think this is pretty spot on where Hogan should improve.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I don't see anything in Grealish that says he's better than Hourihane.
Not really like-for-like those two though. Grealish would play in a bit more of an advanced position than Hourihane.
Why though? Last time we played Hourihane in an advanced position he scored a hat trick. Grealish has never looked close to being that prolific in front of goal.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I don't see anything in Grealish that says he's better than Hourihane.
Not really like-for-like those two though. Grealish would play in a bit more of an advanced position than Hourihane.
Why though? Last time we played Hourihane in an advanced position he scored a hat trick. Grealish has never looked close to being that prolific in front of goal.
You're right about the second point, but I don't think Hourihane played particularly far forward in that game, at least in terms of his starting positions - he just had some freedom to make runs from deep, whereas before that, he had generally come off as being apprehensive about advancing past the halfway line, whether due to himself or due to tactical instruction.
Comparatively, Jack's always looked comfortable starting well up the pitch, but then dropping back and looking to receive the ball around the edge of the box. That being said, I don't think we need to shoehorn him in so long as the team's performing well, but he's the ideal candidate to get on the end of some of Terry's more progressive passes - and Hourihane's as well, but, again, it doesn't seem like we're set up for the two midfielders to do anything other than playing tidy sideways and backward passes.
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Back when Grealish had his injury, Bruce commented that he wanted to focus our attacking play through him. If that's the case, Hogan almost certainly would have benefited and, therefore, may well do when Grealish returns.
Grealish has been terrible ever since Sherwood left, hard to see how he would make any of our strikers lift their game.
I think he'd work well with Davis in the same way he did with Benteke. In fact, I think he'd offer more supply to our forwards than any of the current midfield.
I don't see anything in Grealish that says he's better than Hourihane.
Not really like-for-like those two though. Grealish would play in a bit more of an advanced position than Hourihane.
Why though? Last time we played Hourihane in an advanced position he scored a hat trick. Grealish has never looked close to being that prolific in front of goal.
Hourihane played in a three man midfield that game and as mentioned above, was given licence to push on from there. I don't think you could play Grealish in a three man midfield really. If we are going to play a 'number 10' type of player then I would like to see O'Hare given a chance. From what I have seen of him, I think kid has definitely got something about him and puts himself about.
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The best I have seen Grealish play for two seasons was the second half against Brighton at home last season behind Davis. Grealish is at his best in broken play and at his least effective against the parked bus. Davis mixes it with the opposition defenders, knocking them our of their standard clearance routines. Grealish can make a defensive stumble or a miskick into an attack. For me he is the antidote to the Westwood crossfield compulsion. Be good to see him back in a team with Davis in it.
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Oh Brian, just the mention of Westwood is a footballing black cloud!! I agree on Grealish too. I want to see him play in this 'new' team as he has definitely has more than enough ability. As to who to drop, that is tricky given the sides results lately.
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MON on Hogan
Relevant bit "He has the ability in the box to forge a chance for himself and score,” said O'Neill. “I think that he can improve greatly on his hold-up play outside the penalty area and I have said that to him. But I definitely think that he is a goalscorer,” he added."
http://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2017/10/05/martin-oneill-shares-the-honest-message-he-has-given-to-aston-vi/
Whatever one thinks of MON I think this is pretty spot on where Hogan should improve.
Agreed. Hogan needs more strings to his bow. Good managers will quickly identify his strengths and weaknesses and set up accordingly. I like him as a player but at the moment he offers most to the team as a sub. Adding other aspects to his play should not be beyond him, it's just a question of working hard on them as he already has the fundamentals.
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I don’t think he offers much as a sub either.
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I think him and Onomah are two good subs to bring on. They've both got a lot of energy.
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
It would, it just looks a lot riskier than the current set up, and would require us to leave out Kodjia, and one of Adomah or Snodgrass, our three best current players in an attacking sense. I'm really not sure that Bruce is the manager to get Grealish and Hogan firing in that formation.
I'd rather see something like if we need alternatives:
Davis
Grealish Kodjia
Hourihane Whelan Snodgrass
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
It would, it just looks a lot riskier than the current set up, and would require us to leave out Kodjia, and one of Adomah or Snodgrass, our three best current players in an attacking sense. I'm really not sure that Bruce is the manager to get Grealish and Hogan firing in that formation.
I'd rather see something like if we need alternatives:
Davis
Grealish Kodjia
Hourihane Whelan Snodgrass
That's another one, yes. Though given this thread is about Hogan, I thought I'd include him!
I know my proposal was riskier than our current set-up, but I guess that was the point really, it shifts emphasis to attack and creativity and would make our opponents have to think and change too. We've a solid foundation already and the players could cope I think.
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
It would, it just looks a lot riskier than the current set up, and would require us to leave out Kodjia, and one of Adomah or Snodgrass, our three best current players in an attacking sense. I'm really not sure that Bruce is the manager to get Grealish and Hogan firing in that formation.
I'd rather see something like if we need alternatives:
Davis
Grealish Kodjia
Hourihane Whelan Snodgrass
The trouble with both those ideas is it simultaneously requires our full backs to support the attack by providing width (or we end up struggling to break down teams who're playing for the draw as we're too narrow) and leaves us horribly exposed when the opposition has the ball (as seen against Forest when Snodgrass couldn't be arsed to defend all second half and their full back spent the whole half doubling up on Elmohamady).
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
It would, it just looks a lot riskier than the current set up, and would require us to leave out Kodjia, and one of Adomah or Snodgrass, our three best current players in an attacking sense. I'm really not sure that Bruce is the manager to get Grealish and Hogan firing in that formation.
I'd rather see something like if we need alternatives:
Davis
Grealish Kodjia
Hourihane Whelan Snodgrass
The trouble with both those ideas is it simultaneously requires our full backs to support the attack by providing width (or we end up struggling to break down teams who're playing for the draw as we're too narrow) and leaves us horribly exposed when the opposition has the ball (as seen against Forest when Snodgrass couldn't be arsed to defend all second half and their full back spent the whole half doubling up on Elmohamady).
I don't disagree, but just in terms of Snodgrass bear in mind he had hardly played any football this season up to that point and was probably knackered. I think he's a pretty hardworking player normally.
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If you were to take off a wide man and Kodjia and leave Davis up top with Hogan, and Grealish in behind, you'd have the makings of a very potent threat. Formation wise we'd go from 4-4-2 to 4-3-1-2.Those three would play together as a unit whereas with Kodjia you get a one man band, albeit a very good one!!
It would give us options.
It would, it just looks a lot riskier than the current set up, and would require us to leave out Kodjia, and one of Adomah or Snodgrass, our three best current players in an attacking sense. I'm really not sure that Bruce is the manager to get Grealish and Hogan firing in that formation.
I'd rather see something like if we need alternatives:
Davis
Grealish Kodjia
Hourihane Whelan Snodgrass
The trouble with both those ideas is it simultaneously requires our full backs to support the attack by providing width (or we end up struggling to break down teams who're playing for the draw as we're too narrow) and leaves us horribly exposed when the opposition has the ball (as seen against Forest when Snodgrass couldn't be arsed to defend all second half and their full back spent the whole half doubling up on Elmohamady).
I don't disagree, but just in terms of Snodgrass bear in mind he had hardly played any football this season up to that point and was probably knackered. I think he's a pretty hardworking player normally.
Absolutely - he looked a different player against Bolton.
But it just demonstrated that without fit wingers in front of them our fullbacks struggle to cope.
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Grealish will be an impact sub when he comes back.
Up to him to win some points and maybe then he can get back into the starting 11.
Atm Adomah would be ahead as he has end product and think Snodgrass will be at that level very soon.
It's good we have options off the bench which we didn't really have last year as the bench players were out of form or just signings that didn't work (McCormack, Tishbola etc.)
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Did Hogan so much as touch the ball when he came on? Compare him to some of the similarly expensive Wolves signings, it would almost be funny if it wasn’t so fucking embarrassing.
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Did Hogan so much as touch the ball when he came on? Compare him to some of the similarly expensive Wolves signings, it would almost be funny if it wasn’t so fucking embarrassing.
And compare him to Ohare as well.
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Sell him in January rather than let his value completely diminish. The way we play it's like throwing a fish on the pitch and watching it flail around for 15 minutes.
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Did Hogan so much as touch the ball when he came on? Compare him to some of the similarly expensive Wolves signings, it would almost be funny if it wasn’t so fucking embarrassing.
Scott Hogan has a talent, primarily that is picking a decent ball up in the channels, using his pace and shooting on target. Our manager, the man who bought him, generally using him as a replacement for a big number 9 and not changing the system, is shameful and a waste
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Wouldn't shock me if he hands in a transfer request.
I know he's on a huge amount but no way can he be enjoying his football as much as he was at Brentford.
Just cut our losses, he dosen't fit into our style.
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Well we don't actually have a style.
Davis gets in the team because he's big and Kodjia gets in the side because he can magic something out of nothing. There's no actual link up between midfield and attack most of the time.
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Wouldn't shock me if he hands in a transfer request.
I know he's on a huge amount but no way can he be enjoying his football as much as he was at Brentford.
Just cut our losses, he dosen't fit into our style.
Or change our style to be good...
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Hogan use his pace?
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Hogan use his pace?
A bit like Gabby using his intelligence.
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Hogan does have a good burst of pace over 10 yards but not the top end speed to chase things down over 30-40 yards. That's why he was effective in a team that was playing short sharp passes around the box but looks lost for us either giving him the ball 30-40 yards from goal or firing it at his head from 40 yards away.
Whether that's enough for him to be worth what we paid or be worth building a team around is another matter but he does have something about him that can work, just not playing for us under Bruce.
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I honestly don't think Hogan's good enough for us to completely change our play to get him scoring goals. Certainly from what I've seen of him.
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I honestly don't think Hogan's good enough for us to completely change our play to get him scoring goals. Certainly from what I've seen of him.
I agree, but that's a fair debate, whether he can play the role Bruce is using him in isn't worth discussing because he looks like someone we've grabbed out of the crowd right now.
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I think it's kind of hard to focus on Hogan. The team was set up horribly and I still think with the right tactics his movement would lead to a lot of goals.
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I honestly don't think Hogan's good enough for us to completely change our play to get him scoring goals. Certainly from what I've seen of him.
Yep
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Scott Hogan is never, repeat never, going to make it at Aston Villa. And you can colour that anyway you like.
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I honestly don't think Hogan's good enough for us to completely change our play to get him scoring goals. Certainly from what I've seen of him.
The thing is though, it's not like an upheaval in the style of play would only benefit Hogan - I bet it would make plenty of others look better as well.
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That is predicated on Hogan actually delivering when you have built the team around him. That he would do so is very much open to debate but while you are finding out whether he can or not the games of the season are ticking off and the grip of mid Championship permanence tightens.
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The guy is just a grade A dud. I thought that when he came on yesterday that his name wasn’t being mentioned much. So I checked on Whoscored, and in 30 minutes he managed four touches of the ball and two passes. Compare that to O’Hare and Onomah who came on much later in the game.
Need to stop making excuses for a poor player. We wasted a huge amount of money on a rubbish, exceedingly limited player based on one good half season. We’re never going to base a team around a tap in merchant like him with no other strings to his bow, so need to get rid in January.
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Quite. When you pay the amount of money we paid for him and the wages we pay him you have to expect results quickly. If you pay for a Jaguar you expect a Jaguar. Not a Jaguar that won't start.
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that's because he has a de-cat exhaust.
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Common sense would say, get something for him in January and say thanks but this is not now or ever gonna work for you at this club son, but when was the last time Villa acted within the realms of common sense regarding football players.
As I stated elsewhere, if I was the Doctor I would be well pissed off with having one of my large investments playing Aussie Rules and another one who has won the Argus competition to be a Villa player for a day.
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Dr T might as well have set fire to £25 million. both total shite, and Kodjia apart, we remain embarrassingly goal shy - and I'm not expecting Kodjia to replicate his heroics of last season
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At least Hogan ran around a bit, his little legs giving the impression he is running quickly.
Kodija did not turn up.
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I have to agree that we'll never see Hogan come good here. Get what we can for him and look for a better option.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
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I make it that we have signed 3 strikers largely on the basis of the division scoring charts in the last 18 months - if we scouted Hogan then surely there was an idea on how he actually plays so I would certainly be asking questions of the person who signed him? Sure Brentford never spent their time hammering it at his head....
Do wonder if the Bruce masterplan was to have a front four of;
Snodgrass Grealish Kodjia
Hogan
At the start of season I can’t think Davis was anything close to his first team.
For me Hogan has delivered very little thus far, very underwhelming but I think he is owed another proper chance before being wrote off.
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Be nice if just occasionally he played up top with another forward.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
Why not? We've scored the same number of goals as the team who are second. Will it not get them up either?
There's been an emotional reaction to Saturday's result, but too many statements being made based on emotion.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
Why not? We've scored the same number of goals as the team who are second. Will it not get them up either?
There's been an emotional reaction to Saturday's result, but too many statements being made based on emotion.
Again, it comes back to the oft-discussed 4 wins on the bounce. Absolutely no point in smashing the weaker teams 3 or 4 nil, if we're going to keep failing to score and ge played off the park against the promotion chasers. We'd obviously be much better off if we'd only beaten Burton and Forest 1-0, but had done the same to Cardiff and Wolves. We'd be top if we'd beaten both of them.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
It probably will if we have the best defence.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
It probably will if we have the best defence.
It's more important that we beat the other clubs in and around the top 6.
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
It probably will if we have the best defence.
It's more important that we beat the other clubs in and around the top 6.
Exactly ..especially considering at this point our best chance of going up looks like the play offs where we will have to beat top 6 sides
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We're the 6th highest scorers.
Which won't get us up
It probably will if we have the best defence.
It's more important that we beat the other clubs in and around the top 6.
I was just being pedantic. If you have the 6th best scoring record in the league but let far fewer in than other teams there's a strong chance you'd be in the mix for promotion. I'm not advocating this policy though!
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How many top six teams did we beat last season?
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How many top six teams did we beat last season?
I don't know, how many?
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How many top six teams did we beat last season?
I don't know, how many?
I'd love to help Drummond, I have no idea.
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1 - Reading away.
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Three - Fulham and Wednesday at home, Reading away.
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If we could double that and get three draws we'd be well set.
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So that’s 3 out of 15 games?
And there is no discernible trend to be worried about?
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Three - Fulham and Wednesday at home, Reading away.
So memorable was last season I'd forgotten that a) Fulham and Wednesday finished in the top 6 and b) we'd beaten them both!
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So that’s 3 out of 15 games?
And there is no discernible trend to be worried about?
15 games? If we play each team twice and there were 7.5 teams in the top 6 maybe.
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So that’s 3 out of 15 games?
And there is no discernible trend to be worried about?
15 games? If we play each team twice and there were 7.5 teams in the top 6 maybe.
So top 6 X2 = 12 + 3 this season = 15
Jesus.
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How many top six teams did we beat last season?
Make the rules up as you go along then...
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Interesting discussion.
Fulham were a top six side last season. They played well enough yesterday to convince me that they will be there again this time. We beat them, but it doesn't 'count' as they are not top six -yet!
Figure that out!
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Interesting discussion.
Fulham were a top six side last season. They played well enough yesterday to convince me that they will be there again this time. We beat them, but it doesn't 'count' as they are not top six -yet!
Figure that out!
Yes I know it’s pretty difficult to keep up without a time machine.
If Fulham had won and got into the top 6 then obviously that would have counted as another loss to a top 6 team. :-X
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Bottom line is Fulham are decent, very decent away, we beat them, fair and square, looked the better team and that can only be a good sign.
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amazed Norwich have gatecrashed the top six - they really did look shite against us.
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So that's another top six side that we've beaten then ;-)
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Its so close in the top 10 I can see a fair bit of moving up and down for a while yet
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amazed Norwich have gatecrashed the top six - they really did look shite against us.
Agreed. Leeds lost three on the spin away and then won 3-0 at Bristol city
It's that kind of league for the most part
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We’re doing well, so far so good. Slow start but I can’t complain about the last month or so. Wolves aside who are a different class in this league we’re up there on merit and we’ll stay up there.
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amazed Norwich have gatecrashed the top six - they really did look shite against us.
They were awful at the start of the season, either side of losing to us (when we were pretty poor) they also lost 4-0 at Millwall and 3-1 at home to Sunderland somehow.
Looks like one of those teams that are improving as the season goes on, they certainly have the players for it.
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Poor old Hogan, he's even completely anonymous on his own thread!
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Poor old Hogan, he's even completely anonymous on his own thread!
Ha ha, poor bloody sod!
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Poor old Hogan, he's even completely anonymous on his own thread!
Ha ha, poor bloody sod!
I wasn’t sure he touched the ball when he came on today, but he did. 4 times. Same number of times as his last appearance.
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Strange choice of a stick to beat him with that he didn't do anything in the few minutes he came on and played out of position today. He does however look completely unsuited to our ''style''. Terrible signing by Bruce, needs to be moved on for our finances and him.
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Strange choice of a stick to beat him with that he didn't do anything in the few minutes he came on and played out of position today. He does however look completely unsuited to our ''style''. Terrible signing by Bruce, needs to be moved on for our finances and him.
In his last 45 minutes of football he’s touched the ball 8 times. The least we should expect from a £12m striker in the Championship is that he gives us a chance of scoring a winner. One of the worst, most limited players I’ve ever seen.
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Poor old Hogan, he's even completely anonymous on his own thread!
We’ve managed not just to make £27m disappear, but with it the assets acquired. One literally dumped as far away as possible in Australia, and the other has been handed one of those magic disappearing cloaks from Lord of The Rings.
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He isn't and wasn't worth £12m. We had our pants pulled down, that wasn't his fault. He's had what? 30-40 Championship games before he joined us? It didn't take a genius to work out that planting long balls at him wouldn't really work or asking him to hold the ball up. He's not a unit, but he is a good finisher with good movement who is now totally out of form and confidence after being poorly used by us.
A shining example of our shit transfer policy.
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The won the Argus Villa player for a day competition comment still makes me chuckle.
Bruce chucking him on to play left wing was bizarre.
Not his fault but he is completely out of his depth.
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I keep hoping he will improve. Looked shite again today.
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I agree that in general he looks crap but he doesn't come on in the best of circumstances a lot of the time. 2-0 at Wolves when we hadn't had a shot all game, he wasn't going to do much. Today having to try and get up to the pace of a derby and again when we hadn't created too much. He isn't suited to our style of play which begs the question as to why we signed him. Bruce saw a bloke who had scored a few goals at this level and signed him without realising he wouldn't fit in to his shit style of football.
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I keep hoping he will improve. Looked shite again today.
It’s not a case of Hogan improving more a system we need to play to suit him. As a footballer simply he is not good at anything. Can’t head, can’t control and can’t hold on to the ball and bring other players into the game. He was a goal scorer in a team that played to his strength so unless we can do that I suggest we sell him.
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I keep hoping he will improve. Looked shite again today.
To be fair to him, he was stuck out on the left wing and out of our attacking options is probably the one least suited to playing there. Shows how highly Bjarnason is now thought of when a hideously out of position Hogan is brought on ahead of him.
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well we overpaid but so has everyone recently. Just look at his goals for brentford and that tells you all you need to know. Passed to him on the floor, headers from good crossing. taps-in from sustained attacking pressure. Long HOOFS-UP for him to win and score from conspicuous in their absence. I think Bruce was drunk when he bought him.
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I keep hoping he will improve. Looked shite again today.
To be fair to him, he was stuck out on the left wing and is probably one of the least suited to playing there out of attacking options. Shows how highly Bjarnason is now thought of when a hideously out of position Hogan I'd brought on ahead of him.
Even Bjarnason's Mom doesn't think highly of him. Now he IS shit.
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We knew what we were getting with Hogan when we signed him and not once since then have we played to his strengths. Criticising him for being crap as a left winger is farcical.
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I keep hoping he will improve. Looked shite again today.
To be fair to him, he was stuck out on the left wing and is probably one of the least suited to playing there out of attacking options. Shows how highly Bjarnason is now thought of when a hideously out of position Hogan I'd brought on ahead of him.
Even Bjarnason's Mom doesn't think highly of him. Now he IS shit.
I agree, he is properly shit.
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We knew what we were getting with Hogan when we signed him and not once since then have we played to his strengths. Criticising him for being crap as a left winger is farcical.
He's appeared in 24 league games, and scored 1 league goal. He's never going to have a team based around him like he had at Rochdale and Brentford, because he just isn't good enough to keep the likes of Davis and Kodjia out of the team, and his all round game is non-existent. I agree that the way Steve Bruce sets the team up isn't going to suit him, but then players have to take some responsibility for their perfomances themselves.
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The vast majority of his appearances have been 10 minutes at the end of the game, mostly up front on his own with the nearest teammate about 30 yards away. The way Bruce has us set up to play most the time Lionel Messi would look shite.
Signing him was undoubtedly a mistake and the club should just take the loss on the chin and move him on. I have no doubt though he could go somewhere else in the Championship and get 20 goals available season.
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The vast majority of his appearances have been 10 minutes at the end of the game
That's not true, he averaged over an hour of playing time per game last season, and it's over half an hour a game this season.
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The vast majority of his appearances have been 10 minutes at the end of the game
That's not true, he averaged over an hour of playing time per game last season, and it's over half an hour a game this season.
An average skewed by the fact he started the first three games of this season when we had no other strikers.
He hasn't started a game since mid-August and in all but one game coming off the bench he's had less than 30 mins and normally less than 20.
In any event I'm not sure what your point is. He's normally played in a system which he's completely unsuited to. He could be on the pitch all game and if he's just getting balls lumped up to him even Stevie Wonder could see he won't score.
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That's it in a nutshell, not good enough to alter the other 9 outfield players to suit his game, start hawking him about now for someone to pay maybe 5 million max in January.
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Unfortunately Bruce doesn’t have a scooby about hogan’s role - sell him on for the best interests of the player and the club
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you cant play Hogan on the wing. He is a good sub to have If only you play him where he should be playing.
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you cant play Hogan on the wing. He is a good sub to have If only you play him where he should be playing.
Agree about not playing him on the wing, but he has shown nothing to suggest he is a good sub either.
Look at the impact Ohare had in 10 minutes against Wolves.
We have far better players than Hogan, Bruce keeps chucking him on to justify the ridiculous fee he paid for him.
Another Bruce fuck up.
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Not once have we played Hogan the way that he should be played, with a number 10. He's useless as a winger or as a target man, that is not his fault though, thats all on Bruce.
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Not once have we played Hogan the way that he should be played, with a number 10. He's useless as a winger or as a target man, that is not his fault though, thats all on Bruce.
I think we are all baffled by the Video, his goals were balls he came on to because he was put through or it broke for him.
So he is suited to a team that attacks more, the rest of his game is non existent though and he has no ability to hold the ball up which is a pretty fundamental requirement on a football pitch.
It stil begs the question why on earth did Bruce buy him?
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you cant play Hogan on the wing. He is a good sub to have If only you play him where he should be playing.
Agree about not playing him on the wing, but he has shown nothing to suggest he is a good sub either.
Look at the impact Ohare had in 10 minutes against Wolves.
We have far better players than Hogan, Bruce keeps chucking him on to justify the ridiculous fee he paid for him.
Another Bruce fuck up.
kind of agree Chicago but we only need to get an (bad) injury to JK or KD and does not leave us a lot of cover . Id be depressed if Gabby became the No 1 striker .
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Kodjia is out for the Preston game so Hogan needs to step up
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you cant play Hogan on the wing. He is a good sub to have If only you play him where he should be playing.
Agree about not playing him on the wing, but he has shown nothing to suggest he is a good sub either.
Look at the impact Ohare had in 10 minutes against Wolves.
We have far better players than Hogan, Bruce keeps chucking him on to justify the ridiculous fee he paid for him.
Another Bruce fuck up.
kind of agree Chicago but we only need to get an (bad) injury to JK or KD and does not leave us a lot of cover . Id be depressed if Gabby became the No 1 striker .
You are forgetting Samba ;)
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I don't see why Hogan is seemingly blameless in his not being very good. If he is unable to adapt to different systems then he is not a very good footballer. He's a dud, a waste of money.
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you cant play Hogan on the wing. He is a good sub to have If only you play him where he should be playing.
Agree about not playing him on the wing, but he has shown nothing to suggest he is a good sub either.
Look at the impact Ohare had in 10 minutes against Wolves.
We have far better players than Hogan, Bruce keeps chucking him on to justify the ridiculous fee he paid for him.
Another Bruce fuck up.
kind of agree Chicago but we only need to get an (bad) injury to JK or KD and does not leave us a lot of cover . Id be depressed if Gabby became the No 1 striker .
So would I but Bruce has already shown a complete unwillingness to play a style which suits Hogan so if we're just going to launch balls forward Gabby would actually cause the opposition more problems.
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I don't see why Hogan is seemingly blameless in his not being very good. If he is unable to adapt to different systems then he is not a very good footballer. He's a dud, a waste of money.
He was signed as a forward that primarily gets on the end of through balls. We do not play that style of football at all. If we wanted a forward that can play different roles then we should of signed one instead. It was poor use of our transfer funds.
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I don't see why Hogan is seemingly blameless in his not being very good. If he is unable to adapt to different systems then he is not a very good footballer. He's a dud, a waste of money.
Not being good wouldn't be his fault though, would it? It would just be a fact. If he wasn't trying or something then fair enough people are entitled to have a pop at him.
Personally I still think there is a decent striker in there if we play to a system that suits him. It is reasonable to expect players to be adaptable but that has to be within reason. There would be no point e.g. playing a long ball game with a five foot four striker or expecting Peter Crouch to play a dynamic running game.
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I don't see why Hogan is seemingly blameless in his not being very good. If he is unable to adapt to different systems then he is not a very good footballer. He's a dud, a waste of money.
Not being good wouldn't be his fault though, would it? It would just be a fact. If he wasn't trying or something then fair enough people are entitled to have a pop at him.
Personally I still think there is a decent striker in there if we play to a system that suits him. It is reasonable to expect players to be adaptable but that has to be within reason. There would be no point e.g. playing a long ball game with a five foot four striker or expecting Peter Crouch to play a dynamic running game.
There's demonstrably a decent footballer there or he wouldn't have scored 21 goals in 33 matches for Brentford.
Saying Hogan's "not very good" is like saying a Bugatti Veyron's crap because it can't tow a caravan.
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Kodjia is out for the Preston game so Hogan needs to step up
Would think he'll play Davis up top by himself with Albert and Snodgrass in a 5 man midfield pushing on and supporting.
Elmo Chester Terry Hutton
Snodgrass Jedinak Whelan Hourihane Albert
Davis
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Yeah, Davis will start for the Preston game. We need to hold onto the ball more up front and Davis can provide that.
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Kodjia is out for the Preston game so Hogan needs to step up
Would think he'll play Davis up top by himself with Albert and Snodgrass in a 5 man midfield pushing on and supporting.
Elmo Chester Terry Hutton
Snodgrass Jedinak Whelan Hourihane Albert
Davis
Is Grealish available yet? Jedinak and Whelan in midfield won't be pretty, might be time to give Whelan a breather. Has a lot of games played. Didn't happen for Onomoah yesterday but Preston game might be just what he needs.
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Kodjia is out for the Preston game so Hogan needs to step up
Would think he'll play Davis up top by himself with Albert and Snodgrass in a 5 man midfield pushing on and supporting.
Elmo Chester Terry Hutton
Snodgrass Jedinak Whelan Hourihane Albert
Davis
Is Grealish available yet? Jedinak and Whelan in midfield won't be pretty, might be time to give Whelan a breather. Has a lot of games played. Didn't happen for Onomoah yesterday but Preston game might be just what he needs.
I would go with that (jedinak holding with Onomah and Hourihane playing in front of him and pushing on) and it will be interesting to see if Taylor comes back in or if Hutton keeps his place.
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Huttons done well i covering left back but Taylor balances the line up better. Having 3 out of 4 of our wide positions all wanting to cut inside is far from ideal.
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I don't see why Hogan is seemingly blameless in his not being very good. If he is unable to adapt to different systems then he is not a very good footballer. He's a dud, a waste of money.
He was signed as a forward that primarily gets on the end of through balls. We do not play that style of football at all. If we wanted a forward that can play different roles then we should of signed one instead. It was poor use of our transfer funds.
I agree with you. As we don't play that style i cannot yet confirm that he is a complete dud - not like he is missing loads of chances. But i fear he won't make it with us.
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I'm moving more from "it's just not happening for him" to " he's not good enough".
To be a quality player you've got to at least be able to adapt your skills somewhat. He can't seem to be effective in any system we play. If money is tight I'd offload as soon as possible and try and bring in someone that doesn't resemble a spirited Daschund fruitlessly chasing German Shepards.
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I'm moving more from "it's just not happening for him" to " he's not good enough".
To be a quality player you've got to at least be able to adapt your skills somewhat. He can't seem to be effective in any system we play. If money is tight I'd offload as soon as possible and try and bring in someone that doesn't resemble a spirited Daschund fruitlessly chasing German Shepards.
The use of "any" makes it sound like we're playing a number of noticeably stylistically-different systems though, when we really aren't. Fair enough with the rest of your post, but even the good performances have involved the centre forward basically being used as a lamp-post.
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I'm moving more from "it's just not happening for him" to " he's not good enough".
To be a quality player you've got to at least be able to adapt your skills somewhat. He can't seem to be effective in any system we play. If money is tight I'd offload as soon as possible and try and bring in someone that doesn't resemble a spirited Daschund fruitlessly chasing German Shepards.
The use of "any" makes it sound like we're playing a number of noticeably stylistically-different systems though, when we really aren't. Fair enough with the rest of your post, but even the good performances have involved the centre forward basically being used as a lamp-post.
Teams tend to sit deep against us, not allowing the space required to play to his perceived strengths. I expect that given a run of games he might, in time, find a way to adapt. We don’t really have the time to risk it.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Do we set up for a draw against the bibs and cones too?
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
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very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Is anyone really surprised at this?
Outdated methods
Outdated tactics
Outdated Manager
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
I bet they still use bibs and cones.
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Bibs dont suprise me . Bruce wouldnt want to get any of his kebab down his Villa top would he.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
Probably is brill’ as they easily matched us this season again. And, I imagine if they opted for the bibs and cones method they could well be bottom.
No wonder they no longer allow the public easy access to training at BH any more as we’d no doubt be astounded as to outdated it really is.
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I feel sorry for Hogan. Not his fault the fee was high, not his fault he was bought with no idea how to get the best out of him. Why SB stuck him out on the left on Sunday still baffles me.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
they're 7 points below us.
villa's turnover 15/16 - £108m
brentford turnover 15/16 - £10.6m
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I suspect he's not happy because he's not playing..and rightly so. Would love to see him get a run of games up top with Davis now Kodija is out. However, two up front may be a little too attacking for our manager...Think him and Davis could be decent together. He needs a run of games...
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
they're 7 points below us.
villa's turnover 15/16 - £108m
brentford turnover 15/16 - £10.6m
Bibs and cones ain't cheap!
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he'll be gone in January, right up there with the £12m tossed into a camp fire for McCormack.
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You only have to see how he doesn't interact with any of his team - there's something not right.
As suggested earlier, irrespective of the playing style not playing to SH's strength, he has shown little if anything of a level of desire to make something out of nothing.
Absolutely sick of us wasting money.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Do we set up for a draw against the bibs and cones too?
Hogan gets introduced late into the fray, but is unable to break down the cones.
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I don't have a problem with Hogan and I feel a bit sorry for him. I think he's not been given a proper chance as in a run of successive full games to prove himself (perhaps we can't really afford such a luxury, but it doesn't exactly demonstrate much faith in him from the man who paid umpteen million for him). He's usually used as a late sub with very little time to get up to speed with the game or make an impact. Most players would find that difficult but new strikers under pressure to get off the mark even more so. He's playing in a "system" that doesn't generate much attacking will let alone chances and the whole approach is not suited to his strengths. If we had someone like Hourihane or Lansbury or even Grealish doing a no 10 type role and threading through some clever through balls for him to run on to I think he'd get goals. But we don't play that way and it seems Bruce has no intention of trying to. The only mystery to me is why Bruce bought him.
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I’ve always been convinced that before his injury the plan was to sell Kodjia in the summer and buy another forward to play alongside Hogan - at the time Davis hadn’t had his Norwich game so was not really in the picture...at least I hope that was his plan else signing Hogan just comes across as spectacularly misjudged, coupled with the way he de-valued McCormack publicly outing his attitude it’s fair to say he hasn’t done great with our forwards :-) and their resale potential.
Personally hope Hogan gets 2 or 3 games up with Davis if Kodjia is out, seems foolhardy to judge him on 15 mins here, 15 mins there rather than from the start when we aren’t just trying to close down games.
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Don’t think I have seen a player that it is so easy to take the ball off.
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Don’t think I have seen a player that it is so easy to take the ball off.
He's a finisher that doesn't seem to want much time on the ball; not a ball-player. I agree that now is the perfect time to play him, alongside Davis. If he does not step up, we should look to get rid in the January window.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
Brentford have lost some of their best players this season including Hogan . Came to Villa Park a few weeks ago and and were easily the better side.
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Should be no where near the starting X1.
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I think he would benefit from a 4231 with Grealish in close proximity and a couple of wide players. Its not how we will be setting tonight though.
I would mind seeing him in a 442, but I wonder if Jedinak/Whelan is going to limit Hourihane and on balance, I'd prefer Hourihane and Onomah supporting Davis with Snodders and Adomah to 442.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
None of that shocks me given the little snippets we see from the training sessions on youtube and what we actually produce on the pitch most weeks.
I've been critical of Hogan a fair bit but for the good of his career he needs to move, maybe not in January but next summer. Deep down he knows this wasn't his best career move.
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
Sounds brill...where are Brentford in the table again?
Bit of an odd comment that. Considering their resources, 3-4 years of championship football is pretty good going from them. Anyone who sees them play will realise they're well coached and play decent football for what is a development/feeder club.
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I think he would benefit from a 4231 with Grealish in close proximity and a couple of wide players. Its not how we will be setting tonight though.
I would mind seeing him in a 442, but I wonder if Jedinak/Whelan is going to limit Hourihane and on balance, I'd prefer Hourihane and Onomah supporting Davis with Snodders and Adomah to 442.
Couple of times I've seen him play he's been next to useless at holding the ball up and also wants to avoid physical contact with defenders after his bad injuries so don't think he'd be effective in lone striker role at all.
I do think him and Davis could work with a run of games but would require us switching to 3-5-2 again and we always seem to have awful results playing that formation.
Kodjia hasn't been great so far this season but you know at some point he'll explode and have a great run of form of 9 goals in 10 games or something.
Hogan just dosen't give the indication he's even going to score another goal for us with his cameos.
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I think Hogan could operate as a lone striker but only in a 4231 as Ads suggests or I think better in a 4141. The key is getting the midfield close to him and playing through the midfield rather than launching long balls which are simply not going to work.
Working alongside a big striker could also work but he still relies on balls slotted through, which I'm not sure Davis is capable of. Hogan's not quick enough to do much with flick ons so even if we play him with Davis I'm still not sure we'll see him thrive.
There's just so much that would need to change about our style of play to get the most out of Hogan it's just not worth it. We should cut our losses ASAP.
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I think he would benefit from a 4231 with Grealish in close proximity and a couple of wide players. Its not how we will be setting tonight though.
I would mind seeing him in a 442, but I wonder if Jedinak/Whelan is going to limit Hourihane and on balance, I'd prefer Hourihane and Onomah supporting Davis with Snodders and Adomah to 442.
Might be worth having a look at him with Grealish or O'Hare in the U23's. The snippets I have seen them play together, him and O'Hare do seem to have a bit of an understanding. Would involve us changing the way we play though, so pretty doubtful.
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I don't know if it's lack of ability, lack of confidence or a combination of both but he looked gash again tonight when he came on.
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His confidence looked completely shot to me
It doesn't feel like it's going to be a success does it. He's only ever going to get chances here and there. He never loos like taking them. Today we were just breaking at will in the last twenty and he still never looked dangerous
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Must admit, i'd never really heard of him till we signed, so not sure if he was any good, but he looks completely shot of confidence. Struggles to do the basic things, feel sorry for him.
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Another bad game (although he played us out of the back very well once).
Sadly he is not playing well at all. I wish I could say otherwise :(
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I also felt sorry for him. Confidence clearly at rock bottom. We've clearly not seen him anywhere near his best (and probably won't get to).
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Can't help but wonder if Hogan will be another resident at the Aston Villa Home for Formerly Prolific Championship Strikers. By chance alone, we are due one that continues to be prolific with us.
:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
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I wish people would not get so anxious about Hogan. I believe he will be very useful to us in the promotion push from February onwards when injuries and games toil up on the team.
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Is he at least getting some playing time in the reserves?
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I must have been watching a different game as when he came on last night I thought he looked quite bright - kept making good runs and helped lay on the chance for Adomah.
Would still at some point like to see him have a start up top with Davis
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Said it before and I'll say it again, he's a quality player at this level that just isn't fitting in with the way we're playing. It happens.
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I've seen absolutely nothing in Hogan to suggest he has any footballing quality at all.
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An incident just after he came on for Davis, sums it up for me. They had to drop a midfielder in at centre back in the second half and Davis gave him a torrid time, outmuscling him in pretty much every challenge. Hogan came on and his first challenge with him ended up with Hogan being eased off the ball and onto the floor by the same defender.
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He got passed the ball from a throw in, and under no pressure whatsoever, kicked the ball straight out of play. Then towards the end, he was in their 18 yard box, won the ball, and tamely passed it back to one of their defenders.
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I must have been watching a different game as when he came on last night I thought he looked quite bright - kept making good runs and helped lay on the chance for Adomah.
Would still at some point like to see him have a start up top with Davis
He started well but got steadily worse, if he’d played for any longer he’d have been scoring own goals and offering out his team mates. He clearly has ability but it rarely shows itself. Some people appear determined to blame it on the manager as it suits their standpoint but to me it seems that he is struggling with the level of expectation that comes with playing for the biggest club in the division.
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He got passed the ball from a throw in, and under no pressure whatsoever, kicked the ball straight out of play. Then towards the end, he was in their 18 yard box, won the ball, and tamely passed it back to one of their defenders.
Apparently one of his better games..
As Tom says above, ( and I have noticed every time he plays) his ability to be eased off the ball is extremely concerning, you can not play at this level if every time you get the ball it gets taken off you or you give it away.
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He doesn't really seem to have the technique you'd need to get away with being so lightweight
But he's clearly way below what he was at Brentford, even accounting for different playing styles etc
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Work colleague has one of the Brentford backroom staff as a flatmate. He reckons that Hogan is not at all happy at Villa – still living in London and commuting up, and very critical of the coaching work done each week. At Brentford, they'd have three distinct sessions that were set up to how the opposition were expected to play against them; at Villa, it's a bit more bibs and cones.
None of that shocks me given the little snippets we see from the training sessions on youtube and what we actually produce on the pitch most weeks.
I've been critical of Hogan a fair bit but for the good of his career he needs to move, maybe not in January but next summer. Deep down he knows this wasn't his best career move.
Thorough training sessions won't help you shine if you can't trap a football from a throw in. His confidence is completely shot and its obvious that he needs selling ASAP.
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Okay, I really hope I'm wrong (have been before) but he ain't gonna make it. He has had numerous opportunities, a run of games (agree not that many) different partners but to no avail. I really really hope I'm wrong and he becomes the confident goal scorer he was with Brentford.......
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Okay, I really hope I'm wrong (have been before) but he ain't gonna make it. He has had numerous opportunities, a run of games (agree not that many) different partners but to no avail. I really really hope I'm wrong and he becomes the confident goal scorer he was with Brentford.......
Have to disagree with that a bit. He has come on up front on his own the majority of times he has featured this season and just isn't suited to that role. I can't recall him being partnered up front with Davis or with O'Hare (apart from pre season). He might fe more suited to a 4-4-2 alongside Davis and with crosses coming in or with someone like O'Hare or Grealish playing just behind him. It would need us to change our formation and style of play though, and I still really can't see why he was bought for so much when it is clear he just isn't what we need up there.
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Okay, I really hope I'm wrong (have been before) but he ain't gonna make it. He has had numerous opportunities, a run of games (agree not that many) different partners but to no avail. I really really hope I'm wrong and he becomes the confident goal scorer he was with Brentford.......
Have to disagree with that a bit. He has come on up front on his own the majority of times he has featured this season and just isn't suited to that role. I can't recall him being partnered up front with Davis or with O'Hare (apart from pre season). He might fe more suited to a 4-4-2 alongside Davis and with crosses coming in or with someone like O'Hare or Grealish playing just behind him. It would need us to change our formation and style of play though, and I still really can't see why he was bought for so much when it is clear he just isn't what we need up there.
Which obviously would be a dodgy old idea now that we've seem to have settled on a setup capable of yielding good results (provided that the approach is positive enough, of course). He may be an unknown quantity for the post-Bruce era, but that's thinking way too far ahead at this moment.
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Okay, I really hope I'm wrong (have been before) but he ain't gonna make it. He has had numerous opportunities, a run of games (agree not that many) different partners but to no avail. I really really hope I'm wrong and he becomes the confident goal scorer he was with Brentford.......
Have to disagree with that a bit. He has come on up front on his own the majority of times he has featured this season and just isn't suited to that role. I can't recall him being partnered up front with Davis or with O'Hare (apart from pre season). He might fe more suited to a 4-4-2 alongside Davis and with crosses coming in or with someone like O'Hare or Grealish playing just behind him. It would need us to change our formation and style of play though, and I still really can't see why he was bought for so much when it is clear he just isn't what we need up there.
Which obviously would be a dodgy old idea now that we've seem to have settled on a setup capable of yielding good results (provided that the approach is positive enough, of course). He may be an unknown quantity for the post-Bruce era, but that's thinking way too far ahead at this moment.
Exactly and I just don't see him fitting into that current set up. Said it another thread, but we desperately need to bring some like-for-like cover for Davis in January which would probably mean Hogan being surplus to requirements at that point.
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I've said it before but Hogan is one of these players that you really want to do well, in my opinion his movement is up there with some of the best strikers but a mixture of bad luck and los of confidence has held him back. Really hope he finds his feet.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
See Clampy, I don't think he is at the moment. The minute he comes on, our performances usually take a nosedive as we can't hold the ball up front. Like pretty much everyone else, I really want him to do well, but I just can't see it in the current set up.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
See Clampy, I don't think he is at the moment. The minute he comes on, our performances usually take a nosedive as we can't hold the ball up front. Like pretty much everyone else, I really want him to do well, but I just can't see it in the current set up.
I know what you're saying but I think 'nosedive' is a tad harsh. Yes, he's a different player to Davis but his energy and willingness to run is the last thing opposition defenders want after 80 minutes.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
I didn't say it was true, it's just my opinion. You disagree, that's fine.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
I didn't say it was true, it's just my opinion. You disagree, that's fine.
I agree with you Clampy from what I saw @ Brentford and his previous record he is good player, its not his fault we don't create the chances he needs or give him a decent run of games.......no one can be judged when they are coming on for 10/15 minutes @ the end of games
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Do you think he might just be Kodjia insurance against JK getting injured early on in a match?
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
See Clampy, I don't think he is at the moment. The minute he comes on, our performances usually take a nosedive as we can't hold the ball up front. Like pretty much everyone else, I really want him to do well, but I just can't see it in the current set up.
I know what you're saying but I think 'nosedive' is a tad harsh. Yes, he's a different player to Davis but his energy and willingness to run is the last thing opposition defenders want after 80 minutes.
On reflection it probably is a bit, but I think there is definitely a noticeable dip when he comes on. In terms of opposition defenders, they seem to deal with him with relative ease.
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Darren Bent went through games touching the ball 8-9 times and being a non factor outside the box but very often he scored the crucial goal and all was fine until we signed Benteke.
Hogan needs to be scoring if he's contributing so little in the build up and he just looks a million miles away from that with the lack of confidence on display.
I think we should cut our losses and sign another targetman striker in January to tick things over. I imagine SB is thinking similar. In a funny way Gestede wouldn't be a bad option in the present squad.
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When can we put the "there's a good footballer in there somewhere" or "needs a run of games" soundbites to bed and all admit he's just not that good? I feel we need to rent a space in a church basement and all try and admit this one by one.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
I tend to agree, at least when O'Hare comes on he puts himself about. Hogan is obviously a decent player we just haven't seen it. Okay we don't seem to be playing to his strengths, but surely he has to adapt his game to suit.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
I think you said the same Bout Tonev.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
I didn't say it was true, it's just my opinion. You disagree, that's fine.
I agree with you Clampy from what I saw @ Brentford and his previous record he is good player, its not his fault we don't create the chances he needs or give him a decent run of games.......no one can be judged when they are coming on for 10/15 minutes @ the end of games
A player like Hogan will always look shit when he's replacing another striker when we're either shutting up shop or lumping it to save a game.
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When he starts a couple of games with KD as a partner, then a full and proper assessment can be made. 20 mins late in game is not a good benchmark, with the rest of the team consolidating the win at that stage and not pushing for a win from the first whistle.
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I think there's a decent footballer in Hogan. It hasn't quite happened here for him yet and it might not but I think he's a useful player to bring off the bench, albeit an expensive one.
How on earth is that remotely true? He hasn't done a single useful thing when coming on as a sub. All he did on Wednesday was give the ball away twice. The two appearance before that he touched the ball something like 4 times in each game. How is that useful whatsoever? I'd much rather see somebody like O'Hare, who came on and was industrious and attacking at the same time.
I didn't say it was true, it's just my opinion. You disagree, that's fine.
I agree with you Clampy from what I saw @ Brentford and his previous record he is good player, its not his fault we don't create the chances he needs or give him a decent run of games.......no one can be judged when they are coming on for 10/15 minutes @ the end of games
A player like Hogan will always look shit when he's replacing another striker when we're either shutting up shop or lumping it to save a game.
Plus we're not much good at countering, it feels to me. He's part of the reason why that's the case sometimes, because he can't really hold it up for long enough to link up with runners, but he doesn't even get the chance to nick a cheap one or two when the other team is chasing the game.
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He won’t evade the chop if we get to the Promised Land.
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How many times did he touch the ball today then?
Just cut our losses on him.
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A real chance to get involved today.
File under B for Balaban.
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He is Steve Bruce’s biggest signing.
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Sell in January, why did Bruce buy him? He certainly hasn’t used him well, but Hogan hasn’t taken his chances either
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
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A real chance to get involved today.
File under B for Balaban.
I am also reminded of Balaban in his pomp.
He offers the square root of nothing. Christ knows what has happened to him since we were conned.
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Huge missed opportunity today. Played alongside Davis for almost 90 minutes, even accounting for the fact he spent a wasted 15 minutes on the right wing.
It's just not going to work for him and us is it. I'm convinced there's a decent player there but I'm getting increasingly convinced we'll never see him appear in a Villa shirt.
Time to move on in January I think.
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Just not happening for Scott he has to be moved on sorry
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
If we can see this, I do not understand why Bruce can’t and played him today.
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Just not happening for Scott he has to be moved on sorry
Agreed. Hopeless today. Flog him in January, get some money back and reinvest it while we’re still in the mix.
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
If we can see this, I do not understand why Bruce can’t and played him today.
Out of loyalty because he signed him I’m guessing. He shouldn’t have started, and when we made the second sub he should have been replaced by O’Hare like for like but they left him on and took off Snodgrass instead. That was poor from Bruce.
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
If we can see this, I do not understand why Bruce can’t and played him today.
Out of loyalty because he signed him I’m guessing. He shouldn’t have started, and when we made the second sub he should have been replaced by O’Hare like for like but they left him on and took off Snodgrass instead. That was poor from Bruce.
To be fair Snodgrass was injured.
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
If we can see this, I do not understand why Bruce can’t and played him today.
Out of loyalty because he signed him I’m guessing. He shouldn’t have started, and when we made the second sub he should have been replaced by O’Hare like for like but they left him on and took off Snodgrass instead. That was poor from Bruce.
To be fair Snodgrass was injured.
I didn’t realise. He certainly didn’t look happy going off.
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Words fail me. Even more hopeless than I thought possible. Up there with Tonev for complete lack of talent and footballing ability.
If we can see this, I do not understand why Bruce can’t and played him today.
Out of loyalty because he signed him I’m guessing. He shouldn’t have started, and when we made the second sub he should have been replaced by O’Hare like for like but they left him on and took off Snodgrass instead. That was poor from Bruce.
To be fair Snodgrass was injured.
I didn’t realise. He certainly didn’t look happy going off.
You're right, he didn't. But for the 10 mins before you could see he was struggling and Bruce has since said that he was playing with a broken rib.
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WM made a massive drama over the Snodgrass sub...well Franksy did. Apparently he flung his shinpads in SB's direction?
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Bruce was on the touch line wasn’t he? Shin pads went into the Doug Out. Frustration at the situation nothing else.
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WM made a massive drama over the Snodgrass sub...well Franksy did. Apparently he flung his shinpads in SB's direction?
Shows what he was watching. He clearly took something off from under his shirt on the way off (guessing it was some kind of rib protector from the comments above) and threw that.
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Hogan is a metaphysical footballer. He seems to make the perfect run without actually ever recieving the ball, and no disappointing performance is ever really his fault.
Or he could just be crap. Tough call.
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I don't know. He's obviously suffering from a lack of confidence but watch his goals on youtube. They're not lucky, just getting the ball passed to him on the floor, or crossed accurately. If he was missing sitters all the time or messing up in front of goal that would be one thing. He just doesn't get the ball to miss sitters or accurate crosses.
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brentford played a system that benefitted him, you'd hope with us spending so much money on him that we had a plan on how to utilise him aswell but its looking more and more like we signed him purely because he scored goals without any idea of how to get the best out of him, he sure as hell isn't a fucking target man or a winger.
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People keep defending Hogan in that regard, but if it so clearly doesn't work, it's up to him to help change that. I hate the long ball and have sympathy with him there, but I refuse to believe players like Hourihane and Onomah are too dense to spot one of these perfect runs Hogan is supposed to make. So he liked it to feet at Brentford? Tough. Change your game. Develop. It's the only way it'll work for him under Bruce, because the guy is here to stay for the foreseeable, whereas Hogan may have seven or eight weeks left at Villa Park if he can't get his head right or take chances like the start he was given today.
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Just think that's daft. I mean Bruce must have known what kind of player he was? Like buying a sports car and wanting to drive it off-road. He seems to like it to feet while hanging off the shoulders of the defenders (the amount of offsides he beats at brentford is worth seeing). Surely that's not too hard for our midfield to adapt to, rather than try and turn him into Kodja?
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Its up to him to change his style? He obviously can't and that is all on Bruce for not doing his homework on him before signing him.
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What I'm getting at is that Hogan can scream until he's blue in the face that he wants to play one way, but it's obvious that Bruce has no intention of sending us out to do that. So Hogan can't just wait for it to click - what can he do to make it work? If I was him, and I would say it's a fair bet he's keen to find out, I'd be racking my brains to adapt so I don't get benched or sold.
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still dont get the thinking really. get our midfield to pass to him on the floor or tell him to become Kodja. I'm sorry but even if he does what kodja does he's never going to be any good at it. you could have asked Dwight York to do the same and he would have been crap at it as well.
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So what's the solution? Play him as we do now, where he's completely redundant and hope it works? Because, and I can't stress this enough, there is no evidence Steve Bruce is going to change the way we play to accommodate him. I'm not asking Hogan to become Kodjia, but I'm fed up with people excusing his non-performances on confidence. It's not working for him and there must be something he himself can adjust.
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The solution for me is to sell him in January and hopefully get some of the fee we payed for him back, then spend the money on a striker that will fit into Bruce's system.
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just play it on the floor in the last third. surely we're not hoofing it 100% of the time? Bruce can still do what he likes doing. if he gets in those positions with the ball and messes up then fair enough, but at least give him the chance. As it is there seems to be no understanding between him and the midfielders where he wants the ball played
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Square peg round hole. And he’s very square.
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The solution for me is to sell him in January and hopefully get some of the fee we payed for him back, then spend the money on a striker that will fit into Bruce's system.
Support Crouch.
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The solution for me is to sell him in January and hopefully get some of the fee we payed for him back, then spend the money on a striker that will fit into Bruce's system.
Support Crouch.
We had him once remember? He was the Scott Hogan of his day.
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The solution for me is to sell him in January and hopefully get some of the fee we payed for him back, then spend the money on a striker that will fit into Bruce's system.
Support Crouch.
We had him once remember? He was the Scott Hogan of his day.
Not really.
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He had a chance on Saturday to at least put a full shift in, yes he was pushed wide, but certain players and I think Scotty is one of them do not mind that as it gives them a ready made excuse and also a chance to hide.
I watched him on Saturday and to me he just did not give the effort that a player that realy is out to prove people wrong, in fact he appears to have fallen into the Gabby, Richards school of, best wage I am ever going to get and if the manager does not fancy me anymore, who am I to give a flying f....
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hugely disappointed in Hogan and his attitude. fuck the fucker.
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If you watched the last warm-up routine on Saturday you may have noticed that no one passed to him (it involved Whelan and Hourihane getting the ball, passing into either Adomah or Snodgrass and a ball being delivered into the centre with Davis and Hogan waiting: every pass went to Davis, without exception ... and it looked quite intentional). I wonder if he has simply become a persona non grata in the club?
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Hopefully Grealish will help his style of play, if they are both on the pitch at the same time. I noticed from the highlights on Saturday when Snodgrass had a long range effort there was a huge gap that Hogan was moving into and it just needed a crafty through ball from Snodgrass and he would have been in. Hogan was on the shoulders of the defenders but the ball was shot instead of played through. I hope he gets a chance to show what he has but I get the feeling it ain't gonna happen for him with the way we play.
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Hopefully Grealish will help his style of play, if they are both on the pitch at the same time. I noticed from the highlights on Saturday when Snodgrass had a long range effort there was a huge gap that Hogan was moving into and it just needed a crafty through ball from Snodgrass and he would have been in. Hogan was on the shoulders of the defenders but the ball was shot instead of played through. I hope he gets a chance to show what he has but I get the feeling it ain't gonna happen for him with the way we play.
I think he has shown what he has.
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The solution for me is to sell him in January and hopefully get some of the fee we payed for him back, then spend the money on a striker that will fit into Bruce's system.
Support Crouch.
We had him once remember? He was the Scott Hogan of his day.
Crouch would be brilliant in this division.
Problem is he's still Stoke's best striker so he's going nowhere unless they want to get relegated.
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We've got to the point now were by we don't use him in any capacity, I'm torn between being relieved that we've stopped using him as a target man substitute, and being pissed off that we blew our summer budget on him without having a plan on how to utilise him.
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Sell him, cut our losses and bring someone else in, who can adapt to the awkward way we play the ball forward.
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A friend of mine told me yesterday that one of his friends from Manchester (I know, I know) knows Scott Hogan's mum who said that there has been a fall out between Hogan and some of the other first team players resulting in them not passing to him??? He even said this was about 6 weeks/2 months ago which would support Mister E's comment/observation on the 6th Nov. My friend had Hogan in his fantasy team which is how the conversation came about. I hope it's bollocks, but it was a pretty random conversation. Not sure if his mum lives in the Manchester area? I presume she did at one point.
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A friend of mine told me yesterday that one of his friends from Manchester (I know, I know) knows Scott Hogan's mum who said that there has been a fall out between Hogan and some of the other first team players resulting in them not passing to him??? He even said this was about 6 weeks/2 months ago which would support Mister E's comment/observation on the 6th Nov. My friend had Hogan in his fantasy team which is how the conversation came about. I hope it's bollocks, but it was a pretty random conversation. Not sure if his mum lives in the Manchester area? I presume she did at one point.
I think he was born in the "second city".
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Played okay tonight i thought.. Dare i say it a glimpse of the player we thought we bought? Just need a manager now who plays to his strengths.
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On tonight I'd say there's a good player if we had a manager who had a clue how to use him.
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A friend of mine told me yesterday that one of his friends from Manchester (I know, I know) knows Scott Hogan's mum who said that there has been a fall out between Hogan and some of the other first team players resulting in them not passing to him??? He even said this was about 6 weeks/2 months ago which would support Mister E's comment/observation on the 6th Nov. My friend had Hogan in his fantasy team which is how the conversation came about. I hope it's bollocks, but it was a pretty random conversation. Not sure if his mum lives in the Manchester area? I presume she did at one point.
I think he was born in the "second city".
I’m sorry, I stopped reading that at the point of someone having Hogan in their fantasy team. I mean, that is clearly a piss taker at work.
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His offside goal was the sort of through ball/goal combination that he was thriving on at Brentford when we brought him. Instead of tring it again though we reverted back to using him as a fucking target man.
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A friend of mine told me yesterday that one of his friends from Manchester (I know, I know) knows Scott Hogan's mum who said that there has been a fall out between Hogan and some of the other first team players resulting in them not passing to him??? He even said this was about 6 weeks/2 months ago which would support Mister E's comment/observation on the 6th Nov. My friend had Hogan in his fantasy team which is how the conversation came about. I hope it's bollocks, but it was a pretty random conversation. Not sure if his mum lives in the Manchester area? I presume she did at one point.
I think he was born in the "second city".
I’m sorry, I stopped reading that at the point of someone having Hogan in their fantasy team. I mean, that is clearly a piss taker at work.
To be fair he did say Hogan was initially in his Fantasy football team but that he had to take him out.
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They do fantasy football for the championship?
You learn something new everyday.
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He seemed to be enjoying the celebrations after our goal with his teammates and his body language throughout was decent considering the scraps he was working off.
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If that's true about players falling out, how on earth haven't our coaches sorted that yet?!
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we're clutching at straws here - Hogan is never going to make it with us even if Dean Smith walked into BH tomorrow. Yet another awful buy, which, alongside the others in the past twoseasons, will ensure we are doomed to Chumps League football for a long time.
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They do fantasy football for the championship?
You learn something new everyday.
Apparently so - presto hey! https://fantasyfootball.telegraph.co.uk/championship/home
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I'd personally give him a run of games in the side now, until he gets injured again.
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I'd play him, if Bruce can work out that you need to pass it on the deck to make use of him.
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Play him with Davis, he needs two or three games in a row, no wonder his confidence is shot to bits.
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His run and cross for the goal was excellent forward play. And pretty much the only time we passed it around into that channel the whole game.
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His run and cross for the goal was excellent forward play. And pretty much the only time we passed it around into that channel the whole game.
Agreed and happy new year to you sir and fellow villains let's hope for a good 2018 season!
I would like to see 2 forward strikers Davis and Hogan paired together until strike brought in window. Loan from Premier league of target man Bruce preference or pacey striker. Thinking GA is limited despite chances.
Hogan is due his chance indeed and to play with support and to player strengths is just how to be like in life make use of what somehow or someone is best and good at and goals will come. This =wins and hoping for rise in places.
Let's keep up supports and make Happy new year again. Utv!
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you always cheer me up Skillz, HNY to you.
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Me too. HNY footy. Keep on taking the man and ball in your use of the English language.
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Although I don't rate Hogan, Bruce has to play two up top, Hogan included, for the foreseeable. We're just so impotent without Kodjia and at least Hogan did a bit against Brentford to show there's vital signs.
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How did he go today ?
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How did he go today ?
Same as usual didn't score a goal.
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For his own sanity Hogan needs a move away from Villa
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He was isolated.
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Hogan''s biggest failing is that he signed for a manager called Bruce. You don't score the amount of goals he did for Brentford and become crap overnight unless you sign for Steve Bruce.
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Hogan''s biggest failing is that he signed for a manager called Bruce. You don't score the amount of goals he did for Brentford and become crap overnight unless you sign for Steve Bruce.
Bruce has managed to take Hogan, McCormack and Kodjia and not manage the average goals per season for any one of them out of all three. That takes a special kind of moron.
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in fairness he has made Gabby prolific
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Sort of player we'll flog for nothing, and 2 years down the line he'll turn up at the likes of Bournemouth scoring for fun
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If we were the sort of team that has periods of pressure In attacking areas and creating chances, I think Hogan would do ok, not good enough for top of this league but ok.
Based on the way we are set up, doing ok is a stretch.
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If RHM can stay injury free for more than a week, surely Hogan’s on his way in January? Quite who’d take him I have no idea.
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He had a poor game again. We’re not helping him much of course for all the reasons mentioned multiple times above but he’s not helping himself much either. Starting to look like he’s sulking a bit. RHM did more in 15 minutes than he managed in the proceeding 75.
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How is it that Hepburn Murphy can make himself available for a pass and genuinely look a threat the moment he comes on, but Hogan can’t for every single minute he plays?
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How is it that Hepburn Murphy can make himself available for a pass and genuinely look a threat the moment he comes on, but Hogan can’t for every single minute he plays?
Yeah, I’d like to blame the manager for his woes but it’s not true. He’s not done nearly enough to justify his place. I accept that we don’t play to his strengths, but you have to show some kind of effort to adapt to your teammates, and I haven’t seen it.
It’s made more stark by the fact that kids like Davis and RHM come in from nowhere and have some impact, just doing the basics.
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right up there with Bosko as one of our all-time transfer fuck-ups
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We saw the difference a goal makes last night. Terrific header for the first goal, but even more so for the Snodgrass goal. Both showed he does have a bit of movement to create space for himself, both were good headers. Had Snodgrass looked up and passed early in the second half, he would have had a tap in for another.
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He's gonna come good I tell ya.
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I think the difference was Grealish was feeding to the ball Adomah whilst he was on the run past the fullback, so he gets his cross in early, this allows the forward to make his run and receive the ball. Normally we feed the ball sideways to Adomah who then has to beat the fullback before attempting a cross and the forward has made the run early but doesn't get the ball. The pace of the attacks made all the difference.
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The ball got moved a lot quicker and that helped. He was a lot busier after he scored, running to close, or driving with the ball. His header was superb and the one that Steele saved before our second was excellent too.
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Hopefully that display and goal will do him the world of good and get his Villa career up and running. I hope he can do a Juan Pablo Angel and now start banging them in. Which got me thinking how many different players have we had that have taken a season to settle in before they came good?
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Lovely headers in the game, hopefully with some confidence he'll really add to the team.
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Better. Another 15 goals by the end of the season and he will be starting to look like a good signing!
In fairness last 2-3 appearances he has started to lift his game, hopefully with the monkey ofnot scoring off his back it will start to click with him.
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
Mentioned it in another thread, but I thought he made some good runs in the box and attacked the near post really well last night. He looked a bit sharper overall and it was good to see him score.
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I think the difference was Grealish was feeding to the ball Adomah whilst he was on the run past the fullback, so he gets his cross in early, this allows the forward to make his run and receive the ball. Normally we feed the ball sideways to Adomah who then has to beat the fullback before attempting a cross and the forward has made the run early but doesn't get the ball. The pace of the attacks made all the difference.
This is the crux of it and is also the reason why I've been despairing of this manager's approach to games. Perhaps we've finally turned a corner. It's moving the ball quickly and getting runners available that opens up defences.
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
Not me. His run for Snodgrass second goal took defenders away & opened it up for Grealish to set up Snodgrass.
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
How do you know this Walmley? Not disputing it and I think it's a great thing if true, just wondered how you have heard it?
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Interview with him here.
Honest and some good stuff, although you can really sense his frustration that we haven't played to his strengths.
https://www.facebook.com/avfcofficial/videos/1789442301099831/
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
How do you know this Walmley? Not disputing it and I think it's a great thing if true, just wondered how you have heard it?
Bruce stated it before the Brentford game. Agnew has a great reputation with players apparently. Just what we needed imo.
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Agnew has been coaching him one-to-one so maybe we will start to see the player we thought he was. Delighted for him last night, top draw headers and his running off the ball is excellent but goes unnoticed by the fans and players!
How do you know this Walmley? Not disputing it and I think it's a great thing if true, just wondered how you have heard it?
Bruce stated it before the Brentford game. Agnew has a great reputation with players apparently. Just what we needed imo.
ok thanks. That's great stuff. Although I suspect his performance was probably more down to how the team played as a whole (in particular Grealish's influence) than individual coaching. But if he can get his tail up it would be fantastic for us.
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How many times did he say attack quickly, move it quickly and the chances will come. We have spent the season being long ball and quite ponderous. Hogan needs fast flowing attacking football. He thrived with Grealish, Adomah, Snodgrass and Hourihane all getting up with him.
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How many times did he say attack quickly, move it quickly and the chances will come. We have spent the season being long ball and quite ponderous. Hogan needs fast flowing attacking football. He thrived with Grealish, Adomah, Snodgrass and Hourihane all getting up with him.
What's really good is seeing a player in the squad making the same points that have been made on here.
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It will save us millions (we don’t have) on a new striker if we can utilize properly the striker we spent millions on.
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Particularly liked the closing statement - "What we've got in that dressing room, we'll be alright"
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Great interview. Really class attitude. He just wants to play and score, doesnt blame anyone but himself for problems. Cant ask for more really.
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It will save us millions (we don’t have) on a new striker if we can utilize properly the striker we spent millions on.
One of the differences yesterday was that Grealish in particular got past their midfield with the ball and was running at their defence. I think that is where Hogan comes into his own really as he does make some good runs. Case in point was Snodgrass's second yesterday, where Hogan made a run in the other direction and could have been slipped in as well.
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Interesting in the longer written interview in the express and star Hogan talks of having to learn the way the manager wants him to play. Suggests it's very much different his natural game. I think part of Bruce's job is to ensure thatwe also play to his strengths, and for the first time since he came we did that properly the other night. It's taken illness and injury to get to the personnel and team structure to let it happen but let's hope it is the way forward now.
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Injured again for tomorrow. Turned his ankle against Bristol City. Hopefully not too serious.
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Injured again for tomorrow. Turned his ankle against Bristol City. Hopefully not too serious.
I sincerely hope that the manager sees this as an opportunity: RHM should be given a starting slot.
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I like Hogan and am desperate for him to come good, but he’s got no chance of progressing if he keeps picking up poxy injuries.
If he’s made of glass then he’s no feckin good to anyone.
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All the stuff above about free flowing football is spot on
But let’s not forget that Bristol played into our hands. Most teams will continue to get 11 men behind the ball at villa park and to really get in our faces away. We’ve not proved capable of playing incisive passing football in this circumstances too often
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WM reckon the injury was nothing to worry about and he should be back for Forest.
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Hope not.
Seems to be the way it's gone for him here that he gets injured as soon as he gets a run of starts.
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Fantastic run for the goal yesterday. He basically had one chance and took it.
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Great attitude in his post match interview. He has got the appetite for the fight you have to give him that. Bruce coming out and saying he has been working with Agnew and suddenly he looks a player - because you did not have a fucking clue what to do with him Steve!
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His quotes suggesting we should cancel our search for a striker because he’s not giving up his spot are brilliant. Just love his attitude.
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Adding a fit and firing Scott Hogan together with the returning John Terry, Grealish, Jedi and Green to our post Christmas squad is the sort of riches other clubs in the division could only dream about.
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Great attitude in his post match interview. He has got the appetite for the fight you have to give him that. Bruce coming out and saying he has been working with Agnew and suddenly he looks a player - because you did not have a fucking clue what to do with him Steve!
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What was pleasing was how happy Snodgrass seemed for him too. Its one thing to not be in form or scoring but if you are unpopular as well you are going to struggle in the dressing room and our Hulk seems part of a very happy unit.
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Two of the most positive things from Saturday were Scott and Birkir fitting into the team so well. Two players that had pretty much been written off in terms of their Villa career playing a key role in an important win. They could both have a massive say in where we end up this season.
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Outstanding again from Scotty. So good to see him in the kind of form that made us buy him in the first place.
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Brilliant stuff, keep it up Scotty.
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Fair play to him, didn't think it would happen for him here but finally becoming the striker we all hoped he could be.
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If he could get anywhere around the 12+ mark between now and May I'd fancy our chances big time.
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Thank you Scott. Keep it up.
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Well played today Scott Hogan more next match please
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If he could get anywhere around the 12+ mark between now and May I'd fancy our chances big time.
I fancy them already, it's in our hands now and he's played a big part part in that over the last few games. His attitude is spot on too.
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Chuffed for him, we have finally started playing to his strengths and we are benefitting hugely.
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is it the grealish factor ere playing more balls to feet than slinging it in that's brought the change of fortunes, I don't know , but I like it.
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Chuffed for him, we have finally started playing to his strengths and we are benefitting hugely.
I’m delighted he’s starting to look like the player he was at Brentford, but we haven’t really changed that much. All of his recent goals have come from crosses including one corner, with three of them being headers. We’ve had crosses from Elmo, Albert and Snodgrass all season towards Davis, haven’t we?
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If he's scoring goals he's doing his job and long may it continue. We still need another striker this window though.
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(http://thumb.ibb.co/kFuN8b/great_scott.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kFuN8b)
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I’m sure grealish and snoddy’s form helps
But I agree - I think it’s confidence, fitness, Agnew and a bit of luck in the main part
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Chuffed for him, we have finally started playing to his strengths and we are benefitting hugely.
I’m delighted he’s starting to look like the player he was at Brentford, but we haven’t really changed that much. All of his recent goals have come from crosses including one corner, with three of them being headers. We’ve had crosses from Elmo, Albert and Snodgrass all season towards Davis, haven’t we?
The balls into him the past few weeks have been brilliant, hes been able to run onto them and just get a touch to steer it in, as he did reguarly for Brentford, previously we were playing floated long balls/crosses to him and getting no benefit at all.
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I think there's a lot to be said for allowing players to get to know each other's game and build up a bit of a rapport.
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We now have three guys who can whip in great crosses from wide positions. Throw in Jack and Hourihane who can do that too along with play clever balls from more central positions it poses opponents lots of problems when dealing with a forward who is very confident and makes intelligent runs.
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We now have three guys who can whip in great crosses from wide positions. Throw in Jack and Hourihane who can do that too along with play clever balls from more central positions it poses opponents lots of problems when dealing with a forward who is very confident and makes intelligent runs.
Said in the post match thread, but what I've picked up on in the last few games is how well he attacks the near post off crosses. I wonder if Agnew spotted that and instructed the wide players to whip in early crosses.
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We now have three guys who can whip in great crosses from wide positions. Throw in Jack and Hourihane who can do that too along with play clever balls from more central positions it poses opponents lots of problems when dealing with a forward who is very confident and makes intelligent runs.
Said in the post match thread, but what I've picked up on in the last few games is how well he attacks the near post off crosses. I wonder if Agnew spotted that and instructed the wide players to whip in early crosses.
I once posted that when Joe Cole made a clever run to the near post and scored, it was the first time in many years that I had seen us do it.
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He's probably having his longest fun of games which will have helped him too. Really pleased for him,many more to come hopefully.
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Thought the difference in the two halves was that in the first Elmo and Albert were delivering quick crosses to him where in the second Albert especially held on to the ball trying to get past the full back. Hogan became isolated for much of the second half.
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I'm delighted, he's making me look an absolute twat since I lost faith, and I couldn't be happier.
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I think his movement is his best attribute. He just gets in front of the defenders, it’s a tremendous skill.
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He reached rock bottom at Middlesbrough I thought. Had a poor game and stopped even showing for the ball. RHM came on, changed the game and it looked a bit ominous for Hogan.
Since then he seemed to shake himself out of it and looked a different player. Maybe some fresh ideas for Agnew helped him.
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He's on fire at the moment I'm so pleased for him long may it continue.
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Ive been very vocal in my criticism of Hogan but I'm delighted that he appears to have rammed my words of condemnation down my throat. Long may it continue and I thought he was desperately unlucky not to get a hat trick yesterday.
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Is there a bit of Bent about this guy, a poacher but does not bring much else to the game?
Don’t get me wrong, I am more than happy with that as long as we continue to play to his strength.
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He works way harder than Darren Bent in my opinion. And I’m talking about the pre injury one. With Bent for the most part you had cater to his game. Hogan compliments the overall approach to play and now on form is a clinical final piece to many of or moves.
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He reached rock bottom at Middlesbrough I thought. Had a poor game and stopped even showing for the ball. RHM came on, changed the game and it looked a bit ominous for Hogan.
Since then he seemed to shake himself out of it and looked a different player. Maybe some fresh ideas for Agnew helped him.
I think Grealish moving into midfield has also helped him. Before that, the emphasis was very much on the lone striker holding the ball up and they were often isolated which didn't suit his game at all.
Grealish has been carrying the ball forward from midfield which has meant Hogan can make runs in behind rather than be the focal point.
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He works way harder than Darren Bent in my opinion. And I’m talking about the pre injury one. With Bent for the most part you had cater to his game. Hogan compliments the overall approach to play and now on form is a clinical final piece to many of or moves.
Couldn’t agree more. I watched him closely yesterday and for me he was our hardest worker.
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Apparently he touched the ball 12 times on Saturday. Yet could easily have had a hat trick
That still sounds extremely unusual. But it’s definitely only possible if you’re playing much more through midfield. Previously we were very much going back to front and playing from there
I think that has to be down to grealish, Agnew and probably above all confidence
But Keinan will still have a massive role to play as it won’t work every week
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Apparently he touched the ball 12 times on Saturday. Yet could easily have had a hat trick
That still sounds extremely unusual. But it’s definitely only possible if you’re playing much more through midfield. Previously we were very much going back to front and playing from there
I think that has to be down to grealish, Agnew and probably above all confidence
But Keinan will still have a massive role to play as it won’t work every week
12 times, is what I was alluding to, he does not do hold up or build up play.( not sure he can)
He is a poacher and they thrive on quick ball and getting on the end of things.
As someone who had written him off I am delighted that he is now performing and long may it continue.
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There’s not being a hold up player and there’s barely touching the ball
Three successful passes all game according to the below. That’s pretty extraordinary. And I can’t really see him doing anything at premier league level with that sort of contribution. But it’s working at the moment.
https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1192524/LiveStatistics/England-Championship-2017-2018-Aston-Villa-Barnsley
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Apparently he touched the ball 12 times on Saturday. Yet could easily have had a hat trick
That still sounds extremely unusual. But it’s definitely only possible if you’re playing much more through midfield. Previously we were very much going back to front and playing from there
I think that has to be down to grealish, Agnew and probably above all confidence
But Keinan will still have
What about when he held the ball up following a clearence from their corner and drove the game on 30 yards, knocking it right to Grealish who squared it to Hourihane, who slotted wide. That was excellent hold up play.
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I guess that was one of the three
Or those stats are bollocks
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He only needed three touches for his goals and the effort that hit the post. Data is often awry. One touch, goal. I'm happy with that.
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is it the grealish factor ere playing more balls to feet than slinging it in that's brought the change of fortunes, I don't know , but I like it.
3 of Hogans 4 goals have been with his head.
Glad he is started scoring fingers crossed it continues.
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He'll get the winner at Bramall Lane and then be awarded the Championship's Player of the Month for Jan thus completing a crazy 12 months. His star finally on the rise a year after we bought him.
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He'll get the winner at Bramall Lane and then be awarded the Championship's Player of the Month for Jan thus completing a crazy 12 months. His star finally on the rise a year after we bought him.
I'm lovin' your optimism. Fingers crossed - it would be a nice story.
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Five in five now. I don't care how many times he touches the ball if it goes in. Excellent attitude and the hard work by the midfield to create the chances for him has finally seen him turn into an asset. Long may it continue.
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Hogan has definitely proved that if you continue to work hard, even if it isn't going your way, in time the results will come
It isn't a surprise though that if the team tries to play football the right way, strikers like hogan will thrive, I think this has a lot to do with grealish being fit and back in the team
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He really worked hard yesterday, covered well for Grealish on a few occasions too. Johnson still humped the ball up to him too often mind.
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I'm not a Hogan fan. Far from it in fact. But one thing I will never moan about is his work rate and effort. That simply can not be faulted.
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Like him, improving all the time as confidence builds
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I remember saying in the early part of the season that Hogan would benefit from Grealish being in the side.
I also remember Bruce talking about Grealish being the key and it's proving so. Because he's playing well it's giving Hogan, and others, the opportunity to score and get into more dangerous positions.
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Five in five now. I don't care how many times he touches the ball if it goes in. Excellent attitude and the hard work by the midfield to create the chances for him has finally seen him turn into an asset. Long may it continue.
Yep. He used to frustrate me a lot, but having watched him quite closely in his recent extended run in the side, it is crystal clear what his strengths are. If he is in the side and we don't play to those strengths then it is hardly his fault.
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Five in five now. I don't care how many times he touches the ball if it goes in. Excellent attitude and the hard work by the midfield to create the chances for him has finally seen him turn into an asset. Long may it continue.
Yep. He used to frustrate me a lot, but having watched him quite closely in his recent extended run in the side, it is crystal clear what his strengths are. If he is in the side and we don't play to those strengths then it is hardly his fault.
I still think he is a one trick pony, he will score goals if you get the all to him in scoring positions.
It’s a good trick though.
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He needs the ball to feet and played into the channels. Before Grealish returned, we had nobody who could do that. We were trying to change the way he played to suit us and alien to him. Now with a better player playing him in and creating the space for his runs, hes blossoming.
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The other good thing for Hogan is delivery from out wide is so much better from both Snodgrass and Adomah, quicker, faster and less time for the defence to set.
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The other good thing for Hogan is delivery from out wide is so much better from both Snodgrass and Adomah, quicker, faster and less time for the defence to set.
That's because we're playing higher up the pitch. 2 months ago they were getting the ball 40-50 yards from goal and having to run 15 yards down the wing before cutting in and delivering a cross, that extra time carrying the ball meant all the space got closed up. Now we're playing higher they're often taking 1-2 touches before crossing so the defence is still finding its shape and there are gaps for Hogan to exploit.
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I really admire the fact that Hogan works and works and works, closing down, chasing lost causes, putting defences under pressure, and recently getting some well deserved goals to boot. But what I will never understand is the fact that every single time Johnson boots the ball upfield from a goal kick or a standard clearance, Hogan NEVER gets his head on it. He jumps as high as he can but as he's only a little fella what chance does he have. If you don't believe me, watch on Sunday. Never happens.
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Grealish is key in two ways
He plays the passes through to hogan or the wingers (who then put it on a. Plate for him)
But just as importantly, grealish is key to us getting up the pitch. He moves into pockets and can deal with the ball in tight situations. This means that we don’t need Hogan to play as a target man. Which he can’t.
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Scott nominated for Championship player of the month, along with Daniel Ayala, James Maddison and Ryan Sessegnon.
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Hogan NEVER gets his head on it. He jumps as high as he can but as he's only a little fella what chance does he have
Agreed but makes it even more strange that several of his goals for us have been really good headers. Maybe its easier to get height etc when attacking the ball swung in rather than a huge punt down the middle that allows the brick shithouses (Is it just me but most Championship sides have 2 huge CB's) to pile straight through a CF?
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Hogan NEVER gets his head on it. He jumps as high as he can but as he's only a little fella what chance does he have
Agreed but makes it even more strange that several of his goals for us have been really good headers. Maybe its easier to get height etc when attacking the ball swung in rather than a huge punt down the middle that allows the brick shithouses (Is it just me but most Championship sides have 2 huge CB's) to pile straight through a CF?
There's also very little point him trying to win headers when the ball's just been punted long - it's not like he can flick it on to anyone when he's up front on his own.
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Seeing some suggestions that he may be injured. I hope these are untrue.
I guessed they weren't in today, given the press conference was held on Thursday.
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Unlucky Scott, keep the scoring going and grab next months award.
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Where’s the Hogan injury rumour come from?
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Some bloke on Facebook heard from a bloke, I think.
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Where’s the Hogan injury rumour come from?
Someone reported it on WM apparently. Fingers crossed it's not true.
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I think he's another who deserves a mention for yesterday. He bloke didn't stop running in the time he was on the pitch.
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Hogan NEVER gets his head on it. He jumps as high as he can but as he's only a little fella what chance does he have
Agreed but makes it even more strange that several of his goals for us have been really good headers. Maybe its easier to get height etc when attacking the ball swung in rather than a huge punt down the middle that allows the brick shithouses (Is it just me but most Championship sides have 2 huge CB's) to pile straight through a CF?
There's also very little point him trying to win headers when the ball's just been punted long - it's not like he can flick it on to anyone when he's up front on his own.
There were still quite a few of these yesterday. He won precisely none of them, so even though we don't do it that often, we really shouldn't bother at all when he's up front by himself. Not his fault at all, I should add.
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I said before the Fulham game - with grealish out of the side it won’t work with him as a lone striker
He won’t get the service
But just as importantly we end up hoofing balls to him that he can’t do anything with
Jack is our only midfielder who can accept the ball in tight positions to get us up the pitch without hitting a front man
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I agree, Jack is the key to getting the best out of Hogan. Without him he looks a very mediocre striker again. That header in the second half that was closer to the corner flag was pretty poor.
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Grab an is a much more complete player. If we sick with one up front it should be him.
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It has to be Davis or Grabban up top on Saturday
Can’t see two up top working as we never look right playing 442
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I agree, Jack is the key to getting the best out of Hogan. Without him he looks a very mediocre striker again. That header in the second half that was closer to the corner flag was pretty poor.
He mistimed the header, had he connected properly as he has been in recent weeks this debate would probably not be happening. With Albert unavailable we should consider putting Graban on the left which would allow us to play with a similar shape to our recent winning run.
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No disrespect to Scott but without balls fed through to him he "with the best will in the world" is a passenger, and how long did it take Johnstone to work out the big boot up field was counter productive, as said above if your not playing to Scotts strengths may as well not play him. Mr Bruce!
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Grab an is a much more complete player. If we sick with one up front it should be him.
I'd play him with Davis.
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No disrespect to Scott but without balls fed through to him he "with the best will in the world" is a passenger, and how long did it take Johnstone to work out the big boot up field was counter productive, as said above if your not playing to Scotts strengths may as well not play him. Mr Bruce!
I think it is a myth that he only needs balls threaded through to him. Most of his goals for us have been from crosses, he had the chance again last night and mistimed which is just one of those things, another night he would have buried it.
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One of the two positives last night was Grabban. He's a very confident lad and a half decent footballer too based on his 45 minutes.
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He certainly took the penalty with aplomb. Should be a starter for Saturday.
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No disrespect to Scott but without balls fed through to him he "with the best will in the world" is a passenger, and how long did it take Johnstone to work out the big boot up field was counter productive, as said above if your not playing to Scotts strengths may as well not play him. Mr Bruce!
I think it is a myth that he only needs balls threaded through to him. Most of his goals for us have been from crosses, he had the chance again last night and mistimed which is just one of those things, another night he would have buried it.
I agree that it's a myth but I also think your missing something as well. It's about tempo/timing. Grealish turns us into a side where we can play 2-3 passes and create a chance from nowhere (even if he isn't directly involved they know he's the threat and his movement catches them). Hogan responds to that and moves well in the space that gets created in those little bursts. Once Grealish isn't there we look predictable and pedestrian so defenders have to time to find their position and those gaps aren't around so Hogan has nowhere to play. This is why we have to find a like-for-like option and why so many people want o'hare to get a chance, it may or may not work but he does a similar job for the U23s so he has the skillset at least.
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No disrespect to Scott but without balls fed through to him he "with the best will in the world" is a passenger, and how long did it take Johnstone to work out the big boot up field was counter productive, as said above if your not playing to Scotts strengths may as well not play him. Mr Bruce!
I think it is a myth that he only needs balls threaded through to him. Most of his goals for us have been from crosses, he had the chance again last night and mistimed which is just one of those things, another night he would have buried it.
I agree that it's a myth but I also think your missing something as well. It's about tempo/timing. Grealish turns us into a side where we can play 2-3 passes and create a chance from nowhere (even if he isn't directly involved they know he's the threat and his movement catches them). Hogan responds to that and moves well in the space that gets created in those little bursts. Once Grealish isn't there we look predictable and pedestrian so defenders have to time to find their position and those gaps aren't around so Hogan has nowhere to play. This is why we have to find a like-for-like option and why so many people want o'hare to get a chance, it may or may not work but he does a similar job for the U23s so he has the skillset at least.
Or we need a more adaptable centre forward.
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Grabban looks better than Hogan at every area of the game if you ask me. Just about every game he plays Hogan has miles fewer touches than every other player on the pitch, for either team. He might run around chasing lost causes like a puppy with a balloon, but that's of little use really. Even when he had that brief spell of scoring a few, he added very little else up front.
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Or we need a more adaptable centre forward.
Of course. Personally I'd like to see us try the o'hare/hogan combo with Grabban on the left (if AA and Grealish are still out) before we drop Hogan but either works, how we've started the last 3 games just doesn't help anyone.
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Or we need a more adaptable centre forward.
Of course. Personally I'd like to see us try the o'hare/hogan combo with Grabban on the left (if AA and Grealish are still out) before we drop Hogan but either works, how we've started the last 3 games just doesn't help anyone.
We really need Adomah and Grealish back ASAP, as I think with them feeding Grabban, we'd go back to comfortably seeing off teams. A better team than Sheffield Wednesday would have battered us on Saturday.
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Grabban and Hogan actually worked well together, I thought, on Saturday although it wouldn't be something I'd persist with when AA and JG are back. Grabban has more physical presence and works across the defensive line vey well; I'd like to see him paired with JG and AA when available.
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Has to be Grealish behind Adomah, Grabban and Snodgrass when all fit imo.
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Has to be Grealish behind Adomah, Grabban and Snodgrass when all fit imo.
Yeah I think we will go back to the 4-1-4-1 formation when Grealish and Adomah return. Until they do though, playing 2 up front might be our best option.
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Does anyone know when the aforementioned pair will be back? I’ve skimmed through a few threads but can’t find any mention??
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Does anyone know when the aforementioned pair will be back? I’ve skimmed through a few threads but can’t find any mention??
There is a chance for Saturday apparently but we'll wait for more news before we get too excited.
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Grabban looks better than Hogan at every area of the game if you ask me. Just about every game he plays Hogan has miles fewer touches than every other player on the pitch, for either team.
I'd be surprised if those numbers are correct as Hogan needs at least two touches to control the ball. I still like him but we really do miss a proper centre forward.
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The fact we could win so many games playing one up front who barely touches the ball, is testimony to quite how good grealish has been
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Scotty seems to have turned to shit again - what's going on?
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He’s just an extremely limited player. If everybody is fit he’ll hopefully be dropped this weekend.
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Scotty seems to have turned to shit again - what's going on?
It is probably not a coincidence that his scoring dried up when Grealish and Adomah were injured. We are able to stretch teams and therefore create more space with those two.
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Scotty seems to have turned to shit again - what's going on?
It is probably not a coincidence that his scoring dried up when Grealish and Adomah were injured. We are able to stretch teams and therefore create more space with those two.
Exactly. And if Albert & Jack start on Saturday I'd be fine with Hogan starting too.
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I'm not sure I'd play them both on Saturday though. I don't think we'd be strong enough in the middle of the park against them.
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Exactly. And if Albert & Jack start on Saturday I'd be fine with Hogan starting too.
Not at the expense of Grabban or a midfielder.
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Exactly. And if Albert & Jack start on Saturday I'd be fine with Hogan starting too.
Not at the expense of Grabban or a midfielder.
It should be Grabban or Hogan, not both. Personally I lean towards Grabban, but would be fine with Hogan starting with Grabban to come off the bench.
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Hogan starts v turkey today. Good luck to him and hoping no injury. Hourihane also in starting line up.
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Hogan starts v turkey today. Good luck to him and hoping no injury. Hourihane also in starting line up.
He will gobble those balls up.
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Had one decent chance and missed it, chasing onto a ball but took it too wide of the goalie. Didn't see much but imagine Hourihane was quiet as ever without the howitzers.
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Hourihane set up Hogan's chance apparently.
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Hourihane set up Hogan's chance apparently.
That was Hendrick according to SportsJoeIE
Scott Hogan - 5.5
Making his international debut, the Aston Villa forward spurned a glorious chance to score the opener after 20 minutes. Beating the offside trap to latch onto Hendrick's defence-splitting pass, Hogan's heavy touch rounded the keeper but closed the angle, from which he could only blast the side-netting.
That was Ireland's best chance and the brightest moment from one of our attacking players, but it's a shame the clinical edge was lacking.
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So once again , Hogans` no hero
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Hogan starts v turkey today. Good luck to him and hoping no injury. Hourihane also in starting line up.
He will gobble those balls up.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-D_cbZdZRuC8/Vp6g82ENKwI/AAAAAAAAG64/w6vnRyNYVPA/s1600/4986448_ori.jpg)
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
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A haircut?
I think it will be a bit more than a haircut, unless we can find a Drunken Sailor Chariman option.
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Definitely a fringe player.
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Waste.
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I'd play him tomorrow. Since the Wolves game, Grabban has looked a bit lost on his own up front.
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
I’m sure Bruce will mullet over.
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
I’m sure Bruce will mullet over.
He needs time to gel
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Hopefully we can sell him for a decent wedge.
*One for the youngsters there.
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Aston villa? He's more Barnet.
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He couldn’t hit a duck’s arse with a banjo.
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Whairs the pun there?
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
I’m sure Bruce will mullet over.
He's a fringe player.
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Some of us may comb over to liking him.
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To be fair, he did look good on the You Tube highlights.
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His form has tapered out recently, but he looked good with those square cut balls from Albert. You need him running down the back and sides as it not, he's a 4 all over, at best.
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His goals will be vitalis in the playoffs
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He needs to find some form Sassoon.
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
I’m sure Bruce will mullet over.
He's a fringe player.
Already claimed "fringe" (see 8 above) - You'll need to think of another one!! 😀
I certainly wouldn't say he's Head & Shoulders above Grabban in the pecking order for strikers.
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If it's curtains for him at Villa we'll lose a few bob on the deal.
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He try’s to run with his hair and hunt with the hounds.
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If he curls in a brace in the play off final you could perm any one of two to be goal of the season
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It's more likely he won't have any plans for the weekend. Should be able to afford a nice holiday though.
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Credit to the man for not moaning about starting many games, he knows how to beehive.
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i've spent ten minutes combing through this ridiculous punathon
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Still think he would perform well in a flat top two with Kodjia.
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we've got to move Scotty on in the summer for his sake and ours even if that means taking a haircut on him
I’m sure Bruce will mullet over.
He's a fringe player.
Already claimed "fringe" (see 8 above) - You'll need to think of another one!! 😀
I certainly wouldn't say he's Head & Shoulders above Grabban in the pecking order for strikers.
Cut it out, or I'll have to trim your contributions, cut out the specific item you refer to and hang you out to dry.
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I think he’d benefit from having a 2nd striker up top with him. Someone like Niall Quiff
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Mohican finish pretty much anything in the 6 yard box though.
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I've heard he's had a brush with the law
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Mohican finish pretty much anything in the 6 yard box though.
Yeah, but he's too short - crap in the hair.
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Maybe tonight's game will be his part-in shot
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I thought he was blending in nicely with the rest of the crew.
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Can't wait to see the highlights.
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The keeper was just brushed aside there
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I really wish I hadn't started this - but I must say his goal was a cut above. Well done Scotty.
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If we win this league, with all his trophies John Terry is going to need long sideboards.
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How long is he out for?
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3months shorter than Richards?
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When did he get this groin injury? Did he have it last season? Which would explain why he was so crap 😃
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When did he get this groin injury? Did he have it last season? Which would explain why he was so crap 😃
I think it’s because his legs are too short for his body.
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Remember him?
Called up to the Ireland squad for the Denmark and Wales matches
Wonder if he'll perfom under new management
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He must be happier than any of us to see the back of Bruce.
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He must be happier than any of us to see the back of Bruce.
Even happier if Dean Smith comes in right
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Remember him?
Called up to the Ireland squad for the Denmark and Wales matches
Wonder if he'll perfom under new management
Poor bastard. 18 months of Bruce and then just as Bruce gets binned and things are looking up for him he gets MON.
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Be careful PWS. MON once read law. A book called The Law And Jake Wade.
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A certain Mr Hogan should be pleased by this appointment. Certainly doesn't pull any punches when asked about Brucey here....
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6262913/Aston-Villa-Scott-Hogan-accuses-Steve-Bruce-false-promises.html
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'It (a 4-1-4-1 formation) led to less chances, less touches in the box. But I did what the manager asked me to do, he only ever asked me to work hard.'
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'It (a 4-1-4-1 formation) led to less chances, less touches in the box. But I did what the manager asked me to do, he only ever asked me to work hard.'
Roll your sleeves up. Fuck me what a forward thinking tactic that is.
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I'll put up his direct quotes
Headline :
My head wasn't completely in it:' Scott Hogan accuses Steve Bruce of false promises at Aston Villa
'The most difficult thing in football is not playing when you're fit. The second most difficult is playing in a system where there is just no way on this earth it's suited to you, you are hung out to dry a little bit.
'It (a 4-1-4-1 formation) led to less chances, less touches in the box. But I did what the manager asked me to do, he only ever asked me to work hard.
'I knocked on his door a couple of days before the window shut just to find out what was going on. Sheff United were very interested.
I wasn't allowed to leave. He was adamant that he didn't want me to go, he said I had a future playing as a striker and I was assured we were going to change the way we were playing.
'So it was disappointing for me two days later when he signed a striker and nothing changed at all.
'I then had an injury, which didn't help, but for the past five weeks I've been fit. So it's frustrating, but it's more frustrating when there is no answer. If you have a reason why you're not playing, you can go and work on it.
'People say you've got to be professional, train your best and all that, but it's difficult because you know you're not getting anything out of it. My head wasn't completely in it if I'm honest, because you knew no matter what you did that week, you weren't going to play, so there was nothing you could do except go home.'
But whoever it is, it doesn't matter, you've got a clean slate. Lads who have been playing will be fearing for places and lads who haven't will be thinking, "This is my chance to establish myself in the team now, get the club to where it belongs and become a hero". Hopefully I can be one of those people.'
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There you go. That says everything about Steve Bruce.
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Might start with a clean slate with the management but has all to prove. He just does not look a 20 goals per season striker. Will take a complete change of tactics for him to receive positive service not sure if that is just a step too far.
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I'm not Scotty's biggest fan but let's see what a change of managerial philosophy might bring.
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Scott’s problem is that if we build a system to accommodate one forward, he’s not good enough to be it.
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Might start with a clean slate with the management but has all to prove. He just does not look a 20 goals per season striker. Will take a complete change of tactics for him to receive positive service not sure if that is just a step too far.
In fairness Harry Kane wouldn't have looked a 20 goal per season striker the way we were playing!!
Pair Hogan with Abraham up front, El Gazi and Bolasie wide with Jack linking in behind
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Any player left out by a manager is going to have a gripe, is Hogan really better than Tammy or Kodjia?
He can have no excuses now with the Dean Smith as manager, and if he's good enough he'll get a chance.
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There you go. That says everything about Steve Bruce.
Players not playing are going to moan, but yes that’s quite an indictment
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Scott’s problem is that if we build a system to accommodate one forward, he’s not good enough to be it.
I disagree, he was a free scoring forward at Brentford. Bruce had no confidence in him, no wonder Hogan got fed up. Interesting that Scott said he's been ready to play for 5 weeks. Bruce kept saying "he's not quite ready" for the last month or so. Bruce has gone down in my estimation.
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Scott’s problem is that if we build a system to accommodate one forward, he’s not good enough to be it.
I’d like to think the team will now tactically adapt to who is playing up front versus playing just playing one way irrespective of who our strikers are.
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Scott’s problem is that if we build a system to accommodate one forward, he’s not good enough to be it.
I disagree, he was a free scoring forward at Brentford. Bruce had no confidence in him, no wonder Hogan got fed up. Interesting that Scott said he's been ready to play for 5 weeks. Bruce kept saying "he's not quite ready" for the last month or so. Bruce has gone down in my estimation.
Bruce's bullshit about players almost always coincides with a transfer window. If Hogan was fit 5 weeks ago then the board may not have let him sign Tammy, so lie about it and then leave Hogan in limbo for another month to prove that we had to get Tammy in. Think back, he fucked us up in the striker department in his first window to ensure he got the money for Hogan, he spoke about building his team around Grealish at 10 as soon as he got injured (despite giving him about 10 minutes there in the 9-10 months to that point) so he could get Snodgrass. Kodjia was probably out for the rest of the season in Early December before coming back into full training at the end of Feb and eing available for the last 8-9 games. I'm fairly sure he said something about Jedinak before we signed Whelan as well.
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A certain Mr Hogan should be pleased by this appointment. Certainly doesn't pull any punches when asked about Brucey here....
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6262913/Aston-Villa-Scott-Hogan-accuses-Steve-Bruce-false-promises.html
#dontbuythedailymail
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A certain Mr Hogan should be pleased by this appointment. Certainly doesn't pull any punches when asked about Brucey here....
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6262913/Aston-Villa-Scott-Hogan-accuses-Steve-Bruce-false-promises.html
#dontbuythedailymail
Buy The Mail. It helps with identification.
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
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Why Bruce bought Hogan is a complete mystery, he was never going to perform if asked to work in a completely different structure. Almost as strange as not replacing centre-half 's you sell.
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
If it is to be two up top, regardless of whether one is Hogan or not, then I think Jack will have to nominally continue as one of the wide players, albeit with licence to roam a bit.
ie a one winger / one roamer formation, which should be OK going forward but might get a bit complicated defensively
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
No, that's Tammy Abraham's role.
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Also if we have more possession of the ball, win it back higher up the pitch, we may be able to fit in two strikers with Jack.
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Just the usual gripes from an out of favour player. A not very good one at that.
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Just the usual gripes from an out of favour player. A not very good one at that.
So his 20+ goals for Brentford were some kind of fluke or something?
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Just the usual gripes from an out of favour player. A not very good one at that.
Did you see the games that Hogan played - or was you like the rest of us watching the ball flying either at him or over his head from 40 yards away.
That moron Bruce would have "coached" Messi and Ronaldo into submission
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I think that’s fair enough from Hogan and most pertinent is to remember Bruce bought him and claimed he’d watched him for years. If you want anymore evidence around Bruce’s incompetence it’s purchasing Hogan and then playing a game completely unsuited to him.
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
We already have two loan strikers, I believe.
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I know we didn't play to Hogan's strengths and his confidence was probably low as a result but I've never been that impressed by him. The one I hope will really thrive is Grealish.
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Bruce has ruined so many players! The list grows. Thank God he's out of the club, totally useless! He's even made Jack look mediocre! Hogan should have a new lease of life with Smith at the helm.
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Didn't Smith play 4-2-3-1 at Brentford, with Hogan as the 1? If so, the problem here wasn't him playing up on his own, but that there was nobody behind feeding him with appropriate passes. He's no target man.
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Yep says it all. Not content with wasting money we didn’t have on a player he had no idea how to accommodate, he didn’t give him the dignity of knowing what to work on, or leaving when there were clubs in for him.
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Just the usual gripes from an out of favour player. A not very good one at that.
I don't blame Hogan at all. More like a useless Manager not knowing how to play him. Hogan scored 21 in 27 games for Brentford playing for a Manager knowing his strengths.
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Hogan has to take a little responsibility himself, he signed for Villa knowing Bruce was the manager and knowing how Bruce's Villa (the same as every other Bruce team in history) played, did he ask how he would fit in or if the team would be playing to his strengths or did he just see the £££s on the contract.
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Hogan has to take a little responsibility himself, he signed for Villa knowing Bruce was the manager and knowing how Bruce's Villa (the same as every other Bruce team in history) played, did he ask how he would fit in or if the team would be playing to his strengths or did he just see the £££s on the contract.
Not really.
"Do you want to come to work for us, we'll pay you £4 million over a three year contract"
"Yes, but what if I'm unsuitable for the culture of the organisation and the move turns out to be bad for both of us?"
"You will still be entitled to the full £4 million. And that's on top of all the cash you must have had piling up while you were playing for Stocksbridge Park Steels six years ago, before you got your big money move to Ashton United."
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
He played as a lone striker for Brentford
I think I've posted this about five times on this thread now so should probably stop
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Hogan points out what we all could see, he can't play as the loan striker. He needs to play as part of a front two and I could see him working well with Abraham. The problem is I can't work out how you get a system with two up front and Jack in the team. Over to the new manager.
He played as a lone striker for Brentford
I think I've posted this about five times on this thread now so should probably stop
Absolutely. Hogan could work just fine as a loan striker as long as the midfield is given licence to get forward and support him, something they never had under Bruce.
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There are a couple of things here. Firstly, we don't only have to play one way. More importantly it tells you all you need to know about Bruce and his bollocks re tracking Hogan for years and the outright lies about his fitness in press conferences.
I stick by my assessment that Bruce is a chancer and a bullshitter, with the squad building capacity of a hermit.
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Or
Players have a tendency to overstate their level of fitness because they want to play
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or that the truth is somewhere between the two.
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Scott’s problem is that if we build a system to accommodate one forward, he’s not good enough to be it.
I disagree, he was a free scoring forward at Brentford. Bruce had no confidence in him, no wonder Hogan got fed up. Interesting that Scott said he's been ready to play for 5 weeks. Bruce kept saying "he's not quite ready" for the last month or so. Bruce has gone down in my estimation.
Bruce's bullshit about players almost always coincides with a transfer window. If Hogan was fit 5 weeks ago then the board may not have let him sign Tammy, so lie about it and then leave Hogan in limbo for another month to prove that we had to get Tammy in. Think back, he fucked us up in the striker department in his first window to ensure he got the money for Hogan, he spoke about building his team around Grealish at 10 as soon as he got injured (despite giving him about 10 minutes there in the 9-10 months to that point) so he could get Snodgrass. Kodjia was probably out for the rest of the season in Early December before coming back into full training at the end of Feb and eing available for the last 8-9 games. I'm fairly sure he said something about Jedinak before we signed Whelan as well.
Interesting theory. Surely though Xia and Wyness could've just had a work with the physio to see what the real state of fitness was.
I maintain SB just looked at the championship scoring charts, saw Hogan's name, thought he must be good and signed him. Similar to us getting in McCormack.
A name for this level without any idea how to fit him into the system as he now confirms.
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Hogan has to take a little responsibility himself, he signed for Villa knowing Bruce was the manager and knowing how Bruce's Villa (the same as every other Bruce team in history) played, did he ask how he would fit in or if the team would be playing to his strengths or did he just see the £££s on the contract.
A friend of mine, a Brentford supporter told me that the money received for Hogan went quite a long way towards keeping Brentford afloat so he may just have been encouraged to join us, wages notwithstanding.
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Hogan has to take a little responsibility himself, he signed for Villa knowing Bruce was the manager and knowing how Bruce's Villa (the same as every other Bruce team in history) played, did he ask how he would fit in or if the team would be playing to his strengths or did he just see the £££s on the contract.
A friend of mine, a Brentford supporter told me that the money received for Hogan went quite a long way towards keeping Brentford afloat so he may just have been encouraged to join us, wages notwithstanding.
Maybe they should name a stand after him them in their new stadium.
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I think that’s fair enough from Hogan and most pertinent is to remember Bruce bought him and claimed he’d watched him for years. If you want anymore evidence around Bruce’s incompetence it’s purchasing Hogan and then playing a game completely unsuited to him.
Nails Bruce completely.A striker needs a supply line.Ours was launching the ball or getting crosses in.Anyone who watched Hogan for 30 minutes,would realise he was not suited to that style.Either adapt the style or don't waste a big transfer fee on such a player.
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Hogan has to take a little responsibility himself, he signed for Villa knowing Bruce was the manager and knowing how Bruce's Villa (the same as every other Bruce team in history) played, did he ask how he would fit in or if the team would be playing to his strengths or did he just see the £££s on the contract.
Also remember Brentford took a decent fee so they didn't really want to turn that down did they .
Player would not have been averse to coming villa but Brentford taking £12 to 15 million was what they are about .
A business sense move
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I think that’s fair enough from Hogan and most pertinent is to remember Bruce bought him and claimed he’d watched him for years. If you want anymore evidence around Bruce’s incompetence it’s purchasing Hogan and then playing a game completely unsuited to him.
Nails Bruce completely.A striker needs a supply line.Ours was launching the ball or getting crosses in.Anyone who watched Hogan for 30 minutes,would realise he was not suited to that style.Either adapt the style or don't waste a big transfer fee on such a player.
It really was a very odd transfer
Bruce had even spent the previous two months talking about a target man, and wanting to play Kodjia wide. He even tried to play Gabby there.
And then he signed Hogan. It just never seemed to make sense. And that was borne out
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Also remember Brentford took a decent fee so they didn't really want to turn that down did they .
Player would not have been averse to coming villa but Brentford taking £12 to 15 million was what they are about .
A business sense move
More like 9m i believe
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Doesn't Dean play with one up front? If so Scott's going to slug it out with Abraham with Kodjia on the left and Bolasie (when fully fit) on the right.
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Yeah I think he will play one up
Hard to play the kind of football he wants with two up, unless you got 352 or a diamond
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If Bruce lied re Hogan, perhaps he threw RHM under the bus after Yeovil for the same reason?
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Hogan didn't kick a ball in pre season
I really don't think it's odd that he wasn't considered match fit
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Hogan also up against Kodjia and Abraham for a starting role .
Possibly best two strikers in the league.
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Hogan didn't kick a ball in pre season
I really don't think it's odd that he wasn't considered match fit
So why not give him minutes with the reserves? Considering how often Bruce lied and Hogan was telling his international boss he was fit I find the Hogan side more believable.
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I do feel for Hogan but it has to be said he certainly didn’t shine in any game bar Bristol City at home. A good player would have made it work.
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Well we'll see won't we. I certain Smith will give him a chance and there may be a few people with egg on their face.
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Yes, I'm sure we'll all be devastated if he does well.
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Last thing I want is Hogan playing well and scoring lots of goals. I much prefer us being shit.
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Well we'll see won't we. I certain Smith will give him a chance and there may be a few people with egg on their face.
Who...who isn't pleased?
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Where's that come from? Nobody's said people won't be happy if he plays well. But he's been written off by plenty of people on here and if Smith does get the best out of him those comments will have have proven to be wrong.
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I guess so, that makes more sense. Got a few wires crossed there!
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Hogan also up against Kodjia and Abraham for a starting role .
Possibly best three strikers in the league.
Changed ever so slightly..
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From the goals I've seen, Abraham is a very similar player to Hogan, almost every goal scored in the six yard box. I'm sure with their Chelsea connection, Terry will make sure Abraham has the right attitude. Not sure about how Kodja will work out but he certainly has the talent, somebody just needs to get inside his head and get him playing for the team without killing his eye for goal.
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Hogan is one of the most miserable players I have ever seen, his whole demeanour was of someone who really did not want to be here - I suppose it is to be expected when your only brief is to work hard and run into channels
Lets see if he starts smiling now
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Hogan is one of the most miserable players I have ever seen, his whole demeanour was of someone who really did not want to be here - I suppose it is to be expected when your only brief is to work hard and run into channels
Lets see if he starts smiling now
I'd be fucking miserable in his position too. Having had an attack built around him before then pretty much not being used since a big transfer. Before anyone chips in with him being paid a fortune, it may soften the blow somewhat but the vast majority of footballers like playing the game, not just getting a big wedge every month.
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Hogan is one of the most miserable players I have ever seen, his whole demeanour was of someone who really did not want to be here - I suppose it is to be expected when your only brief is to work hard and run into channels
Lets see if he starts smiling now
I imagine he hasn't stopped smiling since Bruce was sacked.
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Hogan is one of the most miserable players I have ever seen, his whole demeanour was of someone who really did not want to be here - I suppose it is to be expected when your only brief is to work hard and run into channels
Lets see if he starts smiling now
I'd be fucking miserable in his position too. Having had an attack built around him before then pretty much not being used since a big transfer. Before anyone chips in with him being paid a fortune, it may soften the blow somewhat but the vast majority of footballers like playing the game, not just getting a big wedge every month.
Imagine coming to work every day and your boss who hired you to do one specific thing, something your resume is built around, something you have proved at a former employer you did very well indeed, puts you in a completely foreign situation at your new company where you don’t get utilized correctly and get no support to actually do what you are good at.
Look, Hogan isn’t perfect and I’m sure he’ll concede he could have done better, but fuck me Bruce completely wasted this opportunity. And as we can all see he found a way to do it with lots of other players at the club, especially the forwards.
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Hogan is one of the most miserable players I have ever seen, his whole demeanour was of someone who really did not want to be here - I suppose it is to be expected when your only brief is to work hard and run into channels
Lets see if he starts smiling now
I imagine he hasn't stopped smiling since Bruce was sacked.
I've been the same.
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He's got no excuses now. A manager who has got the best out of him previously, and a style of play that suits him. I really hope he proves me wrong.
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I’m looking to Saturday and if he’s there, great. If he’s not, equally, because our new manager is calling it. Maybe later, maybe not.
I just want to give the new manager and assistants the benefit of the doubt on al our players.
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Agreed Lou, clean slates all round.
Apart from Richards, obvs.
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Richards would be washing the players car if he was on my payroll.
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Agreed Lou, clean slates all round.
Apart from Richards, obvs.
Apart from him, yes ;)
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Although, if Richards suddenly flourished under the new leadership I might say, go for it, sunbeam.
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I do wonder, Terry would have watched Richards ''train'' last season, he may well have felt bad for him that he wasn't involved at all and be happy to at least get him training regularly with the first team.
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I do wonder, Terry would have watched Richards ''train'' last season, he may well have felt bad for him that he wasn't involved at all and be happy to at least get him training regularly with the first team.
Who knows what Terry witnessed last year.j
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Didn't impress too much he came on for the Republic of Ireland last night and put in one absolutely woeful cross towards the end.
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He was awful. Got bollocked by McLean for not collecting a pass to him that was a few feet away. had a tame header straight to their keeper and then the awful cross you mentioned. That was the total of his contribution. If he's going to start producing anything like we thought he would there is going to have to be a monumental change of attitude.
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It's a shame. He has a massive opportunity and you would have expected him to be busting a gut to catch Smith's eye.
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It's a shame. He has a massive opportunity and you would have expected him to be busting a gut to catch Smith's eye.
To be fair, Smith will base his decisions more on what he sees in training than a sub appearance for the ROI.
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It's a shame. He has a massive opportunity and you would have expected him to be busting a gut to catch Smith's eye.
To be fair, Smith will base his decisions more on what he sees in training than a sub appearance for the ROI.
He'll base it on everything he sees and a fizzing performance for Ireland would have surely helped his case more than one that lead people to question his attitude?
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It was a fifteen minute cameo for an incredibly limited international team and he won't exactly be sharp from match practice. Let him work with Deano and come Christmas he'll have won us a few points with winning goals, no sweat.
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It was a fifteen minute cameo for an incredibly limited international team and he won't exactly be sharp from match practice. Let him work with Deano and come Christmas he'll have won us a few points with winning goals, no sweat.
Looked to be carrying a bit of timber too
As for MONs Ireland 😫
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Hogan isn’t going to just walk into our side. And I’m sure just because his former boss is the new one he’s not expecting to. He’ll have to prove himself. But like many players in our squad he’s been underperforming under a useless lump who never gave him a chance based on the “tactics” employed. That will change now. It’s up to Hogan (and the others) to make the most of it.
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Agree, TV. Unless Smith decides we've not got the necessary tools to set up to suit Hogan, I have no doubt that we'll set up to suit Hogan. That's how Smith plays, it's how we'll play. It's why we bought Hogan, time to get our money's worth.
Over to you, Scott...
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Smithy said about Hogan vs Norwich "that he never got the service"
"We never really got the ball down the side of the centre backs which would have been really ideal for Scottie. He made some really good runs that we didn't quite see"
I put that down to the inept Hourihane who fails in forward passing.
Whelan there to screen and move on the ball
Whereas Hourihane is the more progressive ball playing midfielder supposedly ,but fails to do this.
Grealish too was not making thru balls or passing quick enough to Hogan's runs.
"Though in hindsight kodjia would have been better option "
Smithy assessing things but he got that one wrong playing Hogan .
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Two words - Get. Rid.
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"Scott's not bad at all at linking things up." Oh Dean....
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It's going to be interesting to see how he gets on now Smith is here so i'd give him a bit more time but he picks up too many injuries for my liking.
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It's going to be interesting to see how he gets on now Smith is here so i'd give him a bit more time but he picks up too many injuries for my liking.
As we should have known when we signed him.He had two half seasons at Rochdale and Brentford combined and and was often injured during his time at both clubs
I just dont know what he is good at
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It's going to be interesting to see how he gets on now Smith is here so i'd give him a bit more time but he picks up too many injuries for my liking.
As we should have known when we signed him.He had two half seasons at Rochdale and Brentford combined and and was often injured during his time at both clubs
I just dont know what he is good at
Well he scored 21 goals in 33 games in this division under our current manager so let's not write him off just yet.
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Big problem is his confidence is shot after two years of Bruceball.
I imagine Dean has already seen in training that this is completely different to the confidence he was showing in his year at Brentford.
Would love to be proven wrong but I don't see it happening for him here like McCormack who won't be getting another chance even with the change of manager.
As we've found to our cost over last 20 years once a striker loses his goalscoring touch here they rarely get it back. I can only really think of Dublin who had a couple of lean seasons and then had a prolific season before he finished his career here in defence.
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I think he might have had more joy than Abraham did tonight, The ball was largely on the deck and QPR didn't have any brick shithouses. Apart from the concourse at the School End.
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Should defo be given chance to play .
Abrahams blocked his path with Smith insistence on one central striker
Now I have confidence scottie can close down and press from front
He got a few bookings for his enthusiastic tackling !
But it's his confidence in scoring and finishing chances
Also him remaining injury free.
With him and Kodjia they have had a sad time with some injuries 2019 can be a new successful chapter.
The most pleasing thing Is he has worked with Smith and that he should get opportunity.
Also his thread should get more comment this year !
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He should get a chance in the fa Cup regardless
But I'm really not convinced. He lacks even the basics of hold up play. It's a bit of a luxury to have a striker who can only run onto through balls
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Scotty mate, if Tammy goes we're counting on you........
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I wouldn't count on Hogan to do anything other than look like a pub player who won the lottery
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A year ago he said this
I'm confident fans will see what they spent the money on," he told BBC WM.
"I've come here to score goals and I haven't. It beat me up that I couldn't score. There's reasons for that. I've come from a certain place in a certain way to a bigger place with a different way. But I'm still confident I'm the best striker at the club."
He was a prolific striker and I found this on his record
Rochdale (2013-14): 17 goals in 29 (4) games
Brentford (2016-17): 21 goals in 27 (6) games
Suffered injuries before and also had some bad luck with them at Villa.
Then Bruce under pressure went with Grabban as a main striker.
I do hope he gets some chance now .
He came out after Bruce left saying he was never getting chance despite training hard hope and seemed disillusioned.
Hopefully he given fair go but it's only Fa cup matches like this or a move to different system that would see him in team as Abrahams seemingly here to stay
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[ Invalid YouTube link ]
I'll put up his direct quotes
Headline :
My head wasn't completely in it:' Scott Hogan accuses Steve Bruce of false promises at Aston Villa
'The most difficult thing in football is not playing when you're fit. The second most difficult is playing in a system where there is just no way on this earth it's suited to you, you are hung out to dry a little bit.
'It (a 4-1-4-1 formation) led to less chances, less touches in the box. But I did what the manager asked me to do, he only ever asked me to work hard.
'I knocked on his door a couple of days before the window shut just to find out what was going on. Sheff United were very interested.
I wasn't allowed to leave. He was adamant that he didn't want me to go, he said I had a future playing as a striker and I was assured we were going to change the way we were playing.
'So it was disappointing for me two days later when he signed a striker and nothing changed at all.
'I then had an injury, which didn't help, but for the past five weeks I've been fit. So it's frustrating, but it's more frustrating when there is no answer. If you have a reason why you're not playing, you can go and work on it.
'People say you've got to be professional, train your best and all that, but it's difficult because you know you're not getting anything out of it. My head wasn't completely in it if I'm honest, because you knew no matter what you did that week, you weren't going to play, so there was nothing you could do except go home.'
But whoever it is, it doesn't matter, you've got a clean slate. Lads who have been playing will be fearing for places and lads who haven't will be thinking, "This is my chance to establish myself in the team now, get the club to where it belongs and become a hero". Hopefully I can be one of those people.'
Just revisting that reminds me now how well we are of not having Bruce shady here any more .
Also with Abraham and Kodjia 2 best strikers in league ahead of him for a central starting role he proper unlucky !
I think he be more included under Smith just because he knows him or at least makes him feel included but it's really tough in him as don't know how he break in.
It's only one side but Hogan seems mislead and also Bruce had pressure to get results never seemed to trust Hogan
I think now under Dean we will scout players to be effective and fit system and not just the best players in their position without realizing character- example McCormack and System - Hogan
I think and hope this window will be far better than previous regime and totally trust Smith and transfer committee to deliver in right areas
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Hogan is a mildly talented pub player and shouldn't feel bitter about anything.
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He's 26, and he'd had one good season at Rochdale, and one good half season at Brentford. Spending £12m on him based on that was unbelievably stupid. He hasn't got anything even remotely like the all round game to command that sort of fee. He shouldn't even be in the match day squad, I'd much rather see any of the U23 team get a chance ahead of him. Sell him for whatever we can get this January. It hasn't worked, and it isn't going to work. Hopefully somebody will think they can get a tune out of him, and pay us £4m or as close as possible.
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I disagree, guy gets signed for a massive fee by a manager who clearly has no idea how to use him, spends the best part of a year struggling to feed off scraps and then eventually gets a player behind him who starts dictating play in a way that works. Scores a 4 goals in 3 games and then sees a new striker come in, I can totally understand him finding it frustrating.
The most telling bit though is:
But I did what the manager asked me to do, he only ever asked me to work hard.
This is a guy who scored 2 in about 40 games before that little spell, the coaches and manager should've been talking to him all the time trying to work out how to get him into the game and getting chances, not just telling him to keep working hard.
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I still think there's a player in Hogan and if anyone's going to get a tune out of him it's Dean Smith so I'm willing to give him a chance.
But when you think of the money we've pissed away spent on strikers since we got relegated it's just frightening!
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Baffled as to why Hogan gets grief, when you consider A. There are so many bellends far more deserving of our ire, and B. His record as a striker pre villa vs ours as a club which ruins good players.
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Big chance for him tomorrow
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Will we ever play a system that would suit him?
Hope we can and he starts scoring.
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I disagree, guy gets signed for a massive fee by a manager who clearly has no idea how to use him, spends the best part of a year struggling to feed off scraps and then eventually gets a player behind him who starts dictating play in a way that works. Scores a 4 goals in 3 games and then sees a new striker come in, I can totally understand him finding it frustrating.
Other than the chance when the keeper kicked the ball straight to him, the goals he scored all came from crosses.
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I disagree, guy gets signed for a massive fee by a manager who clearly has no idea how to use him, spends the best part of a year struggling to feed off scraps and then eventually gets a player behind him who starts dictating play in a way that works. Scores a 4 goals in 3 games and then sees a new striker come in, I can totally understand him finding it frustrating.
Other than the chance when the keeper kicked the ball straight to him, the goals he scored all came from crosses.
I know, but Grealish still played a massive part in our turnaround in form this time last year where Hogan actually looked a good striker for a few weeks. As we're seeing right now Grealish changes the way we play even if it isn't reflected in massive numbers of assists.
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Will we ever play a system that would suit him?
Hope we can and he starts scoring.
Exactly !
Also how is he to get in ahead of Abraham ?
Abrahams is the Grabban of last season - and is main striker
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Did Smith ever play with two strikers at Brentford or Walsall? I still believe Hogan would be most effective playing off a big man - a bit like Michael Owen in his heyday.
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That's some top coaching there. Just work hard. Lolol.
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Did Smith ever play with two strikers at Brentford or Walsall? I still believe Hogan would be most effective playing off a big man - a bit like Michael Owen in his heyday.
Something that Bruce never really did yet he claims always played two up top.
Hogan was told system would change under Bruce
Now under Smith This current system is similar to 4-1-4-1 rather than a 4-3-3 well maybe a 4-1-2-2-1
Either way it's only one central role
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Will we ever play a system that would suit him?
Hope we can and he starts scoring.
Exactly !
Also how is he to get in ahead of Abraham ?
Abrahams is the Grabban of last season - and is main striker
Why should he get in ahead of Abraham? Abraham is just about the most lethal striker we've ever had and is a million miles ahead of Hogan in terms of all round ability.
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Will we ever play a system that would suit him?
Hope we can and he starts scoring.
Exactly !
Also how is he to get in ahead of Abraham ?
Abrahams is the Grabban of last season - and is main striker
Why should he get in ahead of Abraham? Abraham is just about the most lethal striker we've ever had and is a million miles ahead of Hogan in terms of all round ability.
Yes , so that's the debate .
Hogan perhaps would be involved if Abraham was not at club and could well fit Dean Smith preferred system and style of play.
That said if he never going to be involved then for good of everything sell him on.
The problem is Abraham is temporary .
He's been brilliant for villa absolutely . And I said he score 20+ goals and that was under Bruce system !!. Now he could get double what he's current on goals tally 32 + probably
Hogan left having a pot noodle and a wank
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Hogan left having a pot noodle and a wank
That just made me laugh like a drain, nice one!
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Hogan left having a pot noodle and a wank
That just made me laugh like a drain, nice one!
:)
I love H and V .
Up the villa !
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Wasted another opportunity today.
We can’t keep using the excuse that he needs a particular type of service to get the best out of him.
You don’t need a particular type of service to chase down, put deferenders under pressure or make a nuisance of yourself.
I am coming to the conclusion he is a lazy fucker, not an unlucky one.
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He's fucking mince. Get. Rid.
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Scott Hogan is th footballing equivalent of an STD
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Scott Hogan is th footballing equivalent of an STD
Surely an STD is preceded by some sort of 'action'?
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Scott Hogan is th footballing equivalent of an STD
Easily caught?
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I don't think he's lazy. Staggeringly unaware of any situation unfolding around him, but not lazy.
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I always thought Hogan didn't help himself. When everyone was saying that he wasn't getting the right service I thought it was on Hogan to amend his style to meet the midfield halfway, even if it wasn't his strength. He didn't and won't, and it won't happen for him here.
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He won't get an STD in a standing position not without a box to stand on.
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Sell him for 3m if you can.
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Him and McCormack to Motherwell for JMG's brothers.
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Him and McCormack to Motherwell for JMG's brothers.
Ask the bulb lady if she has a position for him. We could find him digs in Spalding.
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I could certainly find a hole for him.
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It’s never going to happen for him in a Villa shirt is it?
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Well, he really took his chance to cement his place in the team today.
*sarcastic mode*
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Mitt fit for purpose in a Sunday league team
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I thought he did well today setting up their first goal with his (not so) excellent first touch.
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A zero trick pony. I thought he might be ok and especially after Dean Smith came in but he just isn’t.
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A zero trick pony. I thought he might be ok and especially after Dean Smith came in but he just isn’t.
File firmly under Bosko Balaban
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He's shit and a 2m pound player tops.
Hey ho.
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He's shit and a 2m pound player tops.
Hey ho.
Two fucking pound more like bruv.
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I don't think he's lazy. Staggeringly unaware of any situation unfolding around him, but not lazy.
I disagree LFS - I view him as being totally disinterested and not showing for openings - he almost seems to look for a marker - certainly one of the poorest signings in the last 20 years and we've had our fair share . If Smith can't get him to recreate his Brentford goal scoring exploits then we need to get rid asap
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It may be little comfort, but he’s not stuck behind his gate, never to be seen again.
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If Hogan is the answer, I hate to think what the question might be. Unless it is something like, "Can you name a really shit current Villa striker?"
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It’s never going to happen for him in a Villa shirt is it?
Definitely not, going to have to try and get him off on loan somewhere or swap him for someone else.
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The obvious place to fly tip him is Brentford. As a make weight for somebody decent.
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Personally i don't think he's disinterested or lazy, just chronically lacking in confidence that he doesn't even try to make anything happen anymore. He had that one spell last season when he scored about 4 in 5 and it looked like he was getting his act together but then grabban came in and he was back to square one. Shame because he obviously did know where the goal was at one stage.
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The obvious place to fly tip him is Brentford. As a make weight for somebody decent.
I trust your knowledge in thoroughbreds, Hogan for a horse please. Take it from there.
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He's very average and one dimensional.
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He got one decent ball today and nearly scored. The rest of the time he was being asked to deal with hopeful punts from Elphick because central midfield was completely absent and the wingers were having a mare.
He's not the sort of player who's going to create something out of nothing. If you're looking for that head Kodjia's way. But if you want someone who can react around the box, something the likes of Gary Linekar, Ian Rush and Michael Owen made careers out of, then I think he's your man.
It just seems churlish to slate him today when he was stuck at the top of the worst performance we've seen in ages.
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He needed to score from that one decent ball today. I know Tammy missed the odd sitter here but he was pretty much a stick on to score from any decent cross as we saw with all his goals v Forest, QPR, PNE etc.
We're not finishing in the top 6 if we're waiting for Hogan to come good rest of the season. It's simply not a gamble worth taking when you factor in the potential lost millions.
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Any minute he's playing when Davis is fit is a minute wasted.
Hogan will never be good enough, Davis has a chance.
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Smith said in his interview with AVTV about the chance we had right after kick off that had Hogan not touched the ball McGinn would have had an empty net to put the ball into. I hope and pray that now means we'll never see the useless waste of a shirt again.
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We may as well start with 10 men, I've never seen a player so consistently offer so little.
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We started with 9 today.
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That's being generous.
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I think I influenced the game more than Hogan today
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I flushed more effective footballers down the toilet tgis morning.
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I think I influenced the game more than Hogan today
So did I, and I didn’t even go.
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I think I influenced the game more than Hogan today
So did I, and I didn’t even go.
Me too and I was playing a different sport.
|From what I've seen, heard and read I think that the complaints about Bruce that were posted yesterday are more indicative of Hogan's attitude than I wanted them to be. When you get sidelined like he has you have 2 options, you can be determined to prove the manager wrong and give everything (players often try too hard when they take this stance) or you can decide that the manager just doesn't like you and nothing will be good enough. Players that go that way tend to come in and look lazy/disinterested/unfit/etc and it seems pretty clear that's where his head is right now. Given that I'd suggest there's no point persevering with him (given our needs right now) because he's already given up on himself.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
Stainrod?
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
Stainrod?
Given we're a division lower probably yes.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
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Gary Penrice played a bit like Hogan.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
Christ, I'd forgotten about him. But even so, even he seemed to at least try and make a nuisance of himself.
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He works hard closing down defenders but somehow never manages an interception, often only a split second out. He would suit a team that shifts the ball quickly and pass well. Sadly that isn’t us. He had a terrible game today.
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Gary Penrice played a bit like Hogan.
Don't think he tended to play upfornt on his own though
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
Christ, I'd forgotten about him. But even so, even he seemed to at least try and make a nuisance of himself.
Plus he cost what, half a million.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
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He can run around a lot.
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He got one decent ball today and nearly scored. The rest of the time he was being asked to deal with hopeful punts from Elphick because central midfield was completely absent and the wingers were having a mare.
He's not the sort of player who's going to create something out of nothing. If you're looking for that head Kodjia's way. But if you want someone who can react around the box, something the likes of Gary Linekar, Ian Rush and Michael Owen made careers out of, then I think he's your man.
It just seems churlish to slate him today when he was stuck at the top of the worst performance we've seen in ages.
I largely agree with this. I worry that he's been written off without ever having the chance to show what he can do (post-Bruce). Sadly though, he hasn't shown enough to risk giving him a fair crack at it.
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Considering what we paid for Bowery compared to Hogan it has to be Hogan He does not even look interested most of the time
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Billy Myerscough was pretty bad but Johnny Dixon was the real attacking spearhead from an inside forward berth.
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That is an interesting story about Jordan Bowery. The story goes that he was on the open market for £250,000. We paid £500,000 for him I believe.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
I never saw enough of Balaban to know how crap he was.
Shame I can't say the same about Bowery.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
Good shout, he cost a fair bit.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
I never saw enough of Balaban to know how crap he was.
Shame I can't say the same about Bowery.
No one saw enough of Balaban.Can't even have a Villa T shirt printed 'I saw Bowery (or Balaban) score'
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
I never saw enough of Balaban to know how crap he was.
Shame I can't say the same about Bowery.
No one saw enough of Balaban.Can't even have a Villa T shirt printed 'I saw Bowery (or Balaban) score'
I saw him in a reserve game and he scored a penalty I think. He looked like he was running through treacle most of the time from memory.
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No point dressing it up, he’s the worst centre forward I’ve seen in a Villa shirt.
You’re having a laugh, mate. Jordan Bowery is easily the worst striker I’ve seen in 40 years watching this team. No one comes close to how shit he was.
This.
Jordan Bowery was a competition winner. I met a Chesterfield fan just after we signed who said he didn't even stand out for them!
Bosko Balaban is right up there.
I never saw enough of Balaban to know how crap he was.
Shame I can't say the same about Bowery.
I saw him make his debut, he came on as a sub against Manure to great acclaim, someone passed the ball to him and he stood on it and fell over.
It was quite comical, I think that was his Villa highlight.
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He's very one dimensional. If we could get players around him playing quick, intricate passing his movement could get goals but every time he plays no one seems to be anywhere near him and he's going to create very little through individual skill.
Signing him when we did shows how poor our thinking as a club was back then. There's no point signing a player like him unless you play a certain way. We just seemed to look at goals scored. I really hope we've learned our lessons as a club going forward.
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Bruce is on record saying he signed Hogan because "his stats were good".
Bruce was signing players as if he was playing Championship Manager.
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Less than 40 goals for Brentford and Rochdale and we shelled out nearly £10m for him. Disasterous.Simply not good enough.
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Hogan is basically a shaved Gary Penrice with a fat arse. He’s shit.
Goodnight
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Headless chicken - get rid.
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Bruce is on record saying he signed Hogan because "his stats were good".
Bruce was signing players as if he was playing Championship Manager.
Didn't know he actually had said that, I just imagine he was like Nyland and SB had been "tracking him for years."
My big fear at the time when signing him was our style was completely different to Brentford's and Hogan was only effective with quick short throughballs which we didn't really do as we relied on more individualism in final third which Kodjia could do.
If you look at the mountain of strikers SB has signed in his career many of them have just been flavour of the month type strikers and very few have been good long term strikers for the clubs he's been at.
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He's very one dimensional. If we could get players around him playing quick, intricate passing his movement could get goals but every time he plays no one seems to be anywhere near him and he's going to create very little through individual skill.
Signing him when we did shows how poor our thinking as a club was back then. There's no point signing a player like him unless you play a certain way. We just seemed to look at goals scored. I really hope we've learned our lessons as a club going forward.
Oh yeah, slick intricate passing like what Leeds, Swansea today and previously Brentford played.
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He's very one dimensional. If we could get players around him playing quick, intricate passing his movement could get goals but every time he plays no one seems to be anywhere near him and he's going to create very little through individual skill.
Signing him when we did shows how poor our thinking as a club was back then. There's no point signing a player like him unless you play a certain way. We just seemed to look at goals scored. I really hope we've learned our lessons as a club going forward.
Oh yeah, slick intricate passing like what Leeds, Swansea today and previously Brentford played.
We have played that aswell in last few months. Problem was Hogan still struggled to get into even those games even if he made it off the bench. Boro away only one when he made a bit of impact although of course it's not easy to make impact with 10 minute starts.
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Bruce is on record saying he signed Hogan because "his stats were good".
Bruce was signing players as if he was playing Championship Manager.
I doubt Bruce would do well on Championship Manager.
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Bruce is on record saying he signed Hogan because "his stats were good".
Bruce was signing players as if he was playing Championship Manager.
I doubt Bruce would do well on Championship Manager.
Dads promotion record is second to none.
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I get the Bowery comparison but we paid peanuts for him and took a bit of a punt. We paid about £8-10m for Hogan and he’s absolutely terrible. Like really really bad. You’d think if he thought himself he was struggling a bit he’d put himself about but he doesn’t even do that. This exactly the reason why Dean Smith needs a summer to mould his own side, nothwithstanding (and I do keep saying this I know ) I still think we can finish in the top 6.
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Exactly. You pay peanuts for a premier league punt and you take it on the chin. He also played well at stoke away (the Lowton game) iirc.
We paid top dollar as a championship club for Hogan and you expect a much better return.
I don’t buy the theory that all he fed on was long balls as we have said the same for 2 years now. We have to accept he’s had his chance and not took it, time and time again. Let’s move him on in the summer as doing it now will leave us with 2 strikers (assuming Abraham goes)
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I don’t want to get on any of our players’ backs but he’s been dreadful. I’m sure he’s better than he’s showing at the minute but for whatever reason it’s not working.
During our only decent passage yesterday, just after Davis and Lansbury came on I genuinely forgot Hogan was playing. He’s miles off the action and looks unfit. I know he’s Smith’s man but if he gets the nod when Tammy goes I’ll be amazed.
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I don’t want to get on any of our players’ backs but he’s been dreadful. I’m sure he’s better than he’s showing at the minute but for whatever reason it’s not working.
During our only decent passage yesterday, just after Davis and Lansbury came on I genuinely forgot Hogan was playing. He’s miles off the action and looks unfit. I know he’s Smith’s man but if he gets the nod when Tammy goes I’ll be amazed.
Probably because he made way for Davis.
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Ha, into the realms of making up reasons why he's shit.
I'm quite patient with players especially if they're at least trying. He was unlucky not to score yesterday and we played awful as a team. He can't be sharp from training sessions alone, I'd have given him more game time from the bench in recent weeks when we've been drawing too many games but unfortunately for him, up-front is where we've been very strong since his old gaffer came in.
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Smith must know him pretty well, I should think. He should also know when he's at his most effective. There's a reason why he doesn't start him in league games when previously he'd have been his first name on the team sheet, and it's because he's not the player he last saw at Brentford.
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Smith must know him pretty well, I should think. He should also know when he's at his most effective. There's a reason why he doesn't start him in league games when previously he'd have been his first name on the team sheet, and it's because he's not the player he last saw at Brentford.
It's also because Abraham has been knocking goals in every week. Even Kodjia doesn't start every game.
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I get the Bowery comparison but we paid peanuts for him and took a bit of a punt. We paid about £8-10m for Hogan and he’s absolutely terrible. Like really really bad. You’d think if he thought himself he was struggling a bit he’d put himself about but he doesn’t even do that. This exactly the reason why Dean Smith needs a summer to mould his own side, nothwithstanding (and I do keep saying this I know ) I still think we can finish in the top 6.
That's what frustrates me most about him. He may not be suited to the style of play, but he has literally no impact on the game at all. He isn't a pest to defenders and just gets brushed out of the way so easily. I remember a game last season where the defence had been so comfortable against Hogan throughout, only for Hepburn-Murphy to come on in the final stages and cause them all kind of problems. It's no just us either, as he has been exactly the same on the occasions I have seen him play for Ireland.
It just hasn't worked for him and it would probably suit both parties if he were to leave. I would definitely be looking at giving Davis opportunities before him for the rest of the season.
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I'm a big sceptic
But if anyone can get a tune out of him Smith can. We may as well see what he can do for the rest of the season
Although I'd start Kodjia next game with a plan to bring davis on if Kodjia is doing his frustrating act
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
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We may as well see what he can do for the rest of the season
Nah, you're alright.
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We may as well see what he can do for the rest of the season
Nah, you're alright.
I think if that happens, we're going to need to start switching our attemtions to the other end of the table.
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At least we didn't hump high balls up to him Saturday which is pointless and was pointless under Bruce. On Saturday's showing balls played to his feet are equally pointless. His touch is shocking.
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Balls to his feet have always been problematic too
Based on what we've seen so far he only really comes alive when a ball is played through or crossed
Maybe he does have more to his game and I'm up for giving him a chance to show it under Smith. But being a fox in the box and not much else just isn't enough nowadays
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He looks like a rookie kid whenever I've seen him play. No awareness of what's going on around him. Maybe his confidence is totally shot.
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The problem is that he lacks all the basic football skills to er play football.
So if he ain’t scoring we are playing with10 men.
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the Benny Hill music is all that's missing when he's running about on the pitch in all directions
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
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His strength is running onto the quick ball in behind. He does have good movement in that respect. But its a bit limited to say the least
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His strength is running onto the quick ball in behind. He does have good movement in that respect. But its a bit limited to say the least
It is, which is why he'll never make it in the Prem. But it's been demonstrated over and over again that a one trick pony can be incredibly effective in this division.
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Can't remember reading a player get such a slating on here for his footballing prowess or lack thereof. Feel kinda sorry for him.
He always comes across in interviews as someone who just wants to play.
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Hope he gets a move for his and our sake.
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Can't remember reading a player get such a slating on here for his footballing prowess or lack thereof. Feel kinda sorry for him.
He always comes across in interviews as someone who just wants to play.
He is very well paid for doing very little ......personally I think he looks totally disinterested but that's just my opinion
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Could is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that last paragraph.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Good comparison
Thing is with bent, even when he was scoring the team wasn't doing thay well. Same at Sunderland and Charlton. I just think its too limiting to have a centre fwd who basically just looks to score and contribute little else
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Hogan will never get a better supply line than he might get now with the likes of Kodjia, Bolasie, Albert and El Ghazi. With Abraham going, or gone, whatever, Hogan isn't going to get a better chance to show us we are wrong about him than the rest of this season.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Good comparison
Thing is with bent, even when he was scoring the team wasn't doing thay well. Same at Sunderland and Charlton. I just think its too limiting to have a centre fwd who basically just looks to score and contribute little else
Bent also had a bit of pace which worried defenders whereas Hogan does not.
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We'd all like him to have done well, but Hogan is a one trick pony and he's not even very good at that. No pace, too small, doesn't graft, doesn't score and can't create his own chances. A complete waste of time, space and money. Terrible signing...and a perfect example of why we are where we are.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Good comparison
Thing is with bent, even when he was scoring the team wasn't doing thay well. Same at Sunderland and Charlton. I just think its too limiting to have a centre fwd who basically just looks to score and contribute little else
Bent also had a bit of pace which worried defenders whereas Hogan does not.
Bent's pace went after that ankle injury in the McLeish season. He was scoring well in a crap team minus Young and Downing before then if I recall correctly.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Good comparison
Thing is with bent, even when he was scoring the team wasn't doing thay well. Same at Sunderland and Charlton. I just think its too limiting to have a centre fwd who basically just looks to score and contribute little else
Bent also had a bit of pace which worried defenders whereas Hogan does not.
Bent's pace went after that ankle injury in the McLeish season. He was scoring well in a crap team minus Young and Downing before then if I recall correctly.
Yep away at Wigan, innocuous challenge and think he trod on the ball, was never the same afterwards. Of course the substitution McLeish then made sealed his fate and the away crowd turned......
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Hogan will never get a better supply line than he might get now with the likes of Kodjia, Bolasie, Albert and El Ghazi. With Abraham going, or gone, whatever, Hogan isn't going to get a better chance to show us we are wrong about him than the rest of this season.
Have you seen the quality of the final ball from Bolasie and El Ghazi? Absolutely shocking the majority of the time.
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I must have heard 'we don't play to his strengths' a hundred times now. I'd like to know what these strengths are, because I haven't seen any.
We had the same with Darren Bent.
When he arrived we had Young and Downing as his supply line.
When they went He was a shadow of of his former self.
When Hogan arrived he had no supply line, But, with the likes of Jack, Bolasie, El Ghazi it's possible he could start firing again if he gets a bit of a run of games.
Good comparison
Thing is with bent, even when he was scoring the team wasn't doing thay well. Same at Sunderland and Charlton. I just think its too limiting to have a centre fwd who basically just looks to score and contribute little else
Bent also had a bit of pace which worried defenders whereas Hogan does not.
Bent was an England international when he came to us. He did well for us in the Premier League for the remainder of the season after he signed, only for it to go wrong under McLeish and injuries finished him off. Hogan has struggled against poor opposition for going on two years now.
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If we can somehow start playing the football Hogan thrives on, like he had with Brentford.
I’d be playing Hepburn-Murphy, I think he’d do a better job.
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If we can somehow start playing the football Hogan thrives on, like he had with Brentford.
I’d be playing Hepburn-Murphy, I think he’d do a better job.
Me too. On the few occasions I've seen RHM he looks to have something about him. Scored a great goal last night too, so he seems to be fit and in form. Thing is, if he can't get a game now, will he ever?
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Hogan will never get a better supply line than he might get now with the likes of Kodjia, Bolasie, Albert and El Ghazi. With Abraham going, or gone, whatever, Hogan isn't going to get a better chance to show us we are wrong about him than the rest of this season.
Have you seen the quality of the final ball from Bolasie and El Ghazi? Absolutely shocking the majority of the time.
No sure about that, some of Bolasie's crosses have been outstanding.
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And relax.
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Some of his crosses have been great. Not all of them but he's set a few up.
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Perhaps we might sell him to get funds towards improving other areas and keeping to FFP.
The new boss at Sheff Wed won't be interested but Wilder at Sheff U rates him and I've heard that Wolves are desperate to sign a new striker.
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Hogan will never get a better supply line than he might get now with the likes of Kodjia, Bolasie, Albert and El Ghazi. With Abraham going, or gone, whatever, Hogan isn't going to get a better chance to show us we are wrong about him than the rest of this season.
Have you seen the quality of the final ball from Bolasie and El Ghazi? Absolutely shocking the majority of the time.
I don't agree with that
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Perhaps we might sell him to get funds towards improving other areas and keeping to FFP.
The new boss at Sheff Wed won't be interested but Wilder at Sheff U rates him and I've heard that Wolves are desperate to sign a new striker.
His wages are the problem ...
well, that and the fact that he's shite.
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If we can somehow start playing the football Hogan thrives on, like he had with Brentford.
I’d be playing Hepburn-Murphy, I think he’d do a better job.
Eddie Murphy would do a better job, let’s face it
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can roll it in glitter
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can roll it in glitter
roll it in glitter
Or throw it....
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can roll it in glitter
roll it in glitter
Or throw it....
If you’re a west ham fan.
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can roll it in glitter
You can be sure some turd fondler artist has baked some stools in a kiln, varnished them with an acrylic resin and then given them a thorough Goldfinger treatment. Probably made piles as well the arsehole.
I played for a Sunday football team at Warwick University in the mid 1970's named Septic Rectums. It was a laugh at the time, but hurts you in the end.
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You can't polish a turd. Ever.
But you can roll it in glitter
You can be sure some turd fondler artist has baked some stools in a kiln, varnished them with an acrylic resin and then given them a thorough Goldfinger treatment. Probably made piles as well the arsehole.
I played for a Sunday football team at Warwick University in the mid 1970's named Septic Rectums. It was a laugh at the time, but hurts you in the end.
Bummm tish ;D
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Gone to Sheff Utd on loan then.
Don’t say it
Don’t say it
Don’t say it
Don’t say it
Don’t say it
So we’ve helped our chances by weakening a rival?
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Scott Hogan to Sheffield Utd on-loan until the end of the season.
https://www.sufc.co.uk/news/2019/january/hogan-speaks/
"I'm finally here and I can't wait to get started. There's no hiding from the fact it's been a difficult time at Villa, I've been there two years and had relative success, but personally it didn't really happen for me."
They said:
"Scott had options but he made it clear that he wanted to join us and that goes a long way in my book."
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'Realtive' 'success' even with my non fully understand of English that's not right ?!
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great response footy !
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I hope this is the first time that a club loaning a player to another team has INSISTED that he play against them.
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'Realtive' 'success' even with my non fully understand of English that's not right ?!
That's means I have had relative successful football career yippeeee :)
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In his eyes, Aston Villa have had ‘relative success’ over the past 9 years.
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Perhaps he just likes wearing red & white striped shirts and black shorts to get turned on to score!!
Sheff U and Brentford having identi-kits.
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Good news for player and both clubs. Wilder appears to be an excellent coach and gets a decent tune out of journeyman like Sharp and McGoldrick so there is hope for Hogan.
Was never going to happen for him at Villa Park. To be honest it was apparent very early on that we had our pants pulled down by Brentford on the price. Bruce's claims that he had been scouting him since his Rochdale days never seemed convincing.
McCormack and Hogan over 20m spent with neglible return, teams at our level shouldn't get away with that waste.
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Fair play to Smith .
He let some one go who he knows .
That says a lot about Hogan more than Smith.
Yes he wants game time but he gonna show more Everytime he gets any minutes on the pitch and didn't !
I like our coach he understands what type of players are needed.
Smith probably be diplomatic (around 1pm pre match conference ) if having to refer to this . He'll to say that Hogan gone off seeking football but like Deano did with Bolasie he's moving on those who aren't adding the Smith required effort !
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Good news for player and both clubs. Wilder appears to be an excellent coach and gets a decent tune out of journeyman like Sharp and McGoldrick so there is hope for Hogan.
Agree, though I think Sheff Utd might want to reserve judgement on that.
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Good news for player and both clubs. Wilder appears to be an excellent coach and gets a decent tune out of journeyman like Sharp and McGoldrick so there is hope for Hogan.
Was never going to happen for him at Villa Park. To be honest it was apparent very early on that we had our pants pulled down by Brentford on the price. Bruce's claims that he had been scouting him since his Rochdale days never seemed convincing.
McCormack and Hogan over 20m spent with neglible return, teams at our level shouldn't get away with that waste.
And we probably won't if we're not up this summer.
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I always liked Hogan but have to concede that it’s not worked out for him or for us.
Our style of play has never suited him and in more recent appearances, he hasn’t looked as bothered as previous.
It speaks volumes that Smith has decided to let him go despite him being a key part of his early Brentford team.
He goes with no ill feeling from me and I hope that his career can be kickstarted elsewhere so long as it does not negatively impact us.
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Don't see him playing much for them, they have five forwards at the club already.
Odd move to me.
You've got Sharp who's a 20 goal striker at this level, Leon Clarke hits 15 for them each year then you have McGoldrick who's been a regular starter for them.
They also signed Gary madine from Cardiff earlier this window.
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Hogan currently has more chance being promoted with Sheff Utd than with our lot - good luck to him, when he signed for us, him and Kodja were never going to work together as a partnership (especially as Kodja does not pass)
Leon Clarke has gone to Wigan
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Don't see him playing much for them, they have five forwards at the club already.
Odd move to me.
You've got Sharp who's a 20 goal striker at this level, Leon Clarke hits 15 for them each year then you have McGoldrick who's been a regular starter for them.
They also signed Gary madine from Cardiff earlier this window.
Clarke has gone to Wigan, but Sharpe is going to play unless his legs are hanging off. Wages off our books at least.
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Don't see him playing much for them, they have five forwards at the club already.
Odd move to me.
You've got Sharp who's a 20 goal striker at this level, Leon Clarke hits 15 for them each year then you have McGoldrick who's been a regular starter for them.
They also signed Gary madine from Cardiff earlier this window.
Sharp is old though and does get rested.
They play 3-5-2 I believe and impressive use of defenders and wing backs.
I always thought they lack cutting edge.
Despite billy sharp and Clarke last season.
8-10 goals for Hogan he does ok as long as chances created
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He never looked happy here and there did not seem any camaraderie with him and his fellow players - maybe he is a moody bugger, maybe he felt poorly treated by the likes of Bruce and co
Either way - I wish him no ill and hope he can resurrect his career elsewhere
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Do we get a fee or are his wages so high that we only got an offer of part-subsidising them? Bitten again with our reckless spending.
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Wonder who he’s on about.
"I've watched teams with big egos and I don't like seeing it. But here, you see the lads will go that bit extra for each other and it pays dividends in the end, they'll end up running you into the ground or score four or five past you. "I know they did it to Villa earlier this season and they absolutely destroyed them. There is nothing like that in this dressing room which is the best thing about it." Despite citing September's 4-1 victory over his parent club as evidence of their potential it was eight months earlier, following Villa's narrow win at Bramall Lane, when Hogan first became a fan of United's attack-minded football.
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Wonder who he’s on about.
"I've watched teams with big egos and I don't like seeing it. But here, you see the lads will go that bit extra for each other and it pays dividends in the end, they'll end up running you into the ground or score four or five past you. "I know they did it to Villa earlier this season and they absolutely destroyed them. There is nothing like that in this dressing room which is the best thing about it." Despite citing September's 4-1 victory over his parent club as evidence of their potential it was eight months earlier, following Villa's narrow win at Bramall Lane, when Hogan first became a fan of United's attack-minded football.
He's got no real incentive to be making this stuff up. I guess that one man's (Bruce's) 'big character', i.e. Terry, Snodgrass (who, to be fair, always came across as a decent bloke to me), Grealish etc, is another man's egotist (and again, to be fair, the evisceration of his own self-confidence might make Tom Carroll seem like a Charlie Big Potatoes to him).
Edit: then again, I'm not sure I'd be so publicly bitter to an organisation that had guaranteed me £5m that I didn't really deserve.
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Exactly. Really gets on my tayters the way they go on.
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Wonder who he’s on about.
"I've watched teams with big egos and I don't like seeing it. But here, you see the lads will go that bit extra for each other and it pays dividends in the end, they'll end up running you into the ground or score four or five past you. "I know they did it to Villa earlier this season and they absolutely destroyed them. There is nothing like that in this dressing room which is the best thing about it." Despite citing September's 4-1 victory over his parent club as evidence of their potential it was eight months earlier, following Villa's narrow win at Bramall Lane, when Hogan first became a fan of United's attack-minded football.
He's got no real incentive to be making this stuff up. I guess that one man's (Bruce's) 'big character', i.e. Terry, Snodgrass (who, to be fair, always came across as a decent bloke to me), Grealish etc, is another man's egotist (and again, to be fair, the evisceration of his own self-confidence might make Tom Carroll seem like a Charlie Big Potatoes to him).
Edit: then again, I'm not sure I'd be so publicly bitter to an organisation that had guaranteed me £5m that I didn't really deserve.
And one that is your employer....
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Exactly. Really gets on my tayters the way they go on.
He’s obviously not expecting to be recalled and probably expects his loan to be made permanent in the summer.
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Bitter little twat.
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Bitter shit little twat.
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Agreed. If he is referring to his Villa team mates, he should be careful not to start badmouthing people at a place he will/might have to go back to in a few months time.
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Hope he does well so we can recoup some money for him, but he really was poor for us. So off the pace.
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Did he say he's had ample opportunity to make his mark in a poor Villa side? Did he say he's frustrated with himself that he hasn't made a success of it especially given the huge financial outlay by the club?
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Nope. It's all the bigger boys fault.
Small time little cock wipe.
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If he made those comments, then he is a total prick.
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If Hogan was referring to Villa who might he have been referring to I wonder? Gabby last season? The likes of Richards still walking the corridors of BMH? Bruce? Current 1st team squad players? Who knows, there are probably ego players in every team. That said he should have kept his mouth shut bigging up a club he's only on loan to probably at the expense of one still paying his wages. The reality is he has been a huge disappointnent, clearly Villa were too big a club for him and at best he's only a championship player and he's certainly not been at his best since bruce brought him in (bruce had a part in this as well as the player).
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The quotes are from an article in the Yorkshire Evening Post (https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/football/sheffield-united/sheffield-united-v-bolton-wanderers-scott-hogan-happy-to-be-back-on-familiar-ground-in-sheffield-1-9572041)and taken in context are not quite as controversial as it is first appears. In fact, it could reasonably be argued that he is not taking about us at all.
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Yep, he's clearly not having a pop at us at all.
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The sniveling reasonable little prick.
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Hogan continued his Saturday routine of sitting on the bench for 90 minutes again.
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Not sure as to why we didn’t sell him rather than loan him. Obvious he doesn’t want to be at the villa
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I recall watching the players "warm up" during half time vs Wigan last season. There was zero synergy between Hogan and the other subs. He never looked as though he fitted in at all
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Too thick to realise we still own him.
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Hogan continued his Saturday routine of sitting on the bench for 90 minutes again.
With the form Billy Sharp's in at the moment, that's where he's likely to remain.
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The rent-a-has-been crew brought out of mothballs for Sky's "epic" Deadline Day were all getting a hard on over Scott Hogan using words like "electric" and "pacey" to describe him. You begin to understand how the unwary (or downright thick) pay such stupid money for mediocre players. They listen to their mates on the manager go round.
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Hopefully Brian those days are behind us with NSWE. I was going to cancel my ST for next season, but it could actually prove to be the most interesting since relegation with lots of deadwood out of contract and others sure to be shown the door one way or the other.
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A few people on Twitter are suggesting Hogans move to Sheffield Utd is made permanent, on promotion.
I hope so, that would be a very smart bit of business.
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Scored yesterday, but actually nearly missed!
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A few people on Twitter are suggesting Hogans move to Sheffield Utd is made permanent, on promotion.
I hope so, that would be a very smart bit of business.
That would be great. Perhaps we could offer them a 2 for 1 deal and they could take McCormack too.
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What!s the point. It’s not as if DS wants him here. Get shot and be ruthless
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anything is better than nothing, I suppose going to Stoke really is out of sight, out of mind.
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anything is better than nothing, I suppose going to Stoke really is out of sight, out of mind.
Stoke need a goal scorer though.
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I'd refuse to go to Stoke.
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I suspect wages are the issue with selling him so if a loan deal gets some money in to the club for a player who realistically is far from Premier League quality then why not.
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At the end of last season he said he needs games (and obviously he needs to get his confidence back although he didn't say that) if Stoke can give him the games I think he'd be bordering on insane not to go (especially if he wants more Ireland caps). With Stoke and Albion both being in the Premier League they've got decent facilities etc so it would surely be a no brainer. He said if he gets 40 games he's confident he can get 25 goals so he obviously still has lots of self belief.
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personally i think Hogan and Stoke are a good fit
he's not going to get a look in next season at Villa, and Stoke are a bigger club than Brentford where he can take a fresh start get a few goals and become a good championship striker like the rest of good championship strikers
then we might get a bit of a transfer fee for him back
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Apparently there are not many Stoke fans that are happy with this news and some Bitters are well, just bitter at the thought of downgrading to Hogan
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we want this done - Jones is only a few games from the tin tack I think, his results have been very poor.
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Apparently there are not many Stoke fans that are happy with this news and some Bitters are well, just bitter at the thought of downgrading to Hogan
Maybe they should realise that Hogan is downgrading to them!
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A few people on Twitter are suggesting Hogans move to Sheffield Utd is made permanent, on promotion.
I hope so, that would be a very smart bit of business.
That would be great. Perhaps we could offer them a 2 for 1 deal and they could take McCormack too.
McCormack has gone
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Hogan will always score goals in the right circumstances. The opposition playing without a defence on the field for example.
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Stoke for the season confirmed.
Hope he bags them in.
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Any mention of an option or commitment to buy at end of loan?
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Hope he goes there and does well. He's never whinged about things. He's just got his head down and got on with it.
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I'm surprised Stoke haven't taken Whelan back on a free. Think he's still got another decent year in him at Championship level.
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That leaves just Wesley, Kodjia and Davis as strikers ? A couple of injuries and we're screwed up front. This league is unforgiving. A new striker by 5.00pm tomorrow is essential!
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https://www.stokecityfc.com/news/2019/august/Great-Scott/
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That leaves just Wesley, Kodjia and Davis as strikers ? A couple of injuries and we're screwed up front. This league is unforgiving. A new striker by 5.00pm tomorrow is essential!
I'm glad I don't need to worry, you do all the worrying for me.
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I'd very much like to know what the club is making out of this if, as reported by some, we are still covering the majority of his wages. I don't rate Hogan but given RHM is out on loan too, and we can't depend on either Kodjia or David's injury record, seems ill-advised to me.
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Would we get a loan fee on top of the bit of his wages they pay or no fee and more of his wages covered?
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I'd very much like to know what the club is making out of this if, as reported by some, we are still covering the majority of his wages. I don't rate Hogan but given RHM is out on loan too, and we can't depend on either Kodjia or David's injury record, seems ill-advised to me.
It's not about making anything. We have too many players over 21 and have to name a 25 man squad. If there's no chance of him getting into that then we're better off putting him on loan and hoping he shows enough to be worth something to us next summer.
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I can’t remember now . But didn't Stoke try to buy Chester on the cheap last season ? I wouldn’t be doing them any favours if they did.
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Best of luck Scott.
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Awful signing.
He was previously valued at 3 and 6 then Bruce paid #12mil.
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Like others, I hope that there's an obligation to buy if he plays so many games. He was just never cut out for Villa, although would have done better under Dean Smith, but we've simply moved on! Good luck to him, I hope he scores goals, particularly against team in blue!
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It looks as though Hogan is, at least temporarily, a replacement for Berahino who they have just released - £12M for just 5 goals, a drug ban and a drink/drive conviction is up there with the worst of Villa's spending excesses in the last 20 years.
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The Championship is Hogans level and that is on the caveat that he is the right team that can provide him the right kind of service. He will never be the kind of player that can create something out of nothing and needs to be fed through balls close to the box (because he has no pace) and low crosses or scraps in the box (because he’s too small to win a header). Nothing against the man but hope this turns into a permanent move for all concerned.
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Are Stoke resurfacing a car park? Only reason I can think we are lending them a traffic cone.
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I'll miss his Hobbit running.
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How long will he have left on his deal next summer, a year? Even with a good season and a permanent transfer in the offing we'll get very little for him. Still, no one wins with him being here so it's a decent move overall.
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"Hi Christian we would like to take one of your players off you."
"Oh, who?"
"Hogan. We would like to loan him for the season. But we don't want to pay for him and we want you to keep paying most of his wages. Is that alright?"
Got to wonder how these conversations go.
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He looked like he might be OK for a few weeks in January 2018. As career summaries go it's not a great one.
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Good luck to him. He appears to be a good professional albeit slightly short or required ability for top two divisions.
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Best of luck Scott, I hope that you do well at Stoke and get your career back on track. You will not be the first to fail at the Villa and you certainly won't be the last!
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Was apparent early on that Hogan didn't fit the type of football that Bruce preferred. So much for his scouting of Hogan since his Rochdale days. There was a brief flicker of form the season after but Grabban came in and was vastly superior. Disappointing that there was no improvement from Hogan once Smith came in, though again Abraham was a far better option.
Arguably one of our worst ever signings in terms of value for money.
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He looked like he might be OK for a few weeks in January 2018. As career summaries go it's not a great one.
Yes he did and I really hoped he’d kick on from that, but it wasn’t to be.
I hope it goes well for him at Stoke and everyone comes out a winner.
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The Championship is Hogans level and that is on the caveat that he is the right team that can provide him the right kind of service. He will never be the kind of player that can create something out of nothing and needs to be fed through balls close to the box (because he has no pace) and low crosses or scraps in the box (because he’s too small to win a header). Nothing against the man but hope this turns into a permanent move for all concerned.
For the very reasons that you've indicated in your post, I suspect it won't.......
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He did an impressive first interview on his arrival. Seems like a sound bloke, hope it goes well for him at Stoke. Bruce, Wyness the Doc have a lot to answer for - so glad we've got an actual structure/ transfer policy now - rather than some throw away/made up sound bite in the form of a broken, misfiring, Villa Engine.
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We simply have to own up to this being one of several egregious signings made in the first season we went down. Hopefully those days are behind us.
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Yes I too hope the days of us going down are behind us.
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Interesting to see his introduction interview at Stoke.
He started by saying it was ‘a weight of his shoulders to get away from Villa’ before quickly saying ‘ I mean leave Villa’.
I guess he hasn’t been happy at the club which would explain why he has been so shit.
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Interesting to see his introduction interview at Stoke.
He started by saying it was ‘a weight of his shoulders to get away from Villa’ before quickly saying ‘ I mean leave Villa’.
I guess he hasn’t been happy at the club which would explain why he has been so shit.
That and the fact that he *is* shit.
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I doubt he'll find it much easier at Stoke, the natives aren't happy. Ten years in the premier league tends to give clubs a divine right to be there mentality (see also Leeds).
Do Stoke actually play the ball on the grass nowadays? He's kind of screwed if it's still long throws set pieces and hit the front man early rubbish.
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Link to Hogie's interview?
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Interesting to see his introduction interview at Stoke.
He started by saying it was ‘a weight of his shoulders to get away from Villa’ before quickly saying ‘ I mean leave Villa’.
I guess he hasn’t been happy at the club which would explain why he has been so shit.
How does he explain his poor form at SheffU, I wonder?
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Looks like a nice lad putting on a brave face to me.
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Interesting to see his introduction interview at Stoke.
He started by saying it was ‘a weight of his shoulders to get away from Villa’ before quickly saying ‘ I mean leave Villa’.
I guess he hasn’t been happy at the club which would explain why he has been so shit.
Not only is he shit, but he’s full of excuses too.
Prove us wrong? Fuck off.
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Telegraph confirming what we already knew!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/08/18/scott-hogan-admits-didnt-enjoy-one-bit-time-aston-villa-keen/
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Absolutely no loss whatsoever. As bad a striker as I've ever seen down the Villa, and there have been some shockers.
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File under R for Rubbish.
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Telegraph confirming what we already knew!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/08/18/scott-hogan-admits-didnt-enjoy-one-bit-time-aston-villa-keen/
Well, to be fair, I don’t think any of us have enjoyed his time at the Villa either.
I wish the lad well, but just get your head down and focus on your game. Chapter closed.
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Don't think he has said a great deal wrong there. He hasnt slated the club and has blamed himself to an extent. Hope it goes well for him.
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Another one who got a big money deal and then felt he had achieved what he set out to do, that he was now made for life and could just cruise.
Hopefully the players we're now signing aren't going to settle for that and will want to push on do more.
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It didn’t help that for much of the early part of his Villa career the bloke who bought him then spent most of that time limping long balls at his head or down the wing to chase. A forward who is 5’10 or so and really is someone who runs between the CB.
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Saw everything that needed to be seen after that goal at Shrewsbury
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Scott Hogan.
(https://i.ibb.co/2jDHKhz/1-CC55-EE4-EC51-4-FBC-AD71-921-CDB65-E0-A2.png) (https://ibb.co/2jDHKhz)
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Saw everything that needed to be seen after that goal at Shrewsbury
Which was what?
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Saw everything that needed to be seen after that goal at Shrewsbury
Which was what?
I am not saying for one minute that he should run around this shearer with arm aloft after a goal in a friendly but his half arsed attitude didn’t convince me that he wanted to be here.
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He’s been shite since he’s been here, and only has himself to blame if he “hasn’t enjoyed it a bit” at Villa...we wanted you to be good but the truth is that we haven’t enjoyed watching a minute of you being shite in a claret and blue shirt either Scott, but at least you’ve admitted you took your eye of the ball. My heart bleeds for you and the nice big wages you were receiving...I’m sure that helped ease the pain of not fitting in. Fuck off.
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Fuck off indeed. Rarely has a Villa player had so may excuses made for him.
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Gestede and Ayew both had a long list of excuses made for them too...it’s what happens when we want to believe they will turn good and aren’t as shite as we are watching. I hope we aren’t clinging onto the same hope with Wes. Believe!
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Shit player with a shit attitude.
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I'm not sure what all these excuses for him are, the main (only?) one is that Bruce was shit, compounded by him seeming to think Hogan was taller than Gestede. I'm not sure many of us would disagree with Bruce being shit, misusing players and being a bit clueless.
Hogan turned out to be a poor signing, it happens but he's hardly the worst player to ever turn out for us.
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Good riddance to Tyrion.
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Saw everything that needed to be seen after that goal at Shrewsbury
Which was what?
I am not saying for one minute that he should run around this shearer with arm aloft after a goal in a friendly but his half arsed attitude didn’t convince me that he wanted to be here.
Players don't really celebrate goals during friendlies anyway. He probably knew he needed a fresh start by then and it was only a matter of time before he left. Shame really because I think there is a decent player in there somewhere but it just didn't work out.
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Meh. Did a passable Gary Penrice impression.
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Best of luck Scott - lets hope you score 20+ goal this season - then you will get your move and we may get some money for you! otherwise he will be back with us for next season
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Looking on the bright side the manager who dropped Hogan on us from a great height for a massively inflated price was Dean Smith. The same sort of talent to get top dollar for our rejects will make a very welcome change from the Get Rid policy that bled us white
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To think if he had netted that easy header against Fulham at Wembley we might have gone up with Bruce in charge. Then again we might have done a Fulham. Funny old game football.
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Looking on the bright side the manager who dropped Hogan on us from a great height for a massively inflated price was Dean Smith. The same sort of talent to get top dollar for our rejects will make a very welcome change from the Get Rid policy that bled us white
Unfortunately doesn’t seem to have worked this summer.
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I think this summer DS has been trying to make a silk purse out of the sow's ear he inherited from Bruce and his predecessors. His astuteness will be more apparent, in my opinion, when he does not have so much dross on the books.
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I'm not sure the Brentford astuteness was down to Dean Smith. They have a team looking at tranfers that heavily relies on stats to identify players. I think this was there before Smith joined and is still in place now. Unfortunately listening to a podcast from the Stasbomb team (who I think are involved with Brentford but I can't be 100% sure) they were not impressed by our summer transfer business. That's not to say the players won't be a success, but from a stats basis they didn't stand out.
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Top players can be good in any system. Not so good players can look good playing in one system but not another. Hogan is limited and is in the latter category . Why Bruce ever bought him, I could never understand as he was never going to fit in.
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The point I hoped to make aligns with the views of Martin and Chris. Dean Smith comes to us from a culture of shrewd player dealing. Whether he is or was the driving force of the discipline of spending money wisely is a moot point. Probably not. But he is the beneficiary of immersion in that discipline and so are we if he brings good practice to Villa Park. Right back to MON we have seen massive waste of money both on incoming and outgoing sales. Player movements orchestrated by bombsquaddery and player antipathy towards the club. I am confident that our dealings are now much more about who is being bought and sold than who is doing the buying and selling.
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He’s been shite since he’s been here, and only has himself to blame if he “hasn’t enjoyed it a bit” at Villa...we wanted you to be good but the truth is that we haven’t enjoyed watching a minute of you being shite in a claret and blue shirt either Scott, but at least you’ve admitted you took your eye of the ball. My heart bleeds for you and the nice big wages you were receiving...I’m sure that helped ease the pain of not fitting in. Fuck off.
My thoughts exactly. He will never play for a club with such a high profile as Villa in the rest of his career, or earn anywhere near as much once his Villa contract is up. I was really hoping Dean Smith could get the best out of him considering the goals he was banging in under him at Brentford, but it soon became obvious it was never going to happen.
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Everybody conveniently forgetting that super goal he scored against Shewsbury in a tightly contested pre season friendly !!
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I don't really understand the hatred for Hogan.
He was signed by a manager who didn't really understand what he was buying, beyond a set of goalscoring statistics, and who then proceeded to play him in a system which was completely different to the system he'd previously scored all those goals in.
He got disheartened with it and has now admitted that he took his foot off the accelerator as well.
At no point has he slagged the club off, or the fans, or anything else. He's just admitted it didn't work out and has now moved on.
Why the animosity?
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I agree Ad@m
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Dunno...cos for 33k a week and a nice promotion bonus he should be sucking our willys or something.
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Watched 1st half last night, and he looked very average at best, but Butland - looked like me in goal, he was dreadful
The Stoke team looked as though the cannot wait to get rid of their Manager, they were dreadful.
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I agree Ad@m
So do I. I'll continue to watch his career, wherever it is, with interest. I genuinely wish him well.
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I saw the game last night and thought it epitomised his time here - he moped about, hardly made any runs that could draw a pass and was non existent in the box.
He also looks such a miserable fucker that you think he really does not enjoy football at all - I think we maybe lumbered with him till his contract expires
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The point I hoped to make aligns with the views of Martin and Chris. Dean Smith comes to us from a culture of shrewd player dealing. Whether he is or was the driving force of the discipline of spending money wisely is a moot point. Probably not. But he is the beneficiary of immersion in that discipline and so are we if he brings good practice to Villa Park. Right back to MON we have seen massive waste of money both on incoming and outgoing sales. Player movements orchestrated by bombsquaddery and player antipathy towards the club. I am confident that our dealings are now much more about who is being bought and sold than who is doing the buying and selling.
Dean Smith did a good job at Brentford as a head coach working alongside a director of football, which is the structure we have now at Villa with Purslow, Pitarch and Smith. It is a set up a million miles away from Bruce signing or attempting to sign whoever was Championship player of the month the previous month.
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I saw the game last night and thought it epitomised his time here - he moped about, hardly made any runs that could draw a pass and was non existent in the box.
He also looks such a miserable fucker that you think he really does not enjoy football at all - I think we maybe lumbered with him till his contract expires
He looks like a poor player in what despite looking decent on paper is a poor Stoke side with very little spirit at the moment. But to be fair he looked decent in a successful Sheffield United side last season.
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I agree Ad@m
So do i. One of the most unfathomable dislikes of our own player that i can remember. Yes he cost a packet and OK it didn't work out but i'm not sure what part of all of that is his fault. It was the first thing that Bruce did early on which gave a few warning signs, the lack of thought which must have gone into it was alarming.
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From Stoke LIve:
Stoke City are happy to let striker Scott Hogan cut short his loan spell and return to Aston Villa before the end of the month.
Hogan is currently on a season-long loan, but has evidently become surplus to requirements.
Manager Michael O’Neill hasn’t even included the 27 year-old Ireland international on the bench in recent times for Stoke.
And he will have fallen even further down the pecking order after goals for Sam Vokes, Tyrese Campbell and Lee Gregory at Huddersfield on New Year’s Day.
Hogan last featured in the goalless draw with Reading on December 14 and has just four league starts to his name since joining from Villa.
Villa have shown no desire to take him back as yet, but injuries are beginning to bite at Villa Park.
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We're saved!!
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Cue the ‘couldn’t wait to leave Stoke’ line. No thanks.
I’d rather promote Archer.
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Ugh leave him at Stoke please, if they get relegated he may find his level.
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Our saviour. Jesus forgot all about him. Guess he will come into smiths thinking now.
God what a utter flop this guys been
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£150m spent and we may end up seeing out the season with a strikeforce of.................... Kodjia, Hogan, and Davis
You couldn't make this stuff up. Only at the Villa.
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Send him to Hull as a makeweight.
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You never know. Smith and Hogan reunited.
Football is a funny old game.
Mind you I don’t think it’s that funny!
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Our saviour. Jesus forgot all about him. Guess he will come into smiths thinking now.
God what a utter flop this guys been
You never know. Smith and Hogan reunited.
Football is a funny old game.
Mind you I don’t think it’s that funny!
No he won't, and yes, I think we do. He didn't go until the 7th of August. He had his chance.
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Just when you think things can't get any worse
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Send him to Walls for sausage meat.
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Is it ok to say that I think he is not as good as Wes?
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Stoke City are happy to let striker Scott Hogan cut short his loan spell and return to Aston Villa
I bet they are, tough shit, he's theirs for the season.
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Stoke City are happy to let striker Scott Hogan cut short his loan spell and return to Aston Villa
I bet they are, tough shit, he's theirs for the season.
I didn’t realize that. Yes fuckem and the horse they rode in on.
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Is Hogan the one who told the world how he couldn’t wait to get away from his villa nightmare?.............that’s awks !
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He can fuck right off. I'd honestly rather play any other play we have up front than Hogan.
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the club he plays for who are 3 points of the bottom of the championship want to send him back which gives you a good idea of what standard he is at the moment
he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
although he’s probably not that bothered once he had the big money contract he’s secured for life without having to worry to much
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Cue the ‘couldn’t wait to leave Stoke’ line. No thanks.
I’d rather promote Archer.
Same here. Hogan cannot get in to a struggling Stoke team.
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Is Hogan the one who told the world how he couldn’t wait to get away from his villa nightmare?.............that’s awks !
Totes.
Do Stoke have to keep him til May as part of the deal or can they send him back and not pay any salary contributions (probably what...£10k of £40k a week?)?
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Depends on the contract, any clauses can be added. I'd guess that they can't send him back without our say so. Tough shit, me ducks.
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More chance of the shoe shop taking back Tony's shoes, if it's a season long loan.
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he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
Not necessarily.
He did very well for one season in a system that suited him. It's not his fault Bruce signed him with no clue how to get the best out of him.
I don't think he's as bad as Jordan Bowery for example, he's just incredibly one-dimensional and not Prem standard. But he's 27 now and needs to be playing regularly, which won't be for us.
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He’s not even lower Championship standard any more by the looks of it.
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I completely forgot he existed.
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he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
Not necessarily.
He did very well for one season in a system that suited him. It's not his fault Bruce signed him with no clue how to get the best out of him.
I don't think he's as bad as Jordan Bowery for example, he's just incredibly one-dimensional and not Prem standard. But he's 27 now and needs to be playing regularly, which won't be for us.
Forgive me but I actually laughed out loud when you said ‘ I don’t think he’s as bad as Jordan Bowery for example’
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Bloody hell he should be in his prime now !
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he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
Not necessarily.
He did very well for one season in a system that suited him. It's not his fault Bruce signed him with no clue how to get the best out of him.
I don't think he's as bad as Jordan Bowery for example, he's just incredibly one-dimensional and not Prem standard. But he's 27 now and needs to be playing regularly, which won't be for us.
Forgive me but I actually laughed out loud when you said ‘ I don’t think he’s as bad as Jordan Bowery for example’
I know. That's setting a low bar but it just shows how terrible some of those lucky enough to pull on a Villa shirt have been over the past decade. Hogan isn't close to being the worst. He was lucky to get picked up by us and unlucky Bruce was the manager at the time.
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he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
Not necessarily.
He did very well for one season in a system that suited him. It's not his fault Bruce signed him with no clue how to get the best out of him.
I don't think he's as bad as Jordan Bowery for example, he's just incredibly one-dimensional and not Prem standard. But he's 27 now and needs to be playing regularly, which won't be for us.
Forgive me but I actually laughed out loud when you said ‘ I don’t think he’s as bad as Jordan Bowery for example’
I know. That's setting a low bar but it just shows how terrible some of those lucky enough to pull on a Villa shirt have been over the past decade. Hogan isn't close to being the worst. He was lucky to get picked up by us and unlucky Bruce was the manager at the time.
i don't disagree with you
but i still think he has to take some responsibility for the way his career has gone
actually maybe more than just some
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To be fair, he has.
He's on record as saying it went to his head when he signed for us and in combination with being played in a system which didn't play to his strengths he let things slip.
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To be fair, he has.
He's on record as saying it went to his head when he signed for us and in combination with being played in a system which didn't play to his strengths he let things slip.
well there we are then
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he must have had ability at some stage yet he’s now surplus wherever he goes at whatever level,
he can only have himself to blame for that
Not necessarily.
He did very well for one season in a system that suited him. It's not his fault Bruce signed him with no clue how to get the best out of him.
I don't think he's as bad as Jordan Bowery for example, he's just incredibly one-dimensional and not Prem standard. But he's 27 now and needs to be playing regularly, which won't be for us.
Forgive me but I actually laughed out loud when you said ‘ I don’t think he’s as bad as Jordan Bowery for example’
I know. That's setting a low bar but it just shows how terrible some of those lucky enough to pull on a Villa shirt have been over the past decade. Hogan isn't close to being the worst. He was lucky to get picked up by us and unlucky Bruce was the manager at the time.
Bowery played really well in one match at home to Hull - that’s one more league match than Hogan and at a higher level.
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I thought Bowery played quite well in that classic Stoke away game (LOWTON!!) as well.
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Hogan was really poor when he did play for us. Didn't improve at all when his former coach Smith came in. Was he more of a poacher at Brentford?
Bruce claimed he had been scouting him since his Rochdale days but it was clear after a handful of games that he wasn't a good fit for the team. Hard to know what club would even go for him on loan.
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I saw Hogan score in a 1 nill victory up at Shrewsbury
and people say he never delivered
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The Hogan nightmare continues...
So he’s being sent back from Stoke for being as shit as we thought he was at Villa. Let’s hope we don’t end up being stuck with and reliant upon him.
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Another player we handsomely rewarded for fuck all return.
Maybe he'll go into punditry with Richards and Lescott who seem to be on TV a lot these days.
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I saw Hogan score in a 1 nill victory up at Shrewsbury
and people say he never delivered
People on here are just too quick to write off players.
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The Hogan nightmare continues...
So he’s being sent back from Stoke for being as shit as we thought he was at Villa. Let’s hope we don’t end up being stuck with and reliant upon him.
Is he?
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I thought Bowery played quite well in that classic Stoke away game (LOWTON!!) as well.
Yes he did but ultimately given he's gone back down the leagues and is now at Crewe I think in league 2 it's amazing what Lambert really thought was premier league quality about him. Most of his signings were like that though.
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Could we send Scott out to Belgium or Netherlands?
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Or perhaps Antarctica.
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And we never discovered whether there was any truth in the rumour that we paid £500,000 for Bowery, a player who could have been acquired for £200,000.
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Or perhaps Antarctica.
He maybe some time.
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Or perhaps Antarctica.
He maybe some time.
Quality history! *applauds*
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Just for shits & giggles, go back to Page 1 of this thread and read the hopes and expectations of Scott Hogan.
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Just for shits & giggles, go back to Page 1 of this thread and read the hopes and expectations of Scott Hogan.
It's the usual story. People starts off excited, then after a few less than stellar performances people start calling for patience and saying the player isn't being used properly, before in the end reality hits and just about everybody accepts he's shit.
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Just for shits & giggles, go back to Page 1 of this thread and read the hopes and expectations of Scott Hogan.
It's the usual story. People starts off excited, then after a few less than stellar performances people start calling for patience and saying the player isn't being used properly, before in the end reality hits and just about everybody accepts he's shit.
I don't recall ever being massively excited about Hogan (my first post on this thread was about 3 weeks after he signed when he broke his ankle/leg) mainly because I knew nothing about him and there was only really 6months of his career available as highlights. I think I approached him with cautious optimism more than anything because he seemed willing to shoot early and one of our problems at the time was that we weren't getting enough shots on target. I do wonder how much getting a season ending injury after a handful of games shaped how he performed for us though.
On the broader point I think the excitement leads to people getting to the "he's shit" stage far too quickly. As an example Adama Traore, according to many on here, was fucking shit and would never be a footballer because he was disappointing for us as an 18 year old. Plenty of people thought Amavi, Veretout and Gollini were shit by the time they left as well but they've gone on to do well. In general we're too quick in calling players world beaters and too quick in calling players shit when the truth is most of them are between the 2 and can be useful players in the league with a season or 2 of experience to fall back on. Wesley, Luiz and Trezeguet are all suffering from this (and Engels recently as well).
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Veretout, Amavi and Gollini haven't gone on to be useful players in this league though. English football just doesn't suit all players, and I think Veretout definitely falls into that category. Lots of players with bigger reputations than them have come from foreign leagues and not really adapted to English football.
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The “there is a god player in there “ was applied to Tonev as well.
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The “there is a god player in there “ was applied to Tonev as well.
He certainly sent many offerings to the heavens.
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Veretout, Amavi and Gollini haven't gone on to be useful players in this league though. English football just doesn't suit all players, and I think Veretout definitely falls into that category. Lots of players with bigger reputations than them have come from foreign leagues and not really adapted to English football.
I don't disagree, but not being suited to the premier league isn't the same as being shit.
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Whatever the reasons, Veretout was shit for us, same with Gollini.
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Whatever the reasons, Veretout was shit for us, same with Gollini.
Dunno if Gollini will be a good player or not in the longer term, but he had about 10 games for us, be harsh to judge him as shit, even though he might not have played well in those games. McGrath himself struggled when he first came to villa, as things are now we’d be judging him as shit on his first few months performances. I remember seeing Nigel Spink have a generally shit season the year after we came up from Div 1 in the late eighties, doesn’t mean he was a shit keeper.
Point is we are a bit quick to write players off
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But they played about half a season of games each, that's far too soon to decide that they can never be good enough, especially given they were both still U23 when they were with us. My point really is that we move from the 'give them time' to 'nah they're shit' stages far too quickly with young players.
Calling players like Elmo, Taylor, Lansbury, etc shit is different, they're at the peak of their career, they shouldn't need patience, you pay a premium (in wages at least) for them to come in and do a job straight away.
I just think anyone younger than 23-24 needs to have their age and experience taken into account more than we are often willing to do.
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Please don't go shit on us, like so many have in the past. It's not a big ask is it?
looks like des called it back in jan 2017
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But they played about half a season of games each, that's far too soon to decide that they can never be good enough, especially given they were both still U23 when they were with us. My point really is that we move from the 'give them time' to 'nah they're shit' stages far too quickly with young players.
Calling players like Elmo, Taylor, Lansbury, etc shit is different, they're at the peak of their career, they shouldn't need patience, you pay a premium (in wages at least) for them to come in and do a job straight away.
I just think anyone younger than 23-24 needs to have their age and experience taken into account more than we are often willing to do.
You do know it's not a few dozen people on here who decide on whether to persevere with a player, right?
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Please don't go shit on us, like so many have in the past. It's not a big ask is it?
looks like des called it back in jan 2017
For no reason whatsoever I dont think this transfer will be a success.
PeterWithe got it spot on.
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Please don't go shit on us, like so many have in the past. It's not a big ask is it?
looks like des called it back in jan 2017
For no reason whatsoever I dont think this transfer will be a success.
PeterWithe got it spot on.
the spirit of Derek Acoura lives on
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Please don't go shit on us, like so many have in the past. It's not a big ask is it?
looks like des called it back in jan 2017
In fairness he didn’t Go shit , it never changed ;)
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I’d like to be able to claim some far reaching insight but I can’t reallŷ remember why I didn’t think it would work out, probably as I didn’t think he did anything particularly impressively given the fee, he wasn’t quick, strong, skilful or had any stand out qualities. He just got on the end of a lot of good balls slid down the side of CBs by a No10 that we didn’t tend to play a lot of. As I think Jack was bit part at that stage.
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I’d like to be able to claim some far reaching insight but I can’t reallŷ remember why I didn’t think it would work out, probably as I didn’t think he did anything particularly impressively given the fee, he wasn’t quick, strong, skilful or had any stand out qualities. He just got on the end of a lot of good balls slid down the side of CBs by a No10 that we didn’t tend to play a lot of. As I think Jack was bit part at that stage.
To be fair, you could make that claim about 75% of Villa's transfers and be right!
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Was this the same window Bruce identified the need for a player who could carry the ball through the midfield? And then bought Hourihane, Barney and Lansbury, none of which could do that job whilst Jack was on he bench.
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But they played about half a season of games each, that's far too soon to decide that they can never be good enough, especially given they were both still U23 when they were with us. My point really is that we move from the 'give them time' to 'nah they're shit' stages far too quickly with young players.
Calling players like Elmo, Taylor, Lansbury, etc shit is different, they're at the peak of their career, they shouldn't need patience, you pay a premium (in wages at least) for them to come in and do a job straight away.
I just think anyone younger than 23-24 needs to have their age and experience taken into account more than we are often willing to do.
You do know it's not a few dozen people on here who decide on whether to persevere with a player, right?
Yes, because slagging off young players after 15-20 games in limited to solely this forum and hasn't been widespread on forums, facebook and twitter or been represented in how crowds at games treat players.
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I don’t think any perceived lack of patience on here is necessarily transferred to match day home crowds. Wesley being the obvious example.
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Obvious but he needs games and goals.
Would he drop down to League One if wages were not an issue?
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But they played about half a season of games each, that's far too soon to decide that they can never be good enough, especially given they were both still U23 when they were with us. My point really is that we move from the 'give them time' to 'nah they're shit' stages far too quickly with young players.
Calling players like Elmo, Taylor, Lansbury, etc shit is different, they're at the peak of their career, they shouldn't need patience, you pay a premium (in wages at least) for them to come in and do a job straight away.
I just think anyone younger than 23-24 needs to have their age and experience taken into account more than we are often willing to do.
You do know it's not a few dozen people on here who decide on whether to persevere with a player, right?
Yes, because slagging off young players after 15-20 games in limited to solely this forum and hasn't been widespread on forums, facebook and twitter or been represented in how crowds at games treat players.
Even if every single member of the crowd was calling a player shit, which just isn't even remotely the case, it's still the manager who picks the team and decides when to sell a player.
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Even if every single member of the crowd was calling a player shit, which just isn't even remotely the case, it's still the manager who picks the team and decides when to sell a player.
Of course, but are you trying to suggest that fans turning on a player has no impact at all? When it happens at the ground everyone sees the impact (Guzan and Lescott are good examples from the relegation season) but when it's all happening on the internet it's hard to be sure but it's not much of a stretch to think that a fair few players (or at least people that know them and pass things along) will be part of the fan community and will see the criticism.
All of this is missing the point though, one of the stated goals of the current owners is to develop younger players, that comes with a risk of some inconsistent performances and will mean everyone will need to be patient with players sometimes. The real skill in developing young players is mastering the balance of giving them chances and knowing when to cut them loose. As fans that means sometimes we do need to be less eager to call someone "the worst striker in the history of the club" (to use a recent example).
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All of this is missing the point though, one of the stated goals of the current owners is to develop younger players, that comes with a risk of some inconsistent performances and will mean everyone will need to be patient with players sometimes. The real skill in developing young players is mastering the balance of giving them chances and knowing when to cut them loose. As fans that means sometimes we do need to be less eager to call someone "the worst striker in the history of the club" (to use a recent example).
That 'mastering the balance' is the manager's job. I've hardly heard a single cross word about any of the likes of Wesley or Guilbert etc this year at the ground. Same with previous years, whatever we say on here or on Twitter, the crowd have been largely supportive for the most part, even faced with the dismal football we've had to endure for the best part of 10 years. Gollini wasn't let go because the crowd were on his back, he wasn't played because the manager decided he was costing us too many points and played Bunn instead before getting Johnstone in on loan.
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Every time I see a new comment pop up on this thread I oanic, lest Hogan has returned.
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Sorry.
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Hogan probably the biggest flop in our history.
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Hogan probably the biggest flop in our history.
Balaban, Ross Mcgateface Micah ?
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I still cannot believe we spent £12 million on him, he has had more games and goals than McCormack managed for the same price however, gotta think positive!
Didn't Hogan have maybe a 4 or 5 game spell where he started every game got a few goals and played really well, I think in Bruce's play off season around the time when we smashed Wolves 4-1 or am I imagining this happening?
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I still cannot believe we spent £12 million on him, he has had more games and goals than McCormack managed for the same price however, gotta think positive!
Didn't Hogan have maybe a 4 or 5 game spell where he started every game got a few goals and played really well, I think in Bruce's play off season around the time when we smashed Wolves 4-1 or am I imagining this happening?
No
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I still cannot believe we spent £12 million on him, he has had more games and goals than McCormack managed for the same price however, gotta think positive!
Didn't Hogan have maybe a 4 or 5 game spell where he started every game got a few goals and played really well, I think in Bruce's play off season around the time when we smashed Wolves 4-1 or am I imagining this happening?
He had a run of games in Jan 18 where he got 5 in 5, then we signed Grabban and slowly reduced Hogan's game time again I think he got 1 more near the end of the season and ended with 6 for the year and hasn't scored for us since (but has been on 2 half season loans).
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Worst case and we can't get someone in, I'd bring him back. Someone is better than no one. Even if we get one in, it may be worth recalling him as it least he's a player who'll run and hit the channels. I think he'll offer more to the side than Kodjia with how Smith plays.
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Worst case and we can't get someone in, I'd bring him back. Someone is better than no one. Even if we get one in, it may be worth recalling him as it least he's a player who'll run and hit the channels. I think he'll offer more to the side than Kodjia with how Smith plays.
Agreed. We're probably paying most of his wages anyway, so we may as well use him.
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I'm not suggesting he get's one, but he hasn't ever had a pro-longed run in the team. Any team.
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I’d rather use Archer or if we have any other academy players coming through give them a try
Liverpool do they don’t sit back and piss there pants about it ‘being to soon’
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I'm not suggesting he get's one, but he hasn't ever had a pro-longed run in the team. Any team.
There's a very good reason for that.
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Has he started crying about being mistreated at Stoke yet?
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The way things are looking he might be on the bench tomorrow.
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He's not good enough, but bizarrely, 343 is probably the system that suits him most.
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He's not good enough, but bizarrely, 343 is probably the system that suits him most.
343? Is that what we're supposed to be playing now!
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It's what we played at Burnley.
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He'll probably get a chance, perform really well, then bugger off on a free to someone like Bournemouth going on to become their record league scorer.
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He'll probably be shit because he's shit.
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He'll probably be shit because he's shit.
Well there is that.
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He'll probably be shit because he's shit.
Well there is that.
But we need all the forwards we can get atm :D
And Wesley hasnt really been that much better
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Yep, Hogan with 10 goals in 61 games (mostly in the championship) certainly comes close to Wesley with 6 in 22, mostly in the premier league.
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we have no strikers and still we try to get rid , doesn't bode well for him
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He's clearly not good enough for the Prem. I bet he'd score hatfuls at Celtic though - crap defending and the better quality players than Stoke have got creating the chances for him.
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Are we sure that he's back? It looks like he started for Stoke U23s last night and scored.
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We wouldn't have him! He's still there.
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The ultimate Brucie brain fart
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
Wrong thread.
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
Wrong thread.
Why is this the wrong thread? It was a question about Scott on the Scott Hogan thread. If I have suggested something that can be shot down, then take aim. But its not the wrong thread.
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After having fired duds at Villa, ShueffU and Stoke, I don't see lil' Scottie as the answer to any of our current squad issues.
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
Wrong thread.
Why is this the wrong thread? It was a question about Scott on the Scott Hogan thread. If I have suggested something that can be shot down, then take aim. But its not the wrong thread.
Sorry I thought you'd made a mistake.
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
Wrong thread.
Why is this the wrong thread? It was a question about Scott on the Scott Hogan thread. If I have suggested something that can be shot down, then take aim. But its not the wrong thread.
Sorry I thought you'd made a mistake.
No worries, it wouldn't have been the first time ::)
And he still can have a role to play a villa, as unless I have missed something. we have no other forwards!!! ::)
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If we can recall him, then we need to, its that simple, as we don't have any forwards.
Wrong thread.
Why is this the wrong thread? It was a question about Scott on the Scott Hogan thread. If I have suggested something that can be shot down, then take aim. But its not the wrong thread.
Sorry I thought you'd made a mistake.
No worries, it wouldn't have been the first time ::)
And he still can have a role to play a villa, as unless I have missed something. we have no other forwards!!! ::)
If he came back we’d still have no forwards.
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worse still, we'd have an anti-forward.
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worse still, we'd have an anti-forward.
This is no different to the comments that I have made about Wesley when he was apparently 'playing' so I'll guess we'll disagree, that a less than perfect player is better than no player.
Yes, wrong thread.
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About to join Birmingham City on loan for the rest of the season, according to John Percy.
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Must be horrible losing all your footballing ability and having to retire from professional football.
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Lol, 5 goals before the end of the season and he’ll get on the ‘legends’ staircase in reception, between the second picture of Trevor Francis and Nigel Gleghorn.
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Blues Staff must have been reading this thread and see people think he’s due a second wind and cashed in
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Lol, 5 goals before the end of the season and he’ll get on the ‘legends’ staircase in reception, between the second picture of Trevor Francis and Nigel Gleghorn.
Dugarry being in their hall of fame never stops being funny.
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He really has reached rock bottom
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A match made in heaven.
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Agent Hogan?
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He really has reached rock bottom
One minute you are a rising star in your company who everyone wants to associate with. The next you’re living under a bridge in a wet cardboard box. Nobody remembers your name.
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Best wishes in your retirement, Scott.
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I can sense an embarrassing press release to get the Blosers on side on the horizon. Dwight Yorke redux, with a much reduced impact on either set of fans.
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If he thought he had something to bitch about before...
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I feel sorry for him the thread over there is shall we say less than complimentary. Mostly because he’s a DVB
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is Scott Hogan any worse than that US kid Vassilev that people were suggesting should have started games earlier in the month?
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We know Hogan is nowhere near good enough.
Vassilev we have no idea.
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I feel sorry for him the thread over there is shall we say less than complimentary. Mostly because he’s a DVB
It's comedy gold! This being my favourite...
(https://i.ibb.co/12y18Nq/Smart-Select-20200127-204713-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/12y18Nq)
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is Scott Hogan good enough to get in the squad for the 18th best team in the Championship? probably.... he may do ok there, hope so - the dumb bastards may buy him in the summer.
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I feel sorry for him the thread over there is shall we say less than complimentary. Mostly because he’s a DVB
It's comedy gold! This being my favourite...
(https://i.ibb.co/12y18Nq/Smart-Select-20200127-204713-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/12y18Nq)
Nah, for me that's a proper football reply!
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I know it's them, but imagine it was us hovering above the relegation places, and the board decide that Scott Hogan, as we now know him, is the man to fire us out of trouble. I'd be livid.
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Comedy gold that thread over there. We must be picking up at least 75% of his wages too, there's no way blues can afford his £40k a week in their financial predicament.
We may have well put that £ 12 million we paid Brentford for him in a dumpster and set the whole thing alight.
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I can’t stop laughing at them fighting like cats in a sack. One of them has now said we have signed Barry to replace Wesley this season.
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Looking on twitter they are hoping for the Brentford Hogan in the same way we were hoping for the Leicester Drinkwater with about the same chance of success I’d say
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I’m hoping to win the Euro Millions and the return of Ranchero crisps. Ain’t life a bitch?
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I’ve just made your day Des.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/KP-Rancheros-24-20g-packs/dp/B011A9YTOC
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I love you Kippax. Fcuk the Euro Millions!
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We must have sent them Hogan to help keep them up.
After all, if it all goes tit's up for us, we will want our regular guaranteed easy 6 pointer.
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
Have to agree with this. Either pay all his wages (which they clearly can't) or you dont have him.
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I'm not sure he'll even get in their team. They don't play 4-4-2 this season.
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I look at it as further evidence that small heath so desperately want to be Aston Villa. They follow our results closely, they know our financial situation like it's their own club and they crave our players. Like the Gardener/Jota swap was set up long before last summer's transfer window (when Gardener was there on loan) maybe Hogan has gone there potentially as the prelude to a Hogan/Bellingham (I think that's his name) swap deal next summer!
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
Have to agree with this. Either pay all his wages (which they clearly can't) or you dont have him.
Hang on, they're taking a player off our hands who is widely regarded as being one of the worst strikers we've had in decades. How are we helping them out exactly?
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
Have to agree with this. Either pay all his wages (which they clearly can't) or you dont have him.
Hang on, they're taking a player off our hands who is widely regarded as being one of the worst strikers we've had in decades. How are we helping them out exactly?
Plus, it seems like our contract is with Stoke and they've sub let him to Birmingham. They're most likely taking the hit on the wages.
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Just because someone was rubbish for us, doesn't mean it's inconceivable he could be okay for them. I'd rather we had told him to stay at Stoke until a more suitable offer came in.
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
Have to agree with this. Either pay all his wages (which they clearly can't) or you dont have him.
Hang on, they're taking a player off our hands who is widely regarded as being one of the worst strikers we've had in decades. How are we helping them out exactly?
Exactly. He's awful, and it's been a while since he helped any club in a positive way. All he's going to do is to continue to drain Stoke's finances to whatever extent they're contributing to his wages, and make a crap team like Small Heath a smidge crapper than they were before. He burned his bridges with his interview when he joined Stoke, so he can piss off and continue his spiral into football oblivion for all I care. If anything it's quite funny that some Noses might actually harbour some hope that he might be quite good.
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As crap as Hogan is I’d still rather we didn’t help THEM out with loans. There’s no way they will be paying all of his wages, as was also the case with Gardner. They despise us, physically attack our players, and yet we’re helping them out. We shouldn’t give them the steam off our piss.
Who is their best player now, is it that Bellingham lad? Maybe we are doing the same thing as with Jota last year, and in the summer we will get him for Scott Hogan and a bag of crisps.
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Just because someone was rubbish for us, doesn't mean it's inconceivable he could be okay for them. I'd rather we had told him to stay at Stoke until a more suitable offer came in.
I'm sure we're no worse off from the deal. He's done fuck all anywhere since we signed him and loaned him out. Maybe Stoke will get better with him gone and them lot get worse...
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I look at it as further evidence that small heath so desperately want to be Aston Villa. They follow our results closely, they know our financial situation like it's their own club and they crave our players. Like the Gardener/Jota swap was set up long before last summer's transfer window (when Gardener was there on loan) maybe Hogan has gone there potentially as the prelude to a Hogan/Bellingham (I think that's his name) swap deal next summer!
Could you imagine the explosion of hatred over on SHA if we bought Bellingham?!?! ;D
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I actually think he'd be a reasonable signing for them. He's capable of being an average Championship striker, which I assume is a level above most of their players.
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I look at it as further evidence that small heath so desperately want to be Aston Villa. They follow our results closely, they know our financial situation like it's their own club and they crave our players. Like the Gardener/Jota swap was set up long before last summer's transfer window (when Gardener was there on loan) maybe Hogan has gone there potentially as the prelude to a Hogan/Bellingham (I think that's his name) swap deal next summer!
Could you imagine the explosion of hatred over on SHA if we bought Bellingham?!?! ;D
Yes, I think he's going to be a good player. Hogan has lost nearly all his value and Bellingham is obviously worth much more. He is probably better than many of those much vaunted Liverpool youth players like Elliott. It all depends on how long Blues will be able to hold out and for how much.
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Scott retires from football:
https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2020/01/29/scott-hogan-loan-blues-villa
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Yes!
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Looks chuffed to bits.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFqcmcb/image.png) (https://ibb.co/PFqcmcb)
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Looks chuffed to bits.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFqcmcb/image.png) (https://ibb.co/PFqcmcb)
(https://i.ibb.co/Z2Yk4LS/Screenshot-20200129-130024-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Z2Yk4LS)
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Your mission, Agent Hogan, should you choose to accept it, is to make certain that Blues self-destruct in 5... 4... 3... 2...
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Thoughts and prayers Scott
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Looks chuffed to bits.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFqcmcb/image.png) (https://ibb.co/PFqcmcb)
He looks bloody terrified!
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How horrific for any professional footballer to wear that. My thoughts are with him and his family.
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#prayforscottyhogan
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He looks like a young David Gold
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How long has he got left on his contract with us? I'm hoping it runs out in the summer and that's that.
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#sadnessinhiseyes
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That really is a Sunday league kit isn't it :o
What a shame for all parties - apart from us ;D
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I get that you've got to pay the bills, but surely he's got more pride in himself than to go there?!
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Looks chuffed to bits.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFqcmcb/image.png) (https://ibb.co/PFqcmcb)
He looks bloody terrified!
Looks like he's wandered into The Hills Have Eyes or something...which isn't far from the truth. Did he get driven to the ground with a resin sack over his head? Furthermore, is he allowed to keep the sack for home matches? For his sake, I hope so.
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How long has he got left on his contract with us? I'm hoping it runs out in the summer and that's that.
Another year I believe.
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Yes just another £2.3m or so in wages to go. What a clusterfuck signing Scotty was.
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He is there for one reason only... to score against Albion. Do that and he’ll be partly forgiven.
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For about a week last January I think, he scored a few and almost looked like a professional footballer. Then he woke up again.
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Where did it go wrong for Scott Hogan at Aston Villa?
Of course, it has to be assumed that something 'went wrong' for the striker. It's natural.
He's not playing in the Premier League for Villa, and he's just signed a loan deal to join Villa's fierce rivals, Birmingham City.
But for something to 'go wrong', it must have once 'gone right' for Hogan to end up at Villa in the first place.
So for Hogan, no doubt, and a fair few Villa fans, there are a lot of regrets and the sense of some unfinished business at the club.
To understand the striker, and offer further context to his current situation, we have to go back to the start. Back to Brentford, and even before that. So what is Hogan's story? And how did a pub team striker end up at Brentford?
A recent book 'The Expected Goals Philosophy' provides insight into Brentford's transfer pursuit of Hogan. Powered by owner Matthew Benham's 'Smartodds' company, his club utilised data analysis to find undervalued players.
Benham's systems via the use of expected goals (xG) could use a league table based on 'expected points' (a value of expected goals for and against to judge a 'just' match winner based on chance quality). This was termed a 'justice table' and used by the club to find value.
Brentford - in 2014 - were in a fairly sticky position. They had been promoted from League One to the Championship and found themselves needing strikers of a higher quality.
The Bee's analytics and scouting team were asked to find not just an additional striker - but one that was undervalued. They needed to find a team in a lower league that created a high quality of chances, but not necessarily one that was succeeding in the league table - perhaps due to poor luck.
Using their analysis on expected points tables, the team at Brentford highlighted Rochdale as a team of interest.
In 2013-2014, Rochdale under manager Keith Hill finished third in League Two - but their chances and quality of performances hinted that even promotion was a slight injustice that season - Rochdale were better than that.
Having identified their team, it wasn't long before the Bees found their player.
Scott Hogan was studying at college in Salford for a BTEC qualification when Rochdale released him. A raw, pacey and passionate forward, Hogan had impressed for the youth side at Spotland - but the club decided against offering him a professional deal due to the size of the squad.
Hogan then fell into the grind of daily life away from football. He worked as a cleaner, at a chemical factory, as an order picker and at a tyre recycling plant.
The dream dies on the 9-5. Countless life ambitions have been crushed by the cruel yet demanding grind for money. “It shapes you. At the time you’re not thinking about being a footballer. You’re thinking ‘I hate my life, I don’t know where I’m going here', I was literally picking one tyre up up, putting it on a belt, picking another one up, putting it on a belt, and that was your day. Nothing changed. I did that for about four months." Hogan told the Irish Mirror.
While that was four months of his life, for others - it is the life. Hogan got lucky. Hard work helped, and so did his desire, but chance had a big part to play in this story. It had to.
Fighting for the dream, Hogan continued his work while playing non-league football for the likes of Halifax, Stocksbridge Park Steels, Woodley Sports, Mossley, Ashton United and Hyde. Before that, he was working while playing for Irlam - and Irlam's pub team.
Fortunately for Hogan, his work ethic was noticed by Keith Hill and he was invited back to Rochdale to train. It wasn't long before he signed for Rochdale on a permanent basis.
We could see the difference,” Hill said to The Guardian when asked about Hogan's path. “During the time he spent in non-league there was a massive realisation from Scott himself that he could miss out on fulfilling his potential.
"The next time we saw him he was a totally different character – the same ability but his mentality was stronger and he had a more professional approach.”
It all had to happen the way it happened. Fate was at play, and thanks to his hard work, Hogan had carried on to earn his chance right-back at the start. After being rejected by Rochdale, Hogan eventually signed for them.
In a twist of fate, Hogan's return came around the same time as Hill's. The gaffer had left to join Barnsley, but when that fell apart, he was brought back by Rochdale in 2013.
The Dale scored 69 goals to secure promotion to League One a year later, and Brentford found that one of their strikers stood out amongst the data - and had statistics that compared well to the average Championship forward, even when scoring in League Two.
Hogan scored 17 goals for Rochdale to end their 41-year stint in the fourth tier of English League football. His goals had put him on the radar - a contract offer from Peterborough was rejected so that Hogan could concentrate on Rochdale's promotion bid. He eventually left the club later in the year to join Brentford.
Hogan didn't get to jump straight into his new team. He succumbed to knee and ACL injuries and spent most his first two seasons at the club on the bench and the injury table.
But when Dean Smith arrived at the Bees, Hogan was firing. He scored 14 goals in 25 appearances during 2016/2017 and brought a great deal of focus and attention to the club.
That same season - not even five years removed from Hogan's pub team and shift work days - he signed for Aston Villa for a fee of around £12m. You know the rest of this story.
At Villa, Hogan scored one goal during his first season before falling to injury.
He started for Villa during his second season - and began to impress but Steve Bruce, the club's manager at the time, opted to bring in Lewis Grabban on loan in January instead of sticking with Hogan. He then scuppered a loan move for the striker when Sheffield United came in the following summer.
After that, he played barely an hour of football for the club under current Villa boss Dean Smith and was eventually sent to Sheffield United on loan at the end of the season. He bagged twice in two starts, but Chris Wilder opted against a permanent deal.
At the start of the season, Villa fans noted that their training camp included a striker who was becoming cut adrift. Hogan was brought in by Stoke City on loan, but failed to make a solid impression there too.
Potters writer Peter Smith noted that Hogan wasn't just torn between managerial changes - he didn't really fit in at all.
"His problem was that he wasn't either!" said Smith when asked about whether Hogan was more of a Nathan Jones striker or a Michael O'Neill striker.
"Jones was keen to bring in another striker in the summer but when that fell through he was pleased to get Hogan from Villa to pair him in a front two. In turn, Hogan immediately impressed with a lively debut at Charlton and two goals against Derby in his second game. But he was hooked early in the second half of his next match, a deflating defeat at Preston, and Jones all-but ripped up his blueprint."
"Hogan was barely seen of until he passionately made his case to be involved in an away match at Swansea - convincing Jones that if he was taken, he'd score. He duly did, coming off the bench to score a dramatic injury time winner."
"Jones's time was almost up and when he left, poacher Hogan did not tick the boxes O'Neill required in a solo striker-come-target man who could hold up the ball. He has only featured three times from the bench since the change in manager."
Stoke wanted to return the player to Villa - but the club refused. Instead, the Potters had to find another club themselves.
They did, and it turned out to be Birmingham City. Villa agreed to the move, and today - Hogan has been announced as a Blues forward.
Now, back in the present, the story of Scott Hogan at Villa should allow us to reset our expectations. Success isn't always up to us to define, but should rest on the context of the individual concerned.
The loan signings of Tammy Abraham and Lewis Grabban didn't help his cause at Villa - and neither did Villa's £30m splurge on Hogan, Jonathan Kodjia and Ross McCormack within six months of each other.
And what about Brentford? To succeed as a club, they must purchase undervalued players cheaply before selling them on. Hogan's metrics defined him as a Championship player. Brentford bought him, played him, put a new value to him and Villa paid it.
For Brentford to succeed with their transfer strategy, another club has to lose out. As it goes with bookies and casinos, the house always wins. Hogan's new value damned him.
Context is key when considering him. Hogan's career has a pattern. He goes backwards to go forwards and he has always done so. He didn't impress at Rochdale, so he went back to move forward. He didn't impress at Villa, so once again he must go back to go forward.
Still, for Hogan - goals at Villa Park, hearing his name sung by a crowd, Irish international caps and a decent wage. It's all a cry from those days working at the plant.
“I still drive past there [the tyre plant] some days as it’s near the house, and I say to the missus, ‘I’m never going back there again.'
And nor does he have to.
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I wonder what McCormack & Hogan cost villa in total.
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I wonder what McCormack & Hogan cost villa in total.
chuck Micah Richards in the mix too
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Looks chuffed to bits.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFqcmcb/image.png) (https://ibb.co/PFqcmcb)
(https://i.ibb.co/Z2Yk4LS/Screenshot-20200129-130024-Chrome.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Z2Yk4LS)
Is that Doug Ellis at the bottom of the stairs there back to haunt us?
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He played for Stockbridge Parks Steels and Halifax. Unfortunately that is all he has in common with Jamie Vardy.
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That IS Doug Ellis at the bottom of the stairs. You can tell by his halo. First that it a ghost and second that it a saint of some sort. Saint of Bicycle Kicks perhaps.
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He played for Stockbridge Parks Steels and Halifax. Unfortunately that is all he has in common with Jamie Vardy.
They both look like plumbers.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPctXVcXUAAn9nE?format=jpg&name=small)
This is what humiliation looks like
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He might as well be shaking his head and gently sobbing.
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If he is then he's only got himself to blame I guess
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPctXVcXUAAn9nE?format=jpg&name=small)
This is what humiliation looks like
It's like a stag do photo the morning after the big night out.
Except the depth of sorrow in his eyes is far more serious than that night the stag shagged a couple of cheap prossies, got arrested for public indecency as he was stripped naked and found laying in a pile of vomit and piss in the gutter. That.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPctXVcXUAAn9nE?format=jpg&name=small)
This is what humiliation looks like
That is almost as good as that photo when Anelka joined Albion.
(https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article2026183.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/WEST-BROMWICH-ALBION-Nicolas-Anelka-signed-from-Juventus-on-a-free.jpg)
Seem to recall some journo saying he looked like he was holding a blanket covered in sick.
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I was talking to Nodge about this yesterday, I thought it was some wag on here said that he looked like he was holding a dead pigeon covered in sick, either way it's a great picture and like the Hogan one, it says more about the two clubs than a thousand posts on here could ever do.
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I was talking to Nodge about this yesterday, I thought it was some wag on here said that he looked like he was holding a dead pigeon covered in sick, either way it's a great picture and like the Hogan one, it says more about the two clubs than a thousand posts on here could ever do.
That's it, dead pigeon!
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPctXVcXUAAn9nE?format=jpg&name=small)
This is what humiliation looks like
He looks happy lol
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It's a bad thing that he's done.
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I just have this inkling he will do well there. Short term obviously but I think he will be the shot in the arm they need up front. He's just got to make sure he puts a shift in cos as a DVB they will turn on him in an instant.
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he does run around a lot
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he does run around a lot
Usually away from the goal and his team mates
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he does run around a lot
Like a kitten chasing a butterfly
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he does run around a lot
Usually away from the goal and his team mates
He's one of them rare players that is slower than he looks.
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he does run around a lot
Usually away from the goal and his team mates
He's one of them rare players that is slower than he looks.
All the acceleration of a scrapped car
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A lesson for other footballers in how to take a promising career and spiral down uncontrollably before hitting rock bottom. I honestly think if he's joined Sunderland he'd have done better. At least he'll have the voices of 10,000 'people' shouting his name every second week.
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Scored today
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F*** him.
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Scored today
Good if he keeps it up maybe we might get a few quid selling him on ..
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Hope he scores more and blose lose so he can gi for bigger money
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Not just scoring for Small Heath, but helping Leeds and Albion in the process. Twat.
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It shows how shit the standard is at the Sty - he got man of the match!
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Why help them out at all? They absolutely fucking hate us? He's helped them get all 3 points. They were starting to look over their shoulders at teams below them.
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It all happened in about 120 seconds just before Half Time yesterday. Ex Villa player Grabban misses a penalty for Forest. Hogan a Villa loanee although God knows why goes straight up the other end to score for them. Pan back to our game to see us go 2-0 down. What a shit day.
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It all happened in about 120 seconds just before Half Time yesterday. Ex Villa player Grabban misses a penalty for Forest. Hogan a Villa loanee although God knows why goes straight up the other end to score for them. Pan back to our game to see us go 2-0 down. What a shit day.
Must be the first time Joe Lolley didn't actually score in a game at the sty.
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2 in 2 for Scotty
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Feed him and he'll score. How can Blose feed him better than us or Stoke or Sheff?
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Feed him and he'll score. How can Blose feed him better than us or Stoke or Sheff?
Don't know, don't care. Let's just hope he carries on scoring because then we will get some money for him.
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Feed him and he'll score. How can Blose feed him better than us or Stoke or Sheff?
I haven't seen him play for anyone apart from us and Brentford, but I wonder whether it's Darren Bent Syndrome - they've got fuck all else, so they might as well serve him?
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He scored from a deflection off the keeper. He was full of confidence after that. Got caught offside 3 times and offered little else of note. Let’s hope he keeps Getting the goals as we might get something for him.
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My thoughts when he scored was never good enough for us but I hope he scores a few so we can get him off the payroll.
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My thoughts are still why the fuck give blues any help whatsoever . End of.
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Because it might mean we get a few million for him come the summer, rather than paying his wages to play for someone else next season.
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I couldn’t give a shit if he scores for them in every game, if he impresses enough, someone may buy him and we’ll get a fee, we free up wages for FFP and another squad space.
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watched him last night and my assessment of him is still the same
He runs around like he’s been chased by a wasp
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His goal was quite lucky to be honest. The rest of the game he did absolutely nothing. As long as he keeps scoring so we can get a half decent fee for him I’ll be happy.
Both teams had so many of our rejects yesterday.
Have to say Weizmann is looking dreadful these days. He had so much potential here
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Even taking the own goal out of the equation, Weimann still looked awful. He still has the 100% effort that he always had but he doesn't seem to have developed anything else to his game since leaving us.
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Weimann Pieman sold his soul
Changed his name by deed poll
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My thoughts are still why the fuck give blues any help whatsoever . End of.
Because we're bigger than them.
Because it serves our purpose. And we should put our needs first, and not worry about fucking them up, they're good enough at that already.
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A hot steaming pile of garbage for player, 2 in 2 or not. A truly abysmal signing on our behalf.
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A hot steaming pile of garbage for player, 2 in 2 or not. A truly abysmal signing on our behalf.
Fence sitter ;)
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Honestly Blues are pretty meaningless. If they need our reserves so be it.
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Honestly Blues are pretty meaningless. If they need our reserves so be it.
yet when we had the pitch invasion and were celebrating getting through to a Wembley final
the song went up ‘Birmingham are you listening’
meaningless maybe but still are ultimate rivals bar none
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Don’t really understand why such an innocuous player who admittedly never hit the heights at B6 (through no lack of effort) is still subject to quite vehement criticism . Let him move on and get a game.
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Don’t really understand why such an innocuous player who admittedly never hit the heights at B6 (through no lack of effort) is still subject to quite vehement criticism . Let him move on and get a game.
Probably because he cost an incredible amount of money (for the Championship) and simply did not deliver, putting in a string of absolutely woefully inept performances.
That said it's not his fault we were stupid enough to pay what we did for him. He always was and always will be a very average Championship level striker.
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Don’t really understand why such an innocuous player who admittedly never hit the heights at B6 (through no lack of effort) is still subject to quite vehement criticism . Let him move on and get a game.
Probably because he cost an incredible amount of money (for the Championship) and simply did not deliver, putting in a string of absolutely woefully inept performances.
That said it's not his fault we were stupid enough to pay what we did for him. He always was and always will be a very average Championship level striker.
Was all down to Brucey.
Bought McCormack, played him wrong (or was that RDM?)
Bought Hogan, played him wrong
Sometimes players are not suited to a style of play and this was the main issue with Hogan.
I’m not surprised he’s doing ok a Small Heath.
Can only benefit us when we sell at end of season.
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Don’t really understand why such an innocuous player who admittedly never hit the heights at B6 (through no lack of effort) is still subject to quite vehement criticism . Let him move on and get a game.
Probably because he cost an incredible amount of money (for the Championship) and simply did not deliver, putting in a string of absolutely woefully inept performances.
That said it's not his fault we were stupid enough to pay what we did for him. He always was and always will be a very average Championship level striker.
Was all down to Brucey.
Bought McCormack, played him wrong (or was that RDM?)
Bought Hogan, played him wrong
Sometimes players are not suited to a style of play and this was the main issue with Hogan.
I’m not surprised he’s doing ok a Small Heath.
Can only benefit us when we sell at end of season.
I don't get the idea that he was played wrong or that we never played to his strengths. He never really showed much at all and good players adapt anyway. Smith obviously didn't rate him either and he for one certainly should've known any strengths.
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To get the most of Hogan you needed to be playing a press so you won the ball back high up the pitch and could put him in on goal within a couple of passes. As soon as a defence gets organised he struggles to find space but he's a good finisher if he's not got much else to do other than get on the end of the ball in the box.
It's the sort of striker I can totally understand being incredibly successful at lower levels (bottom half of the championship at best) but he was never suited to the way Bruce played and was never going to be good enough when we were promoted.
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He also wasn’t suitable for us under Smith, Sheffield United under Wilder, or Stoke under Jones or O’Neill. Two goals for Small Heath doesn’t change the fact that he is a shit, limited player. He got 5 in 5 for us once, then scored once in the next 20 or so.
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He also wasn’t suitable for us under Smith, Sheffield United under Wilder, or Stoke under Jones or O’Neill. Two goals for Small Heath doesn’t change the fact that he is a shit, limited player. He got 5 in 5 for us once, then scored once in the next 20 or so.
Under Smith he didn't play because he was never going to be good enough to replace Tammy. He did ok at Sheff Utd and I think he could've worked in that squad. Stoke were a complete mess, they made Butland look like a pub player. None of this is excuses, I think he's a poor player who is probably now at the highest level his ability can go, but the play style issue is still true, if Bruce honestly watched him and couldn't see how poorly suited he was then it's yet more evidence that Bruce is delusional and doesn't see the limitation of his approach.
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Oh I agree, I don't think Bruce's scouting extended to anything more than looking at the list of top scorers in the division.
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He also wasn’t suitable for us under Smith, Sheffield United under Wilder, or Stoke under Jones or O’Neill. Two goals for Small Heath doesn’t change the fact that he is a shit, limited player. He got 5 in 5 for us once, then scored once in the next 20 or so.
I’ve just read the first few pages of this thread 😂
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He also wasn’t suitable for us under Smith, Sheffield United under Wilder, or Stoke under Jones or O’Neill. Two goals for Small Heath doesn’t change the fact that he is a shit, limited player. He got 5 in 5 for us once, then scored once in the next 20 or so.
I’ve just read the first few pages of this thread 😂
Hairbandinho was scarily accurate with his comment!
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Oh I agree, I don't think Bruce's scouting extended to anything more than looking at the list of top scorers in the division.
Well there was only really Hogan that falls into this category; Lansbury to a degree.
However, whatever we may think about the tactics under Bruce, I think his good signings, including loanees, easily outweighed the negative ones.
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The absolute worst case scenario here is Hogan's goals keep them in The Championship.
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Anither goal for hogan. Only thag idiot would flop at every club and score goals at blose.
I dislike him even more
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The more he scores, the better. The mongrels are going nowhere so who cares if they finish 18th or 10th?
A boatload for Hogan and his value will go up - We are in a win win situation.
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When some of us on here complained about how ridiculous it is that we are helping out a club that despises us, we were told not to worry as Hogan won’t score any goals anyway.
That’s now 3 goals in 3 games, SHA have now turned things around and are on a good run of form, whilst their official twitter page tries to take the piss out of us.
We should’ve just told them to fuck off.
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It doesn't matter. Fuck them lot. Hogan scoring is doing us a favour.
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I've checked my pockets and there's just some gum in there and not a single fuck.
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When some of us on here complained about how ridiculous it is that we are helping out a club that despises us, we were told not to worry as Hogan won’t score any goals anyway.
That’s now 3 goals in 3 games, SHA have now turned things around and are on a good run of form, whilst their official twitter page tries to take the piss out of us.
We should’ve just told them to fuck off.
Who gives a duck. We had an asset that had no value and now we should get some money. Blues are going nowhere. Just need to make sure we have no play clause if we sell and go down
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When some of us on here complained about how ridiculous it is that we are helping out a club that despises us, we were told not to worry as Hogan won’t score any goals anyway.
That’s now 3 goals in 3 games, SHA have now turned things around and are on a good run of form, whilst their official twitter page tries to take the piss out of us.
We should’ve just told them to fuck off.
How are they taking the piss? Or more to the point, how can they?
Personally, I don't really care about them now we're in different divisions. I hate them but I'm glad they're contributing to Hogan's wages and if they bump his price up, even better. It's a marathon not a sprint - I can't see Hogan continuing like this anyway.
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FFS Scotty.....
Its like when an ex you dumped and never really fancied anyway gets off with someone in front of you...you don't care....but somehow you do care, just a little bit
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When some of us on here complained about how ridiculous it is that we are helping out a club that despises us, we were told not to worry as Hogan won’t score any goals anyway.
That’s now 3 goals in 3 games, SHA have now turned things around and are on a good run of form, whilst their official twitter page tries to take the piss out of us.
We should’ve just told them to fuck off.
Where????
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If you care that a player who is valued at nothing is scoring for a midtable side, in a different division and most probably earning us a few million because of that then you have your priorities wrong in my view.
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If nothing else, we’ll be able to get more than a goldfish and a balloon for him. Every cloud.
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The more we talk about him and get upset about him scoring, the more they like it. He, and they, are best ignored.
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
There are 7 teams above them - It would take an incredible run for them to jump all of them. Chill out and enjoy your day - They're going nowhere.
Think about the fun that could be had if we chopped in Hogan in part exchange for Bellingham, only to then field him in our U23s.
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The more we talk about Hogan playing for them, the more we descend towards their level. Let them have our cast offs we don’t need him because he isn’t good enough.
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I couldn't give a fuck if he invented a coronavirus vaccine over there. He's doing it over there. Who gives a flying fuck?
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They are going no where with him or without him.
The more he scores the better value we will get for him , the better his value the less chance they have of then signing him themselves
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I couldn't give a fuck if he invented a coronavirus vaccine over there. He's doing it over there. Who gives a flying fuck?
Yes, imagine not wanting your local rivals to win. I think that's unique in world football history. Shame on us.
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I couldn't give a fuck if he invented a coronavirus vaccine over there. He's doing it over there. Who gives a flying fuck?
Yes, imagine not wanting your local rivals to win. I think that's unique in world football history. Shame on us.
Good job nobody's said it then.
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I was highlighting the odd posts of those on this thread who seem very bothered to let everyone know how not bothered they are.
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Again, nobody's said that. I look at them with disdain and see an asset appreciating in value.
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I was highlighting the odd posts of those on this thread who seem very bothered to let everyone know how not bothered they are.
I see people being really bothered that other people aren't bothered about what they are (incorrectly) bothered about.
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Oh, you.
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
There are 7 teams above them - It would take an incredible run for them to jump all of them. Chill out and enjoy your day - They're going nowhere.
That's exactly what Blosers said about us this time last year ;)
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
There are 7 teams above them - It would take an incredible run for them to jump all of them. Chill out and enjoy your day - They're going nowhere.
That's exactly what Blosers said about us this time last year ;)
We had Jack Grealish, they have
And here is the punch line
Scott Hogan ;D ;D
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He can only score goals for teams beginning with "B"
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Everyones a winner if he does well over there. It's not like they'd be able to make his move permanent, is it? Some other club can take this toxic liability off our hands.
He'll probably get his own place in their "Legend's Lounge" at this rate. Christophe Dugarry only needed less than 50 appearances to do the same.
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yes keep it going Scotty we want someone to bid!
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
There are 7 teams above them - It would take an incredible run for them to jump all of them. Chill out and enjoy your day - They're going nowhere.
That's exactly what Blosers said about us this time last year ;)
I think that is probably best answered by one of their own literary geniuses:
Dreams do come true if you're a DVB scumbag. End of Feb last season Vile had 45pts from 34 games (wiki)
Not impossible but you need to be REALLY jammy scum bags to do that and that's just not us. We're Blues
I'd love to know what goes on in that tiny little mind. How were we in any way, shape or form jammy? We gained more points than other teams. We didn't even scrape 6th, we finished 5th. I love that they think we're jammy - It must eat away at them even more and ruin their sorry lives further.
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Now he's had a few games surely its time to recall him and put him in the reserves?
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Birmingham only 7 points off the play-offs. Of course it's fine for Scotty to keep scoring.
There are 7 teams above them - It would take an incredible run for them to jump all of them. Chill out and enjoy your day - They're going nowhere.
That's exactly what Blosers said about us this time last year ;)
I think that is probably best answered by one of their own literary geniuses:
Dreams do come true if you're a DVB scumbag. End of Feb last season Vile had 45pts from 34 games (wiki)
Not impossible but you need to be REALLY jammy scum bags to do that and that's just not us. We're Blues
I'd love to know what goes on in that tiny little mind. How were we in any way, shape or form jammy? We gained more points than other teams. We didn't even scrape 6th, we finished 5th. I love that they think we're jammy - It must eat away at them even more and ruin their sorry lives further.
Plus the fact that we'd been in the play off final 12 months before just to show it wasn't a fluke.
Anyway, i'm really not bothered, and i'm also not bothered if anyone thinks i'm bothered.
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Anyway, i'm really not bothered, and i'm also not bothered if anyone thinks i'm bothered.
That bothers me.
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Scott who?
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Put a 8m price tag on him to blose and 4m for everyone else.
Or if we stay up bid for bellingham offer them some cash and hogan
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I want to sign Bellingham just to send them into meltdown. ;D ;D ;D
Not that I'm bothered about them of course.
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I am in the fuck the Blues at all costs camp. If we never played them again and they went out of existence I wouldn’t give a shit. Amount of ridiculous abuse bordering on the mentally disturbing given to us over the years is enough for them to be put on the scrap heap for good.
That goes for us lending them Hogan. Pretty sure if we searched hard enough we could’ve ensured he ended up at a different championship club.
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I think it's lovely that we're willing to help those less fortunate than ourselves.
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The advantage of dealing with Blues is that it works both ways. Whereas before, they might not have sold a player to us, with us loaning and (subsequently selling) them Gardner and now Hogan; there is a better chance of us being able to sign players off them as we did with Jota last summer. Although that doesn't seem to have quite worked out, most of us thought we had a good deal at the time. In the future, they may be prepared to deal with us - Especially if we have something to give them as part ex.
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Ridiculous to help our neighbours or even give the possibility of assistance. End of. Pathetic. Only if it hurts their ffp is it acceptable.
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Disagree. We should be doing all we can to help out small clubs in the region. We must look after the little ones to ensure grass roots football in the Midlands remains healthy.
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We have a history of helping out our less-fortunate neighbours, the two closest of which are on record as having thanked us for enabling their continued existence. Fact.
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I'd agree about not helping them if our league positions were reversed. But they're not. We're a division higher.
Just think, how bad must their fans be feeling having to take our cast-offs.
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Points taken. Still wouldn’t even make a debate out of it. Shouldn’t help, despite the fact they are our small silent neighbours.
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As soon as hogan doesn’t score for one/two matches, his confidence will slide out of his backside as always and blues will finish a blindingly mediocre 16th or something similar.
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And he'll go back to being a 'DVB' despite the fact they're currently queuing up to suck him off!
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They have so little in their miserable lives and it is nearly Valentine's Day.
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They have so little in their miserable lives and it is nearly Valentine's Day.
To my luvley gurlfrend
Hapy valuntines day
Luv from Billy
SOTV
xxxx
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They have so little in their miserable lives and it is nearly Valentine's Day.
To my luvley sister
Hapy valuntines day
Luv from Billy
SOTV
xxxx
FTFY
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Another for hogan jesus where the hell was this hogan for all the time we had him 😡
I think we can command quite a good fee for him come the summer cheers blose
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Hogan is a poacher, which is a luxury in the premier league these days.
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Two goals now for hogan jesus he is on fire.
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£4m from Derby or someone come the summer. Won't be bad in the grand scheme of things.
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If he's scoring goals in the championship maybe we should hang on to him.
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If he's scoring goals in the championship maybe we should hang on to him.
I agree. Get rid of wesley and keep if we go down
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He's shit. If we can get any money we should get rid. No way does he have any future at Villa.
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It is starting to get annoying
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We will need him in the Championship.
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
I agree. Playin AEG ul top was a bloody disaster. Hogan could do worse than AEG did
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
I agree. Playin AEG ul top was a bloody disaster. Hogan could do worse than AEG did
I agree.He could do worse.
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I'm sure Scott would be better than Borja Baston! Another shite decision by the management. And helping out the morons across the City makes it worse. Hogan plays best in a two upfront. Smith somehow fails to see it....
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I realise its been a shite day and things look bleak but I maintain that Hogan doing well for somebody is good for us, and lets not re-write history saying we should of given him a go this season etc, not one single person was advocating that before he started scoring for them.
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Some players just cannot perform for big clubs
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Do small heath play with two up front?
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I realise its been a shite day and things look bleak but I maintain that Hogan doing well for somebody is good for us, and lets not re-write history saying we should of given him a go this season etc, not one single person was advocating that before he started scoring for them.
I just think it strange that Smith couldn't get a tune out of him bearing in mind he had him at Brentford ......
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It's not been totally disastrous. Watford winning nobody expected that,they are within reach however.But Brighton result was a very big positive .I had more hope of overhauling them than West Ham..The last game might see them safe,on the beach as opposed to having to get points v us to stay up.
Bournemouth haven't pulled away.It could get worse before it gets better,ie Leicester away.The return of McGinn could be a game changer.We are in a better position of being in the Cash League than we were 12 months ago.
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I know you have to play and give your all for the shirt you are wearing and the noses and Hogan are currently having a big love in with each other but him blowing kisses to the travelling Small Heath fans after scoring today is a bit OTT.
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I take no notice of anyone scoring goals in the championship
there is a long list of players who have done that in the past including ones who have played for us who will never make it at premier league level
the gulf is massive
as it is for every other aspect of the game
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I realise its been a shite day and things look bleak but I maintain that Hogan doing well for somebody is good for us, and lets not re-write history saying we should of given him a go this season etc, not one single person was advocating that before he started scoring for them.
I just think it strange that Smith couldn't get a tune out of him bearing in mind he had him at Brentford ......
Remember he did sod all at Sheffield United and Stoke so this run was hardly predictable.
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
I agree. Playin AEG ul top was a bloody disaster. Hogan could do worse than AEG did
Jesus wept. This year was always going to be a struggle. We’re in a domestic cup final today and barring yesterday where results went against us we were hanging on outside the bottom 3.
But it’s been a shit show of a season and now a player who by his own admission didn’t perform well enough for us as he thought he had made it and who most fans wanted rid of is scoring goals whilst out on loan for a mid table championship has retrospectively become the answer?!?
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He’s found his level at a mid-championship team. Great news for us as we might get a few bob for him. How anyone can think he would be any use in the Premier League is beyond me. A shit player settled in well at a shit team. Good luck to him.
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
I agree. Playin AEG ul top was a bloody disaster. Hogan could do worse than AEG did
Jesus wept. This year was always going to be a struggle. We’re in a domestic cup final today and barring yesterday where results went against us we were hanging on outside the bottom 3.
But it’s been a shit show of a season and now a player who by his own admission didn’t perform well enough for us as he thought he had made it and who most fans wanted rid of is scoring goals whilst out on loan for a mid table championship has retrospectively become the answer?!?
Maybe you misread my reply
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I hope he keeps scoring as he only has a year left on his contract, so a big fee is unrealistic. If he doubles his tally by season's end, I would have thought £5m is possible.
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He’s having his purple patch. Good for him.
However unfortunately for us they’ll be no one foolish enough to spend the kind of money on him like we did the last time he had a purple patch.
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We will need him in the Championship.
Maybe Smith should have given him a chance in the premier league when we had no fit striker.
Serious questions need to be asked of this total shitshow of a season.
I agree. Playin AEG ul top was a bloody disaster. Hogan could do worse than AEG did
Jesus wept. This year was always going to be a struggle. We’re in a domestic cup final today and barring yesterday where results went against us we were hanging on outside the bottom 3.
But it’s been a shit show of a season and now a player who by his own admission didn’t perform well enough for us as he thought he had made it and who most fans wanted rid of is scoring goals whilst out on loan for a mid table championship has retrospectively become the answer?!?
Maybe you misread my reply
Wasn’t responding to you! But agree the sentiment!!
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He’s having his purple patch. Good for him.
However unfortunately for us they’ll be no one foolish enough to spend the kind of money on him like we did the last time he had a purple patch.
he's a proven goalscorer played in the right position. At Villa he was played as a lone striker and had the ball hoofed up to him - he never stood a chance. He needs to play with another striker. There are numerous Villa players who we have signed who have been a great success at their previous club and we somehow manage to turn them into turds.
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There are numerous Villa players who we have signed who have been a great success at their previous club and we somehow manage to turn them into turds.
See also: managers. I can only think of one in my lifetime who went on to bigger things, and I am 51.
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He’s having his purple patch. Good for him.
However unfortunately for us they’ll be no one foolish enough to spend the kind of money on him like we did the last time he had a purple patch.
he's a proven goalscorer played in the right position. At Villa he was played as a lone striker and had the ball hoofed up to him - he never stood a chance. He needs to play with another striker. There are numerous Villa players who we have signed who have been a great success at their previous club and we somehow manage to turn them into turds.
That's a bit of a myth, when we signed him he'd been playing a a lone striker for months and was playing the best football of his life. What he needs is people to create space for him, that can be another forward, or tucked in wingers or someone overlapping from midfield but it's key because he's a very good finisher but he struggles to create space for himself. That limitation is why he's no good for the premier league and why he struggled for us because we've never played that way whilst he's been 'ours'.
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It never helped when the bloke who signed him decided punted long balls down the flanks was the way to go.
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all well and good Skillz but he is a Villa player and it is in our interests to get the best for him and out of him. Who knows, he might still be with us next season.
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Scotty-boy scores again, this time with a chip. He's going to be worth a fortune in the summer.
At this rate I may have to send the Rags a 'Thank You' card.
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Yep he is going to get t least 6-7m in the summer.
If we go down we shoukd keep him on this form
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Our top goalscorer will be playing for blues at this rate. Typical Villa
The club that let Adama Traore leave on exchange for Albert Adomah. We never learn
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Our top goalscorer will be playing for blues at this rate. Typical Villa
The club that let Adama Traore leave on exchange for Albert Adomah. We never learn
What exactly don't we learn? That a player not good enough for us might do better at a lower level?
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He has become a good Championship striker in form this season. He always had that potential in the Championship. Would he be scoring for fun for us in the Premier League? Probably not.
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Our top goalscorer will be playing for blues at this rate. Typical Villa
The club that let Adama Traore leave on exchange for Albert Adomah. We never learn
Both Traore and Hogan were garbage for us. Albert on the other hand made a very positive contribution.
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Hogan said he works better in a front two.Has DS ever played him in that formation? To be honest I'd rather he was still with us than Borja Baston.
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
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Hogan said he works better in a front two.Has DS ever played him in that formation? To be honest I'd rather he was still with us than Borja Baston.
Baston and Hogan might be our front 2 next season.
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Hogan said he works better in a front two.Has DS ever played him in that formation? To be honest I'd rather he was still with us than Borja Baston.
Same.
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7 goals in 48 games suggests to me Hogan is not good enough for us.
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
...for Tony Cascarino.
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
...for Tony Cascarino.
He set up a couple of crucial goals against Arsenal and Chelsea in 1-0 wins late in the season in 1990 then scored in the last two games against Norwich and Everton if I remember right. Plus some vital goals against our relegation rivals Derby and Sunderland late in the following season. Although he was mainly celebrated due to the fact Doug actually shelled out a record fee for him. He always speaks highly of us on Talksport to be fair.
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
...for Tony Cascarino.
Sali-Salifou!
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He wasn’t garbage at all, he was raw and take a look at the players keeping him out the team.
The management of the club was garbage as were many things going on behind the scenes.
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Adama was ok for us in his few appearances, at least he was exciting which was distinctly lacking from pretty much every other player that season. He left because he had no interest in playing for us after relegation, not because we wanted to sell him.
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Surely could get 5m for him in the summer given the form he's in? Bristol City were linked with him in the past and they like spending decent money on forwards.
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Hogan said he works better in a front two.Has DS ever played him in that formation? To be honest I'd rather he was still with us than Borja Baston.
Baston and Hogan might be our front 2 next season.
Or we didnt use him to his strengths
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
Traore was raw and exciting which got the crowd on their feet. First time I saw him was against Notts County in a cup game and he got the place buzzing until he was stamped on and then he was out injured for a while. No he wasn't garbage but injuries and probably crap coaching went against him. He now has more of an end product.
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Calm your tits people. Hogan wouldn't get nowhere near this many goals in the Premier League.
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He wasn’t garbage at all, he was raw and take a look at the players keeping him out the team.
The management of the club was garbage as were many things going on behind the scenes.
he was the wrong player, at the wrong club, with the wrong manager - the whole thing was a mess....
also, remember, Traore has had a good few months - no doubt about that, but that's all it's been really....
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Hogan has consistently played under "the wrong manager" though: Dean Smith (Villa), Wilder (Sheff U), ONeill (Stoke).
For me, he needed to adapt to styles of play and couldn't. He seems to be thriving playing with Jukevick or whatever his name is and long may it continue. It's a marathon not a sprint though and I still think he'll level out.
Tarore was always a fantastic prospect - He didn't want to be here in the Championship so it was better to move him on. Wolves paid £18m for him which is a measure of how far he'd improved. There was always a very good chance of him improving.
I've no problems with letting Hogan go and whilst I wanted to keep Tarore, I understand the reasons for not standing in his way of a move.
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Its pronounced Juicybitch. At least according to one commentator I've heard.
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Traore was many things for us but never garbage. If he was, he is the only Villa player in my watching games live for 75 years home and away, who had the Villa fans singing the name of a garbage player.
Ok maybe garbage is a bit strong but when you compare his contribution to Albert it’s night and day. Fair play to any of the 15/16 squad that went onto better things but after that season I personally wouldn’t have been against selling 99% of that squad (Traore, Veretout and Gueye included)
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He can obviously play do maybe we should just recall him in the summer and play him in a front two, maybe with Samatta, whichever division we are in. That would really p**s off SHA.
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He can obviously play do maybe we should just recall him in the summer and play him in a front two, maybe with Samatta, whichever division we are in. That would really p**s off SHA.
Wesley, Hogan, Davis and Samatta. There will be an abundance of riches up front next season.
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Che Adams did well playing next to Jutkiewicz in the mid-table of the 2nd division aswell. Now hes in a squad were by hes nowhere near good enough at this level.
Before this loan, not 1 single fucker on here would have advocated giving Hogan a go so lets not re-write history. Whatever division were in next season he is not what we need.
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Che Adams did well playing next to Jutkiewicz in the mid-table of the 2nd division aswell. Now hes in a squad were by hes nowhere near good enough at this level.
Before this loan, not 1 single fucker on here would have advocated giving Hogan a go so lets not re-write history. Whatever division were in next season he is not what we need.
Indeed. The Che Adams point is a good one, and I'd say he's a much better all round player than Hogan. Hogan was, and is, wank.
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Che Adams did well playing next to Jutkiewicz in the mid-table of the 2nd division aswell. Now hes in a squad were by hes nowhere near good enough at this level.
Before this loan, not 1 single fucker on here would have advocated giving Hogan a go so lets not re-write history. Whatever division were in next season he is not what we need.
He's said himself that it was never going to work with us and that he was relieved to get away, so as far as I'm concerned if he keeps scoring then it just means that we will get better money for him.
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There's quite a few players we couldn't get the best out of, either who did very well before joining (McCormack, Hogan, arguably Kodija) and others who went on to do very well after leaving (Guye, Veretout, Traore etc.). To counter that though, we have got more out of some players than others have - Benteke is the obvious one, and I'd say Delph hasn't been as good for either City or Everton as he was for us. I suppose all that says is that some players fit and some don't.
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Funny how not watching the ball sailing over his head and a bit of support has got him scoring again.
Even the Noses appear to have a system that works.
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Che Adams did well playing next to Jutkiewicz in the mid-table of the 2nd division aswell. Now hes in a squad were by hes nowhere near good enough at this level.
Before this loan, not 1 single fucker on here would have advocated giving Hogan a go so lets not re-write history. Whatever division were in next season he is not what we need.
Indeed. The Che Adams point is a good one, and I'd say he's a much better all round player than Hogan. Hogan was, and is, wank.
I actually thought Adams played well when he came on against us. He's got this massive monkey on his back though about not scoring.
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So did Shane Long but we helped him out in the same game.
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Championship player of the month
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Is that the first time ever a Birmingham player has won an award for something?
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Is that the first time ever a Birmingham player has won an award for something?
Didn't Trevor Francis once win Rear of the Year?
Sorry, I meant Arsehole of the Century.
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Is that the first time ever a Birmingham player has won an award for something?
Haha, so they can't even win that for themselves, a Villa loan reject has to win an award for them.....
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Is that the first time ever a Birmingham player has won an award for something?
Early release from an electronic ankle tag? ;D
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Is that the first time ever a Birmingham player has won an award for something?
Early release from an electronic ankle tag? ;D
Forever known as a Jerome.
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Scouse Rolex.
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I see our Scott has expressed his desire to join SHA permanently and mentions contract clauses. Nice of him to show due respect to his paymasters.
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Who?
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They can't afford him, they have no money unless they sell Bellingham.
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A straight swap I suggest.
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A straight swap I suggest.
Nah, they can have hurrah Henri as well.
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Aside from a signed and framed photograph of Christophe Dugarry and an old David Dunn jockstrap, I'm not sure they have anything to offer.
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After scoring a busting load of goals his worth has gone up
I reckon we should be looking for offers in and around at least a box of crunchy nut clusters
and if we can get a bidding war going maybe even push it up to a 30% extra bumper pack
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I’d take a goldfish and a balloon for him, and that includes delivery. The useless little twat.
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Probably got about 1m before we loaned him to them, we can probably ask about 6m now. Nice one.
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Probably got about 1m before we loaned him to them, we can probably ask about 6m now. Nice one.
It's like someone taking your broken car, fixing it up, valetting it, whilst paying you for the privalge.
Thanks guys, you're the best.
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To be fair it is a perfect example all round of a successful loan period.
His goals helped Small Heath stay out the bottom six and serious relegation worries.
He will almost certainly be sought after by several Championship clubs meaning Villa can ask a decent price for him, higher than before his loan spell at the sty.
His career has had a kick start and he will probably pocket a decent signing on fee from a Championship club.
I doubt he will end up at Small Heath as I suspect he will have better options and I also suspect they couldn't afford him.
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I can't imagine that he'll go anywhere unless his final year is paid up by Villa. He wouldn't have been seeing a contract like he's on again under normal circumstances. He'll be looking at £6k per week maximum wherever he ends up once it ends.
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He is a championship level player , no one in that league is going to have any cash next season with no fans apart from those who go down ( which could include us ) so I doubt we are going to get very much for him at all
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Officially signed for SHA. Oh my they’ve given him a four year deal!
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They really do take small time to new levels. This is from their OS. Aston and the Clarets.
And it was with The Bees where he really flourished, scoring 21 times in 36 appearances and earning himself a £9m move to Villa.
His playing time with the Aston side was limited as spent three spells out on loan during his tenure at Villa Park, at Sheffield United, Stoke City and most recently Blues.
His 61st and final appearance for The Clarets came in an FA Cup third round tie against Swansea City in January 2019.
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They are talking promotion now on SHA.
I kid you not.
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Have they given us any dough?
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He’ll be their record signing.
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Good riddance. Whiny little shit bloke.
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Ross McCormack was a better signing.
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Good luck Scott. Deano getting yet another one over Bruce! Poor signing.
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It just didn't work out for him, it happens.
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Good riddance. Whiny little shit bloke.
Good summing up.
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I’m laughing my Fcukin head off at our sites words on it!
https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2020/09/16/hogan-blues-move
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What I particularly disliked about him was his clear contempt for the Villa fans. On the increasingly rare occasions he drew applause from the crowd he would turn his back. Small Heath is a perfect club for him.
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What I particularly disliked about him was his clear contempt for the Villa fans. On the increasingly rare occasions he drew applause from the crowd he would turn his back. Small Heath is a perfect club for him.
Yep, and we made him an incredibly wealthy man into the bargain. Fucking weasel.
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To be honest I couldn’t dislike him. I actually felt sorry for him.
Bruce bought him in and played hoof it up to him.
It didn’t take a genius to realise it was never going to work out.
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I’m laughing my Fcukin head off at our sites words on it!
https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2020/09/16/hogan-blues-move
I just burst out laughing too and getting quizzical looks. Brilliant!
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Good luck Scott. Deano getting yet another one over Bruce! Poor signing.
To be fair, Bruce's signings were generally reasonably good although this one turned out to be a poor one.
At the time, few predicted that it would turn out the way it did and Dean himself played him as first choice at Brentford after a bad injury so obviously rated him at that level.
Undisclosed fee - maybe the club are reluctant to divulge how much we have lost!
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It just didn't work out for him, it happens.
Agreed, good luck to him - within reason. I'm happy for him and them to (hopefully) bob around lower mid-table in that division for eternity, and have a good time at what is, in reality, the most appropriate level for both player and club.
We're able to stop paying a player who never really delivered for us and was never going to feature for us again. So a positive move for everyone.
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It’ll be a tough task for whoever takes on his legendary shirt number 99.
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One of our worst ever signings and the alarm bells were ringing very loudly after his first few appearances. Offered absolutely nothing when wasn't scoring. One run aside that was pretty much every game. Bruce claimed at the time he had scouted him since his Rochdale days, such a crock of sh*t. We were in Man City esque mode at the time trying to buy promotion....McCormack, Kodjia, Hogan all signed within six months for ridiculous fees. It was only after Grabban arrived that you realised just how bad the likes of McCormack and Hogan were.
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They reckon we will still be funding some of his wages. Surely that can’t be right.
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
"F**k off Scott" would have been more appropriate.
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
I can't find any comments on the official site other than that either. What am I not seeing?
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
Close the door on the way out love !
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
I can't find any comments on the official site other than that either. What am I not seeing?
Yes, that's it! (Show, don't tell)
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"is that it?" does sum up his time here quite well.
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"Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City." Is that it?
I can't find any comments on the official site other than that either. What am I not seeing?
Yes, that's it! (Show, don't tell)
I reckon High Tower from Police Academy wrote that up.
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£950,000 fee with Villa paying £416,000 towards his remaining year’s wages was a figure I was told . Could be butter ollocks but sounds about right 🤔
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I'm that Alan Partridge gif about this. The shrugging one.
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How are they paying us, a mixture of Embassy fag tokens and Green Shield stamps?
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It’ll be a tough task for whoever takes on his legendary shirt number 99.
I think we should retire the number in his honour.
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Good luck to him - a limited player who can only play in one way signed by an idiot who clearly had no clue how to use him. Think he realised pretty quickly that he was out of his depth & always looked miserable.
Our recruitment in the early Championship years for strikers always appeared to be exclusively look at top scorer charts and pay over the odds for those at the top - kodjia did ok but McCormack & Hogan have been a disaster
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How are they paying us, a mixture of Embassy fag tokens and Green Shield stamps?
Probably rapidly burning into the Bellingham transfer money as we speak . Not that their gate money and commercial revenues were ever good, we know from our recent time in the championship that TV money for the most featured club ( us) was only £6m . They won’t be getting anywhere near that, have no parachute payments and must be haemorrhaging cash operationally 🤞
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I’m laughing my Fcukin head off at our sites words on it!
https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2020/09/16/hogan-blues-move
I just burst out laughing too and getting quizzical looks. Brilliant!
nothing says Skid Row like ‘Striker Scott Hogan has completed a permanent move to Birmingham City’
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player who can only play in one way signed by an idiot who clearly had no clue how to use him.
Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more.
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FattyBumBum
22:46, Wed 16 Sep
b34blues
He could be our Jamie Vardy this fella
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FattyBumBum
22:46, Wed 16 Sep
b34blues
He could be our Jamie Vardy this fella
😂😂😂
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In a parralel universe we are 18th in the Championship with a front two of Hogan and McCormack.
Twenty four fucking million.
-
player who can only play in one way signed by an idiot who clearly had no clue how to use him.
Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more.
Never had Shakespeare quoted at me on H&V before.....excellent
Now....much like A Level English I must order the York Notes for Macbeth to see what it all means :-) :-)
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There are very few situations in anyone's life where that verse isn't relevant, but more so for Scott Hogan!
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Very true
-
Sliding Doors. Ours, as opposed to Leicester City away.
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Err thanks for everything. Hope you go on to bigger and better things...... Oh....
-
It’ll be a tough task for whoever takes on his legendary shirt number 99.
I think we should retire the number in his honour.
That would be the best way to rip the piss out of that lot we could do. It would be brilliant.
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It would also be acknowledging them, the cretins would probably take it as a compliment.
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Can’t believe he is only 28 !
-
player who can only play in one way signed by an idiot who clearly had no clue how to use him.
Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more.
It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
-
So we have managed to get rid of yet more of our crap to our little neighbours in Small Heath .Good to get rid of him at last
-
player who can only play in one way signed by an idiot who clearly had no clue how to use him.
Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more.
Never had Shakespeare quoted at me on H&V before.....excellent
Now....much like A Level English I must order the York Notes for Macbeth to see what it all means :-) :-)
Yes I enjoyed it very much. Thank you our SexyE.
I had to search to find the final lines and happened to get it from here Gareth (not that You were serious, but anyway... https://www.sparknotes.com/nofear/shakespeare/macbeth/page_202/
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So we have managed to get rid of yet more of our crap to our little neighbours in Small Heath .Good to get rid of him at last
They won’t enjoy being our B/cast off team though will they?
-
Give the potatoe his due, Bruce has written three more soccer themed crime novels than Bill ever managed.
-
Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more.
"Now put yer knickers on and make me a cup of tea, chop chop!"
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ES_7uaeWoAMvzwK.jpg)
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As an aside, Simon Day's autobiog is one of the most painfully honest you could read.
-
Bye Tyrion.
-
I always thought him more like Reek
-
Undisclosed fee - maybe the club are reluctant to divulge how much we have lost!
A fair bit I imagine, but I wonder how much we ended up actually paying for him? The fee was said to be up to £12m with add-ons, but I presume some of them were triggered on him actually achieving something. Any to do with scoring goals wouldn't be paid but no doubt we had to pay extra when getting promoted.
-
I always thought him more like Reek
Ha!
-
Sliding Doors. Ours, as opposed to Leicester City away.
Absolutely. I still shudder when I think about that game. Sliding doors moment for us, Leicester and Tim Sherwood's career.
-
Bye Tyrion.
Ha ha nice one. I still chuckle at someone's description of him on here. It went "watching Hogan chase after the ball is like watching Tyrion Lanister running into battle"
-
Bye Tyrion.
Ha ha nice one. I still chuckle at someone's description of him on here. It went "watching Hogan chase after the ball is like watching Tyrion Lanister running into battle"
That was me I think.
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Bye Tyrion.
Ha ha nice one. I still chuckle at someone's description of him on here. It went "watching Hogan chase after the ball is like watching Tyrion Lanister running into battle"
That was me I think.
Kudos to you. Still one of my favourite ever posts on here.
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has been shown to the masses of B9 yet ? stretching the shirt and spouting the usual Blues bollox and SOTV etc etc...
UTV
The Doc
-
B9 has masses?
-
B9 has masses?
yeah everyone in Brum supports dabluuz.
UTV
The Doc
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has been shown to the masses of B9 yet ? stretching the shirt and spouting the usual Blues bollox and SOTV etc etc...
UTV
The Doc
He looked at that shirt & thought ‘yay signing for Peterborough loads of chances for me’ - imagine his disappointment going back to the Wastlands
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B9 has masses?
Yes, like Mordor.
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If he's twice as good for them as he was for us he will still be useless.
-
Bye Tyrion.
Ha ha nice one. I still chuckle at someone's description of him on here. It went "watching Hogan chase after the ball is like watching Tyrion Lanister running into battle"
That was me I think.
Kudos to you. Still one of my favourite ever posts on here.
Seconded. Extremely memorable, and I couldn't watch Game of Thrones after without thinking of our Scott.
Good riddance. He looks like a Blues player.
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I'd like to hope that at least some attempt was made to punt him back to Brentford.
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B9 has masses?
On the brainstem probably.
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Masses of them but they still can’t find Sherlock Street.
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Bye Tyrion.
Ha ha nice one. I still chuckle at someone's description of him on here. It went "watching Hogan chase after the ball is like watching Tyrion Lanister running into battle"
That was me I think.
Kudos to you. Still one of my favourite ever posts on here.
Seconded. Extremely memorable, and I couldn't watch Game of Thrones after without thinking of our Scott.
Good riddance. He looks like a Blues player.
I was spared that. I had to Google "Tyrion".
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I don't hold him any ill will, he got very few chances for us but he never seemed to be a shirker like some. He just didn't fit our system and wasn't good enough to adapt I guess. I blame Bruce more than him really.
When I say I wish him no ill will, obviously I hope he loses as many games as possible and is relegated next year, but I don't mind if he scores a few goals along the way.
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
‘Jude’ is better than Jack according to many noses.
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Must we continue with this thread in any way ?
No relevance or interest!
The man had his biggest chance ever and failed for all sorts of reasons I won't be interested in him like I am with say Green, Robinson or even Weimann and Adomah he's a distant thought.
Let him be gone!
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
‘Jude’ is better than Jack according to many noses.
Can't compare but Bellingham is decent have to say that . But that's why he moved from a lowly EFL club and that league
Far too good.
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
‘Jude’ is better than Jack according to many noses.
Can't compare but Bellingham is decent have to say that . But that's why he moved from a lowly EFL club and that league
Far too good.
Was talking to a friend (he's a nose but a decent enough guy) the other day Grealish and Bellingham sum the 2 clubs up perfectly. Even at our lowest point for 50 years we've had a genius emerge from our academy and stay with us, becoming the club captain with most of their fans desperately holding on to the myth that he's a bad boy because of a photo of him drunk in tenerife 6 years ago. They had one come through and he's left the club before he can even legally drink but many of there fans still think he's their version of Jack. The term small time gets used on this forum a bit too often but how they've handled selling a teenager to a champions league club is the best definition of it I think we'll ever see.
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
‘Jude’ is better than Jack according to many noses.
Can't compare but Bellingham is decent have to say that . But that's why he moved from a lowly EFL club and that league
Far too good.
Was talking to a friend (he's a nose but a decent enough guy) the other day Grealish and Bellingham sum the 2 clubs up perfectly. Even at our lowest point for 50 years we've had a genius emerge from our academy and stay with us, becoming the club captain with most of their fans desperately holding on to the myth that he's a bad boy because of a photo of him drunk in tenerife 6 years ago. They had one come through and he's left the club before he can even legally drink but many of there fans still think he's their version of Jack. The term small time gets used on this forum a bit too often but how they've handled selling a teenager to a champions league club is the best definition of it I think we'll ever see.
Retiring the number 22 shirt for a kid who played a handful of games? That's the most small time thing I've ever heard.
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He’s better than Watkins according to one Nose
‘Jude’ is better than Jack according to many noses.
Can't compare but Bellingham is decent have to say that . But that's why he moved from a lowly EFL club and that league
Far too good.
Was talking to a friend (he's a nose but a decent enough guy) the other day Grealish and Bellingham sum the 2 clubs up perfectly. Even at our lowest point for 50 years we've had a genius emerge from our academy and stay with us, becoming the club captain with most of their fans desperately holding on to the myth that he's a bad boy because of a photo of him drunk in tenerife 6 years ago. They had one come through and he's left the club before he can even legally drink but many of there fans still think he's their version of Jack. The term small time gets used on this forum a bit too often but how they've handled selling a teenager to a champions league club is the best definition of it I think we'll ever see.
Retiring the number 22 shirt for a kid who played a handful of games? That's the most small time thing I've ever heard.
Nano time.
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Must we continue with this thread in any way ?
No relevance or interest!
The man had his biggest chance ever and failed for all sorts of reasons I won't be interested in him like I am with say Green, Robinson or even Weimann and Adomah he's a distant thought.
Let him be gone!
That quote made me laugh. No "Thanks and good luck Scott", just "Let him be gone"! I can think of a number of players who deserved that farewell message over the years. A few of our managers as well.
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Hogan has signed a four year contract? Have we agreed to pay his wages or something?
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
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Was never good enough for us and he’s found his level again now.
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
I doubt it.
I’m pretty sure that would have been picked up by someone when he signed
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
I doubt it.
I’m pretty sure that would have been picked up by someone when he signed
This was it
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mylondon.news/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-aston-villa-arent-big-11695460.amp
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Awful signing. Had a decent month in Bruce's playoff season before Grabban replaced him. Other than that, woeful.
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Legs too short for his body, he will fit in well.
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
I doubt it.
I’m pretty sure that would have been picked up by someone when he signed
This was it
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mylondon.news/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-aston-villa-arent-big-11695460.amp
Plonker
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
I doubt it.
I’m pretty sure that would have been picked up by someone when he signed
This was it
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mylondon.news/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-aston-villa-arent-big-11695460.amp
Plonker
Yeah, too big for you too handle sausage man.
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I appreciate we are probably talking gobstoppers and marbles, but do we have any idea what the fee was for Hogan?
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Guardian listed it as 3m. No idea what their source is, but usually pretty reliable.
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I appreciate we are probably talking gobstoppers and marbles, but do we have any idea what the fee was for Hogan?
Undisclosed, but i remember reading somewhere (here?) that it was £950,000 with us paying a fair chunk of his wages for the first season.
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If we got anything like £3M for him it would be fantastic.
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If we got anything like £3M for him it would be fantastic.
and we would have been wearing the full Lincoln green for that deal
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Typical knee-jerk short-sighted Steve Bruce "let's buy an in form player without researching about him or learning how to play to his strangths" - he did it with Lansbury, Hourihane and Hogan. A failure on so many levels.
Probably at a club to match his level. Which, doesn't say much about Blues or Hogan.
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Typical knee-jerk short-sighted Steve Bruce "let's buy an in form player without researching about him or learning how to play to his strangths" - he did it with Lansbury, Hourihane and Hogan. A failure on so many levels.
Probably at a club to match his level. Which, doesn't say much about Blues or Hogan.
and signed Bjarnason on the basis he'd played well agianst England a few months earlier.
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Maybe Birkir blasted that penalty over the bar against England on purpose last week to show how silly Steve Bruce is.
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Typical knee-jerk short-sighted Steve Bruce "let's buy an in form player without researching about him or learning how to play to his strangths" - he did it with Lansbury, Hourihane and Hogan. A failure on so many levels.
Probably at a club to match his level. Which, doesn't say much about Blues or Hogan.
Harsh on Hourihane, who played a big part in our return to the Premier League.
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Birkir strikes me as the kind of person who would begrudge you the steam from his piss.
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Birkir strikes me as the kind of person who would begrudge you the steam from his piss.
You mean he is tight?
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Didn’t he have a pop at us the summer before he joined? Something about us not being a big club?
I doubt it.
I’m pretty sure that would have been picked up by someone when he signed
This was it
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mylondon.news/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-aston-villa-arent-big-11695460.amp
Stand corrected, bud 👍
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Birkir strikes me as the kind of person who would begrudge you the steam from his piss.
You mean he is tight?
I obviously have no idea what his relationship with his money is. He just always seemed pretty self-centred to me (based on no knowledge whatsoever on my part).
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Birkir strikes me as the kind of person who would begrudge you the steam from his piss.
You mean he is tight?
I obviously have no idea what his relationship with his money is. He just always seemed pretty self-centred to me (based on no knowledge whatsoever on my part).
Ah got you👍
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I think Sexual is onto something. Apparently during his many days off in Brum, Bjarnasson posed in his undies on Instagram for designer labels.
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I think Sexual is onto something. Apparently during his many days off in Brum, Brnassojan posed in his undies on Instagram for designer labels.
If you and SE aren't confusing Bjarnason with Bjorn Borg you may have a point and we're the berks 'ere.
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I think we can safely say Scottie is not going to be their Jamie Vardy.
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I don't have a problem with Hogan. The fee and presumably the wages were not at his instigation, but rather the throw the cash road to bankruptcy that the then owner was pursuing. He put a shift in but it didn't work out. It happens. I wish him well and hope he scores plenty of late consolation goals.
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He put a shift in but it didn't work out. It happens.
He didn't though, not really. He even said so himself when he moved to Stoke.
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He put a shift in but it didn't work out. It happens.
He didn't though, not really. He even said so himself when he moved to Stoke.
He completely lost, like a bloke who had been told he had won the lottery even though he hadn't bought a ticket.
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He will score goals for that lot though. If his attitude is right.
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He will score goals for that lot though. If his attitude is right.
He will need to as they don't score many. Although to be fair they don't concede many either.
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“We had a list and Scott was at the top of the list at that time, we were in no hurry. We didn’t make any mistake because we knew we wanted Scotty and Scotty wanted to come back here."
And Karanka is confident that Blues' new number 9 can reproduce the form that saw him bag seven goals in nine games earlier in his loan.
“I want the Scotty Hogan who played here at the beginning of the loan – and he knows that. It is a hungry player who has come," continued Karanka.
“A four-year contract is a big show of commitment from the Club and I think is the only way to convince a player like Scotty who had a nice contract at Villa and a lot of offers to go (elsewhere).
“If he has shown commitment coming here, we have to show that same commitment. There are also three parties in this scenario and Birmingham City and Scotty wanted to be together.
“He told me he wanted to move and know he wasn’t going back. The last how many years he has had to go along knowing he had to go back again. Now it is permanent which is important for him.”
Interesting comments from Blose's journeyman manager (though most are, in fairness) Karanka. A few clubs interested but probably none willing to hand him a four year deal which is a big commitment in a division where most clubs are short on cash, pandemic or not.
I imagine it's similar to when we signed Shay Given - generous contract length because the weekly salary was too high to spread it over less years.
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The sorts of veiled, snidey, anti Villa comments from those associated with them classless twats just tell me again that we should never ever do them any favours ever. Hogan is a whiny little prick and always will be.
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Totally Nan's hair's fault the whole saga. Any idiot could see he didn't suit Bruce's style of play. Presumably he talked to him before signing and wanted him to come, so apart from Hogan telling him he hasn't got a clue about tactics, i'm not sure what he could do. Nan's hair has form for this before and since Villa so, its par for the course he'd leave us with a total dud striker.
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At the risk of repeating the idea of a discussion board for fans, the idea is to discuss things including players, ex players, classless clubs that are within the same vicinity. That is why we are discussing him. And he is of relevance since he has signed for them, saved them from relegation last season and if you believe most accounts, we are still paying for the dud's wages this season even after he has gone.
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Not surprised to hear from Karanka that Hogan had other options. At the reported fee plus our wage subsidy, it’s a worthwhile punt for mid to low championship sides.
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What will it take to move on for Hogan obsession to diminish.
He's of no relevance!
Why are people still talking about him?
He's hardly a villa legends player seeing such a thread existing so prominently makes no sense!
I'm pretty sure the endless speculation about players that aren't ours are irrelevant too, so let's stop that.
No point in chatting about past matches as we can't influence them, so forget it.
No point talking about someone's personality unless we've met them ourselves and can vouch for it, so let's get rid of most of the player threads too.
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well one year left on a 50k a week contract vs 4 years on probably half that. Would guess that's what swung it for him. Doubt the other clubs were offering that sort of security
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https://mobile.twitter.com/bcfc/status/1308058657851084801?s=12
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The gift that keeps giving
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How many references to genitals do those idiots need?