Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Legion on April 03, 2012, 07:20:29 PM
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Might be a possibility (http://www.myoldmansaid.com/aston-villa-response-villa-vs-celtic-for-stan/)
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Brilliant suggestion of ticket prices being £19 too.
Other than that I'm saying nothing after the last thread had to be locked.
Talk Celtic site has a thread here and they are definitely keen on the idea of a game.
http://www.talkceltic.net/forum/showthread.php?t=121414
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And as an aside, could people keep their bickering to a minimum to prevent this thread being locked like the last one.
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I wonder how this thread will go?
(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/th_popcorncat.gif)
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excellent idea - as long as it's OK with Stan's family
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excellent idea - as long as it's OK with Stan's family
here here
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Rummor in Ireland that match will be played at Celtic Park
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And as an aside, could people keep their bickering to a minimum to prevent this thread being locked like the last one.
Yes please. The last thread was a disgrace.
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Rummor in Ireland that match will be played at Celtic Park
If it happens it may well work out like that due to Celtic Park holding more spectators.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
Even if it is the east end of Glasgow you'd be visiting? ;)
Was in Glasgow not long ago, there's loads to do there, like museums and galleries etc.
However, I expect everyone will be on the piss (me included). I'm not missing this game for the world if it happens.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
Even if it is the east end of Glasgow you'd be visiting? ;)
Was in Glasgow not long ago, there's loads to do there, like museums and galleries etc.
However, I expect everyone will be on the piss (me included). I'm not missing this game for the world if it happens.
Yeah, been there. I will, of course, insist on a cople of days in Edinburgh to make the trip really worth while.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
Even if it is the east end of Glasgow you'd be visiting? ;)
Was in Glasgow not long ago, there's loads to do there, like museums and galleries etc.
However, I expect everyone will be on the piss (me included). I'm not missing this game for the world if it happens.
Yeah, been there. I will, of course, insist on a cople of days in Edinburgh to make the trip really worth while.
Yeah, I'd prolly stay there if possible. In fact its worth pointing this out:
The Edinburgh Fringe and Comedy Festival is on in August for the entire month. If this game happens in August, it's worth keeping this in mind when looking at hotels. Abandon all hope of getting one in Edinburgh.
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I really hope this happens.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
Even if it is the east end of Glasgow you'd be visiting? ;)
Was in Glasgow not long ago, there's loads to do there, like museums and galleries etc.
However, I expect everyone will be on the piss (me included). I'm not missing this game for the world if it happens.
Yeah, been there. I will, of course, insist on a cople of days in Edinburgh to make the trip really worth while.
Yeah, I'd prolly stay there if possible. In fact its worth pointing this out:
The Edinburgh Fringe and Comedy Festival is on in August for the entire month. If this game happens in August, it's worth keeping this in mind when looking at hotels. Abandon all hope of getting one in Edinburgh.
Very good point. Probably best to avoid August then. ;)
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Sounds great. I'd go to either venue.
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I would love to go to either venue but the biggest thing to consider is not the fans but STAN.
We want him to be there to watch the match but if it means that travelling up to Celtic will make his health worse then its better held at Villa Park.
When i let the Celtic supporters on Talkceltic site know who to email at the club everyone thought it was a great idea and all are up for seeing this match.
The club replied to my email stating that they are discussing it at the moment and will notify the supporters in due course.
No matter were it is held it will be a brilliant atmosphere although you Villa fans might not like the idea of singing along to "You'll Never Walk Alone". LOL
But at least you will all be made welcome to the home of the SPL Champions.
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Interesting football facts for matches between Celtic and Aston Villa.
Celtic have played Villa 9 times with 4 wins each and 1 draw. Most were friendlies.
Here are the results:
09/04/1894 Aston Villa 3 v Celtic 2
21/04/1894 Celtic 2 v Aston Villa 1
20/04/1896 Celtic 3 v Aston Villa 2
21/12/1900 Aston Villa 3 v Celtic 1
02/09/1901 Aston Villa 2 v Celtic 1
20/04/1911 Celtic 1 v Aston Villa 1
01/03/1947 Aston Villa 1 v Celtic 2
05/02/1949 Celtic 0 v Aston Villa 2
02/08/1986 Celtic 1 v Aston Villa 0
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If it goes ahead that people are fully aware of certain political sensitivities, and that all political grandstanding should be banned.
In respect to Stan .
If not an idea with good intentions maybe marred.
I shalll not be drawn into debate. to keep this topic alive I shall show some respect.
I have serious reservations and would not attend in any way shape or form.
I will donate money to the Anthony Nolan trust which looks after maybe the more disadvantaged people that do not have the benefit of the best health care can provide.
Get well Stan our thoughts and prayers are with you.
AVFC
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The politics of this make it unwise.
The Stan connection is nice, but you cannot undo the past.
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Interesting football facts for matches between Celtic and Aston Villa.
Celtic have played Villa 9 times with 4 wins each and 1 draw. Most were friendlies.
Here are the results:
09/04/1894 Aston Villa 3 v Celtic 2
21/04/1894 Celtic 2 v Aston Villa 1
20/04/1896 Celtic 3 v Aston Villa 2
21/12/1900 Aston Villa 3 v Celtic 1
02/09/1901 Aston Villa 2 v Celtic 1
20/04/1911 Celtic 1 v Aston Villa 1
01/03/1947 Aston Villa 1 v Celtic 2
05/02/1949 Celtic 0 v Aston Villa 2
02/08/1986 Celtic 1 v Aston Villa 0
You seem to have completely overlooked our 2-1 win over Celtic in the Daily Express 5-a-side tournament at the Empire Pool, Wembley in 1983! Think we knocked Celtic out a couple of years earlier as well.
Proper competitive football too - none of this friendly rubbish!
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The politics of this make it unwise.
The Stan connection is nice, but you cannot undo the past.
Eh?
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Would like to see this game played, it would be a great way to show our support for Stan and raise money for leukaemia charities.
But like others have said people will need to put there political beliefs to one side and remember that's it's for Stan.
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To Dekuip, i only mentioned professional matches whether Friendlies or competitive matches NOT 5 a side.
I have just emailed Andrew Lansley MP, Secretary of State for Health asking if he and his colleagues would kindly request that the HMRC waive all the VAT from the benefit match if it takes place. I explained the situation with STAN and also how much Leukemia research stood to benefit. Capacity crowd at Celtic park with tickets at £19 means minimum of £1,155,808 and if at Villa Park if capacity crowd it would be minimum of £812,972 and that's just from tickets. That doesn't account for all merchandise and the possible Bulgarian TV money as well.
All that going to Leukemia research.
Hopefully i get a positive reply.
I also agree that ALL politics should be binned. Actually, come to think of it, politics should have no place in football.
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
i would love that to,
never been to Celtic Park, would be a great day out in support of a good cause
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To Dekuip, i only mentioned professional matches whether Friendlies or competitive matches NOT 5 a side.
I have just emailed Andrew Lansley MP, Secretary of State for Health asking if he and his colleagues would kindly request that the HMRC waive all the VAT from the benefit match if it takes place. I explained the situation with STAN and also how much Leukemia research stood to benefit. Capacity crowd at Celtic park with tickets at £19 means minimum of £1,155,808 and if at Villa Park if capacity crowd it would be minimum of £812,972 and that's just from tickets. That doesn't account for all merchandise and the possible Bulgarian TV money as well.
All that going to Leukemia research.
Hopefully i get a positive reply.
I also agree that ALL politics should be binned. Actually, come to think of it, politics should have no place in football.
I would guess the VAT would be waived as it is a charitable cause. However, as both clubs involved are clearly commercial businesses liable to VAT I expect it is more complex. VAT regulation is a minefield.
I believe I am correct in saying that there was successful lobbying for VAT being waived on sales of the Military Wives record before Xmas, so there is precedent.
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I really hope the game against Celtic happens it would be worth it for a good cause.
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To Dekuip, i only mentioned professional matches whether Friendlies or competitive matches NOT 5 a side.
I have just emailed Andrew Lansley MP, Secretary of State for Health asking if he and his colleagues would kindly request that the HMRC waive all the VAT from the benefit match if it takes place. I explained the situation with STAN and also how much Leukemia research stood to benefit. Capacity crowd at Celtic park with tickets at £19 means minimum of £1,155,808 and if at Villa Park if capacity crowd it would be minimum of £812,972 and that's just from tickets. That doesn't account for all merchandise and the possible Bulgarian TV money as well.
All that going to Leukemia research.
Hopefully i get a positive reply.
I also agree that ALL politics should be binned. Actually, come to think of it, politics should have no place in football.
The costs to stage the game have to factored into the equation too so the total figure on ticket sales would be reduced, however, as has been mentioned I am sure merchandising etc would also contribute to the final figure.
Just a thought, considering how aggressive the illness that Stan has, would the timing of this summer for any game be a challenge for the great man to undertake considering his focus & attention will be solely on fighting his illness?
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Personally, I'd prefer it to be at Celtic Park. Never one to miss an opportunity to visit Scotland.
i would love that to,
never been to Celtic Park, would be a great day out in support of a good cause
No, it has top be at VP, this is where he plays his football. Let the Jocks / Irish come down here and spend money in Brum - Hotels etc. a little boost to the local economy.
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Do you reckon if this game goes ahead we got get back players who played alongside Stan i.e Ashley Young, Milner, Carew and little Shaun Maloney he must know Petrov really well.
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Ian Taylor on Talksport in a bit giving his backing to getting this game on.
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The politics of this make it unwise.
The Stan connection is nice, but you cannot undo the past.
Eh?
Celtic are a nationalist, separatist, anti- British club with a history of overt IRA support amongst their fans,and banning poppy day collections.This isn't ancient history- this is now, this bile which still prompts fines and arrests amongst their support.
Many of our support remember the pub bombings and are disgusted by the substantial support amongst their support for views that many in Northern Ireland have moved on from.
I have no problem with Celtic offering whatever moral or financial support for Stan that they may wish either directly, or for charitable causes.
You may disagree with me, and that is fine. But I am surprised that you are unaware of the vitriolic bigotry which charecterises a significant section of their support and the affront that causes many of us with Birmingham roots.
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Any more politics on this thread and it will be locked for the second time, which will be shameful considering its theme.
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A model professional and a worthy cause but a definate no for Villa Park.
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Any more politics on this thread and it will be locked for the second time, which will be shameful considering its theme.
Hear Hear
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I think the game definitely should be at Villa park as this is where Stan plays, his family live, and he is the captain of this club.
As for the politics I understand why certain supporters may not like the political persuasions and certain view points of certain sections of the Celtic support but this is about Stan. Let's try and remember that and not gt into petty insults.
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The politics of this make it unwise.
The Stan connection is nice, but you cannot undo the past.
Eh?
Celtic are a nationalist, separatist, anti- British club with a history of overt IRA support amongst their fans,and banning poppy day collections.This isn't ancient history- this is now, this bile which still prompts fines and arrests amongst their support.
Many of our support remember the pub bombings and are disgusted by the substantial support amongst their support for views that many in Northern Ireland have moved on from.
I have no problem with Celtic offering whatever moral or financial support for Stan that they may wish either directly, or for charitable causes.
You may disagree with me, and that is fine. But I am surprised that you are unaware of the vitriolic bigotry which charecterises a significant section of their support and the affront that causes many of us with Birmingham roots.
Celtic are a Scottish club - the first British one to win the European Cup. Their former Chairman was John Reid former Armed Forces Minister for the UK government.
A lot of Celtic fans are Irish as the club was founded by the Irish diaspora in the UK (Glasgow, Scotland). It's a small minority of supporters who would be of the knuckledragger mentality associated with the politics of Northern Ireland.
You can't tar a whole football club because of the actions of a vocal minority. I've known plenty of Celtic fans serving in the British armed forces. A match between our two clubs would be a magnificent gesture to Stan Petrov - that is all that matters here. Inaccurate generalisations is the cause of all the problems between Celtic and Rangers, it's not our business as Villa fans, surely, to fall into the small minded trap of quack politics? Aston Villa is above all of that.
The clubs have played each other on a number of occasions in the past (as recently as '86)...why on earth should they not play now? I can think of no more fitting or appropriate reason for a friendly between two clubs. Playing for Stan and raising money is all that matters here. This is what football should be all about: doing good for society and helping people. A match between the two clubs for Stan would be in the best traditions of Aston Villa and William McGregor.
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Absolutely should be at VP. He's our captain.
No disrespect to Gabby. Or, indeed, anybody else.
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Why not make it 2 legged - one at start one at end of season.
All then happy.
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Interesting reading the comments on the Celtic forums about Stan, they really love him, putting him in the their top 3 players of recent times and add to the fact he spent 7 years up there, they're obviously very upset to hear about his illness. The mention of a game against ourselves has drawn great support, giving them an opportunity to demonstrate their affection for him.
As I mentioned in the 'other' thread, I'd expect nothing less than a love-in and an unforgetable atmosphere at Villa Park but all for the right reasons. The only issue is the number of Celtic fans that would want to attend the game, so the most logical solution would be to have two games, one at Villa Park and one at Parkhead. I for one hope it can be arranged.
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Stan and his family must be fully consulted at all stages and hopefully he is well enough to attend, I would love to see a two legged event and the winners presented with the Petrov Cup by the man himself. Admission prices £19 at each game, maybe with a Villa v Celtic old stars game before the main event.
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Obviously there would be a large contingent from Celtic that would want to attend along with plenty of Villa fans so how about playing it half way between the 2 at a larger capacity stadium where both sets of supporters get
50/50 allocation. Only Villa & Celtic can sell tickets to keep some control. Maybe moneybags citeh could allow the use of the Ethiad. Just a thought.
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The whole idea is spiralling a bit out of control with talk of neutral venues.
A game at each venue sounds the fairest way to do it given Stan's popularity at Celtic.
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Stan and his family must be fully consulted at all stages and hopefully he is well enough to attend, I would love to see a two legged event and the winners presented with the Petrov Cup by the man himself. Admission prices £19 at each game, maybe with a Villa v Celtic old stars game before the main event.
A two legged event would be a great idea. Also, the old stars game would be a good idea.
If it is allowed why not have a smaller sized replica of the European cup with both clubs engraved on it showing the european cup " Celtic Fc European cup winners 1967 winners" on one side and "Aston Villa European cup winners 1982" on the other side and headlined with "STILYIAN PETROV CUP" above them.
Both clubs could play for it.
The first match i think should be held at Villa Park.
As for politics, please don't bring it into this. I am ashamed of some of the idiots who still sing those reprehensible songs, as is the club and they are gradually being weeded out.
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I have read the threads and thought about this. I really believe that this could be the start of a great friendship between our clubs. It would be great for Stan it would raise money for a great cause.
This not about politics it is about a genuine feeling for a very decent man and allowing people to come together and feel that they can help in some way. I would look forward to sharing a few beers with our friends from across the Border.
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Make it annual, and stage it in turns.
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I struggle to understand that if anyone puts forward some reservations about this insane idea. The whole thread locking charade comes .
The simple fact is that outside of this little fraternity and the Brigada bunch .
It does not sit right , lets split the proceeds between Stan and tbe Victims from that night.
I am sure the Celtic lot wont mind . As you all say they are a decent bunch
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Lets ignore the politics and think about what is important - Stan and his illness and the fellow sufferers who will be helped. I have my views on the politics but it is completely irrelevant in this scenario. This is all in an excellent cause and it is absolutely diabolical that some people on here cannot see past these petty issues.
I think that the friendly is an excellent idea, especially if it is done over two legs with hopefully packed Villa and Celtic Parks.
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Sunny do us a favour leave the Brigada out of this.
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I fully respect the feelings of anybody for who the game does not `sit right`. I would suggest their best course of action is simply ignore the whole thing and stay away from any game organised. It would be a friendly and not a competitive fixture after all, so you will not be missing anything. If large numbers of people really feel uneasy about this idea they will not go, voting with their feet and thus reducing the attendance. For those who on principle could not go, please feel free to donate £19 direct to Lukaemia research or any other good cause as you see fit, or not.
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I struggle to understand that if anyone puts forward some reservations about this insane idea. The whole thread locking charade comes .
The simple fact is that outside of this little fraternity and the Brigada bunch .
It does not sit right , lets split the proceeds between Stan and tbe Victims from that night.
I am sure the Celtic lot wont mind . As you all say they are a decent bunch
Give it a rest, it's comments like this that will get this thread locked and most likely the reason the game would be difficult to put on.
This thread is about a game to show are respect to Stan and raise some money for leukaemia charities and nothing else.
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I struggle to understand that if anyone puts forward some reservations about this insane idea. The whole thread locking charade comes .
The simple fact is that outside of this little fraternity and the Brigada bunch .
It does not sit right , lets split the proceeds between Stan and tbe Victims from that night.
I am sure the Celtic lot wont mind . As you all say they are a decent bunch
What's Brigada got to do with anything? We haven't commented on this, anything that makes money for Petrov i will personally be happy with, wether its v celtic, bulgaria or sutton united.
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Make it annual, and stage it in turns.
I do like this. We could all wear our Villa/Celtic scarves and Support Stan T shirts (got mine yesterday). Using management speak, JFDI, and see what transpires - I'll attend along with my son.
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I struggle to understand that if anyone puts forward some reservations about this insane idea. The whole thread locking charade comes .
The simple fact is that outside of this little fraternity and the Brigada bunch .
It does not sit right , lets split the proceeds between Stan and tbe Victims from that night.
I am sure the Celtic lot wont mind . As you all say they are a decent bunch
FFS. Can you please just leave the political stuff out of this thread?
That's why we locked it. It wasn't a charade. It was because in a thread about raising money for a good cause, people (you, mostly) were banging on about politics - this is the least appropriate of threads for that.
If you want to discuss the poltiics of Ulster and Celtic, start a thread on OT for it, please.
So, I'll ask again, not here, please.
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I do like this. We could all wear our Villa/Celtic scarves and Support Stan T shirts
I've still got my half Villa, half Celtic ski hat that was all the rage on the Holte in the early 80s
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I know that I am swimming against the tide on this. I don’t expect others to agree with me, and I respect the views of those who think a Celtic friendly is a good idea.
I do think that some clear thinking is required. This is not a money issue for Stan, or his family, they are well provided for. Using his illness to raise awareness about Leukemia is a worthy cause in its own right – but not more so than the excellent work that we already do for Acorns Trust.
Stan’s illness as a catalyst to raise cash for leukemia research is fine, all donations welcome. But Celtic football club, and their support, carry far too much baggage for me and are unnecessary, and inappropriate, partners for a Birmingham football club.
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Half an half hats - eightiestastic!
Somewhere in the Birmingham area, I reckon someone has about 2000 of them left over from flogging them in 1988.
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FFS If Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness can from a coalition government together in Northern Ireland Aston Villa can play Celtic in a friendly.
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I know a lot of Celtic fans, both here and in Ireland, and I think the political side of things is being played up way too much, which is all I'll say on that side of it.
The game, quite obviously in my opinion, is simply a fantastic idea. The two legs, with an all stars game first, would just add to it. Stan doesn't need the money himself, but between us and Celtic that's around 100,000 tickets to be sold, and they will all go, at £19 a throw, plus whatever other fundraising ideas they can put together.
It's a real no brainer for me!
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FFS If Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness can from a coalition government together in Northern Ireland Aston Villa can play Celtic in a friendly.
This
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FFS If Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness can from a coalition government together in Northern Ireland Aston Villa can play Celtic in a friendly.
The difference is that the above two have moved on - a significant section of Celtic's support have not.
Pauliewalnuts has warned about the politicisation of this - but that is exactly what you get when Celtic are involved.
I have no wish to rock the boat. I do think that the dangers of this proposal are currentlly being artificially subsumed under a wholly appropriate wave of goodwill for Stan - and all those with, and touched by, Leukemia.
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Surely if there is a large enough group who don't want Celtic at VP, then we should look for another opponent? The idea is too raise as much cash for a Leukaemia charity as possible, now if bringing Celtic down is going to stop some of our fans wanting to attend then we should look elsewhere.
Like I've mentioned in the locked thread how about a XI or Stans former teammates: Berbatov, Young, Martin Petrov etc and maybe get Stoichkov in to manage it?
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I think the whole episode is starting to run away with itself. Talking of having a annual "cup" to play for & creating "alliances" with the Celtic or any other club is ridiculous. Celtic, as have Rangers, have allegiances with many clubs already, usually Liverpool & Man Utd in England, but St Pauli in Hamburg which is questionable, & I would rather we keep our independence and identity.
I also find it uncomfortable as its the sort of thing that is done in honour of some ones life as opposed to Stan beating the disease.
If the game comes off then it will be personal choice if people wish to attend, if politics are kept out of it by the Celtic supporters then great, but I hope that alcohol does not become a troublesome factor.
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Rangers sing offensive songs too but I'd be all for a fixture with them to raise money for a good cause. I'd realise songs about the famine are just songs and that most of the Rangers support that sing them don't know what they are talking about.
Same applies to Celtic. Crikey, even our beloved Aston Villa have fans that can display moronic tendencies but I wouldn't want us all to be damaged by association.
Maybe it's best this tie isn't played actually. I didn't realise how much of an issue It'd be and I wouldn't want something that thousands of people haven't a clue about becoming the source of vitriol for those same thousands of people.
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FFS If Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness can from a coalition government together in Northern Ireland Aston Villa can play Celtic in a friendly.
The difference is that the above two have moved on - a significant section of Celtic's support have not.
Pauliewalnuts has warned about the politicistation of this - but that is exactly what you get when Celtic are involved.
I have no wish to rock the boat. I do think that the dangers of this proposal are currentlly being artificially subsumed under a wholly appropriate wave of goodwill for Stan - and all those with, and touched by, Leukemia.
How come we've been able to play Celtic in the past without any of this raisng its head before? As far as I can make out the only "dangers" would come from from some of our fans who seem to hold a grudge against Celtic. It would be disappointing if such a minority would put a halt to the most appropriate way of raising funds and supporting Stan.
Just going back to what VillaBobby is saying; you are right about the St. Pauli/Hamburg connections re Rangers/Celtic, attempts have been made among certain sections of their fans to mirror the Glasgow rivalry. Liverpool and Man Utd have no such allegiances with either Glasgow club as far as I know and I genuinely don't think there is any desire among Villa fans to form any nonsensical "allegiance" either. Of course, we do have some extreme elements following our club but they - I am sure - are very small in number and live in a world of their own.
In short, it would be a crying shame if the two clubs that Petrov has served for the bulk of his career could not get together in tribute. (If Petrov had played for Rangers I would be of the same opinion.) Let's not allow poisonous, outdated, bullshit politics to destroy a potentially beautiful and uplifting gesture.
Just to add, would it be worth running a poll to gauge opinion as to whether such a game would be worthwhile - maybe I am underestimating the genuine concerns, in which case I hold my hands up.
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I say do a poll. I am sure the club monitor sites such as this to gauge opinions. H & V is only a small number of Villa fans overall, and not necessarily entirely representative. Indeed, I would not want the club making decisions based on polls here or anywhere else but lets see which way the wind blows and how strong.
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FFS If Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness can from a coalition government together in Northern Ireland Aston Villa can play Celtic in a friendly.
The difference is that the above two have moved on - a significant section of Celtic's support have not.
Pauliewalnuts has warned about the politicistation of this - but that is exactly what you get when Celtic are involved.
I have no wish to rock the boat. I do think that the dangers of this proposal are currentlly being artificially subsumed under a wholly appropriate wave of goodwill for Stan - and all those with, and touched by, Leukemia.
How come we've been able to play Celtic in the past without any of this raisng its head before? As far as I can make out the only "dangers" would come from from some of our fans who seem to hold a grudge against Celtic. It would be disappointing if such a minority would put a halt to the most appropriate way of raising funds and supporting Stan.
Just going back to what VillaBobby is saying; you are right about the St. Pauli/Hamburg connections re Rangers/Celtic, attempts have been made among certain sections of their fans to mirror the Glasgow rivalry. Liverpool and Man Utd have no such allegiances with either Glasgow club as far as I know and I genuinely don't think there is any desire among Villa fans to form any nonsensical "allegiance" either. Of course, we do have some extreme elements following our club but they - I am sure - are very small in number and live in a world of their own.
In short, it would be a crying shame if the two clubs that Petrov has served for the bulk of his career could not get together in tribute. (If Petrov had played for Rangers I would be of the same opinion.) Let's not allow poisonous, outdated, bullshit politics to destroy a potentially beautiful and uplifting gesture.
Just to add, would it be worth running a poll to gauge opinion as to whether such a game would be worthwhile - maybe I am underestimating the genuine concerns, in which case I hold my hands up.
I am not sure that playing a pre-season friendly in 1984, of which probably a few hundred from Birmingham would have attended the game in Glasgow, actually represents the potential opinion of the people of Birmingham. Brummies will see it's city visited, its city centre & its pubs, then taken locally to Villa Park with a potential for unrest due to political or sectarian chanting or songs, which are offensive. Any club with vocal & visual support has always been welcome at Villa Park & illuminated the city centre, ala, Bilbao, who's representation where brilliant, drank wine from leather pouches all game & added to a fantastic visual & football experience.
I am not trying to drag any political or sectarian nonsense into this thread but trying to highlight that there is still a sense of anger towards the plight of some of our fellow Brummies that will be offended by such behaviour.
If assurances, which I doubt possible, can be given that such actions would not be present, then Celtic FC & its supporters would be more than welcome in Birmingham, as we have a large Irish community that would also welcome such a visit and the day & game could be played & witnessed in the spirit intended.
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Here's a suggestion. How about those who think that who we play against is more important than why we're playing them just stay at home and don't go to the game.
I lived in Manchester and worked in the city centre when United played Celtic for Brian Mclair's testimonial, Mark Hughes' testimonial and Captain Marvel's testimonial and there was a great atmosphere for all 3 games.
Fuck me, we're talking about a friendly game here to support a player who has represented both clubs.
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VillaBobby you do understand that Bilbao have one of the most politicised supports in world football? The club itself has a Basque only signing policy.
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Villa v Brazil :)
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We love Stan and would love this game to be played. Celtic fans love Stan and want the game to be played so surely on that alone there should be a great atmosphere that's all about Stan.
Also if there are any Celtic fans who would be here just to sing sectarian song and show any kind of support to the IRA they would be in a minority and the majority of the Celtic fans would be at the game for the same reason we are.
Hope who ever are trying to organise this game don't read this thread because they would definitely think twice.
To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
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Here's a suggestion. How about those who think that who we play against is more important than why we're playing them just stay at home and don't go to the game.
I lived in Manchester and worked in the city centre when United played Celtic for Brian Mclair's testimonial, Mark Hughes' testimonial and Captain Marvel's testimonial and there was a great atmosphere for all 3 games.
Fuck me, we're talking about a friendly game here to support a player who has represented both clubs.
Well said
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To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
Exactly what I asked them to do, but got ignored.
So, can we keep this to discussion of the game, and start a thread in OT on the politics of Rangers / Celtic instead?
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I think it was Martin from Japan who posted a very insightful timeline into how any thread involving the words 'Celtic & Rangers' usually evolved.
EDIT- Nope, cant find it but trust me it was f'in funny.
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Should be at Villa Park because Celtic have bigger away support than us.
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FIFA 12 has spoken.
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Play the game against Celtic and give the money to Rangers.Happy days.
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To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
Exactly what I asked them to do, but got ignored.
So, can we keep this to discussion of the game, and start a thread in OT on the politics of Rangers / Celtic instead?
Paulie, you will be pleased to know that I will duck out of this after this contribution.I have studiously avoided spelling out the politics.
This isn't about Celtic/Rangers. This is about Celtic's relationship with Britain and Birmingham.
The whole point is that with Celtic, it is about more than the game. Ignore that, and you cannot have a discussion about the merits of the game.
We all wish Stan well.
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Garyfouroaks, I appreciate that it's insensitive of me to respond to your above post but Celtic are a British club. Some of their supporters sing about something they know little about because it annoys their rivals who also sing about a subject that they are quite ignorant about. A lot villa fans don't approve of the Paul McGrath song but it still gets sung. Should a recovering alcoholic thus be offended by Aston Villa FC? Let's try and see the bigger picture here.
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Spot on Irish Villain.
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I'm with garyfouroaks on this one! I wont go antwhere near Villa Park if THAT club are invited down to play a friendly!! I've had the misfortune of seeing what "jolly craicsters" their anti-British support are on more than one occasision & I'd like to think there's no room for it at Villa Park!!
Why dont we play CSKA Sofia instead??
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/s320x320/559348_174265512693474_170475779739114_256966_232432404_n.jpg)
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This thread is immensely depressing.
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This thread is immensely depressing.
Never was the expression Little Englander so appropriate.
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This thread is immensely depressing.
Isn't it.
Two clubs with a shared goal of raising money for a worthy cause on behalf of a player they both hold in the highest regard yet still some people just cannot keep their prejudices to themselves.
Shame.
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If a charity match was to take place, what percentage of the takings would a charity actually receive? On top of the usual costs for a game, the bill for policing this one would be enormous. I would prefer to stick my 19 quid in an envelope and send it direct to a charity who would get it all.
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VillaBobby you do understand that Bilbao have one of the most politicised supports in world football? The club itself has a Basque only signing policy.
The ETA haven't bombed Birmingham though!
For what it's worth, my feelings are that we should wait until Stan is through it all until any game is played – be it in Brum or Glasgow. I'm sure everyone means well but I do feel Stan and his family should be left to concentrate 100% on what is of most importance over the next few months, or however long it takes. Being the type of guy Stan is he'd insist on getting involved in some way if a game was planned - or at least be feeling as though he should - when he could probably do without any added stress.
I really don't know the timescale involved but I would imagine the worst time for him physically will be over the next few months.
Let's just keep up the 19 mins applause and support for him, and work something out with Celtic when Stan's well enough to be involved.
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If a charity match was to take place, what percentage of the takings would a charity actually receive? On top of the usual costs for a game, the bill for policing this one would be enormous. I would prefer to stick my 19 quid in an envelope and send it direct to a charity who would get it all.
Totally agree with this!!
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Garyfouroaks, I appreciate that it's insensitive of me to respond to your above post but Celtic are a British club. Some of their supporters sing about something they know little about because it annoys their rivals who also sing about a subject that they are quite ignorant about. A lot villa fans don't approve of the Paul McGrath song but it still gets sung. Should a recovering alcoholic thus be offended by Aston Villa FC? Let's try and see the bigger picture here.
Well said Irish villain.
I've posted on this thread a few times now about how too many people are letting the politics get in the way of what could be a truly top moment for the football family and not just us and Celtic.
It's time to make it clear where I'm coming from on this, my dad and his best mate (who is now my stepdad, yeah I know its all very Jeremy Kyle) lost two of there best mates in the pub bombings and for years I've had them both banging on on about the IRA, sectarianism and about how We should hate Celtic, I Actually like Rangers not that it's got fuck all to with politics, I loved watching Lazio on 4 and i loved Gascoigne and so when he went to Rangers I started following them, I'm also massive fan of Larsson and Lambert and raved about Stan before we signed him.
Ive spoken to both my dad(season ticket holder for nearly 20 years befoe AM) and my step dad, a man who never cared about football but is now a massive villa fan thanks to me dragging him all over the place to watch us, over the last couple of days about Stan and this potential match and even they agree it would be a tremendous show of are support to Stan and a great way of supporting any charities that will benefit from this match.
A lot of people posting on here are starting to remind of Liverpool fans. They can't play an FA Cup semi final on a Sunday because they can't let something in the past go and we can't play a friendly against Celtic to show respect for our captain because some people done a fucked up thing decades ago to show there political beliefs.
Eventually we all just have to move on, something's are just more important.
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This thread is immensely depressing.
Pathetic isn't it?
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First and foremost I want Stan to get well, and get well soon. The idea behind this game is clearly well intentioned, as is I believe peoples reasons for not wanting it.
I've been to two Rangers v Celtic games, one at Ibrox, one at Celtic Park, both games in the Rangers 'end'. Not because I have any political or religious leanings as I don't. I went in the Rangers end in both games as that is where I got the tickets, I would have been more than happy to be in the Celtic end. On both occasions when I've been to these games it has made me realise that these games are not just about football. The chants, the songs, between both clubs, from both sets of fans was vile. So why am I mentioning it here? Well, as far as I can see it, Villa fans want to have this game to support our captain, Celtic fans want to come because of their admiration and respect for their old player and show their support.
Celtic fans, are showing a high degree of sensitivity in wanting to come and support Stan, why would they want to come to Villa Park to cause problems about something that happened in our city years before most of them were probably born? As for some of our morons knowing Celtic fans are in town, I doubt they go looking for trouble down in Digbeth when they fancy a ruck.
I've thought long and hard about this, the longer I think about it, the more I think it should happen (If it is what Stan and his family would like) It would be OUR responsibility, as decent, law abiding football supporters to ensure WE play our part in making the game a special occassion for Stan, it would be Celtic supporters responsibility to do the same. It wouldn't do us, Celtic fans or most importantly Stiliyan Petrov any good at all if there was problems.
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This is Birmingham, the city which every year holds the worlds third biggest St. Patrick's Day parade. Beaten only by Dublin and New York. And a great day out it is too, enjoyed by a large cross section of the city's population.
I'm pretty certain that if this match went ahead a large proportion of the away tickets would end up in the hands of the Brummie Irish population who are obviously proud of their Irish ancestry and also proud to live in our city. So I can't see them causing any problems.
It's already been said many times that somethings are more important than football, I say that this match is more important than outdated politics and bigotry from either side.
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Yes this is not about bigoted politics, it won't be when the offensive anti English / British vitriol is spewed either, just about ignorance and alcohol.
But we all know it will happen.
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This is Birmingham, the city which every year holds the worlds third biggest St. Patrick's Day parade. Beaten only by Dublin and New York. And a great day out it is too, enjoyed by a large cross section of the city's population.
And I'm not aware of it ever coming under attack from mobs of fervent Orangemen. Ask around at Villa Park on Monday and see how many (or rather, how few) associate Celtic with anything other than football.
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Can we have a poll please ?
I suggest the choices are...1. One off game at Villa
2. One off game at Celtic
3. Two legged affair
4. One off game at neutral venue
5. No game should be played
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Yes this is not about bigoted politics, it won't be when the offensive anti English / British vitriol is spewed either, just about ignorance and alcohol.
But we all know it will happen.
Do we? Thanks for clearing that up.
You'll always get drunken twats talking bollocks, no matter who the teams are. Do we just not bother because of an idiotic minority?
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To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
Exactly what I asked them to do, but got ignored.
So, can we keep this to discussion of the game, and start a thread in OT on the politics of Rangers / Celtic instead?
It's this kind of stupidity that leads people in this country to vote in a government that acts in the interest of the 500,000 richest people to the exclusion of all else and then has the same people who ask why there are riots, mass unemployment no services and the NHs has been privatised as if they didnt think that would happen. They are not separatable issues.
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I wonder if McLeish would be less popular in the home or away leg?
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To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
Exactly what I asked them to do, but got ignored.
So, can we keep this to discussion of the game, and start a thread in OT on the politics of Rangers / Celtic instead?
It's this kind of stupidity that leads people in this country to vote in a government that acts in the interest of the 500,000 richest people to the exclusion of all else and then has the same people who ask why there are riots, mass unemployment no services and the NHs has been privatised as if they didnt think that would happen. They are not separatable issues.
I cant stand the Tories, but what exactly does George Osbournes budget and the policies of the Cameron/Clegg coalition have to do with Stiliyan Petrov getting Leukaemia and a lot of well meaning people wanting to raise a million quid towards research ? I think if people have a mind you could start a thread on any topic at all and within about three steps appear to link it to almost anything else going on in the world. I think the above comment more than amply demonstrates that.
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I wonder if McLeish would be less popular in the home or away leg?
I think as its a friendly you could bring in guest managers for the game.
I would like to suggest Martin O'Neill and Billy McNeill, but I haven't decided which way round would be more interesting yet.
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I wonder if McLeish would be less popular in the home or away leg?
I think as its a friendly you could bring in guest managers for the game.
I would like to suggest Martin O'Neill and Billy McNeill, but I haven't decided which way round would be more interesting yet.
Good idea and we should do the same with players. We'll have McInally, they can have Cascarino
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Yes this is not about bigoted politics, it won't be when the offensive anti English / British vitriol is spewed either, just about ignorance and alcohol.
But we all know it will happen.
Do we? Thanks for clearing that up.
You'll always get drunken twats talking bollocks, no matter who the teams are. Do we just not bother because of an idiotic minority?
I hate to keep referring back to the point, but some seem either ignorant or in denial.
Celtic support of the IRA is not minority pastime, it's the majority. I can state this from experience of several Celtic games and a Roman Catholic Glaswegian family.
Now stop trying to be patronising.
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Yes this is not about bigoted politics, it won't be when the offensive anti English / British vitriol is spewed either, just about ignorance and alcohol.
But we all know it will happen.
Do we? Thanks for clearing that up.
You'll always get drunken twats talking bollocks, no matter who the teams are. Do we just not bother because of an idiotic minority?
I hate to keep referring back to the point, but some seem either ignorant or in denial.
Celtic support of the IRA is not minority pastime, it's the majority. I can state this from experience of several Celtic games and a Roman Catholic Glaswegian family.
Now stop trying to be patronising.
Where do you live, Bobby? Because from my Edinburgh point of view all the Celtic fans I know (I know far too many) couldn't really give a shit about all that stuff. Bit, shall we say, old school.
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This is Birmingham, the city which every year holds the worlds third biggest St. Patrick's Day parade. Beaten only by Dublin and New York. And a great day out it is too, enjoyed by a large cross section of the city's population.
And I'm not aware of it ever coming under attack from mobs of fervent Orangemen. Ask around at Villa Park on Monday and see how many (or rather, how few) associate Celtic with anything other than football.
What time and where will you start the canvassing?
You still miss the point, this is not about Brummie opinion, as most have already said, Celtic FC would represent a spectacular and very interesting game with 2 sides from either side of the border.
What I question and will guarantee, is the support that comes from Glasgow, even more unfortunate is theplastic paddy Irish contingent who live in Brum,is the ignorance and glorying songs that support a terrorist organisation that killed and maimed my fellow Brummies.
That will never be welcome.
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it's a right shame that this thread is threatening to go all political again. This is a proposal for a friendly to help a player that is loved by two sets of supporters. What moron would bring political allegiances into that? This isn't the 1970's or 80's. It's a game to help out a former player. How about we give the great, great majority of good Celtic fans the benefit of the doubt that they would treat the occasion accordingly.
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I will set up a separate thread in Off Topic for political observations. Please keep this thread to the original intent.
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I hate to keep referring back......
I hate it too. I don't think I have ever got in a slanging match in two years on this forum and I don't intend starting now but I am now thoroughly pissed off and totally fed up.
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Yes this is not about bigoted politics, it won't be when the offensive anti English / British vitriol is spewed either, just about ignorance and alcohol.
But we all know it will happen.
Do we? Thanks for clearing that up.
You'll always get drunken twats talking bollocks, no matter who the teams are. Do we just not bother because of an idiotic minority?
I hate to keep referring back to the point, but some seem either ignorant or in denial.
Celtic support of the IRA is not minority pastime, it's the majority. I can state this from experience of several Celtic games and a Roman Catholic Glaswegian family.
Now stop trying to be patronising.
Where do you live, Bobby? Because from my Edinburgh point of view all the Celtic fans I know (I know far too many) couldn't really give a shit about all that stuff. Bit, shall we say, old school.
I live in Birmingham mate. I am proud of my heritage etc and my parents were staunch Scots.
But I also have experienced having a beer around Parkhead and witnessed the vitriol that comes with it. The barrowlands has pubs awash with the tricolour, that's fine if they wee welcoming to none REpublicans, but they are not.
I am not trying to be counterproductive to the actual sentiment, but I know what reaction will be created by such bigotry in a city tat was blighted.
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I will set up a separate thread in Off Topic for political observations. Please keep this thread to the original intent.
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I hate to keep referring back......
I hate it too. I don't think I have ever got in a slanging match in two years on this forum and I don't intend starting now but I am now thoroughly pissed off and totally fed up.
I was not aware there was a slanging match and if you feel so then I will refrain from commenting anymore.
These forums are about debate and opinion but shouldn't cross the line of becoming offensive or insulting.
UTV.
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To all the people posting about the politics why don't you start a seperate thread and discuss it there?
Exactly what I asked them to do, but got ignored.
So, can we keep this to discussion of the game, and start a thread in OT on the politics of Rangers / Celtic instead?
It's this kind of stupidity that leads people in this country to vote in a government that acts in the interest of the 500,000 richest people to the exclusion of all else and then has the same people who ask why there are riots, mass unemployment no services and the NHs has been privatised as if they didnt think that would happen. They are not separatable issues.
I cant stand the Tories, but what exactly does George Osbournes budget and the policies of the Cameron/Clegg coalition have to do with Stiliyan Petrov getting Leukaemia and a lot of well meaning people wanting to raise a million quid towards research ? I think if people have a mind you could start a thread on any topic at all and within about three steps appear to link it to almost anything else going on in the world. I think the above comment more than amply demonstrates that.
Nothing. I am very sorry Stan has leukaemia; I am all in favour of well meaning people raising money for leukaemia research and on balance I am probably in favour of a Villa - Celtic friendly to that end to which I would probably like to go. My observation was that to pretend it has no political dimension was stupid and suggested that it was comparable to - not linked to - the millions on low income who voted in the tories who are now moaning about the policies they are implementing.
I understand why there is anti-republican sentiment in Birmingham - my Aunt was on duty for St Johns that night and saw the aftermath - and that is germane to the discussion of the game. I would like to think that in this situation everyone could rise above their bigotries so that something good could come out of it.
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I will set up a separate thread in Off Topic for political observations. Please keep this thread to the original intent.
*cough* Other Football
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I initially considered putting it in Other Football but opted for OT. Either is fine.
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Not seen this elsewhere but I see it all kicked of at Carrow Road. Shocking stuff.
http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/forums/2727973/ShowPost.aspx
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Not seen this elsewhere but I see it all kicked of at Carrow Road. Shocking stuff.
http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/forums/2727973/ShowPost.aspx
Sounds great - when are they coming to VP for the SP fundraiser?
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I know that we have more pressing matters at the moment, but does anyone know if the possibility of a Villa v Celtic pre season match is still being explored?
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I know that we have more pressing matters at the moment, but does anyone know if the possibility of a Villa v Celtic pre season match is still being explored?
Heard nothing. But if its pre season on a weekend, then looking at our schedule it would have to be 28th/29th July weekend.
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Not seen this elsewhere but I see it all kicked of at Carrow Road. Shocking stuff.
http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/forums/2727973/ShowPost.aspx
Perhaps it's been edited, but it sounds like a love-in?
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Nice article here with Lambert and his relationship Stan. Looks like they will be pursuing the Celtic friendly game. Also Stan to remain club captain which is a nice touch.
http://www.sundaymercury.net/midlands-sport/aston-villa-fc/aston-villa-fc-news/2012/06/10/aston-villa-stiliyan-petrov-to-remain-club-captain-paul-lambert-66331-31149246
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Honestly I hope not. While football fans are always welcome, Celtic fans unfortunately insist on making it not about football, they will bring banners and songs that are offensive to the victims of atrocities in our city.
I would sooner they set up a charity drive of some sort.
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Great. This again.
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Has the city of Norwich recovered from their rape and pillaging yet?
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Has the city of Norwich recovered from their rape and pillaging yet?
Are we talking about the Vikings?
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Has the city of Norwich recovered from their rape and pillaging yet?
Not quite. I went on one of their messageboards the other day and they were still whinging and wailing about it. They've even started calling us Vile now.
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Has the city of Norwich recovered from their rape and pillaging yet?
Kind of. There's talk about opening up a Norwich branch of the Celtic Supporters Club, playing them in a friendly every season, lots of kissing, cuddling and talk of "my new second team".
I did warn you it would be a love-in.
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Must remember to make some half-Villa, half-Celtic scarves, with 'The Fields of Aston Park/Villa Park' on the back.