Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Matthius on June 07, 2011, 02:05:17 PM
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Martin Laursen has told the OS that he wants to manage the villa in the future, And is starting his coaching course in December, This new manager may only be for a few years until HRH Laursen completes his course gets his badges and walks in to villa park again.
Discuss :)
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Would we take Laursen straight after he'd just walked out of manager college?
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When will we stop talking about our former manager, he's gone, get over it.
Oh, hang on...
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I have a dream...
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with a decent assistant i'd let him start today. he knows the passion of the fans, understands the team and knows the players. He is the perfect choice imo.
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with a decent assistant i'd let him start today. he knows the passion of the fans, understands the team and knows the players. He is the perfect choice imo.
You did spot the fact that he hasn't actually ever coached before?
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I'd be interested to see how he does in a more modest position initially, but as a character he does seem to have an appropriate blend of intelligence, passion, and experience, to be a good manager. Its significant that despite his experience in Italy, and his injury problems whilst with us, he played more games for us than any other club during his career.
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with a decent assistant i'd let him start today. he knows the passion of the fans, understands the team and knows the players. He is the perfect choice imo.
You did spot the fact that he hasn't actually ever coached before?
Yes but thats why there is the need for the "Decent" assistant. To help him on his path. he knows the players and knows how much the team means to the fans. He would be perfect.
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Maybe bring him in as the assistant for a few years then see how he copes then make him boss :)
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Other than him being fondly remembered by the supporters, the idea of giving the manager's job to Martin Laursen has nothing to commend it.
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Just give him the job. I don't care if he takes us down.
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with a decent assistant i'd let him start today. he knows the passion of the fans, understands the team and knows the players. He is the perfect choice imo.
You did spot the fact that he hasn't actually ever coached before?
Pfft, who needs experience when you understand passion?
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If he wants it and the new man is keen on him I'd offer him a decent job in the coaching staff to help him learn and develop as a coach. Don't think he is ready to be the manager yet but he can be one in the future.
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with a decent assistant i'd let him start today. he knows the passion of the fans, understands the team and knows the players. He is the perfect choice imo.
You did spot the fact that he hasn't actually ever coached before?
Pfft, who needs experience when you understand passion?
My point exactly :) i hope you were being serious ? and it wasnt sarcasm ?
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If he wants it and the new man is keen on him I'd offer him a decent job in the coaching staff to help him learn and develop as a coach. Don't think he is ready to be the manager yet but he can be one in the future.
Absolutely agree. We have been crying out for a defensive coach.
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Other than him being fondly remembered by the supporters, the idea of giving the manager's job to Martin Laursen has nothing to commend it.
Without a doubt.
Let him get some success at other clubs under his belt, before we even consider it.
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Get him in for a junior coaching job whilst he does his badges and assess his capability, willingness and commitment to the role. Then take a view.
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Get him in for a junior coaching job whilst he does his badges and assess his capability, willingness and commitment to the role. Then take a view.
Perfect idea !!!!!!!
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nice to read his comments about his affiliation with the club. I for one have been championing him as Villa boss for ages! Hope it happens.
UP THE VILLA
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I'm sure at one point fans of Porto were dismissing the idea od appointing Bobby Robson's interpreter as their manager. Hughes had no management experience when he took the Wales job.
My point being that all managers, good bad or indifferent, start somewhere. I like the idea of someone with the club in their blood getting a go, instead of the same old names always being linked, so why not try something different?
Have him as manager to instill some passion and hunger to the side, have Sid and K-Mac as his coaches and get a DOF in to give them guidance and handle the scouting and transfers.
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Based on what, exactly?
Why do so many people think that a manager will be a roaring success just because he played for a club? I don't get it.
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7/10 times it tends to work man with a stick. :-\
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While we're at it, how about jobs for Dion Dublin, Gary Shaw and Ugo Ehiogu?
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I'm sure at one point fans of Porto were dismissing the idea od appointing Bobby Robson's interpreter as their manager. Hughes had no management experience when he took the Wales job.
My point being that all managers, good bad or indifferent, start somewhere. I like the idea of someone with the club in their blood getting a go, instead of the same old names always being linked, so why not try something different?
Because it would be based on hope or guesswork. And it's too big a job to be given to someone whose suitability to manage a club, let alone a Premier League club, you have absolutely no idea about.
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I'm sure at one point fans of Porto were dismissing the idea od appointing Bobby Robson's interpreter as their manager. Hughes had no management experience when he took the Wales job.
My point being that all managers, good bad or indifferent, start somewhere. I like the idea of someone with the club in their blood getting a go, instead of the same old names always being linked, so why not try something different?
Because it would be based on hope or guesswork. And it's too big a job to be given to someone whose suitability to manage a club, let alone a Premier League club, you have absolutely no idea about.
His suitability would be ascertained by the interview process. As I said every manager started somewhere, so if he has the passion and intelligence to convince the club he'll be a great manager for us, why wait for him to have a few jobs elsewhere to prove it as opposed to backing our own judgement and giving him the job?
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I'm sure at one point fans of Porto were dismissing the idea od appointing Bobby Robson's interpreter as their manager. Hughes had no management experience when he took the Wales job.
My point being that all managers, good bad or indifferent, start somewhere. I like the idea of someone with the club in their blood getting a go, instead of the same old names always being linked, so why not try something different?
Because it would be based on hope or guesswork. And it's too big a job to be given to someone whose suitability to manage a club, let alone a Premier League club, you have absolutely no idea about.
Exactly. One of the problems these days is that too many clubs give jobs to ex-players before they've proved their worth lower down the leagues. Look at Newcastle and Shearer, I'm sure they hoped that their legendary player was going to inspire them to stay up. In fact he was shit, Newcastle were shit, and down they went. All of our decent managers (eg Taylor, Atkinson, Little, O'Neill) learned their trade at the coal face.
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His suitability would be ascertained by the interview process.
Blimey, do you ever have to take people on in your role John?
"So Mr Smith, tell me what makes you think you'll be a great computer programmer."
"Well, I love computers. Computing's in my blood!"
"Have you any experience?"
"No"
"When can you start?!"
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This is one of the reasons that I keep banging on about having a DoF.
One of his main jobs would be to coach the coaches establishing a "Villa way". I just do not see how the traditional manger would have the time for this sort of role.
The likes of Laursen would happily manage a youth team whilst learning the nitty gritty of management from an experienced guy. If he if is good at it then he can be promoted through the ranks.
Job's a good un.
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Shearer at Newcastle was the last desperate gamble of a doomed club, which is quite different to this.
With the right coaches and a DOF, it could be a real inovative and successful move for us.
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7/10 times it tends to work man with a stick. :-\
Really? Have you got a link to the study that shows this?
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His suitability would be ascertained by the interview process.
Blimey, do you ever have to take people on in your role John?
As it happens I don't, but if it was just a matter of experience why would you bother interviewing as opposed to just picking someone from the CVs that come in? And who'd ever be able to get a managers job once they stop playing?
I'm not saying that he'll be the next great manager a la Fergie or Mourinho, but if a suitable target isn't available I'd prefer we try something like this than go more the likes of McLaren.
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What could he point to at interview that would indicate he not only knew exactly what it took to be a successful manager of a Premier League club but that he also knew how to carry it out? I'm not saying it's impossible John but the likelihood is that he would be a failure.
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It would be insanity to take somebody on with zero management experience.
I love Martin as much as anybody, but it takes more than passion to run a Premier League club.
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What could he point to at interview that would indicate he not only knew exactly what it took to be a successful manager of a Premier League club but that he also knew how to carry it out?
Well, he could talk about what he has learnt from the managers he has played under, about his vision for how he'd like us to play, where he sees the weaknesses in our side are and how he'd go about fixing them.
I think he'd make a good manager as he speaks intelligently and also has a real passion about him, which should combine to make him a great motivator, which is a key component of football management. As I said good coaches like Sid and K-Mac can help with the technical side of things he'd have little experience of and a DOF to guide him through the transfer market.
It's pretty accademic as I don't expect this to happen, but I do think it's not the 'doomed to failiure' move others do.
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If he needs two coaches to help with the technical side, and a DoF to do the transfer market bit, what does he do as manager?
Laursen was a great player for us, but he's got a long, long way to go before he should ever be considered as our manager.
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Which manager would have him as no 2.
We never tried an unknown manager or player manager. We always have a manager with some experience. I know We should have Martin as manager with Sir Brian Little as no 2. Can that work.
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Gareth Southgate was an intelligent lad who was a great defender for Villa. Anybody like to see his name mentioned as taking over?
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Gareth Southgate was an intelligent lad who was a great defender for Villa. Anybody like to see his name mentioned as taking over?
That's because he wasn't a very good manager at Middleborough, but just because one ex centre half didn't take to management does not mean another one won't.
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Gareth Southgate was an intelligent lad who was a great defender for Villa. Anybody like to see his name mentioned as taking over?
That's because he wasn't a very good manager at Middleborough, but just because one ex centre half didn't take to management does not mean another one won't.
Well, let's let Laursen prove himself elsewhere before we let sentiment get in the way off good sense.
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He should try a danish team or work in our academy to learn the rope, and be ready to step in when we need to replace the manager after the new one. (That probably be about 9 years)
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Gareth Southgate was an intelligent lad who was a great defender for Villa. Anybody like to see his name mentioned as taking over?
That's because he wasn't a very good manager at Middleborough, but just because one ex centre half didn't take to management does not mean another one won't.
One reason so many successful players don't make it in management is that they get thrown into management at too high a level to start with.
Southgate, who is undoubtedly intelligent and erudite, is now considered to be a failure in management, having started out in too big a job. Shearer, having taken the Newcastle job even for a short while, is going to be considered the same way, I imagine.
I understand why players take jobs like those when they're offered as a first step into management - it must be flattering - but I wonder how many potentially really good managers get ruined by going that way, rather than starting off and learning their trade further down the leagues.
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
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Gareth Southgate was an intelligent lad who was a great defender for Villa. Anybody like to see his name mentioned as taking over?
That's because he wasn't a very good manager at Middleborough, but just because one ex centre half didn't take to management does not mean another one won't.
One reason so many successful players don't make it in management is that they get thrown into management at too high a level to start with.
Southgate, who is undoubtedly intelligent and erudite, is now considered to be a failure in management, having started out in too big a job. Shearer, having taken the Newcastle job even for a short while, is going to be considered the same way, I imagine.
I understand why players take jobs like those when they're offered as a first step into management - it must be flattering - but I wonder how many potentially really good managers get ruined by going that way, rather than starting off and learning their trade further down the leagues.
That's the point I was making earlier. Of all the Premier League managers, how many are ex-players who went straight from a top side into management, and how many cut their teeth elsewhere?
You've got managers like Redknapp, Hodgson, Bruce and even Martinez who have managed in the lower leagues. Then you've got the aforementioned Southgate, Shearer and also Roy Keane who stepped straight into jobs at big clubs, and all failed.
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
From a team further down the league, where all the decent current managers have come from, which is the whole point. Let Laursen go and be a coach somewhere for a year, then get a manager's job at somewhere like Sheffield Wednesday for a couple of years. That'll tell you far more about his ability than giving him £30m to play with in the Premier League.
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
That's fair enough, but when they're tried out at the higher levels of the game, and fail, they very rarely recover, because they're so stigmatised by high profile failure
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I think it was Alan Sugar who said that a famous, recently retired Ex-International came to him for an interview for the Spurs Manager position.
Sugar asked what qualities he had for the job, he replied
'I was a top, international footballer.'
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Hes danish,having lived there for 5 years,all the people seem to be hard working,smart and diligent and he loves the Villa.Got to be a start hasnt it?
How about G.T. all director of football and M.L. as team manager?
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
From a team further down the league, where all the decent current managers have come from, which is the whole point. Let Laursen go and be a coach somewhere for a year, then get a manager's job at somewhere like Sheffield Wednesday for a couple of years. That'll tell you far more about his ability than giving him £30m to play with in the Premier League.
Playing devils advocate here really. But just say this happens and he is a raging success. So good infact that the likes of Madrid, Barcelona, etc come a calling. Would we still be able to secure his services then?
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
That's fair enough, but when they're tried out at the higher levels of the game, and fail, they very rarely recover, because they're so stigmatised by high profile failure
Yet every now and then, someone doesn't fail. What it takes is not only the person themselves, but someone with the vision to see the potential greatness just lurking below the surface.
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I'll tell you what, with Martin at the helm we'd have the meanest and most organized defense in the league, still a few years away though...
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WE HAVE A MESSIAH!
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7/10 times it tends to work man with a stick. :-\
Sorry, I stand corrected.
David Platt was twice the player that Laursen was, why not give him a crack first?
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And since when did we start referring to Laursen as "God"?!
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So then, once every great manager in existence today has shuffled off their mortal coil- that will be the end of football as we know it?
Just where is the next exceptional manager going to come from, if no-one is willing to try out someone with no experience, but great intelligence, passion and knowledge of the game?
Not necessarily saying it's Martin, but who knows?
From a team further down the league, where all the decent current managers have come from, which is the whole point. Let Laursen go and be a coach somewhere for a year, then get a manager's job at somewhere like Sheffield Wednesday for a couple of years. That'll tell you far more about his ability than giving him £30m to play with in the Premier League.
Playing devils advocate here really. But just say this happens and he is a raging success. So good infact that the likes of Madrid, Barcelona, etc come a calling. Would we still be able to secure his services then?
That's about as likely as Guardiola getting on a private jet to talk to Randy Lerner tomorrow. How many of the European giants have appointed a manager from the English lower leagues, however well they've done? I don't see Inter banging on Paul Lambert's door for example.
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I put all this down to the panic we all feel at the possibility of McClaren becoming our next manager. Which is understandable. Nevertheless, appointing Laursen - however much we love him and would want him to succeed - would be a terrible idea.
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I'd rather have him just as a defensive coach but I think he'd do an OK job.
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I would like him to be our manager one day but I would like him to learn the ropes lower down the leagues or with the youth teams of the danish international team.
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That's about as likely as Guardiola getting on a private jet to talk to Randy Lerner tomorrow. How many of the European giants have appointed a manager from the English lower leagues, however well they've done? I don't see Inter banging on Paul Lambert's door for example.
Fair enough, point noted.
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So, is this still sounding like such a bad idea to everyone now?
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So, is this still sounding like such a bad idea to everyone now?
Yes. A worse idea than Martinez even.
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You'll see the light yet, Risso ;)
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So, is this still sounding like such a bad idea to everyone now?
Yes, still an awful suggestion.
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yes, terrible. may as well, ask Shaun Teale, Paul McGrath or Olof Mellberg as they were all better defenders...
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yes, terrible. may as well, ask Shaun Teale, Paul McGrath or Olof Mellberg as they were all better defenders...
I'm not sure about that. Shaun Teale better than Martin Laursen? I loved Teale but I think Laursen was a far better player and if it wasn't for his injury problems he would have been one of the best defenders in the game. Laursen came from A.C Milan, Teale came from Bournemouth (I think).
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It shows how much Laursen is loved at the Villa by the fact the poll options are yes and maybe....... :)
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So, is this STILL a bad idea??
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So, is this STILL a bad idea??
There is no fun in coming up with ridiculously bad ideas for humourous effect any more. The bar has now been set way to high.
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So, is this STILL a bad idea??
Yep.
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So, is this STILL a bad idea??
It's still a bad idea. Not as bad an idea as appointing McLeish though, I will concede!