Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: danlanza on April 11, 2013, 05:40:46 PM
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Have not seen it posted so far, if so please delete this thread.
I have posted it on Heroes discussion because it affects us.
So, from next season, the Charity Shield being the first game, Goal line Technology will be with us in the Premiership.
Supplied by Hawkeye it will be at all Premiership grounds for the start of next season.
Me, i think it is a fantastic step forward for our game. What do the rest of you think HnV ?
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
I just hope we're not the 1st team to be caught out by it.
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
I just hope we're not the 1st team to be caught out by it.
Hey! A comment as to the likelihood that we'll still be in the Premier League next season!
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It won't make any difference to the players and managers who will still cry like babies when decisions go against them and say fuck all when it goes in their favour.
I look forward to the first time the accuracy of the technology is called into question......
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
I just hope we're not the 1st team to be caught out by it.
Strange choice of words. It's not a question of getting caught out, it's a question of getting decisions right.
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Great. Now it's just hoverboards and robots with hearts that need to be invented by 2020 for it to have been worthwhile to carry on living for.
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There are two systems going, this Hawkeye one, which we've plumped for, and a German one which I believe is being used in the confederations cup. I've absolutely no idea as to the difference between the two.
If all it does is objectively determine whether the ball has crossed the line, then fair enough. Seems like a bit of a waste of money for something that'll hardly ever get used (seriously, when would've been the last time it wouldn't have just been gathering dust at VP?), but it's not doing any harm.
However, if it's effectively a television replay relayed to the fourth official to call, thereby visible to whoever sticks his head into the dugout, then it gets a thumbs down from me.
He blocked the keeper.
He used his arm.
That was a push.
He's offside.
Pointy end of a pretty big wedge if it is.
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Video on how it's going to work for those who haven't seen it. Not sure why there's 80's porn music on in the background.
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Video on how it's going to work for those who haven't seen it. Not sure why there's 80's porn music on in the background.
And that is why we need it. To much money in football not to have it.
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Presumably the clubs relegated next season to the championship won't then be using it in their next season as they'd have some sort of advantage?
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Thanks for the video, Chipsticks. Can't argue with that, really. Anybody got any idea what the other system involves?
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This is the one to be used at this year's Confederations Cup
The GoalControl-4D system works with 14 high-speed cameras (7 per goal) around the pitch at the stadium roof/catwalk. The cameras are connected to a powerful image processing computer system which tracks the movement of all objects on the pitch and filters out the players, referees and all disturbing objects. The remaining object is the ball and the system knows its three dimensional x-, y- and z-position with a precision of a few millimeters in the coordinate system of the pitch. When the ball passes the goal line, the system sends a vibration- and optical signal to the officals´watches. Of course, all camera images of such goal event, and also of all near-goal events, are stored and can be replayed anytime.
The bit in bold worries me a bit.
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This is the one to be used at this year's Confederations Cup
The GoalControl-4D system works with 14 high-speed cameras (7 per goal) around the pitch at the stadium roof/catwalk. The cameras are connected to a powerful image processing computer system which tracks the movement of all objects on the pitch and filters out the players, referees and all disturbing objects. The remaining object is the ball and the system knows its three dimensional x-, y- and z-position with a precision of a few millimeters in the coordinate system of the pitch. When the ball passes the goal line, the system sends a vibration- and optical signal to the officals´watches. Of course, all camera images of such goal event, and also of all near-goal events, are stored and can be replayed anytime.
The bit in bold worries me a bit.
Why does that worry you?
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While we are waiting for the judges decision will they play some sort of dramatic music while we wait the decision?
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
This technology is no stop in play or look at replays. It's in or out and if in the ref gets a signal and a goal will be awarded.
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
This technology is no stop in play or look at replays. It's in or out and if in the ref gets a signal and a goal will be awarded.
Something FIFA did right. They set a maximum time limit for the signal to get to the ref. Hawkeye and the German system alert the ref in less than a second.
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Thank god there are no premier league teams down this end of the country as this would be the local version of Hawkeye!!!
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTQVB-HJzC-lXKDU4jb6t0OtiCk1Ub1JlAy_NbsPYxU4NHJ31Yu)
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This is the one to be used at this year's Confederations Cup
The GoalControl-4D system works with 14 high-speed cameras (7 per goal) around the pitch at the stadium roof/catwalk. The cameras are connected to a powerful image processing computer system which tracks the movement of all objects on the pitch and filters out the players, referees and all disturbing objects. The remaining object is the ball and the system knows its three dimensional x-, y- and z-position with a precision of a few millimeters in the coordinate system of the pitch. When the ball passes the goal line, the system sends a vibration- and optical signal to the officals´watches. Of course, all camera images of such goal event, and also of all near-goal events, are stored and can be replayed anytime.
The bit in bold worries me a bit.
Why does that worry you?
As I posted earlier, if it remains as purely an objective view of over the line or not, then fine. It'd be difficult to make an argument against. Frees linesmen up from focusing on that in a crowded goalmouth, if nothing else.
But were the pictures to be available real-time pitchside, I venture that it wouldn't be too long before we start hearing post-match interviews saying "we've got the technology in place, so we should use it" about every single debatable decision and non-decision in and around the box.
My earlier 'wedge' metaphor was probably not the best. 'Slippery slope' might be better.
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This is the one to be used at this year's Confederations Cup
The GoalControl-4D system works with 14 high-speed cameras (7 per goal) around the pitch at the stadium roof/catwalk. The cameras are connected to a powerful image processing computer system which tracks the movement of all objects on the pitch and filters out the players, referees and all disturbing objects. The remaining object is the ball and the system knows its three dimensional x-, y- and z-position with a precision of a few millimeters in the coordinate system of the pitch. When the ball passes the goal line, the system sends a vibration- and optical signal to the officals´watches. Of course, all camera images of such goal event, and also of all near-goal events, are stored and can be replayed anytime.
The bit in bold worries me a bit.
Why does that worry you?
As I posted earlier, if it remains as purely an objective view of over the line or not, then fine. It'd be difficult to make an argument against. Frees linesmen up from focusing on that in a crowded goalmouth, if nothing else.
But were the pictures to be available real-time pitchside, I venture that it wouldn't be too long before we start hearing post-match interviews saying "we've got the technology in place, so we should use it" about every single debatable decision and non-decision in and around the box.
My earlier 'wedge' metaphor was probably not the best. 'Slippery slope' might be better.
I think that's quite a good point actually, the idea of every single big tackle or possible dive halting play and requiring video consultation would be a piss take.
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
This technology is no stop in play or look at replays. It's in or out and if in the ref gets a signal and a goal will be awarded.
That was my point and that's why I am in favour of it.
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As much as I am against having any kind of TV replays, I do think this is necessary.
This technology is no stop in play or look at replays. It's in or out and if in the ref gets a signal and a goal will be awarded.
I hope it's a suitably high voltage signal. If Lowton's goal last week lacked anything it was the sight of the ref jumping six feet in the air and then collapsing in a smouldering heap.
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Leave that to Dowd this Saturday !
I am sure he will when we score 3 and he has no reason to card us to death.
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Well that didn't take long, did it?!!! Just heard Wenger, he wants it used for offsides. Slippery slope, WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
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As long as Arsenal are never given offside !
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Presumably the clubs relegated next season to the championship won't then be using it in their next season as they'd have some sort of advantage?
The Football League haven't adopted it so the relegated clubs won't need to both installing it.
But why would it give them an advantage anyway? All the system seeks to do is make goalline decisions more accurate. There's no inherent advantage in that for any team.
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Well that didn't take long, did it?!!! Just heard Wenger, he wants it used for offsides. Slippery slope, WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
But he never saw it did he?
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I think it should be used in major tournament ie Champ League, World Cup, (Final of Cup final), and European Champions, plus top league like Premier League, La Liga, Serie A, Bungeliga, so if the stadium have it should be used, but we shouldn't expect the like of Walsall, Coventry, and Small Heath to have it as they are not in top division. I think there should be a red flag challenge for Manager to use but only limited to 2 each half, so if they got both wrong in first half, they lose a challenge in 2nd half.
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Thanks for the video, Chipsticks. Can't argue with that, really. Anybody got any idea what the other system involves?
Yes its German and its been designed to conclusively prove Geoff Hursts volley was not over the line.....but it was!!!!
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Thanks for the video, Chipsticks. Can't argue with that, really. Anybody got any idea what the other system involves?
Yes its German and its been designed to conclusively prove Geoff Hursts volley was not over the line.....but it was!!!!
Very good, Ron.
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Presumably the clubs relegated next season to the championship won't then be using it in their next season as they'd have some sort of advantage?
The Football League haven't adopted it so the relegated clubs won't need to both installing it.
But why would it give them an advantage anyway? All the system seeks to do is make goalline decisions more accurate. There's no inherent advantage in that for any team.
Sorry, didn't word it properly. I was referring to the teams that have had it installed and are then relegated. As you say the Football League haven't adopted it, so in these cases it will have been installed, used for a season or two, then will be unused. Unless they're promoted of course.
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I assume that Hawk-Eye will retain ownership of all the kit, so it'll just get moved to the new grounds
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I assume that Hawk-Eye will retain ownership of all the kit, so it'll just get moved to the new grounds
I very much doubt it.
The Premier League requires all clubs to install it. Why would Hawkeye rent it to them? They'll make more money selling it to them. Then when new clubs get promoted they can sell it to them too.
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I'm not so sure. There's 7 clubs ever-present since inception, man city aren't going anywhere soon, fulham could be described as well-established, and newcastle should soon get their house in order, so that's 10. Added to which is the forthcoming increased revenue which, in all regrettable likelihood, will see the same small number of clubs yoyoing, so surely 20 rental and service agreements in perpetuity would generate more income?
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I'm not so sure. There's 7 clubs ever-present since inception, man city aren't going anywhere soon, fulham could be described as well-established, and newcastle should soon get their house in order, so that's 10. Added to which is the forthcoming increased revenue which, in all regrettable likelihood, will see the same small number of clubs yoyoing, so surely 20 rental and service agreements in perpetuity would generate more income?
That's my take on it. Expensive to install, if you get relegated expensive to uninstall. Rental will probably be the way they do it.
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I'm not so sure. There's 7 clubs ever-present since inception, man city aren't going anywhere soon, fulham could be described as well-established, and newcastle should soon get their house in order, so that's 10. Added to which is the forthcoming increased revenue which, in all regrettable likelihood, will see the same small number of clubs yoyoing, so surely 20 rental and service agreements in perpetuity would generate more income?
That's my take on it. Expensive to install, if you get relegated expensive to uninstall. Rental will probably be the way they do it.
The expense of the installation and uninstallation is even more likely to see clubs buy rather than rent.
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Better financially for Hawkeye to rent, surely ?
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That hawkes bloke hes gonna be pretty rich . Good on him.
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43 years too late.
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About bloody time. Cricket is a much better and fairer sport because of technology.
Ive never understood the argument if Sunday league teams wont have the technology then why should premier league teams.
Looking forward to snicko coming in to determine corners / goalkicks, and hotspot to establish the size of Barrys ass.
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Ive never understood the argument if Sunday league teams wont have the technology then why should premier league teams.
Me neither.
The vast majority of Sunday league games I was involved in over the years didn't have linesmen either so the absence of goalline technology wasn't really going to make things any worse!
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About bloody time. Cricket is a much better and fairer sport because of technology.
Ive never understood the argument if Sunday league teams wont have the technology then why should premier league teams.
Had this argument with someone yesterday, he was insisting that football should be the same at all levels and it's the best sport in the World because it is the same for Premier League and Sunday League players.
I pointed out that generally in Sunday League you get much worse referees and it's often the substitutes running the line, so it's nowhere near the same as Premier League.
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About bloody time. Cricket is a much better and fairer sport because of technology.
Ive never understood the argument if Sunday league teams wont have the technology then why should premier league teams.
Had this argument with someone yesterday, he was insisting that football should be the same at all levels and it's the best sport in the World because it is the same for Premier League and Sunday League players.
I pointed out that generally in Sunday League you get much worse referees and it's often the substitutes running the line, so it's nowhere near the same as Premier League.
If the top end of the game could never introduce anything that wasn't immediately introduced at all levels, we would probably still be playing with posts with a rope tied across and no nets.