Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: supertom on October 30, 2012, 11:01:04 AM
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The current squad, who makes the grade in terms of quality and/or consistency/reliability, who doesn't? New signings included based on your early views on them (though not Westwood or Bowery).
Guzan- Yes
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- No (He'll hopefully improve but I'm not sure on him defensively or offensively. We'll see).
Dunne- No (Too many fitness and injury problems, before you even consider poor form in the last two years).
Clark- Yes (just about- needs to deliver a lot more)
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan- No
Herd- Yes
Albrighton- No
Ireland- No
N'Zogbia- No
Holman- Yes
Agbonlahor-Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
For me we've got enough quality up top in place and solid keepers. The defence needs a bit of experience and the midfield needs that and a lot more quality.
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I'd question:
Given - he did have the quality but he's starting to look his age
Bannan - I don't think he's done much wrong this season
Gabby - has been too long since he delivered now, needs to find the net in the league a few times soon
It's hard to disagree with any of the others though.
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If you're talking about now, I don't think I could be more pleased if Richard Dunne made a miraculous recovery and was available this weekend. We desperately miss his experience and leadership at the back.
And Lambert needs to get Ireland And N'Zogbia integrated into a stable formation and playing. They are our most creative players and it should be his job to get the best out of them.
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If Dunne came back as he was 3 years ago I'd be happy. I just think he's getting to the point where this level of football is going to be beyond his physical capablities. We do need someone like Dunney at his best though. He's a leader and a warhorse. Vlaar needs some experience alongside him to settle.
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I'd disagree on Given - he's past it & boosting his pension.
Clark is just about Ok but not in central defence
I think Gabby has shot his bolt now and no longer is the palyer he promised to be.
You missed out Westwood and Bowery!!! ;)
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To me, Agbonlahor is more of a link man, or a player without portfolio. I don't think he was that bad on Saturday and he's been quite good this season as a whole, but I agree that he's basically a non-scoring striker. He should have been converted into a winger a long time ago.
Bennett is unsuited to the Premier League, simple as. He was targeted by Norwich before the yellow and all of their attacks came down that side for 90 minutes as a consequence. I'd like to see Dunne back because he's an experienced head even if his speed has gone.
Finally, I don't rate Clark in his current position. Baker is a better player and Clark should be moved forward to a holding role. He can't defend very well, so shouldn't be placed as the last line.
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The current squad, who makes the grade in terms of quality and/or consistency/reliability, who doesn't? New signings included based on your early views on them (though not Westwood or Bowery).
Guzan- Yes
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- No (He'll hopefully improve but I'm not sure on him defensively or offensively. We'll see).
Dunne- No (Too many fitness and injury problems, before you even consider poor form in the last two years).
Clark- Yes (just about- needs to deliver a lot more)
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan- No
Herd- Yes
Albrighton- No
Ireland- No
N'Zogbia- No
Holman- Yes
Agbonlahor-Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
For me we've got enough quality up top in place and solid keepers. The defence needs a bit of experience and the midfield needs that and a lot more quality.
Can't see why Ireland got a no and gabby got a yes - Ireland I'm not sure about as he's hit and miss - gabby most definitely is a massive no for me.
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I think it's very hard to make a judgement on any of the new signings yet really other than to say Lowton, Vlaar and Benteke definitely look they have it. The others we really don't know yet. The only players I'd say are no hopers are Warnock, Hutton, Delph and Albrighton.
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I'm surprised you give Gabby a yes and Ireland, Bannan and N'Zogbia a no.
The only thing consistent or reliable about Gabby is his extreme averageness for quite a long time now. The others are at east capable of creating something.
Much as I don't rate either of them that much, I also think Hutton and Warnock may have been jettisoned too soon given the thinness of our resources and experience. We can't afford to do likewise with Dunne at the moment.
Lichaj I think is ok, a decent squad player. Clark I've never really rated, neither strong enough or fast enough to be a top CB, I'd prefer Baker or Herd, but again ok as a squad player. Delph isn't a holding midfielder and has never been given a chance as an attacking midfielder which is where he did well for Leeds.
Albrighton looks a busted flush, lacks both pace and a trick.
A bit harsh to be judging Bennett and Lowton so soon.
The big problem is not enough definite, indisputable yesses to make a good team.
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i have been lucky enough to watch Westwood a couple of times at Crewe. While he was playing at a lower level, i think he could do a job over Delph in that he seems more calm on the ball, and doesnt pass into pressure
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At present and on current form, I'd say there are very few pople in the 'yes' camp, probably only Guzan, Vlaar, Clark and Benteke. Others have it in them to be good enough, eg Gabby, Ireland and Bent, but aren't doing it for various reasons. The youngsters like Lowton and Bennett aren't good enough yet, but may be in future. Others like Delph and Albrighton are never, ever going to be good enough. Then there are the distinctly average KEA and Holman, who you could probably get away with if they were surrounded by much better players, but aren't.
It all adds up to a squad that is getting the results its lack of quality deserves.
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How Delph is making the first team I will never know. It must be because Lambert reckons we lack a bit of muscle and toughness otherwise which is probably a fair point.
Our midfield is our main weakness. If we could augment it with one premier league quality player it would improve us so much. We need a leader in midfield who can take responsibility.
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Guzan- Yes
Given- No
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- Yes - don't think he's been as bad as people make out
Dunne- No
Clark- Yes
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan-Yes
Herd- Yes
Albrighton- No
Ireland- Yes
N'Zogbia- No
Holman- Yes
Agbonlahor- No, gives his all but always runs into a dead end and doesn't deliver the final ball/shot
Bent- Yes, won't be at the club much longer though it seems. Question on attitude but the skill level is there
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
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Ireland a yes and Gabby a no . There is not many prem teams Gabby would get into at the moment as well as a few others too. Thats why we are in trouble.
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Agree with all except Gabby for Yes - not delivered for a long time
Herd / Ireland maybes, not convinced on either
The others spot on but as noted by others Given is an expensive 2nd choice keeper
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Guzan- Yes
Given- No
Hutton-No
Lichaj- Yes - (as back up)
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- Yes
Dunne- No
Clark- Yes
Baker- Yes (as back up)
Vlaar- Yes
Stevens - Yes (as back-up)
Summary defence isn't that bad the young player can only improve through games. Although you could argue there at too many at once, I actually belive the down fall has been poor protection from the midfield
KEA- Yes (best part of his game disappears covering for Delph)
Delph- Yes (as back-up)
Bannan-Yes (as back up)
Herd- Yes (as back up)
Albrighton- Yes (as back up)
Ireland- No
N'Zogbia- No
Holman- Yes
Westwood - Yes (as back up)
Too many squad players only KEA is a defiant starter and Holman is at a push. Craig Gardner would be realistic (Milner would be best) we haven't go any really haven't got a box to box mid-fielder who can score and tackle. Also feel we need a new right mid-fielder (not winger)
Agbonlahor - Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
Jordan Bowery - Yes
Good balance of strikers but they aren't going to score without chances being created for them!
Overall its the mid-field that's letting us down but I think I'm stating the obvious there.
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N'Zogbia, Ireland, Bent and Gabby are all yes on ability, but probably no on current form. Arguably only Vlaar from defence is a yes as a starter, the others probably only good enough as back up right now, in terms of real premier league quality. Benteke, Holman, KEA all yes, but need a lot more quality alongside them. Both keepers yes.
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Bannan more of a yes than Herd, Delph and Albrighton for me, but all probably no as starters.
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Agree with most here that:
Keepers are fine (though Given should be replaced as his wages are an issue)
Defenders are young, inexperienced though improving (I actually like Lichaj, Bennet will have more long-term quality but Lichaj is tough and can do a job, unsure on Clark though have been impressed with Baker and Herd, Vlaar seems to be growing with each game). I also agree that the lack of cover from midfield isn't helping them.
Strikers - we have a good choice of strikers. Gabby has become ineffectual as a N° 9 but I thought he did a great job on Saturday as a wing forward, working the channels, using his pace and strength. I'd keep him around. Benteke is a goalscorer with an aerial threat no doubt. Weimann, like Lichaj has all the makings of a great team player and I like him. Bent has quality though if we need the money I wouldn't hesitate to sell him.
Midfield needs work but I think a lot of this work is to be done by Lambert, throw the names of Bannan, KEA, Ireland and Holman into the mix and on paper we do have quality there. But it needs the right balance and formation. Delph gets a resounding no from me but I think Albrighton would be OK as a squad player.
Two quality midfielders (one defensive minded and one attacking) coupled with a balanced and settled midfield, I think the rest of the team would all start looking the better for it.
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In fact the more I think of it, the midfield is Lambert's problem, he ought to be able to get better out of
Bannan, KEA, Ireland, Holman and N'Zogbia.
We do need a DM but there's definitely quality that needs unlocking in there.
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Not good enough and never will be
Hutton
Lichaj
Stephens
Given (past his best)
Gabby
Bannan
Albrighton
Not currently good enough, but might become so
KEA (Like Boateng but not as good)
Holman (works hard but no end product or skill)
Westwood (too soon to tell)
Bowery (see Westwood)
Bennet (not that hopeful on him)
Bent (not playing well and questionable attitude)
Clark (not living up to his promise)
NZogbia
Warnock (would give him a game in midfield at the moment)
Good enough currently
Benteke
Weimann (squad player)
Herd (squad player)
Baker
Guzan
Dunne (if fit)
Ireland
Vlaar
Lowton
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If I'm being brutally honest....
Guzan- Yes
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- Yes (as a reserve full-back he's fine)
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- Yes
Dunne- Yes, when fit
Clark- Yes.....
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Delph- No (sadly)
Bannan- Yes
Herd- No (not as a midfielder, reasonable back-up defender)
Albrighton- Yes, just about, but I think he can only play as a RW, current system doesn't suit.
Ireland- No (just does not do enough in that role)
N'Zogbia- Yes
Holman- Yes
Agbonlahor- No (doesn't seem to be a threat in the PL anymore)
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
Can't call Westwood or Bowery.
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Can someone please identify what KEA actually does?
Cannot head the ball
Does not seem to tackle
Does not seem to want to shoot (other than the Everton goal)
Not even sure which is his best foot
Does not seem box to box link up man
Does not seem to be a holding player
His passing is awful anything over 5 foot
He came as an exotic foreign player (as we had been so bereft of them previously) from a decent league - yet i have seen nothing that even gives me a hope that he is finding his feet
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Re some of the question-marks above:
Bennett - too early to call it. Yes, he was poor on Saturday (Hughton did a good job of targetting him from the start) but it's the first time he's been outstandingly poor; and he's still learning the EPL.
Herd - definitely a 'yes'. He has utility value even if he's not a first choice in MF.
Lichaj - I think he's a centre-back in waiting: hard, good in the air and has some pace.
BB - there's enough there to persist with, given the results the team has had when he's started this season.
Delph - as an attacking MF he may still be able to do a job (I keep thinking back to his Leeds days when he scored a number of goals from an attacking MF role). Or, if we ever considered a 3-5-2 set-up he might make a left wing-back. He's definitely not a holding MF.
Carruthers - not mentioned, but he needs a run in the side / as oncoming sub. We need to know whether he has the trickery and pace that Albie lacks.
Gabby - well, he scored twice against Citeh and set up Holman on Saturday for the cross converted by Benteke. As someone else has said above, he might not be Mr Prolific (at least, in the goalscoring stakes) but he may still have a value as a supporting player. If he moves on (and maybe this is the right thing for him to do), he will serve another EPL club well.
N'Zog - never agreed that he was right for us when he came to Villa. Too temperamental. We should sell him and take the financial hit.
Ireland - I don't like him (he's a scrote IMHO) but cannot make my mind up about whether he'll come good.
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Good enough for what, though?
Take a young player like Bennett. He might prove out to be a quality player, he might not. You could say that he's "good enough" to be at the club and to contribute, but is he good enough to start week in, week out?
Doesn't it really depend on what we're asking them to do? Are we asking whether we can rely on these players?
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The current squad, who makes the grade in terms of quality and/or consistency/reliability, who doesn't? New signings included based on your early views on them (though not Westwood or Bowery).
Guzan- Yes
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Lowton-Yes
Warnock-No
Bennett- No (He'll hopefully improve but I'm not sure on him defensively or offensively. We'll see).
Dunne- No (Too many fitness and injury problems, before you even consider poor form in the last two years).
Clark- Yes (just about- needs to deliver a lot more)
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan- No
Herd- Yes
Albrighton- No
Ireland- No
N'Zogbia- No
Holman- Yes
Agbonlahor-Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
For me we've got enough quality up top in place and solid keepers. The defence needs a bit of experience and the midfield needs that and a lot more quality.
My main gripe is the crticism of Bannan. He could be a class player for us, we just need to put him in the right position in the right team with the right mentality. Playing him out wide does not suit to his nature, as does playing him deep. I think playing him behind Benteke with two defensive midfielders behind him would bring out the best in him and we would see a very talented footballer emerge. We often see little flickers of brilliance from him, and if he could become consistent there'd be no stopping the lad.
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Can somebody please explain to me why moving from the championship to the premier is next to impossible for Villa signings? I was under the impression Bennett was one of the best players Boro had, and they're a team in the play-off places currently. I'd imagine the fact he has played more physical games and a greater number of them would have held him in good stead, particularly against the teams we have played, who are mainly bottom Prem/top Championship material. But he looks all at sea.
This isn't another anti-Bennett post, but I'm using him as an example as a genuine enquiry. Arsenal can sign Ramsey or Everton can sign Jagielka, for example, and they don't look out of place. Villa sign Delph, Bennett, or Harewood and they look like they've come from non-league.
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It does, and you're right, it's not as simple as good enough or not, but it's interesting to see how people rate players.
I understand the point though. I've said no to Ireland, because he should be one of our most influential players, and is taking up that role, but he's not delivering anywhere near the standard and it's a crucial position. Whereas I've said yes to Lichaj, because his role is as a squad defender, which I think he's suitable for.
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Villa sign Delph, Bennett, or Harewood and they look like they've come from non-league.
I still remember that Delph looked outstanding at first. Vision, pace and confidence. Really thought he was going to be something. I suppose his various injuries could have had a big effect. As for Harewood I don't think there was ever a great expectation of how he would turn out.
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My main grip is the crticism of Bannan. He could be a class player for us, we just need to put him in the right position in the right team with the right mentality. Playing him out wide does not suit to his nature, as does playing him deep. I think playing him behind Benteke with two defensive midfielders behind him would bring out the best in him and we would see a very talented footballer emerge. We often see little flickers of brilliance from him, and if he could become consistent there'd be no stopping the lad.
Maybe for his career he's better off leaving then?
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They are clearly lacking so much confidence also, which clearly shows at football.
For all these people who say Gabby was brilliant at Man City, may I ask who saw the full 90 mins?He was absolute gash in the first half.
One concern with midfield (there are many), is that the centre two ate within 8 yards of each other all the time. A little square pass here and one there and we aren't expansive enough. As soon as it gets in a forward zone there is no-one to support, so our strikers have no option but to run in a dead end of shoot from miles out.
Ireland needs to play with people who move, namely Bentecke and Wiermann. Gabby can only play direct kick and rush football as he is the proverbial greyhound chasing the hare. The season Bent went through last year has rendered him very low on confidence but his lack of effort isn't endearing him to people.
Albrighton would not get in my team at all, he needs a loan move somewhere to give him confidence.
I've tried to keep positive for the team, believing they will come good. It pains me to say this is the worst Villa team for quality since another GT mk2.
To answer the question;
Gk
Both good enough
Def
Good: Vlaar, Clark, Baker,
Jury out: Lowton, Bennett, Lijhai
Poor: Dunne, Hutton, Warnock
Mid
Good: Kea, Ireland,
Jury Out: n'Zogbia, Bannan, Herd, Westwood, Holman
Poor: Albrighton, Delph
Att
Good: Bentecke, Bent, Wiermann
Jury out: Agbonlahor, Bowery
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I'm not splitting hairs re: Delph, but I recall he looked great v Fiorentina in pre-season 2009-10, awful v Wigan on the opening day and was injured not long after. The only other game I recall him living up to anything like his reputation was in the FA Cup v Brighton in 2010
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I seem to remember a couple of cameos in which Delph looked very good. Couldn't tell you which particular matches they were now. Was Brighton at home? Don't know if that was one of them. I was on holiday in Austria when we lost to Wigan.
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Yes, Brighton was at home in round 3. Delph scored, I seem to recall he powered through their midfield and played a short one-two, leaving him clear and he slotted his finish underneath the keeper.
That was also the game where Albrighton started, created a goal then had to go off with an injury which turned out to be quite lengthy. ACL? Achilles?
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Guzan- Yes
Lowton-Yes
Bennett- Yes but...
Clark- Yes
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Herd- Yes
Ireland- Yes
Holman- Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
Given- No
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Warnock-No
Dunne- No
Delph- No
Bannan- No
Albrighton- No
N'Zogbia- No
Agbonlahor-No
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Delph had a great game home to Man U about 3 years ago.
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Interesting that people's memory of Delph playing well is as an attacking MF, which is what he did well at Leeds.
Successive managers have been trying to shoehorn him into a DMF role: perhaps he needs some time in the role where he made his name; perhaps he should be playing behind the lone striker?
How about Benteke upfront with Weimann and Delph supporting; with a MF three of KEA, Herd / Clark and BB?
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
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My main gripe is the crticism of Bannan. He could be a class player for us, we just need to put him in the right position in the right team with the right mentality. Playing him out wide does not suit to his nature, as does playing him deep. I think playing him behind Benteke with two defensive midfielders behind him would bring out the best in him and we would see a very talented footballer emerge. We often see little flickers of brilliance from him, and if he could become consistent there'd be no stopping the lad.
Maybe for his career he's better off leaving then?
Well, yes... but that's probably true for most of our team.
I'm not saying that I want him to.
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Many of you have said a no for Lichaj, I think he is worth keeping as he is versatile but of course it is always a matter of opinion.
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Many of you have said a no for Lichaj, I think he is worth keeping as he is versatile but of course it is always a matter of opinion.
I think lichaj is a decent squad player, not sure he'd win a regular spot but worth keeping.
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
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Eric Lichaj is our version of Tony Hibbert (Everton) good squad player may become a regular in latter years if he hangs around.
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Interesting piece from Sam Wallace from Sunday's Independent which seems appropriate to this thread - apologies if already posted elsewhere.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/sam-wallace-aston-villa-owner-randy-lerner-must-be-ready-to-dig-deep-to-insure-admirable-youth-policy-8229965.html
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
I expect the vast percentage of those passes were less than 10 yards.
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
ok so its for the season,
yes i was supprised to, but it does show he does find another Villa player more often than we think
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
I expect the vast percentage of those passes were less than 10 yards.
But it still contradicts one of the main criticisms of him that he gives the ball away too much. When I checked it was a higher pass rate than Carzola (the Arsenal fella) Gerrard and a quite a few others.
And yes, i'm still surprised.
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
I expect the vast percentage of those passes were less than 10 yards.
But it still contradicts one of the main criticisms of him that he gives the ball away too much. When I checked it was a higher pass rate than Carzola (the Arsenal fella) Gerrard and a quite a few others.
And yes, i'm still surprised.
Although he does seem to get tackled a lot before he passes the ball and loses it that way.
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Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
I expect the vast percentage of those passes were less than 10 yards.
What, like many of the Spanish players?! ;)
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I'm surprised by that stat. Are they including ones that he makes during the warm-up?
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Maybe it's because he's shown himself subsequently to be rubbish at getting the ball to another Villa player?
i thought he had a 90% pass completion stat on saturday ?
Delph has a pass success rate of just under 90% for the season. It still surprises me.
I expect the vast percentage of those passes were less than 10 yards.
Is that a bad thing?
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I'm surprised by that stat. Are they including ones that he makes during the warm-up?
Ha, ha.
As I said earlier, successive managers have been trying to shoehorn him into a DMF role: perhaps he needs some time in the role where he made his name, as an attacking MF. Then we'll at least know what he might be capable of before ditching him
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Delph's problem isn't necessarily his short passing it's that his first touch is often so poor that he gets tackled and loses the ball immediately.
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Delph's problem isn't necessarily his short passing it's that his first touch is often so poor that he gets tackled and loses the ball immediately.
Delph does three things.
1. Passes successfully, but sideways.
2. Wins ball, turns, runs straight into opposition player, loses ball.
3. First touch causes ball to bounce off him at random angle, dives in two footed and late to get it back, gives away free kick.
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Reo Coker?
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Reo Coker?
Clappy thing.
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The problem with Bannan is where to play him. In our current system he's far too lightweight to play in the centre two. I mean Delphs no brick out house by any stretch and not a particularly great player but he's the man of choice at the moment.
Bannan for me also needs to keep things simpler too. He goes for the Hollywood pass too often and misses. I just think he's now reached an age where he should have made it by now but hasn't, for whatever reason. In truth I think O Neill did him and a few others, no favours by not helping them develop more 3-4 years ago. They'd have been better players at this point.
Also for all that he's supposed to be technically very good, his set piece delivery has been consistently poor. Ours just generally is, and if his was much better it'd give PL a good reason to start him.
I don't see him making the grade to be honest. He needs a move to a championship side. Maybe if they get promoted in the future he'll get another crack at this level. IMO Whittingham played better for us in his time than BB has, and has developed now into a solid player. He should be in the top flight IMO. Perhaps BB should make the drop and hope he has more luck coming back up than PW.
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I like Bannan, but he doesn't seem capable of making the step up from promising kid to proper midfielder. Hope I'm wrong. Same for Delph. We need to buy a fully fledged and cultured midfielder in January.
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Bannan is a bit too lightweight to play in the middle of a 4-4-2.
I think Ireland and KEA would work. Ireland seems to have added the work ethic to his game now. We should try that with Holman on the right and maybe Bannan on the left?
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What i like about Bannan is his ability to pick players out with passes that no-one else in the team can do really. He seems to know where players are on the pitch. He did have a period in the second half last night where he gave the ball away a few times but i still think we should persevere with him. People who already expecting the complete midfielder forget that he's still only 22. We'll create more chances with him and the likes of Ireland in the side than we will Delph.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
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What i like about Bannan is his ability to pick players out with passes that no-one else in the team can do really. He seems to know where players are on the pitch. He did have a period in the second half last night where he gave the ball away a few times but i still think we should persevere with him. People who already expecting the complete midfielder forget that he's still only 22. We'll create more chances with him and the likes of Ireland in the side than we will Delph.
Results seem to agree with you clampy- he and Ireland have done enough to start on Saturday.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
The two who i think could be really good if given a good run are Bannan and Baker. Baker would be my choice alongside Vlaar. I like Clark a lot but i'm still not overly sure he's cut out for a centre half. Maybe a few years down the line he will be but yet. Baker's a natural centre half and you can tell. If he can stay clear of injuries he'll be excellent i reckon.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
The two who i think could be really good if given a good run are Bannan and Baker. Baker would be my choice alongside Vlaar. I like Clark a lot but i'm still not overly sure he's cut out for a centre half. Maybe a few years down the line he will be but yet. Baker's a natural centre half and you can tell. If he can stay clear of injuries he'll be excellent i reckon.
What I find quite interesting is that we seem to have struggled defending set pieces since Clark has been out.
I think there's very little between Baker and Clark, both of them (and Vlaar) would look a lot more solid with better covering from the midfield in front of them.
If Dunne can get fit I actually think our defence is fine, Lowton looks good, Bennett is a little hit and miss but has only had 1 really poor game, centrally we're fine and Herd and Lichaj provide good squad options. We need to get them established as a unit, which will come with time when the injuries clear up.
Up front we're good, we have a better set of forward than most sides in the league, in my opinion at least, Gabby needs a few goals and Bent needs to get more service but all 4 are well capable of playing at a decent level in the prem.
In midfield we need a leader. Bannan, Ireland, KEA, Nzogbia, Holman are all good enough and Delph and Albrighton have looked good enough at times but we don't have anyone dictating the game. What I can't decide is how much of that is ability and how much is belief.
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Interesting that people's memory of Delph playing well is as an attacking MF, which is what he did well at Leeds.
Successive managers have been trying to shoehorn him into a DMF role: perhaps he needs some time in the role where he made his name; perhaps he should be playing behind the lone striker?
How about Benteke upfront with Weimann and Delph supporting; with a MF three of KEA, Herd / Clark and BB?
Well said. I've never understood why various managers have insisted on playing Delph at DM where he often looked poor, and not as an AM where he looked very promising for Leeds and showed he could score from distance too. He also looked kind of okay when played at LB, but mostly when bombing forward to support the attack. I think the combination you suggest, with Delph and Weimann supporting a main striker could offer creativity, energy and movement and might be worth a shot.
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What i like about Bannan is his ability to pick players out with passes that no-one else in the team can do really. He seems to know where players are on the pitch. He did have a period in the second half last night where he gave the ball away a few times but i still think we should persevere with him. People who already expecting the complete midfielder forget that he's still only 22. We'll create more chances with him and the likes of Ireland in the side than we will Delph.
That's why passing stats can be misleading, they don't take into account the difficulty of the passes being attempted. Bannan used to overdo the ambitious balls and gave it away far too often, but I think he picks his times better now. Every team needs players who are willing to try the risky, creative pass, especially in the final third. I do think though that Bannan's best position puts him in direct competition with Ireland, just behind the strikers in the middle. That's arguably also Delph's best position.
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lichaj is a woeful centre-back. his positional sense and reading of the game is awful. was caught flat footed for the goal at fulham, and got done for the first last night.
it's telling that lambert would rather shoe-horn chris herd in there.
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That's why passing stats can be misleading, they don't take into account the difficulty of the passes being attempted. Bannan used to overdo the ambitious balls and gave it away far too often, but I think he picks his times better now. Every team needs players who are willing to try the risky, creative pass, especially in the final third. I do think though that Bannan's best position puts him in direct competition with Ireland, just behind the strikers in the middle. That's arguably also Delph's best position.
Delph doesn't have the ideas to play there, for me. For Bannan, I think his best position might be called the David Silva role: a roving inside-right playmaker. He AND Ireland should play behind Benteke, with one other player there as well in a 4-2-3-1.
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Bannan's most successful Hollywood pass was to Albrighton at Craven Cottage in 2010. It was sublime, but also 2 years ago.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
That is a real issue for me. I remember Shane Warne commentating on a cricket match and referring to somebody having played "20 first tests". When asked to explain what he meant, he said that the player hadn't really improved since he first came into the side and was still making the same mistakes over and over. I think that is certainly the case with our younger players and although they haven't played that many games, you couldn't say that any of them have shown any sign of real progression. They still make basic errors during games (Lichaj's header for their 2nd goal last night a prime example) and although you can't fault the effort, they just don't seem to have moved on.
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lichaj is a woeful centre-back. his positional sense and reading of the game is awful. was caught flat footed for the goal at fulham, and got done for the first last night.
it's telling that lambert would rather shoe-horn chris herd in there.
Played at left back and right back last night. Thought he was good - great ball for Ireland to set up the first and great early cross for the third. Didn't think there was a lot he could do for thier first... beaten really by the quality of the ball that was played. Didn't think it was his clearing header either... wasn't it Lowton?
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Two years almost to the day in fact. Two weeks later they tore apart ManUre for a spell too. It was to be their Hollywood apex.
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lichaj is a woeful centre-back. his positional sense and reading of the game is awful. was caught flat footed for the goal at fulham, and got done for the first last night.
it's telling that lambert would rather shoe-horn chris herd in there.
Played at left back and right back last night. Thought he was good - great ball for Ireland to set up the first and great early cross for the third. Didn't think there was a lot he could do for thier first... beaten really by the quality of the ball that was played. Didn't think it was his clearing header either... wasn't it Lowton?
Have to say I like Lichaj, not because of what he's not good at but what he is good at. He's got a bit of the Phil Neville mongrel about him, even when he came on against Norwich it was noticeable how he made the first attacking foray from full back all game. He's not perfect but I have to say I think that along with Herd, he's one of the few scrappers we have.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
That is a real issue for me. I remember Shane Warne commentating on a cricket match and referring to somebody having played "20 first tests". When asked to explain what he meant, he said that the player hadn't really improved since he first came into the side and was still making the same mistakes over and over. I think that is certainly the case with our younger players and although they haven't played that many games, you couldn't say that any of them have shown any sign of real progression. They still make basic errors during games (Lichaj's header for their 2nd goal last night a prime example) and although you can't fault the effort, they just don't seem to have moved on.
Their development has been pretty stunted as well. MON was terrible for the likes of Bannan and Albrighton, and never rated them mainly because of size. Bannan at 18 was very exciting, but MON was the only one out of the whole staff, Sid, McAndrew and so on, who didn't rate him because he valued physicality over skill. GH was quite good for the youngsters but the problems of that season scuppered chances of any serious development, with the behaviour of the seniors a total disgrace. As for Eck, well, he was never going to be good for the development of skillful, attacking players, and they unlearned any of the calm and thought they might have learned under GH and replaced it with fear and neanderthal approaches to football. Hopefully Lambo can get them back on track, and signs are there - Baker and Clark look pretty assured, and Bannan is showing signs of an understanding with KEA and Ireland - but it will take time.
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Lots of question marks for me, from our so called youngsters who are now around 22/23 to the likes of N'Zogbia. I like Lichaj, Herd, Baker and Lowton. Too soon to say with Bennett. Can't make my mind up on Bannan and Delph. I thought Clark would be the best of the bunch but he hasn't kicked on as much as I expected. Stevens and Albrighton are the definate not good enoughs for me.
That is a real issue for me. I remember Shane Warne commentating on a cricket match and referring to somebody having played "20 first tests". When asked to explain what he meant, he said that the player hadn't really improved since he first came into the side and was still making the same mistakes over and over. I think that is certainly the case with our younger players and although they haven't played that many games, you couldn't say that any of them have shown any sign of real progression. They still make basic errors during games (Lichaj's header for their 2nd goal last night a prime example) and although you can't fault the effort, they just don't seem to have moved on.
Their development has been pretty stunted as well. MON was terrible for the likes of Bannan and Albrighton, and never rated them mainly because of size. Bannan at 18 was very exciting, but MON was the only one out of the whole staff, Sid, McAndrew and so on, who didn't rate him because he valued physicality over skill. GH was quite good for the youngsters but the problems of that season scuppered chances of any serious development, with the behaviour of the seniors a total disgrace. As for Eck, well, he was never going to be good for the development of skillful, attacking players, and they unlearned any of the calm and thought they might have learned under GH and replaced it with fear and neanderthal approaches to football. Hopefully Lambo can get them back on track, and signs are there - Baker and Clark look pretty assured, and Bannan is showing signs of an understanding with KEA and Ireland - but it will take time.
Some good points Monty, but how much time do they need? Some of them are approaching 24 and still look no better than when they first came into the team. There are still major question marks over all of them (and I would include Clark in that) as to whether they will make the grade in the Premiership.
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PlaceForParks Lichaj's not a CB though is he, so it shouldn't be surprising if he doesn't look good there. I agree with Onje-Villa, I'm another (kind of) fan of Lichaj. He's a bit rough around the edges but loves to bomb forward and get stuck in, and provides a lot of energy and drive when he plays. If he could control his tendency for rash challenges I think he'd be a real asset. I'd keep him in ahead of Bennett at LB.
Montbert, how do you know Delph doesn't have the ideas to play behind the strikers, he's never been given the chance to play there.
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I like Bannan in so far he he seems to be very good at increasing the tempo of a match with his passing.
His big problem, particularly with the style of play which PL has adopted, is that he is usually several yards away from the player he is supposed to be marking when we do not have possession.
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Some good points Monty, but how much time do they need? Some of them are approaching 24 and still look no better than when they first came into the team. There are still major question marks over all of them (and I would include Clark in that) as to whether they will make the grade in the Premiership.
Oh I agree, and under Lambert who appears to want to play more football than certain previous managers it is definitely sink or swim time. The point is also that the crucial stage of their development - ages 18-22 - has been so disjointed that maybe it's a case of salvaging something from them rather than getting them to their absolute maximum potential.
Montbert, how do you know Delph doesn't have the ideas to play behind the strikers, he's never been given the chance to play there.
Well he hasn't displayed much imagination in the positions he's played in so far. I mean, of course it's possible it could be his best position, but FWIW I'm unconvinced.
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I like Bannan in so far he he seems to be very good at increasing the tempo of a match with his passing.
Ireland plays a part in that as well. The midfield looks a lot more mobile and energetic when they're both on the pitch. Because they've both got the abilty to open games up, it does make us look better.
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I like Bannan in so far he he seems to be very good at increasing the tempo of a match with his passing.
Ireland plays a part in that as well. The midfield looks a lot more mobile and energetic when they're both on the pitch. Because they've both got the abilty to open games up, it does make us look better.
I agree , but I do wish they would both show more consistency. They have the ability but need to deliver regularly.
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Some good points Monty, but how much time do they need? Some of them are approaching 24 and still look no better than when they first came into the team. There are still major question marks over all of them (and I would include Clark in that) as to whether they will make the grade in the Premiership.
Oh I agree, and under Lambert who appears to want to play more football than certain previous managers it is definitely sink or swim time. The point is also that the crucial stage of their development - ages 18-22 - has been so disjointed that maybe it's a case of salvaging something from them rather than getting them to their absolute maximum potential.
Montbert, how do you know Delph doesn't have the ideas to play behind the strikers, he's never been given the chance to play there.
Well he hasn't displayed much imagination in the positions he's played in so far. I mean, of course it's possible it could be his best position, but FWIW I'm unconvinced.
That could well be the case. Not wishing to sound too harsh, but I personally think that some of them of are at best Championship level players who are extremely lucky to have played as many Premiership games as they have for a club like Aston Villa and the sooner we get into a position where we are no longer reliant on calling upon them the better.
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I like Bannan in so far he he seems to be very good at increasing the tempo of a match with his passing.
Ireland plays a part in that as well. The midfield looks a lot more mobile and energetic when they're both on the pitch. Because they've both got the abilty to open games up, it does make us look better.
I agree , but I do wish they would both show more consistency. They have the ability but need to deliver regularly.
Agreed with all of the above.
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PlaceForParks Lichaj's not a CB though is he, so it shouldn't be surprising if he doesn't look good there.
personally i don't think it's unreasonable to expect an international footballer to do a passable job in another position across the back four!
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Guzan- Yes
Lowton-Yes
Bennett- No
Clark- Yes
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Herd- Yes
Ireland- Yes
Holman- Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- No
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- No
Warnock-No
Dunne- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan- Yes
Albrighton- No
N'Zogbia- No
Agbonlahor-Yes
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Here is my version FWIW...
Guzan- Yes
Lowton-Yes
Bennett- Yes
Clark- Yes
Baker- Yes
Vlaar- Yes
KEA- Yes
Herd- Yes
Ireland- Yes
Holman- Yes
Bent- Yes
Benteke- Yes
Weimann- Yes
Given- Yes
Hutton-No
Lichaj- Yes
Warnock-No
Dunne- Yes
Delph- No
Bannan- Yes
Albrighton- No
N'Zogbia- No
Agbonlahor-Yes