Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: The Laughing Policeman on February 10, 2013, 12:16:32 PM
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Dear Mr. Lerner,
Today my football club are playing West Ham at home and I wont be going to the game simply because I feel that I as a fan and supporter not valued by the club anymore.
I was taken to Villa Park as a nine year old in 1955 and was smitten. Since that day I have experienced all the highs and lows that go with supporting a football club but I've never before had this feeling that I just can't be bothered to travel the four miles to Villa Park from my home.
Even when the wheels well and truly came off in the late sixties early seventies I still went to every home game and for three years never missed a game home or away. Maybe it was youthful enthusiasm that kept me going through those dark days, but I believe it was because the club had a plan and it was communicated to us the fans so that we knew where we were heading.
Today in the age of instant communication we don't know what your vision for the club is or where you are trying to take us. A rudderless ship is exactly what The Villa looks like at the moment.
Some of the things being done off the pitch are excellent, but you can't parade through the city to a civic reception waving carbon certificates.
I'm sorry Mr. Lerner but I still don't think that you really understand the depth of feeling that football fans have for their clubs. You have never had to go to work in a factory or office on Monday morning after a bad defeat at the weekend and have a lot of your work colleagues really take the piss. It really does hurt deep down in a way that I can't explain.
When you took over the club you said that you were the custodian of our great club and you laid out a plan that we all bought into, we now know that the plan was flawed for certain reasons but we haven't been told what the revised plan is. We just seem to be drifting on a downward spiral with no effort being made from on high to put a stop to it, it really does look to us as if the club is resigned to relegation.
During the January transfer window Paul Lambert said he was looking to bring in a decent central defensive midfielder and a couple of defenders. What happened?
We're not asking you to spend your entire fortune on overpriced, overpaid players (we know that doesn't work) all we ask is that we have players good enough to give a good account of themselves and not have us scrabbling around at the bottom of the league. A few years of mid table obscurity is preferable to what we are going through at the present.
We know that you are a very private person and you aren't keen on being in the limelight and I don't think any Villa fan is asking that you make pronouncements after every game or even to attend every game (although that would be nice) but please, please come out at this very important time in the clubs history and tell us what your plans are for our club, all we have at the moment is rumour and supposition and it isn't very good for the morale of the fans turning up in cold wet weather not knowing what is going on and this makes for a not very good atmosphere at matches which must transmit it's self on to the pitch and affect the players.
If you really do have the best interests of our club at heart then come on and tell us where you want to take us.
Yours sincerely,
Kevin Dean. VTID.
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Good read that Kevin.
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Yours sincerely Kevin Dean + Richard Moore + every other Villa fan + every Cleveland Browns fan
Sadly some of what you say is as much a reflection of modern day football as much as it is about the Villa
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Well you've certinlay chosen the right game not to come and give the lads your support.
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Sad thing is there are many more who feel like this .... including me although I am 12 months ahead of you in my relationship break down with the Villa.
I didnt renew, thought I would go through cold turkey each and every game, shall I sharnt I well I can honestly say I havent felt like that at all...the missus said last night "will you be getting a season ticket next year" and without hessitation I responded no chance.
To say I dont care about the villa anymore wouldnt be true...I just dont care in the same way as I used to
I care that my club is disintegrating before my eyes and there is nothing we as fans can do to halt its decline ...I care about the name, the heritage and history...I dont care about the obscene money in the game, the shit attitude of players and the general arrogance of football.
Whilst the best get better and better there is no doubt Messi Ronaldo ect .... there are also too many poor players and managers making a ludicrous living at our expense.
Football is about to eat itself ...Im out !
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Good letter. Sums my thoughts up exactly
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lose today and knock another 3/4000 off the home crowds in the remaining season.
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Well you've certinlay chosen the right game not to come and give the lads your support.
I've not turned up today, I've just had enough of being desperately disappointed. Last year against Bolton when the team needed me. Even including Bradford that was my worst experience as a fan
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Well I,m sorry you all feel like that , and I posted in the pre match thread that I was grumpy and irritable and I wasn't looking forward to it , but when Clattenburg blew that whistle ? still the best feeling in this world lads and the players Need your support, **ck Lern.er ! Keep the faith !
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Can't disagree with someone's opinion, action or decision not to attend a match. It is choice. There is little to disagree with. We went today with heavy hearts.
All I will say Kevin is that the people who run football clubs have never given a damn about us fans. The players can't stand us, they think we are mad idiots who make unreasonable demands on them. I have very low expectations these days and took immense pleasure in today's win as we have seen so few in the last three seasons.
Hope you will find the motivation to attend VP again afte rputting in all those years. We make football what it is.
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Absolutely agree with everything there Kevin, I'm sure there are may more of us who feel this way.
I've seen the Villa from the lows of being knocked out of the FA Cup First Round to Southend, to the highs of Rotterdam, I've always loved and always will love the Villa, but after 25 years as a season ticket holder this season I didn't renew and I didn't attend today with a heavy heart.
I just feel like my Villa has somehow gone.
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I felt like i was visiting a sick relative in hospital today doing it out of duty, thinking its peeing down its on TV ok I am a season ticket holder and still felt a bit empty when I left the ground.
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30,000 today. Looks like a few are feeling the same way.
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Joined this forum today and reading this disappoints me
You sign VTID,but wont travel the 4m to a game when the team needs you the most
Aston Villa will be around long after the likes of Lerner and chunts like Faulkner are gone
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
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Uh-oh, fans in inverted commas, AND the F word in the same post.
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
And another thing, you're still banned, kryten.
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On further reflection I find it dissappointing that so many of my fellow fans seem ready to turn their backs on the club.Yes Lerner is making a right balls of it a-la Cleveland Browns but from what I saw today the players are fighting and maybe if we filled Villa Park and made it as intimidating as possible we would have better home form and wouldn't have to listen to the away fans singing that our ground is too big for us. The fans there today got behind the team ( far better than the West Ham fans did )Maybe the fans who are not turning up are the first to moan when a pass goes astray or boo the team ( I always find that embarrassing ) Now is the time to get your selves down there and give the team all the support you can, Post mortems on the season should wait till the end , and if we do find ourselves in the Championship I will still be there .
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I don't get these 'open letter' type posts. So you've had enough, great, don't go to the game then, but spare us the bleeding heart hyperbole eh?
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I don't get these 'open letter' type posts. So you've had enough, great, don't go to the game then, but spare us the bleeding heart hyperbole eh?
What's the point so these forums if you can't vent your spleen now and again?
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I don't get these 'open letter' type posts. So you've had enough, great, don't go to the game then, but spare us the bleeding heart hyperbole eh?
Nor me. I don't feel the need to start a thread because i'm going or not.
Personally I had a great time today. Saw some mates, stood all game, sang, saw the Villa win, got drenched and froze (especially waiting for buses back) and wouldn't swap it for the world.
VTID for a reason.
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Surely people can post what ever is on their mind regarding AVFC, otherwise why have a forum?
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Surely people can post what ever is on their mind regarding AVFC, otherwise why have a forum?
They can, and those that disagree can also comment, otherwise as you say, why have a forum?
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I don't get these 'open letter' type posts. So you've had enough, great, don't go to the game then, but spare us the bleeding heart hyperbole eh?
What's the point so these forums if you can't vent your spleen now and again?
Oh I'm all for spleen venting, I do a lot of it, but it's the whole "Look how angry I am, I've created a whole new thread where I've written a pointless diatribe that will never be read by anyone of any importance, but hopefully a few interweb people will tell me how good it was so I can feel dead good" thing that I just don't get.
Hey ho, each to their own, carry on if it floats yer boat.
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
And another thing, you're still banned, kryten.
I'm probably being thick, what's the Middlesex reference about?
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
And another thing, you're still banned, kryten.
I'm probably being thick, what's the Middlesex reference about?
Wembley.
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
And another thing, you're still banned, kryten.
I'm probably being thick, what's the Middlesex reference about?
If we had got to Wembley I suppose
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
And another thing, you're still banned, kryten.
I'm probably being thick, what's the Middlesex reference about?
Wembley.
That's what I thought, but we're out of both cups. So a rubbish point badly made.
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I think he meant: had we been appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans"
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
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Tingle moment.
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Surely people can post what ever is on their mind regarding AVFC, otherwise why have a forum?
They can, and those that disagree can also comment, otherwise as you say, why have a forum?
But it doesnt seem to be his sentiment that you object to but the fact that he's posted it at all, perhaps I've misinterpreted the last few posts.
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I said I don't get why folks feel the need to make these posts. I never said they aren't allowed to. As I said in my post, I don't feel the urge to start a thread when i'm going or not going, or when i'm happy or fucked off with the Villa/Mod£rn football etc.
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
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Tingle moment.
The very essence of what it's all about. Magic.
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Exactly, Des. Though I often forget.
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i say stay away you negative twonk and stay in harborne. VTID. what does that mean?, villa till i get old and fed up going because we are a bit shit so i will profess my total love for the club and slag someone off?
you arent needed pal in the battle we have on at the moment!
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Fair enough PWS.
With regards to the original post, I would only ever stop going due to ill health or financial restrictions.
Aston Villa has been the only constant in my life, and as previously mentioned no feeling comes close to that when N'Zog scored today.
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Today was only the third league win i've seen at VP since Nov 5th 2011 (I missed Reading, one of the few I have missed). And the feeling when I realised that freekick had gone in made it all worthwhile. As did that Weimann goal vs Fulham make the previous few months. Pretty much nothing else comes close to those moments.
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Fair enough PWS.
With regards to the original post, I would only ever stop going due to ill health or financial restrictions.
Aston Villa has been the only constant in my life, and as previously mentioned no feeling comes close to that when N'Zog scored today.
I'm the same. Even when we're shit I love the Villa and going to VP. Health and money meant I missed a few before Xmas and I hated it. Once I knew I wasn't going to pop my clogs soon and scraped some money together first thing I did was buy a half ST.
And sad/crazy as it sounds whenever I look at the attendance for a game I was at I know that forever I am part of Villa's history. Just as my dad was, and his dad and his dad.
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
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superb stuff, thanks for posting
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
YouTube Video Here As Above
The finest view in the house. Nice post. Thanks.
I don't get all this open letter malarky either - but I suppose the fans forums are a place to vent - so it I can't condemn the chap. We've had some awful results but in patches we've still played more football than we ever did under McRubbish.
Saw a series of posts in another place where they were organising a Lerner/Lambert Out protest if we lost. Weird feeling that must be - all that effort painting up signs only to see your team win and feeling even angrier about it.
Villa while I live.
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I wonder how many hundreds of hours of wasted camera phone footage there's been from our free-kicks and corners over the last few years.
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My OP isn't intended as a 'ooh look at me' post. I've given a few home games a miss this season not through lack of interest or because I think the team is crap, far from it, I actually believe that there's a good team in the making there and my friends have started rolling their eyes every time I say 'we wont get relegated' no matter how bad results have been.
My frustration comes from the club appearing to lurch from crisis to crisis on the player and management side of the club and no one on the board seems willing to come out and tell us what is being done to change things.
It's all very well having a very well run commercial and community base and it's something to be proud of that we have such well run organisations off the field but with out communicating to us what the boards vision for the club on the playing side of things is it feels as if part of the whole is missing.
I mentioned in the letter that we the fans only seem to hear rumours and supposition about what is happening at the club, witness the ITK's that pop up occasionally to tell us we're on the verge of being taken over by gentlemen from the middle east or that Randy is looking to bring in outside investors. Yes we all take what they say with a massive pinch of salt, but it would be good if Randy came out and told us that he's going nowhere and what his plans are to take the club forward.
That's all I ask, as I said in my OP if he came out and said for the next few years we're going to hover about in mid table obscurity and then we go again (to coin a phrase) it would be enough, but to be told absolutely nothing isn't good enough.
If things at the club are really as bad as some say (I don't believe that they are) then please tell us, that way we'd know what to expect.
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
is there any possible situation that you would actually praise the club ?
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(http://th06.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2011/031/2/9/bazinga_by_trickd123-d38ivc8.jpg)
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
Thats uncalled for saunders and totally wrong.
The point chris made puts everything into perspective.
I have disagreed with chris on many issues especially mr o neill but i have always respected his opinion, and am delighted to see him getting back to some semblance of normality.
Chris takes a more laid back relaxed attitude rather than some of us who tend to wear our heart on a sleeve and maybe overreact to certain things, but he is a fair man .
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
Yes, the fact they keep selling you tickets for starters. ;¬)
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This is why we go even when we're shit. Very little can match the feeling when this happens.
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superb stuff, thanks for posting
I'm sure that's the back of my head in the hat...
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I still love the club like a like a hurt lost and blinded fool.
Oh no, I've said too much
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No, you haven't said enough
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No, you haven't said enough
<Starts doing manic arm flailing dance>
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
is there any possible situation that you would actually praise the club ?
Yes, when there's something to praise.
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After facing the prospect of having the choice of whether or not to go taken away from me, this sort of argument does strike me as a touch precious.
Is there any possible situation that you would actually criticise the club though?
is there any possible situation that you would actually praise the club ?
Yes, when there's something to praise.
You can't find anything?
Haters want to hate!
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
What was the reason you used the word "sic" again the other day?
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
You seem to have a strange fascination with late-fifties Spurs.
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
You seem to have a strange fascination with late-fifties Spurs.
It is just a coincidence.
Villa's divergent fortunes with Arsenal is a far better story, I think.
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
You seem to have a strange fascination with late-fifties Spurs.
It is just a coincidence.
Villa's divergent fortunes with Arsenal is a far better story, I think.
Unless this yarn contains floodlights and is entirely written in classical latin then I do not want to hear it.
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The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
The annoying and hypocritical things about the opening letter is, should we be appearing in Middlesex in a couple of weeks time, you'd be first in line for a ticket along with 15,000 other fickle arsed "fans".
I dont know Kevin personally although i've probably spoke to him in the White Horse in Harborne which is full of good regulars and well kept ale. However, I know from his posts on here that he has is a diehard Villa fan whos been going down before I was born. The current plight of our club would test any supporter so please don't call him fickle because he is not!
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
Maybe having a Chairman who has lost interest not even being in the same country when our games kick off. Or even the fact that players now get paid more in a month than the annaul salary of the Prime Minister!
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
Maybe having a Chairman who has lost interest not even being in the same country when our games kick off. Or even the fact that players now get paid more in a month than the annaul salary of the Prime Minister!
The bond we have is with the club, not the players, management, chairmen or owners.
It is a bond for life.
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So the laughing policemen isn't laughing any more.
The strange thing is that in 1955 Villa sold their best player in Danny Blanchflower and missed relegation by a squeak in 1956.
You got over that, so why is it so difficult now?
Maybe having a Chairman who has lost interest not even being in the same country when our games kick off. Or even the fact that players now get paid more in a month than the annaul salary of the Prime Minister!
I am not sure an appeal to his sentiment or a plea for some rousing words about his vision for the club is going to get a response from Lerner.
You might feel better if you resort to personal abuse which at least gets it off your chest.
I remember a particular low point back in March 1986 when Villa were beaten 0-3 by Blues, a mate of mine walking out, and pausing at the directors box, gave Ellis a damned good tongue-lashing.
It never made any difference but he told me he sure felt better.
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There are a raft of clichés about the varying thickness of things or the general quality of the road that the club is on, that are all applicable here.
It is emotional torture at times, especially these last three years, but even in the gloom there are the sparks of joy that a cracking away win here and a last minute goal there give you, with the long term goal that eventually it will get better.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things? will we just end up in the same position year after year, which will eventually lead to Relegation? Or will this season be a massive wake-up call to PF and RL. I thought last season may be that wake-up call. Evidently not.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things? will we just end up in the same position year after year, which will eventually lead to Relegation? Or will this season be a massive wake-up call to PF and RL. I thought last season may be that wake-up call. Evidently not.
Given the youth in the side, the theory is they will get better as they get older and develop into a good side. It'll still need reinforcements, but that's what the longterm plan seems to be.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things? will we just end up in the same position year after year, which will eventually lead to Relegation? Or will this season be a massive wake-up call to PF and RL. I thought last season may be that wake-up call. Evidently not.
It gave them notice that the oil tanker that is the Good Ship Aston Villa needs to turn around. Unfortunately Oil Tankers have quite a slow turning circle.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things? will we just end up in the same position year after year, which will eventually lead to Relegation? Or will this season be a massive wake-up call to PF and RL. I thought last season may be that wake-up call. Evidently not.
It gave them notice that the oil tanker that is the Good Ship Aston Villa needs to turn around. Unfortunately Oil Tankers have quite a slow turning circle.
As does Richard Dunne.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things? will we just end up in the same position year after year, which will eventually lead to Relegation? Or will this season be a massive wake-up call to PF and RL. I thought last season may be that wake-up call. Evidently not.
You hear many people say they have fallen out if love with football due to how expensive it is or ridiculous players wages/behaviour. I was quite pleased that Villa set out to halt paying very average players astronomical amounts but when you really think about it, if any team refuses to pay the going rates for premiership players then ultimately they won't be in the premiership. Teams like Albion have got by but could well find it catches up with them too. So to be brutally honest, if we stay up and repeat the level of investment next year then it will surely be the same sort of year.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things?
Optimism, it's a great thing to have as a football fan.
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There are a raft of clichés about the varying thickness of things or the general quality of the road that the club is on, that are all applicable here.
It is emotional torture at times, especially these last three years, but even in the gloom there are the sparks of joy that a cracking away win here and a last minute goal there give you, with the long term goal that eventually it will get better.
Bang on there. When the second goal went in against West Ham, it was like winning the league for me. We can't all win. We have to take our turn in history. I have no problem with what TLP has written. He has been there for years and we all get despondent at times. However, when the next game comes along, it will all start again.
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I don't know about anyone else, but my bond with he club gets stronger when we're on our arse.
And god help anyone who wants to take a pop at us.
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I don't know about anyone else, but my bond with he club gets stronger when we're on our arse.
And god help anyone who wants to take a pop at us.
Absolutely
I will moan about them on here all day long but woe betide anyone from outside having a go at my club.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things?
Optimism, it's a great thing to have as a football fan.
Spot on.
There may be a bit more cash to spend in the summer, and I actually think Lambert's plan will start come together....if we stay up.
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What makes anyone think that staying up next season will lead to better things?
Optimism, it's a great thing to have as a football fan.
Spot on.
There may be a bit more cash to spend in the summer, and I actually think Lambert's plan will start come together....if we stay up.
But can he communicate it with his mumblings?
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But can he communicate it with his mumblings?
I think there's a lot of Villa fans that need to see an Otologist if they really can't hear, or understand, what Lambert says.
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I would prefer trauma counselling
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To be fair Lerner backed PL in the summer to the tune of £25M. Was that money well spent, Benteke aside?
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To be fair Lerner backed PL in the summer to the tune of £25M. Was that money well spent, Benteke aside?
Lerner has let us down. End of story.
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To be fair Lerner backed PL in the summer to the tune of £25M. Was that money well spent, Benteke aside?
It is arguable that with Lambert already in possession of a prolific striker, he should have spent that money on other areas of the team - midfield and defence maybe.
He might have decided to have fewer but better quality players too.
The fact that Benteke has been so good has distracted from the fact that there might have been better alternatives for the team.
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But can he communicate it with his mumblings?
I think there's a lot of Villa fans that need to see an Otologist if they really can't hear, or understand, what Lambert says.
Or just go to Google Translate and select Mumbling Incoherent Nonsense ---> English.
Mnnooidfbfbff = We go again
Huummpppooorgh = We go again
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Not so much the mumbling, it's more how quiet he is.
It's like listening to a 30's music hall recording on an i-pod.
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I wish people would stop blarting about his post match interviews, I don't remember Ron Saunders coming across like Louie Spence when he spoke.
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I wish people would stop blarting about his post match interviews, I don't remember Ron Saunders coming across like Louie Spence when he spoke.
Ron Saunders spoke as though he was a ventriloquist. His lips barely moved.
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I wish people would stop blarting about his post match interviews, I don't remember Ron Saunders coming across like Louie Spence when he spoke.
Ron Saunders spoke as though he was a ventriloquist. His lips barely moved.
Always economical with his words and with the ability to put down commentators and reporters with just a single comment or a simple rhetorical question. The never to be forgotten "Do you want to bet against us?", being the best.
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Ferguson regularly loses me with his incoherent ramblings, but his players don't seem to have any communication problems.