Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: keving on May 24, 2014, 05:53:33 PM
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Hi all, First time poster here, or maybe second. can't remember, anyway I thought a thread about Laws of the game might be interesting. My question was asked by my 10 year old. If a game is abandonded because a team is reduced to 7 players( I think thats what happens). Will the sending offs and cautions still be counted. I said yes because they occurred when the game was played. Thoughts?
Another thing he asked was if a player is sent off he has to leave the field of play. Sometimes you see them appear at the entrance of the tunnel. How can this not be an areaa of play as you can still be sent off in the tunnel e.g. for fighting etc. I'm sure he has more to ask but that will do for now.
Thanks enjoy reading your forum
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I believe that the sending-offs and cautions would still be counted.
Second question is an interesting one.
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If the cautions etc. stood would any goals scored count?. If the game was abandonded would it be awarded to the team that didn't go down to 7 men, if it did is there a standard score given when this occurs. I seem to remember its usually scored as 3-0, but that might just be me imagining it.
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Remember the 'Battle of Bramall Lane'?
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In the case of abandoned games, cautions and sending offs stand.
Regarding the second question, there are things to be considered: if it's a grass roots match (parks etc) as a referee you have to use common sense. If as a referee you are happy that the dismissed player is going to behave himself then, quite reasonably he may be allowed to stand on the side until the game concludes. This makes sense because the dressing rooms may be located away from the pitch and may well be locked. If the referee considers the dismissed player may be disruptive he would be within his rights to ask the officials of his club to remove him.
In the event that the match takes place on a private pitch the same criteria can be applied, the only difference being that the referee may insist the player be removed from all areas. This happened to me when I gave a referee dogs abuse for incompetence resulting in the injury of two players. I was acting as "sponge man" on the day. I got fined £30 and banned for a month. I should have known better. I'm not proud.
As you progress higher up the pyramid criteria changes and dismissed players may have to retreat to a position in the stand. The rules of the competition the match is being played under will always dictate.
Things have changed since my day but, I hope what I have said makes sense and helps.
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If the cautions etc. stood would any goals scored count?. If the game was abandonded would it be awarded to the team that didn't go down to 7 men, if it did is there a standard score given when this occurs. I seem to remember its usually scored as 3-0, but that might just be me imagining it.
When it happened before.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Bramall_Lane
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Refreshing thread. Reminds me of the old 'you're the ref' cartoons.
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Another one. I was watching a program with Collina(Italian Ref), he was talking about the official behind the goal and used Kieron Gibbs sending off as an example. He said if the 5th official was behind the goal line as they are in europa competition, He would have spotted the handball, who did it and that the ball was going wide so Gibbs should only have had a yellow card. I thought it was the intent to prevent a goal scoring chance was the reason to be sent off, Gibbs obviously thought the ball was going in or he wouldn't have handballed it. So what Collini was basically saying was he tried to prevent a goal illegally but because it was actually going wide it was only a yellow card, I think that's nonsense, what do you think ?
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Thanks Dave, Do the goals still count on individual scoring recrds or are they wiped out?
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Goals don't stand either. Regarding the Colina thing, I personally think he's talking rubbish but, it can be argued that he's trying, as most referee's will do, to try and keep as many players on the pitch as is possible. The thing is Kevking, as with all contentious refereeing decisions, they are debated on here to death. The problem being IMO the laws of Association Football are so wide open to interpretation that, it's no wonder there are so many disputed calls. You see it nearly every week at all levels of football; the same kind of infringement happening and referees up and down the country giving different decisions. It's no wonder sometimes that followers of football continually claim that there's no consistency with referees. I personally think given what they have to gon on, there's no such thing. The best any referee can do is to be consistent with himself, ie if he gives a free kick for a player putting his hand in front of his face for "protection" during one match at the start of a season then, he continues to give that same free kick every time it happens.
Remember the matchboxes years ago that had these little motto's written on the back? I remember reading one once that said, "football is a game played by twenty-two players and 30,000 referees". Hope this gives you a better understanding as to why the majority of the football populous hates us.
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I dont hate refs I think they usually do a good job. I've lost count of the times I thought refs had got it wrong then watched it again and they have been right. I ask these questions because my son at 10 takes every thing literally and when i say something and the ref says or does something else he gets confused. He's only just got into football so I'm trying to encourage him as much as I can.
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I have a question. If a team in a cup match get a player sent off and they go to penalties what happens on the 11th round of penalties? Do the team with 10 men have 'no shot'? Or do they start using players from the beginning again? If the latter they get an advantage that the 11 man team have to use their worst penalty taker, and the 10 man team, presumably their best.
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I have a question. If a team in a cup match get a player sent off and they go to penalties what happens on the 11th round of penalties? Do the team with 10 men have 'no shot'? Or do they start using players from the beginning again? If the latter they get an advantage that the 11 man team have to use their worst penalty taker, and the 10 man team, presumably their best.
Doesn't the second team nominate a player not to take a pen?
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Yes
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Dont know about the laws of the game but i now have a certain amount of sympathy for Jose Mourinho`s complaints over his sending off at Villa Park after watching Diego Simieone`s antics in last nights Champions Leage Final, how did he not get sent off for that??. My opinion is probably coloured somewhat by my deep-rooted pathalogical hatred of any Argentinian called Diego, but even so, there is a massive inconsistency there.
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I thought he had been sent to the stands but with all the mayhem and the match ending virtually straight away, he never got there.
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I have a question. If a team in a cup match get a player sent off and they go to penalties what happens on the 11th round of penalties? Do the team with 10 men have 'no shot'? Or do they start using players from the beginning again? If the latter they get an advantage that the 11 man team have to use their worst penalty taker, and the 10 man team, presumably their best.
Doesn't the second team nominate a player not to take a pen?
When one team has finished the penalties, they have to restart using the same order.
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Why do Refs use the unfair advantage when adjudicating Hand Ball decisions as opposed to using the Laws of the game that quite clearly state that hand ball has to be deliberate?
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I don't have an up-to-date copy of the official referee's chart on the laws of the game, and haven't had for many years now but it used to be full of "in the opinion of the referee". And therein lies your answer.
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I've been playing football with my son again and more questions came up. If you take a throw in and it goes in the goal, how do you restart the game. Originally I said it was a foul throw so the opposition would get the throw, but I think thats wrong. I now think if the throw was legal then you would restart with either a goalkick or a corner. Thoughts?
If you were playing and still had subs and goalkeeper available could you swap one of your outfield players for your goalkeeper and keeper move as an out field player and not use someone off the bench. If you can would it count as one of your substitutions
In answer to previous post Simeone was sent off
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Goal-kick to the first one.
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Yes. It would not be classed as a substitution as no-one has been replaced.
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http://areferee.com/soccer.php
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I've been playing football with my son again and more questions came up. If you take a throw in and it goes in the goal, how do you restart the game. Originally I said it was a foul throw so the opposition would get the throw, but I think thats wrong. I now think if the throw was legal then you would restart with either a goalkick or a corner. Thoughts?
Peter Enkleman may know the answer ;D
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...but David Elleray certainly wouldn't!!!
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I don't have an up-to-date copy of the official referee's chart on the laws of the game, and haven't had for many years now but it used to be full of "in the opinion of the referee". And therein lies your answer.
dave it hasnt been called the chart for many years ;-)
You have answered the questions pretty much spot on dave, im having trouble keeping up with all the questions tbh.
Regarding the question on the abandoned game , the result would be determined by the league/competion rules.
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I've been playing football with my son again and more questions came up. If you take a throw in and it goes in the goal, how do you restart the game. Originally I said it was a foul throw so the opposition would get the throw, but I think thats wrong. I now think if the throw was legal then you would restart with either a goalkick or a corner. Thoughts?
That should have been a corner, but in defense of the ref, he probably gave his decision based on enklemans reaction, giving the impression he had touched the ball
Peter Enkleman may know the answer ;D
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I've been playing football with my son again and more questions came up. If you take a throw in and it goes in the goal, how do you restart the game. Originally I said it was a foul throw so the opposition would get the throw, but I think thats wrong. I now think if the throw was legal then you would restart with either a goalkick or a corner. Thoughts?
If you were playing and still had subs and goalkeeper available could you swap one of your outfield players for your goalkeeper and keeper move as an out field player and not use someone off the bench. If you can would it count as one of your substitutions
In answer to previous post Simeone was sent off
As long as the ref is asked first its fine.
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Why do Refs use the unfair advantage when adjudicating Hand Ball decisions as opposed to using the Laws of the game that quite clearly state that hand ball has to be deliberate?
Its all down to 'opinion'.if a players hands/arms are outstretched and the ball hits them then the advice is handball as they are making themselves bigger and trying to prevent the cross...
To try and simplify, a ref sees an incident and has one view, he/she then makes a judgement call based on what they see, and then they apply law depending on their decision.
When i teach on a basic refs course, we always have a quick test before to see how much people know, it wont surprise you to know that nearly all dont know as much as they thought, it opens their eyes.
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http://areferee.com/soccer.php
just realized that I know nothing about refereeing, I will never criticize a nother referee again.
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I have been playing football with my son again and he's asked more questions.
Can a player of the same team foul another of the same team.
I said yes (Hales and Flanagan)
How does the restart occur.
I said free kick to the opposition, from where the incedent happened.
comments welcome.
I may have to stop playing football with him if he keeps this up.
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Correct, I think. Remember the Newcastle incident when Barry intervened?
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Correct, I think. Remember the Newcastle incident when Barry intervened?
Yes. Those two fuckwits were in the process of knocking some sense into each other and GB stepped in to separate them.
He said something in the way of "Yes, I stepped in. Nobody wants to see that". I thought he could not be more wrong, and plenty of people would pay good money to see Racist Rat Boy and the other dipshit kick the crap out of each other.