Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Ron Manager on July 31, 2015, 04:37:26 PM
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Following the recent influx of talented players I think it is about time young Mr Grace called the following individuals into his boardroom.
Mr T.Sherwood
Mr T Fox
Ms Lorna McClelland
Ms Sharon Barnhurst
Mr Paddy Reilly
to tell them .....all together now
" You've all done very well"
Ms Lorna must be on treble time the ammount of woman hours she must have put in!
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Hear, hear! Great window. Would be interesting to know who targeted these players.
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They have clearly planned well and executed efficiently on all of their targets. They should absolutely be commended. Part of me does wonder what all this would have looked like had Delph and Benteke not been sold. But if they have done nothing else, and not to ignore the obvious quality of those two players, these additions have gone a long way to helping us move on.
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I think that the DoF needs to added also.
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Hear, hear! Great window. Would be interesting to know who targeted these players.
There seem to be generic TS quotes for some and more genuine ones for others, like Gestede. I wonder if that's a clue.
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What about Nicky Keye? She's been keeping the bastid place afloat all-decade.
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Hear, hear! Great window. Would be interesting to know who targeted these players.
There seem to be generic TS quotes for some and more genuine ones for others, like Gestede. I wonder if that's a clue.
Good point, I noticed that with Veretout, sounded like someone on someone else's list.
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Randolph Lerner needs to be on that list for blowing away any theories some people had that he would just trouser the money from this summers sales.
Randy - if this is what the future is going to look like, take the club off the market and stick around.
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And all for a tasty 2.75 million profit so far.
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It's been a remarkable transfer window so far. Obviously there is a risk that it mightn't work out, but it's a calculated risk from the looks of things. Think of how low the mood was just, what, two weeks ago, to how much optimism there is around here now. Let's hope that continues through the start of the campaign, regardless of results. There may need to be a little bit of bedding in time for the players to gain an understanding, we might not see instant results.
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I think the club have done well to get a few players in before pre-season and a fair few more before the season starts. Let's hope most of them turn out well.
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Considering he's a cheeky chappie cockerney, who likes to play up to the press and who loves to give a quote or 4, Mr Sherwood has been no less than magnificent over the last 2 weeks.
Quietly going about the business of transforming the playing staff.
Well done Tim, that's the way to do it.
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I think that the DoF needs to added also.
Paddy Reilly is basically our DoF in it's traditional sense. He has the ear of Fox, responsible for choosing/recommending our manager, running our scouting network and helping Sherwood rubber stamp his back room staff and player requirements. Fox appears to have a very sharp mind and knows his way around but Reilly is his football sounding board. He fact that Sherwood was a Reilly recommendation means there's great harmony behind the scenes. Bringing in the football analyst was a great move by Sherwood but despite his job title he's not a DoF.
What I like right now is we have a very good set up from the boardroom down. Everything is geared to providing the best opportunity to success where it most matters, on the pitch. Over to you, Tim. Do us proud.
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One of the things I like is that we appear to have targeted players and made a move for them without any fuss, the first time any of the media has picked up on any is when we are already in negotiations.
The other great thing is that none of them were on the list compiled by footyskillz.
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Randolph Lerner needs to be on that list for blowing away any theories some people had that he would just trouser the money from this summers sales.
Randy - if this is what the future is going to look like, take the club off the market and stick around.
Agree with this. Also for finally getting a decent management team in. It's not been for the want of trying but finally we look like we have the behind the scenes stuff going on. Well in Randy. Up the Villa.
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We should still have about 20m left in the kitty to buy more if Sherwood wanted to on top too. Maybe Lerner I'd genuinely reinvigorated by Good and Sherwood. Fingers crossed because we are acting like a genuinely big club with ambition for the first time in years it seems it is underpinned with a real thought through plan.
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Randolph Lerner needs to be on that list for blowing away any theories some people had that he would just trouser the money from this summers sales.
Randy - if this is what the future is going to look like, take the club off the market and stick around.
I'd have to say I'm one of the biggest Lerner defenders around. I've even defended his actions against Browns fans when they were begging him to sell the team as if some new owner was going to magically wave a wand and pull in a new roster over-night that would suddenly look like they had played with each other for 5 years.
That said ... Lerner has taken around 40+ million pounds from the sales of Benteke and Delph and let Tim turn them into a slew of other players. His net-spend is probably among the lowest of any year since he's been here. Now granted he let the guy do his work and didn't pocket 40 million pounds and run off into retirement, but let's not pretend he's gone on some massive spending spree all of the sudden ... yet anyway. ;)
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Ditto randy Lerner and Sheila in the ticket office for reasons only I know big bunch of flowers for her when i get up from towie land
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It's not about net spend. It's about what you do with whatever resources you have available. If every season we sold a top player for £20-25m and invested that money 2-3 players we'll be better off. I almost think that teams like Man U spend the way they do because the fans simply couldn't face them buying in the £5-10m shop. Even if they could find the same or very similar quality there. We need to make sure we always invest wisely which we all hope Fox and Sherwood have done.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
No, do it all now before it all turns to shit.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
Have they exceeded all of your expectations for this transfer window? If the answer is yes, then plaudits are due. We'll worry about the season when it starts.
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Randolph Lerner needs to be on that list for blowing away any theories some people had that he would just trouser the money from this summers sales.
Randy - if this is what the future is going to look like, take the club off the market and stick around.
I'd have to say I'm one of the biggest Lerner defenders around. I've even defended his actions against Browns fans when they were begging him to sell the team as if some new owner was going to magically wave a wand and pull in a new roster over-night that would suddenly look like they had played with each other for 5 years.
That said ... Lerner has taken around 40+ million pounds from the sales of Benteke and Delph and let Tim turn them into a slew of other players. His net-spend is probably among the lowest of any year since he's been here. Now granted he let the guy do his work and didn't pocket 40 million pounds and run off into retirement, but let's not pretend he's gone on some massive spending spree all of the sudden ... yet anyway. ;)
This does remind me of the hyperbole around Lambert's first 'young and hungry' transfer window. I wasn't convinced and I think that, broadly speaking, I was right. I can see a lot more arguments for this window that actually hold water, but I am cautiously optimistic at best that we will be safe a bit earlier. I will, hopefully, be thrilled and delighted to be publicly wrong at the end of the season.
I also agree, that this is not some huge change in Randy's strategy. We are still living within our means, as we have done since McLeish.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
I'd call that a Eureka moment in this thread.
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Spurs spunked the Bale money and Liverpool the Suarez money so lets not get carried away yet until we have seen them all in action, but I do feel genuinely excited going into the season.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
No, do it all now before it all turns to shit.
Lulz, spoken like a true Villain.
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They have an excellent transfer window and I could see 3-4 more arrivals and maybe 2-3 departure in next few weeks. I hope we are using Arsenal transfer methods as footprint and we learn from our mistakes from O'Neill to Lambert era. But again we will know say in October or November if the team are gelling nicely.
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If you believe as I do that Timmah thought we could keep Benteke and Delph, then this rapid execution of Plan B has been exemplary, and he deserves plaudits whether it works out or not.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
This.
And if that is too negative for some then aside from a load of stats and Youtube videos we have no idea how these new signings are likely to perform in the Premier League. We could hve signed a load of duffers for all we know. I'd certainly not heard of any of the French-/Spanish based players before the last few weeks.
I want to believe. I'd love to believe, however this club has kicked me in the balls too many times for me to just accept a load of transfer activity as proof that things are going to be better. The last four or five years of gash football have helped see to that.
We can start working out if plaudits are due next Saturday at about 4.50pm. It'll be examination one of thirty-eight.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
This.
And if that is too negative for some then aside from a load of stats and Youtube videos we have no idea how these new signings are likely to perform in the Premier League. We could hve signed a load of duffers for all we know. I'd certainly not heard of any of the French-/Spanish based players before the last few weeks.
I want to believe. I'd love to believe, however this club has kicked me in the balls too many times for me to just accept a load of transfer activity as proof that things are going to be better. The last four or five years of gash football have helped see to that.
We can start working out if plaudits are due next Saturday at about 4.50pm. It'll be examination one of thirty-eight.
So what did you want the club to do in this window sign nobody at all.
Just in case they were 'Gash' as you put it.
No pleasing some people is there?
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I'm in the 'it's too early to say' camp.
That is not a criticism, just that I had not heard of any of the french lot so cannot begin the say whether they're good value for money or otherwise. That said, they're all pretty much the type of player that I would have wanted us to buy - e.g. age and value - and trust that they have been suitably scouted and checked out by the new backroom staff.
As an aside I'm intrigued to know how the process has been managed between Sherwood/Reilly/The camp from Arsenal (not Fox, the new one).
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Me too. To use a cricket analogy*, we'll see how good our 1st innings total is once the other team has batted. Yes, lots of seemingly decent signings, but not too much is known of some of them and how will they all fit together? A lot of changes. But as Daniel says, everything looks like it was and is, being done the right way.
*not the best!
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I think the plaudits are timely and very much deserved. The club from the top down is finally beginning to act like the big club we are and always have been. I second and agree with all the praise in this thread but those of us who agree that we are finally on the right path have got to be braced for the inevitable comments of those who are poised in the wings to pass critical judgement. We saw at Forest yesterday that the team is basically thrown together and there were defensive blunders in abundance. But what we also saw was a team packed with good technique, speed, flair and imagination. We have to hold our nerve during the difficulties of the early games and see the project of post TSMx2 team rebuilding through. God knows how long we have waited for a player to make a cross for Sinclair's third goal like Veretout did yesterday, that alone was worth the drive from Southwold to Nottingham and back.
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It's been very good and efficient. I think we're still a proven goal scorer and a quality centre half short, but we've done a very good job.
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So what did you want the club to do in this window sign nobody at all.
I don't believe I said that.
Just in case they were 'Gash' as you put it.
You don't know that they aren't gash.
No pleasing some people is there?
Actually, there is. What you're failing to recognise (simply because I have a different opinion to you) is that I'll be pleased when the club have come through the season without getting relegated. Actually, dull, boring mid-table obscurity would actually be a joy for a change. That'll be the time for plaudits, in my opinion.
Some of us have been here before - the summer of 1986 we made signings. Do you remember it? We went into a new season full of hope. That hope was cruelly extinguished by Spurs (and a rampant Clive Allen in particular) on the opening day at home and things barely improved all season. The history books will tell you where we finished.
Ultimately, its results that the club will be judged on in history. Results will determine at which level we play beyond the coming season.
Not who we sign.
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I was not applauding who we have signed. Only time will tell us the answer to that one. What I am applauding is the way we have gone about our business. There has clearly been a plan. In my eyes it is a very astute plan to look for european players and pay with record low Euros. France was always going to offer opportunities to acquire better class players at competitive prices and players willing to move a relatively short distance for better wages than they can earn in Ligue Un.
I do not ask every new player we sign to be a Benteke, all I ask is for the purchase of the player to be done in a planned, positive and professional way. For five years every sign coming out of VP was that we were making it up as we went along. That that is over is reason enough to celebrate.
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Here here Brian.
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I'll be pleased when the club have come through the season without getting relegated. Actually, dull, boring mid-table obscurity would actually be a joy for a change. That'll be the time for plaudits, in my opinion.
The season before last we lost away to a poor Newcastle side in February. After the game my Newcastle friends were celebrating the fact that those 3 points meant that they were safe for another season, whereas we had another 3 months of tension and nervousness. I agree with you that mid-table obscurity would be a pleasant change.
As far as the new signings are concerned, we can't expect them all to succeed. Let's hope that a few do. QPR, Spurs and Liverpool have shown that wholesale changes don't necessarily bring success and certainly don't bring stability. Southampton, on the other hand, have proved that a good manager can change half the team and start winning immediately.
Of course we hope that the new Villa will play exciting, dynamic football and, like Saints, achieve instant success. But that may not happen. In the light of the last few seasons, comfortably avoiding relegation would be an achievement.
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I think some people are missing the point. It's not so much about who we've signed specifically but the professional (finally) way in which the club have gone about bringing in promising players in good time for the season. I think most people accept that new signings can always go either way, even the Shevchenkos and Falcaos of this world aren't guaranteed to work out. I think credit is due for the approach, especially if they now add some more defensive options.
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I think some people are missing the point. It's not so much about who we've signed specifically but the professional (finally) way in which the club have gone about bringing in promising players in good time for the season. I think most people accept that new signings can always go either way, even the Shevchenkos and Falcaos of this world aren't guaranteed to work out. I think credit is due for the approach, especially if they now add some more defensive options.
True to an extend, but the professionalism can only really be judged once the quality of the players is apparent, after all to spend money is not hard, to spend it in a sustainable way, much more difficult.
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We haven't played a competitive game yet. Let's save the plaudits for a while...
This.
And if that is too negative for some then aside from a load of stats and Youtube videos we have no idea how these new signings are likely to perform in the Premier League. We could hve signed a load of duffers for all we know. I'd certainly not heard of any of the French-/Spanish based players before the last few weeks.
I want to believe. I'd love to believe, however this club has kicked me in the balls too many times for me to just accept a load of transfer activity as proof that things are going to be better. The last four or five years of gash football have helped see to that.
We can start working out if plaudits are due next Saturday at about 4.50pm. It'll be examination one of thirty-eight.
I broadly agree, Im looking at the sides people are thinking we will start with and am still wondering if it will be strong enough. However if we bring in another centre back and a forward then I think we will be in better shape.
The club have done well to get the players in with a minimum of fuss, it will be an interesting season.
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Quantity isn' t quality, but time will tell.
Frankly I don't give a monkey's chuff whether the signings were done months in advance with meticulous planning or were agreed over 10 pints of Inferno, written on the back of a fag packet- all signings are a gamble.
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Quantity isn' t quality, but time will tell.
Frankly I don't give a monkey's chuff whether the signings were done months in advance with meticulous planning or were agreed over 10 pints of Inferno, written on the back of a fag packet- all signings are a gamble.
I would suggest that the first type of signing has a higher chance of success than the second, though.
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Quantity isn' t quality, but time will tell.
Frankly I don't give a monkey's chuff whether the signings were done months in advance with meticulous planning or were agreed over 10 pints of Inferno, written on the back of a fag packet- all signings are a gamble.
Barry, Barry Fry? Is that you?
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Quantity isn' t quality, but time will tell.
Frankly I don't give a monkey's chuff whether the signings were done months in advance with meticulous planning or were agreed over 10 pints of Inferno, written on the back of a fag packet- all signings are a gamble.
Barry, Barry Fry? Is that you?
Superb!
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Quantity isn' t quality, but time will tell.
Frankly I don't give a monkey's chuff whether the signings were done months in advance with meticulous planning or were agreed over 10 pints of Inferno, written on the back of a fag packet- all signings are a gamble.
Barry, Barry Fry? Is that you?
I thought it was Martin O'Neill but then remembered he didn't smoke.
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I think some people are missing the point. It's not so much about who we've signed specifically but the professional (finally) way in which the club have gone about bringing in promising players in good time for the season. I think most people accept that new signings can always go either way, even the Shevchenkos and Falcaos of this world aren't guaranteed to work out. I think credit is due for the approach, especially if they now add some more defensive options.
True to an extend, but the professionalism can only really be judged once the quality of the players is apparent, after all to spend money is not difficult, to spend it in a sustainable way, much more difficult.
I disagree, the quality of the players is often a gamble however much you spend and however you bring them in. There are no guarantees, but I would have thought an approach where the signings are part of an overall strategy, are well scouted and brought in relatively early to give them a run together in pre-season, has more chance of succeeding.
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I was not applauding who we have signed. Only time will tell us the answer to that one. What I am applauding is the way we have gone about our business. There has clearly been a plan. In my eyes it is a very astute plan to look for european players and pay with record low Euros. France was always going to offer opportunities to acquire better class players at competitive prices and players willing to move a relatively short distance for better wages than they can earn in Ligue Un.
I do not ask every new player we sign to be a Benteke, all I ask is for the purchase of the player to be done in a planned, positive and professional way. For five years every sign coming out of VP was that we were making it up as we went along. That that is over is reason enough to celebrate.
Spot on. For the first time in a long time, the club looks like it's being run on a professional basis.
Well done to all concerned, let's hope they are able to deliver improved results throughout the season.
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I honestly can't comment on the signings as not seen any of them play. Maybe Crespo in Europa League games gone by. Haven't even looked at the YT footage of the others.
However there seems to be a more imaginative approach to signings for the first time in a long time so the recruitment side has been done effectively.
I now hope this is transposed to the playing side in the coming weeks.
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I honestly can't comment on the signings as not seen any of them play. Maybe Crespo in Europa League games gone by. Haven't even looked at the YT footage of the others.
However there seems to be a more imaginative approach to signings for the first time in a long time so the recruitment side has been done effectively.
I now hope this is transposed to the playing side in the coming weeks.
Have you watched any of the pre-season footage? Amavi looks a fantastic prospect from both the YT footage and from his perfromances so far, I think we might have bagged an absolute bargain there, looks every bit as good as Luke Shaw to me.
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The only cause for concern I've noticed with the new players is that they make (with a few exceptions) the remaining squad members look as bad as we thought they were. Its like having a new kitchen fitted, filled with all the latest mod cons and appliances...except you forgot to buy a new kettle and toaster because they did a job.
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The only cause for concern I've noticed with the new players is that they make (with a few exceptions) the remaining squad members look as bad as we thought they were. Its like having a new kitchen fitted, filled with all the latest mod cons and appliances...except you forgot to buy a new kettle and toaster because they did a job.
From what I've seen Westwood and Clark have stepped up and Gil, Bacuna, Kozak and Sinclair have shown they can do the same. Grealish was showing the rest of the squad up already last year so I'm confident he'll fit right in as well. If Guzan, Okore and Sanchez step up as well that's the core of the matchday 18 all performing at a higher level than we're used to, which is what I thik will happen, but it may take a few games for them to all get properly used to each other and start looking like a unit.
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To my mind all the players Sherwood inherited have been signed on frees from a particuarly shite team. Let's see what they can do with the benefit of decent coaches; remember that in his first season Westwood was as good as the snake.
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To my mind all the players Sherwood inherited have been signed on frees from a particuarly shite team. Let's see what they can do with the benefit of decent coaches; remember that in his first season Westwood was as good as the snake.
I agree. He has actually got worse since he has been here in some aspects. He was much more willing to pass/move when he first joined and has only shown that fleetingly since. I think he is now stronger however and possibly is starting to feel that he belongs at this level.
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To my mind all the players Sherwood inherited have been signed on frees from a particuarly shite team. Let's see what they can do with the benefit of decent coaches; remember that in his first season Westwood was as good as the snake.
I agree. He has actually got worse since he has been here in some aspects. He was much more willing to pass/move when he first joined and has only shown that fleetingly since. I think he is now stronger however and possibly is starting to feel that he belongs at this level.
Westwood is a very tidy passer of the ball and is a good player when we are in possession. If he can add more first time passes to his game to surprise opponents he can be dangerous for us.
Defensively he is not great and he needs to work more on interceptions and being a nuisance.
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Westwood could become the Carrodus/ Bremner type player the team needs (seniors please explain to juniors)
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Westwood could become the Carrodus/ Bremner type player the team needs (seniors please explain to juniors)
We need an old bloke in midfield.*
* I was being facetious!
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Westwood could become the Carrodus/ Bremner type player the team needs (seniors please explain to juniors)
He may need some Red Bull.
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Oldtimernow
Not even mo farah can run as much as frank carrodus
Wish we had him now mate
Utv
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To be fair we were mostly very complimentary about he way we did business in Lambert's first window. There always seemed to be an alternative if the selling club messed about and we had no problem dropping a deal and moving on if it looked like getting sticky.
Maybe the difference this time around is the apparent quality of the players we have bought, and it does help when you have a Benteke to sell.
The proof will be in the playing, but if some players we have bought in this window turn out to be as good investments as Benteke, Lerner's fourth generation Villa will be some team.
I'd certainly agree with the sentiments about coaching. In pre-season Westwood and Bacuna especially have already looked more accomplished players.
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Westwood could become the Carrodus/ Bremner type player the team needs (seniors please explain to juniors)
Bremner was the prototype for the Duracell bunny. I don't think Westwood will ever have the energy or willing to play the wide midfield role.
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Er.....even more plaudits are due. In fact bloody hundreds of them!!!
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They cannot be faulted for the imagination they have shown. Time will tell whether each signing has been equally well researched.
Without doubt the most exciting villa team (on paper) I can remember.
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Have the Plaudits signed yet?
They've been due for ages. Are they French? Jordan Plaudit?
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Villa have played a blinder in the transfer market, and with 2+ weeks to go. I can't even remember the players we sold given how excited I am about the ones we brought in.
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Have the Plaudits signed yet?
They've been due for ages. Are they French? Jordan Plaudit?
I've managed to find one Plaudits that's for sale, although I don't think he would fit into our current set-up.
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So, do we still think those plaudits are appropriate?
Feeling all like 1986-87 again for me, sadly.
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Depends on If he's spent the last couple of weeks lining up a manager qualified and competent to take the job whilst working out what his "thanks, now go away and don't darken our door again" package should be.
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I still think that overall the summer signings are more than decent, the problem is how they are being trained and then used on match day.
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Agreed this time around i don't think it's the players it's the bloke telling them what to do.
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And this is where I have some hope for us. Some decent players there but dreadfully lead. The right appointment (cough, Lerner is making it) and we can still salvage this.
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Yep.
Look at the 86/87 squad -it's not too shabby, is it?
Manage it badly however, and it's bloody awful.
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We were all desperate for a bit of hope and optimism in the summer after Delph and Benteke left that the influx of signings - unknown and expensive added frisson to the young'n'hungry template established in 2012. With the right staff behind them they could still come good.
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I hate it when threads like this are bumped. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, particularly after a victory.
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It's a results sport, results are terrible - no plaudits from me.